I just hope future games will pick up the torch and run with it, rather than trying to just clone GW2. Not only does cloning equal stagnation, but if no one managed to come close to successfully cloning WoW, there is no way anyone is going to successfully clone GW2.
Well, I think just cloning B2P would help making better MMOs honestly. When you are no longer trying to design a game to psychologically manipulate people to keep player, you can...you know...focus on fun! That alone would lead to a lot more innovation.
It's a question of when the industry will decide to stop going for sub-based games.
uh.. I wish people would stop using the word "revolutionary" to describe MMOs before they are launched... I've yet to see one that is revolutionary after all the excuses and same o same o code comes out.....just like SWTOR ...that word was bandied around more than I can shake a stick at...but nothing about it was revolutionary. If fact....havent see much that even comes close.
I get you're excited about it...but really....
Just my 2 cents
Carry On!
Well, I have logged over 150 hours playtesting the game, so I actually feel comfortable saying the game is pretty revolutionary. I know that's a lot more hours than most professional reviewers will spend playing the game before offering up their opinions and 145 to 150 hours more than the majority of people who will be trashing the game after it releases.
The game isn't perfect, but it brings the MMO genre back on track, after most developers veered off into "clone the WoW now" territory, which resulted in us losing about two generations of MMO evolution! GW2 was designed to be an evolution over the expected evolution of the genre that never actually occured during the time it was in development. I think 2+ generations ahead of your contemporary competition equals revolution!
I just hope future games will pick up the torch and run with it, rather than trying to just clone GW2. Not only does cloning equal stagnation, but if no one managed to come close to successfully cloning WoW, there is no way anyone is going to successfully clone GW2.
I too pushed 160+ hours between all betas with an extensive background of gaming experience for the past 15 years and completely Agree with Fiontar.
Are a lot of the things being presented in Guild Wars 2 similar to what has been done in the past? Only on paper, guild wars 2 has taken aspects and familiarity of great mechanics from the past and some of their own, a lot of their own mechanics and made them incredibly organic.
No other game has ever offered as much as Guild Wars 2 is offering at launch all coupled with Buy 2 Play... This ladies and gents = Revolutionary.
I read someone trying to over simplify the game and categorize it with "things are from previous games" all I can say is from personally testing them is you are dead wrong. Though familiar compared to those previous mechanics, Anet has made them their own and done them really well.
It isn't the fact that Guild Wars 2 is bringing 1, 2 or even 5 unique, changed, or even used before aspects to the game. No, its the fact that they are bringing countless little things to the game along with some really big mechanics all combined with no monthly sub! This is why Guild Wars 2 is special, it deserves a monthly sub more then any game currently on the market and yet it doesn't force its players to pay one. This in itself will cause a change a revolt or should I say REVOLUTION within the gaming Genre. Why you might ask? Because gamers will soon realize they can demand much, much more from their games whom are trying to force a monthly sub fee for a mediocre game.
IamApropos See where adventure will lead you! My PC Specs: i5-3570k oc'ed @4.2GHz 8GB 1600 RAM GTX670 oc'ed @ 1.25Ghz Samsung 830 SSD.
uh.. I wish people would stop using the word "revolutionary" to describe MMOs before they are launched... I've yet to see one that is revolutionary after all the excuses and same o same o code comes out.....just like SWTOR ...that word was bandied around more than I can shake a stick at...but nothing about it was revolutionary. If fact....havent see much that even comes close.
I get you're excited about it...but really....
Just my 2 cents
Carry On!
Well, I have logged over 150 hours playtesting the game, so I actually feel comfortable saying the game is pretty revolutionary. I know that's a lot more hours than most professional reviewers will spend playing the game before offering up their opinions and 145 to 150 hours more than the majority of people who will be trashing the game after it releases.
The game isn't perfect, but it brings the MMO genre back on track, after most developers veered off into "clone the WoW now" territory, which resulted in us losing about two generations of MMO evolution! GW2 was designed to be an evolution over the expected evolution of the genre that never actually occured during the time it was in development. I think 2+ generations ahead of your contemporary competition equals revolution!
I just hope future games will pick up the torch and run with it, rather than trying to just clone GW2. Not only does cloning equal stagnation, but if no one managed to come close to successfully cloning WoW, there is no way anyone is going to successfully clone GW2.
