Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
And, all these statements can be applied to WoW and Rift and EQ2 and so on. MEANING, GW2 is no different.. when they claimed it was. Which I'm fine with BTW. I didn't expect it to be without it anyway.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
ANet have also stated that they are planning to add more with a similar kind of mechanic.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people. Maybe they'd just prefer it if they could start the highest difficulty straight away.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people.
well if your goal in the game is to run that dungeon then you earn the gear to progress while doing it. but you can do the dungeon without the gear and all previous content. you can see everything it the game without the gear.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
ANet have also stated that they are planning to add more with a similar kind of mechanic.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people. Maybe they'd just prefer it if they could start the highest difficulty straight away.
the people that it bothers seem to want everything handed to them. like the people asking for max stat gear on the gw2 forums. the ascendant gar does not block off any game content. if it doesnt bother you than why argue it?
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people.
well if your goal in the game is to run that dungeon then you earn the gear to progress while doing it. but you can do the dungeon without the gear and all previous content. you can see everything it the game without the gear.
and if someone wants to do it in hard mode straight away? They can't. That freedom has been taken away from them That's what people are complaining about. To some people, doing it on the hardest difficulty is the most fun and there is a barrier to get through to experience that..
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
ANet have also stated that they are planning to add more with a similar kind of mechanic.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people. Maybe they'd just prefer it if they could start the highest difficulty straight away.
the people that it bothers seem to want everything handed to them. like the people asking for max stat gear on the gw2 forums. the ascendant gar does not block off any game content. if it doesnt bother you than why argue it?
it doesn't bother me, no. But I can understand why it bothers others.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
Is "You don't need max stat gear to play/enjoy the game." a valid counter to people suggesting GW2 has introduced gear grind through the Ascended tier of gear?
Yes a treadmill has been added because people enjoy it, although some people who see the treadmill for what it is do not HAVE to grind it to experience the 9 fractals. That is the biggest difference between GW2 Treadmill and the standard MMO treadmill scheme.
Its just a FREE addition to fulfill other preferences of gameplay...some of my friends love the progession of treadmills, I do not. GW2 offers it now which pleases them, and it doesnt bother me since I can still do the 9 fractals without any hinderance.
I still dont see how "You don't need max stat gear to play/enjoy the game." is not a valid argument, although what people enjoy about the game and how they play is wildly different...but as a baseline you do not need the new gear to experience (play) the new content to completion...now if you enjoy it is a different story.
Need for what? Arguably you dont need exotic gear either, however RPGs is all about progression so if you dont have skills progression and no gear progression then what kind of progression do you have? And dont tell me how to play your character better, you have that kind of progression in any game, even angry bird.
Originally posted by xpiher I voted no because agony will be used as a gating mechanic, similar to T gear in WoW.
QFT. Mandatory for PvE and WvW. Yeah sure in WvW you're going to encounter a variety of opponents of varying levels and numbers but if you're 80 you're going to want full ascended otherwise your gimping yourself. I only don't include sPvP cuz said gear will be available for free there due to it's implementation.
Agony, as A.Net said is just in this area. So it may be a one off so people don't farm them so much. As was stated, very similar to Spectral Agony from the Mursaat in GW1: Prophecies. The infusion in GW1 was only good those areas with the Mursaat.
Agony as a stat reduction isn't the problem, the problem is the added stats. Please stay on subject.
The way that this gear is NOT like the Mursaat is that it has significantly higher states then the Exotic and they did this on purpose. They wanted to attract specifically the crowd that stays with a game only long enough to get their gear until they are off to do some other dungeon only grind game.
Stats were added to this gear when you add all the stats together they are significantly better in stats then the exotic gear. When you add this to any game people are going to go and get it because they need the higher stats to be better.
When Anet started they said they would not have multiple tier end game armor.
When they started they said they would not force people to play in a single play style only.
When they started they said they would not make it nearly impossible to progress.
They just broke all three of those promises.
The problem is the game was not built for higher tier armor as evident by the lack of people in Orr the lack of people in any other dungeons BUT the Fractals dungeon thus making all open world content, all other dungeons, and crafting obsolete and useless in a single patch.
Sure the difference will be more noticeable (significantly like on WoW you mean, because that's just not true) when all the ascended gear will be release, but we are far from there. They will also make ascended gear more accessible over time.
What you call broking promises is what I call please your players.
Just because they added 1 SINGLE TIER doesn't mean they will add more.
No one is forcing you to play a single play style if you don't want to, the patch didn't change that whatsoever.
The progress isn't nearly impossible, sure it's kinda grindy atm but I'm pretty sure it won't stay that way.
So no they didn't broke those three promises whatsoever.
Also saying that they make the open world, dungeons and crafting obsolote and useless in a single patch is completely nonsense. Sure at some point it may be that way, but in an MMO where most people want some type of progression, you don't have much choices, if you don't give something to the payers to strive for, they will just call the content useless and won't play it whatsoever and players will QQ about the useless content instead of the QQ there is now. I don't have any ascended gear, didn't play any dungeons, didn't max my crafting and I'm still having the same fun I had since the release. That doesn't stop me from doing 99% of content and be able to stay competitive in WvW.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
Is "You don't need max stat gear to play/enjoy the game." a valid counter to people suggesting GW2 has introduced gear grind through the Ascended tier of gear?
