I expect that "beta" should be for large scale testing for bugs, issues and testing of features.
I played WoW up until WotLK, played RoM for 2 years and now Rift. I am F2P player. I support games when I feel they deserve my money and I want the items enough. I don't troll, and I don't take kindly to trolls.
Originally posted by Rossboss I expect that "beta" should be for large scale testing for bugs, issues and testing of features.
But Neverwinter is doing this. There have been bugs in the games that have cause huge latency problems and has been fixed, not to mention it the game has been patched a ton since Open Beta for everyone.
Are they actually testing the cash shop? Or trying to make money?
If they are testing, then give the beta testers an amount of cash-shop currency, and let them buy whatever they want. This will test the cash-shop, and give the developer some ideas about what is popular. All of this should be wiped when the game actually releases, along with any characters that were created when TESTING the character creation tool and TESTING the game.
Or, if they are actually trying to make money, with real cash in the shop, and characters that don't get reset when the game is released, then they aren't testing at all, they have released the game. In this case, calling it "beta" appears to just be an excuse for releasing a game that isn't ready.
Originally posted by Leiloni They should not have the cash shop open until launch, period. Pay to play games don't charge you a dime until they are launched, why should a F2P game ask for any cash until it's officially launched? And no, they do not need the masses to "test out" their cash shop. Plenty of games have released cash shops without having the masses "test" it out. This soft launch open beta crap is shady business practices.
This of course is totally untrue and interesting that so many subscriber fans (which i am one) tend to overlook. Several Subscription based games have charged both a box price and a subscription to "Beta" their games. Most recently it was Aventurines Darkfall unholy wars, which charged a box cost as well as a monthly subscription to "beta test" their game for 5 months. While GW is not a subscription but a B2P game it always forced most people to pre-buy the game if they wanted to beta test the game.
This not a really new trend nore is a F2P only trend it extends to all MMO's these days.
This.Open Beta is for testing, including testing the cash shop. But if it is on the live server and isn't wiped, then it's a launch.
We have to remember that with Neverwinter, they are planning on making the three servers into one mega server. So technically what you are saying that are Beta testing the cash shop because these are not the live servers.
If these are not the live servers, then there must be a wipe coming. But they say there will not be a wipe. So that means it's a launch.
Originally posted by Rossboss I expect that "beta" should be for large scale testing for bugs, issues and testing of features.
But Neverwinter is doing this. There have been bugs in the games that have cause huge latency problems and has been fixed, not to mention it the game has been patched a ton since Open Beta for everyone.
The point is that it is a testing phase. It's not a final product, therefore, isn't worth the full price and shouldn't be charged as full price if at all.
Imagine you get into a game "beta test", they accept your money in exchange for items, and then they promptly decide they won't be doing a full release so that they can make massive mistakes and blame it on the "beta testing". This is honestly happening in many games that tag "Beta" onto their games. They are using it as an excuse for not properly testing their games so they don't have to do a comprehensive test.
It's being abused to the point where "beta" is synonymous with "never going to work properly". Most games that have "beta" phases don't properly collect data from the users unless the users want to display the data. Many people just exploit the "beta bugs" to make gains instead of reporting them to the devs.
I played WoW up until WotLK, played RoM for 2 years and now Rift. I am F2P player. I support games when I feel they deserve my money and I want the items enough. I don't troll, and I don't take kindly to trolls.
This.Open Beta is for testing, including testing the cash shop. But if it is on the live server and isn't wiped, then it's a launch.
We have to remember that with Neverwinter, they are planning on making the three servers into one mega server. So technically what you are saying that are Beta testing the cash shop because these are not the live servers.
I agree, if you pay money for a character that is not going to be wiped at release, then the game has actually released.
The term "beta" is cover for releasing a game before it is ready. The better term would be "pre-release" or "early access", meaning you get to play before most other people, and you get to keep what you have when it actually releases for the public. For that privilege, you might pay something.
If these are not the live servers, then there must be a wipe coming. But they say there will not be a wipe. So that means it's a launch.
This.Open Beta is for testing, including testing the cash shop. But if it is on the live server and isn't wiped, then it's a launch.
We have to remember that with Neverwinter, they are planning on making the three servers into one mega server. So technically what you are saying that are Beta testing the cash shop because these are not the live servers.
If these are not the live servers, then there must be a wipe coming. But they say there will not be a wipe. So that means it's a launch.
Why would they wipe characters from open to live? No game EVER has wiped characters from open to live. What I'm stating is that there will be a mega server, so it seems they are testing stuff out with these mini shards. Now if they wipe stuff we bought and refunded us the currency to do it again, then there will be your answer. There is no wipe of characters, but they didn't say anything about wiping other stuff.
Originally posted by Leiloni They should not have the cash shop open until launch, period. Pay to play games don't charge you a dime until they are launched, why should a F2P game ask for any cash until it's officially launched? And no, they do not need the masses to "test out" their cash shop. Plenty of games have released cash shops without having the masses "test" it out. This soft launch open beta crap is shady business practices.
