Ah men to the OP. I was seriously done with MMO's, then over the last few months I've been glancing at Guildwars 2 and reading about it, then last monday when I heard about WvWvW and took into consideration everything else I've read, I think I'll be putting some time in.
I mean dear god, there are so many skills per character its unreal. I was just looking at the engineer class since it seems by far the most diverse and I couldn't believe how many options they give you 30-40 skills... I mean I craped my pants and sent a check in that day.....
I would be surprised if there weren't "mission packs" or one-off dungeons, or a whole host of cash shop items we're not prepared for, before this goes live.
I agree with @Creslin about the aggressive pricing, but something still doesn't add up. How do you recoup your costs on the initial development, plus pay the salaries of 50 developers, and keep the lights on with only ONE x-pack per year?
I guess we'll find out. But if the cash-shop is a little more robust than anticipated, or we see downloadable content available for a fee, I fear the deluge of tears that will hit the forums.
They did. They said the 6-month model just wasn't working for them, and they'd end up having to cut out or reduce content ideas just to hit the 6-month dev mark.
Guild Wars: Eyes of the North and Guild Wars 2 were both originally part of the expansion to be released after Nightfall, called Utopia. They ended up dropping the 6-month model during development of it, then separated Utopia up and re-worked it into Eyes of The North, while also starting work on Guild Wars 2.
So no, there isn't going to be some 2-3 month expansion packs, 6 months is more than likely not going to occur either.
I doubt we'll see full blown expansions every six months, but I'm sure they'll be releasing content regardless, I wouldn't mind seeing content packs/dungeons etc.. in the cash-shop, I'd rather buy that, much more so than cosmetics.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Unlike blizzard who charge you a sub and then fool people into spending 25 dollars on a stupid sparkley pony.
Sorry but what you just said sounds foolish. No one is forced or tricked into buying cosmetic items in any game. If someone wants to blow money on them, its their choice and they are responsible for that choice. You make it sound like Blizzard is trying to trick you to make your own choices as to what you want to buy. Furthermore, if that upsets you, i would recommend avoiding mass effect 3 at all cost (literally when I mean "costs")
It's not foolish! because the mentallity of the wow player is to collect everything so they can feel more leet than all you other noobs, blizzard know if they release a unique item in the store that the fans will go mad to get their hands on it..a mount is somehow worth more than subscription cost to a game and you cant even keep that mount unless you keep subscribing to the game..its a scam nothing more.
Mass effect 2 was uninspiring so why woud i buy mass effect 3?
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
So the OP must be living is some sort of coocky land if he dosnt think Anet didnt absoultley makea killingfrom the cash shop. Organised pvp instances wer a big thing, and trust me they must have mad a killing from pvp players. Sorry but Anet used to sel anything and verything back then. And I played GW1 some 6 years ago when all the fanbois in this thread didnt even play GW.
Unlike blizzard who charge you a sub and then fool people into spending 25 dollars on a stupid sparkley pony.
Sorry but what you just said sounds foolish. No one is forced or tricked into buying cosmetic items in any game. If someone wants to blow money on them, its their choice and they are responsible for that choice. You make it sound like Blizzard is trying to trick you to make your own choices as to what you want to buy. Furthermore, if that upsets you, i would recommend avoiding mass effect 3 at all cost (literally when I mean "costs")
It's not foolish! because the mentallity of the wow player is to collect everything so they can feel more leet than all you other noobs, blizzard know if they release a unique item in the store that the fans will go mad to get their hands on it..a mount is somehow worth more than subscription cost to a game and you cant even keep that mount unless you keep subscribing to the game..its a scam nothing more.
Mass effect 2 was uninspiring so why woud i buy mass effect 3?
Ye well, you can't really blame blizz for peoples lack of control or for actually liking the stuff there or even for knowing their playerbase. They are not forcing anyone to buy those things, it's the players choice. When I used to play, I never bought any of those items and enjoyed my time without them. As long as it doesn't influence the actual gaming experience and it's kept to fluff level, no one is forced to buy anything in any cash shop and hope ANet keep it that way too.
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
So the OP must be living is some sort of coocky land if he dosnt think Anet didnt absoultley makea killingfrom the cash shop. Organised pvp instances wer a big thing, and trust me they must have mad a killing from pvp players. Sorry but Anet used to sel anything and verything back then. And I played GW1 some 6 years ago when all the fanbois in this thread didnt even play GW.
I don't think you actually played GW1 after reading that, sure they must have made cash on there shop but the problem is none of it was neccessary as almost all of it (Except for the cosmetic costumes) could be obtained in game and through other means.
If you didn't want to unlock something in game you could do so with cash on the store. It gave you no in game advantage over any other player and the prices were low.
But hey maybe you know more than I do since I only played GW for about 7 years.
Expansions will be out every 3-4 months to offset the subscription lost.
It will work out the same as a subscription way if you want to keep up with the game and stay competative.
So rather than take your money by subs they will get if from expansions.
Looking forward to it though, eyes wide open.
ArenaNet have already stated that the short development cycle of GW1 was not good for their creative process and they found they had to cut a lot of things from each expansion which werent ready for the public.
I doubt they would put themselves under such stressful conditions again, and expansions will more likely be on a yearly basis with smaller content patches (mainly cash shop options such as cosmetic items) every 2-3 months.
"The problem with quotes from the Internet is that it's almost impossible to validate their authenticity." - Abraham Lincoln
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
So the OP must be living is some sort of coocky land if he dosnt think Anet didnt absoultley makea killingfrom the cash shop. Organised pvp instances wer a big thing, and trust me they must have mad a killing from pvp players. Sorry but Anet used to sel anything and verything back then. And I played GW1 some 6 years ago when all the fanbois in this thread didnt even play GW.
