If a game doesnt have open world pvp I dont see myself playing for more then a few months. I dont like warzones its like pvp lite. If you dont like being ganked maybe they need a system like swg were you can be in pvp or non pvp mode on the same server.
Real PvPers get their kicks fighting challenging opponents who can give them a good fight, not killing lowbies. Open world PvP is for gankers and griefers. 'Nuff said.
When I did play WoW, I always had my arena rogue or priest mains parked where my lowbies were leveling. I never once got a good fight out of someone that ganked my lowbies. They were sh#$ty players that couldn't do well in big boy pvp so they ganked lowbies they knew they had a chance with, lol. Corpse camp them and they release to graveyard and find a new area to go ganking lowbies.
Ganking lowbies, isn't challenging and it is just a waste of time.
Here's the thing. You're either A) the minority, or the lesser noticed party. There are players who enjoy ganking people unable to effectively fight back. There are players who like being a bully. As long as open world pvp allows them to engage in that behaviour without consequence, they ruin the potential of open pvp for people like yourself by making more people hate it.
Now if an open world pvp game did what GW2 does and near-equalizes people in lower level zones by de-levelling them, I'd be all for it. Then a lowbie could at least put up a fight against a ganker, or a group of lowbies could gan up on the guy.
For the real diehard open PvP (Ultima...) crowd, this is not going to appease anyone. It's not better to them and never will be because the following possibilities are missing
Ganking people minding their own business questing.
Being ganked in the same state.
Recurring Grudge matches over the span of motnhs with individual players/guilds
Griefing (yes, there are people that enjoy this, admit it. Even if there are some that don't)
The constant feel of danger no matter where you go.
Personally, I like WvW. But there's a large contingent of open pvp players who like the above items, and will not be satisfied with WvW.
Mind you they won't be satisfied with anything else on the current market either.
I agree with above reasons, except for number 5 W v W is also a constant danger zone no matter where you go to, just wait till GW2 releases and W V W will be trully a sight to behold, we haven't seen anything yet during BWE's of what the real scope of W v W is.
I would add the following:
6. the main reasons these so called die hard open world pvp players do not want to even try GW2 W v W is:
it's all on the level and skill is involved they would never have the always winning advantage they seek to be sure never to lose a fight, ofcourse they would never say it like that so they disguise it with reasons like:
- theres' no thrill
- there's no sense of danger
- I'm a pure breed open world pvp player and that is not open world pvp
bottomline is they do not like the fact they cannot do above mentioned reasons 1.2.3.4.5 and 6.
good thing these so called purists are a niche, like they say, "take out the rotten apple before it contaminates the whole basket". in the context of the game that translates to take out the ganker type skill-less pvpers and we will truly have a great game that no one will want to quit because of them bad apples. pawn intended.
Although i wish this game succes because i really enjoy it, and how they changed the combat system plus more. I fear i won't be playing for so long because it has no open world pvp. Open world pvp is the best endgame anyone could ask for tbh, its just one map which is good for anet because it will be less money to add content to the game, for pvp that is.
sPVP is very limited, ya they added a new map but that makes it what 3-4?
WvW is ok, but it not anything like a true open world pvp where you grab soloers and do small groups/1v1 fights. It is a place where servers raid up and fight...which would be kind of annoying to people who enjoy 1v1/small group. I can back this up because i have already seen this on beta.
In the end, people might not play this game for so long due to limited pvp but then again they could always add more pvp content. ATM i don't feel they have so much of that but its just the launch so i don't expect anything big.
I'm mainly a PvE player so I play on a PvE server. This don't mean PvP has been ignored on my part with several thousand kills and many large-scale fights under my belt. GW2 will be good for me since GW2 is all PvE servers where you can do minis and WvW.
I don't understand why they don't have PvP servers though for those inclined (like xalvi), there could even be less of them than PvE servers, but at least give players the option.
all you people that are posting complaining about owpvp just dont play on that server. do you post on the rp forums saying how you dont want that server type either? look at the numbers that play on pvp servers they can support the few people to recode events.
