You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
Some of these pay to win arguments are getting so flimsy I'm starting to think that some of those arguing loudest with barely a basis to their argument are secret gold farm customers who are annoyed at losing out potentially on an advantage.
It is to my understanding, that gems do not bring in new gold, as it is gold that a player has earn already, being bought. Is that no longer the case? Did I miss something?
Yeah because everyone knows that the Cash shop is really a conspiracy devised by ANet and it's loyal customer base to trick ANet's evil master, NCSoft into thinking that there really is a future moneymaking plan in place when everyone knows it's just there for show and isn't really supposed to earn money by not offering anything worth paying real money for.
No RMT gold farmer has ever used money that was spawned from nothing. They have always been earned by someone in game. The difference is that farmers will use the game to obtain gold and items to convert into gold (mats and drops) where as ANet is spawning something of value directly into the economy that did not previously exist in game nor was it worked for. But rather is introduced into the economy via credit card.
The whole statement about gold being earned by players is a straw-man. it has always been that way.
What is it they are spawning into the economy!
In my previous experience most cash shop items are no trade and have no effect on the economy.
Now I never used gw1 cash shop so I can't comment on it.
This is a similar arguement.
But look at it like this.
I need gold and don't have any.
You have gold
I use real money to buy a gem worth the value of gold you have
we trade
Now, I have gold, and you have a gem worth the same value as the gold you had before
neither of us has nothing.
Fair point. But to get the gold I will then have to exchange the gem to another player with gold and so on, in theory eventually a player will end up with a gem that can't be traded as noone has the gold to do so. But that is theory.
Your point is a good one and likely to be practical and bears thinking about
Currently playing- SWG PreCU & GW 2 Have tried WoW, AoC, & Vanguard, SWG:NGE, GW, LOTRO & SWTOR Best MMO: SWG Worst MMO: SWTOR
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Just to stur the pot, influence can be bought via gold, and influence can be used to purchase direct buffs to almost every apsect of the game, including buffs in the WvWvW world. ;P
by the guild that buys the buff and only in the immediate area of the tower/keep/castle/supply depot they own.
Also people will still buy gold even with no cash shop. I'd rather money go back into the game however, rather than gold sellers.
And if you think noone buys gold, than you are deluding yourself.
lol where did this come from?
IMO there will probably be gold sellers still, so you can buy gems in the cash shop, but you can't buy gold, so gold farmers will sell the gold, i personally would rather support ANet but i see what he is saying.
Yeah I thought this thread was about buying gems to buy gold to buy influence.
I was making a point that even without the gems part, people will still buy gold to get the influence if they so wished.
I'd rather my money went back into the game than an external gold selling company.
Ahh ok, so pay money for gold in game to get what gems can get, because you are buying the gems to get what's in the cash shop?
But in order to get gems you must give gold to players in game?
Did I miss something
I've caused confusion by notbposting properly lol.
Not quite.
From what I understand, gems can be used to buy gold, and gems can be brought with cash.
But the gold that gems buy, is coming from players in the game who have earn the gold, pretty much legalised gold farmers.
So it's not newly generated gold. And my point was that if you takeaway the cash shop option, than players will still buy the gold, using the traditional gold farmers we all know and love.
So the argument that guild wars 2 is pay to win cos of the gems for gold issue is kind of....pointless inmy mind
Ahh ok lol, I acttually get what you mean.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
Kind of yes, even if the CS weren't in game, he is saying people will still buy gold, they will do so by getting it from gold farmers/sellers, 3rd party sites. which they can use that gold to buy influence, or P2W, just it would be P2W via 3rd party, and not ANet. gold farmers typically is just one guy, multiple comps on 1 keyboard and he finds a way to amass a bunch of gold, then sells it on a 3rd party website for real money. or somewhere along those lines.
Correct me if i'm wrong
Yeah that was my point
A lot of the p2w arguments I see centre around the gems for gold deal.
But gold sellers have been around for a long time and people will always buy gold so that argument is pointless as it pretty much applies to every mmo.
As I say I'd rather the game got supported by gold buyers rather than an individual.