I don't think you actually played GW1 after reading that, sure they must have made cash on there shop but the problem is none of it was neccessary as almost all of it (Except for the cosmetic costumes) could be obtained in game and through other means.
If you didn't want to unlock something in game you could do so with cash on the store. It gave you no in game advantage over any other player and the prices were low.
But hey maybe you know more than I do since I only played GW for about 7 years.
Haven't played GW, but beside the cosmetic stuff, could anything be optained through in game means, including extra story/quest/mission stuff?
Unlike blizzard who charge you a sub and then fool people into spending 25 dollars on a stupid sparkley pony.
Sorry but what you just said sounds foolish. No one is forced or tricked into buying cosmetic items in any game. If someone wants to blow money on them, its their choice and they are responsible for that choice. You make it sound like Blizzard is trying to trick you to make your own choices as to what you want to buy. Furthermore, if that upsets you, i would recommend avoiding mass effect 3 at all cost (literally when I mean "costs")
It's not foolish! because the mentallity of the wow player is to collect everything so they can feel more leet than all you other noobs, blizzard know if they release a unique item in the store that the fans will go mad to get their hands on it..a mount is somehow worth more than subscription cost to a game and you cant even keep that mount unless you keep subscribing to the game..its a scam nothing more.
Mass effect 2 was uninspiring so why woud i buy mass effect 3?
Its not a scam and you are foolish to clump all gamers into one stereotype and if those gamers wana waste their money to get something they can and it doesnt affect your gameplay other then what Jelousy? If you buy everything a game gives you ust for the sake of having it and store it its your choice, if you do it and complain after saying "they forced me!" then your an idiot and should stop playing video games the genre is better off without you. I am a believer that everything should be earnable in a game but im not so blind that i think what some games do are evil and they implant things in my mind that makes me buy some stupid item that has no value.
Basicly if you fall for it and buy it itss your fault your the reason they sell things like that and personally stop playing games if your the sucker an you complain about it as your doing it. There suppose to make money thats how games work, run, and get developed and game desingers usually get paid crap and work crap hours and its all a waste if there game does suck and doesn't turn a profit. But seriously thats really just ignorant you make it sound like they have mind control devices.
P.S. not saying if you buy it and are happy/disatisfied but you understand they didnt make you then so be it unless they actually lied about it before you bought it then i understand. Its like those people that pre-order a game buy a year sub before there free month is up then 2 months down the road they complain that they arent having fun anymore and they MADE you waste your money, they dont make you you just made a stupid emotional decision with your money(or mommy's money) and refuse to take responsibility that you made a mistake.
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
So the OP must be living is some sort of coocky land if he dosnt think Anet didnt absoultley makea killingfrom the cash shop. Organised pvp instances wer a big thing, and trust me they must have mad a killing from pvp players. Sorry but Anet used to sel anything and verything back then. And I played GW1 some 6 years ago when all the fanbois in this thread didnt even play GW.
I played the original Guild Wars at launch and got every single expansion.... and I have no idea what you are talking about.
You could not buy level 20 characters, ever. Everyone can make level 20 characters for the sole purpose of PvP, and you didnt need to pay for that. The skills you could buy were only a PvP character unlock, you had to earn your skills as every PvE character.
Up until after Nightfall, the only things available in the cash shop were unlocks for PvP or unlocks for all pet types.... things you could already earn in game through normal gameplay. On top of that, the pet unlocks didnt include any of the prestige pets, which you were still expected to earn. I didnt feel the need to buy a single thing from the cash shop.
At some point before Eye of the North they introduced appearance armor for $4-5 each, which has been pretty popular as most people in towns would have some appearance armor on. This isnt necessary though, as there are dozens of armor appearance options, many which take a lot of effort to aquire and look fantastic.
They also introduced a few mini-adventures that you can play through for a small fee (I think it was $5 for all 4 adventures). These books expanded on the lore for the NPC characters of Gwen, Saul, Togo and Turai but didnt provide any advantage over players who chose not to buy them.
This stuff hardly qualifies as 'anything and everything'. In fact it is the most tame Cash Shop I have seen in any game. With most things obtainable through normal gameplay, or completely irrelevant to your character aside from appearance.
IMO, when a company makes a product that many consider to be on par with, if not better than the industry leader, and then offer this product at a lower price point, they do this for only one reason. Aggression. I think that ANet is trying to aggressively position GW2 against WoW and break its stranglehold on the market. They are doing this by trying to make a superior product and then offer it for less money.
This, this and this.
Guild Wars is one of the highest selling PC franchises of all time. Think about what that really means. They were a little no-name company that developed a no-name game with niche appeal and STILL managed to sell 6 million copies.
Just imagine the impact that GW2 is going to have on the market.
ArenaNet might not be in direct competition with other MMO's but no mistake about it, this is still a hostile takeover of the market.
Originally posted by chilliz
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
Blatant lie is blatant. I've played Guild Wars since release and own all campaigns + EotN and they have never charged for Level 20 Characters, they have always been free for PvP and even today you still can't buy Level 20 PvE characters.
Skills unlocks have always been limited to PvP Characters so that those players that want to focus solely on PvP and completely ignore PvE are able to do so and not be gimped. Aside from that everything is cosmetic, even Hero Unlocks as they just allow you to gain benefits you've already had to earn through in-game effort.
IMO, when a company makes a product that many consider to be on par with, if not better than the industry leader, and then offer this product at a lower price point, they do this for only one reason. Aggression. I think that ANet is trying to aggressively position GW2 against WoW and break its stranglehold on the market. They are doing this by trying to make a superior product and then offer it for less money.
