I don't know about Dark P. though, they just seemed like a shill - they kept saying these guys are trying. Trying isn't results, get results and you won't have to talk about what might be but what IS.
DarK was DarKPenguin from RPGCodex. He's been following and exposing the story for quite some time. I don't think he'd fit into the "shill" category, considering how much he's brought to light through investigation. This includes all chat logs between Jason Appleton and James Proctor, which, while quite lengthy, are incredibly hilarious to read ...
I do think Joel and James are trying their best. However, like you said, it's far from "enough", and even James' best has been very poor, slow, and unprofessional. Considering he's the one developing the game, he couldn't even get his microphone to work properly, didn't even bother to show his face for more than a few seconds at a time, and never actually answered any questions directed at him. Seemed incredibly immature and unprofessional.
Joel was a lot more well-spoken than I expected ... And he was actually real! Which was a real surprise considering he's been notoriously absent and on-again-off-again since the beginning. He's also been completely absent since April 9th on the official website, and has done the majority of his posting on MMOChampion arguing with vitriolic posters (really ... they make what happens here seem tame).
The hangout went from a Q&A to a comedy show to a depressing confessional towards the end.
I do feel bad for James and Joel; they should have never taken up the torch for Jason Appleton. However, it's still yet to be seen if this was their goal all along: tank Greed Monger and take the code/assets/engines/servers/framework for his own profit. Maybe James really was so incompetent (according to Appleton) and planned to take the assets from Greed Monger to continue developing Rise of Heroes (Which Joel mentioned being the plan, by the way, and by name) instead.
I have a feeling that another title/project will be coming from James Proctor soon, featuring Joel Hager as the front-man.
The Greed Monger website hasn't even been updated with information from the Hangout ... Goes to show that Joel Hager was all talk when it came to the questions about communication. Some of the things Joel claimed were so comedic on their own ... According to Joel they were "considering investment offers from multiple sources". What a joke. Who would actually invest in such incompetence, especially if that video was all they had to show after three years of development? If Joel's credibility wasn't already ruined, it certainly became a complete joke after that comment.
What's even more sad is that only two people joined the conversation on the Google Hangout aside from DarKPenguin (reporter), and neither of them were backers, apparently.. Goes to show you how many people are actually still interested in the hundreds of dollars they spent on the game's development. Guess they all gave up after January's video (lol).
@Epony "This includes all chat logs between Jason Appleton and James Proctor, which, while quite lengthy, are incredibly hilarious to read ..."
Do you have the link to those lengthy chat logs? I seriously cannot find them. lol~
...or wait is it all on RPGCODEX? I think I may have found it.
Also another question...how did DarkP obtain conversations between Proctor and Appleton? How has he been shedding the light on everything; did he previously work for appleton or something?
Watched the video 3 times so far and have it playing in the background right now... it never gets old! Haha.
Dark and I are now Friends so he's in our Skype Discussions and sees first hand what takes place with MMO Interactive on a daily basis. When Jason said he was going to release our chat logs I decided to beat him to it. I went through our logs from December of 2012 and released those. It took me a while to go through them and remove sensitive information (Account usernames and Passwords). By the time I got that first month released Jason had said that he had decided to hold off releasing the chat logs until he saw what my next move was going to be and so I did the same. So the logs that were released where far from all of them.
It includes enough information to conclude that you should've known it was a scam from the beginning, James.
Also enough information to determine you're exactly the kind of "leader" Jason needed for GM in order to swindle the backers out of all their money. Seriously, if it wasn't blatantly obvious to you as early as 2012 when Jason Appleton said this, there's something terribly wrong.