Exactly. Back in the day prior to WoW, MMO's were about innovation and having different play designs and elements counting the big 3 (UO, EQ and AC) none of those 3 were remotely similar then comes DAoC and CoH and again more evolution and innovation. Then comes WoW (it too revolutionized and innovated) and it garners massive subs and all of a sudden its like MMO developers go freaking nuts and start proclaiming innovation and evolution has reached its pinnacle, thereafter every game was basically a reskinned WoW. Now after 6 long years a company decides to go back to the roots of what made MMO's so special in the first place. Not surprising this same company is releasing possibly the most well deserved and hyped MMO since WoW. Hopefully.........and its a big hopefully Studios and MMO execs see that truue innoavtion and evolution is the driving force behind successful games, but knowing our luck we will get 6+ years of GW2 clones lol.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
Originally posted by Syno23 Think about the PvP and how revolutionary that is. Thing about the PvE which are Dynamic Events and hearts. No more having to compete for quests and areas and tokens and items. Work together. Create a world that works with more and more players. WvW included.
Warhammer Online has been using Public Quests (Dynamic events) for quite some time now.
Other games also toyed with similar ideas prior to WAR. Rift is a current example, via rift openings and invasions.
World vs. World vs. World combat is essentially DAoC RvR combat in a box that gets shuffled around every two weeks.
This has been implemented in several games since that time in varying degrees.
Dynamic events sound good on paper, but they will likely lead to an outcome similar to that in WAR. Everyone levels up and you're stuck alone trying to solo a difficult boss meant for groups. Or, on the other hand, players will focus solely on PvP and/or skip the events altogether.
I fail to see anything revolutionary.
Just sayin'...
What you fail to understand is none of those games took all these concepts and put it into a working living breathing box. Thats where the evolution comes from. The innovation comes from adding their own flair and ways of doing things.
Last time I looked WAR didnt have a massive world littered with PQ's, only an occasional PQ to break up the monotony of the quyest grind hub syndrome.
WvW is similar to DAoC's RvR but again with their own flair. Multiple entry points to keeps, walls that can be destroyed. Supply system to actualy drive the realism of "starving the defenders out". not to mention the PvE element in the game with mercs and NPC's you can saway to your side. This sint even mentioning the fact that you can Level via WvW and partake in it at level 2. Non of those DAoC did.
On top of all those you have the:
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curve
guild system
home instance
mini games
an amazing dye system
the trading post
ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist
NO SUB FEE
I could go on a little bit more but if you fail to see the innovation in this game then I dunno what to tell you. IMO GW2 is oozing innovation out its pores.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I don't need to play GW2 extensively to make assumptions about game concepts, or to recount past implementations of said concepts in other games.
I can assure you, what I said regarding dynamic events is exactly what WILL happen in 3 - 6 months, later if you're lucky.
Also, feel free to tell me where I'm wrong about WvWvW.
It is a non-static instanced continent, with a small associated dungeon. There are siege weapons and capture points.
Benefits are gained by the victors and matches are made between similarly ranked servers (worlds).
With the exception of the match-making (a result of the non-static nature), it is essentially DAoC RvR in a box.
Keep upgrades were implemented in WAR, so perhaps that is the better comparison.
I really shouldn't waste my time as this has been covered many times by many people, but the Stress Test is over and I'm bored so here goes:
First off only somebody with the most superficial and shallow exposure to GW2 would say that GW2 DEs are just like WAR PQs. Where WAR PQs were static group content on a timer with no lasting effects, DEs are the content in GW2. Most all of them are soloable. They scale (and scale well) based on the number of players participating far better than WAR's ever did. They have a wide variety of Triggers, Fail States, Success States, and Chains making them far more involved than WAR's DEs ever were. Put simply - if you have played them you would know they can play much differently than WAR PQs.
WvW might or might not be "DAoC in a Box" - I can't speak to that in detail because I didn't play DAoC but I'm sure there are others who can comment on it. One thing I can say is having the Eternal Battlegrounds reset every two weeks in a Matchmaking System is an improvement over DAoC. I have heard many comment on the problems in that game when Server Populations were wildly out of balance preventing 2 out of the 3 Factions from being able to have any meaningful impact ever.