Open world PvP (or a PvP server for that matter) doesn't make any sense due to game lore mechanics.
There are no factions, so it would have to be FFA or guild-oriented PvP, and then again the game is made to be fully cooperative, the races like and help eachother and the players do not compete in the world.
As full cooperation is somewhat the opposite of what PvP brings it doesn't make sense to have PvP open in the world. And between having battlegrounds + parallel world with full PvP on or some sort of "Arenas" in the main world, the first choice is way better IMO since it brings much more freedom to everyone.
all you people that are posting complaining about owpvp just dont play on that server. do you post on the rp forums saying how you dont want that server type either? look at the numbers that play on pvp servers they can support the few people to recode events.
You'd have to recode the whole game, since it's entirely based on cooperative play among people on the same server. Stuff like friendly fire, which would be required for an open PvP server, would make dynamic events totally impossible to complete without being in a group, which completely destroys the whole concept.
It will not happen. If you hope ANet will change their mind, in my opinion, you are wasting your time.
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Although i wish this game succes because i really enjoy it, and how they changed the combat system plus more. I fear i won't be playing for so long because it has no open world pvp. Open world pvp is the best endgame anyone could ask for tbh, its just one map which is good for anet because it will be less money to add content to the game, for pvp that is.
sPVP is very limited, ya they added a new map but that makes it what 3-4?
WvW is ok, but it not anything like a true open world pvp where you grab soloers and do small groups/1v1 fights. It is a place where servers raid up and fight...which would be kind of annoying to people who enjoy 1v1/small group. I can back this up because i have already seen this on beta.
In the end, people might not play this game for so long due to limited pvp but then again they could always add more pvp content. ATM i don't feel they have so much of that but its just the launch so i don't expect anything big.
I'm mainly a PvE player so I play on a PvE server. This don't mean PvP has been ignored on my part with several thousand kills and many large-scale fights under my belt. GW2 will be good for me since GW2 is all PvE servers where you can do minis and WvW.
I don't understand why they don't have PvP servers though for those inclined (like xalvi), there could even be less of them than PvE servers, but at least give players the option.
Wait what?
I can't seem to remember because the BWEs were months ago, but i thought there were pvp servers lol?
Although i wish this game succes because i really enjoy it, and how they changed the combat system plus more. I fear i won't be playing for so long because it has no open world pvp. Open world pvp is the best endgame anyone could ask for tbh, its just one map which is good for anet because it will be less money to add content to the game, for pvp that is.
sPVP is very limited, ya they added a new map but that makes it what 3-4?
WvW is ok, but it not anything like a true open world pvp where you grab soloers and do small groups/1v1 fights. It is a place where servers raid up and fight...which would be kind of annoying to people who enjoy 1v1/small group. I can back this up because i have already seen this on beta.
In the end, people might not play this game for so long due to limited pvp but then again they could always add more pvp content. ATM i don't feel they have so much of that but its just the launch so i don't expect anything big.
I'm mainly a PvE player so I play on a PvE server. This don't mean PvP has been ignored on my part with several thousand kills and many large-scale fights under my belt. GW2 will be good for me since GW2 is all PvE servers where you can do minis and WvW.
I don't understand why they don't have PvP servers though for those inclined (like xalvi), there could even be less of them than PvE servers, but at least give players the option.
Wait what?
I can't seem to remember because the BWEs were months ago, but i thought there were pvp servers lol?
If TSW had Fusang and the two minigames on a seperate server would it make the game any different? Ofc not, there would still be no regular PvP servers.
people were somewhat happy with the pvp system in bw2. friendly fire is asked for by about 5% of the people but it wont work there is about the same amount of people asking for full loot. there would be no real recoding bw2 system is done when you zone into the wvw area turn off the pvp flag.
WvW is a great alternative to owPvP for several reasons. Most (or all) of the people who want full open world PvP want the chance to gank, that's all there is to it. For anyone who is into fair PvP, GW2 is awesome. Want to gank newbies? There's plenty of games for that, and most of them are pretty unpopulated (especially if they have PvE server options) for a reason.
