There are two major differences between the GW2 "gear grind" and the "grind" of most other theme park MMOs.
1) That supposed "grind" is not mandatory to play. You can enjoy the game without doing it at all if you don't want to.
2) While you do that "grind", you are not simple undergeared canon fodder. You already have the right stats, you are not a weakling who is going to be steamrolled (notably in PvP), you are already competitive, a force to reckon with.
Those two points make all the difference in my opinion. Nothing is worse that hitting the level cap in some WoW clone, and then having to be facerolled in PvP for weeks before you become remotely competitive and not just a bumb on the road, and before you can start the harder content in PvE. The difference between "grind" and "fun".
EDIT: adding an example.
I still have my WoW accounts active, and I mostly do PvP nowadays (can't be bothered with raiding or even PvE dungeons anymore). My feral druid is well geared (4500+ resilience, 4 pieces of cataclysmic among which the weapon) and is now fun to play because if I meet another geared player, I'm not a simple bump on the road anymore and he will have to fight for his life. I was considering starting PvP with my shaman or my death knight for a change, but then I realized the time it took me to become competitive with the druid... weeks and weeks of being a complete weakling before you start to see things balance out. And the shaman doesn't even have stealth to reduce that imbalance a bit. I gave up, I'll stick with my druid for a month until GW2 is released. I just can't do that grind as a weakling a second time (and even less now that I have played GW2).
It's also the reason why I never got deeply into PvP in SW:TOR. It was the same crap all over again. No thanks.
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Originally posted by The_Korrigan The difference between "grind" and "fun".
Can be abbreviated by "how much time and punishment is involved"?
Seems to be the general agreement reached after reading 15 years of grind threads, anyway.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
There are two major differences between the GW2 "gear grind" and the "grind" of most other theme park MMOs.
1) That supposed "grind" is not mandatory to play. You can enjoy the game without doing it at all if you don't want to.
2) While you do that "grind", you are not simple undergeared canon fodder. You already have the right stats, you are not a weakling who is going to be steamrolled (notably in PvP), you are already competitive, a force to reckon with.
Those two points make all the difference in my opinion. Nothing is worse that hitting the level cap in some WoW clone, and then having to be facerolled in PvP for weeks before you become remotely competitive and not just a bumb on the road, and before you can start the harder content in PvE. The difference between "grind" and "fun".
EDIT: adding an example.
I still have my WoW accounts active, and I mostly do PvP nowadays (can't be bothered with raiding or even PvE dungeons anymore). My feral druid is well geared (4500+ resilience, 4 pieces of cataclysmic among which the weapon) and is now fun to play because if I meet another geared player, I'm not a simple bump on the road anymore and he's have to fight for his life. I was considering starting PvP with my shaman for a change, but then I realized the time it took me to become competitive with the druid... weeks and weeks of being a complete weakling before you start to see things balance out. And the shaman doesn't even have stealth to reduce that imbalance a bit. I gave up, I'll stick with my druid for a month until GW2 is released.
It's also the reason why I never got deeply into PvP in SW:TOR. It was the same crap all over again. No thanks.
quoted for an excellent account of the gear inflation issue that has dogged modern gaming.
The other thing I'd add to this is that you can progress your character constantly at max level in GW2 since nearly everything (SPVP being the acception) still grants EXP which in turn translates to Skill Points to put towards Legendaries and other Mystic Forge based stuff! an excellent idea from Arena Net, especially for those of us keen on WvW, who can gain the exp mentioned for costmetic gear whilst enjoying the playstyle we enjoy making the whole scenario not a grind.
A. The gear in question may have a better statistical order that fits my playstyle, and B. I'm a vain gamer that stares at my avatar 99.99% of the time.
The grind part is personal opinion since people have different opinions on what a "grind" is.
For just about anything really but far as cosmetics go I could give a fuck
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I would definately grind for cosmetic gear. I would only grind for stats gear if I absolutely had to for progression, and having to grind for progression might stop me from playing the game.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
they will definitely giv achievement points and as far as i knw achievement points hav some in game value in guild wars franchise, like extra skill points or such. so yeah i will definitely grind for that.