Currently playing- SWG PreCU & GW 2 Have tried WoW, AoC, & Vanguard, SWG:NGE, GW, LOTRO & SWTOR Best MMO: SWG Worst MMO: SWTOR
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Currently playing- SWG PreCU & GW 2 Have tried WoW, AoC, & Vanguard, SWG:NGE, GW, LOTRO & SWTOR Best MMO: SWG Worst MMO: SWTOR
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
It just seems so difficult since you can't just repeat things over and over and over.
Maybe people will farm karma lol, but then again that's easy to get like gold.
Though SWG was a sandbox so I'm sure they had things.
I was going to say they could have bots sit at an event and let others complete it but the bot would have to do something atleast once and it'll prolly get less gold depending on how much it did.
Souds like hell for a farmer.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
It just seems so difficult since you can't just repeat things over and over and over.
Maybe people will farm karma lol, but then again that's easy to get like gold.
Though SWG was a sandbox so I'm sure they had things.
I was going to say they could have bots sit at an event and let others complete it but the bot would have to do something atleast once and it'll prolly get less gold depending on how much it did.
Souds like hell for a farmer.
i think that is what ANet is trying to do, other than make a pretty good game.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
You can use gold to buy gear but watching TB's De video he made a good amount of karma from 1 DE dunno if it was boosted for beta but he could get 1 piece of blue karma gear from 1 DE run
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
You can use gold to buy gear but watching TB's De video he made a good amount of karma from 1 DE dunno if it was boosted for beta but he could get 1 piece of blue karma gear from 1 DE run
I doubt he boosted his karma, i mean it is possible by all means, but doubtfull, and thats why these CS is evil threads are.... pointless? there isn't a gear treadmill and on top of that it's simple to get, gold farming still has a chance to be a hassle or P2W aspect, but gold in this game can only buy you so much, nothing beats knowing your toon in this game, it all comes down to skill.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
I doubt he boosted his karma, i mean it is possible by all means, but doubtfull, and thats why these CS is evil threads are.... pointless? there isn't a gear treadmill and on top of that it's simple to get, gold farming still has a chance to be a hassle or P2W aspect, but gold in this game can only buy you so much, nothing beats knowing your toon in this game, it all comes down to skill.
Doubtful yes, but noone knows for sure except for Anet. If they are more concerned with people accessing all the content, rather than testing the economy / attrition rates, then it would make sense for Anet to boost karma / gold gain for everyone to make it easier to test the content. However, I don't think this is the case.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
You can use gold to buy gear but watching TB's De video he made a good amount of karma from 1 DE dunno if it was boosted for beta but he could get 1 piece of blue karma gear from 1 DE run
I doubt he boosted his karma, i mean it is possible by all means, but doubtfull, and thats why these CS is evil threads are.... pointless? there isn't a gear treadmill and on top of that it's simple to get, gold farming still has a chance to be a hassle or P2W aspect, but gold in this game can only buy you so much, nothing beats knowing your toon in this game, it all comes down to skill.
i meant that karma in general was boosted for beta. not that an individual did. the boost in the shop arent high enough to effect the karma anyay at least not at his level, but he was getting enough to buy weapons and gear per de
I doubt he boosted his karma, i mean it is possible by all means, but doubtfull, and thats why these CS is evil threads are.... pointless? there isn't a gear treadmill and on top of that it's simple to get, gold farming still has a chance to be a hassle or P2W aspect, but gold in this game can only buy you so much, nothing beats knowing your toon in this game, it all comes down to skill.
Doubtful yes, but noone knows for sure except for Anet. If they are more concerned with people accessing all the content, rather than testing the economy / attrition rates, then it would make sense for Anet to boost karma / gold gain for everyone to make it easier to test the content. However, I don't think this is the case.
yea i agree with you, ANet could've hyped everything up no doubt, but also it was only 2-3 days? so thats is non-comparable after its been released for 3 months.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
You have a point, you mean people pay for Gold to get influence, with or without gems, if anything gems like already said negate this being p2w any way, because people would have to play to get gold to buy the gems.
I got another question to, is gold farming done by bots or what's the actual process?