[12/5/2012 11:05:49 PM] James Proctor: To get it done in a reasonable time it's going to take a team twice this size... Takes AAA companies with hundreds of people 4+ years just to release a MMO... [12/5/2012 11:06:08 PM] Jason Appleton: No it wont. I've done my research man [12/5/2012 11:06:27 PM] Jason Appleton: Early on I didnt know for sure. But I've been reading on gamasutra and other resources
[12/7/2012 12:53:26 AM] Jason Appleton: Some times, you have to fake it till you make it. [12/7/2012 12:53:30 AM] Jason Appleton: " /> [12/7/2012 12:53:31 AM] James Proctor: lol [12/7/2012 12:53:35 AM] Jason Appleton: I'm serious [12/7/2012 12:53:59 AM] Jason Appleton: Just make sure when you fake it, there aren't holes in your faking. lol
Pretty sure anyone with any sense would easily know your original statement was true, James, but you continued the charade for years after this. Furthermore, being told to "fake it til you make it" and "make sure there aren't holes" is also pretty exculpatory in determining it was a scam from the start. Jason Appleton gave plenty of clues that this was a scam. How did you never pick up on it?
Do you and Joel have any intention of updating your backers about what transpired during the Hangout, or are you going to continue to leave them in the dark about development the same way Electric Crow did? For two people who claim to love the backers so much, you sure seem to leave them in the dark about pretty much everything (stress test, t-shirts, and now the Hangout). Also, no new team members were introduced during the Hangout like you claimed.
It includes enough information to conclude that you should've known it was a scam from the beginning, James.
Also enough information to determine you're exactly the kind of "leader" Jason needed for GM in order to swindle the backers out of all their money. Seriously, if it wasn't blatantly obvious to you as early as 2012 when Jason Appleton said this, there's something terribly wrong.
[12/5/2012 11:05:49 PM] James Proctor: To get it done in a reasonable time it's going to take a team twice this size... Takes AAA companies with hundreds of people 4+ years just to release a MMO... [12/5/2012 11:06:08 PM] Jason Appleton: No it wont. I've done my research man [12/5/2012 11:06:27 PM] Jason Appleton: Early on I didnt know for sure. But I've been reading on gamasutra and other resources
[12/7/2012 12:53:26 AM] Jason Appleton: Some times, you have to fake it till you make it. [12/7/2012 12:53:30 AM] Jason Appleton: " /> [12/7/2012 12:53:31 AM] James Proctor: lol [12/7/2012 12:53:35 AM] Jason Appleton: I'm serious [12/7/2012 12:53:59 AM] Jason Appleton: Just make sure when you fake it, there aren't holes in your faking. lol
Pretty sure anyone with any sense would easily know your original statement was true, James, but you continued the charade for years after this. Furthermore, being told to "fake it til you make it" and "make sure there aren't holes" is also pretty exculpatory in determining it was a scam from the start. Jason Appleton gave plenty of clues that this was a scam. How did you never pick up on it?
Do you and Joel have any intention of updating your backers about what transpired during the Hangout, or are you going to continue to leave them in the dark about development the same way Electric Crow did? For two people who claim to love the backers so much, you sure seem to leave them in the dark about pretty much everything (stress test, t-shirts, and now the Hangout). Also, no new team members were introduced during the Hangout like you claimed.
The Hangout is available for anyone to see. At this point in time nothing has changed. We are discussing our next course of action and will update the community when we have a plan in place. We will be creating a forum post soon with a poll to see what people want us to do and we will factor the results from that into our final plan on how to move forward.
As for your first comment about knowing it was a scam I was told by everyone around me that it was nothing more then a scam... I knew there was a chance but I also knew that I was going to do everything in my power to see it through to launch. It didn't matter what other people's intentions were as long as I saw it through and got it launched.
Also we did introduce new members of our team. We had John, one of our Programmers, and we had both Tyler and Paul who are members of our QA Team. None of them talked much because the agenda for the night quickly changed when PFO started asking questions and then ended up attacking us. I tried to have a open discussion format with members of the community because I wanted our Hangouts to be a time where we could talk with the community and hear concerns and discuss things however if we are just going to be attacked then we may have to rethink how we conduct our hangouts in the future.
I've watched for like 43 minutes and all I heard was excuses about why the game is bad. We get it, you tried to help everybody out by taking over the game and continuing development lmao, I mean it's brought up so much I'm starting to wonder if that's really all it was about.
