To stay in the analogy, if they produce a great hit, but one that you didn't like, then it's still a great hit and band. DA2 may be merely good, but ME2 was still awesome, SWTOR so far is very enjoyable to many people although its longterm appeal will show in the upcoming months, and ME3 has a high chance of being on the same quality level as ME and ME2 were. If that's the case, then it should be equivalent to a band that had great hits, then a lesser hit, and then great hits again.
Can't argue with that.
That said, it works both ways. What may not be gamebreaking to you will be a deal breaker to someone else. The fact that different people play for different reaons must be respected.
When a game fails to be satisfying to a large majority of people on an objective level, then it is a failure. SWTOR seems to lack a lot of features on an objective level.
Calling something objective doesn't make it so, and it's rarely that simple. There's no LFG tool.... but SHOULD there be? Some people don't like the characterization options... but SHOULD there be more? It's all subjective.
The main reason why I enjoy this game is the SW universe and the story... I love how I can loose myself in the main story line and can't actually wait to see what's the next thing going to be, tho I am SW fan so maybe that's the key...
IF this game wouldn't be made by bioware it would mean the story would suck ass, but it would also mean it would probably waste more money on some other aspects of the game which are not totally well developed/implemented in the game (yet)...
IF this game wouldn't be set in SW universe I would NOT play it because then it would feel too much wow-ish (yes I said it)... But that's just me... and this are only my opinions and assumptions.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life." -------------------------------
I'm not sure this game can be separated from the starwars universe, mostly because the jedi classes are intrinsic to Star Wars.
A game without the IP but still using some sort of laser sword for 2- 4 classes would not be as well received because it would be an inescapable rip off of Star Wars.
A game with something 'different' then Jedi could'nt be judged without knowing what they replace those classes with.
A sci-fi game done with voice overs and cut scenes may potentially be as well received if made by bioware, but as already stated, only if the replacements for the Jedi classes were good.
I believe that the exact same game if it were to be released by a different company would be as well received.
Lastly, it seems what you are really asking is, ' if a different company made a different sci fi game would it be as well received '.....how could anyone possibly know that? EVE does alright, Tabula Rasa shut down. Those are two examples of different companies making different sci fi games, and, no, neither were as well recieved.
Calling something objective doesn't make it so, and it's rarely that simple. There's no LFG tool.... but SHOULD there be? Some people don't like the characterization options... but SHOULD there be more? It's all subjective.
They don't have to be identical features but if a contemporary game offers the same benefit in a better (convenient, more efficient, more enjoyable, etc) way, then that game is better than this one regardless of all those people who like the relatively rudimentary method (and those sort of people will always exist).
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I think this is more a case of wishful thinking. I consider myself to be in my right mind, and compared with the issues and problems I've seen with the launch of other MMO's, SWTOR's issues are - in my experience - nowhere near 'massive issues' as some claim/want it to be. But that's how I see it, I'm not ignoring the issues and annoyances that are present, but I've been around MMO's and MMO launches for over 10 years now and seen a lot, and often a lot worse.
I seriously am not in the mood to take another ban from this site, but Bioware has not even added a search feature on their forums. Add that with the multiple other issues that are just game breaking and it is blatantly obvious this game is getting a free pass.
The real question how is how long will the free pass last? Nice mod edit btw. Another e-mail incoming to Mike B it seems for selective moding
Calling something objective doesn't make it so, and it's rarely that simple. There's no LFG tool.... but SHOULD there be? Some people don't like the characterization options... but SHOULD there be more? It's all subjective.
They don't have to be identical features but if a contemporary game offers the same benefit in a better (convenient, more efficient, more enjoyable, etc) way, then that game is better than this one regardless of all those people who like the relatively rudimentary method (and those sort of people will always exist).
There are many, many players who hate the idea of a LFG feature, believing that it destroys the community, makes it feel like a lobby game, etc. As I said, completely subjective.
Calling something objective doesn't make it so, and it's rarely that simple. There's no LFG tool.... but SHOULD there be? Some people don't like the characterization options... but SHOULD there be more? It's all subjective.
They don't have to be identical features but if a contemporary game offers the same benefit in a better (convenient, more efficient, more enjoyable, etc) way, then that game is better than this one regardless of all those people who like the relatively rudimentary method (and those sort of people will always exist).
