The MMo that i am playing now is gender locked so i had no choice but to have a man character. Honestly, when you are a guy in game, other men will not pity you for being a low level, for having a hard time finishing a quest, etc. It is actually more fun to be treated equally. It is more challenging. But still, if the MMO was not gender locked, id still choose a female character.
The #1 reason I as a girl do not want to bring too much attention to my identity is in this thread. :P We're not an alien race, we're not different. You don't need to wonder and speculate on our motivations. We're just people, and we want to be treated like people. We want to be treated like your fellow guildy, not like "the female guild member", just another guild member, the same as everyone else. It's a lot less drama, a lot less weirdness, a lot more just enjoying the game if people think of us as just another dude.
Every single person you'll ever meet in your life is different. I hope people realize that saying "girls like to wear short shorts and show off" is frankly just ignorant. That kind of attitude is actually very offensive. Any speculation about the motivation of women (or any group of people really) is just upsetting. Every person has their own reasons for their actions.
For the record I do want to say that I never lie about the fact that I am a female gamer, but I do not boldly claim it either. I only mention it if it comes up or if someone directly asks me. Because I always play female characters people do sometimes ask, and a lot of the times the reaction when they find out I'm a girl is very undesirable. I just want to play the game, same as anyone else.
+1 I honestly think that if I were in your shoes, I would be more annoyed by the legion of people rallying to help me because of my "frailty," then I would be by the people actually trying to harass me.
It's more than just wanting to protect a "woman's frailty", it's about harassement in general. It just happens to be worse for female players, which is why threads like these tends to spawn. Insults thrown at male gamers tends to boil down to the "You suck, you're gay, your mom is fat, I did your mom, I'll go to your home and kill you", of course there's always that creepy guy that goes into a bit more details, but still, it's dealt with ease. Female gamers have to deal with a lot more than that, and can receives pictures of dicks amongst other things (You'll hear stories about those, but you won't usually see the pictures posted on the internet for obvious reasons :P )
Harassement has definitively become worse over the years or at least more visible, and for the last year or so, communities are slowly waking up and being more vocal about harassement (which may have been influenced by the rise of websites like "FatUglyorSlutty" or "Why Was I Banned").
Sadly there are a lot of stories out there of female gamers who make the decision of hiding their identities, stop using mics, or simply leaving online gaming completely because they can't stand it anymore (the Cross Assault story is a decent example). Because of this, it turned into a major key point for Communities trying to push for better tools to prevent and punish harassement.
What could possibly be worse verbal harassment than "I'm going to go to your home and kill you" lol ?
And as for the pictures of dicks. I remember plenty of people sending me pictures of goatse back in the day, and I think that is far worse than some random dude's junk lol.
I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it's the type of harassment that women receive that makes us feel it's worse than the harassment a man would receive...it's the fact that the target of the harrasment is a woman that makes us think it's worse. And I don't know if that is really fair. I mean, on one side you basically say that women are inherently more frail and can't handle the harassment. And then on the other side you say that men should be able to handle harassment and are undeserving of sympathy.
Personally, I would rather harassment of people be viewed as the same regardless of gender. And be despised universally.
I'm pissed off because the current paradigm is that it's ok for Woman to have to hide their identity while playing online simply because the need is there. Why the hell is it acceptable to allow situations that force this kind of preasure thereby spawning the need to begin with? I don't think it's ever ok for a situation to arrise that warrants being forced to hide who & what you are simply because others are ok with said situations happening. Isn't there a way to change this mentality?
ps: I've been around for awhile so I very well know that it's been this way for some time, but in my book that doesn't make it right seeing as how it's 2012 already!
For a roleplayer, hiding your identity is always a good idea; you aren't entitled to know.