These points don't even touch on the deliberate design efforts to minimize many of the annoyances of "traditional" PvE play, the removal of the gear treadmill, the incredibly high amount of detail put into the world, the lack of a monthly sub for a AAA quality game, or instant access to max-level max-stat competitve PvP.
Sure, many of their features are improvements over existing features, but at some point you have to step back and admire the holistic design effort - the whole is greater than the sum of its parts and THAT is what makes it Revolutionary to me.
I know how the dynamic events work. They are an improvement upon the initial public quest concept, on it's pitfall to be exact.
They will suffer the same fate as WAR public quests regardless of how well they scale or how complex they are in comparison. The only difference is that in GW2, you can complete the resulting event/quest. This defeats the purpose, however, as it's no longer a public group addition to the game and doesn't encourage teamwork as there will be no team. It's essentially the same fate as PQs, but in the form of a reduction into dynamic solo quests.
The lack of late game raids and grouping also compounds the problem of group content. Based on my experiences playing MMOs, I forsee a medium-lived casual game which will occupy players for some time but won't keep them around. It's a good thing they've chosen high game prices in favor of having no subscription, as income is assured regardless of initial player reactions to the game.
DAoC has been around for more than 10 years, so It's obvious that at one point one faction was doing well enough to dominate the other two completely for some time, but for the most part this did not happen. Matchmaking wasn't in place in DAoC, because RvR was persistent open-world. You faught the opposing factions on your server and your server only, so there was no need. Not to mention, having the same enemies made things a little more competitive and interesting. Multi-server battlegrounds were a recent addition in DAoC in response to decreased population which couldn't sustain the old setup.
I wouldn't call the matchmaking an improvement or something revolutionary, it's just a different method, the only method that really works with GW2 and the current lore.
Originally posted by Syno23Think about the PvP and how revolutionary that is. Thing about the PvE which are Dynamic Events and hearts. No more having to compete for quests and areas and tokens and items. Work together. Create a world that works with more and more players. WvW included.
Warhammer Online has been using Public Quests (Dynamic events) for quite some time now.Other games also toyed with similar ideas prior to WAR. Rift is a current example, via rift openings and invasions.World vs. World vs. World combat is essentially DAoC RvR combat in a box that gets shuffled around every two weeks.This has been implemented in several games since that time in varying degrees.Dynamic events sound good on paper, but they will likely lead to an outcome similar to that in WAR. Everyone levels up and you're stuck alone trying to solo a difficult boss meant for groups. Or, on the other hand, players will focus solely on PvP and/or skip the events altogether.I fail to see anything revolutionary.Just sayin'...
What you fail to understand is none of those games took all these concepts and put it into a working living breathing box. Thats where the evolution comes from. The innovation comes from adding their own flair and ways of doing things.Last time I looked WAR didnt have a massive world littered with PQ's, only an occasional PQ to break up the monotony of the quyest grind hub syndrome.WvW is similar to DAoC's RvR but again with their own flair. Multiple entry points to keeps, walls that can be destroyed. Supply system to actualy drive the realism of "starving the defenders out". not to mention the PvE element in the game with mercs and NPC's you can saway to your side. This sint even mentioning the fact that you can Level via WvW and partake in it at level 2. Non of those DAoC did.On top of all those you have the:
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curveguild systemhome instancemini gamesan amazing dye systemthe trading postability to add your own music to the ingame playlistNO SUB FEE
I could go on a little bit more but if you fail to see the innovation in this game then I dunno what to tell you. IMO GW2 is oozing innovation out its pores.
Damn, I hope you are getting paid for promoting the game. You just convinced me to buy it a second time!
ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist
Really? Interesting...wasn't aware of that one. Thanks for the info
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
WvW is similar to DAoC's RvR but again with their own flair. Multiple entry points to keeps, walls that can be destroyed. Supply system to actualy drive the realism of "starving the defenders out". not to mention the PvE element in the game with mercs and NPC's you can saway to your side. This sint even mentioning the fact that you can Level via WvW and partake in it at level 2. Non of those DAoC did.
Wait a minute...
DAoC keeps had multiple entry points. You either battered down the gate with a ram (you could ram the walls too), or you could fire catapults/trebuchets at any of the walls until they crumbled. After you knocked your way inside, the castle donjon obviously only had one entry as it was the inner keep.
