Far too many bitter old vets - we'll never have another "good" year for MMORPG gaming according to ya'll.
Personally? I've gotten a lot of enjoyment (even if short lived) with MMOs like GW2 and FFXIV in 2013, and am currently enjoying WoW again.
I'm looking forward to more WoW in 2014, maybe a crack at ESO, but more so D3 expansion and Destiny/The Division (pseudo-MMO ish games)
Hopeful for LOTS of great XB1 games this year like Titanfall, Halo 5 (maybe), the before mentioned D3 expansion (hopefully), Destiny, The Division, and (hopefully) great RPG's including Witcher 3, DA3, maybe a new ME, and FFXV.
sadly many ppl don't appreciate what they get like for example POE,a great free game and yet some bash it for wrong reasons.but still 2013 was a bad year for MMOs even without considering the bitter ppl and their lack of cooperation (since the more ppl in game the better for the game itself)
also good choices i am looking forward to all those games too plus Dark Souls 2 in RPG genre and many more in other genres.(not a fan of D3 though still a great game hope the expansion become a game changer and lure me)
I will agree with you on Path of Exile. The depth that that game brought was pretty impressive (skill system). Their FTP model is nice, too.
I just don't really think of it as a full blown MMO, though. Moreover, the game is just too short. Gear grinding is fun, but not if there isn't some purpose to do so, e.g., high end raiding, world pvp, etc. when I played, PvP was not in it. It just felt half-complete.
i know what you are saying i am not sure if i should count it as MMO too or not but for me it isn't because of the lack of PvP focus or raiding cause i am not into these stuff much it is mostly because it felt single-playerish and probably most or even all the stuff are do-able alone.i am mostly a PVE guy that loves a good story and even though the game is not much story-driven i enjoyed the atmosphere and it was enough to keep me entertained.i prefer this to a game that has a bad story or pretend to have one and fail to deliver.still if it wasn't free depending on it's price my opinion about the game could change.
the value of POE for me was not only the game itself but the positive effect it can cause and causing to F2P gaming,PC gaming and Indie gaming.
in the end it is all matter of taste.the important part is appreciating the game for what it is then criticizing it for what it could or should be all based on your preferences and that's what you did which is the important part.sadly many refuse to do this.
also just to clarify when i was saying it was a bad year i was talking about MMOs that launched this year otherwise i am still enjoying GW2 and TSW for example.
my top MMOs: UO,DAOC,WoW,GW2
most of my posts are just my opinions they are not facts,it is the same for you too.
At one point, back during its (re-)development, I'd have given a whole-hearted "hell yeah!" to choosing XIV for that title. That would have been before all the real details about the game - the things Yoshi-P consistently dodged or gave otherwise vague responses to when asked - started to come out. When it became clear he was taking the "safe route" with it, claiming that it would be too difficult to do something new and interesting, because he "isn't intelligent enough to reinvent the wheel" (his words, not mine) I quickly lost faith and interest in it.
At this point, my acknowledgment of ARR's selection is cynical at best.
Tried Neverwinter and just could not get into that game at all. There's no one specific thing I can point to about it. The whole package just felt "off" to me.
Far too many bitter old vets - we'll never have another "good" year for MMORPG gaming according to ya'll.
Personally? I've gotten a lot of enjoyment (even if short lived) with MMOs like GW2 and FFXIV in 2013, and am currently enjoying WoW again.
I'm looking forward to more WoW in 2014, maybe a crack at ESO, but more so D3 expansion and Destiny/The Division (pseudo-MMO ish games)
Hopeful for LOTS of great XB1 games this year like Titanfall, Halo 5 (maybe), the before mentioned D3 expansion (hopefully), Destiny, The Division, and (hopefully) great RPG's including Witcher 3, DA3, maybe a new ME, and FFXV.
Oh yeah, it's all the fault of the "bitter vets" that developers keep churning out crap year after year, pretty common consensus from all sorts of posters here that 2013 was a bad year for MMORPG's.
Look at your wish list, you are a MMO tourist, dropping in from game to game for short periods of time. If a game doesn't have the design behind it to grab a substantial portion over the long haul, (what the purists want) then they are failures in my eyes.