WvW is a great alternative to owPvP for several reasons. Most (or all) of the people who want full open world PvP want the chance to gank, that's all there is to it. For anyone who is into fair PvP, GW2 is awesome. Want to gank newbies? There's plenty of games for that, and most of them are pretty unpopulated (especially if they have PvE server options) for a reason.
Ganking is pretty common but far from being all open world pvp is about.
1. Danger while questing
2. Duels
3. Random fights (fair in lvl difference and numbers)
4. Group fights
5. Random small fights that escalates (e.g. one player attacking one player but failing so he ask for help, one player has a hard time beating 3 players so he also ask for help and it might end with 5 players beating 10 worse players).
WvW is a great alternative to owPvP for several reasons. Most (or all) of the people who want full open world PvP want the chance to gank, that's all there is to it. For anyone who is into fair PvP, GW2 is awesome. Want to gank newbies? There's plenty of games for that, and most of them are pretty unpopulated (especially if they have PvE server options) for a reason.
Ganking is pretty common but far from being all open world pvp is about.
1. Danger while questing
2. Duels
3. Random fights (fair in lvl difference and numbers)
4. Group fights
5. Random small fights that escalates (e.g. one player attacking one player but failing so he ask for help, one player has a hard time beating 3 players so he also ask for help and it might end with 5 players beating 10 worse players).
6. And probably more
Not so many years ago this arguement worked, but nobody is buying it anymore. These days everyone knows that OWPvP is a gankfest full of griefers and lowlifes.
As a person who has played many times on a PVP server I've been the gankee far more often than the ganker, just not how I roll.
I mostly played on them to make the boring PVE content more exciting, and since GW2 is suppose to be much more fun in this area, I don't feel the need for open world PVP.
I'm looking forward to the new approach to see how it all pans out.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus Ironically GW2 has everything needed for a perfect open world PvP game, if they would mix the dynamic events and the WvW setting with eachother in an open world.
Aren't those events just, "defend the keep," and such?
Defend the Keep.
Attack the Tower.
Attack the Keep.
Or are there more PvE oriented ones that I just missed?
They have a lot more, up to and including world bosses and stuff that were added in.
There are also a whole bunch of PvP assister DEs like the weather control stations in the lake and stuff... Which while not directly part of a siege, grant your side an advantage.
Eve is FFA PvP if you happen to recall? And its pretty much the healthiest MMO out there.
That doesn't mean that all the PvP is pretty much greifing and ganking. Besides corporation wars and battles, that is all EVE is. I have been greifed, harrassed (people trying to get me to loot their cans so I get flagged and they can kill me) as well as just killed randomly when in certain low security zones.
It isn't skillful, or fair in any way, shape or form. Is it a rush? Sure, I guess. But it is far from competitive or fair PvP. And even then, EVE puts some pretty strict limits on where you can PvP, I don't really consider it as open as games like Darkfall.
Either way, for the majority of all my experience, open world PvP is a greifers/lamers game. This is why it isn't a feature in games hardly at all anymore.
I played UO at release, and I used to be a big proponent of open world PvP. I never was a PK, but I just liked the freedom of it all, and the fact that I knew that I might be able to be an actual "hero" and save someone or hunt down gankers. Indeed, I liked it so much, that even after UO, I would almost always play on a PvP server of whatever game I was playing.
But at some point, it may have been in the AoC era, I realized something...
I had been ganked tons of times. But I had actually saved someone from ganking or killed a ganker only a handful of times, maybe three or four. The problem was that open world PvP, without any real structure or harsh penalties, simply devolves into a predator and prey situation.
You are either a predator (ganker) or prey (non-ganker). There really is no in between. Trying to be an "anti-ganker" is so inefficient when compared to being a regular ganker that there is almost no point. So for a ganker, PvP servers are great, you have tons of unsuspecting and vastly underpowered players to kill unfairly. But for everyone else...it's kind of crappy. Who wants to be prey?
And that's when I stopped playing on PvP servers. I really have no interest in ganking, and I definitely don't want to serve as a deer to every ganker's wolf.
