Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Calling all people who think Sandbox mechanics need to be put back into MMOS!
Zlayer77
Member Posts: 826
No longer are MMOs are created with the expectation that anything can happen. Those days are long past. If players were left to forge their own destinies it would result in chaos and conflict which would be unacceptable to the story obsessed new breed of video game designer who insists that every aspect of what a player does should be tightly controlled and scripted. You see, you as a player can’t be trusted.
Instead MMOs have become virtual sausage factories where the spectator-like player sits back and enjoys the ride. Game design has been reduced to process of crafting every moment of the player experience — nothing is left to chance — a philosophy that would make amusement park tycoon Walt Disney proud.
Wolfshead 11/2-2012
After reading Wolfsheads artical it has gotten me thinking Maybe We need to do a PROTEST SUB to a SANDBOX to show the Industry that this is the gameplay that we want. But we might not want that sanbox but we want the mechanics and we want Developers who we can Respect...
So Im asking here, all those of you WHO miss the old days should we pick one Sandbox game and all Sub to it for one Month in protest against the Industry for making brainless games without any challenge??
My sugestion is that we Subcribe to EvE online. Reason for this is that its up to date, it has by far one of the largest subscription numbers of the old games. And CCP might have done wrong a few times but they always OWN up to their misstakes.
But Im open to sugestions...
So the question is would you SUB to a sandbox game for 1 month in Protest!
Comments
To be a bit more clear I would sugest that we do this In numbers and all sub at about the same time.. We pick the game and announce publicly that we are subing and then we do it... If we get enough people onboard we can do this very organized... I think the time has come to fight back.. And the Only way to fight back is with Money this is the sad truth...
Well i hope you can get enough players for protest. Even thought i doubt all 4 of you can make them think otherwise. Good luck.
Good job. I am on board. Just let me know.
Currently bored with MMO's.
hehe Well its more to see if people would do it. Get enough people and you can make a diffrence. But Whining on the forums havent got us anywere for the last 8 years.
If we want something new that is an A+ title we have to do something that takes notice. This goes for you themeparkers that are fed up with playing clone games also. Only way to get a new type of game is if we show that we are willing to go to Extremes to make that happen..
You are not going to get as many people as you would like to sign your petition. The reason that most people play themeparks rather than sanboxes is that it is really only a sandbox for people who have been playing since the beginning. If you are not there at the start, you are not entering a sandbox; you are entering a themepark world created by the players who were there before you. It is no longer a sandbox for you because you will encounter a world created by others.
Hedonismbot: Your latest performance was as delectable as dipping my bottom over and over into a bath of the silkiest oils and creams.
I'll do it, I've played every MMORPG released, and telling you what, if I could play AA (archeage) I would not be on these forums right now.
(-_-)
I see your point ... but i do not think that is 100% true. EVE being my example. You can do what you want.. true there are more established players/corps but they tend to get broken up by the mechanics of the game - the mechanics of which are - anything goes. Corps have died on the whim of 1 disgruntled member. New corps start, old alliances fail and new ones arise. All we are hoping is that other people try it. But they will never do that unless they know that there is a market for it. That some of us have played enough themeparks. nuff said.
Currently bored with MMO's.
Maybe i'm unique, but a sandbox is more about being able to change the world than creating it from scratch, that in my opinion is important.So suggesting new users can't come into the game is just BS
join us and we will be 5, or 6 or whatever.
Currently bored with MMO's.
The thing is that we are not totaly happy with the sanboxes ourself. Or we would be playing them and be happy right? But I think there is a huge market for a sanbox hybrid. And I think many of you that are tired of the Clones.. would like to have more tools to effec the game world.
And that you cant effect a sanbox is just not true.. You dont have to be there at the start to make an Impact.
And this is a genral protest against the Industry for making Clone games and not trying something new and Innovationg. And for not trusting us to create things inside the game worlds. It a protest against putting everything On rails and forcing us to just ride along.. and be happy.
We need more sanbox feeling In MMOS or it will be like Wolfshead put it
If anything, this has made me pause to reflect about the current state of virtual MMOs and the unfortunate suicidal direction they are heading in — a virtual bridge to nowhere.
Those of us looking for a serious fantasy virtual world experience have few options. It’s like we are trapped a dark age where ancient knowledge has been lost and barbarism holds sway and I’m not the only one that believe this. I get letters from readers every week that lament the loss of what once was. Perhaps, while we still remember them, it’s time to draft a MMORPG manifesto and codify the noble principles and unswerving constants that many of us believe were hallmarks of the first golden age of this genre
Originaly by Wholfshead.. creative changes by Zlayer77 to avoid fanboying
I don't agree (in a constructive way) with you. If we do a paralel with the real world, generations built the world before us and still, it constantly evolve. No one puts a path before me I must follow, I can choose whatever I want to do or wherever I want to go. A sandbox is as much a virtual world as it is a video game.
this.
