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If SWTOR failed so badly, tell us what you are playing now so we can compare!!!
Belgaraath
Member UncommonPosts: 3,205
I'm a long time member of these forums and I see so much criticism here of a game that has had one of the most successful launches in MMO history and a huge number of subs. It has had almost all positive reviews from professional outlets. In response to that I heard stupid comments like "they were all paid,etc", but prior to this games launch there were certain individuals that couldn't wait to post a negative impression of those same outlets about 1/2 year to a year ago. I guess they are only paid when they don't agree with you.
Throughout the first 30 days, all I heard was how the game was going to drop drastically after the first free month. That hasn't happened despite the duplicate threads here. On the fleet, the numbers at the times I play are just about the exact same as they were a few weeks ago. My guild has just as much or more online at the same time. I have no trouble finding groups. Now I do feel this game has a large room for improvement and I provided that feedback to Bioware, but all in all its a solid MMO to a huge number of people out there.
To those people here who continuously critique TOR, please post the MMO you are playing and loving now or something that you think is better so we can compare it against this game and try to figure out if that game offers so much more in features, choices, story, graphics, innovation etc that this game has to offer. I want to see how those games differ so drastically from the WOW forumula and what made them successful. Just remember we have your forum history to compare against (except those that mysteriously only post here with like 10 posts or so) and the reality of how those games have done up until this point.
As a pretty experienced MMO player, I am more than ready for innovation and the next level of MMO, but denying that this game isn't even a half step up from previous MMOs AT LAUNCH is incomprehensible to me, especially if you prefer PVE!
There Is Always Hope!
Comments
It isnt a step up because it is the same. Same old quests, same old graphics(not the paintings in the background), same old boring... THAT is the issue ppl have. Yes it's LAUNCH was successful, becuase it was well hyped and has a huge following from Bioware and Star Wars fans... but why don't you look at how many of those people actually paid for their second month.
SWTOR ultimately wasn't for me, although I did enjoy myself most of the first month. Currently I'm not playing any MMO, although I'll probably try Guild Wars 2 and Mists of Pandaria. Currently playing UFO: Enemy Unknown, Blood Bowl: Legendary Edition and Skyrim.
I'm also playing Skyrim which I love, but thats not an MMO and unrealistic that it will ever be one soon until 10M WOW players all upgrade their computers to top of the line Alienwares. Mists of Pandaria offers nothing that SWTOR doesn't already offer except the ability to read walls of text that everyone ignores without hitting a space bar. GW2, can't wait, but so far that game is all theoretical until we can try it in beta and see how bugless that came will be. UFO, not sure what that is. Isn't that a strategy game? lol.
There Is Always Hope!
Your premis is faulty. That, and you didn't really ask a question in your long winded pro TOR rant.
Your post is a challenge, not a question. You are challengeing the readers to tell you what MMO they currently play that is better than TOR . You don't stop there, though. You go on to list a long string of requirments that attempts to force people to compare TOR with wow based on several variables (graphics, story, et al).
And this, sir, is why your != question else (value = challenge) is a failed premis.
I do not currently play any MMO, and I have not since WoW came out with cataclysm and I got tired of Rift because it just didn't hold my interest. After hitting the 85 in WoW and being dealt the blow of trying to get into random dungeon groups just to get kicked for being noob and not knowing the fights, I hadn't bothered with any MMO's until after reading several pro TOR posts and anti TOR posts on this website, among others.
So I paid the 60 bucks for the digital download, then paid for one month to play it...And I had a TON of fun, because it was very new in how it presented everything. The first real heroic mission on that groups transport that you take after getting of the first planet? WOW, MAN! I mean, it was so friggin' epic. But then I kept playing, and things began to get stail, just like they were stail in WoW. It was the same old same old after the window dressing of voicovers fell away. I got tired of waiting for hours to find a group to attack X heroic. Some planets were so baren of players that I couldn't do ANY heroics. Then I would get into storyline instances where other people couldn't be there with me, because they were the same class, or where the boss fights were BROKEN. And then when I complained about it in public, I'd get jumped by all the people who were so desperately trying to defend the game against any decent.
else
I don't currently play any MMO, because they are pretty much all the same right now, just with different graphics. I am waiting to see what GW2 and a few other MMO's do. I'm interested in seeing what WoD does...But honestly? The whole MMO scene seems very tired to me. Why? Because there is no real inovation. Because you aren't playing a virtual world where anything can happen and where you can actually affect change in the world around you, or be a part of a group that affects real change to the world environment.
In either case, ToR was a let down because it didn't do anything different and it didn't even do many things very good, and it was missing TONS of features that other MMO's already have.
No, I didn't answer your question, because you didn't ask one. I didn't answer your challenge, because your challenge is flawed. Deal.
you said at the end 'especially if you prefer PVE'...
well i do and umm groups of static npcs waiting for you to finish killing the previous group of static npcs 20 yards away did not feel like a step up sorry..also i like fluid combat motion not out of sync laser deflects with my light sabre...i mean if you look at it you start deflecting stuff thats already hit you in the face or hasnt even been shot yet.
