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I wanted to vomit.
Mkilbride
Member UncommonPosts: 643
I read this post on another forum...and quite literally wanted to vomit.
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The Deal Breaker
This is a message mostly towards the devs, but also a statement for my fellow gamers. I've seen bits of Darkfall for quite a few years now. I originally lost interest during my highschool years when everything else in life bogged down on me. Seeing it on steam, I was excited and even pondering whether or not to purchase it like I always wanted to. Then I saw the business model...
That death sentence for any mmo in 2013; $15 a month. Can you even fathom how utterly dissapointed I was? I've seen gameplay videos of this game; they look interesting! Fun! Good! I really, REALLY wanted to play this game soooo badly. $40? Sure! I don't mind paying a good lump of cash for an mmo. Pay once to play forever mmos are by far my favorite; unfortunately that wasn't the case here.
I still considered buying the game for awhile, but eventually came to the conclusion that in doing so, I was making a statement not just to the devs of this game, but all devs for any mmo, that subscription fees are acceptable. They're not. Cash shops; expansion packs; things like that are more than welcomed. But blatant subscription fees are a thing of the past. An ugly archaic practice that can not compete with other business practices these days. Something I have to vote 'no' at with my wallet
It's the deal breaker for me, and I'm sorry to see it happen to what looked like a really good game. I hope those of you playing this game are enjoying it thoroughly for that extra $15 a month. As for the rest of you considering whether or not to purchase this game, take into consideration what paying may mean for the rest of the gaming community. What will those added votes, your payments, do to influence the industry later on? Are you alright with the return of the subscription era? Do you wan't to motivate developers and publishers to find compromise in better business models that don't tax players? Think long and hard about this before you hit that 'purchase' button.
Best of wishes.
That death sentence for any mmo in 2013; $15 a month. Can you even fathom how utterly dissapointed I was? I've seen gameplay videos of this game; they look interesting! Fun! Good! I really, REALLY wanted to play this game soooo badly. $40? Sure! I don't mind paying a good lump of cash for an mmo. Pay once to play forever mmos are by far my favorite; unfortunately that wasn't the case here.
I still considered buying the game for awhile, but eventually came to the conclusion that in doing so, I was making a statement not just to the devs of this game, but all devs for any mmo, that subscription fees are acceptable. They're not. Cash shops; expansion packs; things like that are more than welcomed. But blatant subscription fees are a thing of the past. An ugly archaic practice that can not compete with other business practices these days. Something I have to vote 'no' at with my wallet
It's the deal breaker for me, and I'm sorry to see it happen to what looked like a really good game. I hope those of you playing this game are enjoying it thoroughly for that extra $15 a month. As for the rest of you considering whether or not to purchase this game, take into consideration what paying may mean for the rest of the gaming community. What will those added votes, your payments, do to influence the industry later on? Are you alright with the return of the subscription era? Do you wan't to motivate developers and publishers to find compromise in better business models that don't tax players? Think long and hard about this before you hit that 'purchase' button.
Best of wishes.
__________________________________________________
Your thoughts?
Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained
Comments
I need more information as to what aspect made you want to vomit. Was it someone not wanting to pay a sub? Or was it that someone would be interested in Darkfall?
I was on the fence about it too. I never played the original but heard some great things and stories about it. Long story short, I got drunk one night and thought it would be a great idea to download Darkfall: UW. How wrong could my judgment be? I literally projectile vomit with such force that my monitor flew off my desk, went through the drywall and framing, killed my neighbours cat, and finally exploded a transformer just outside the house, leveling the block's hydro for the weekend.
Game sucks period. Nothing would change my opinion of it. Wasn't worth the initial $40, would no way in hell be worth an additional $15/mo.
I gave it a good shot. Had troubles getting it downloaded, had troubles installing it, had troubles getting past the tutorial without the game crashing. People in game are shitheads, controls suck, UI sucks, graphics make my eyes bleed, sounds are made by a 2 year old with a fisher price set.
I thought I had a leak from my ceiling, but it was actually my fucking monitor crying tears of agony pleading me to turn the shit off.
Originally posted by Arskaaa
"when players learned tacticks in dungeon/raids, its bread".
agree with Khorax poster... lots of noise on both sides.
there's good F2P, there's good P2P, there's good Sub2P.
BUT...
there is a lot more bad models than good.
and that's it. Of course it's a good source of endless debate...but I hardly see how a "payment model" could please everybody anyway.... Except a donation model ofc but we know this doesn't work in our actual world.
Old school french hardcore whiner. Online since T4C.
I was "Namless" and "Daroot" in AO (Rk2)
Been known as "Vindicar" (Aion (EU), SWTOR (EU), WoW (EU).
Recently Known as "Wundicar" and "Wundee" in Age of Wushu (US) and Wulin (EU)
Franky Rivera Reyes , From the Reyes Brotherhood (Star Citizen)
Not sure that it makes me want to puke too, but I do have to chuckle at all the Internet Business Gurus that seem to make up the MMO fanbase lately. F2P games are nice, don't get me wrong, but if it's not complaining about a monthly sub fee, these same people are likely to complain about "greedy developers nickel and diming you with micro transactions".
MMOs aren't like SP games, which are pretty much baked and final at release (aside from a patch here and there). They don't need constant updating, because they have a built-in endgame that results in the game being completed and likely uninstalled to make space for the next game. MMOs, on the other hand, have a team of developer employees that come in every day constantly doing work on the game. As well, there are servers that have to be constantly maintained, updated, upgraded, and otherwise attended to. Somebody has to pay for that.
So the two revenue models are either to charge a monthly subscription or to make a game that offers a basic experience for free with advanced or fluff items available on a point of sale basis. Yes, that includes games like GW1/2 and The Secret World. Some F2P or B2P provide a more complete game at the price point than others, but there's always going to be aspects of those games that can only be purchased to access. Or you can get a P2P game with a sub and access as much as you're willing to put the effort into. Me, I like games that offer both. You can start off using the F2P side of things as an extended trial, and if you like it enough, have a subscription plan available to get access to it all. Sorta like SOE's model
I think there's always going to be the Occupy MMOs contingent that feel that just because they can't afford it, MMO developers are greedy, evil bastards. Fortunately, they seem to just be a very loud minority.
"You'll never win an argument with an idiot because he is too stupid to recognize his own defeat." ~Anonymous
Dude don't eat food that makes you vomit, seriously. If it keeps happening visit a doctor.
And sub of 15$ a month for something as indie as that game is way out of line. I understand what greed is but I don't have to accept it. Wurm is as indie as that and its 5 a month.
No fate but what we make, so make me a ham sandwich please.
So paying for a product you want to use causes you to become physically sick ?
How did you manage to even type this melodramatic post ?
Is your keyboard vomit proof ?
.... someone had to pay for your computer, someone had to pay for your internet. If paying for things you want makes you sick then I assume you must still live at home with your parents.
For me the Free to Play model is lame, it just allows a bunch of "entitled" gamers to play a game that someone else is paying for and distracts the DEV's attention as they struggle with ways to monetize the game. Money / Profit is King so it doesn't take long for an MMO DEV team to be gutted and new content delayed as staff are focused on the next set of Vanity Pets, Costumes and in the end things slip into P2W.
The Free trail / Subscription model provides consistent predictable revenue and helps the DEVs focus on the most important thing.. the game, not the cash shop.
It is ALWAYS about value not the cost.That added old saying quality before quantity is oh so true.
I do not think it is any coincidence but my top 5 rated games in this genre were all sub based games.Then 99% of the cash shop games,i wouldn't play them if they paid me the 15 bucks a month.Matter of fact i am lucky to last one month in the ones i do play for a bit.
Point is ,i wouldn't play any of these cash shop games if they did carry a subscription,so imo they are low value games,they are only worth the free to play monicker.
We should also not forget that there is no such thing as FREE,unless that developer has some gimmick to recoup costs,they are shutting that game down right quick.
One very noticeable trait i have seen in cash shop games is badly dithered down graphics,i have to strain my eyes to see anything,the compression rate is high and lighting is poor,so there is no clarity looking at anything.Some games are even worse,all color is lost with the dumb down graphics,and quite often everything is covered in fog.
The most tell tale sign of a cheap effort ,this of course if you are not well versed into spotting it are,buildings with no insides or moving doors.That right there is a super lazy effort,cutting more than half the effort needed to make a realistic game world.Cut scenes,ugly or no animation,i love that excuse "We are showing off our world class art team" ,i almost fell out of my chair when i heard that BS.Or how about cut scenes where your player is not even in the CS ..lol.
I forgot to mention,i love devs that tell you THEIR game is doing a better job with community ,then everything is automated or played on shards,i hate Shards.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Did you even read it? I don't think you did ~
Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained
Because it is true. I am as pro f2p as they come and I am still angry at the f2p models they're coming out with. First, call it what it is: Share To Play not free. Second, do it right. Only sell pets, mounts, jewelry, and potions. Never something anyone really needs to play the game. Third, no adds or lotteries. Plus, if you're gonna Box To Play your game give a months worth of a free trial. Your games sucks so much no one wants to play it after a month get out of the gaming business and look in to ranching seahorses instead.
Yeah, I had to re-read the title again. What was making the OP want to vomit again? Paying money?
Just because there is a trend right now leaning towards microtransactions via Cash Shops, this does not mean other methods are also viable. I'd happily pay a sub to a game that had enough depth and quality to keep me entertained. Personally, I find the tactics some company's use to funnel you into their CS's to be nauseating, and it would be refreshing to just play a game without all the hidden, tedious mechanics designed to make you pay.
So... People want to play an MMO for no cost. The quoted poster said they want to pay once and that is it. Sounds like they do not want to purchase items in a cash shop, either, as that would mean paying more "than once." I guess all the updates should be free, too?
I really should not be surprised, I guess...
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
And I think there's always going to be the Gun Jumping contingent that feel that simply because someone doesn't want to pay means they can't. Fortunately, you're wrong and subs are going the way of the dodo either way.
1 - You are exagerating
2 - The guy has its point / nothing crazy about what he said.
i hate subscription fees and darkfall should have been a free to play.
that is why i take my hat of to neverwinter,good game and free,only aaa games should ask for money to buy the game
and if they do not have the funding to create a game go to kickstarter.
off the point but i am very sad that EA is going to create future star wars games!
Wow, how are people not understanding what I said?
Seriously, they don't understand that that was the post I quoted?
I don't agree with it, ya idjits.
Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained
A company makes a product.
A company decides on the price.
A consumer decides if he thinks it is worth the money.
The rest: bla bla bla
Never, ever, expect people to read.
Either way, that load of drivel made me want to throw up as well.
Sorry Man, its early in the morning. Your comment was really brief and I posted after 3/4 of the way through the quote.
There seems to be this misconception that cash shops are cheaper than monthly fee's.
For instance, my brother refuses to pay a monthly fee for a game ever again, yet he buys things from cash shops all the time. It eventually adds up to be WAY more than $15 a month. Does this seem to register with him? Nope.
Indeed. And when you try to politely point this out to some people... RAGE. xD