Btw, didn't James say just a few days ago they have a team working on Greed Monger, of like 15 or 20? I guess that's why none of them called you when you fell asleep with your headache, because they're non existent. The only people who joined the Google Hangout call was you & Joel, the same people we've heard about for years, where is your team of developers at? Or was that a lie just like everything else has been?
It's really becoming clear to me why you guys offered to "take over the game" in such a horrible contract where you're operating at perceived loss in every category without having the foresight on simple issues like, where is the kickstarter money (you know, the only reason the game even exists). Or, where are the t-shirts?
Joel, your slug like, slouching posture throughout the entire video screams how disinterested you are in the entire project & conversation, that is not how a PR person should act like, that is not how somebody who cares about what they're advertising should act like.
James, you were basically MIA for the entire conversation, I guess it's because you're extremely shy/nervous/whatever, which probably explains why you aren't working and making money for yourself., instead of making train wreck games like this disaster. I mean really, you could have tested your mic before you were going to show off your game, or buy a better mic before the show. It all ties together nicely with why the test never happened, and why none of your "developers" bothered to call you when you fell asleep with your headache, why none of them had your phone #, why Joel didn't care about the test, and why the game is a piece of trash.
Seriously, Joel, James & Jason, you're all scumbags as far as I'm concerned, if I see your names on any future projects, kickstarters, or anything, that will be one game I will make sure to never check out & get my hopes up for.
You're both extremely gullible, not very smart, to take over ownership of Green Monger how you did proves that. You guys don't act responsibly, you're actually so stupid you believe that you didn't have a good playing field when negotiating that horrendous contract. You basically ended up screwing over ALL of the Kickstarter backers, because magically the only thing the contract you signed gave you was assets that you two will be using in your other fail game.
Stop trying to act like you did any of us a favor, because you didn't. We gained absolutely nothing while you walk away with however much assets the Kickstarter money bought you. You can't answer any of our questions, you have no game to show, literally. You have no devs to show off, none of them joined the hangout. Joel, besides two hours of that Google Hangout video, you haven't done any PR at all, and James has been working for free for 3 years. So stop trying to act like you're helping us, you haven't sunk a penny into the game, and you didn't plan to.
I mean think about it, your PR person, who owns the company 50/50 with you, James, decided Google Hangout was a good place to take some question and show an unfinished game? You guys were getting trolled the entire video, and you have random loud music playing over top of you talking because nobody takes your project seriously. You could have at least gotten some questions on the forums or something, and did a regular Q&A video. Jfc rofl.
Here's some words of advice for you two, stop trying to hit the lottery, stop thinking you're good with PR, and you're doing smart business tactics, you aren't. Go outside & get a job.
Good luck.
When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
To be honest, you guys (JamesP and Joel) were incredibly dumb for taking over this game in its current shape with no money behind you. Appleton walks away with over $75,000 for doing nothing while you two geniuses accept responsibility for a game in less than alpha state with no money behind you. You guys will continue to lose money on this project from sending out t-shirts, buying assets and wasting your time when there is no way anyone with any business sense is going to give you guys any money for this project.
Joel, you look ridiculous sitting on your couch like you dont give a rats behind about anything. In the future you might want to just put up a picture and not do any live videos. Your appearance alone is enough to change the mind of any potential investor and make them run away.
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
Iv caught up on things from RPGCODEX and wish to give my final conclusion/thoughts to this GM deal. My conclusion is that you are way in over your head; Honorable that you wish to continue on to fulfill broken promises, and see this through until the very end. You James Proctor have been working for FREE for 3-years as a volunteer programmer, with a promise of receiving a small percentage after the game releases. What are you trying to prove at this point? Greed Monger was Appletons Dream/Scam.