You could also level up through PvP in DAoC. The only difference was that you could halt your XP gain via a chat command. A supply system wasn't really necessary, as it wouldn't have been effective. Smart groups would just feint an attack somewhere else then zerg a lightly defended keep, or just zerg it outright regardless of defenses. You'll likely end up seeing something similar with GW2 assaults. The games may change but large group gaming tactics always remain the same (zerg zerg zerg).
Originally posted by seridan Originally posted by immodiumOriginally posted by DrachasorThe only thing revolutionary about SWTOR was the story system. That's it. I'm not sure how you can't say that aspect wasn't revolutionary for an MMO.I guess despite the fact the design of GW2 is immensely different from all previous MMOs that you deny it is revolutionary either?
Immensley different to what?EvE yes, WoW no. The only thing slighly different is the combat and how quests are presented.
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curve guild system home instance mini games an amazing dye system the trading post ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist NO SUB FEE
As someone mentioned above
All of these things have been done before in some shape or form..
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
The only thing revolutionary about SWTOR was the story system. That's it. I'm not sure how you can't say that aspect wasn't revolutionary for an MMO.
I guess despite the fact the design of GW2 is immensely different from all previous MMOs that you deny it is revolutionary either?
Immensley different to what?
EvE yes, WoW no. The only thing slighly different is the combat and how quests are presented.
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curve
guild system
home instance
mini games
an amazing dye system
the trading post
ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist
NO SUB FEE
As someone mentioned above
Those points do not make it IMMENSLEY different though. Some maybe slight differences, but non I would class as IMMENSE.
DE chains are a pretty big difference. Even beyond that, what you have are a lot of little differences that add up. The end result is something that's a lot different from what games are out there now.
And how you can claim a game that doesn't have progression grind raiding and the Holy Trinity is pretty much just like WoW is frankly quite beyond me. Because those are immense differences in and of themselves. Speaking of which, we can add those two things above.
The only thing revolutionary about SWTOR was the story system. That's it. I'm not sure how you can't say that aspect wasn't revolutionary for an MMO.
I guess despite the fact the design of GW2 is immensely different from all previous MMOs that you deny it is revolutionary either?
Immensley different to what?
EvE yes, WoW no. The only thing slighly different is the combat and how quests are presented.
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curve
guild system
home instance
mini games
an amazing dye system
the trading post
ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist
NO SUB FEE
As someone mentioned above
Those points do not make it IMMENSLEY different though. Some maybe slight differences, but non I would class as IMMENSE.
DE chains are a pretty big difference. Even beyond that, what you have are a lot of little differences that add up. The end result is something that's a lot different from what games are out there now.
And how you can claim a game that doesn't have progression grind raiding and the Holy Trinity is pretty much just like WoW is frankly quite beyond me. Because those are immense differences in and of themselves. Speaking of which, we can add those two things above.
DE'S are not a huge difference though, it just feels more action based. Your still fighting and questing at the end of the day.
If it was truly revolutionary it would at least create it's own genre, which it isn't. It still a themepark based MMORPG.
These have all contributed something but also for a lot of people lacked something. I think GW2 has the best shot of being popular for more reasons, for more people, for longer.
Eg WAR's Gamebryo engine caused issues, ArenaNet's will be much better performance. eg 2 factions in WAR was a killer, 3 in GW2 will help exponentially. AoC apparently was not so polished/completed out of the tutorial, the level of polish in GW2 will be another level up. Perhaps the replayability will be higher in GW2 than SWTOR? And so on...
I definitely think mmorpg.com has rated some of the above higher than they deserve? I don't expect GW2 to be scored through the roof, but if the previous scores are high... how to put that into comparison with GW2?
Originally posted by Drughi is a really nice game, but not gonna revolutionize anything
It could possibly far as the payment model companies decide to go with considering how successful the game appears it is going to be.
About it really. Not to take anything away from the game itself. They have expanded on a lot of great concepts used in other mmos to make a game that will probably keep a significant player base vested in the game long term.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
The only thing revolutionary about SWTOR was the story system. That's it. I'm not sure how you can't say that aspect wasn't revolutionary for an MMO.
I guess despite the fact the design of GW2 is immensely different from all previous MMOs that you deny it is revolutionary either?
Immensley different to what?
EvE yes, WoW no. The only thing slighly different is the combat and how quests are presented.
