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I am SICK and TIRED of the "more difficult" crowd

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  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Enerzeal

    Eli, did you play Everquest? 

    Did you play Asheron's Call?

    Final Fantasy XI?

    No, goodness.

    The ideal difficulty for my taste were EQ2 (post year one), WOW or LOTRO, and all three were great successes so I can't be too far off what the majority wants. Everything else is niche hardcore.

    Guildwars?

    It sold 4 million accounts, which is far more than EQ2 and LOTRO.

  • TibernicusTibernicus Member Posts: 433
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Enerzeal

    Eli, did you play Everquest? 

    Did you play Asheron's Call?

    Final Fantasy XI?

    No, goodness.

    The ideal difficulty for my taste were EQ2 (post year one), WOW or LOTRO, and all three were great successes so I can't be too far off what the majority wants. Everything else is niche hardcore.

    EQ2 and LotRO weren't really that successful.... And all three of those games were so easy it was hard to give a shit about anything in them.

    But sure if GW2 wants to go after the casual audience in WoW, making the game boring sure is the way to do it.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by ForumPvP

    What happened to WoW,dumbed down to the bottom,this post doesnt make any sense.

    Edit:Even so called hardcore game DF is getting dumbed down.

    what dumb down? Play hard mode raid .. that is hard.

  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
    Originally posted by Loke666
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

    I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

    Grrrr

    Actually computer games are getting easier and easier all the time. It is not 16 year old players that want a higher difficulty, it old players from the C-64 and Amiga era.

    And we haer you complain as well. And guess what, the games are still getting easier. GW1 however was an exception since it usually were pretty challenging.

    If you want easy there are plenty of games for you including TOR, Rift and Wow.To me GW2s difficulty is good, it is challenging so I actually cant sleep while I do a simple skill rotation. I am willing to bet that you can do it too with a little tutoring from someone, join a guild and learn how to play.

    You know the thing that really irks me is: in other MMos, if a quest or place was too hard for whatever reason, you levelled and came back later to stomp them into the ground and feel the glee of revenge. Here, you can't. It downlevels you. I really come to dislike that. The idea to have levelled my char into 80 and then being killed by some trash level 5 rats possibly is just embarrasing and uncool.

    It was one of the best things about MMOs that you could come back later and bring revenge on some low level pest which tortured you earlier. Heck, I often killed grey mobs in EQ2 just to feel better, thinking of the pain they had caused me!

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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Rayshe
    We dont want a more difficult game to prove our dick size, we want a more difficult game because its more fun. everything being easy and handed to you is boring, If there is no challange there is no point.

    Only 2% of the player base who can do it .. is not the right level of challenge.

    And also difficulty setting is good. Not every player wants to devote hours to practice raiding (and yes, that is hard mode raiding back in WOTLK, wipe, wipe and wipe to learn the strategies).

     

  • stringboistringboi Member UncommonPosts: 394
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Loke666
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

    I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

    Grrrr

    Actually computer games are getting easier and easier all the time. It is not 16 year old players that want a higher difficulty, it old players from the C-64 and Amiga era.

    And we haer you complain as well. And guess what, the games are still getting easier. GW1 however was an exception since it usually were pretty challenging.

    If you want easy there are plenty of games for you including TOR, Rift and Wow.To me GW2s difficulty is good, it is challenging so I actually cant sleep while I do a simple skill rotation. I am willing to bet that you can do it too with a little tutoring from someone, join a guild and learn how to play.

    You know the thing that really irks me is: in other MMos, if a quest or place was too hard for whatever reason, you levelled and came back later to stomp them into the ground and feel the glee of revenge. Here, you can't. It downlevels you. I really come to dislike that. The idea to have levelled my char into 80 and then being killed by some trash level 5 rats possibly is just embarrasing and uncool.

    It seems like maybe you just dont like the challenge the game is offering. 

    The game sort of reminds me of how real life would be....you go up to someone else rushing in, your not going to win every time....get to know who and what your fighting and things become a bit easier.  Just like in real life....if you go back to that person (visiting a lower level area for instance) after honing your skills (leveling up) a year later....things may be easier but if you just wave your arms around (mash buttons) your not likely to win.  You still need to know and use what you've learned along the way to win.  Simple as that!