You are correct though, they may never make a MMORPG designed as I am looking for ever again, but I still have hope that the greater player base will weary of what they've been playing and "mature" if you will into desiring MMORPG's with some more challenging and long term designs.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
2012 and 2013 were both rather barren on the MMO front, a few games came along but nothing that could hold players the way MMOs have done in the past.
Having said that though, those that came out were fairly enjoyable games, FFXIV ARR, Neverwinter, Age of Wushu and even Defiance, but, and I can't stress this enough, they were only enjoyable in the short term.
I can't even remember the last MMO that held me on past the first 30 days, it definitely hasn't been in the last two years. I have though gone back to all of the MMOs I played during those two years for another go at them, to scratch an itch I guess. I've not been disappointed with the time I spent in any of them and definitely believe I've had my value for money.
Maybe I am a bitter old veteran, but I really would like to have an MMO that I can play for more than a month at a time without getting bored of it. TESO and Wildstar have potential, but to be honest, it might actually turn out to be Destiny that does it for me this time, but only time will tell.
2014 definitely looks better than 2013 did at this time last year.
EDIT: A complete lack of AAA single player RPGs on PC didn't help either... can't believe I had to get a PS3 to get my story fix.
Originally posted by Dauzqul I didn't realize what a bad year 2013 was in terms of gaming. lol. Just my opinion.
A bad year for launched MMO's, sure. However, ones that launched last year -particularly Guild Wars 2- have had a fantastic year. Ignoring haters (who are going to hate) about the 'doom', 'gloom', and 'it's dying', the game has been thriving with tons of content, updates, and enjoyable fun.
"Tell us what you think. What are your favourite games of the year?" My list would be similar to the official, except hybrid and veteran.
GotY - FF XIV ARR (runner up Neverwinter), because there's not a wide selection of choices really...
Anticipated - Wildstar (runner up ArcheAge instead of ESO)
Rising star - Landmark
Hybrid - n/a, but surely not those lame diablo clones
Innovative - Defiance (runner up Age of WulinShu)
Veteran - "Not many games in this industry can claim to be gaining subscribers ten years into their lifespan." You mean still gaining new alts?
Dunno, for the description of "the game that’s at least three years old and had a particularly great year" I think STO would be a much more fitting candidate, with the LoR expansion, the event on Risa, and the new season with the Sphere. Not a bad year at all.
Pretty nice to give Most Innovative to what a company WANTED to do and not what they did.
That being the case, go ahead and give me most innovative for the game I WANT to make which has:
a leveless yet deep character system
Truly astounding AI that both plays with you and against you
True world creation and destruction
A deep complex economy
Skill based PvP on a level never seen before
I will still accept the award when instead I make a game that looks and plays worse than original EQ since my intents were so innovative and the results don't matter.
I played my 3DS more than any other console. The new Zelda was amazing.
You mean "A Link between Worlds"? I liked it very much but it was also very short. I think that Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks used the features of the Nintendo DS very good. I missed that in "Link betweek Worlds". And dId I mentioned it was very short compared to the other two DS Zelda Games?
2013 will go down as one of the dullest years in MMO"s and 2014 will provide one of the biggest flops for MMO's including Wild Star going F2P within 6-12 months, ESO being a marginal success (fanboi's unite) and EverQuest Next being further delayed to 2015. I believe 2015 will be the year of excitement with EQ Next and Star Citizen.
I hope 2014 turns out better. Enjoyed some of the games on that list but in the end walked away from them for many reasons. I hope 2014 is the year I find a new MMO to lose myself in. So far thats been EQ1, DAoC and WoW. No real winners for me after 2004 =- 10 years of ok games. We need something stellar.
Far too many bitter old vets - we'll never have another "good" year for MMORPG gaming according to ya'll.
Oh yeah, it's all the fault of the "bitter vets" that developers keep churning out crap year after year, pretty common consensus from all sorts of posters here that 2013 was a bad year for MMORPG's.
Look at your wish list, you are a MMO tourist, dropping in from game to game for short periods of time. If a game doesn't have the design behind it to grab a substantial portion over the long haul, (what the purists want) then they are failures in my eyes.
