Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I find it laughable that they claim the "protection" of the "Open Beta" flag, yet are conducting business exactly the same way as if the game was launched.
Then why doesn't Cryptic / PWE officially launch the game? There's clearly a strategic purpose to maintaining the "Open Beta" status which does not benefit the players in any way.
If you continue to support mediocrity, why would game companies give you anything more?
Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I find it laughable that they claim the "protection" of the "Open Beta" flag, yet are conducting business exactly the same way as if the game was launched.
Then why doesn't Cryptic / PWE officially launch the game? There's clearly a strategic purpose to maintaining the "Open Beta" status which does not benefit the players in any way.
If you continue to support mediocrity, why would game companies give you anything more?
So what if everyone got some of their money and/or currency back because prices changed from the transition of Open to Launch. Would that still make them a shifty harmful company?
Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I disagree with companies charging money for products and services while hiding behind terms like "open beta" to minimize accountability.
Obviously, you don't seem to have a problem with this which is fine but I do think that players like yourself who choose to support this business model are doing more harm than good for the genre we all enjoy.
How is it harmful. I payed five dollars for two character slots in Neverwinter (which is way better than paying five bucks for one from the other places) and now I have four characters slots. I now supported a game I liked, how is it bad? You keep saying it's harmful and deceitful yet you haven't given me that reason on why it is? I had the same thoughts as you before and mine changed, I just want to know why you think they are so awful
It's called a "slippery slope" my friend and I prefer not to support this type of business model because I do not see a benefit for us (the players).
Open Betas are frequently used as a way to hype a game's launch nowadays, opening the doors in a way that feels exclusive. Often they do take money, because while hype is one goal, the beta typically is used to identify and solve key issues before launch -- and store functionality/scaling is one such issue. Starting to earn revenue is obviously a desired side-effect of such a soft launch.
Companies have to be careful about how they approach this though, as this practice has created an environment where unless you specifically market your beta as a beta, players are going to just treat it as a free game. Then they're going to criticize its faults to their friends based on that first glance, and potentially be a negative influence on your game.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I find it laughable that they claim the "protection" of the "Open Beta" flag, yet are conducting business exactly the same way as if the game was launched.
Then why doesn't Cryptic / PWE officially launch the game? There's clearly a strategic purpose to maintaining the "Open Beta" status which does not benefit the players in any way.
If you continue to support mediocrity, why would game companies give you anything more?
So what if everyone got some of their money and/or currency back because prices changed from the transition of Open to Launch. Would that still make them a shifty harmful company?
Do you REALLY believe that prices will be reduced "after the game launches" ?
And do you REALLY believe that PWE will refund players the difference between the old and the new (reduced) prices ?
PWE clearly don't give a hoot about their "reputation", so why would they give back money that they already banked ?
Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I find it laughable that they claim the "protection" of the "Open Beta" flag, yet are conducting business exactly the same way as if the game was launched.
Then why doesn't Cryptic / PWE officially launch the game? There's clearly a strategic purpose to maintaining the "Open Beta" status which does not benefit the players in any way.
If you continue to support mediocrity, why would game companies give you anything more?
So what if everyone got some of their money and/or currency back because prices changed from the transition of Open to Launch. Would that still make them a shifty harmful company?
Do you REALLY believe that prices will be reduced "after the game launches" ?
And do you REALLY believe that PWE will refund players the difference between the old and the new (reduced) prices ?
PWE clearly don't give a hoot about their "reputation", so why would they give back money that they already banked ?
I like to think on the positive side of things. If they do, that's awesome, if they don't oh well. I've seen it happen on Allods like i've posted on my OP. Their bags started at nearly 20 bucks (and at Open Beta) and then when it "launched" it was magically five
Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I disagree with companies charging money for products and services while hiding behind terms like "open beta" to minimize accountability.
Obviously, you don't seem to have a problem with this which is fine but I do think that players like yourself who choose to support this business model are doing more harm than good for the genre we all enjoy.