This of course is totally untrue and interesting that so many subscriber fans (which i am one) tend to overlook. Several Subscription based games have charged both a box price and a subscription to "Beta" their games. Most recently it was Aventurines Darkfall unholy wars, which charged a box cost as well as a monthly subscription to "beta test" their game for 5 months. While GW is not a subscription but a B2P game it always forced most people to pre-buy the game if they wanted to beta test the game.
This not a really new trend nore is a F2P only trend it extends to all MMO's these days.
gaming in general actually:
Here pre-order this sight unseen uber super action packed story driven piece de resistance and receive a pink too-too with purchase TIME IS LIMITED. Based purely on a scripted CGI video demo and suckers jump on board every time.
? No game EVER has wiped characters from open to live.
Your joking right?
I guess I am. Since you seem to know games that have, what games had a total character wipe when they went from open beta to live status? All the MMOs I've beta tested have never done such a thing except for the closed betas.
? No game EVER has wiped characters from open to live.
Your joking right?
I guess I am. Since you seem to know games that have, what games had a total character wipe when they went from open beta to live status? All the MMOs I've beta tested have never done such a thing except for the closed betas.
UO
EQ
EQ2
DAOC
Jumpgate
WOW
EVE
WARHAMMER
LOTRO
AOC
Anarchy Online
STO
SWTOR
off the top of my head, you may be confusing early access/ pre- release / head start offers some titles offer during a 1 week to 1 month period between end of open beta and launch
? No game EVER has wiped characters from open to live.
Your joking right?
I guess I am. Since you seem to know games that have, what games had a total character wipe when they went from open beta to live status? All the MMOs I've beta tested have never done such a thing except for the closed betas.
UO
EQ
EQ2
DAOC
Jumpgate
WOW
EVE
WARHAMMER
LOTRO
AOC
Anarchy Online
STO
SWTOR
off the top of my head, you may be confusing early access/ pre- release / head start offers some titles offer during a 1 week to 1 month period between end of open beta and launch
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
? No game EVER has wiped characters from open to live.
Your joking right?
I guess I am. Since you seem to know games that have, what games had a total character wipe when they went from open beta to live status? All the MMOs I've beta tested have never done such a thing except for the closed betas.
UO
EQ
EQ2
DAOC
Jumpgate
WOW
EVE
WARHAMMER
LOTRO
AOC
Anarchy Online
STO
SWTOR
off the top of my head, you may be confusing early access/ pre- release / head start offers some titles offer during a 1 week to 1 month period between end of open beta and launch
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
Sorry those wiped at the close of of open beta you are confusing the pre-play offer
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
Actually Rift is one that I got accepted into closed and went straight into Beta, just like Lotro and Swtor. I played RIFT in closed to open and my character was wiped from the closed beta servers. I made a new character during Open Beta, and it was an honest Open Beta that you didn't have to buy the game for, and then it went live, my character was still there until I bought the game a week later (they had a grace period). Now a days they are doing the early access stuff, but the other games I played had Open Beta's that you could sign up and just play (same as DCUO that I closed and Open Beta tested for, and still had my open character available to me when it went live)
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies to find hardware breaking points. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
for most buying the box and beta testing usually qualifies you. it varies by provider some limit it to pre-orders, some to any beta tester, or a fee, or another such criteria
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
for most buying the box and beta testing usually qualifies you
again TOR and RIFT I didn't pay a dime on, nor Warhammer or EQ2. I was accepted into those tests since I signed up and when it came time to Open Beta test, I made a new character and it was kept when it went live.
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
for most buying the box and beta testing usually qualifies you
again TOR and RIFT I didn't pay a dime on, nor Warhammer or EQ2. I was accepted into those tests since I signed up and when it came time to Open Beta test, I made a new character and it was kept when it went live.
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
for most buying the box and beta testing usually qualifies you
again TOR and RIFT I didn't pay a dime on, nor Warhammer or EQ2. I was accepted into those tests since I signed up and when it came time to Open Beta test, I made a new character and it was kept when it went live.
you bought a box you tested the game
I bought the box after open beta with lots of spaaaaaaaaaaaaaces
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
for most buying the box and beta testing usually qualifies you
again TOR and RIFT I didn't pay a dime on, nor Warhammer or EQ2. I was accepted into those tests since I signed up and when it came time to Open Beta test, I made a new character and it was kept when it went live.
you bought a box you tested the game
I bought the box after open beta with lots of spaaaaaaaaaaaaaces
Comments
I played WoW up until WotLK, played RoM for 2 years and now Rift.
I am F2P player. I support games when I feel they deserve my money and I want the items enough.
I don't troll, and I don't take kindly to trolls.
But Neverwinter is doing this. There have been bugs in the games that have cause huge latency problems and has been fixed, not to mention it the game has been patched a ton since Open Beta for everyone.
Closed Beta is for testing game mechanics and content for bugs and issues and refinement.
Open Beta is for stress testing game systems and your network backbone.
Launch should be when the dev believes they have the game in a state where they can deliver a quality of experience that people will pay for.
By some people's definition of open beta every game in existence has in fact not launched.
Are they actually testing the cash shop? Or trying to make money?