The money is gone you do not have the talent on hand to continue building a game. While you have new Q/A & Programmers joining you do not have any 3D-Modelers or Animators or skilled Level-Designers. $100,000 allowed you to pay for the missing skill; The "Contractors" and I quote you "We paid around $20,000 to the guy who created our Custom Housing Modules. We have a world builder who worked on our old world who we paid so much to per climate that he did. We have 3d modelers, animators, and riggers who we hired to do some specific tasks. We hired the texture artist / UI Artist to create our UI and Icons."
Let's be real you don't have the money and skill on hand to continue development; Greed Monger had money and paid for these contractors who came and eventually left. Earlier you accounted $21,000 and yet above you said on RPGCODEX you paid one guy around $20,000 for a housing module [Which was actually seen in the video at the end] [Sort of looked like a Landmark Claim] Furthermore what everyone has seen on the video yesterday was an incredible disappointment; even for those who have never seen or heard of the game before such as myself.
3-Years with $100,000 and that was when appleton had money to throw around at "Contractors". In your conversations earlier this year in 2015. MMO-Interactive was not even fully registered and might not even be today. You can still gain credibility and respect if you make realistic choices. Continuing to build upon an MMO at this point is just a kids dream "I want to build an MMO!" Everyone at this point will only smirk and sort of laugh at the continued development on GM. You said on your MMO-Interactive forums [May 5th] that you had intentions of rebranding the game. Do not rebrand it just drop it like a stone and then rise to the top under a new name/project.
Your time is worth more than this; and you are free of appletons shackles.
An RPG-Codex staff wrote the following words which I also agree with: "You should skip the MMO "developing" and switch to something where your energy is used more efficient." You are leading this whole thing; a simple volunteer programmer with a 'Company' that may or may not even be registered properly. You don't have the money and the skill on hand to continue development as said above. I'm sure you already had intentions of rebranding and continuing on; but what im trying to point out is that you should just ABANDON and DROP GM and start your own thing. [Plays "Let It Go"]
The assets and licensing is still yours; so at least that is a good start to things. Some fruitful things have come from working at Electric Crow for free it would seem. Take those benefits and move on.
...And for the love of god drop the MMO tag/idea build a simple game that hosts up to 10 players or something. MMO's aren't exactly thriving lately. Also I wish to add the gameplay video was not lagging due to poor specs on the streamers side as claimed, but instead due too poor optimization. It honestly looks like a game that was made over 7+ years ago, and any computer would be able to handle it. [last sentence; is just what I believe] xD
-----Tapping out!-----
OhhPaigey; you need to watch everything after 1:00:00~ lol~ srsly! >:
The Hangout is available for anyone to see. At this point in time nothing has changed. We are discussing our next course of action and will update the community when we have a plan in place. We will be creating a forum post soon with a poll to see what people want us to do and we will factor the results from that into our final plan on how to move forward.
As for your first comment about knowing it was a scam I was told by everyone around me that it was nothing more then a scam... I knew there was a chance but I also knew that I was going to do everything in my power to see it through to launch. It didn't matter what other people's intentions were as long as I saw it through and got it launched.
Also we did introduce new members of our team. We had John, one of our Programmers, and we had both Tyler and Paul who are members of our QA Team. None of them talked much because the agenda for the night quickly changed when PFO started asking questions and then ended up attacking us. I tried to have a open discussion format with members of the community because I wanted our Hangouts to be a time where we could talk with the community and hear concerns and discuss things however if we are just going to be attacked then we may have to rethink how we conduct our hangouts in the future.
Wait, wait, wait. So of the seven people on that video, there are you, Joel, John, Tyler and Paul. That's five of the seven. The other two are Dark (who's covering it for rpgcodex) and PFO (who wasn't even a backer). You did a hangout for the members of your community and literally none of them showed up. The first law of holes applies here: if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.
___________________________ Have flask; will travel.
The Hangout is available for anyone to see. At this point in time nothing has changed. We are discussing our next course of action and will update the community when we have a plan in place. We will be creating a forum post soon with a poll to see what people want us to do and we will factor the results from that into our final plan on how to move forward.
As for your first comment about knowing it was a scam I was told by everyone around me that it was nothing more then a scam... I knew there was a chance but I also knew that I was going to do everything in my power to see it through to launch. It didn't matter what other people's intentions were as long as I saw it through and got it launched.