You are correct though, they may never make a MMORPG designed as I am looking for ever again, but I still have hope that the greater player base will weary of what they've been playing and "mature" if you will into desiring MMORPG's with some more challenging and long term designs.
Many would consider me a "bitter vet" - after all, I tend to be negative and have been playing MMOs since UO pre-Trammel.
I don't think developers have been churning out crap year after year.
There have been some great games and some great expansion to long-running games. 2013 was a year that wasn't filled with all too much, I will agree to that.
Actual releases you have what, FFXIV, Defiance, Neverwinter as the biggest 3? That's not a great year, but lots of people enjoy FFXIV.
2013 was a good year for EvE, was a good year for MMO-lite with PoE, and saw the launch of both the PS4 and XB1- too platforms that are going to have a big impact on MMO gaming.
If I'm a tourist, it's because I am burned out - not because the games are all garbage. There are GREAT MMOs out there to play, like WoW, like EvE, like FFXIV, like Age of Wushu and others...
But this part really get's me-
"You are correct though, they may never make a MMORPG designed as I am looking for ever again, but I still have hope that the greater player base will weary of what they've been playing and "mature" if you will into desiring MMORPG's with some more challenging and long term designs."
So you are saying that you are not getting what you are looking for, and implying that people who disagree with your wishlist are immature "child" gamers that haven't yet elevated themselves to your level.
That, right there, is the real "problem" people on MMORPG REALLY have- old-man "walk uphill both ways" "everything was better before" types.
People who think WoW is a casual game still, to this day, crack me up.
Just because a game can be played casually doesn't mean it is a casual game.
So funny how people still don't understand this.
Chess can be a casual game. Chess can be a hardcore game.
EvE can be a casual game. EvE can be a hardcore game.
Farmville can be a casual game. Farmville can be a hardcore game.
(bold for emphasis)
Casual is a play style, not a game type.
Games that only support a hardcore playstyle usually don't do very well.
Neither do games that only support a casual playstyle.
The really successful and lasting/powerful games support multiple playstyles. Fact.
You are partly right. Some games can be played casually or hardcore but this does not make any game hardcore because people play it hardcore. Heck I cant stop playing Clash of Clan but its far from a hardcore game. What gamers call hardcore is a concept that is almost hard to really define and why so many say games like WoW are casual or hardcore. For some a game that focuses on crafting as the main way to get items is hardcore and for others its raids. For another its PvP.
What is casual? Now that can be defined. A game you can advance at top level game with little effort or by paying your way to success. But someone may say I am wrong in that. ((shrugs))
Defiance is the only recently released game that I enjoyed in 2013. But, I just started playing Diablo 3 after the Holidays and I am really enjoying it.
I can't really disagree with the list this year...although I don't think it was really a hard pick like it has been in years past.
Defiance is one of my best and most disappointing mmos I played this year. I was having a really good time playing the story and talked a lot about how much fun it was with friends....then, one day, just out of no where the fun went off a cliff because the short story they were telling just came to an end.
What was left was disappointing to say the least. Shooting rocks is not my idea of fun content to " grind" on.
At least next year is looking a bit brighter. At the very least people can be disappointed with better mmos.
Far too many bitter old vets - we'll never have another "good" year for MMORPG gaming according to ya'll.
Personally? I've gotten a lot of enjoyment (even if short lived) with MMOs like GW2 and FFXIV in 2013, and am currently enjoying WoW again.
I'm looking forward to more WoW in 2014, maybe a crack at ESO, but more so D3 expansion and Destiny/The Division (pseudo-MMO ish games)
Hopeful for LOTS of great XB1 games this year like Titanfall, Halo 5 (maybe), the before mentioned D3 expansion (hopefully), Destiny, The Division, and (hopefully) great RPG's including Witcher 3, DA3, maybe a new ME, and FFXV.
"bitter old vets" have nothing to do with the negativity. It's 100% the game. The games are either too hardcore (darkfall, mortal online) or too linear / redundant (swtor, virtually every theme park). It's just boring.