Depends on a person and what they are after.
If you say, do you need the gear to do 99% of the game? The answer is no.
If you say, do you need the gear to do 1% of the game? The answer is yes.
If you say, do I have to grind gear to cover 100% of the game? The answer is yes
So there is a gear grind. Might only be for 1% of the game, but it's there.
Doing the dungeon on the highest difficulty is a part of the game you know.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
Is "You don't need max stat gear to play/enjoy the game." a valid counter to people suggesting GW2 has introduced gear grind through the Ascended tier of gear?
Depends on a person and what they are after.
If you say, do you need the gear to do 99% of the game? The answer is no.
If you say, do you need the gear to go 1% of the game? The answer is yes.
If you say, do I have to grind gear to cover 100% of the game? The answer is yes
So there is a gear grind. Might only be for 1% of the game, but it's there.
Doing the dungeon on the highest difficulty is a part of the game you know.
IMHO, if you need a certain type of gear to be able to do 1% of the game, it is not a gear grind at all. Gear grind imply that you ALWAYS need to grind to be able to stay competitive in either PvE or PvP. And that's just not the case with GW2 atm.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
Is "You don't need max stat gear to play/enjoy the game." a valid counter to people suggesting GW2 has introduced gear grind through the Ascended tier of gear?
Depends on a person and what they are after.
If you say, do you need the gear to do 99% of the game? The answer is no.
If you say, do you need the gear to go 1% of the game? The answer is yes.
If you say, do I have to grind gear to cover 100% of the game? The answer is yes
So there is a gear grind. Might only be for 1% of the game, but it's there.
Doing the dungeon on the highest difficulty is a part of the game you know.
IMHO, if you need a certain type of gear to be able to do 1% of the game, it is not a gear grind at all. Gear grind imply that you ALWAYS need to grind to be able to stay competitive in either PvE or PvP. And that's just not the case with GW2 atm.
I completely agree, but others don't.
So, yeh, it is a valid arguement.. maybe I shouldn't have stated it wasn't in that first post... but I guess it depends on the individual and what their goals are in the game.
But that's enough from me, I'll let those that are bothered about the addition defend their opinions themselves.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
I voted yes because exotics are all that is needed to enjoy all lvl 80 content save maybe for higher level fractal runs which is really made for the hardcore players anyway :P.
Are some people going to repeat a dungeon to get the new gear for the benefits it gives?
Yes, they are.. even if they don't have to some people are going to do it.
So, some people will be on gear treadmill?
Yes.
So, a gear treadmill has been introduced to the game?
Yes
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people.
well if your goal in the game is to run that dungeon then you earn the gear to progress while doing it. but you can do the dungeon without the gear and all previous content. you can see everything it the game without the gear.
Thats the way the current game is set up. Too bad ANET said they are going to expand on that concept. If the gear isn't required for future content updates that they'll be using to expand on that, then its not progression. So its safe to assume that, the next content patch will add content that will require you to have, at the very least, ascended to compelte the first tier.
Do you need to even acess the better items in the game or as long as you can do 99% of the game it is fine if the gear required to do the other 1% is sold only in the cash shop?
I mean it is only 1%.
You can still have fun.
Especially because you can buy gems with in game money too.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It IS a valid arguement, because there isn't really any non-FotM content that you need Exotic gear for, let alone Ascended Gear. Infusions and Agony Mitigation are a seperate arguement. I appreciate the design of Fractals of the Mist and the difficulty mechanic and I understand the role that Infusions/Agony mitigation play in the design, but I do hate that this introduces not only a soft form of content gating, but the difficulty system does indeed split the community and introduces grouping "snobbery" that Arenanet said they wanted to completely avoid.
The splitting of the community is the only issue I have with Fractals of the Mist. The role that Ascended Gear/Infusions/Agony resistance play in FotM really shouldn't be an issue for people who frequently play FotM, as aquisition of these stats/items should just naturally occur as part of the progression. However, if it turns out that players become gated to a particular difficulty threshold for an extended period of time while waiting on the RNG gods to bless them with the required gear to push the difficulty level higher, that could be an issue. I'd hate to see regular FotM groups forced to wait on those who have been screwed by RNG and have fallen behind the rest of the group on the needed gear acquisition.
Comments
little bit one sided of an argument wouldn't you say.
How about;
Will some people not repeat the dungeon content to get the gear? Yes
So are some people still not on a gear treadmill? Yes
So are some people complaining about something insignificant? Yes
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
No, I was proving a gear treadmill has been introduced in the game. It has, and that's a fact.
What you've put is also true, also a fact. But the gear treadmill is still present and that is what people are complaining about or asking about.
And, all these statements can be applied to WoW and Rift and EQ2 and so on. MEANING, GW2 is no different.. when they claimed it was. Which I'm fine with BTW. I didn't expect it to be without it anyway.
it's not a 'gear treadmill' because it doesnt prevent you from doing anything.