There are many, many players who hate the idea of a LFG feature, believing that it destroys the community, makes it feel like a lobby game, etc. As I said, completely subjective.
Why are you so hung up on LFG feature? I don't believe I mentioned that anywhere in my post..
Anyway, the process to group in SWTOR is poor IMO. There is no incentive for a tight knit server community and BiOWare has provided no tools for such a community.
So if you want to harp on this feature, then I can objectively say that BioWare didn't check this box.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I think this is more a case of wishful thinking. I consider myself to be in my right mind, and compared with the issues and problems I've seen with the launch of other MMO's, SWTOR's issues are - in my experience - nowhere near 'massive issues' as some claim/want it to be. But that's how I see it, I'm not ignoring the issues and annoyances that are present, but I've been around MMO's and MMO launches for over 10 years now and seen a lot, and often a lot worse.
I seriously am not in the mood to take another ban from this site, but Bioware has not even added a search feature on their forums. Add that with the multiple other issues that are just game breaking and it is blatantly obvious this game is getting a free pass.
The real question how is how long will the free pass last? Nice mod edit btw. Another e-mail incoming to Mike B it seems for selective moding
There seem to be those that believe it is financially possible and physically possible to add every feature from every previous mmo before launch in a polished state in less development time than all previous mmos, although it took some of those games literally over a decade to create and implement these said features.
Gone seem to be the days when an mmo was to 'grow' after its initial release, now we demand a 'complete' ever growing game which already has everything we ever wanted, but is can still add more of what we want. In short, we are demanding a feature, which is unobtainable.
The game is not a month old, could you folks let them spend some time with their families before crying foul and their slow pace of adding features.
I think this is more a case of wishful thinking. I consider myself to be in my right mind, and compared with the issues and problems I've seen with the launch of other MMO's, SWTOR's issues are - in my experience - nowhere near 'massive issues' as some claim/want it to be. But that's how I see it, I'm not ignoring the issues and annoyances that are present, but I've been around MMO's and MMO launches for over 10 years now and seen a lot, and often a lot worse.
I seriously am not in the mood to take another ban from this site, but Bioware has not even added a search feature on their forums. Add that with the multiple other issues that are just game breaking and it is blatantly obvious this game is getting a free pass.
The real question how is how long will the free pass last? Nice mod edit btw. Another e-mail incoming to Mike B it seems for selective moding
? I have no idea why your post was edited out, there was nothing wrong with it as far as I could tell. As for the search function, actually there was one on those forums, no idea why it suddenly isn't there anymore. But from a broader perspective, I think it's simply a case that different things aren't all equally important to everyone, which is why everyone plays and enjoys different games, I guess. Something that can be a gamebreaker to one person is a minor nuisance or even a non-issue to another person, and a feature that one person considers a major appeal can have no meaning or value to another person. Different strokes and such.
Calling something objective doesn't make it so, and it's rarely that simple. There's no LFG tool.... but SHOULD there be? Some people don't like the characterization options... but SHOULD there be more? It's all subjective.
They don't have to be identical features but if a contemporary game offers the same benefit in a better (convenient, more efficient, more enjoyable, etc) way, then that game is better than this one regardless of all those people who like the relatively rudimentary method (and those sort of people will always exist).
There are many, many players who hate the idea of a LFG feature, believing that it destroys the community, makes it feel like a lobby game, etc. As I said, completely subjective.
Why are you so hung up on LFG feature? I don't believe I mentioned that anywhere in my post..
Anyway, the process to group in SWTOR is poor IMO. There is no incentive for a tight knit server community and BiOWare has provided no tools for such a community.
So if you want to harp on this feature, then I can objectively say that BioWare didn't check this box.
But I think that the process to group is great, and there is plenty of incentive for a tight knit server community and they have provided all the tools I need.
Hmmmm... two people with differing opinions on the same thing. Sounds awfully subjective to me...