I hope people are not judging this threads responses with those outside the realm of GW2. GW2 is all about cosmetic differences equating to accomplishment. I can't see how anyone would be surprised at the results considering the section it's in and the way the subject was framed.
perhaps my understanding of cosmetic gear is different. cosmetic to me is the angel wings, the school uniform, or the beret that give no bonus. not the epic pvp gear that you get by collecting pvp kills in an arena setting or pve armor from farming a dungeon or specific mob.
and the only p2p game i played was called the 4th coming. you've prolly never heard of it. it had one dungeon and you only went through it when you were doing a rebirth (which was how you progressed your char). other than that i've played f2p games, where cosmetic gear only changes how you look. cosmetic is pretties, pvp gear might look cool but it does more than look pretty. and therefor is not cosmetic. so to say that i'm voting the way that i did because i love wow or gw/gw2 is attempting to square peg/round hole.
anyway using my understanding of cosmetic: yes I would grind for and yes i have.
Just wondering how many of you would invest hours into PvE/PvP to get gear that looks awesome but has the same stats as common equipment. Personally if I saw someone with awesome gear in PvP i would still see them as a huge threat. Not because i know his gear is stronger than mine, its because he has probably played long enough to know how to literally wipe the floor with my ass.
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
This would be a maybe for me. If all the cosmetics look great, I would at least grind for one but if there's multiple ones and only one or two I like I doubt I would since you know everyone else would look the same. I'd rather look like the silly one than everyone else.
If I don't have much else to do anymore in the game, I think I would, yeah.
The same in TOR: never really bothered with cosmetic changes to orange gear up until a few weeks ago, as I didn't have anything left unfinished or undone in the game, I started to grind out modifications and augments to combine it with the look I wanted.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Just wondering how many of you would invest hours into PvE/PvP to get gear that looks awesome but has the same stats as common equipment. Personally if I saw someone with awesome gear in PvP i would still see them as a huge threat. Not because i know his gear is stronger than mine, its because he has probably played long enough to know how to literally wipe the floor with my ass.
What do you guys think?
I don't grind for anything... super boring. /shrug if it requires that I grind for it, oh well, off to actually "play" another game. Grinding is an old game concept, at some point developers will have to actually "think" about adding content. Bummer for them I guess.
There will always be grind (alts, cosmetic gear, etc) unless you play for no reason (that might work for a while but you will get bored, quit and maybe come back when more content is added) or you just like to chat and do nothing.
It's impossible to make enough fresh content (it's only degrees of how far the developers lag behind players), just like it takes years to develope the game and only one month to experience a lot of it.
People have been grinding for cosmetics for years even if they don't realize it. WoW is a perfect example. The statistical differences between the next step up in arena or dungeon gear is marginal (at least when I played). It was all about the look. The newest shoulder piece or weapon represented skill and achievement much more so then stats. It was a symbol of accomplishment.
Simply put, looks are what you can use to guage players experise in GW2. So instead of the every other MMO grind of stat gear, you have cosmetic gear instead. Still the same concept.
Comments
There are two major differences between the GW2 "gear grind" and the "grind" of most other theme park MMOs.
1) That supposed "grind" is not mandatory to play. You can enjoy the game without doing it at all if you don't want to.
2) While you do that "grind", you are not simple undergeared canon fodder. You already have the right stats, you are not a weakling who is going to be steamrolled (notably in PvP), you are already competitive, a force to reckon with.
Those two points make all the difference in my opinion. Nothing is worse that hitting the level cap in some WoW clone, and then having to be facerolled in PvP for weeks before you become remotely competitive and not just a bumb on the road, and before you can start the harder content in PvE. The difference between "grind" and "fun".
EDIT: adding an example.
I still have my WoW accounts active, and I mostly do PvP nowadays (can't be bothered with raiding or even PvE dungeons anymore). My feral druid is well geared (4500+ resilience, 4 pieces of cataclysmic among which the weapon) and is now fun to play because if I meet another geared player, I'm not a simple bump on the road anymore and he will have to fight for his life. I was considering starting PvP with my shaman or my death knight for a change, but then I realized the time it took me to become competitive with the druid... weeks and weeks of being a complete weakling before you start to see things balance out. And the shaman doesn't even have stealth to reduce that imbalance a bit. I gave up, I'll stick with my druid for a month until GW2 is released. I just can't do that grind as a weakling a second time (and even less now that I have played GW2).