If they are testing, then give the beta testers an amount of cash-shop currency, and let them buy whatever they want. This will test the cash-shop, and give the developer some ideas about what is popular. All of this should be wiped when the game actually releases, along with any characters that were created when TESTING the character creation tool and TESTING the game.
Or, if they are actually trying to make money, with real cash in the shop, and characters that don't get reset when the game is released, then they aren't testing at all, they have released the game. In this case, calling it "beta" appears to just be an excuse for releasing a game that isn't ready.
------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.
This of course is totally untrue and interesting that so many subscriber fans (which i am one) tend to overlook. Several Subscription based games have charged both a box price and a subscription to "Beta" their games. Most recently it was Aventurines Darkfall unholy wars, which charged a box cost as well as a monthly subscription to "beta test" their game for 5 months. While GW is not a subscription but a B2P game it always forced most people to pre-buy the game if they wanted to beta test the game.
This not a really new trend nore is a F2P only trend it extends to all MMO's these days.
If these are not the live servers, then there must be a wipe coming. But they say there will not be a wipe. So that means it's a launch.
The point is that it is a testing phase. It's not a final product, therefore, isn't worth the full price and shouldn't be charged as full price if at all.
Imagine you get into a game "beta test", they accept your money in exchange for items, and then they promptly decide they won't be doing a full release so that they can make massive mistakes and blame it on the "beta testing". This is honestly happening in many games that tag "Beta" onto their games. They are using it as an excuse for not properly testing their games so they don't have to do a comprehensive test.
It's being abused to the point where "beta" is synonymous with "never going to work properly". Most games that have "beta" phases don't properly collect data from the users unless the users want to display the data. Many people just exploit the "beta bugs" to make gains instead of reporting them to the devs.
I played WoW up until WotLK, played RoM for 2 years and now Rift.
I am F2P player. I support games when I feel they deserve my money and I want the items enough.
I don't troll, and I don't take kindly to trolls.
I agree, if you pay money for a character that is not going to be wiped at release, then the game has actually released.
The term "beta" is cover for releasing a game before it is ready. The better term would be "pre-release" or "early access", meaning you get to play before most other people, and you get to keep what you have when it actually releases for the public. For that privilege, you might pay something.
------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.
Why would they wipe characters from open to live? No game EVER has wiped characters from open to live. What I'm stating is that there will be a mega server, so it seems they are testing stuff out with these mini shards. Now if they wipe stuff we bought and refunded us the currency to do it again, then there will be your answer. There is no wipe of characters, but they didn't say anything about wiping other stuff.
gaming in general actually:
Here pre-order this sight unseen uber super action packed story driven piece de resistance and receive a pink too-too with purchase TIME IS LIMITED. Based purely on a scripted CGI video demo and suckers jump on board every time.
Your joking right?
I guess I am. Since you seem to know games that have, what games had a total character wipe when they went from open beta to live status? All the MMOs I've beta tested have never done such a thing except for the closed betas.
UO
EQ
EQ2
DAOC
Jumpgate
WOW
EVE
WARHAMMER
LOTRO
AOC
Anarchy Online
STO
SWTOR
off the top of my head, you may be confusing early access/ pre- release / head start offers some titles offer during a 1 week to 1 month period between end of open beta and launch
I played Lotro, Warhammer, SWTOR and EQ2 from closed to live. When Closed beta went into open, characters where wiped. When they went from an Open Beta to live launch status, I still had access to my characters.
Sorry those wiped at the close of of open beta you are confusing the pre-play offer
You're confusing early access with open beta. Open betas always wipe...up until this free to play soft launch thing. Early access for people who pre buy games don't have wipes. Many of the games you listed didn't have a real open beta, they had stress tests and mass key give aways. I don't think any of them had actual open ...as in anyone can join betas ( not sure about that though )
Actually Rift is one that I got accepted into closed and went straight into Beta, just like Lotro and Swtor. I played RIFT in closed to open and my character was wiped from the closed beta servers. I made a new character during Open Beta, and it was an honest Open Beta that you didn't have to buy the game for, and then it went live, my character was still there until I bought the game a week later (they had a grace period). Now a days they are doing the early access stuff, but the other games I played had Open Beta's that you could sign up and just play (same as DCUO that I closed and Open Beta tested for, and still had my open character available to me when it went live)
what he said there are usually several open beta phases often the last phase of open beta is a pure stress test and is usually refered to as a stress test not beta as systems testing is considered done. Where they just need huge amounts of bodies to find hardware breaking points. with pre-play offers you often keep chars from that phase depending on offer.
Well, I didn't pay a dime for any offer, so I don't know where you are coming from on pre-pay offers.
for most buying the box and beta testing usually qualifies you. it varies by provider some limit it to pre-orders, some to any beta tester, or a fee, or another such criteria
again TOR and RIFT I didn't pay a dime on, nor Warhammer or EQ2. I was accepted into those tests since I signed up and when it came time to Open Beta test, I made a new character and it was kept when it went live.
you bought a box you tested the game
I bought the box after open beta with lots of spaaaaaaaaaaaaaces
then you qualified for pre-play