This, this and this.
Guild Wars is one of the highest selling PC franchises of all time. Think about what that really means. They were a little no-name company that developed a no-name game with niche appeal and STILL managed to sell 6 million copies.
Just imagine the impact that GW2 is going to have on the market.
ArenaNet might not be in direct competition with other MMO's but no mistake about it, this is still a hostile takeover of the market.
Originally posted by chilliz
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
Blatant lie is blatant. I've played Guild Wars since release and own all campaigns + EotN and they have never charged for Level 20 Characters, they have always been free for PvP and even today you still can't buy Level 20 PvE characters.
Skills unlocks have always been limited to PvP Characters so that those players that want to focus solely on PvP and completely ignore PvE are able to do so and not be gimped. Aside from that everything is cosmetic, even Hero Unlocks as they just allow you to gain benefits you've already had to earn through in-game effort.
Really so your trying to fudge the issue by syaing Arenanet didnt have a cash shop? If it waspvp or pve who the fuck cares, they had a cash shop pure and simple, yeha maybe i got confused with the lvl 20 character so yeah I am a blantant blatant lier omg. They had a cash shop pure and simple. They had it for skills and extra storage space, so dont bloody lie, I am not mistaken as well they also used to sell dyes in it. So really dont try fudge everything and justify they had a cashop by sayinh " oh it was only for that group". THEY had a CASH SHOP which they probabaly made thousands from it.
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
So the OP must be living is some sort of coocky land if he dosnt think Anet didnt absoultley makea killingfrom the cash shop. Organised pvp instances wer a big thing, and trust me they must have mad a killing from pvp players. Sorry but Anet used to sel anything and verything back then. And I played GW1 some 6 years ago when all the fanbois in this thread didnt even play GW.
I played the original Guild Wars at launch and got every single expansion.... and I have no idea what you are talking about.
You could not buy level 20 characters, ever. Everyone can make level 20 characters for the sole purpose of PvP, and you didnt need to pay for that. The skills you could buy were only a PvP character unlock, you had to earn your skills as every PvE character.
Up until after Nightfall, the only things available in the cash shop were unlocks for PvP or unlocks for all pet types.... things you could already earn in game through normal gameplay. On top of that, the pet unlocks didnt include any of the prestige pets, which you were still expected to earn. I didnt feel the need to buy a single thing from the cash shop.
At some point before Eye of the North they introduced appearance armor for $4-5 each, which has been pretty popular as most people in towns would have some appearance armor on. This isnt necessary though, as there are dozens of armor appearance options, many which take a lot of effort to aquire and look fantastic.
They also introduced a few mini-adventures that you can play through for a small fee (I think it was $5 for all 4 adventures). These books expanded on the lore for the NPC characters of Gwen, Saul, Togo and Turai but didnt provide any advantage over players who chose not to buy them.
This stuff hardly qualifies as 'anything and everything'. In fact it is the most tame Cash Shop I have seen in any game. With most things obtainable through normal gameplay, or completely irrelevant to your character aside from appearance.
Does any of that get away from the fact they were probabaly the originators of a cahs shop? This notion of them being generous is somone living in coocky land. Yes ok they didnt sell everything and anythinBUT they had a CASH SHOP, they had items in there that yes wasnt just for apperance, and yes they sold stuff. So lets not try pretend they arnt in it for the money. They probably made thousands if not millionsjust by the low prices, and there were probably thousands of people buying stuff. So
I think your understanding of what a Cash Shop is far different from what ANet offered though.
You're looking for that other Cash Shop on the Corner of Pay2Win & EZMode.
Im not misunderstanding anything. I wasnt making the point if it was pay2win, or ezmode. I am trying to point out there whole aim was to make money, yes its a business and that is there right, but tOP must be living is seriuos denial mode, if he thinks that Anet were generouos and allergic to money.
"At some point before Eye of the North they introduced appearance armor for $4-5 each, which has been pretty popular as most people in towns would have some appearance armor on. This isnt necessary though, as there are dozens of armor appearance options, many which take a lot of effort to aquire and look fantastic.
They also introduced a few mini-adventures that you can play through for a small fee (I think it was $5 for all 4 adventures). These books expanded on the lore for the NPC characters of Gwen, Saul, Togo and Turai but didnt provide any advantage over players who chose not to buy them"
These are some of the features aded to yes the cash shop after the original, I dont know what else has been added as I havnt played GW in years. So lets not try pretend Anet are allergic to money and they are doing it out of the kindness of their hearts. If blizzard had implemented any of these they would be chastaized on this site. Lets not try pretend paying for skills dosnt affect peoples play style. becausanyone in pvp who has the better skills agasint the player who hasnt bought them might and will probably lose. yes those are game affecting. because the wankers that used to stand in the pvp area lFG all day used to specifficaly ask for those skills on players, and if said person hadnt acquired them or couldnt eb arsed to, you know what he did??? Yes thats right good ol cash shop.
IMO, when a company makes a product that many consider to be on par with, if not better than the industry leader, and then offer this product at a lower price point, they do this for only one reason. Aggression. I think that ANet is trying to aggressively position GW2 against WoW and break its stranglehold on the market. They are doing this by trying to make a superior product and then offer it for less money.
This, this and this.
Guild Wars is one of the highest selling PC franchises of all time. Think about what that really means. They were a little no-name company that developed a no-name game with niche appeal and STILL managed to sell 6 million copies.
Just imagine the impact that GW2 is going to have on the market.
ArenaNet might not be in direct competition with other MMO's but no mistake about it, this is still a hostile takeover of the market.
Originally posted by chilliz
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
Blatant lie is blatant. I've played Guild Wars since release and own all campaigns + EotN and they have never charged for Level 20 Characters, they have always been free for PvP and even today you still can't buy Level 20 PvE characters.