It's also the reason why I never got deeply into PvP in SW:TOR. It was the same crap all over again. No thanks.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Can be abbreviated by "how much time and punishment is involved"?
Seems to be the general agreement reached after reading 15 years of grind threads, anyway.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
quoted for an excellent account of the gear inflation issue that has dogged modern gaming.
The other thing I'd add to this is that you can progress your character constantly at max level in GW2 since nearly everything (SPVP being the acception) still grants EXP which in turn translates to Skill Points to put towards Legendaries and other Mystic Forge based stuff! an excellent idea from Arena Net, especially for those of us keen on WvW, who can gain the exp mentioned for costmetic gear whilst enjoying the playstyle we enjoy making the whole scenario not a grind.
A. The gear in question may have a better statistical order that fits my playstyle, and
B. I'm a vain gamer that stares at my avatar 99.99% of the time.
The grind part is personal opinion since people have different opinions on what a "grind" is.
Depends on how much of a grind it is. If it takes hundreds (or even dozens) of hours killing the same mobs over and over again, then probably not, no.
If I can play the game, have fun and by playing gain the karma I need to acquire these cool looking gears, then sure, why wouldn't I?
No...I wouldn't
For fun
For ranking
For itemization
For just about anything really but far as cosmetics go I could give a fuck
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I would definately grind for cosmetic gear. I would only grind for stats gear if I absolutely had to for progression, and having to grind for progression might stop me from playing the game.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
I would defintly get some of the cosmetic gear... Because it looks so pretty xD!
While I am always incredibly humble, right?
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Indeed I'd rather to grind for unique stuff like cosmetic elements of gear than gear that everyone will have after some time
I would grind anything including cosmetic gear that represented a challenge in the game.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
they will definitely giv achievement points and as far as i knw achievement points hav some in game value in guild wars franchise, like extra skill points or such. so yeah i will definitely grind for that.
perhaps my understanding of cosmetic gear is different. cosmetic to me is the angel wings, the school uniform, or the beret that give no bonus. not the epic pvp gear that you get by collecting pvp kills in an arena setting or pve armor from farming a dungeon or specific mob.
and the only p2p game i played was called the 4th coming. you've prolly never heard of it. it had one dungeon and you only went through it when you were doing a rebirth (which was how you progressed your char). other than that i've played f2p games, where cosmetic gear only changes how you look. cosmetic is pretties, pvp gear might look cool but it does more than look pretty. and therefor is not cosmetic. so to say that i'm voting the way that i did because i love wow or gw/gw2 is attempting to square peg/round hole.
anyway using my understanding of cosmetic: yes I would grind for and yes i have.
In all honesty:
NO F***ING WAY.
if the gameplay is ok and fun xD
Have done, many times!
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
Wouldn't hear of such a thing.
/cough
/cough
Life IS Feudal
This would be a maybe for me. If all the cosmetics look great, I would at least grind for one but if there's multiple ones and only one or two I like I doubt I would since you know everyone else would look the same. I'd rather look like the silly one than everyone else.
Nothing new, Guild Wars Factions was all about grinding for looks...
If I don't have much else to do anymore in the game, I think I would, yeah.
The same in TOR: never really bothered with cosmetic changes to orange gear up until a few weeks ago, as I didn't have anything left unfinished or undone in the game, I started to grind out modifications and augments to combine it with the look I wanted.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
There will always be grind (alts, cosmetic gear, etc) unless you play for no reason (that might work for a while but you will get bored, quit and maybe come back when more content is added) or you just like to chat and do nothing.
It's impossible to make enough fresh content (it's only degrees of how far the developers lag behind players), just like it takes years to develope the game and only one month to experience a lot of it.
Never.
Simply put, looks are what you can use to guage players experise in GW2. So instead of the every other MMO grind of stat gear, you have cosmetic gear instead. Still the same concept.