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DIABLO 3 IS NOT AN MMO!

24

Comments

  • dontadowdontadow Member UncommonPosts: 1,005

    At first i was like , wow, really duh. But as i read beyond the all caps, i realize what he's saying.  There are a ton of games out there that come out and have relevance on the genre. Dragon's Dogma (IE) (which is a pretty cool game, very much in the same genre as an adventure/dungeon game and has multiplayer capability) and that game has not been covered.  I few of us will be playing it I can believe.  

     

  • UnlightUnlight Member Posts: 2,540
    Originally posted by Ausare
    Originally posted by DarkPony
    Originally posted by Ausare

    D3 is about as much MMO as GW1 is in my opinion.

    *reads your post, runs off and takes a leap for cover*

    INCOMING FANLY FIRE!

     

     

    Shields of "I do not care if they do not agree" are up.  GW1 is a avatar chat room with Diablo runs that a small amount of people can do together.

    I didn't realize that you had to fight your way from "chat room" to "chat room" in D3.  Good to know.  Have to say, that's pretty cool of them to have implemented a similar system.  I figured the lobby system they used was done at login when you choose a server, like with Torchlight 2.  Kudos.

  • adderVXIadderVXI Member UncommonPosts: 727

    Hell, it took 2 months to get MMORPG.com to give AA its own forum!   Why D3 at all??!

    Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.

    George Washington

  • HolyTrevorHolyTrevor Member UncommonPosts: 55

    You do know that there was a poll out a while ago as to whether they should add diablo 3 to the site or not, which im guessing the majority said they would like it on here and here it is. Whats to compain about?

  • KhinRuniteKhinRunite Member Posts: 879
    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Ugh, Faded. Not this discussion again V_V

    - We voted to have it on the site: a majority was in favor

    - We shouldn't be anal in regards to the site's actual name, I think, as:

    - It's an rpg

    - It's online

    - It allows for multiplaying

    - There is a huge overlap in mmorpg fans and hack & slash fans

    - Also more popular featured games = more hits = bigger advertising revenues. (Can't blame the staff to try and make some money to buy oats with to not starve in real life).

    I for one, welcome our new hack & slash overlords. Especially since most current mmorpg's aren't really ringing my bell anyway.

    Hope that helped, my friend.

     

    Though I admit I got half-surprised at first, ultimately it doesn't bother me if D3 is on this site. But does this also mean that in the forseeable future any non MMORPG will be included in this site as long as its an RPG with online capabilities and its popular?

  • AusareAusare Member Posts: 850
    Originally posted by Unlight
    Originally posted by Ausare
    Originally posted by DarkPony
    Originally posted by Ausare

    D3 is about as much MMO as GW1 is in my opinion.

    *reads your post, runs off and takes a leap for cover*

    INCOMING FANLY FIRE!

     

     

    Shields of "I do not care if they do not agree" are up.  GW1 is a avatar chat room with Diablo runs that a small amount of people can do together.

    I didn't realize that you had to fight your way from "chat room" to "chat room" in D3.  Good to know.  Have to say, that's pretty cool of them to have implemented a similar system.  I figured the lobby system they used was done at login when you choose a server, like with Torchlight 2.  Kudos.

    Yes clearly you are right...GW1's chat rooms make it an MMO....you win...GW1 MMOCRG (Massively Multiplayer Online Chat Room Game"...you win.

  • AusareAusare Member Posts: 850
    Originally posted by KhinRunite
    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Ugh, Faded. Not this discussion again V_V

    - We voted to have it on the site: a majority was in favor

    - We shouldn't be anal in regards to the site's actual name, I think, as:

    - It's an rpg

    - It's online

    - It allows for multiplaying

    - There is a huge overlap in mmorpg fans and hack & slash fans

    - Also more popular featured games = more hits = bigger advertising revenues. (Can't blame the staff to try and make some money to buy oats with to not starve in real life).

    I for one, welcome our new hack & slash overlords. Especially since most current mmorpg's aren't really ringing my bell anyway.

    Hope that helped, my friend.

     

    Though I admit I got half-surprised at first, ultimately it doesn't bother me if D3 is on this site. But does this also mean that in the forseeable future any non MMORPG will be included in this site as long as its an RPG with online capabilities and its popular?