Sure I would, since someone bought me a copy. Otherwise, I doubt it. I might have come around to it eventually whether it was Star Wars or not because I'm just that bored, but Bioware had even less to do with it. I never thought their games were that mind-blowing, and the same goes for TOR, whatever the IP. It will be a fun distraction, that's all. I don't see myself playing it in 6 months because it doesn't do anything well enough or new enough for this long time themepark player.
if this game wasnt SWTOR and made by Bioware, it would something like GW so no i wouldnt play it.
So your saying it's like Guild Wars 1 right?
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
If this game didnt have crew skills or gearing out companions, or space missions, voice overs and dialog choices... and if i didnt get to be a double lightsaber wielding twilek that tanks giant robots and shoots lightning.. oh and if my wife didnt play it, or my best friend... then I wouldnt play it.
I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.
The game was made by Bioware and it is set in the Star Wars universe. And Im not playing it.
You can base a game on the greatest thing ever, but if its not a great game, I dont play it. A neat license is not enough for me. The game has got to be special. Granted I am a little choosy when it comes to my gaming. Ive played amazing games and thats the bar I set. I know what games can be because Ive played them. Swtor doesnt meet my standards.
But this game would be getting a lot of flack from the fan boys if it werent based on Star Wars. The voice overs are pretty neat, but the rest of it is below par. Its not even standard. Its below that. From animations, to functionality, to tools, to it all. Its just below the standard line.
Well honestly that could be said about most games. For me anyway its the lore of LOTRO that makes the game, without the lore of Middle Earth the game most likely would'nt even exist. Same with EQ2 and the Norrath lore, it makes the game. I think the only MMO ive played where lore was meaningless to me was WOW and I think Blizz kinda makes it up as they go along lol. Star Wars fans might reply differently but thats my take on things.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
BioWare has been losing their touch -- DA2 anyone? So I doubt the "BioWare" pull would make me pick it up either (if it wasn't a SW game).
I don't understand how one game (that wasn't even that bad) can mean a company is "losing their touch".
As for the question it would most certainly depend on the game that replaced it. Just because it wasn't made by Bioware or set in the Star Wars universe doesn't mean it would be a bad game or not worth praise and attention.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
BioWare has been losing their touch -- DA2 anyone? So I doubt the "BioWare" pull would make me pick it up either (if it wasn't a SW game).
I don't understand how one game (that wasn't even that bad) can mean a company is "losing their touch".
As for the question it would most certainly depend on the game that replaced it. Just because it wasn't made by Bioware or set in the Star Wars universe doesn't mean it would be a bad game or not worth praise and attention.
well consider how great Dragon Age 1 was and how DA2 just fell apart does make you wonder whats going on in a company and considering prior to that what games have they made in thepast that were not great games for the most part?
also I'm pretty sure the OP meant for the most part if the game was excatly the same as this one as in a themepark clone without much new aside from biowares story elements but not star wars would it do as well.. I would say no... anything you slap star wars on is going to initially sell well no matter what the actually quality of it.
OP's question can't be answered with a yes or no. The setting and developer determines for a major part how the game will play, what features it will have and what the setting will be about. Different ip and different developer would be a different game.
So the OP couldve just as well asked 'Would you play some other game?' What else can I answer then 'maybe' without knowing any specifics?
We'll know after the second month numbers come out if the game merits the popularity of the original draw.
I imagine the detractors of the game are praying that it fails in some deluded belief that it will halt the general trend of the genre towards greater casual game play and convince the developers to return to a more hardcore, masochistic play style.
We'll know after the second month numbers come out if the game merits the popularity of the original draw.
I imagine the detractors of the game are praying that it fails in some deluded belief that it will halt the general trend of the genre towards greater casual game play and convince the developers to return to a more hardcore, masochistic play style.
It's probably easier to believe that all the detractors are hardcore, masochistic gamers, but the fact of the matter is that there is a large group of people unhappy with what was provided in TOR, and that group spreads across a very large range of individual preferences for entertainment.
I know, it's easy and cathartic to blame it all on the hardcore gamers. If I wasn't trying to be nice, I'd make a statement about how some mindless collection of drones has allowed the genre to become stale, uncreative, and derivative. Oh wait.
"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)
Comments
Calling something objective doesn't make it so, and it's rarely that simple. There's no LFG tool.... but SHOULD there be? Some people don't like the characterization options... but SHOULD there be more? It's all subjective.