How is it harmful. I payed five dollars for two character slots in Neverwinter (which is way better than paying five bucks for one from the other places) and now I have four characters slots. I now supported a game I liked, how is it bad? You keep saying it's harmful and deceitful yet you haven't given me that reason on why it is? I had the same thoughts as you before and mine changed, I just want to know why you think they are so awful
It's called a "slippery slope" my friend and I prefer not to support this type of business model because I do not see a benefit for us (the players).
I find it is does benefit us (the players) If they receive the money for certain things in their shop, then others that are not being payed for will be lowered. The whole process it seems for Open Beta cash shops is to see if 1) The damn thing works and people aren't getting screwed over (then if they didn't fix that problem then it is very shady and harmful) and 2) how prices should be in the future. Now they have their bags at 10 bucks a piece, but I can still get free ones. I'm going to stick with those of course, but if they lower that bag price to five bucks here you go.
Now another way I see this beneficial is that if we are giving them money, they'll give me more content. They'll give me classes, new zones with new quests in them. New gear to look awesome in and hopefull, new Foundry stuff to play around in.
The problem that I do see is this. If we give all this money to them and in two years we don't see new anything, I would feel bad. You won't see a post about how they took my money mind you, but I will stew on it silently.
If you want to test your cash system in closed beta, you could award in game cash cards and players can spend those in the cash system. Later you can wipe without them having spent real money.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
This isn't a troll post, nor is it one to start a flame war. But I know this will generate both. Not to mention I'm trying to throw logic and reasoning in a forum that I try to stay away from since everyone just likes to go with a knee jerk reaction, but I'm staying the course on this!
Neverwinter is indeed in open beta/soft launch, but I don't have a gripe for it. I threw down five bucks for some character slots and thats about it, and I might throw down money in the future if classes that I want are hidden behind a pay wall, but that is neither here or there. What seems to be the problem lately is free games going into open with their cash shop open, and it seems some people forget that during closed it was not open. How I view all this, is that during open beta their cash shop needs to tested and tweaked. I saw the same thing in Allods Online as well, where their shop was open and by the time "launch" showed up, their market was different. Open beta lets the masses in, it's bigger than closed betas of course, so this would be a perfect time to test out their market place, and it seems when the actual launch shows up, maybe just maybe that 10 dollar back might be down to five.
Now I got done reading Bill Murphy's blog, and I respect the guy, but I think the blog post is just one big destructive criticism that we see in every MMO forum, and all it does is cater to more destructive talks. I think what would make a better blog is if Bill gave us an opinion on what to do with Free to Play games cash shop during their betas. It seems like he is stuck in 1999/early 2000s where every game needs an subscription and nothing more. He is not the only one, there is a vast majority of people that want a subscription based only game (P2P) and want nothing more. There is an ugly stigma with F2P that needs to be cleared. The games that are free now are not what they where ten years ago, they are not the korean grinders that make you buy XP pots just so you can get a level after one day (but that is how they like that for some reason). The stereotypical MMO gamer now is someone who wants instant gratification NOW, but doesn't know what he/she wants when they get it. I've seen it time and time again, like one post I read on here on what people would do to make their perfect game. What did they pick? WoW options that is freemium, yet most of these people before hate WoW "clones" that are freemium.
This is just an opinion of mine from observations. If people prefer to pay fifteen bucks a month, go for it, if you wish to play a free game thats awesome too. I myself like the Freemium/Free to play games because I'm a poor gamer. I don't have the money to throw down 14.99 a month for a game that I might just randomly stop playing because I'm bored of raiding or running dungeons over and over again. Sure some of the free games will make me do it at their endgame, but I have nothing to loose if I don't put all that money down and can just leave it to go back to another game that is free.
tl;dr: I'm just giving out my opinion is all and I'm tired of people just trying to see stuff ruined when we should work together to solve problems, or just let other people have their fun.
I would be more ok with calling it open beta if they would at launch, wipe everything like most (if not all) p2p games do. They don't do this so that they can charge earlier and have it mean something to the players, but it also means, to me, that you really aren't in beta anymore. This would mean that they do character wipes and simply refund the zen spent. I do think that they way they are allowing for trading zen for in game currency probably makes this prohibitively difficult. Also, they could do what the Marvel game was/is doing and just give a code for free points to test the system. This doesn't test the billing portion, but since Neverwinter is integrated with the main PWE webpage for zen purchases, they ought to already have payment all worked out.