    I think it would depend on the type of online activity, are their community features, and interest in the game.

  • VarthanderVarthander Member UncommonPosts: 466
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb

    Stop comparing it to MMOs! Jesus Christ, the staff at MMORPG can't seem to let Diablo 3 just BE another genre game that released.

     

    It is an ACTION RPG! Similarly, you don't see FPS games being actively reported on as having "an impact" on WoW's bottom line. So why the hell should Diablo 3 impact anything MMO related? They're TWO seperate market types, and people aren't going to quit WoW to play Diablo 3 as their new "online attraction". Quite simply, since Diablo 3 was never made to be as in-depth as an MMO, it won't keep MOST people for more than a month actively unlike an MMO.

     

    For the love of god MMORPG.com, it's like you literally have NOTHING to report on! We're even seeing more "paid" advertisements in the form of reviews now. 

     

    Seriously?

     

    Don't get my wording wrong, I'm not angry. I just like adding emphasis to things that require it :)! I'll be angry when another "MMORPG Staff" article compares Diablo 3 to another MMO though. 

     

     

    -Cheers

    Totally agree.

    image

  • darkchewydarkchewy Member Posts: 8
    Originally posted by Varthander
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb

    Stop comparing it to MMOs! Jesus Christ, the staff at MMORPG can't seem to let Diablo 3 just BE another genre game that released.

     

    It is an ACTION RPG! Similarly, you don't see FPS games being actively reported on as having "an impact" on WoW's bottom line. So why the hell should Diablo 3 impact anything MMO related? They're TWO seperate market types, and people aren't going to quit WoW to play Diablo 3 as their new "online attraction". Quite simply, since Diablo 3 was never made to be as in-depth as an MMO, it won't keep MOST people for more than a month actively unlike an MMO.

     

    For the love of god MMORPG.com, it's like you literally have NOTHING to report on! We're even seeing more "paid" advertisements in the form of reviews now. 

     

    Seriously?

     

    Don't get my wording wrong, I'm not angry. I just like adding emphasis to things that require it :)! I'll be angry when another "MMORPG Staff" article compares Diablo 3 to another MMO though. 

     

     

    -Cheers

    Totally agree.

    cant agree more ...

  • LeFantomeLeFantome Member RarePosts: 698
    Originally posted by darkchewy
    Originally posted by Varthander
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb

    Stop comparing it to MMOs! Jesus Christ, the staff at MMORPG can't seem to let Diablo 3 just BE another genre game that released.

     

    It is an ACTION RPG! Similarly, you don't see FPS games being actively reported on as having "an impact" on WoW's bottom line. So why the hell should Diablo 3 impact anything MMO related? They're TWO seperate market types, and people aren't going to quit WoW to play Diablo 3 as their new "online attraction". Quite simply, since Diablo 3 was never made to be as in-depth as an MMO, it won't keep MOST people for more than a month actively unlike an MMO.

     

    For the love of god MMORPG.com, it's like you literally have NOTHING to report on! We're even seeing more "paid" advertisements in the form of reviews now. 

     

    Seriously?

     

    Don't get my wording wrong, I'm not angry. I just like adding emphasis to things that require it :)! I'll be angry when another "MMORPG Staff" article compares Diablo 3 to another MMO though. 

     

     

    -Cheers

    Totally agree.

    cant agree more ...

    Totally agree, can't agree more , Diablo 3 is NOT a MMO.

    image
  • FadedbombFadedbomb Member Posts: 2,081
    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Ugh, Faded. Not this discussion again V_V

    - We voted to have it on the site: a majority was in favor

    - We shouldn't be anal in regards to the site's actual name, I think, as:

    - It's an rpg

    - It's online

    - It allows for multiplaying

    - There is a huge overlap in mmorpg fans and hack & slash fans

    - Also more popular featured games = more hits = bigger advertising revenues. (Can't blame the staff to try and make some money to buy oats with to not starve in real life).

    I for one, welcome our new hack & slash overlords. Especially since most current mmorpg's aren't really ringing my bell anyway.

    Hope that helped, my friend.