Skills unlocks have always been limited to PvP Characters so that those players that want to focus solely on PvP and completely ignore PvE are able to do so and not be gimped. Aside from that everything is cosmetic, even Hero Unlocks as they just allow you to gain benefits you've already had to earn through in-game effort.
Really so your trying to fudge the issue by syaing Arenanet didnt have a cash shop? If it waspvp or pve who the fuck cares, they had a cash shop pure and simple, yeha maybe i got confused with the lvl 20 character so yeah I am a blantant blatant lier omg. They had a cash shop pure and simple. They had it for skills and extra storage space, so dont bloody lie, I am not mistaken as well they also used to sell dyes in it. So really dont try fudge everything and justify they had a cashop by sayinh " oh it was only for that group". THEY had a CASH SHOP which they probabaly made thousands from it.
Haha I'm sure they made "thousands" from it. With probably 1.5 million players, making "thousands" from a cash shop is pretty piss poor .
Anyway, here is what the GW1 cash shop sold:
1. Cosmetic crap (costumes, name changes, special pets, etc.)
2. The ability to use your other characters as companions (largely cosmetic because your default heroes can do the same crap)
3. Content (expansions, the game, more missions)
4. Extra character slots
5. Skill unlock pack (lets you unlock all skills for your PvP character)
Now really, I don't think that any of this crap is that bad, and I think you're trying to inflate into something it's not.
Does any of that get away from the fact they were probabaly the originators of a cahs shop? This notion of them being generous is somone living in coocky land. Yes ok they didnt sell everything and anythinBUT they had a CASH SHOP, they had items in there that yes wasnt just for apperance, and yes they sold stuff. So lets not try pretend they arnt in it for the money. They probably made thousands if not millionsjust by the low prices, and there were probably thousands of people buying stuff. So
Dude, go practice your reading comprehension. Nobody has claimed that ArenaNet didn't have a cash shop or that they didn't make money from it. People, including myself, just corrected you on the fact that the cash store never game direct in-game advantages, which you claimed it did in your previous post.
IMO, when a company makes a product that many consider to be on par with, if not better than the industry leader, and then offer this product at a lower price point, they do this for only one reason. Aggression. I think that ANet is trying to aggressively position GW2 against WoW and break its stranglehold on the market. They are doing this by trying to make a superior product and then offer it for less money.
This, this and this.
Guild Wars is one of the highest selling PC franchises of all time. Think about what that really means. They were a little no-name company that developed a no-name game with niche appeal and STILL managed to sell 6 million copies.
Just imagine the impact that GW2 is going to have on the market.
ArenaNet might not be in direct competition with other MMO's but no mistake about it, this is still a hostile takeover of the market.
Originally posted by chilliz
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
Blatant lie is blatant. I've played Guild Wars since release and own all campaigns + EotN and they have never charged for Level 20 Characters, they have always been free for PvP and even today you still can't buy Level 20 PvE characters.
Skills unlocks have always been limited to PvP Characters so that those players that want to focus solely on PvP and completely ignore PvE are able to do so and not be gimped. Aside from that everything is cosmetic, even Hero Unlocks as they just allow you to gain benefits you've already had to earn through in-game effort.
Really so your trying to fudge the issue by syaing Arenanet didnt have a cash shop? If it waspvp or pve who the fuck cares, they had a cash shop pure and simple, yeha maybe i got confused with the lvl 20 character so yeah I am a blantant blatant lier omg. They had a cash shop pure and simple. They had it for skills and extra storage space, so dont bloody lie, I am not mistaken as well they also used to sell dyes in it. So really dont try fudge everything and justify they had a cashop by sayinh " oh it was only for that group". THEY had a CASH SHOP which they probabaly made thousands from it.
Haha I'm sure they made "thousands" from it. With probably 1.5 million players, making "thousands" from a cash shop is pretty piss poor .
Anyway, here is what the GW1 cash shop sold:
1. Cosmetic crap (costumes, name changes, special pets, etc.)
2. The ability to use your other characters as companions (largely cosmetic because your default heroes can do the same crap)
3. Content (expansions, the game, more missions)
4. Extra character slots
5. Skill unlock pack (lets you unlock all skills for your PvP character)
Now really, I don't think that any of this crap is that bad, and I think you're trying to inflate into something it's not.
Im not trying to inflate anything. The fact they had it and some peopel pretend here that Anet are doing it out of the goodness of their heart because they are a charity and they love all people is ridiculous. The fact you said they soldcontent, NOT pets, or dyes, but actual content shows they are not in it for the charity or love of the players. Once again I WILL state that is their absolute right to do it, and I will not begrudge them that because I bought skill unlfor my pvp character at lvl 20. The point I am making is that they are not allergic to money, and doing it all out of some pure kindness they were the originators of the cash shop pure and simple.
The fact that i said they made thousands was just me saying it. Lets do some math shall we and lets be generous to because they are Gnenerous and alleric to money.
You say they had 1.5 million ok so lets be generous and say half of that pop bought items at between $5-10 ONLY 1 time that is 700000 players paying $3500000 working on them only paying $5, once again being generous
Lets be generous to anet again and say only half of that were repeat buyers that would mean 450000 players paying again $5 that is $2250000 so on and so on.