  • QuicklyScottQuicklyScott Member Posts: 433
    My 49 year old father, who has servere learning difficulties, who also has the reactions of a half deaf 80 year old, seems to be enjoying himself and isn't complaining about the difficulty....  The game really can't be that hard...

    image

  • TardcoreTardcore Member Posts: 2,325
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

    I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

    Grrrr

    Hearing this actually heartens me that maybe, just maybe, game developers are trending towards NOT catering to the "Training Wheels" gaming crowd that in my opinion have almost single handedly ruined the kind of gaming I enjoy. The same crowd of entitlement seeking locusts that have helped turn the film industry into a mindless sequel/prequil/reboot regurgitation factory, and the music industry into nothing but emo ego wanking and pink cotton candy pap.

    If GW2 has actually managed to make a game that makes some of the gaming crowd who are unwilling to adapt cry, then I say more power to them. (Though personally after watching my mates play I'm not seeing that, as it just looks to be a clusterfuck zerging mess to me.)

    "Rule 1 : You can only get smarter by playing a smarter opponent."

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  • itgrowlsitgrowls Member Posts: 2,951
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by Loke666
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

    I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

    Grrrr

    Actually computer games are getting easier and easier all the time. It is not 16 year old players that want a higher difficulty, it old players from the C-64 and Amiga era.

    And we haer you complain as well. And guess what, the games are still getting easier. GW1 however was an exception since it usually were pretty challenging.

    If you want easy there are plenty of games for you including TOR, Rift and Wow.To me GW2s difficulty is good, it is challenging so I actually cant sleep while I do a simple skill rotation. I am willing to bet that you can do it too with a little tutoring from someone, join a guild and learn how to play.

    You know the thing that really irks me is: in other MMos, if a quest or place was too hard for whatever reason, you levelled and came back later to stomp them into the ground and feel the glee of revenge. Here, you can't. It downlevels you. I really come to dislike that. The idea to have levelled my char into 80 and then being killed by some trash level 5 rats possibly is just embarrasing and uncool.

    It was one of the best things about MMOs that you could come back later and bring revenge on some low level pest which tortured you earlier. Heck, I often killed grey mobs in EQ2 just to feel better, thinking of the pain they had caused me!

    I like it because i don't want to instantly own everything and without that downgrading i wouldn't be able to help friends. The higher level toons have a few more abilities and more powerful attacks in their disposal. I saw a thief the other day running around at high speeds killing level 8 in two shots because he had more abilities and slightly better gear. Notably he was using three signets that seem to work in tandem to give him a boost to speed, and power causing him to blast through the human area. Also, other starter zones seem to be easier then others. I'd suggest going through the other areas. Yodas and the pod people seem to be the easiest.

  • tank017tank017 Member Posts: 2,192
    You actually think GW2 is hard?.....maybe the problem isn't the games, maybe its you.
  • DibdabsDibdabs Member RarePosts: 3,239
    Originally posted by Enerzeal

    Eli, did you play Everquest? 

    Did you play Asheron's Call?

    Final Fantasy XI?

    Nekkid corpse runs in Nektulos Forest, no ingame maps and XP loss for each death... that was the last time I felt heart-pounding excitement in a game.  Ditto for a sense of real achievement, clawing my way up through the levels.  Every other game, bar Eve, is a faceroll-fest, so if GW2 has made a game that takes some effort, good luck to them.

  • XthosXthos Member UncommonPosts: 2,740

    I am SICK and TIRED of the exact opposite.....Leveling is too fast, game mechanics are too shallow...

     

    If anything, TSW is probably a little too easy, but advancing/'leveling' is too fast. 

     

    Want to be the hero?  How can you be a hero when what you fight is like a bowling over babies.  Run in, spin move...spin move...spin move...spin move...12 dead mobs!  I am the man!   Rift, I had a cleric that everything was macroed on 2 buttons, for different situations....only had to use one though...I could pull as many mobs as I could get and spam 1.11.1.1.1.1.1.1..1.1.1.1.1.1.....It is maybe cool and fun for a second, but boring hits pretty quick.