     

    You're forgetting the MOST important part for it to be on this site:

    -Massive

     

    it is NOT massive, it is broken up into game-lobbies, NOT dissimilar to how MPlayer (now GameSpy Acarcade) used to be.

     

    This is NOT an MMO, and the problem I'm having isn't that it's on this site (though it shouldn't be). The problem i'm having is the staff comparing it, or even saying it'll effect other MMOs, when it won't. It is NOT an MMO, and should NOT be treated as one. The staff here, note: not all of them, are treating it as such.

     

    That is the point of this thread Pony.

     

    Trying to degrade what it means to be an MMO by picking apart the word doesn't make it one. Nor does it allow you to whore yourself out (MMORPG.com) for more "hits" so you can make more money. You're an MMORPG site, act like one. 

    Again, it's fine to have discussions about Diablo 3 on this site, but treating it like an MMO is simply unacceptable.

    The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
    Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.

  • JetrpgJetrpg Member UncommonPosts: 2,347

    Diablo 3 is current down becuase all of blizzards mmos come down on tuesday. Thus d3 = mmo. That and everyone is calling it an mmo...

     

    So yeah d3 = mmo because someone said it was..

     

     

    PS its obviously not an mmo, but then agian nor are most mmos , as most of then are anything but MASSIVE.

    "Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine

  • CavodCavod Member Posts: 295

    k

     

    It's a mmoArpg then

     

    happy?

     

    i kid i kid

     

    but you gotta admit

    massively : check

    multiplayer: check

    online: check

    rpg: check check check

     

    Really, I don't consider it a MMO either but it does meet the very basic criterias.  It kind of falls into the 'guild wars' grey area, just barely.

    We really need separate forums for every newly launched game. There can be the anti-<MMO> one and there can be the 'what general discussion should be' one. All the lamenting can happen together where each can find solace in like minded can't-move-on-ers leaving the rest of us to actually move forward and discuss meaningful and relevant topics.

  • FadedbombFadedbomb Member Posts: 2,081
    Originally posted by Cavod

    k

     

    It's a mmoArpg then

     

    happy?

     

    i kid i kid

     

    but you gotta admit

    massively : check

    multiplayer: check

    online: check

    rpg: check check check

     

    Really, I don't consider it a MMO either but it does meet the very basic criterias.  It kind of falls into the 'guild wars' grey area, just barely.

    It is NOT Massively, that is the key component to making it an MMO. You might as well call the Call of Duty, Battlefield, League of Legends, or Age of Empire franchises MMO's. 

     

    They're NOT!

    The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
    Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.

  • XasapisXasapis Member RarePosts: 6,337

    nah, it fails at massive really. How many players can have in one map? CoD is more "massive" than Diablo right now. However it is popular, thus why it's covered by mmorpg and it is covered by battle.net DRM, which is why it's down when battle.net is down.

  • LizardEgyptLizardEgypt Member UncommonPosts: 333

    It's just another game that will be useless in less than a month, Blizzard gave it the MMO treatment without any MMO features. Single player coop game with crashses, DC's, login ques, cash shop market. The fact anyone gave in to the Diablo name with this pile is beyond me.

    Currently playing - FF14ARR
    Previous games - SWG, World of Warcraft, ShadowBane, Warhammer, Age of Conan, Darkfall, Planetside Asheron's Call, Everquest, Everquest 2, Too many.

  • FadedbombFadedbomb Member Posts: 2,081
    Originally posted by Xasapis

    nah, it fails at massive really. How many players can have in one map? CoD is more "massive" than Diablo right now. However it is popular, thus why it's covered by mmorpg and it is covered by battle.net DRM, which is why it's down when battle.net is down.

    Pretty much this ^. 

     

    DRM =/= MMO.

     

    Diablo 3 cannot be considered an MMO simply because it is lobby based 4player cap per GAME. It's worse than instanced games like GuildWars, and GuildWars1 is in the "Gray Area" because it is absolutely instanced beyond believe. Yet, it has MMO elements that allow it to remain in the gray area. I'd even go as far as saying GW1 was an Action RPG, but then i'd be set aflame with napalm :x, so i don't :).