One day...I hope that there is an open-world PvP game with enough structure and penalties for ganking (REAL penalties like perma-death or perma-stat loss) so that the whole thing doesn't devolve into predator/prey...but that has yet to happen. The problem is I think that all open-world PvP games cater to players who want to gank.
thats someting i personally belive Conquer did well.
if you pk'd enough you would slowly become red name. that name would make city guards attack (and they were almsot super powered) and almost everyone likes to kill red names. and once killed with a red name you must serve time in prison. a place full of pkers. you could not leave until your time was lived out. but you could not leave yourself unattended as they are all criminals and likely to murder you for your stuff
Not to mention CCP themself said that the vast majority of their players rarely if ever leave secure space...
Only around 65% of players "reside" in high sec and the majority of them will venture into low sec, null sec or W-space. Hardly a vast majority.
High sec is also not "secure" in the sense that open world conflict does not exist within it.
Besides people must realise that even the people staying in high sec are benefiting from the open nature of the pvp as that is a massive part of what generates the economy (and the meta game in general).
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Comments
If a game doesnt have open world pvp I dont see myself playing for more then a few months. I dont like warzones its like pvp lite. If you dont like being ganked maybe they need a system like swg were you can be in pvp or non pvp mode on the same server.
Here's the thing. You're either A) the minority, or
the lesser noticed party. There are players who enjoy ganking people unable to effectively fight back. There are players who like being a bully. As long as open world pvp allows them to engage in that behaviour without consequence, they ruin the potential of open pvp for people like yourself by making more people hate it.
Now if an open world pvp game did what GW2 does and near-equalizes people in lower level zones by de-levelling them, I'd be all for it. Then a lowbie could at least put up a fight against a ganker, or a group of lowbies could gan up on the guy.
I agree with above reasons, except for number 5 W v W is also a constant danger zone no matter where you go to, just wait till GW2 releases and W V W will be trully a sight to behold, we haven't seen anything yet during BWE's of what the real scope of W v W is.
I would add the following:
6. the main reasons these so called die hard open world pvp players do not want to even try GW2 W v W is:
it's all on the level and skill is involved they would never have the always winning advantage they seek to be sure never to lose a fight, ofcourse they would never say it like that so they disguise it with reasons like:
- theres' no thrill
- there's no sense of danger
- I'm a pure breed open world pvp player and that is not open world pvp
bottomline is they do not like the fact they cannot do above mentioned reasons 1.2.3.4.5 and 6.
good thing these so called purists are a niche, like they say, "take out the rotten apple before it contaminates the whole basket". in the context of the game that translates to take out the ganker type skill-less pvpers and we will truly have a great game that no one will want to quit because of them bad apples. pawn intended.
Angry Joe's Guild Wars 2 video review
Aerowyn's Video Compilation of ALL things Guild Wars 2
@Taugrim explains why the fanbois don't get it
What makes you so sure that you'll be able to stop them from ganking you? What makes you so sure you're going to have the superior skill?
So I had to either take up the viola or become a vampire; and they were fresh out of violas.
I'm mainly a PvE player so I play on a PvE server. This don't mean PvP has been ignored on my part with several thousand kills and many large-scale fights under my belt. GW2 will be good for me since GW2 is all PvE servers where you can do minis and WvW.
I don't understand why they don't have PvP servers though for those inclined (like xalvi), there could even be less of them than PvE servers, but at least give players the option.
all you people that are posting complaining about owpvp just dont play on that server. do you post on the rp forums saying how you dont want that server type either? look at the numbers that play on pvp servers they can support the few people to recode events.
Open world PvP (or a PvP server for that matter) doesn't make any sense due to game lore mechanics.
There are no factions, so it would have to be FFA or guild-oriented PvP, and then again the game is made to be fully cooperative, the races like and help eachother and the players do not compete in the world.
As full cooperation is somewhat the opposite of what PvP brings it doesn't make sense to have PvP open in the world. And between having battlegrounds + parallel world with full PvP on or some sort of "Arenas" in the main world, the first choice is way better IMO since it brings much more freedom to everyone.