     

    I don't see devs listening to anyone but the easy crowd for the most part....Games are designed for people with ADD, and 10 minutes to play.

     

  • JedicowboyJedicowboy Member UncommonPosts: 140
    Originally posted by Loke666
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

    I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

    Grrrr

    Actually computer games are getting easier and easier all the time. It is not 16 year old players that want a higher difficulty, it old players from the C-64 and Amiga era.

    And we haer you complain as well. And guess what, the games are still getting easier. GW1 however was an exception since it usually were pretty challenging.

    If you want easy there are plenty of games for you including TOR, Rift and Wow.To me GW2s difficulty is good, it is challenging so I actually cant sleep while I do a simple skill rotation. I am willing to bet that you can do it too with a little tutoring from someone, join a guild and learn how to play.

    i agree with Loke66, to me i have no problem with the difficulty and i welcome the challenge also, plus if i wanted the game to be easier i would play tor, rift or even  wow (hits my head on wall).  But  Elikal quick question, not to be a smartass or anything  just looking at your avatar, is it vulcan if so i thought vulcans are suppose to not have emotions????  JK just had to throw that in because your avatar looks like a vulcan :)

  • fenistilfenistil Member Posts: 3,005

    GW2 open world content is TOO EASY + it was nerfed heavily compared to BWE1.

     

    Besides - screw you - mmorpg's have been going easy-mode for way too long + they STILL are.

    Way too easy still - in open world. Instances in some games are very ok difficulty wise.

     

    Besides - easy games feel like chore not challanging ones. No idea where you took it from.

  • VyethVyeth Member UncommonPosts: 1,461

    I'd have to agree with a bit of what was said..

    But I will also say this:

    When I first started playing MMO's back in 99 with everquest, I did not care for nor did I simply play for the difficulty.. For me it was all about immersion and for being the first virtual world I ever explored the game offered much of it.

    To this day I tend to want to play mmo's for the sense of adventure, the fulfillment of building a character, and sometimes the lore of it all..

    Difficulty is one of those things that can mean different things. Some fighting game pro's will tell you that a game isn't difficult unless it has combos and multiple button press move lists.. Fans of Dota will tell you that a game isn't difficult unless you have to deny, harass and feed carry kills.. Fans of Vindictus and TERA will tell you that a game isn't difficult unless you are allowed to roll dodge and aim your attacks manually..

    There is no medium in the broad world of MMO's on how to make the "right" difficulty for the masses.

    I can also see how this has mutated over the years as the actually genre has basically dissipated and instead comes in various flavors of other genres (instead of having just an MMO genre you have MMOFPS , which one could say belongs in the FPS genre category, or MMORTS, which could belong in the RTS category etc.). This change, while neither good or bad, has shifted the core idea of the "world,customization and lore" into "accesibility, difficulty, and content"..

    I have to note though, that people who claim to want this and that in the land of MMO's cannot always be taken seriously because we have seen all types of MMO's fail due to lack of support, yet the one that everyone claims to be "tired" of is the ONLY one that is still making money as a sub game..

    Wizardry Online is coming out soon and it is slated to have a perma death feature, which should make it a pretty decent pick for those who want challenge..

  • maplestonemaplestone Member UncommonPosts: 3,099
    edit: *deleted since the post it referenced appears to have been removed*
  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Member RarePosts: 3,319
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by WhiteLantern

    /eye on you image

    I've noticed that at some point I seem to have gotten your goat.

    LOL!

    /attaboy

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

  • RednecksithRednecksith Member Posts: 1,238

    If I want challenge, I'll go play Dark Souls or roll a hardcore character in D2 / D3 / Torchlight. Not saying the game should be faceroll-easy mind you, but I definitely understand where Elikal is coming from.