So it's gold farmers one should be concerned about not the gems and cash shop.
Which in fact makes a lot of sense.
Correct me if I'm still being dumb/wrong lol.
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
It just seems so difficult since you can't just repeat things over and over and over.
Maybe people will farm karma lol, but then again that's easy to get like gold.
Though SWG was a sandbox so I'm sure they had things.
I was going to say they could have bots sit at an event and let others complete it but the bot would have to do something atleast once and it'll prolly get less gold depending on how much it did.
Souds like hell for a farmer.
i think that is what ANet is trying to do, other than make a pretty good game.
I think it is as well.
I almost feel like their reasoning for a lot of design choices in the game was not only to change the typical MMO feel, but as well combat all the gamebreaking issues they had.
I.e for WvWvW no keep trading,no points for killing and camping players, and so on.
In PVE the de's are made to not repeat really fast and reward you based on how much you did.
Level scaling.
Ability to get things in cash shop but making it where those that play will have the upperhand in wvwvw or pve before those that try to buy gems in order to get gold, because you need gold first.
The downtime of influences is like a day long, they can't be stacked.
It's not a gear grind, so xp boosters on only killing mobs doesn't matter.
You get a lot of karma so karma boosts don't matter in the first place.
List goes on and on.
Though in a sense this is what I was talking about in the first place, they made a game to combat all these p2w attempts and are trying to make a fun game at the same time, but in order to achieve this you must change a lot of things from the norm in which you'll end up innovating(not bring nothing new) and changing up experiences.
Game makes the cash shop optional because of the game itself, and gives hell to farmers. Not saying they won't go through hell to get money, but sheesh it's like you will be doing it for awhile. Maybe even years to get some amount people are interested in.
Hey but if I'm wrong on this let me know, I don't mind talking about it more.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
A lot of the p2w arguments I see centre around the gems for gold deal.
But gold sellers have been around for a long time and people will always buy gold so that argument is pointless as it pretty much applies to every mmo.
As I say I'd rather the game got supported by gold buyers rather than an individual.
I agree with you.
There is actually a real problem here but most people seems to have missed the point. The problem is that you can buy influence for gold, not gold for gems.
Take away that and it would solve the problem.
It is not as huge as some people scream about but it should be fixed anyways. The alternative is to take away all the buffs in the mists.
A lot of the p2w arguments I see centre around the gems for gold deal.
But gold sellers have been around for a long time and people will always buy gold so that argument is pointless as it pretty much applies to every mmo.
As I say I'd rather the game got supported by gold buyers rather than an individual.
I agree with you.
There is actually a real problem here but most people seems to have missed the point. The problem is that you can buy influence for gold, not gold for gems.
Take away that and it would solve the problem.
It is not as huge as some people scream about but it should be fixed anyways. The alternative is to take away all the buffs in the mists.
Doesn't make sense to however, when you consider the buffs are only for the immediate area of whatever fort the guild happens to own, while they own it. People are complaining simply for the reason of trying to tear the game down, not because it's a real issue.
A lot of the p2w arguments I see centre around the gems for gold deal.
But gold sellers have been around for a long time and people will always buy gold so that argument is pointless as it pretty much applies to every mmo.
As I say I'd rather the game got supported by gold buyers rather than an individual.
I agree with you.
There is actually a real problem here but most people seems to have missed the point. The problem is that you can buy influence for gold, not gold for gems.
Take away that and it would solve the problem.
It is not as huge as some people scream about but it should be fixed anyways. The alternative is to take away all the buffs in the mists.
The way I see it, the game (any game) needs gold sinks. Buying a large amount of influence for 100g is something that at least has the potential to be a repeat purchase by a bunch of guilds on a regular basis. It seems like a major sink as opposed to other ones like teleportation and repair seem like particularly minor amounts.
Another thing too is that I'm one of those people who is looking forward to converting my excess gold to gems to buy character slots. There needs to be something worth buying with gold for that transaction to work, otherwise people just buy gems to buy store things directly.