You'd have to recode the whole game, since it's entirely based on cooperative play among people on the same server. Stuff like friendly fire, which would be required for an open PvP server, would make dynamic events totally impossible to complete without being in a group, which completely destroys the whole concept.
It will not happen. If you hope ANet will change their mind, in my opinion, you are wasting your time.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Whatever you want to call it, I prefer their take on it better.
Main thing I like is being able to count anyone on the server I play on as an ally.
Wait what?
I can't seem to remember because the BWEs were months ago, but i thought there were pvp servers lol?
If TSW had Fusang and the two minigames on a seperate server would it make the game any different? Ofc not, there would still be no regular PvP servers.
people were somewhat happy with the pvp system in bw2. friendly fire is asked for by about 5% of the people but it wont work there is about the same amount of people asking for full loot. there would be no real recoding bw2 system is done when you zone into the wvw area turn off the pvp flag.
WvW is a great alternative to owPvP for several reasons. Most (or all) of the people who want full open world PvP want the chance to gank, that's all there is to it. For anyone who is into fair PvP, GW2 is awesome. Want to gank newbies? There's plenty of games for that, and most of them are pretty unpopulated (especially if they have PvE server options) for a reason.
Ganking is pretty common but far from being all open world pvp is about.
1. Danger while questing
2. Duels
3. Random fights (fair in lvl difference and numbers)
4. Group fights
5. Random small fights that escalates (e.g. one player attacking one player but failing so he ask for help, one player has a hard time beating 3 players so he also ask for help and it might end with 5 players beating 10 worse players).
6. And probably more
Not so many years ago this arguement worked, but nobody is buying it anymore. These days everyone knows that OWPvP is a gankfest full of griefers and lowlifes.
Your wasting your time, move along.
Amen.
QQ-ing wanna-be Gankers and Griefers simply want the opportunity to one shot lowbie new players.
If you get off on the threat of being attacked while doing something else, stay in WvW and do the many activities available there, or go play Dayz.
Open world pvp is just a hassle and I am glad Arenanet has made any PVP an option.
As a person who has played many times on a PVP server I've been the gankee far more often than the ganker, just not how I roll.
I mostly played on them to make the boring PVE content more exciting, and since GW2 is suppose to be much more fun in this area, I don't feel the need for open world PVP.
I'm looking forward to the new approach to see how it all pans out.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
They have a lot more, up to and including world bosses and stuff that were added in.
There are also a whole bunch of PvP assister DEs like the weather control stations in the lake and stuff... Which while not directly part of a siege, grant your side an advantage.
That doesn't mean that all the PvP is pretty much greifing and ganking. Besides corporation wars and battles, that is all EVE is. I have been greifed, harrassed (people trying to get me to loot their cans so I get flagged and they can kill me) as well as just killed randomly when in certain low security zones.
It isn't skillful, or fair in any way, shape or form. Is it a rush? Sure, I guess. But it is far from competitive or fair PvP. And even then, EVE puts some pretty strict limits on where you can PvP, I don't really consider it as open as games like Darkfall.
Either way, for the majority of all my experience, open world PvP is a greifers/lamers game. This is why it isn't a feature in games hardly at all anymore.
Not to mention CCP themself said that the vast majority of their players rarely if ever leave secure space...
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
thats someting i personally belive Conquer did well.
if you pk'd enough you would slowly become red name. that name would make city guards attack (and they were almsot super powered) and almost everyone likes to kill red names. and once killed with a red name you must serve time in prison. a place full of pkers. you could not leave until your time was lived out. but you could not leave yourself unattended as they are all criminals and likely to murder you for your stuff
Only around 65% of players "reside" in high sec and the majority of them will venture into low sec, null sec or W-space. Hardly a vast majority.
High sec is also not "secure" in the sense that open world conflict does not exist within it.
Besides people must realise that even the people staying in high sec are benefiting from the open nature of the pvp as that is a massive part of what generates the economy (and the meta game in general).
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."