    My engineer (17) isn't having any serious problems yet, but I have had a few of what I consider to be 'cheap' deaths due to either mob density / respawn / aggro range, or simply getting two-shotted by something I didn't see.

    I do think characters should be a bit more robust, as pretty much every non heavy armor wearing class I've tried seems to be made of wet tissue paper. Furthermore, endurance / stamina / whateveritscalledIcantremember should probably recharge more quickly. Not greatly so, maybe just reduce recharge time by a second or two. If you can't dodge, you're screwed.

    Oh, and those #@!(ing veteran mobs need to quit resetting all the )!%^ing time. In a game where kiting = life, having them reset when they get a fairly modest distance from their spawn point while being actively engaged in combat is just stupid.

    Oh, and )*&@ getting stuck in overflow all the time. That is all.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 44,059
    Originally posted by WhiteLantern
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by WhiteLantern

    /eye on you image

    I've noticed that at some point I seem to have gotten your goat.

    LOL!

    /attaboy

    Too many hoofed animals in these forums anyways!  image

    Actually, I can relate to what Elikal is saying, I played TERA and TSW, and while I did manage to adapt, it was quite a challenge for a person of my advance age.  image

    One thing holding me back from GW2 is the descriptions I've seen about it's combat, I can understand how folks raised on consoles would be eager to embrace it, but I fled to the PC based gaming world and MMORPG's a while ago because, well basically, they were more my speed.

    Yeah, hate on me and call me a loser, can't help being what I am, and for what I like.

    But hey, not every game is for everyone, so I'm steering clear for now, but one day I'm likely to give it a go.

    Meanwhile, there's still EVE fortunately, and more to my liking.

     

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  • roo67roo67 Member Posts: 402
    Always liked the idea of easy mode and advanced difficulty servers . Playing WoW at the moment and every time I return its less challenging than the time before . What amazes me is many WoW players seem to think other mmos are noob games when they are playing what is now the easiest mmo I've ever experianced . PVP is still fun shame theres none to speak of in the world anymore and its confined to bgs and arenas .
  • LatronusLatronus Member Posts: 692
    Originally posted by Elikal
    Originally posted by ForumPvP

    What happened to WoW,dumbed down to the bottom,this post doesnt make any sense.

     

    Dumbed down is good. Dumbed down is GREAT, because it makes me feel the HERO and not the useless twat I am for free in RL 24/7 already thank you very much.

    So, what you are basically saying is that you don't want to WORK for anything. You just want things to be given to you.  If you really want to feel like a HERO then keep trying until you actually accomplish something through good ol hard work combined with a lot of trial and error.  When you finally beat that hard mob you WILL have an overwhelming sense of accomplishment.  Just because you got a trophey for showing up for little league doesn't mean you deserve it.. Try earning it for once.

    image
  • JTJT Member Posts: 401
    Originally posted by Elikal

    Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

    I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

    Grrrr

    You can't be serious?  They don't make difficult mmo's any longer.  The devs have been catering to the "i want a game my 1 year can play" group for years.  I have one arm, blind in one eye and these are still easy to me.

  • GardavsshadeGardavsshade Member UncommonPosts: 907

    " I am SICK and TIRED of the "more difficult" crowd "

     

    I am sick and tired of the "make it more easy, it's only a game" crowd.

    It's NOT a game. It's a MMO. There IS a difference.

    Don't like that fact? Go play a another genre of games. Stop trying to get MMOs changed into a game you would like.

    ...

    There, now we're even.

  • David_LopanDavid_Lopan Member UncommonPosts: 813
    Originally posted by Mephster
    There is always pacman and asteroids available to play.

      Those games are harder then any mmo out to date. At least pacman

  • blognorgblognorg Member UncommonPosts: 643
    I agree. I think they should have the epic weapons available in the gem shop, too. I'm not saying that they should only be there, but at least it would allow those who don't have a lot of time on their hands, or if the dungeons are too hard, to get them. Or they should do what WoW did and have those items that scale with your level. They give exp bonuses, and they they're better than pretty much anything you can get at your level. They should have something like that in the gem store too. I hate having to grind just to get a decent weapon.
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