If you gave me gold because you guessed wrong, well....lesson learned, maybe.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
The #1 reason I as a girl do not want to bring too much attention to my identity is in this thread. :P We're not an alien race, we're not different. You don't need to wonder and speculate on our motivations. We're just people, and we want to be treated like people. We want to be treated like your fellow guildy, not like "the female guild member", just another guild member, the same as everyone else. It's a lot less drama, a lot less weirdness, a lot more just enjoying the game if people think of us as just another dude.
Every single person you'll ever meet in your life is different. I hope people realize that saying "girls like to wear short shorts and show off" is frankly just ignorant. That kind of attitude is actually very offensive. Any speculation about the motivation of women (or any group of people really) is just upsetting. Every person has their own reasons for their actions.
For the record I do want to say that I never lie about the fact that I am a female gamer, but I do not boldly claim it either. I only mention it if it comes up or if someone directly asks me. Because I always play female characters people do sometimes ask, and a lot of the times the reaction when they find out I'm a girl is very undesirable. I just want to play the game, same as anyone else.
+1 I honestly think that if I were in your shoes, I would be more annoyed by the legion of people rallying to help me because of my "frailty," then I would be by the people actually trying to harass me.
It's more than just wanting to protect a "woman's frailty", it's about harassement in general. It just happens to be worse for female players, which is why threads like these tends to spawn. Insults thrown at male gamers tends to boil down to the "You suck, you're gay, your mom is fat, I did your mom, I'll go to your home and kill you", of course there's always that creepy guy that goes into a bit more details, but still, it's dealt with ease. Female gamers have to deal with a lot more than that, and can receives pictures of dicks amongst other things (You'll hear stories about those, but you won't usually see the pictures posted on the internet for obvious reasons :P )
Harassement has definitively become worse over the years or at least more visible, and for the last year or so, communities are slowly waking up and being more vocal about harassement (which may have been influenced by the rise of websites like "FatUglyorSlutty" or "Why Was I Banned").
Sadly there are a lot of stories out there of female gamers who make the decision of hiding their identities, stop using mics, or simply leaving online gaming completely because they can't stand it anymore (the Cross Assault story is a decent example). Because of this, it turned into a major key point for Communities trying to push for better tools to prevent and punish harassement.
What could possibly be worse verbal harassment than "I'm going to go to your home and kill you" lol ?
And as for the pictures of dicks. I remember plenty of people sending me pictures of goatse back in the day, and I think that is far worse than some random dude's junk lol.
I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it's the type of harassment that women receive that makes us feel it's worse than the harassment a man would receive...it's the fact that the target of the harrasment is a woman that makes us think it's worse. And I don't know if that is really fair. I mean, on one side you basically say that women are inherently more frail and can't handle the harassment. And then on the other side you say that men should be able to handle harassment and are undeserving of sympathy.
Personally, I would rather harassment of people be viewed as the same regardless of gender. And be despised universally.
In this case, is it fair to feel sorry for one more than the other? Was the boy a "coward" for committing suicide, while the girl was just a "victim?"
It's silly to claim that one is worst or better than the other, and that's not what I'm saying. But there's no doubt that there's more ammunition for harassement towards female gamers, and the "threshold" to become a target is much lower for female gamers. Which isn't to say that male gamers are not harassed, but just being present in a room or using the microphone to talk is a lot less likely to trigger harassement than it is for female gamers. You could say that male gamers are less afraid of harassing female gamers than male gamers as well. That's what I'm getting at. Heck, the issue of sexism in the US still exist quite a bit when you look at the political sphere and thre should be no surprise that this also affect even online communities.
I'm not saying that a male being harassed versus a female being harassed is worse or not as worsed. They're both completely intolerable. But what I'm saying is that in the gaming communities, female gamers are an easier target. Which is why the subject is more prevalent when talking about online harassement, because it's the most visible.
I remember the very moment I changed my way of thinking on the subject.
Always, and I mean *always* played male-only, and figured others had to be weird not to. Then I played FFXI... and then I got my male character it's first bronze subligar... then I asked myself if I could keep playing as a male warrior if I had to look at that the entire time.