The main reason why I enjoy this game is the SW universe and the story... I love how I can loose myself in the main story line and can't actually wait to see what's the next thing going to be, tho I am SW fan so maybe that's the key...
IF this game wouldn't be made by bioware it would mean the story would suck ass, but it would also mean it would probably waste more money on some other aspects of the game which are not totally well developed/implemented in the game (yet)...
IF this game wouldn't be set in SW universe I would NOT play it because then it would feel too much wow-ish (yes I said it)... But that's just me... and this are only my opinions and assumptions.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life."
-------------------------------
I'm not sure this game can be separated from the starwars universe, mostly because the jedi classes are intrinsic to Star Wars.
A game without the IP but still using some sort of laser sword for 2- 4 classes would not be as well received because it would be an inescapable rip off of Star Wars.
A game with something 'different' then Jedi could'nt be judged without knowing what they replace those classes with.
A sci-fi game done with voice overs and cut scenes may potentially be as well received if made by bioware, but as already stated, only if the replacements for the Jedi classes were good.
I believe that the exact same game if it were to be released by a different company would be as well received.
Lastly, it seems what you are really asking is, ' if a different company made a different sci fi game would it be as well received '.....how could anyone possibly know that? EVE does alright, Tabula Rasa shut down. Those are two examples of different companies making different sci fi games, and, no, neither were as well recieved.
They don't have to be identical features but if a contemporary game offers the same benefit in a better (convenient, more efficient, more enjoyable, etc) way, then that game is better than this one regardless of all those people who like the relatively rudimentary method (and those sort of people will always exist).
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
I seriously am not in the mood to take another ban from this site, but Bioware has not even added a search feature on their forums. Add that with the multiple other issues that are just game breaking and it is blatantly obvious this game is getting a free pass.
The real question how is how long will the free pass last? Nice mod edit btw. Another e-mail incoming to Mike B it seems for selective moding
There are many, many players who hate the idea of a LFG feature, believing that it destroys the community, makes it feel like a lobby game, etc. As I said, completely subjective.
Why are you so hung up on LFG feature? I don't believe I mentioned that anywhere in my post..
Anyway, the process to group in SWTOR is poor IMO. There is no incentive for a tight knit server community and BiOWare has provided no tools for such a community.
So if you want to harp on this feature, then I can objectively say that BioWare didn't check this box.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
There seem to be those that believe it is financially possible and physically possible to add every feature from every previous mmo before launch in a polished state in less development time than all previous mmos, although it took some of those games literally over a decade to create and implement these said features.
Gone seem to be the days when an mmo was to 'grow' after its initial release, now we demand a 'complete' ever growing game which already has everything we ever wanted, but is can still add more of what we want. In short, we are demanding a feature, which is unobtainable.
The game is not a month old, could you folks let them spend some time with their families before crying foul and their slow pace of adding features.
I think this is more a case of wishful thinking. I consider myself to be in my right mind, and compared with the issues and problems I've seen with the launch of other MMO's, SWTOR's issues are - in my experience - nowhere near 'massive issues' as some claim/want it to be. But that's how I see it, I'm not ignoring the issues and annoyances that are present, but I've been around MMO's and MMO launches for over 10 years now and seen a lot, and often a lot worse.
I seriously am not in the mood to take another ban from this site, but Bioware has not even added a search feature on their forums. Add that with the multiple other issues that are just game breaking and it is blatantly obvious this game is getting a free pass.
The real question how is how long will the free pass last? Nice mod edit btw. Another e-mail incoming to Mike B it seems for selective moding
? I have no idea why your post was edited out, there was nothing wrong with it as far as I could tell. As for the search function, actually there was one on those forums, no idea why it suddenly isn't there anymore. But from a broader perspective, I think it's simply a case that different things aren't all equally important to everyone, which is why everyone plays and enjoys different games, I guess. Something that can be a gamebreaker to one person is a minor nuisance or even a non-issue to another person, and a feature that one person considers a major appeal can have no meaning or value to another person. Different strokes and such.But I think that the process to group is great, and there is plenty of incentive for a tight knit server community and they have provided all the tools I need.
Hmmmm... two people with differing opinions on the same thing. Sounds awfully subjective to me...