Also we did introduce new members of our team. We had John, one of our Programmers, and we had both Tyler and Paul who are members of our QA Team. None of them talked much because the agenda for the night quickly changed when PFO started asking questions and then ended up attacking us. I tried to have a open discussion format with members of the community because I wanted our Hangouts to be a time where we could talk with the community and hear concerns and discuss things however if we are just going to be attacked then we may have to rethink how we conduct our hangouts in the future.
Wait, wait, wait. So of the seven people on that video, there are you, Joel, John, Tyler and Paul. That's five of the seven. The other two are Dark (who's covering it for rpgcodex) and PFO (who wasn't even a backer). You did a hangout for the members of your community and literally none of them showed up. The first law of holes applies here: if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.
To be fair, they only posted the news on the official website just minutes before the Hangout actually started. As poorly as this reflects on the current interest in the game's development, it's largely their own fault. They also never pointed the readers of the news to the Hangout stream or linked the YouTube video. Even Joel commented on how short-notice it was in the video. Anyone who uses the official website or forums as a source of news still either doesn't know the Hangout happened, and/or has no idea where there YouTube video for it is located.
There were only two people in the Hangout that weren't part of the "team", and neither of them were backers apparently.
The only member of the "team" who even spoke was Joel. James didn't even have the gumption to keep his video live, much less actually speak to people who had questions for him.
It was less of a "Hangout" and more like the "Joel and PFO Show".
Everything has been said about the project that can be said. James and Joel you have been given advise by total strangers you don't know. But if you take a few steps back you will realise your names will forever be tainted by the Greedmonger debacle. Instead of staying in the pit of tar, you should step out of it, and wash it of your skins. Staying in the pit will just let you sink further and further.
Give the IP back to Jason Appleton. It's his problem, and his problem alone.
You counted the money and saw that $75,000 could not be accounted for. If you really want to help the backers you contact Kickstarter, show them your contract with Appleton, and tell them about the missing money. Ask them for legal advise, heck they might even help you.
As long as you keep developing Greedmonger you are hindering any legal actions backers of the project might ever want to take.
It's been several days since the Hangout originally aired, and there's still no news updates on the official website or forums and Joel is still just as absent as before.
Guess you intend to continue keeping your backers in the dark. They shouldn't be surprised by now, after three years and no playable alpha and only a slap-shod video to show for all their money ...
(EDIT: Looks like Joel at least commented on the YouTube video of the hangout, just to apologize for his sniffles, though. Guess he still can't be bothered to actually post to the official forums to update backers on their recent "considerations".)
I feel like I should send these guys $5 for the amount of entertainment this project has given me. This is far better than any game they could possibly make.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
That is kind of disappointing. I have no interest in GM but I did believe that James genuinely wants to get the game done.
Now he starts some other random project...
I do/did want to get the game done... The vast majority of the community that we talk to however seems to want us to drop GM and work on our own IP that would actually stand a chance of being Successful. However all of that aside we are doomed to fail with out doing something to get funding. There fore we are looking into doing some smaller side Projects... They will help us to get some projects complete, see how our team works together, and hopefully be good enough to start bringing in some funding for larger projects like GM.
The post that was posted here about my Zombie Survival prototype was a post I made to my Friends on my personal Facebook page just showing my friends what I've been up to. It was NOT meant for public viewing. But since it was made public first of all YES it started out as a Template from the Asset Store. It was a really good foundation for the type of Game I am prototyping. I have put in hours of work over the last couple days networking it and adding features. It's FAR more then what the template comes with. I have Networked the entire Character Controller Player Movement is completely synced up, I added UniStorm to it and created a Networking Plugin for UniStorm so the Server controls the entire Day/Night cycle and Weather Generation. I've added a Command Console and started added Commands that can be used to change the weather and other things from the Client. I added a Chat System with support for different Chat Channels, Custom Text Colors, ect. I created a Custom Mob Spawning System so that the Server can spawn the mobs and sync it all up with the clients. You can shoot and kill Zombies and once they are dead they will despawn after 20 seconds. I have started on a Inventory and Loot System though I still have a ways to go on it.