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curve
guild system
home instance
mini games
an amazing dye system
the trading post
ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist
NO SUB FEE
As someone mentioned above
Those points do not make it IMMENSLEY different though. Some maybe slight differences, but non I would class as IMMENSE.
DE chains are a pretty big difference. Even beyond that, what you have are a lot of little differences that add up. The end result is something that's a lot different from what games are out there now.
And how you can claim a game that doesn't have progression grind raiding and the Holy Trinity is pretty much just like WoW is frankly quite beyond me. Because those are immense differences in and of themselves. Speaking of which, we can add those two things above.
DE'S are not a huge difference though, it just feels more action based. Your still fighting and questing at the end of the day.
If it was truly revolutionary it would at least create it's own genre, which it isn't. It still a themepark based MMORPG.
Oh you're right. It's really just like Final Fantasy I. I mean, you're still fighting and questing at the end of the day. What the heck does the form it takes or system it uses matter? None right? Especially if it feels different. I mean, who cares about how the game plays. That's not what they are about or anything.
So is your contention that you can't have a revolutionary innovation within a very broad genre like "themepark MMORPG"?
The only thing revolutionary about SWTOR was the story system. That's it. I'm not sure how you can't say that aspect wasn't revolutionary for an MMO.
I guess despite the fact the design of GW2 is immensely different from all previous MMOs that you deny it is revolutionary either?
Immensley different to what?
EvE yes, WoW no. The only thing slighly different is the combat and how quests are presented.
combat ability system
discovery crafting system
storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
active dodging
Open world exploration
e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
flat leveling curve
guild system
home instance
mini games
an amazing dye system
the trading post
ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist
NO SUB FEE
As someone mentioned above
Those points do not make it IMMENSLEY different though. Some maybe slight differences, but non I would class as IMMENSE.
DE chains are a pretty big difference. Even beyond that, what you have are a lot of little differences that add up. The end result is something that's a lot different from what games are out there now.
And how you can claim a game that doesn't have progression grind raiding and the Holy Trinity is pretty much just like WoW is frankly quite beyond me. Because those are immense differences in and of themselves. Speaking of which, we can add those two things above.
DE'S are not a huge difference though, it just feels more action based. Your still fighting and questing at the end of the day.
If it was truly revolutionary it would at least create it's own genre, which it isn't. It still a themepark based MMORPG.
They are not? Questing without requirements, questing without kill-stealing, questing at any point of a chain, players affecting the world in a major way, player actions affecting those around them, different outcomes in quests. For you it might not be a huge difference. For those who tried it and experienced it, it is a huge leap forward to the "usual" questing. You may say whatever you want but as someone else said: "in other MMOs players do quests, in GW2 quests do players" and I really liked that phrase, there is no "skip" or "accept" button, all npc conversations happen real-time with chat bubbles, allowing everyone to participate at any point, events happen with or without the presence of players, that's why it is dynamic and feels alive. This is what makes the game unique, immersive and revolutionary as no other game has ever done that before.
Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums
I think GW2 is going to do really well. This seems quite likely to me anyhow.
I hope the net result is not just people mimicking GW2, but a realization that you don't have to strictly adhere to the WoW model to make an MMO. And hopefully more movement towards a simple B2P model like most other games which is a healthier incentive for generating good gameplay.
GW2 is not the first to not adhere to the WOW model.B2P is a wake up call to other devs teams who charge a flat monthly rate and it's also a wake up call to the F2P model that has a cash shop and in game restrictions.
Comments
Well, I think just cloning B2P would help making better MMOs honestly. When you are no longer trying to design a game to psychologically manipulate people to keep player, you can...you know...focus on fun! That alone would lead to a lot more innovation.
It's a question of when the industry will decide to stop going for sub-based games.
I too pushed 160+ hours between all betas with an extensive background of gaming experience for the past 15 years and completely Agree with Fiontar.
Are a lot of the things being presented in Guild Wars 2 similar to what has been done in the past? Only on paper, guild wars 2 has taken aspects and familiarity of great mechanics from the past and some of their own, a lot of their own mechanics and made them incredibly organic.
No other game has ever offered as much as Guild Wars 2 is offering at launch all coupled with Buy 2 Play... This ladies and gents = Revolutionary.