     

    Just because something is popular doesn't make it "ok" to completely break the entire premise of a website, or the entire classification that a game can aquire.

    Other games in the past have attempted to claim themselves as MMOs, and they all fell by the wayside for lieing to customers to the point of nausium. 

     

    This subject, albeit beaten to death, isn't the topic of this thread. The whole point of this thread was to get MMORPG.com staff to stop treating it as if it were an MMO.

    The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
    Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.

  • p_c_sousap_c_sousa Member Posts: 620

    lool. anyone think diablo 3 is a MMO dont have a clue what MMO mean...

    Diablo 3 is a MO game, is a game with multyplayer online (only 4 guys coop how can this be massively????).

    FIFA is more MMO than Diablo 3 loooool

  • Bama1267Bama1267 Member UncommonPosts: 1,822
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb
    Originally posted by DarkPony

    Ugh, Faded. Not this discussion again V_V

    - We voted to have it on the site: a majority was in favor

    - We shouldn't be anal in regards to the site's actual name, I think, as:

    - It's an rpg

    - It's online

    - It allows for multiplaying

    - There is a huge overlap in mmorpg fans and hack & slash fans

    - Also more popular featured games = more hits = bigger advertising revenues. (Can't blame the staff to try and make some money to buy oats with to not starve in real life).

    I for one, welcome our new hack & slash overlords. Especially since most current mmorpg's aren't really ringing my bell anyway.

    Hope that helped, my friend.

     

    You're forgetting the MOST important part for it to be on this site:

    -Massive

     

    it is NOT massive, it is broken up into game-lobbies, NOT dissimilar to how MPlayer (now GameSpy Acarcade) used to be.

     

    This is NOT an MMO, and the problem I'm having isn't that it's on this site (though it shouldn't be). The problem i'm having is the staff comparing it, or even saying it'll effect other MMOs, when it won't. It is NOT an MMO, and should NOT be treated as one. The staff here, note: not all of them, are treating it as such.

     

    That is the point of this thread Pony.

     

    Trying to degrade what it means to be an MMO by picking apart the word doesn't make it one. Nor does it allow you to whore yourself out (MMORPG.com) for more "hits" so you can make more money. You're an MMORPG site, act like one. 

    Again, it's fine to have discussions about Diablo 3 on this site, but treating it like an MMO is simply unacceptable.

     Well, they went down this road sometime ago. Covering several games that are not MMORPG's, Diablo 3 is no different. Hits? Money? Since they already established they would do it just because a large majority are interested in a game .... I think it's probably a little more simple than that.

     Hell, with all teh garbage being mas produced from the MMO industry, they don't deserve any less than to be compared to single player action rpg games.

  • CavodCavod Member Posts: 295
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb
    Originally posted by Cavod

    k

     

    It's a mmoArpg then

     

    happy?

     

    i kid i kid

     

    but you gotta admit

    massively : check

    multiplayer: check

    online: check

    rpg: check check check

     

    Really, I don't consider it a MMO either but it does meet the very basic criterias.  It kind of falls into the 'guild wars' grey area, just barely.

    It is NOT Massively, that is the key component to making it an MMO. You might as well call the Call of Duty, Battlefield, League of Legends, or Age of Empire franchises MMO's. 

     

    They're NOT!

    The massively opinion is pretty far from fact and relative to how one looks at it.

     

    It's massive in the sense that there are a lot of people playing it,  It's massive in the sense that you can play with a LOT of different people.

     

    It's not massive in the sense that you can only have so many people in any one instance.  It's not massive in the sense that you are playing with everyone at the same time.

     

    However, when you take these statements and apply them to 'real MMOs'... how much does the word 'massive' hold true.

     

    playing on servers...  or even a dying server.... GW1 being completely instance.... a niche MMO which never had that many players to begin with...

     

    All of these points challenge the strength of the word 'massive' and the question really becomes 'where do we draw the line'.  

     

    Now before you get me wrong, I will reitterate that I do not consider D3 a MMO by any means.  However I am open minded enough to see where one could contemplate outside of the norm and come to the conclusion that it is really close to, or maybe even generously give it the title.