BUT swtor didnt fail so badly...the hype machine made a pretty penny from the masses and those execs living it up in the bahamas are thanking you guys very much...well they would if they didn't just see you as statistics
i am playing planetside and that game is on lifesupport and you can't really compare it to TOR anyway....apples and oranges
why did you bother with this thread anyway? seriously eventually it will be compared to WoW and feature for feature tor loses hands down.
All hail the Barn Owl! oh.. and the RED SQUIRREL!!!
Currently play: I still play SWTOR - then again I am only level 22 and have played since launch.
Before I post a small paragraph let me break down my MMO experience/credentials:
Games: Everquest, Everquest 2, Dark age of Camelot, World of Warcraft, Aion, Rift and now SWTOR.
Time played 2000-20010 were my hay-days now I work fulltime and study part-time so games such as Rift and SWTOR suit my style.
Coming from a hard-core MMO gaming background with Everquest to the current "soft-core" editions that are MMORPGS all I can say is that the problem with people's expectations and their deliverance on them is that most people have already played through their starting MMORPG and from there on in that will be their benchmark to all other games. I am and will always be one of those MMOPlayers that judge a game against my hay-days of EverQuest and if you ask me no other game compares.
Why do/can I make this broad assumtion, because you never forget the first time you killed your first dragon, or finally got to the bottom of x dungeon in a game. This reminicent based judgement that alot of the MMORPG community has is the reason why people get so God darn hyped and jacked up on the potential of reliving their "omg MMORPG days".
MMORPGers need to accept the fact that no new game is going to fulfill or replace those firsty days of mmorpging.
It's a terrible attittude to have and it's the reason why people "flock" to new MMORPGs, get disappoint and desub and then bitch on forums how it was a "shit game" etc. etc.
I am 25 years old now and my hay days of slaying dragons in my undies are over - I've come to terms with this and that's the reason why I personally can play game and not be pressured in to thinking it's the new OMG MMORPG. I think it would do the MMORPG community a hell of good if people in all lack of a better terms grew up and stopped placing their expecations on newly released MMORPGS. If history has taught you well enough nothing will every replace your first love.
No, you misread him. He isn't actually doing that. what he's doing is calling out for help. He wants to know what better MMORPG is out there: One that offeres the new glam and glitter of ToR AND has all the features that WoW has to offer. The sad thing is, that doesnt' exist, and it's not going to exist for a long time. Some company with millions of dolalrs to spend is going to need to shift this community into the next phase of MMO.: Massive Multyplayer Online Player Driven Worlds.
I play EvE online.
Me reasons for hating on SWTOR has much more to do with its hypetrain, I also personaly Dislike EA as a publisher, I think they ruin good independent companies, bringing to much money and NO soul into the gaming industry. I also think that the copy cat train has to stop somewhere. You can compare my mindset to a greenpeace activist, or anny other organisation that fights for a cause, against something they think is an Injustice....
SWTOR is not a sanbox so it was never a game I would spend my money on. But what bothers me more is that from Independent Reviewers and the genral public ( people I know) (and people posting on forums about their concerns about the game) It looks like it isn't even a good theampark experince. Take away the VO and you are left with a shallow game, that offers little in the way of Innovation or progression for the genre.
I do play theamparks from time to time to entertain myself.. Playing Star Trek online right now and by the 16 of february I will start playing AION. Im an oldschool MMOR and I kinda like to grind. So Korean games do not bother me. For me its only a grind and if I have the Option of Killing X mobs in the same area or running around all over picking up quest and listening to voice overs I pick the first option. I even grind in theamparks that offer quests, Usally that makes levling go faster.. and Speed is what im after.. Leveling is just a time sink, I see no reason to bother with it longer then necessary. Back in the day me and my friends used to compeat who got to max first. So we pushed alot of hours come game day release. Many of us made schedules, Wake up at 7 a clock eat a good breakfast.. set the timer for 5 hours, grind like crazy. Get up go out for a walk, move around get some air. Come back eat a good lunch and play for another 5 hour straight. Take a dinner break, another walk, back to another 5-6 hours game time... Sleep.. rinse and repeat. For me MMOs are a competition, My fun factor either comes from me curbstomping someone or avoiding getting curbstomped...
Both Star trek and Aion are free to play.. and the quality these days on MMOs are so bad, that thats the only chans I will ever test them. All of them are just a very Inferior products compared to the level of player vs player interaction I get in a game like EvE online... Big publishers have decided though that this I the way to make money, so Im stuck playing 8+ year old games. I would be fun if something new in the Sandbox genre was made. But sadly we get games like WARHAMMER (2 servers left now I think) Champions online (free to play) AOC (not many servers left and free to play) STO (free to play) AION(free to play) DDO (free to play) and LOTRO (free to play) do we see a patern here?? EvE online (not free to play, and still growing) WoW (not free to play, still growing). Developers should come up with something Uniqe instead of copying games that have allready been done..