I read someone trying to over simplify the game and categorize it with "things are from previous games" all I can say is from personally testing them is you are dead wrong. Though familiar compared to those previous mechanics, Anet has made them their own and done them really well.
It isn't the fact that Guild Wars 2 is bringing 1, 2 or even 5 unique, changed, or even used before aspects to the game. No, its the fact that they are bringing countless little things to the game along with some really big mechanics all combined with no monthly sub! This is why Guild Wars 2 is special, it deserves a monthly sub more then any game currently on the market and yet it doesn't force its players to pay one. This in itself will cause a change a revolt or should I say REVOLUTION within the gaming Genre. Why you might ask? Because gamers will soon realize they can demand much, much more from their games whom are trying to force a monthly sub fee for a mediocre game.
IamApropos
See where adventure will lead you!
My PC Specs:
i5-3570k oc'ed @4.2GHz
8GB 1600 RAM
GTX670 oc'ed @ 1.25Ghz
Samsung 830 SSD.
Exactly. Back in the day prior to WoW, MMO's were about innovation and having different play designs and elements counting the big 3 (UO, EQ and AC) none of those 3 were remotely similar then comes DAoC and CoH and again more evolution and innovation. Then comes WoW (it too revolutionized and innovated) and it garners massive subs and all of a sudden its like MMO developers go freaking nuts and start proclaiming innovation and evolution has reached its pinnacle, thereafter every game was basically a reskinned WoW. Now after 6 long years a company decides to go back to the roots of what made MMO's so special in the first place. Not surprising this same company is releasing possibly the most well deserved and hyped MMO since WoW. Hopefully.........and its a big hopefully Studios and MMO execs see that truue innoavtion and evolution is the driving force behind successful games, but knowing our luck we will get 6+ years of GW2 clones lol.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
What you fail to understand is none of those games took all these concepts and put it into a working living breathing box. Thats where the evolution comes from. The innovation comes from adding their own flair and ways of doing things.
Last time I looked WAR didnt have a massive world littered with PQ's, only an occasional PQ to break up the monotony of the quyest grind hub syndrome.
WvW is similar to DAoC's RvR but again with their own flair. Multiple entry points to keeps, walls that can be destroyed. Supply system to actualy drive the realism of "starving the defenders out". not to mention the PvE element in the game with mercs and NPC's you can saway to your side. This sint even mentioning the fact that you can Level via WvW and partake in it at level 2. Non of those DAoC did.
On top of all those you have the:
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I know how the dynamic events work. They are an improvement upon the initial public quest concept, on it's pitfall to be exact.
They will suffer the same fate as WAR public quests regardless of how well they scale or how complex they are in comparison. The only difference is that in GW2, you can complete the resulting event/quest. This defeats the purpose, however, as it's no longer a public group addition to the game and doesn't encourage teamwork as there will be no team. It's essentially the same fate as PQs, but in the form of a reduction into dynamic solo quests.
The lack of late game raids and grouping also compounds the problem of group content. Based on my experiences playing MMOs, I forsee a medium-lived casual game which will occupy players for some time but won't keep them around. It's a good thing they've chosen high game prices in favor of having no subscription, as income is assured regardless of initial player reactions to the game.
DAoC has been around for more than 10 years, so It's obvious that at one point one faction was doing well enough to dominate the other two completely for some time, but for the most part this did not happen. Matchmaking wasn't in place in DAoC, because RvR was persistent open-world. You faught the opposing factions on your server and your server only, so there was no need. Not to mention, having the same enemies made things a little more competitive and interesting. Multi-server battlegrounds were a recent addition in DAoC in response to decreased population which couldn't sustain the old setup.
I wouldn't call the matchmaking an improvement or something revolutionary, it's just a different method, the only method that really works with GW2 and the current lore.
Damn, I hope you are getting paid for promoting the game. You just convinced me to buy it a second time!
Immensley different to what?
EvE yes, WoW no. The only thing slighly different is the combat and how quests are presented.
Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums
Really? Interesting...wasn't aware of that one. Thanks for the info
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Wait a minute...
DAoC keeps had multiple entry points. You either battered down the gate with a ram (you could ram the walls too), or you could fire catapults/trebuchets at any of the walls until they crumbled. After you knocked your way inside, the castle donjon obviously only had one entry as it was the inner keep.