As I posted earlier (either in this thread or one of the others), there are people out there who are willing to spend tons of cash in a cash shop (people who use the shop average $50 per month in Puzzle Pirates, while the other 95% play for free (source)). It's just good business to give those people stuff to buy, especially if it doesn't really affect anybody else.
I look at ArenaNet's cash shop like it's appealing to people with more money than brains. If someone wants to spend a ton of cash to buy XP boosts that don't really help them accomplish much of anything, go ahead. If someone wants to try to spend real money to convert to influence like they think that they're going to make a difference among the 2000 people who are fighting, be my guest. ArenaNet will enjoy their money and the rest of us will enjoy playing a AAA MMO with no subscription.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
What's the next excuse? WvW isn't PvP so it doesn't have to be fair? Siege weapons can be used against players or the all mighty fort door. Hell, every gem buyer can buy the most expensive, and the only mobile siege weapon, the siege golem (A gundam!).
For those that don't already know, you can buy gems in the cash shop, then trade them for gold with other players.
Man if the price were 100g+ I will agree with you, but for 1g? really?
I encourage you to watch a few of the press videos that are out. You get about 1-2 silver per event from what they show. When I played at an expo last year I had a handfull of silver at level 4. GW2's money flow is a lot less than other games.
I remember in DaoC, getting that first gold. Think I was in my 20's. Granted, when you are 50 plats are easy to get. If you have EVER played a mmorpg you know how this works.. early levels is hard to get money, later levels easier. You are now just grasping at straws. You keep posting on a forum for a game you obviously hate, throwing out anything you can reach for so you can tell yourself you are right in front of a bunch of strangers.
Really? I hate this game? Holy shit, my first encounter with a hostile fanchild.
I actually really like this game. The mechanics and the flavor are excellent. I hate what they've done with the shop, though, and I'm on a crusade to get any advantage-granting items removed from it. If that means I hate the game in your eyes then so be it, but nothing could be farther from the truth.
I can tell you for a fact that from what precious little time I had playing this game last year the money situation was much slower than many other MMOs. Copper actually mattered for a long time. In most modern games I can hop into the highest tier of currency fairly quickly, but I didn't with GW2. In the demo time I was alotted, I reached level four, and if memory serves I had all of 6 silver at that point. Unless money gain has changed dramatically since then (and it hasn't if you look at the screenshots and video clips) then one gold will mean a hell of a lot in this game (which is a good thing). I strongly doubt you'd be able to legitimately obtain a gold piece before level 15 unless the economy is already matured (or inflated due to people buying advantages from the cash shop).
I also wouldn't take what the "reporters" on this website say as gospel. They're the same people that rate "bad" games highly and promised us SWTOR would be a super awesome game with super awesome story and super aswesome PvP. I am a gamer, first and foremost, and all I care about are quality games without cheesy shops that give people power for real-life money. I have absolutely no reason to lie to anyone on these boards. I don't care how cool or trollish you think I am. I'm here because I'm passionate about my hobby of choice, and particularly about this game. I want it to do well, but no matter how much I may like the game (and the company developing it) I will call out bullshit when I see it. The cash shop is just that no matter how much you want it to be the best thing since sliced bread... unless you like the idea of using real-life money to buy advantages (regardless of how you percieve their impacts or whether or not they matter to you at all, buying a bonus to anything is an advantage over people who do not buy said bonus) in which case this shop may give you a chubby.
Ahem, back on subject. The money flow is not what you think it is. I guarantee you that I have a better understanding of how money works in this game than you do, but don't take my word for it if you don't want your illusions shattered. I actually like the way money flows because it makes each tier of currency matter more, but don't go thinking for a minute that gold is "easy" to get at lower levels. It is not unlikely that press people had access to stuff that plebians didn't, including methods of acquiring currency (with or without diregarding females).
Look I shit you not you actually are proving those you disagree with right.
Did you know that in order for gems to get gold, gold must be there?
Did you know that?
I don't think you get what that means. Period.
In conclusion this means that one must first have the gold, then go buy the gems, gems just don't get gold from nothing.
Do you really and I mean reallly see why this is actually against paying to get an advatange?
In this case that means it's going to take someone longer to get goold than someone who's getting gold and influence by playing.
Obviousely this contradicts your agreement with the op and you really just agreeing to agree.
The fact is that this is not an advantange by paying it's more so an advatange by playing.
So please understand what your agreeing with and please for the love of God, I played at an expo to, 10 silver by level 7, I do have friends as well as you do who are under nda, I do know what you've been talking about, it's not even true in itself, scrolls?
May the common sense be with you folk.
I never said they did. Since you brought it up, though, I don't believe people should be able to essentially buy gold on a market place with real money. I know it doesn't materialize out of nothing, but it doesn't change the fact that people are buying economic power with real-life money.
What? I don't know what kind of mental loops you must be jumping through to not consider "exchanging" gems (bought with money) for gold (earned by playing) an advantage. The person selling the gems is still using real-life money for in-game currency. He's getting gold without actually playing the game.
Not necessarily. In theory, I can buy thousands of gold at a time by selling gems to multiple people. This varies based on the going rate for gems to gold, but it still doesn't change the fact that I am buying in-game currency for real-life money, even if its from other players.
When you're trying to attack people in semi-clever ways it helps if you don't mispell words, especially when you're calling them idiots. I also don't see where I agreed with the OP. Are you even sure you're quoting/attacking the right person?
Wat? I could never play the game, buy X amount of gems, sell them on the marketplace, and make out with a ton of gold without even killing a mob. How in the hell is that not buying an advantage over people who always earn their gold the legitimate way... you know, by actually playing the game?
Please understand that I'm leaving a lot of things out of my posts because of the NDA. I know without a doubt that I am right and you are wrong. I have seen a lot more than you have, and if I am ever able to discuss what I've seen without getting banned here I'll be more than happy to. Again, I have no reason to lie or mislead anyone. I like this game, but I think ArenaNet's current version of the cash shop is misguided at best. That doesn't make me a hater.
I wouldn't talk about common sense when your argument ignores the simple fact that the gem system still allows you to buy in-game advantages, including buying gold for gems. You should have to play the game to earn gold, not buy it on a cash shop, even if its being bought from other players.
Interesting to see we still have these long threads where people are arguing personal opinion on how everyone else should be playing the game. Having skimmed through this thread I just have to chuckle and shake my head. When you become god of the multiverse you can dictate how MMOs should or shouldn't be played. Until then each company gets to decide for their own MMO how it gets run and players can decide for themself by playing and supporting it or not.
Interesting to see we still have these long threads where people are arguing personal opinion on how everyone else should be playing the game. Having skimmed through this thread I just have to chuckle and shake my head. When you become god of the multiverse you can dictate how MMOs should or shouldn't be played. Until then each company gets to decide for their own MMO how it gets run and players can decide for themself by playing and supporting it or not.
Or, or... people who feel negatively about a developer changing their cash shop vision can make their opinions known and potentially even create enough of a ruckus that the developer backtracks on their decision. We can do that, you know? It's worked in the past with other types of goods and services. Just ask Netflix or Verizon.
Really though, if all you have to post is "shut up unless you're king of the world" you may as well not post anything at all. You're not contributing a damn thing to the conversation.
Interesting to see we still have these long threads where people are arguing personal opinion on how everyone else should be playing the game. Having skimmed through this thread I just have to chuckle and shake my head. When you become god of the multiverse you can dictate how MMOs should or shouldn't be played. Until then each company gets to decide for their own MMO how it gets run and players can decide for themself by playing and supporting it or not.
Or, or... people who feel negatively about a developer changing their cash shop vision can make their opinions known and potentially even create enough of a ruckus that the developer backtracks on their decision. We can do that, you know? It's worked in the past with other types of goods and services. Just ask Netflix or Verizon.
Really though, if all you have to post is "shut up unless you're king of the world" you may as well not post anything at all. You're not contributing a damn thing to the conversation.
so should eveyone that's fine with it rise up and stant against you to not get it changed? What about the people that like being able to buy account services with in game gold.
A lot of the p2w arguments I see centre around the gems for gold deal.
But gold sellers have been around for a long time and people will always buy gold so that argument is pointless as it pretty much applies to every mmo.
As I say I'd rather the game got supported by gold buyers rather than an individual.
I agree with you.
There is actually a real problem here but most people seems to have missed the point. The problem is that you can buy influence for gold, not gold for gems.
Take away that and it would solve the problem.
It is not as huge as some people scream about but it should be fixed anyways. The alternative is to take away all the buffs in the mists.
The way I see it, the game (any game) needs gold sinks. Buying a large amount of influence for 100g is something that at least has the potential to be a repeat purchase by a bunch of guilds on a regular basis. It seems like a major sink as opposed to other ones like teleportation and repair seem like particularly minor amounts.
Another thing too is that I'm one of those people who is looking forward to converting my excess gold to gems to buy character slots. There needs to be something worth buying with gold for that transaction to work, otherwise people just buy gems to buy store things directly.
As I posted earlier (either in this thread or one of the others), there are people out there who are willing to spend tons of cash in a cash shop (people who use the shop average $50 per month in Puzzle Pirates, while the other 95% play for free (source)). It's just good business to give those people stuff to buy, especially if it doesn't really affect anybody else.
I look at ArenaNet's cash shop like it's appealing to people with more money than brains. If someone wants to spend a ton of cash to buy XP boosts that don't really help them accomplish much of anything, go ahead. If someone wants to try to spend real money to convert to influence like they think that they're going to make a difference among the 2000 people who are fighting, be my guest. ArenaNet will enjoy their money and the rest of us will enjoy playing a AAA MMO with no subscription.
Pretty much lol
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Interesting to see we still have these long threads where people are arguing personal opinion on how everyone else should be playing the game. Having skimmed through this thread I just have to chuckle and shake my head. When you become god of the multiverse you can dictate how MMOs should or shouldn't be played. Until then each company gets to decide for their own MMO how it gets run and players can decide for themself by playing and supporting it or not.
Or, or... people who feel negatively about a developer changing their cash shop vision can make their opinions known and potentially even create enough of a ruckus that the developer backtracks on their decision. We can do that, you know? It's worked in the past with other types of goods and services. Just ask Netflix or Verizon.
Really though, if all you have to post is "shut up unless you're king of the world" you may as well not post anything at all. You're not contributing a damn thing to the conversation.
so should eveyone that's fine with it rise up and stant against you to not get it changed? What about the people that like being able to buy account services with in game gold.
Wasn't changed, lol
Man I wish that leak post was still there by Colin would of helped ease this, I mean we can do quotes to though. From ANET.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Comments
No yer not being dumb, or wrong for that matter.
You know now that i think about it one of the things i have not really paid attention to in all the videos i have watched is the gold rewards from mob killing. If the amount thats dropped is insignificant it will be alot harder for gold farmers to amass large amounts of gold in a timely manner.
You then need to consider if what a gold farmer sells on the auction house really has such a great value as to warrant selling itmes to get gold. I think ANet has also thrown a wrench in gold farmer plans by having a global AH and not just the server.
Guess we will have to wait and see how much can be farmed from grinding.
Lolipops !
Fair point. But to get the gold I will then have to exchange the gem to another player with gold and so on, in theory eventually a player will end up with a gem that can't be traded as noone has the gold to do so. But that is theory.
Your point is a good one and likely to be practical and bears thinking about
Currently playing- SWG PreCU & GW 2
Have tried WoW, AoC, & Vanguard, SWG:NGE, GW, LOTRO & SWTOR
Best MMO: SWG
Worst MMO: SWTOR
I think it's a great idea, it gives incentive to spend money with ANet rather than spend money with cashcowgoldfarmers.com, which i find completely reasonable, they made the game, why should a 3rd party get money from it.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
I'm also curious how to farm gold, it's like de's negate that, I could be wrong on that but just a bit curious, about the farming.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Yeah that was my point
A lot of the p2w arguments I see centre around the gems for gold deal.
But gold sellers have been around for a long time and people will always buy gold so that argument is pointless as it pretty much applies to every mmo.
As I say I'd rather the game got supported by gold buyers rather than an individual.