Originally posted by waynejr2 If you want to test your cash system in closed beta, you could award in game cash cards and players can spend those in the cash system. Later you can wipe without them having spent real money.
This is something that I would like to see myself. Most companies like to hype out everything and hope that with enough of the hype people will start buying early. I don't mind it if it's in open beta, but I mind if it's in open and their shop just doesn't work but they keep pushing it (like if i bought something and don't get it for a week)
Considering that sub based games don't charge players for playing during "open beta", it seems like a game that's considered "free to play" would also be able to conduct an open beta without collecting money from players.
I don't play Neverwinter and don't plan to but I find the way that they are handling the game to be a definitive step in the wrong direction for the genre.
People who want to stick up for NW are certainly entitled to but please know that you are doing nothing to help improve the genre by continuing to support this type of shifty business model.
How is it shifty though. People are claiming that this is shifty but it's not. And I don't mean for just Neverwinter, but in general. You pay for a "product" (bag, mount, clothes) and you get it. How is that wrong?
I disagree with companies charging money for products and services while hiding behind terms like "open beta" to minimize accountability.
Obviously, you don't seem to have a problem with this which is fine but I do think that players like yourself who choose to support this business model are doing more harm than good for the genre we all enjoy.
How is it harmful. I payed five dollars for two character slots in Neverwinter (which is way better than paying five bucks for one from the other places) and now I have four characters slots. I now supported a game I liked, how is it bad? You keep saying it's harmful and deceitful yet you haven't given me that reason on why it is? I had the same thoughts as you before and mine changed, I just want to know why you think they are so awful
It's called a "slippery slope" my friend and I prefer not to support this type of business model because I do not see a benefit for us (the players).
I find it is does benefit us (the players) If they receive the money for certain things in their shop, then others that are not being payed for will be lowered. The whole process it seems for Open Beta cash shops is to see if 1) The damn thing works and people aren't getting screwed over (then if they didn't fix that problem then it is very shady and harmful) and 2) how prices should be in the future. Now they have their bags at 10 bucks a piece, but I can still get free ones. I'm going to stick with those of course, but if they lower that bag price to five bucks here you go.
Now another way I see this beneficial is that if we are giving them money, they'll give me more content. They'll give me classes, new zones with new quests in them. New gear to look awesome in and hopefull, new Foundry stuff to play around in.
The problem that I do see is this. If we give all this money to them and in two years we don't see new anything, I would feel bad. You won't see a post about how they took my money mind you, but I will stew on it silently.
We'll agree to disagree my friend. I do wish you the best and hope you enjoy your time in NW.
Open Betas are frequently used as a way to hype a game's launch nowadays, opening the doors in a way that feels exclusive. Often they do take money, because while hype is one goal, the beta typically is used to identify and solve key issues before launch -- and store functionality/scaling is one such issue. Starting to earn revenue is obviously a desired side-effect of such a soft launch.
Companies have to be careful about how they approach this though, as this practice has created an environment where unless you specifically market your beta as a beta, players are going to just treat it as a free game. Then they're going to criticize its faults to their friends based on that first glance, and potentially be a negative influence on your game.
F2P games don't have much to fear from player criticism during their so-called "open beta" phases. It's free to play, so hundreds of thousands of players will try it anyway, regardless of how bad the game's reputation is.
Selling "Founder's Packs" with "Guaranteed Early Access" to the Open Beta is the first move.
Announcing the start of Open Beta with great fanfare and promotions gets the first wave of potential Cash Shop customers in. Doesn't matter that the game is rough and servers are shaky, the Cash Shop works 100% !
All criticism can be deflected with "But it's only BETA !"
Then you announce warnings that the sale of "Founder's Packs" will soon be ending, so get your awesome deal NOW !
Then the "Official Launch" is timed for when the game is showing signs of losing the initial momentum, because the "launch" can be used to generate hype and game site reviews and all sorts of publicity.