Again we can go on and on, and keep being generous to them. So again lets not pretend they didnt make seriuos $$$$ out of their playerbase. Which again is their right and perogitive to do so. But lets not pretend they are a charity and doing it all out of the kindness of their hearts
Does any of that get away from the fact they were probabaly the originators of a cahs shop? This notion of them being generous is somone living in coocky land. Yes ok they didnt sell everything and anythinBUT they had a CASH SHOP, they had items in there that yes wasnt just for apperance, and yes they sold stuff. So lets not try pretend they arnt in it for the money. They probably made thousands if not millionsjust by the low prices, and there were probably thousands of people buying stuff. So
Dude, go practice your reading comprehension. Nobody has claimed that ArenaNet didn't have a cash shop or that they didn't make money from it. People, including myself, just corrected you on the fact that the cash store never game direct in-game advantages, which you claimed it did in your previous post.
Really so selling content and unlockable skills to players that
a) couldnt be arsed runnign dungeons etc to get the skillz dosnt give someone an advantage? Really because let me tell you i bought some skillz from the cash shop, and the really OP skills that I couldnt be arsed to runnign dungeons repeatedly again and agin to get them i just bought from the cash shop. So therefor giving me a direct advantage especially in the pvp area with all the other elitist pricks certain skills on characters or they couldnt get in groups. So yes that 1 skill probabaly did help me the times i did pvp and probabaly helped my group as well.
Unlike blizzard who charge you a sub and then fool people into spending 25 dollars on a stupid sparkley pony.
You know I have a job who takes a lot of my time and some mounts in Wow takes hours to grind. So think that a 25$ mount is not necessarely a bad thing. If blizzard would make only cash shop mounts or make only long grinding mounts it would be stupid, the fact that they allow both is cool.
I prefer buying a 25$ sparking poney mount to my gf wich is less than an hour of work for me , than spend 3-4 hours grinding in a game to get a mount. So i just love that wow allows us to decide how we get our mounts
Does any of that get away from the fact they were probabaly the originators of a cahs shop? This notion of them being generous is somone living in coocky land. Yes ok they didnt sell everything and anythinBUT they had a CASH SHOP, they had items in there that yes wasnt just for apperance, and yes they sold stuff. So lets not try pretend they arnt in it for the money. They probably made thousands if not millionsjust by the low prices, and there were probably thousands of people buying stuff. So
Dude, go practice your reading comprehension. Nobody has claimed that ArenaNet didn't have a cash shop or that they didn't make money from it. People, including myself, just corrected you on the fact that the cash store never game direct in-game advantages, which you claimed it did in your previous post.
Really so selling content and unlockable skills to players that
a) couldnt be arsed runnign dungeons etc to get the skillz dosnt give someone an advantage? Really because let me tell you i bought some skillz from the cash shop, and the really OP skills that I couldnt be arsed to runnign dungeons repeatedly again and agin to get them i just bought from the cash shop. So therefor giving me a direct advantage especially in the pvp area with all the other elitist pricks certain skills on characters or they couldnt get in groups. So yes that 1 skill probabaly did help me the times i did pvp and probabaly helped my group as well.
Using that logic you can't stop at the cash shop then, you have to be against selling the different campaigns as well because they provided the exact same benefits. If you are against the cash shop but not campaigns then you are inconsistent and lose credibility.
Expansions will be out every 3-4 months to offset the subscription lost.
It will work out the same as a subscription way if you want to keep up with the game and stay competative.
So rather than take your money by subs they will get if from expansions.
Looking forward to it though, eyes wide open.
You'll never fall out of competetiveness. Maybe you'll be missing out on some sweet armor designs, but the PvE and PvP in this game are not carrots on a stick. Max statistical value gear is easily obtainable in PvE at max level of 80, which they have no reason to raise with each expansion. And in PvP, you get everything you need the moment you enter the PvP lobby, even right after tutorial. :O
So what your saying is there is no progression lol I really don;t get wtf u pvp for in guild wars 2 if not for gear what can u offer me that would make me wanna do pvp if it's not gear? I think alot of people are going to really displeased wiht the pvp side of things it' s being limited way to much so they can be lazy and not have to balance much. Also no raids so whats the point of gearing up in a regular dungeon sorry but wihtout somesort of progression nobody is going to hang around long after max lvl. RThe reason they get away wiht no trinity is becasue there is no progression at max lvl or the content is super easy.
Ohh my friend you are very very very wrong. There is a huge population, one that I would wager is actually higher then the progression crown you are apart of, that is tired of being led around by a carrot on a stick.
I do not nor will I ever need a carrot on a stick to enjoy a game especailly when its game is all carrots and no sticks.
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Not really... most games give a large amount of content to that degree. In terms of B2P you need to keep in mind that sure, your going to buy it and not have to pay another cent for it, but any big updates will need to be purchased. $50 doesn't sound like much but 6 months later you might need to pay $50 more for an expansion and then $50 more for an expansion 6 months later. While I doubt it will be done in that exact way, its more then likely you will be actually paying for content in this game more often then you might see in a traditional p2p MMo. The cash shop is likely going to alleviate this to some degree but I am sure they will be doing this yearly or at least every 2 years. With that method, its very unlikely many content updates will be released in order to preserved the content for a paid expansion.
I would gladly pay them $50 dollars every 6 months for an expansion. This way I am getting tons of content. I loved that concept in GW1. I was more than happy to give them 50-60 dollars every 6 months in exchange for a huge amount of content.
Your regular MMO will charge you $15 per month and this will mean that in 6 months you will pay $90. However, you will get no content whatsoever. Every single MMO on the market at the moment provides virtually no content in their updates. Period.
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IMO, when a company makes a product that many consider to be on par with, if not better than the industry leader, and then offer this product at a lower price point, they do this for only one reason. Aggression. I think that ANet is trying to aggressively position GW2 against WoW and break its stranglehold on the market. They are doing this by trying to make a superior product and then offer it for less money.
This, this and this.