Comments
DarK was DarKPenguin from RPGCodex. He's been following and exposing the story for quite some time. I don't think he'd fit into the "shill" category, considering how much he's brought to light through investigation. This includes all chat logs between Jason Appleton and James Proctor, which, while quite lengthy, are incredibly hilarious to read ...
I do think Joel and James are trying their best. However, like you said, it's far from "enough", and even James' best has been very poor, slow, and unprofessional. Considering he's the one developing the game, he couldn't even get his microphone to work properly, didn't even bother to show his face for more than a few seconds at a time, and never actually answered any questions directed at him. Seemed incredibly immature and unprofessional.
Joel was a lot more well-spoken than I expected ... And he was actually real! Which was a real surprise considering he's been notoriously absent and on-again-off-again since the beginning. He's also been completely absent since April 9th on the official website, and has done the majority of his posting on MMOChampion arguing with vitriolic posters (really ... they make what happens here seem tame).
The hangout went from a Q&A to a comedy show to a depressing confessional towards the end.
I do feel bad for James and Joel; they should have never taken up the torch for Jason Appleton. However, it's still yet to be seen if this was their goal all along: tank Greed Monger and take the code/assets/engines/servers/framework for his own profit. Maybe James really was so incompetent (according to Appleton) and planned to take the assets from Greed Monger to continue developing Rise of Heroes (Which Joel mentioned being the plan, by the way, and by name) instead.
I have a feeling that another title/project will be coming from James Proctor soon, featuring Joel Hager as the front-man.
The Greed Monger website hasn't even been updated with information from the Hangout ... Goes to show that Joel Hager was all talk when it came to the questions about communication. Some of the things Joel claimed were so comedic on their own ... According to Joel they were "considering investment offers from multiple sources". What a joke. Who would actually invest in such incompetence, especially if that video was all they had to show after three years of development? If Joel's credibility wasn't already ruined, it certainly became a complete joke after that comment.
What's even more sad is that only two people joined the conversation on the Google Hangout aside from DarKPenguin (reporter), and neither of them were backers, apparently.. Goes to show you how many people are actually still interested in the hundreds of dollars they spent on the game's development. Guess they all gave up after January's video (lol).
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Watched the video 3 times so far and have it playing in the background right now... it never gets old! Haha.
I'll say it again... Just let ~GM~ fall into the dirt and move on...appleton can only be on the run for so long.
Dark and I are now Friends so he's in our Skype Discussions and sees first hand what takes place with MMO Interactive on a daily basis. When Jason said he was going to release our chat logs I decided to beat him to it. I went through our logs from December of 2012 and released those. It took me a while to go through them and remove sensitive information (Account usernames and Passwords). By the time I got that first month released Jason had said that he had decided to hold off releasing the chat logs until he saw what my next move was going to be and so I did the same. So the logs that were released where far from all of them.
Company Owner
MMO Interactive
It includes enough information to conclude that you should've known it was a scam from the beginning, James.
Also enough information to determine you're exactly the kind of "leader" Jason needed for GM in order to swindle the backers out of all their money. Seriously, if it wasn't blatantly obvious to you as early as 2012 when Jason Appleton said this, there's something terribly wrong.
[12/5/2012 11:05:49 PM] James Proctor: To get it done in a reasonable time it's going to take a team twice this size... Takes AAA companies with hundreds of people 4+ years just to release a MMO...
[12/5/2012 11:06:08 PM] Jason Appleton: No it wont. I've done my research man
[12/5/2012 11:06:27 PM] Jason Appleton: Early on I didnt know for sure. But I've been reading on gamasutra and other resources
[12/7/2012 12:53:26 AM] Jason Appleton: Some times, you have to fake it till you make it.