Rerolled a female Elvaan, kept the panty armor.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I prefer not to know the gender of my fellow players.
First and foremost, not knowing much about your fellow players helps with immersion because you can concentrate on the characters actions. In every game, as soon as I got to know anything about a person in real life, it has changed my view of their character... If you say it doesnt, I think you are fooling yourself.
With that in mind and guilty as charged, I cant help it I view characters differently when I know they are females. But also many other cases, where I found out people were very pro something I dont like (I will avoid giving examples), or find I have similar interests.
So its a dilemma, I really want to talk to some real people and know what they are doing in real life, but I dont want to know too much either hehe.
I do not understand some of the replies to this thread regarding the fact that males, too, experience the same issues in online environment. Some of the replies are blatant misinterpretations (or twisting) of the OP's intentions. Everybody, obviously, is and will be subjected to unjustified behaviors from others, but the degrees to which males and females experience these situations is nowhere near equal. While I do not condone harmful behavior directed to anybody from anybody else, there is a distinct difference in the treatment of females, because they are female, in MMO communities.
To address the topic: I am female and while I don't "hide" my gender from people, I do not mention it until asked and even then, I do not like to answer for many of the reasons already stated. Many males are respectful individuals - I have amassed many good male friends who do not discriminate on the basis of gender - but in every pool of people, there are always those who are... not so wonderful. Even when I was asked to reveal my gender from another party, people would always assume that I was looking for attention or trying to get free stuff from them (excuse me, YOU asked!). And then there were those who felt entitled to me falling in love with and being in a relationship with them, after knowing them for one minute, because they knew my gender. Now, I can bear with such annoyances and ignore them, but these kind of players tend to ALWAYS ignite drama and it is the drama I hate the most. I even had one person who went to great lengths to find my personal information to stalk me with - one experience that has made me extremely cautious with revealing any bit of information about myself online.
I wish game companies would do more to enforce respectful player conduct (for everyone); but as it is not efficient to do so, I can only rant about it here.
Dunno if it was brought up yet - but why is there such a slew of threads trying to defend women's rights - be it oversexualization in some game, or treatment of females in the gamespace, etc - but all brought forward by men?
So much overcompensating without ever having been asked to.
Quit it.
Oh, no way does it happen only in games. Permeates our whole society.
This way lies a political correctness discussion, and complete madness.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Comments
The MMo that i am playing now is gender locked so i had no choice but to have a man character. Honestly, when you are a guy in game, other men will not pity you for being a low level, for having a hard time finishing a quest, etc. It is actually more fun to be treated equally. It is more challenging.
But still, if the MMO was not gender locked, id still choose a female character.
I can't imagine that kind of behavior being acceptable. I can't even imagine being in a guild where that is anywhere near acceptable.
What could possibly be worse verbal harassment than "I'm going to go to your home and kill you" lol
?
And as for the pictures of dicks. I remember plenty of people sending me pictures of goatse back in the day, and I think that is far worse than some random dude's junk lol.
I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it's the type of harassment that women receive that makes us feel it's worse than the harassment a man would receive...it's the fact that the target of the harrasment is a woman that makes us think it's worse. And I don't know if that is really fair. I mean, on one side you basically say that women are inherently more frail and can't handle the harassment. And then on the other side you say that men should be able to handle harassment and are undeserving of sympathy.
Personally, I would rather harassment of people be viewed as the same regardless of gender. And be despised universally.
Here is an example of a boy who committed suicide from being harassed: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_of_Ryan_Halligan. And here is an example of a girl committing suicide for being harassed: http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-04-13/news/bs-md-ho-blue-for-grace-20120413_1_cyber-bullying-anti-bullying-mourners.
In this case, is it fair to feel sorry for one more than the other? Was the boy a "coward" for committing suicide, while the girl was just a "victim?"