I'm not trying to argue your point, just the fact that it's one sided and creates bias.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
It prevents you from running that dungeon on a higher difficulty.
ANet have also stated that they are planning to add more with a similar kind of mechanic.
Whether or not that matters to you is your own preference. Doesn't bother me tbh.. but it obviously bothers some people. Maybe they'd just prefer it if they could start the highest difficulty straight away.
well if your goal in the game is to run that dungeon then you earn the gear to progress while doing it. but you can do the dungeon without the gear and all previous content. you can see everything it the game without the gear.
the people that it bothers seem to want everything handed to them. like the people asking for max stat gear on the gw2 forums. the ascendant gar does not block off any game content. if it doesnt bother you than why argue it?
and if someone wants to do it in hard mode straight away? They can't. That freedom has been taken away from them That's what people are complaining about. To some people, doing it on the hardest difficulty is the most fun and there is a barrier to get through to experience that..
it doesn't bother me, no. But I can understand why it bothers others.
Is "You don't need max stat gear to play/enjoy the game." a valid counter to people suggesting GW2 has introduced gear grind through the Ascended tier of gear?
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QFT. Mandatory for PvE and WvW. Yeah sure in WvW you're going to encounter a variety of opponents of varying levels and numbers but if you're 80 you're going to want full ascended otherwise your gimping yourself. I only don't include sPvP cuz said gear will be available for free there due to it's implementation.
Steam: Neph
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Sure the difference will be more noticeable (significantly like on WoW you mean, because that's just not true) when all the ascended gear will be release, but we are far from there. They will also make ascended gear more accessible over time.
What you call broking promises is what I call please your players.
Just because they added 1 SINGLE TIER doesn't mean they will add more.
No one is forcing you to play a single play style if you don't want to, the patch didn't change that whatsoever.
The progress isn't nearly impossible, sure it's kinda grindy atm but I'm pretty sure it won't stay that way.
So no they didn't broke those three promises whatsoever.
Also saying that they make the open world, dungeons and crafting obsolote and useless in a single patch is completely nonsense. Sure at some point it may be that way, but in an MMO where most people want some type of progression, you don't have much choices, if you don't give something to the payers to strive for, they will just call the content useless and won't play it whatsoever and players will QQ about the useless content instead of the QQ there is now. I don't have any ascended gear, didn't play any dungeons, didn't max my crafting and I'm still having the same fun I had since the release. That doesn't stop me from doing 99% of content and be able to stay competitive in WvW.
Depends on a person and what they are after.
If you say, do you need the gear to do 99% of the game? The answer is no.
If you say, do you need the gear to do 1% of the game? The answer is yes.
If you say, do I have to grind gear to cover 100% of the game? The answer is yes
So there is a gear grind. Might only be for 1% of the game, but it's there.
Doing the dungeon on the highest difficulty is a part of the game you know.
IMHO, if you need a certain type of gear to be able to do 1% of the game, it is not a gear grind at all. Gear grind imply that you ALWAYS need to grind to be able to stay competitive in either PvE or PvP. And that's just not the case with GW2 atm.
I completely agree, but others don't.
So, yeh, it is a valid arguement.. maybe I shouldn't have stated it wasn't in that first post... but I guess it depends on the individual and what their goals are in the game.
But that's enough from me, I'll let those that are bothered about the addition defend their opinions themselves.
I voted yes because exotics are all that is needed to enjoy all lvl 80 content save maybe for higher level fractal runs which is really made for the hardcore players anyway :P.
Looking forward to EQL and EQN.
Thats the way the current game is set up. Too bad ANET said they are going to expand on that concept. If the gear isn't required for future content updates that they'll be using to expand on that, then its not progression. So its safe to assume that, the next content patch will add content that will require you to have, at the very least, ascended to compelte the first tier.
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Currently playing:Nothing
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GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
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AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Do you need anything in a game?
Do you need to even acess the better items in the game or as long as you can do 99% of the game it is fine if the gear required to do the other 1% is sold only in the cash shop?
I mean it is only 1%.
You can still have fun.
Especially because you can buy gems with in game money too.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It IS a valid arguement, because there isn't really any non-FotM content that you need Exotic gear for, let alone Ascended Gear. Infusions and Agony Mitigation are a seperate arguement. I appreciate the design of Fractals of the Mist and the difficulty mechanic and I understand the role that Infusions/Agony mitigation play in the design, but I do hate that this introduces not only a soft form of content gating, but the difficulty system does indeed split the community and introduces grouping "snobbery" that Arenanet said they wanted to completely avoid.
The splitting of the community is the only issue I have with Fractals of the Mist. The role that Ascended Gear/Infusions/Agony resistance play in FotM really shouldn't be an issue for people who frequently play FotM, as aquisition of these stats/items should just naturally occur as part of the progression. However, if it turns out that players become gated to a particular difficulty threshold for an extended period of time while waiting on the RNG gods to bless them with the required gear to push the difficulty level higher, that could be an issue. I'd hate to see regular FotM groups forced to wait on those who have been screwed by RNG and have fallen behind the rest of the group on the needed gear acquisition.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