Open Betas are frequently used as a way to hype a game's launch nowadays, opening the doors in a way that feels exclusive. Often they do take money, because while hype is one goal, the beta typically is used to identify and solve key issues before launch -- and store functionality/scaling is one such issue. Starting to earn revenue is obviously a desired side-effect of such a soft launch.
Companies have to be careful about how they approach this though, as this practice has created an environment where unless you specifically market your beta as a beta, players are going to just treat it as a free game. Then they're going to criticize its faults to their friends based on that first glance, and potentially be a negative influence on your game.
F2P games don't have much to fear from player criticism during their so-called "open beta" phases. It's free to play, so hundreds of thousands of players will try it anyway, regardless of how bad the game's reputation is.
Selling "Founder's Packs" with "Guaranteed Early Access" to the Open Beta is the first move.
Announcing the start of Open Beta with great fanfare and promotions gets the first wave of potential Cash Shop customers in. Doesn't matter that the game is rough and servers are shaky, the Cash Shop works 100% !
All criticism can be deflected with "But it's only BETA !"
Then you announce warnings that the sale of "Founder's Packs" will soon be ending, so get your awesome deal NOW !
Then the "Official Launch" is timed for when the game is showing signs of losing the initial momentum, because the "launch" can be used to generate hype and game site reviews and all sorts of publicity.
Official Launch is when drow and two classes come out, it's only BEETA!
all joking aside, I only do the "it's beta" moniker when it's closed. There have been a ton of tweaks since Neverwinter popped up in Open. (hell, Opening day you couldn't even play the damn game with how laggy it was) I honestly believe that they are testing out the cash shop in Neverwinter and that things may change. But again, I'm optimistic.
Originally posted by reploidx So no one answered the question. What are they supposed to do? How are they supposed to test their cash shop to make it work?
Yes your question WAS answered. It was answered in the first few posts.
Beta Testing Phase is for Beta Testing of a MMO to prepare it for Launch, at which time (launch) a MMO Publisher can start up the cash shop and use it to bring in revenue.
Beta Testing historically is NOT for opening the cash shop early to start making money while the MMO Publishers say they are "Beta Testing". Such is the way of Scammers.
open beta for f2p seems to have taken on the meaning of: We know there are bugs in our game but we want money now.
So they opened the cash shop, but if you complain about the bugs they can say "Hey this is just an open beta, the game has not launched yet". I do believe it is: Having your cake and eating it too.
Originally posted by reploidx So no one answered the question. What are they supposed to do? How are they supposed to test their cash shop to make it work?
Yes your question WAS answered. It was answered in the first few posts.
Beta Testing Phase is for Beta Testing of a MMO to prepare it for Launch, at which time (launch) a MMO Publisher can start up the cash shop and use it to bring in revenue.
Beta Testing historically is NOT for opening the cash shop early to start making money while the MMO Publishers say they are "Beta Testing". Such is the way of Scammers.
So since I bought something (character slots on Neverwinter) during Open beta, I got scammed? I do believe being scammed is giving them money and not receiving anything at all. I guess another question should be why are publishers/devs not a loud to use cash shops until the people decide they should?
Any "Open Beta" that is a F2P title should follow suite with what "Open Beta" actually means. A TEST of content that does not require anything to be charged for testing purposes.
Anytime you CHARGE money in a "Beta" it means you're not in a BETA, and have actually launched.
If people are willing to pay for it, why leave money on the table? And gamers, specifically, are definitely willing to pay for it. Google "buy beta access" or any similar search string and it's all games that comes up. Software developers didn't create the monetized beta. The gamers did.
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PWI has always used open beta as a soft launch for their games, as far as I know they've done it for all of their titles. If they're not going to wipe the servers before the official release build, then why would it matter if they open their store before then.
To the OP I quite agree that a markets system should be tested, however one can do that by issuing fictional currency during beta in conjunction with a character wipe at the conclusion of beta. Testing merely requires feedback on both the tool set involved with the market and the products offered.
Once you offer a product/service for real money it then becomes a commercial enterprise, it is no longer something under "testing" regardless of what one calls it.