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
For a roleplayer, hiding your identity is always a good idea; you aren't entitled to know.
If you gave me gold because you guessed wrong, well....lesson learned, maybe.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
It's silly to claim that one is worst or better than the other, and that's not what I'm saying. But there's no doubt that there's more ammunition for harassement towards female gamers, and the "threshold" to become a target is much lower for female gamers. Which isn't to say that male gamers are not harassed, but just being present in a room or using the microphone to talk is a lot less likely to trigger harassement than it is for female gamers. You could say that male gamers are less afraid of harassing female gamers than male gamers as well. That's what I'm getting at. Heck, the issue of sexism in the US still exist quite a bit when you look at the political sphere and thre should be no surprise that this also affect even online communities.
This website is a perfect example of how easy it is for a female to get harassed : http://www.notinthekitchenanymore.com/
or a good article on RPS about Tropes vs. Women's reception (a Kickstarter project) http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/06/13/tropes-vs-women-in-video-games-vs-the-internet/
I'm not saying that a male being harassed versus a female being harassed is worse or not as worsed. They're both completely intolerable. But what I'm saying is that in the gaming communities, female gamers are an easier target. Which is why the subject is more prevalent when talking about online harassement, because it's the most visible.
I am a girl and I play as a girl.
I don't know of any girls who play as a guy.
I do know lots of guys who play as girls.
I did ask 6 of those guys. Why play as a girl?
Each said, who wants to stare at a guy.....
Life is Short, Read a Book.
I remember the very moment I changed my way of thinking on the subject.
Always, and I mean *always* played male-only, and figured others had to be weird not to. Then I played FFXI... and then I got my male character it's first bronze subligar... then I asked myself if I could keep playing as a male warrior if I had to look at that the entire time.
Rerolled a female Elvaan, kept the panty armor.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I prefer not to know the gender of my fellow players.
First and foremost, not knowing much about your fellow players helps with immersion because you can concentrate on the characters actions. In every game, as soon as I got to know anything about a person in real life, it has changed my view of their character... If you say it doesnt, I think you are fooling yourself.
With that in mind and guilty as charged, I cant help it I view characters differently when I know they are females. But also many other cases, where I found out people were very pro something I dont like (I will avoid giving examples), or find I have similar interests.
So its a dilemma, I really want to talk to some real people and know what they are doing in real life, but I dont want to know too much either hehe.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
I do not understand some of the replies to this thread regarding the fact that males, too, experience the same issues in online environment. Some of the replies are blatant misinterpretations (or twisting) of the OP's intentions. Everybody, obviously, is and will be subjected to unjustified behaviors from others, but the degrees to which males and females experience these situations is nowhere near equal. While I do not condone harmful behavior directed to anybody from anybody else, there is a distinct difference in the treatment of females, because they are female, in MMO communities.
To address the topic: I am female and while I don't "hide" my gender from people, I do not mention it until asked and even then, I do not like to answer for many of the reasons already stated. Many males are respectful individuals - I have amassed many good male friends who do not discriminate on the basis of gender - but in every pool of people, there are always those who are... not so wonderful. Even when I was asked to reveal my gender from another party, people would always assume that I was looking for attention or trying to get free stuff from them (excuse me, YOU asked!). And then there were those who felt entitled to me falling in love with and being in a relationship with them, after knowing them for one minute, because they knew my gender. Now, I can bear with such annoyances and ignore them, but these kind of players tend to ALWAYS ignite drama and it is the drama I hate the most. I even had one person who went to great lengths to find my personal information to stalk me with - one experience that has made me extremely cautious with revealing any bit of information about myself online.
I wish game companies would do more to enforce respectful player conduct (for everyone); but as it is not efficient to do so, I can only rant about it here.
G.I.R.L. = Guy In Real Life
This is mostly correct for MMO worlds
Oh, no way does it happen only in games. Permeates our whole society.
This way lies a political correctness discussion, and complete madness.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.