Sure I would, since someone bought me a copy. Otherwise, I doubt it. I might have come around to it eventually whether it was Star Wars or not because I'm just that bored, but Bioware had even less to do with it. I never thought their games were that mind-blowing, and the same goes for TOR, whatever the IP. It will be a fun distraction, that's all. I don't see myself playing it in 6 months because it doesn't do anything well enough or new enough for this long time themepark player.
if this game wasnt SWTOR and made by Bioware, it would be something like GW so no i wouldnt play it.
So your saying it's like Guild Wars 1 right?
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
If this game didnt have crew skills or gearing out companions, or space missions, voice overs and dialog choices... and if i didnt get to be a double lightsaber wielding twilek that tanks giant robots and shoots lightning.. oh and if my wife didnt play it, or my best friend... then I wouldnt play it.
I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means - except by getting off his back.
The game was made by Bioware and it is set in the Star Wars universe. And Im not playing it.
You can base a game on the greatest thing ever, but if its not a great game, I dont play it. A neat license is not enough for me. The game has got to be special. Granted I am a little choosy when it comes to my gaming. Ive played amazing games and thats the bar I set. I know what games can be because Ive played them. Swtor doesnt meet my standards.
But this game would be getting a lot of flack from the fan boys if it werent based on Star Wars. The voice overs are pretty neat, but the rest of it is below par. Its not even standard. Its below that. From animations, to functionality, to tools, to it all. Its just below the standard line.
Would you play Diablo III if it wasnt Diablo III and not made by Blizzard??
Oh wait, TL2 is none of above lol...
Main point is: depends of how much fun the game is, or can it get my attention long enough regardless of franchise or dev team...
P.S. i founded LoTRO to be terribad, despite it being based on one of my favorite fantasy universes...
Main MMO at the moment: Guild Wars 2
Waiting for: Pathfinder Online
if this game wasnt as awsome as it is, it would be like GW free game [Mod Edit]
Well honestly that could be said about most games. For me anyway its the lore of LOTRO that makes the game, without the lore of Middle Earth the game most likely would'nt even exist. Same with EQ2 and the Norrath lore, it makes the game. I think the only MMO ive played where lore was meaningless to me was WOW and I think Blizz kinda makes it up as they go along lol. Star Wars fans might reply differently but thats my take on things.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
I don't understand how one game (that wasn't even that bad) can mean a company is "losing their touch".
As for the question it would most certainly depend on the game that replaced it. Just because it wasn't made by Bioware or set in the Star Wars universe doesn't mean it would be a bad game or not worth praise and attention.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
well consider how great Dragon Age 1 was and how DA2 just fell apart does make you wonder whats going on in a company and considering prior to that what games have they made in thepast that were not great games for the most part?
also I'm pretty sure the OP meant for the most part if the game was excatly the same as this one as in a themepark clone without much new aside from biowares story elements but not star wars would it do as well.. I would say no... anything you slap star wars on is going to initially sell well no matter what the actually quality of it.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
OP's question can't be answered with a yes or no. The setting and developer determines for a major part how the game will play, what features it will have and what the setting will be about. Different ip and different developer would be a different game.
So the OP couldve just as well asked 'Would you play some other game?' What else can I answer then 'maybe' without knowing any specifics?
ya i mean look at all the awesome ratings final fantasy 14 has just because of its IP and square enix... good point!
We'll know after the second month numbers come out if the game merits the popularity of the original draw.
I imagine the detractors of the game are praying that it fails in some deluded belief that it will halt the general trend of the genre towards greater casual game play and convince the developers to return to a more hardcore, masochistic play style.
It's probably easier to believe that all the detractors are hardcore, masochistic gamers, but the fact of the matter is that there is a large group of people unhappy with what was provided in TOR, and that group spreads across a very large range of individual preferences for entertainment.
I know, it's easy and cathartic to blame it all on the hardcore gamers. If I wasn't trying to be nice, I'd make a statement about how some mindless collection of drones has allowed the genre to become stale, uncreative, and derivative. Oh wait.
"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)
If <insert game> was not made by <insert company name> and not set in <select setting>...WOULD IT BE GUD?!
C'mon man...