Fun fact on a somewhat related note: Several nations are considering legislation in varying forms/wording regarding the valuation of digital properties, I would expect consumer advocacy groups/lobbies to be not too far behind. While not specifically targeted towards mmo's or games in general, once the nomenclature and precedent begin being set I foresee a sea change within the market. There is a reason one doesn't pay to QA test an I-phone.
To the OP I quite agree that a markets system should be tested, however one can do that by issuing fictional currency during beta in conjunction with a character wipe at the conclusion of beta. Testing merely requires feedback on both the tool set involved with the market and the products offered.
Once you offer a product/service for real money it then becomes a commercial enterprise, it is no longer something under "testing" regardless of what one calls it.
It seems the only Test that is being conducted so far (in my mind) is how the servers are handling and how much people are buying. I don't know PWI, I don't know how they do their work, but would it be impossible for them to lower prices if stuff isn't being bought?
Originally posted by reploidx So no one answered the question. What are they supposed to do? How are they supposed to test their cash shop to make it work?
with placeholder dollars.
I'm not trying to defend them and I have played NW without spending a dime, but...
The persistent characters with no wipe from "open beta" to "release" make these test transactions almost impossible to do unless they track what you used the Zen for and take that away from you at launch.
As someone else said, GW2 beta had test cash shop transactions but there was a wipe there before the real start.
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Comments
Then why doesn't Cryptic / PWE officially launch the game? There's clearly a strategic purpose to maintaining the "Open Beta" status which does not benefit the players in any way.
If you continue to support mediocrity, why would game companies give you anything more?
So what if everyone got some of their money and/or currency back because prices changed from the transition of Open to Launch. Would that still make them a shifty harmful company?
It's called a "slippery slope" my friend and I prefer not to support this type of business model because I do not see a benefit for us (the players).
Open Betas are frequently used as a way to hype a game's launch nowadays, opening the doors in a way that feels exclusive. Often they do take money, because while hype is one goal, the beta typically is used to identify and solve key issues before launch -- and store functionality/scaling is one such issue. Starting to earn revenue is obviously a desired side-effect of such a soft launch.
Companies have to be careful about how they approach this though, as this practice has created an environment where unless you specifically market your beta as a beta, players are going to just treat it as a free game. Then they're going to criticize its faults to their friends based on that first glance, and potentially be a negative influence on your game.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Do you REALLY believe that prices will be reduced "after the game launches" ?
And do you REALLY believe that PWE will refund players the difference between the old and the new (reduced) prices ?
PWE clearly don't give a hoot about their "reputation", so why would they give back money that they already banked ?
I like to think on the positive side of things. If they do, that's awesome, if they don't oh well. I've seen it happen on Allods like i've posted on my OP. Their bags started at nearly 20 bucks (and at Open Beta) and then when it "launched" it was magically five
I find it is does benefit us (the players) If they receive the money for certain things in their shop, then others that are not being payed for will be lowered. The whole process it seems for Open Beta cash shops is to see if 1) The damn thing works and people aren't getting screwed over (then if they didn't fix that problem then it is very shady and harmful) and 2) how prices should be in the future. Now they have their bags at 10 bucks a piece, but I can still get free ones. I'm going to stick with those of course, but if they lower that bag price to five bucks here you go.
Now another way I see this beneficial is that if we are giving them money, they'll give me more content. They'll give me classes, new zones with new quests in them. New gear to look awesome in and hopefull, new Foundry stuff to play around in.
The problem that I do see is this. If we give all this money to them and in two years we don't see new anything, I would feel bad. You won't see a post about how they took my money mind you, but I will stew on it silently.
I have opinions and what I believe to be solutions. They are available in my cash shop if the publisher would like to buy them.
do you accept pay pal?
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Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Are they available in 5 packs?
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I would be more ok with calling it open beta if they would at launch, wipe everything like most (if not all) p2p games do. They don't do this so that they can charge earlier and have it mean something to the players, but it also means, to me, that you really aren't in beta anymore. This would mean that they do character wipes and simply refund the zen spent. I do think that they way they are allowing for trading zen for in game currency probably makes this prohibitively difficult. Also, they could do what the Marvel game was/is doing and just give a code for free points to test the system. This doesn't test the billing portion, but since Neverwinter is integrated with the main PWE webpage for zen purchases, they ought to already have payment all worked out.