Currently bored with MMO's.
agree
. And we want that freedom back...
That doesn't mean I'll sub to another game, I'm broken lol
Good initiative here. Someone's got to start a movement of sorts eg "The Slow Movement" etc. I'd sign up but circumstances disallow for now. I'll be signing up for sandbox only mmorpgs going forwards however and will get going on EvE "evenchually" as Manuel would say unless Infinity comes out before. Traveller AR sometime this month too.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
That's not how MMORPG work. They do not constantly evolve unless the developers change them. In Eve Online, the latest stories of someone worming their way into a corporation are the same as the stories from a year ago. Only the individuals and the scale of the events change. The chain of events is just a repeat of the events that happened a year ago. All MMORPG are like this. Unless you're there when the door opens, you're just going back over and doing something that somebody has already done.
There are only two exceptions to this. One is to allow players to mod the game itself and the second is to have the players create their own rules that are socially enforced and everyone plays along. Ultima Online auction houses are an example of the second and so are the RPG/PvP servers in WoW where one side or the other 'owns' a section of land because they won a battle. It's by common player agreement that this works. The first method (mods) will not happen in an MMORPG.
I don't agree with Skooma2's verbiage (sandbox games are sandbox games, regardless of how old they are), but new players are still just retreading content that's been done by older players whether they are playing a sandbox game or a theme park.
** edit **
I have no interest in playing what is possibly the most boring game in existence just to prove a point. I will keep playing the games I like. For now, that's Minecraft.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
will be in again this month - mostly as a miner. Silus Morde will be the name if you are looking to mine.
Currently bored with MMO's.
guess we can just disagree then, but which do you prefer? The retreaded sandbox where you at least have the illusion of freedom or the retreaded Themepark where you are buckled safely in for the ride?
Currently bored with MMO's.
Let's make a real stand and all order the same PNP rulebook to a "REAL" RPG.
I'm not sure if EvE is the best one to choose. It already has enough of a playerbase that a few more won't be noticeable. We all need ot pick a game where a boost in population would be noticed.
"I am not in a server with Gankers...THEY ARE IN A SERVER WITH ME!!!"
I see the buzz word "sandbox" thrown around so much. I'm not certian that any 2 people mean the same thing when they use the term.
Please, difine the meaning of the word "sandbox" as it pertains to the MMO.
Is it a game like Second Life or Tale in the Desert? Are there no quests in it at all? Is it something without any direction at all?
It seems that endgame in any MMO is a sandbox, and people complain there is nothing to do.
Or is it just game feature that you are talking about like crafting and housing?
When I see "sandbox" I think, no quests, no story, nothing but avatars and a combat system.
So, please describe exactly what a "sandbox" game is?
"Don't corpse-camp that idea. Its never gonna rez"
Bladezz (The Guild)
"Gosh, that sandbox game got 50 new subscribers today. Maybe we should consider making a sandbox game." -Themepark Developer A, who then alt-tabs and codes features for 300k+ players
The reality is players want a good game first, and a world second, and that means sandbox-lite (if it's sandbox at all.)
I think a game can feel like a sandbox while still being predominantly themepark (aka Skyrim) but overall the non-MMO sandbox market is way larger than the MMO sandbox market and that will likely never change.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Without going as extreme as giving the ability to players to "mod" the games, I think it would be possible to let them make significant changes to the world and the environment.
For example (I like giving examples lol): a faction builds a city with houses and infrastructures and another faction decides to attack this city and destroy it, this faction will then increase it's influence over the teritory. Ok that's a very simple overview of the situation but that would imply an evolution positive or negative on the environment. No one did mod the game but its world changed, physicaly (the city was destroyed) and culturaly (a faction expand its influence over another).
How about you describe what it is "not"?!
Forward momentum disallows dialectics, you're either with or "not with" on this one, sonny.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
The first part is what actually pops into my head. How many those "new subscribers" would be needed to even people think its big enough ?
5000 ? I don't think that would do it
10,000 ? I still dont think that would do much
100,000 I doubt there are that many people would do it.
Chances are, people wait for others to fight the fight and enjoy the result IF it works. If it doesn't work, they lose nothing.
The problem with "sandbox mechanics" is that this is exactly what happens.
I like games where players can have a visual impact on the environment (furniture, terrain deformation) but with some administration oversight. Personally I like the "mortal builders" program in Midkemia Online; players can apply for a building license and then they get to work with the staff on creating new areas.