     

    cheers

     

    We really need separate forums for every newly launched game. There can be the anti-<MMO> one and there can be the 'what general discussion should be' one. All the lamenting can happen together where each can find solace in like minded can't-move-on-ers leaving the rest of us to actually move forward and discuss meaningful and relevant topics.

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,857
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb

    Stop comparing it to MMOs! Jesus Christ, the staff at MMORPG can't seem to let Diablo 3 just BE another genre game that released.

     

    It is an ACTION RPG! Similarly, you don't see FPS games being actively reported on as having "an impact" on WoW's bottom line. So why the hell should Diablo 3 impact anything MMO related? They're TWO seperate market types, and people aren't going to quit WoW to play Diablo 3 as their new "online attraction". Quite simply, since Diablo 3 was never made to be as in-depth as an MMO, it won't keep MOST people for more than a month actively unlike an MMO.

     

    For the love of god MMORPG.com, it's like you literally have NOTHING to report on! We're even seeing more "paid" advertisements in the form of reviews now. 

     

    Seriously?

     

    Don't get my wording wrong, I'm not angry. I just like adding emphasis to things that require it :)! I'll be angry when another "MMORPG Staff" article compares Diablo 3 to another MMO though. 

     

     

    -Cheers

    Neither is Dust, but that's what happens when companies who advertise their MMOs on MMORG.com.  They get to have their other NON mmo games coattailed in here.

  • LizardEgyptLizardEgypt Member UncommonPosts: 333
    Originally posted by GeezerGamer
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb

    Stop comparing it to MMOs! Jesus Christ, the staff at MMORPG can't seem to let Diablo 3 just BE another genre game that released.

     

    It is an ACTION RPG! Similarly, you don't see FPS games being actively reported on as having "an impact" on WoW's bottom line. So why the hell should Diablo 3 impact anything MMO related? They're TWO seperate market types, and people aren't going to quit WoW to play Diablo 3 as their new "online attraction". Quite simply, since Diablo 3 was never made to be as in-depth as an MMO, it won't keep MOST people for more than a month actively unlike an MMO.

     

    For the love of god MMORPG.com, it's like you literally have NOTHING to report on! We're even seeing more "paid" advertisements in the form of reviews now. 

     

    Seriously?

     

    Don't get my wording wrong, I'm not angry. I just like adding emphasis to things that require it :)! I'll be angry when another "MMORPG Staff" article compares Diablo 3 to another MMO though. 

     

     

    -Cheers

    Neither is Dust, but that's what happens when companies who advertise their MMOs on MMORG.com.  They get to have their other NON mmo games coattailed in here.

    Like SWTOR and all the other instanced single player stuff?

    Currently playing - FF14ARR
    Previous games - SWG, World of Warcraft, ShadowBane, Warhammer, Age of Conan, Darkfall, Planetside Asheron's Call, Everquest, Everquest 2, Too many.

  • UnlightUnlight Member Posts: 2,540
    Originally posted by Ausare
    Originally posted by Unlight
    Originally posted by Ausare
    Originally posted by DarkPony
    Originally posted by Ausare

    D3 is about as much MMO as GW1 is in my opinion.

    *reads your post, runs off and takes a leap for cover*

    INCOMING FANLY FIRE!

     

     

    Shields of "I do not care if they do not agree" are up.  GW1 is a avatar chat room with Diablo runs that a small amount of people can do together.

    I didn't realize that you had to fight your way from "chat room" to "chat room" in D3.  Good to know.  Have to say, that's pretty cool of them to have implemented a similar system.  I figured the lobby system they used was done at login when you choose a server, like with Torchlight 2.  Kudos.

    Yes clearly you are right...GW1's chat rooms make it an MMO....you win...GW1 MMOCRG (Massively Multiplayer Online Chat Room Game"...you win.

    My, aren't we thenthitive.

  • p_c_sousap_c_sousa Member Posts: 620
    Originally posted by Cavod
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb
    Originally posted by Cavod

    k

     

    It's a mmoArpg then

     

    happy?

     

    i kid i kid

     

    but you gotta admit

    massively : check

    multiplayer: check

    online: check

    rpg: check check check

     

    Really, I don't consider it a MMO either but it does meet the very basic criterias.  It kind of falls into the 'guild wars' grey area, just barely.