*double-take*
That ... that's not a response I was prepared for.
This is something that I would like to see myself. Most companies like to hype out everything and hope that with enough of the hype people will start buying early. I don't mind it if it's in open beta, but I mind if it's in open and their shop just doesn't work but they keep pushing it (like if i bought something and don't get it for a week)
We'll agree to disagree my friend. I do wish you the best and hope you enjoy your time in NW.
Thanks for the engaging debate.
F2P games don't have much to fear from player criticism during their so-called "open beta" phases. It's free to play, so hundreds of thousands of players will try it anyway, regardless of how bad the game's reputation is.
Selling "Founder's Packs" with "Guaranteed Early Access" to the Open Beta is the first move.
Announcing the start of Open Beta with great fanfare and promotions gets the first wave of potential Cash Shop customers in. Doesn't matter that the game is rough and servers are shaky, the Cash Shop works 100% !
All criticism can be deflected with "But it's only BETA !"
Then you announce warnings that the sale of "Founder's Packs" will soon be ending, so get your awesome deal NOW !
Then the "Official Launch" is timed for when the game is showing signs of losing the initial momentum, because the "launch" can be used to generate hype and game site reviews and all sorts of publicity.
Official Launch is when drow and two classes come out, it's only BEETA!
all joking aside, I only do the "it's beta" moniker when it's closed. There have been a ton of tweaks since Neverwinter popped up in Open. (hell, Opening day you couldn't even play the damn game with how laggy it was) I honestly believe that they are testing out the cash shop in Neverwinter and that things may change. But again, I'm optimistic.
Yes your question WAS answered. It was answered in the first few posts.
Beta Testing Phase is for Beta Testing of a MMO to prepare it for Launch, at which time (launch) a MMO Publisher can start up the cash shop and use it to bring in revenue.
Beta Testing historically is NOT for opening the cash shop early to start making money while the MMO Publishers say they are "Beta Testing". Such is the way of Scammers.
open beta for f2p seems to have taken on the meaning of: We know there are bugs in our game but we want money now.
So they opened the cash shop, but if you complain about the bugs they can say "Hey this is just an open beta, the game has not launched yet". I do believe it is: Having your cake and eating it too.
Currently bored with MMO's.
So since I bought something (character slots on Neverwinter) during Open beta, I got scammed? I do believe being scammed is giving them money and not receiving anything at all. I guess another question should be why are publishers/devs not a loud to use cash shops until the people decide they should?
If people are willing to pay for it, why leave money on the table? And gamers, specifically, are definitely willing to pay for it. Google "buy beta access" or any similar search string and it's all games that comes up. Software developers didn't create the monetized beta. The gamers did.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
To the OP I quite agree that a markets system should be tested, however one can do that by issuing fictional currency during beta in conjunction with a character wipe at the conclusion of beta. Testing merely requires feedback on both the tool set involved with the market and the products offered.
Once you offer a product/service for real money it then becomes a commercial enterprise, it is no longer something under "testing" regardless of what one calls it.
Fun fact on a somewhat related note: Several nations are considering legislation in varying forms/wording regarding the valuation of digital properties, I would expect consumer advocacy groups/lobbies to be not too far behind. While not specifically targeted towards mmo's or games in general, once the nomenclature and precedent begin being set I foresee a sea change within the market. There is a reason one doesn't pay to QA test an I-phone.
It seems the only Test that is being conducted so far (in my mind) is how the servers are handling and how much people are buying. I don't know PWI, I don't know how they do their work, but would it be impossible for them to lower prices if stuff isn't being bought?
I'm not trying to defend them and I have played NW without spending a dime, but...
The persistent characters with no wipe from "open beta" to "release" make these test transactions almost impossible to do unless they track what you used the Zen for and take that away from you at launch.
As someone else said, GW2 beta had test cash shop transactions but there was a wipe there before the real start.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED