....I actually would like to see games install a new twist to agro management.. >> PROXIMITY <<< The closer you are to the mob the higher chance you'll get smacked by mob.. Example would take place like this.. Warrior that does 100dps point blank, is going to be #1 on that mobs agro list if all other players in the group are at 100dps or lower.. Now lets say you have a rogue that jumps into the fight and does 120dps point blank backstabbing.. HE WILL become #1 on the agro list now, and rightfully so.. However lets use proximity for example, and assume a mage 10 feet away does 130 dps.. YES, he does the most dps, but because he is farther away, the mob doesn't really take that into consideration.. That 130 dps with a proximity adjustment might convert to 102 dps (according to the agro list).. If the mage moves back, the agro number might drop down to 93.. So the further away from the mob, the dps you can afford to shell out without risk of getting smacked..
Different battle is a ranger shooting bow at 50m is smacking the mob with 150dps, but since he is so far away, the agro list is only recording him at 109.. However if the ranger moves up and gets closer to mob, or mob moves and gets closer to ranger, that number will change.. His 150 dps might now be 138 according to the agro list and now the ranger has a new friend.. UNTIL someone deals with the mob, or ranger learns to deal with his dps / proximity issue.. LOL
Proximity mechanic is not a new idea, that is exactly how eq worked. I am sure you know that since you descibe the system, just a clarification for others.
On another note.. Tanking systems are defintely too taunt based, and it could be interesting to see more blocking path, blindness, snare/chaining, summoning, confusion, ground runes, etc as tanking mechanics.. Combined with others classes/roles needing to use the tanks maneuvers to lower their aggro.
Pretty easy: healers and DD can have a small PvP aspect while grouping, since they have measurable numbers to compare during a raid. That leads to more competition and for alot of players to more fun.
Actually a good idea is to return to the original trinity.
Instead of tank - healer - damage dealer, it would be tank - healer - crowd control.
This way EVERYBODY would have to help with the party, not just the tanks and healers.
I wouldn't mind seeing less emphasis on "dealing uber damage"; however, just returning to tank/healer/CC will not alleviate the problem this thread is discussing. This will not create more tanks or more people willing to play tanks.
In my opinion, the genre needs to return to what tabletop RPGs were more about: less role based and more "enjoy an activity with your friends". Again, just my opinion - but the trinity tends to remove the ability to do that. It's not fun to have to tell a friend, "sorry, we don't need you - we already have what we need for a <insert role here>."
This isn't just a tank thing though - this particular issue extends into why developers feel they need to design content to always present a challenge, rather than just design content and let the players enjoy it. There was more than one EQ1 raid back in the day that was beaten simply because the playerbase threw more players at it than the developers designed it for. These days, instancing and player caps prevent the playerbase from having that dynamic available.
Originally posted by Edli I don't care that most endgame content is not massive. If you can do something with a massive number of players that makes it a MMO. If you have a huge world where thousands of players play, if you can gather hundreds of them to raid a city that is a MMO.
If you keep using the word massive for 4 or 10 players that word loses its meaning and you have to find another word to replace. Thankfully words don't change their meanings only because some guy feels like changing it eitherwise we had to come up with new words everyday.
nariusseldon is right actually.
Bread and butter and reason for why absolute most majority of players play WoW are two:
1. Solo play, questing, crafting, collection mounts and other stuff, etc - done mostly solo or rarely in small group
2. Playing in small groups in various instances - dungeons, arenas, battlerounds
WoW 'world' is just a display. You cannot do nothing meaningful or permanent on this world. It is exactly the same on all servers.
You don't have impact on other players on this world either. You can kill them on PVP servers, but that has no meaning - they die, respawn. Nothing happened aside of fact they lost few seconds for respawn.
You can kill enemy faction NPC - you kill, they respawn in same place soon after. Nothing happened.
Sorry mate to burst your bubble - but WoW (and majority of MMORPGs for that matter) is predominately a lobby game played in small groups in instances with additional solo activities. (levelling ,collecting, daily quests. etc)
Just because you can theoretically group bigger group of people to achieve nothing permanent or meaningul by storming enemy capital changes nothing in bigger picture.
So yeah - WoW and most MMORPGs are closer to a lobby game than they are to a 'world' / MMORPG concept.
Sorry mate to burst your bubble - but WoW (and majority of MMORPGs for that matter) is predominately a lobby game played in small groups in instances with additional solo activities. (levelling ,collecting, daily quests. etc)
As i have said many times ... MMO gameplay is mostly "not massive" anymore. And hence games like D3 (which is exactly lobby game played in small groups & solo) is close enough.
I don't think people do not know this. Just that either you like it (like me), or not.
Comments
Proximity mechanic is not a new idea, that is exactly how eq worked. I am sure you know that since you descibe the system, just a clarification for others.
On another note.. Tanking systems are defintely too taunt based, and it could be interesting to see more blocking path, blindness, snare/chaining, summoning, confusion, ground runes, etc as tanking mechanics.. Combined with others classes/roles needing to use the tanks maneuvers to lower their aggro.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
Actually a good idea is to return to the original trinity.
Instead of tank - healer - damage dealer, it would be tank - healer - crowd control.
This way EVERYBODY would have to help with the party, not just the tanks and healers.
I wouldn't mind seeing less emphasis on "dealing uber damage"; however, just returning to tank/healer/CC will not alleviate the problem this thread is discussing. This will not create more tanks or more people willing to play tanks.
In my opinion, the genre needs to return to what tabletop RPGs were more about: less role based and more "enjoy an activity with your friends". Again, just my opinion - but the trinity tends to remove the ability to do that. It's not fun to have to tell a friend, "sorry, we don't need you - we already have what we need for a <insert role here>."
This isn't just a tank thing though - this particular issue extends into why developers feel they need to design content to always present a challenge, rather than just design content and let the players enjoy it. There was more than one EQ1 raid back in the day that was beaten simply because the playerbase threw more players at it than the developers designed it for. These days, instancing and player caps prevent the playerbase from having that dynamic available.
nariusseldon is right actually.
Bread and butter and reason for why absolute most majority of players play WoW are two:
1. Solo play, questing, crafting, collection mounts and other stuff, etc - done mostly solo or rarely in small group
2. Playing in small groups in various instances - dungeons, arenas, battlerounds
WoW 'world' is just a display. You cannot do nothing meaningful or permanent on this world. It is exactly the same on all servers.
You don't have impact on other players on this world either. You can kill them on PVP servers, but that has no meaning - they die, respawn. Nothing happened aside of fact they lost few seconds for respawn.
You can kill enemy faction NPC - you kill, they respawn in same place soon after. Nothing happened.
Sorry mate to burst your bubble - but WoW (and majority of MMORPGs for that matter) is predominately a lobby game played in small groups in instances with additional solo activities. (levelling ,collecting, daily quests. etc)
Just because you can theoretically group bigger group of people to achieve nothing permanent or meaningul by storming enemy capital changes nothing in bigger picture.
So yeah - WoW and most MMORPGs are closer to a lobby game than they are to a 'world' / MMORPG concept.
As i have said many times ... MMO gameplay is mostly "not massive" anymore. And hence games like D3 (which is exactly lobby game played in small groups & solo) is close enough.
I don't think people do not know this. Just that either you like it (like me), or not.