Started with KOTOR, then KOTOR2. Tried STO since it's free. Will likely retry EQ2. I've never played the Mass Effect or Fallout series and so I may try those instead.
I'm basically just waiting for GW2 and D3 and see no reason to pay for SWTOR in its current state. Add a cross server dungeon finder and I'll probably return to SWTOR and to see how I like it.
so true.. good post
+1, I'll bite though: currently for noncompetitive play: EQ1, Castleville, and New Super Mario Bros. Wii (seriously considering trying Vanguard once I have enough constant playtime to warrant a sub fee); For competitive play: League of Legends, Mario Kart Wii, Team Fortress 2, and WAR: Wrath of Heroes beta when it's active.
What bothered me throughout the time I played TOR in beta was that it felt more like a choose your own adventure movie than a game, it felt more suited to be a single player RPG with co-op than a true MMORPG, and the combat felt stale to me (not as bad as LoTRO's combat, but all things considered I still enjoy LoTRO more than my experience in pre-TOR). The devs certainly had some very good ideas, but the way the mechanics were implemented fell flat for me. The choices in quests were not what I wanted to make, but what Bioware allowed me to choose. The effects of these choices really only affected how my companions got along with me and what armor I could wear- BFD. The atmosphere and NPCs were completely lifeless- more a shoebox diorama than a living game world. Finally, scope- I look for MMORPGs that are epic in size and content. When PvE content can be cleared with 16 or fewer people it doesn't seem epic to me in the slightest, especially when these encounters are instanced. As for PvP, it is destined to suck in any two faction game and is only exacerbated with gear grinds.
I have accepted that there will likely not be one MMORPG that encompasses everything I seek in a MMORPG and that's ok- I find games that have content I desire and don't just rely on a single genre.
Well, SW:TOR is an awesome single player game with a co-op mode strapped on. I guess Bioware could do the same with Mass Effect 3 and name it MMO as well, right?
For me that's where the problem lies with SW:TOR. It's not about other games, it's just that this particular game is not an MMO yet, so once the personal story is over, the game appeal ends as well.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
I am really disappointed in SWTOR as it really couldnt manage to create a massive world feeling, using the most massive setting ever (imo). Combat is very boring, characters don't feel unique. Its like a single player game like everybody says. And i dont want that.
Right now, i have given up on MMOs. Playing dota2 and dark souls until GW2 launches.
Im going to tell you a secret.. do you want to hear it? probably not. Reason why TOR might or might not be sinking is that It can even be compared to other games. I mean things like TOR has BGs and TOR has quests and TOR has mouse wheel endgame content is what puts many people of the product in the first place. If TOR dident have all these things anny comparision to other games (like WoW, WAR, LOTRO, Champions online, AION, etc etc) would not be admissible. I personaly dont understand why they just dident do a totaly diffrent game.. Its not hard and it sure isent Rocket sience coming up with a new concept. Draw from outer platforms, like FPS, RTS, FInd other things like a deep crafting system that is actually worth doing instead of a side game, make an Open WORLD, make peoples Toons start as childrean and slowly grow... Just come up with something that we havent seen before.
I want to be amased, and I want to be entertained when i play games. I dont want to feel like "dam it feels like I have done this like 100 times before" And VO cant save anything if you build it ontop of the same gamdesign that has been used for a decade now...
No need to respond to this as it has nothing to do with this thread.. My intiial comments regarding forum history kind of speak for themselves.
There Is Always Hope!
Tribes Acend, a FPS/RPG https://account.hirezstudios.com/tribesascend/
And a little STO, alot has changed, its "ok"
King Aurthur II the Role playing game RTS/RPG http://www.kingarthurii.com/
And I still have not finished up Skyrim
I want to play more Starwars, but im level 50 and bored
So you are basically admitting that no MMO is better for the moment until GW2 comes out, so for those of us who want to still play MMOs, this game might be just fine until then. God knows how many others have posted in response to the same redudant single player post, its only single player if you want it to be. There are tons of things to do that are multiplayer. You do realize you have to group with people for it to be multiplayer, right? This is pretty much the same as every other PVE MMO out there. Then there are those who complained about other MMOs that force you to group. Its like you are damned if you do, damned if you don't. This game at least gives you options.
There Is Always Hope!
IF I only could have your eyes, in the angle that you have not played Fallout or Mass Effect only to expierence them again for the first time!
Yea you need to get those, youll be busy for awhile, dont forget to eat, or bathe
Have you tried playing the other side at least?
There Is Always Hope!
Currently playing Rift.
Its just better.
Bioware and EA have no business making MMO's Swtor shows it. It was a decent single player game though, im just not into those.
Yes, but I want to save it for later...........notice I didnt complain or be someone crying about it
its a good game dont get me wrong
I agree to some degree with your post. I admit that it is unlikely I will ever play an MMO as long as my first, WOW even though I've liked other MMOs more since then.
There Is Always Hope!