Comments
i know what you are saying i am not sure if i should count it as MMO too or not but for me it isn't because of the lack of PvP focus or raiding cause i am not into these stuff much it is mostly because it felt single-playerish and probably most or even all the stuff are do-able alone.i am mostly a PVE guy that loves a good story and even though the game is not much story-driven i enjoyed the atmosphere and it was enough to keep me entertained.i prefer this to a game that has a bad story or pretend to have one and fail to deliver.still if it wasn't free depending on it's price my opinion about the game could change.
the value of POE for me was not only the game itself but the positive effect it can cause and causing to F2P gaming,PC gaming and Indie gaming.
in the end it is all matter of taste.the important part is appreciating the game for what it is then criticizing it for what it could or should be all based on your preferences and that's what you did which is the important part.sadly many refuse to do this.
also just to clarify when i was saying it was a bad year i was talking about MMOs that launched this year otherwise i am still enjoying GW2 and TSW for example.
my top MMOs: UO,DAOC,WoW,GW2
most of my posts are just my opinions they are not facts,it is the same for you too.
It really says it all about 2013.. ....
At one point, back during its (re-)development, I'd have given a whole-hearted "hell yeah!" to choosing XIV for that title. That would have been before all the real details about the game - the things Yoshi-P consistently dodged or gave otherwise vague responses to when asked - started to come out. When it became clear he was taking the "safe route" with it, claiming that it would be too difficult to do something new and interesting, because he "isn't intelligent enough to reinvent the wheel" (his words, not mine) I quickly lost faith and interest in it.
At this point, my acknowledgment of ARR's selection is cynical at best.
Tried Neverwinter and just could not get into that game at all. There's no one specific thing I can point to about it. The whole package just felt "off" to me.
Oh yeah, it's all the fault of the "bitter vets" that developers keep churning out crap year after year, pretty common consensus from all sorts of posters here that 2013 was a bad year for MMORPG's.
Look at your wish list, you are a MMO tourist, dropping in from game to game for short periods of time. If a game doesn't have the design behind it to grab a substantial portion over the long haul, (what the purists want) then they are failures in my eyes.
You are correct though, they may never make a MMORPG designed as I am looking for ever again, but I still have hope that the greater player base will weary of what they've been playing and "mature" if you will into desiring MMORPG's with some more challenging and long term designs.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Well for what was launched in 2013,..sounds about right
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
2012 and 2013 were both rather barren on the MMO front, a few games came along but nothing that could hold players the way MMOs have done in the past.
Having said that though, those that came out were fairly enjoyable games, FFXIV ARR, Neverwinter, Age of Wushu and even Defiance, but, and I can't stress this enough, they were only enjoyable in the short term.
I can't even remember the last MMO that held me on past the first 30 days, it definitely hasn't been in the last two years. I have though gone back to all of the MMOs I played during those two years for another go at them, to scratch an itch I guess. I've not been disappointed with the time I spent in any of them and definitely believe I've had my value for money.
Maybe I am a bitter old veteran, but I really would like to have an MMO that I can play for more than a month at a time without getting bored of it. TESO and Wildstar have potential, but to be honest, it might actually turn out to be Destiny that does it for me this time, but only time will tell.
2014 definitely looks better than 2013 did at this time last year.
EDIT: A complete lack of AAA single player RPGs on PC didn't help either... can't believe I had to get a PS3 to get my story fix.
A bad year for launched MMO's, sure. However, ones that launched last year -particularly Guild Wars 2- have had a fantastic year. Ignoring haters (who are going to hate) about the 'doom', 'gloom', and 'it's dying', the game has been thriving with tons of content, updates, and enjoyable fun.
So it's been a great year...
...to be a Guild Wars 2 player.
BILL!!! Thanks for using below the asteroids ( from EVE) as music, noticed it first thing.
I love that song.
Might show up often now...
Try to be excellent to everyone you meet. You never know what someone else has seen or endured.
My Review Manifesto
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"Tell us what you think. What are your favourite games of the year?" My list would be similar to the official, except hybrid and veteran.
GotY - FF XIV ARR (runner up Neverwinter), because there's not a wide selection of choices really...
Anticipated - Wildstar (runner up ArcheAge instead of ESO)
Rising star - Landmark
Hybrid - n/a, but surely not those lame diablo clones
Innovative - Defiance (runner up Age of WulinShu)
Veteran - "Not many games in this industry can claim to be gaining subscribers ten years into their lifespan." You mean still gaining new alts?