Guild Wars is one of the highest selling PC franchises of all time. Think about what that really means. They were a little no-name company that developed a no-name game with niche appeal and STILL managed to sell 6 million copies.
Just imagine the impact that GW2 is going to have on the market.
ArenaNet might not be in direct competition with other MMO's but no mistake about it, this is still a hostile takeover of the market.
Originally posted by chilliz
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
Blatant lie is blatant. I've played Guild Wars since release and own all campaigns + EotN and they have never charged for Level 20 Characters, they have always been free for PvP and even today you still can't buy Level 20 PvE characters.
Skills unlocks have always been limited to PvP Characters so that those players that want to focus solely on PvP and completely ignore PvE are able to do so and not be gimped. Aside from that everything is cosmetic, even Hero Unlocks as they just allow you to gain benefits you've already had to earn through in-game effort.
Really so your trying to fudge the issue by syaing Arenanet didnt have a cash shop? If it waspvp or pve who the fuck cares, they had a cash shop pure and simple, yeha maybe i got confused with the lvl 20 character so yeah I am a blantant blatant lier omg. They had a cash shop pure and simple. They had it for skills and extra storage space, so dont bloody lie, I am not mistaken as well they also used to sell dyes in it. So really dont try fudge everything and justify they had a cashop by sayinh " oh it was only for that group". THEY had a CASH SHOP which they probabaly made thousands from it.
Haha I'm sure they made "thousands" from it. With probably 1.5 million players, making "thousands" from a cash shop is pretty piss poor .
Anyway, here is what the GW1 cash shop sold:
1. Cosmetic crap (costumes, name changes, special pets, etc.)
2. The ability to use your other characters as companions (largely cosmetic because your default heroes can do the same crap)
3. Content (expansions, the game, more missions)
4. Extra character slots
5. Skill unlock pack (lets you unlock all skills for your PvP character)
Now really, I don't think that any of this crap is that bad, and I think you're trying to inflate into something it's not.
Im not trying to inflate anything. The fact they had it and some peopel pretend here that Anet are doing it out of the goodness of their heart because they are a charity and they love all people is ridiculous. The fact you said they soldcontent, NOT pets, or dyes, but actual content shows they are not in it for the charity or love of the players. Once again I WILL state that is their absolute right to do it, and I will not begrudge them that because I bought skill unlfor my pvp character at lvl 20. The point I am making is that they are not allergic to money, and doing it all out of some pure kindness they were the originators of the cash shop pure and simple.
The fact that i said they made thousands was just me saying it. Lets do some math shall we and lets be generous to because they are Gnenerous and alleric to money.
You say they had 1.5 million ok so lets be generous and say half of that pop bought items at between $5-10 ONLY 1 time that is 700000 players paying $3500000 working on them only paying $5, once again being generous
Lets be generous to anet again and say only half of that were repeat buyers that would mean 450000 players paying again $5 that is $2250000 so on and so on.
Again we can go on and on, and keep being generous to them. So again lets not pretend they didnt make seriuos $$$$ out of their playerbase. Which again is their right and perogitive to do so. But lets not pretend they are a charity and doing it all out of the kindness of their hearts
Of course they are in it for money...they are a for profit company . I never was arguing that they are just being altruistic...and if you look at my previous post in this thread you will see that. So actually, I probably agree with you.
Anyway, all I'm saying is that the cash shop in GW1 was not implemented in a way that is unethical, unfair to the players, or harms the game in some way. It was a "good" cash shop. But yes, still a for profit cash shop.
Comments
Ah men to the OP. I was seriously done with MMO's, then over the last few months I've been glancing at Guildwars 2 and reading about it, then last monday when I heard about WvWvW and took into consideration everything else I've read, I think I'll be putting some time in.
I mean dear god, there are so many skills per character its unreal. I was just looking at the engineer class since it seems by far the most diverse and I couldn't believe how many options they give you 30-40 skills... I mean I craped my pants and sent a check in that day.....
I would be surprised if there weren't "mission packs" or one-off dungeons, or a whole host of cash shop items we're not prepared for, before this goes live.
I agree with @Creslin about the aggressive pricing, but something still doesn't add up. How do you recoup your costs on the initial development, plus pay the salaries of 50 developers, and keep the lights on with only ONE x-pack per year?
I guess we'll find out. But if the cash-shop is a little more robust than anticipated, or we see downloadable content available for a fee, I fear the deluge of tears that will hit the forums.
I doubt we'll see full blown expansions every six months, but I'm sure they'll be releasing content regardless, I wouldn't mind seeing content packs/dungeons etc.. in the cash-shop, I'd rather buy that, much more so than cosmetics.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
It's not foolish! because the mentallity of the wow player is to collect everything so they can feel more leet than all you other noobs, blizzard know if they release a unique item in the store that the fans will go mad to get their hands on it..a mount is somehow worth more than subscription cost to a game and you cant even keep that mount unless you keep subscribing to the game..its a scam nothing more.
Mass effect 2 was uninspiring so why woud i buy mass effect 3?
Have any of the actual people here even played GW1 before any expansions came out or after it? I played GW1 for a year and played a monk. let me tell you Anet was one of the firts companies to use a cash shopthe term cash shop or micro transanctions was a popular term back then. Anet charged for all sorts of crap from skills, characters to lvl 20 etc etc.
So the OP must be living is some sort of coocky land if he dosnt think Anet didnt absoultley makea killingfrom the cash shop. Organised pvp instances wer a big thing, and trust me they must have mad a killing from pvp players. Sorry but Anet used to sel anything and verything back then. And I played GW1 some 6 years ago when all the fanbois in this thread didnt even play GW.