You could also level up through PvP in DAoC. The only difference was that you could halt your XP gain via a chat command. A supply system wasn't really necessary, as it wouldn't have been effective. Smart groups would just feint an attack somewhere else then zerg a lightly defended keep, or just zerg it outright regardless of defenses. You'll likely end up seeing something similar with GW2 assaults. The games may change but large group gaming tactics always remain the same (zerg zerg zerg).
Ugh, yet another thread like this on the front page.
This sort of claim, especially when the game isn't even out yet, gives "trolls" merit.
- combat ability system
- discovery crafting system
- storyline that takes place across the entire characters level up experience
- active dodging
- Open world exploration
- e-sport fair and balanced sPvP
- Dungeons with DE's and multiple paths
- flat leveling curve guild system home instance mini games an amazing dye system the trading post ability to add your own music to the ingame playlist NO SUB FEE
As someone mentioned aboveAll of these things have been done before in some shape or form..
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Those points do not make it IMMENSLEY different though. Some maybe slight differences, but non I would class as IMMENSE.
DE chains are a pretty big difference. Even beyond that, what you have are a lot of little differences that add up. The end result is something that's a lot different from what games are out there now.
And how you can claim a game that doesn't have progression grind raiding and the Holy Trinity is pretty much just like WoW is frankly quite beyond me. Because those are immense differences in and of themselves. Speaking of which, we can add those two things above.
So let's say the game sells 6 million copies and does well over the next several years.
You think it won't dramatically change the MMO market? You think everyone will still largely be making WoW-clones?
It is by the far the most convenient mmo ive ever seen or played. Good game for what it is. Revolution? I kinda hope not.
DE'S are not a huge difference though, it just feels more action based. Your still fighting and questing at the end of the day.
If it was truly revolutionary it would at least create it's own genre, which it isn't. It still a themepark based MMORPG.
Put it into context:
WAR, AoC, SWTOR, Secret World, Tera...
These have all contributed something but also for a lot of people lacked something. I think GW2 has the best shot of being popular for more reasons, for more people, for longer.
Eg WAR's Gamebryo engine caused issues, ArenaNet's will be much better performance. eg 2 factions in WAR was a killer, 3 in GW2 will help exponentially. AoC apparently was not so polished/completed out of the tutorial, the level of polish in GW2 will be another level up. Perhaps the replayability will be higher in GW2 than SWTOR? And so on...
I definitely think mmorpg.com has rated some of the above higher than they deserve? I don't expect GW2 to be scored through the roof, but if the previous scores are high... how to put that into comparison with GW2?
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
Most gaming companies like reliable investments.
Therefore they will always make WoW clones until WoW no longer exists.
It could possibly far as the payment model companies decide to go with considering how successful the game appears it is going to be.
About it really. Not to take anything away from the game itself. They have expanded on a lot of great concepts used in other mmos to make a game that will probably keep a significant player base vested in the game long term.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Oh you're right. It's really just like Final Fantasy I. I mean, you're still fighting and questing at the end of the day. What the heck does the form it takes or system it uses matter? None right? Especially if it feels different. I mean, who cares about how the game plays. That's not what they are about or anything.
So is your contention that you can't have a revolutionary innovation within a very broad genre like "themepark MMORPG"?
Yeah, because those WoW clones have proven to be soooo reliable, right?
Oh wait, most of them crash and burn. The ones that don't just crash or burn.
GW2 could demonstrate there's more reliable ways to model your MMO using more tried and true methods -- the same methods most games use.
They are not? Questing without requirements, questing without kill-stealing, questing at any point of a chain, players affecting the world in a major way, player actions affecting those around them, different outcomes in quests. For you it might not be a huge difference. For those who tried it and experienced it, it is a huge leap forward to the "usual" questing. You may say whatever you want but as someone else said: "in other MMOs players do quests, in GW2 quests do players" and I really liked that phrase, there is no "skip" or "accept" button, all npc conversations happen real-time with chat bubbles, allowing everyone to participate at any point, events happen with or without the presence of players, that's why it is dynamic and feels alive. This is what makes the game unique, immersive and revolutionary as no other game has ever done that before.
Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums
GW2 is not the first to not adhere to the WOW model.B2P is a wake up call to other devs teams who charge a flat monthly rate and it's also a wake up call to the F2P model that has a cash shop and in game restrictions.