Currently playing- SWG PreCU & GW 2
Have tried WoW, AoC, & Vanguard, SWG:NGE, GW, LOTRO & SWTOR
Best MMO: SWG
Worst MMO: SWTOR
In swg it was all done with macros and 3rd party software.
You'd often come across a lev 90 with a dozen lev 5s on a follow macro completing terminal missions for cash.
It's a tedious process, but they made money from it
Currently playing- SWG PreCU & GW 2
Have tried WoW, AoC, & Vanguard, SWG:NGE, GW, LOTRO & SWTOR
Best MMO: SWG
Worst MMO: SWTOR
Mostly what he said, but for GW2 i'm not sure, it all depends on a few things...
1. difficulty to amass gold,
2. value of gold (like is end game gear 10g, or 100g, or 1k gold)
3. kinda back to point 1, but if it is easy to amass gold, then less people would be willing to buy gold, because of its difficulty
If it is hard to farm gold (which is just basically one guy, 5 accounts,finding a way to play all 5 at once, taking all the money from all 5 accounts and selling it, or a company with 50 guys like this), more people will buy money cause why should they waste un needed time.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
It just seems so difficult since you can't just repeat things over and over and over.
Maybe people will farm karma lol, but then again that's easy to get like gold.
Though SWG was a sandbox so I'm sure they had things.
I was going to say they could have bots sit at an event and let others complete it but the bot would have to do something atleast once and it'll prolly get less gold depending on how much it did.
Souds like hell for a farmer.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
i think that is what ANet is trying to do, other than make a pretty good game.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
So do you want ArenaNet to let the players run the servers?
You can use gold to buy gear but watching TB's De video he made a good amount of karma from 1 DE dunno if it was boosted for beta but he could get 1 piece of blue karma gear from 1 DE run
I doubt he boosted his karma, i mean it is possible by all means, but doubtfull, and thats why these CS is evil threads are.... pointless? there isn't a gear treadmill and on top of that it's simple to get, gold farming still has a chance to be a hassle or P2W aspect, but gold in this game can only buy you so much, nothing beats knowing your toon in this game, it all comes down to skill.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
Doubtful yes, but noone knows for sure except for Anet. If they are more concerned with people accessing all the content, rather than testing the economy / attrition rates, then it would make sense for Anet to boost karma / gold gain for everyone to make it easier to test the content. However, I don't think this is the case.
i meant that karma in general was boosted for beta. not that an individual did. the boost in the shop arent high enough to effect the karma anyay at least not at his level, but he was getting enough to buy weapons and gear per de
yea i agree with you, ANet could've hyped everything up no doubt, but also it was only 2-3 days? so thats is non-comparable after its been released for 3 months.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
I think it is as well.
I almost feel like their reasoning for a lot of design choices in the game was not only to change the typical MMO feel, but as well combat all the gamebreaking issues they had.
I.e for WvWvW no keep trading,no points for killing and camping players, and so on.
In PVE the de's are made to not repeat really fast and reward you based on how much you did.
Level scaling.
Ability to get things in cash shop but making it where those that play will have the upperhand in wvwvw or pve before those that try to buy gems in order to get gold, because you need gold first.
The downtime of influences is like a day long, they can't be stacked.
It's not a gear grind, so xp boosters on only killing mobs doesn't matter.
You get a lot of karma so karma boosts don't matter in the first place.
List goes on and on.
Though in a sense this is what I was talking about in the first place, they made a game to combat all these p2w attempts and are trying to make a fun game at the same time, but in order to achieve this you must change a lot of things from the norm in which you'll end up innovating(not bring nothing new) and changing up experiences.
Game makes the cash shop optional because of the game itself, and gives hell to farmers. Not saying they won't go through hell to get money, but sheesh it's like you will be doing it for awhile. Maybe even years to get some amount people are interested in.
Hey but if I'm wrong on this let me know, I don't mind talking about it more.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
I agree with you.
There is actually a real problem here but most people seems to have missed the point. The problem is that you can buy influence for gold, not gold for gems.
Take away that and it would solve the problem.