Ye well, you can't really blame blizz for peoples lack of control or for actually liking the stuff there or even for knowing their playerbase. They are not forcing anyone to buy those things, it's the players choice. When I used to play, I never bought any of those items and enjoyed my time without them. As long as it doesn't influence the actual gaming experience and it's kept to fluff level, no one is forced to buy anything in any cash shop and hope ANet keep it that way too.
I don't think you actually played GW1 after reading that, sure they must have made cash on there shop but the problem is none of it was neccessary as almost all of it (Except for the cosmetic costumes) could be obtained in game and through other means.
If you didn't want to unlock something in game you could do so with cash on the store. It gave you no in game advantage over any other player and the prices were low.
But hey maybe you know more than I do since I only played GW for about 7 years.
ArenaNet have already stated that the short development cycle of GW1 was not good for their creative process and they found they had to cut a lot of things from each expansion which werent ready for the public.
I doubt they would put themselves under such stressful conditions again, and expansions will more likely be on a yearly basis with smaller content patches (mainly cash shop options such as cosmetic items) every 2-3 months.
"The problem with quotes from the Internet is that it's almost impossible to validate their authenticity." - Abraham Lincoln
Haven't played GW, but beside the cosmetic stuff, could anything be optained through in game means, including extra story/quest/mission stuff?
Its not a scam and you are foolish to clump all gamers into one stereotype and if those gamers wana waste their money to get something they can and it doesnt affect your gameplay other then what Jelousy? If you buy everything a game gives you ust for the sake of having it and store it its your choice, if you do it and complain after saying "they forced me!" then your an idiot and should stop playing video games the genre is better off without you. I am a believer that everything should be earnable in a game but im not so blind that i think what some games do are evil and they implant things in my mind that makes me buy some stupid item that has no value.
Basicly if you fall for it and buy it itss your fault your the reason they sell things like that and personally stop playing games if your the sucker an you complain about it as your doing it. There suppose to make money thats how games work, run, and get developed and game desingers usually get paid crap and work crap hours and its all a waste if there game does suck and doesn't turn a profit. But seriously thats really just ignorant you make it sound like they have mind control devices.
P.S. not saying if you buy it and are happy/disatisfied but you understand they didnt make you then so be it unless they actually lied about it before you bought it then i understand. Its like those people that pre-order a game buy a year sub before there free month is up then 2 months down the road they complain that they arent having fun anymore and they MADE you waste your money, they dont make you you just made a stupid emotional decision with your money(or mommy's money) and refuse to take responsibility that you made a mistake.
I played the original Guild Wars at launch and got every single expansion.... and I have no idea what you are talking about.
You could not buy level 20 characters, ever. Everyone can make level 20 characters for the sole purpose of PvP, and you didnt need to pay for that. The skills you could buy were only a PvP character unlock, you had to earn your skills as every PvE character.
Up until after Nightfall, the only things available in the cash shop were unlocks for PvP or unlocks for all pet types.... things you could already earn in game through normal gameplay. On top of that, the pet unlocks didnt include any of the prestige pets, which you were still expected to earn. I didnt feel the need to buy a single thing from the cash shop.
At some point before Eye of the North they introduced appearance armor for $4-5 each, which has been pretty popular as most people in towns would have some appearance armor on. This isnt necessary though, as there are dozens of armor appearance options, many which take a lot of effort to aquire and look fantastic.
They also introduced a few mini-adventures that you can play through for a small fee (I think it was $5 for all 4 adventures). These books expanded on the lore for the NPC characters of Gwen, Saul, Togo and Turai but didnt provide any advantage over players who chose not to buy them.
This stuff hardly qualifies as 'anything and everything'. In fact it is the most tame Cash Shop I have seen in any game. With most things obtainable through normal gameplay, or completely irrelevant to your character aside from appearance.
This, this and this.
Guild Wars is one of the highest selling PC franchises of all time. Think about what that really means. They were a little no-name company that developed a no-name game with niche appeal and STILL managed to sell 6 million copies.
Just imagine the impact that GW2 is going to have on the market.
ArenaNet might not be in direct competition with other MMO's but no mistake about it, this is still a hostile takeover of the market.
Blatant lie is blatant. I've played Guild Wars since release and own all campaigns + EotN and they have never charged for Level 20 Characters, they have always been free for PvP and even today you still can't buy Level 20 PvE characters.
Skills unlocks have always been limited to PvP Characters so that those players that want to focus solely on PvP and completely ignore PvE are able to do so and not be gimped. Aside from that everything is cosmetic, even Hero Unlocks as they just allow you to gain benefits you've already had to earn through in-game effort.
Really so your trying to fudge the issue by syaing Arenanet didnt have a cash shop? If it waspvp or pve who the fuck cares, they had a cash shop pure and simple, yeha maybe i got confused with the lvl 20 character so yeah I am a blantant blatant lier omg. They had a cash shop pure and simple. They had it for skills and extra storage space, so dont bloody lie, I am not mistaken as well they also used to sell dyes in it. So really dont try fudge everything and justify they had a cashop by sayinh " oh it was only for that group". THEY had a CASH SHOP which they probabaly made thousands from it.
Does any of that get away from the fact they were probabaly the originators of a cahs shop? This notion of them being generous is somone living in coocky land. Yes ok they didnt sell everything and anythinBUT they had a CASH SHOP, they had items in there that yes wasnt just for apperance, and yes they sold stuff. So lets not try pretend they arnt in it for the money. They probably made thousands if not millionsjust by the low prices, and there were probably thousands of people buying stuff. So
They had a Cash Shop, Yes.
No one is disputing that.
I think your understanding of what a Cash Shop is far different from what ANet offered though.
You're looking for that other Cash Shop on the Corner of Pay2Win & EZMode.