" />
[12/7/2012 12:53:30 AM] Jason Appleton:
[12/7/2012 12:53:31 AM] James Proctor: lol
[12/7/2012 12:53:35 AM] Jason Appleton: I'm serious
[12/7/2012 12:53:59 AM] Jason Appleton: Just make sure when you fake it, there aren't holes in your faking. lol
Pretty sure anyone with any sense would easily know your original statement was true, James, but you continued the charade for years after this. Furthermore, being told to "fake it til you make it" and "make sure there aren't holes" is also pretty exculpatory in determining it was a scam from the start. Jason Appleton gave plenty of clues that this was a scam. How did you never pick up on it?
Do you and Joel have any intention of updating your backers about what transpired during the Hangout, or are you going to continue to leave them in the dark about development the same way Electric Crow did? For two people who claim to love the backers so much, you sure seem to leave them in the dark about pretty much everything (stress test, t-shirts, and now the Hangout). Also, no new team members were introduced during the Hangout like you claimed.
The Hangout is available for anyone to see. At this point in time nothing has changed. We are discussing our next course of action and will update the community when we have a plan in place. We will be creating a forum post soon with a poll to see what people want us to do and we will factor the results from that into our final plan on how to move forward.
As for your first comment about knowing it was a scam I was told by everyone around me that it was nothing more then a scam... I knew there was a chance but I also knew that I was going to do everything in my power to see it through to launch. It didn't matter what other people's intentions were as long as I saw it through and got it launched.
Also we did introduce new members of our team. We had John, one of our Programmers, and we had both Tyler and Paul who are members of our QA Team. None of them talked much because the agenda for the night quickly changed when PFO started asking questions and then ended up attacking us. I tried to have a open discussion format with members of the community because I wanted our Hangouts to be a time where we could talk with the community and hear concerns and discuss things however if we are just going to be attacked then we may have to rethink how we conduct our hangouts in the future.
Company Owner
MMO Interactive
I've watched for like 43 minutes and all I heard was excuses about why the game is bad. We get it, you tried to help everybody out by taking over the game and continuing development lmao, I mean it's brought up so much I'm starting to wonder if that's really all it was about.
Btw, didn't James say just a few days ago they have a team working on Greed Monger, of like 15 or 20? I guess that's why none of them called you when you fell asleep with your headache, because they're non existent. The only people who joined the Google Hangout call was you & Joel, the same people we've heard about for years, where is your team of developers at? Or was that a lie just like everything else has been?
It's really becoming clear to me why you guys offered to "take over the game" in such a horrible contract where you're operating at perceived loss in every category without having the foresight on simple issues like, where is the kickstarter money (you know, the only reason the game even exists). Or, where are the t-shirts?
Joel, your slug like, slouching posture throughout the entire video screams how disinterested you are in the entire project & conversation, that is not how a PR person should act like, that is not how somebody who cares about what they're advertising should act like.
James, you were basically MIA for the entire conversation, I guess it's because you're extremely shy/nervous/whatever, which probably explains why you aren't working and making money for yourself., instead of making train wreck games like this disaster. I mean really, you could have tested your mic before you were going to show off your game, or buy a better mic before the show. It all ties together nicely with why the test never happened, and why none of your "developers" bothered to call you when you fell asleep with your headache, why none of them had your phone #, why Joel didn't care about the test, and why the game is a piece of trash.
Seriously, Joel, James & Jason, you're all scumbags as far as I'm concerned, if I see your names on any future projects, kickstarters, or anything, that will be one game I will make sure to never check out & get my hopes up for.
You're both extremely gullible, not very smart, to take over ownership of Green Monger how you did proves that. You guys don't act responsibly, you're actually so stupid you believe that you didn't have a good playing field when negotiating that horrendous contract. You basically ended up screwing over ALL of the Kickstarter backers, because magically the only thing the contract you signed gave you was assets that you two will be using in your other fail game.