It is not as huge as some people scream about but it should be fixed anyways. The alternative is to take away all the buffs in the mists.
Doesn't make sense to however, when you consider the buffs are only for the immediate area of whatever fort the guild happens to own, while they own it. People are complaining simply for the reason of trying to tear the game down, not because it's a real issue.
Oderint, dum metuant.
The way I see it, the game (any game) needs gold sinks. Buying a large amount of influence for 100g is something that at least has the potential to be a repeat purchase by a bunch of guilds on a regular basis. It seems like a major sink as opposed to other ones like teleportation and repair seem like particularly minor amounts.
Another thing too is that I'm one of those people who is looking forward to converting my excess gold to gems to buy character slots. There needs to be something worth buying with gold for that transaction to work, otherwise people just buy gems to buy store things directly.
As I posted earlier (either in this thread or one of the others), there are people out there who are willing to spend tons of cash in a cash shop (people who use the shop average $50 per month in Puzzle Pirates, while the other 95% play for free (source)). It's just good business to give those people stuff to buy, especially if it doesn't really affect anybody else.
I look at ArenaNet's cash shop like it's appealing to people with more money than brains. If someone wants to spend a ton of cash to buy XP boosts that don't really help them accomplish much of anything, go ahead. If someone wants to try to spend real money to convert to influence like they think that they're going to make a difference among the 2000 people who are fighting, be my guest. ArenaNet will enjoy their money and the rest of us will enjoy playing a AAA MMO with no subscription.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
I never said they did. Since you brought it up, though, I don't believe people should be able to essentially buy gold on a market place with real money. I know it doesn't materialize out of nothing, but it doesn't change the fact that people are buying economic power with real-life money.
What? I don't know what kind of mental loops you must be jumping through to not consider "exchanging" gems (bought with money) for gold (earned by playing) an advantage. The person selling the gems is still using real-life money for in-game currency. He's getting gold without actually playing the game.
Not necessarily. In theory, I can buy thousands of gold at a time by selling gems to multiple people. This varies based on the going rate for gems to gold, but it still doesn't change the fact that I am buying in-game currency for real-life money, even if its from other players.
When you're trying to attack people in semi-clever ways it helps if you don't mispell words, especially when you're calling them idiots. I also don't see where I agreed with the OP. Are you even sure you're quoting/attacking the right person?
Wat? I could never play the game, buy X amount of gems, sell them on the marketplace, and make out with a ton of gold without even killing a mob. How in the hell is that not buying an advantage over people who always earn their gold the legitimate way... you know, by actually playing the game?
Please understand that I'm leaving a lot of things out of my posts because of the NDA. I know without a doubt that I am right and you are wrong. I have seen a lot more than you have, and if I am ever able to discuss what I've seen without getting banned here I'll be more than happy to. Again, I have no reason to lie or mislead anyone. I like this game, but I think ArenaNet's current version of the cash shop is misguided at best. That doesn't make me a hater.
I wouldn't talk about common sense when your argument ignores the simple fact that the gem system still allows you to buy in-game advantages, including buying gold for gems. You should have to play the game to earn gold, not buy it on a cash shop, even if its being bought from other players.
Interesting to see we still have these long threads where people are arguing personal opinion on how everyone else should be playing the game. Having skimmed through this thread I just have to chuckle and shake my head. When you become god of the multiverse you can dictate how MMOs should or shouldn't be played. Until then each company gets to decide for their own MMO how it gets run and players can decide for themself by playing and supporting it or not.
Or, or... people who feel negatively about a developer changing their cash shop vision can make their opinions known and potentially even create enough of a ruckus that the developer backtracks on their decision. We can do that, you know? It's worked in the past with other types of goods and services. Just ask Netflix or Verizon.
Really though, if all you have to post is "shut up unless you're king of the world" you may as well not post anything at all. You're not contributing a damn thing to the conversation.
so should eveyone that's fine with it rise up and stant against you to not get it changed? What about the people that like being able to buy account services with in game gold.
Pretty much lol
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Wasn't changed, lol
Man I wish that leak post was still there by Colin would of helped ease this, I mean we can do quotes to though. From ANET.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.