"The problem with quotes from the Internet is that it's almost impossible to validate their authenticity." - Abraham Lincoln
Im not misunderstanding anything. I wasnt making the point if it was pay2win, or ezmode. I am trying to point out there whole aim was to make money, yes its a business and that is there right, but tOP must be living is seriuos denial mode, if he thinks that Anet were generouos and allergic to money.
"At some point before Eye of the North they introduced appearance armor for $4-5 each, which has been pretty popular as most people in towns would have some appearance armor on. This isnt necessary though, as there are dozens of armor appearance options, many which take a lot of effort to aquire and look fantastic.
They also introduced a few mini-adventures that you can play through for a small fee (I think it was $5 for all 4 adventures). These books expanded on the lore for the NPC characters of Gwen, Saul, Togo and Turai but didnt provide any advantage over players who chose not to buy them"
These are some of the features aded to yes the cash shop after the original, I dont know what else has been added as I havnt played GW in years. So lets not try pretend Anet are allergic to money and they are doing it out of the kindness of their hearts. If blizzard had implemented any of these they would be chastaized on this site. Lets not try pretend paying for skills dosnt affect peoples play style. becausanyone in pvp who has the better skills agasint the player who hasnt bought them might and will probably lose. yes those are game affecting. because the wankers that used to stand in the pvp area lFG all day used to specifficaly ask for those skills on players, and if said person hadnt acquired them or couldnt eb arsed to, you know what he did??? Yes thats right good ol cash shop.
Haha I'm sure they made "thousands" from it. With probably 1.5 million players, making "thousands" from a cash shop is pretty piss poor
.
Anyway, here is what the GW1 cash shop sold:
1. Cosmetic crap (costumes, name changes, special pets, etc.)
2. The ability to use your other characters as companions (largely cosmetic because your default heroes can do the same crap)
3. Content (expansions, the game, more missions)
4. Extra character slots
5. Skill unlock pack (lets you unlock all skills for your PvP character)
Now really, I don't think that any of this crap is that bad, and I think you're trying to inflate into something it's not.
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Dude, go practice your reading comprehension. Nobody has claimed that ArenaNet didn't have a cash shop or that they didn't make money from it. People, including myself, just corrected you on the fact that the cash store never game direct in-game advantages, which you claimed it did in your previous post.
Im not trying to inflate anything. The fact they had it and some peopel pretend here that Anet are doing it out of the goodness of their heart because they are a charity and they love all people is ridiculous. The fact you said they soldcontent, NOT pets, or dyes, but actual content shows they are not in it for the charity or love of the players. Once again I WILL state that is their absolute right to do it, and I will not begrudge them that because I bought skill unlfor my pvp character at lvl 20. The point I am making is that they are not allergic to money, and doing it all out of some pure kindness they were the originators of the cash shop pure and simple.
The fact that i said they made thousands was just me saying it. Lets do some math shall we and lets be generous to because they are Gnenerous and alleric to money.
You say they had 1.5 million ok so lets be generous and say half of that pop bought items at between $5-10 ONLY 1 time that is 700000 players paying $3500000 working on them only paying $5, once again being generous
Lets be generous to anet again and say only half of that were repeat buyers that would mean 450000 players paying again $5 that is $2250000 so on and so on.
Again we can go on and on, and keep being generous to them. So again lets not pretend they didnt make seriuos $$$$ out of their playerbase. Which again is their right and perogitive to do so. But lets not pretend they are a charity and doing it all out of the kindness of their hearts
Really so selling content and unlockable skills to players that
a) couldnt be arsed runnign dungeons etc to get the skillz dosnt give someone an advantage? Really because let me tell you i bought some skillz from the cash shop, and the really OP skills that I couldnt be arsed to runnign dungeons repeatedly again and agin to get them i just bought from the cash shop. So therefor giving me a direct advantage especially in the pvp area with all the other elitist pricks certain skills on characters or they couldnt get in groups. So yes that 1 skill probabaly did help me the times i did pvp and probabaly helped my group as well.
You know I have a job who takes a lot of my time and some mounts in Wow takes hours to grind. So think that a 25$ mount is not necessarely a bad thing. If blizzard would make only cash shop mounts or make only long grinding mounts it would be stupid, the fact that they allow both is cool.
I prefer buying a 25$ sparking poney mount to my gf wich is less than an hour of work for me , than spend 3-4 hours grinding in a game to get a mount. So i just love that wow allows us to decide how we get our mounts
Using that logic you can't stop at the cash shop then, you have to be against selling the different campaigns as well because they provided the exact same benefits. If you are against the cash shop but not campaigns then you are inconsistent and lose credibility.
Ohh my friend you are very very very wrong. There is a huge population, one that I would wager is actually higher then the progression crown you are apart of, that is tired of being led around by a carrot on a stick.
I do not nor will I ever need a carrot on a stick to enjoy a game especailly when its game is all carrots and no sticks.
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I would gladly pay them $50 dollars every 6 months for an expansion. This way I am getting tons of content. I loved that concept in GW1. I was more than happy to give them 50-60 dollars every 6 months in exchange for a huge amount of content.
Your regular MMO will charge you $15 per month and this will mean that in 6 months you will pay $90. However, you will get no content whatsoever. Every single MMO on the market at the moment provides virtually no content in their updates. Period.
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Of course they are in it for money...they are a for profit company
. I never was arguing that they are just being altruistic...and if you look at my previous post in this thread you will see that. So actually, I probably agree with you.
Anyway, all I'm saying is that the cash shop in GW1 was not implemented in a way that is unethical, unfair to the players, or harms the game in some way. It was a "good" cash shop. But yes, still a for profit cash shop.
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