    It is NOT Massively, that is the key component to making it an MMO. You might as well call the Call of Duty, Battlefield, League of Legends, or Age of Empire franchises MMO's. 

     

    They're NOT!

    The massively opinion is pretty far from fact and relative to how one looks at it.

     

    It's massive in the sense that there are a lot of people playing it,  It's massive in the sense that you can play with a LOT of different people.

     

    It's not massive in the sense that you can only have so many people in any one instance.  It's not massive in the sense that you are playing with everyone at the same time.

     

    However, when you take these statements and apply them to 'real MMOs'... how much does the word 'massive' hold true.

     

    playing on servers...  or even a dying server.... GW1 being completely instance.... a niche MMO which never had that many players to begin with...

     

    All of these points challenge the strength of the word 'massive' and the question really becomes 'where do we draw the line'.  

     

    Now before you get me wrong, I will reitterate that I do not consider D3 a MMO by any means.  However I am open minded enough to see where one could contemplate outside of the norm and come to the conclusion that it is really close to, or maybe even generously give it the title.

     

    cheers

     

    you cant split the initial words of MMO. MMO mean massively multiplayer online, this mean you can interact with thousand of people at same time. otherwise almost any game with online multyplayer will be a MMO. 

    FIFA in that terms is a MMO? Uncharted 3 is a MMO ? CoD is a MMO ? Mortal Kombat is a MMO? obvious no but if you split MMO words this games check them. all have online, all have multyplayer and all have lot of diferent people you can play (massive). 

  • FadedbombFadedbomb Member Posts: 2,081
    Originally posted by p_c_sousa
    Originally posted by Cavod
    Originally posted by Fadedbomb
    Originally posted by Cavod

    k

     

    It's a mmoArpg then

     

    happy?

     

    i kid i kid

     

    but you gotta admit

    massively : check

    multiplayer: check

    online: check

    rpg: check check check

     

    Really, I don't consider it a MMO either but it does meet the very basic criterias.  It kind of falls into the 'guild wars' grey area, just barely.

    It is NOT Massively, that is the key component to making it an MMO. You might as well call the Call of Duty, Battlefield, League of Legends, or Age of Empire franchises MMO's. 

     

    They're NOT!

    The massively opinion is pretty far from fact and relative to how one looks at it.

     

    It's massive in the sense that there are a lot of people playing it,  It's massive in the sense that you can play with a LOT of different people.

     

    It's not massive in the sense that you can only have so many people in any one instance.  It's not massive in the sense that you are playing with everyone at the same time.

     

    However, when you take these statements and apply them to 'real MMOs'... how much does the word 'massive' hold true.

     

    playing on servers...  or even a dying server.... GW1 being completely instance.... a niche MMO which never had that many players to begin with...

     

    All of these points challenge the strength of the word 'massive' and the question really becomes 'where do we draw the line'.  

     

    Now before you get me wrong, I will reitterate that I do not consider D3 a MMO by any means.  However I am open minded enough to see where one could contemplate outside of the norm and come to the conclusion that it is really close to, or maybe even generously give it the title.

     

    cheers

     

    you cant split the initial words of MMO. MMO mean massively multiplayer online, this mean you can interact with thousand of people at same time. otherwise almost any game with online multyplayer will be a MMO. 

    FIFA in that terms is a MMO? Uncharted 3 is a MMO ? CoD is a MMO ? Mortal Kombat is a MMO? obvious no but if you split MMO words this games check them. all have online, all have multyplayer and all have lot of diferent people you can play (massive). 

    He's trying to split hairs in terms of what "Massive" actually means. It doesn't work even for open-minded people. 

     

    Saying it over the internet is one thing, but trying to convince someone in RealLife that is older than 22 that the Diablo Franchise is an MMO, or that the Call of Duty franchise is an MMO will only end in them laughing in your face and calling you names.

     

    At the end of the day trying to argue what an MMO actually is, is simply futile. Diablo 3, like the Call of Duty franchise, is NOT an MMO. DRM means nothing other than hurting your own customers for loyalty.

    The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
    Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.

This discussion has been closed.