Dunno, for the description of "the game that’s at least three years old and had a particularly great year" I think STO would be a much more fitting candidate, with the LoR expansion, the event on Risa, and the new season with the Sphere. Not a bad year at all.
Pretty nice to give Most Innovative to what a company WANTED to do and not what they did.
That being the case, go ahead and give me most innovative for the game I WANT to make which has:
a leveless yet deep character system
Truly astounding AI that both plays with you and against you
True world creation and destruction
A deep complex economy
Skill based PvP on a level never seen before
I will still accept the award when instead I make a game that looks and plays worse than original EQ since my intents were so innovative and the results don't matter.
Yes. It was short but a lot of fun.
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I hope 2014 turns out better. Enjoyed some of the games on that list but in the end walked away from them for many reasons. I hope 2014 is the year I find a new MMO to lose myself in. So far thats been EQ1, DAoC and WoW. No real winners for me after 2004 =- 10 years of ok games. We need something stellar.
Many would consider me a "bitter vet" - after all, I tend to be negative and have been playing MMOs since UO pre-Trammel.
I don't think developers have been churning out crap year after year.
There have been some great games and some great expansion to long-running games. 2013 was a year that wasn't filled with all too much, I will agree to that.
Actual releases you have what, FFXIV, Defiance, Neverwinter as the biggest 3? That's not a great year, but lots of people enjoy FFXIV.
2013 was a good year for EvE, was a good year for MMO-lite with PoE, and saw the launch of both the PS4 and XB1- too platforms that are going to have a big impact on MMO gaming.
If I'm a tourist, it's because I am burned out - not because the games are all garbage. There are GREAT MMOs out there to play, like WoW, like EvE, like FFXIV, like Age of Wushu and others...
But this part really get's me-
"You are correct though, they may never make a MMORPG designed as I am looking for ever again, but I still have hope that the greater player base will weary of what they've been playing and "mature" if you will into desiring MMORPG's with some more challenging and long term designs."
So you are saying that you are not getting what you are looking for, and implying that people who disagree with your wishlist are immature "child" gamers that haven't yet elevated themselves to your level.
That, right there, is the real "problem" people on MMORPG REALLY have- old-man "walk uphill both ways" "everything was better before" types.
People who think WoW is a casual game still, to this day, crack me up.
Just because a game can be played casually doesn't mean it is a casual game.
So funny how people still don't understand this.
Chess can be a casual game. Chess can be a hardcore game.
EvE can be a casual game. EvE can be a hardcore game.
Farmville can be a casual game. Farmville can be a hardcore game.
(bold for emphasis)
Casual is a play style, not a game type.
Games that only support a hardcore playstyle usually don't do very well.
Neither do games that only support a casual playstyle.
The really successful and lasting/powerful games support multiple playstyles. Fact.
EXACTLY , for me wow is still the king
You are partly right. Some games can be played casually or hardcore but this does not make any game hardcore because people play it hardcore. Heck I cant stop playing Clash of Clan but its far from a hardcore game. What gamers call hardcore is a concept that is almost hard to really define and why so many say games like WoW are casual or hardcore. For some a game that focuses on crafting as the main way to get items is hardcore and for others its raids. For another its PvP.
What is casual? Now that can be defined. A game you can advance at top level game with little effort or by paying your way to success. But someone may say I am wrong in that. ((shrugs))
I can't really disagree with the list this year...although I don't think it was really a hard pick like it has been in years past.
Defiance is one of my best and most disappointing mmos I played this year. I was having a really good time playing the story and talked a lot about how much fun it was with friends....then, one day, just out of no where the fun went off a cliff because the short story they were telling just came to an end.
What was left was disappointing to say the least. Shooting rocks is not my idea of fun content to " grind" on.
At least next year is looking a bit brighter. At the very least people can be disappointed with better mmos.
"bitter old vets" have nothing to do with the negativity. It's 100% the game. The games are either too hardcore (darkfall, mortal online) or too linear / redundant (swtor, virtually every theme park). It's just boring.