Stop trying to act like you did any of us a favor, because you didn't. We gained absolutely nothing while you walk away with however much assets the Kickstarter money bought you. You can't answer any of our questions, you have no game to show, literally. You have no devs to show off, none of them joined the hangout. Joel, besides two hours of that Google Hangout video, you haven't done any PR at all, and James has been working for free for 3 years. So stop trying to act like you're helping us, you haven't sunk a penny into the game, and you didn't plan to.
I mean think about it, your PR person, who owns the company 50/50 with you, James, decided Google Hangout was a good place to take some question and show an unfinished game? You guys were getting trolled the entire video, and you have random loud music playing over top of you talking because nobody takes your project seriously. You could have at least gotten some questions on the forums or something, and did a regular Q&A video. Jfc rofl.
Here's some words of advice for you two, stop trying to hit the lottery, stop thinking you're good with PR, and you're doing smart business tactics, you aren't. Go outside & get a job.
Good luck.
To be honest, you guys (JamesP and Joel) were incredibly dumb for taking over this game in its current shape with no money behind you. Appleton walks away with over $75,000 for doing nothing while you two geniuses accept responsibility for a game in less than alpha state with no money behind you. You guys will continue to lose money on this project from sending out t-shirts, buying assets and wasting your time when there is no way anyone with any business sense is going to give you guys any money for this project.
Joel, you look ridiculous sitting on your couch like you dont give a rats behind about anything. In the future you might want to just put up a picture and not do any live videos. Your appearance alone is enough to change the mind of any potential investor and make them run away.
Iv caught up on things from RPGCODEX and wish to give my final conclusion/thoughts to this GM deal. My conclusion is that you are way in over your head; Honorable that you wish to continue on to fulfill broken promises, and see this through until the very end. You James Proctor have been working for FREE for 3-years as a volunteer programmer, with a promise of receiving a small percentage after the game releases. What are you trying to prove at this point? Greed Monger was Appletons Dream/Scam.
The money is gone you do not have the talent on hand to continue building a game. While you have new Q/A & Programmers joining you do not have any 3D-Modelers or Animators or skilled Level-Designers. $100,000 allowed you to pay for the missing skill; The "Contractors" and I quote you "We paid around $20,000 to the guy who created our Custom Housing Modules. We have a world builder who worked on our old world who we paid so much to per climate that he did. We have 3d modelers, animators, and riggers who we hired to do some specific tasks. We hired the texture artist / UI Artist to create our UI and Icons."
Let's be real you don't have the money and skill on hand to continue development; Greed Monger had money and paid for these contractors who came and eventually left. Earlier you accounted $21,000 and yet above you said on RPGCODEX you paid one guy around $20,000 for a housing module [Which was actually seen in the video at the end] [Sort of looked like a Landmark Claim] Furthermore what everyone has seen on the video yesterday was an incredible disappointment; even for those who have never seen or heard of the game before such as myself.
3-Years with $100,000 and that was when appleton had money to throw around at "Contractors". In your conversations earlier this year in 2015. MMO-Interactive was not even fully registered and might not even be today. You can still gain credibility and respect if you make realistic choices. Continuing to build upon an MMO at this point is just a kids dream "I want to build an MMO!" Everyone at this point will only smirk and sort of laugh at the continued development on GM. You said on your MMO-Interactive forums [May 5th] that you had intentions of rebranding the game. Do not rebrand it just drop it like a stone and then rise to the top under a new name/project.
Your time is worth more than this; and you are free of appletons shackles.
An RPG-Codex staff wrote the following words which I also agree with: "You should skip the MMO "developing" and switch to something where your energy is used more efficient." You are leading this whole thing; a simple volunteer programmer with a 'Company' that may or may not even be registered properly. You don't have the money and the skill on hand to continue development as said above. I'm sure you already had intentions of rebranding and continuing on; but what im trying to point out is that you should just ABANDON and DROP GM and start your own thing. [Plays "Let It Go"]
The assets and licensing is still yours; so at least that is a good start to things. Some fruitful things have come from working at Electric Crow for free it would seem. Take those benefits and move on.
...And for the love of god drop the MMO tag/idea build a simple game that hosts up to 10 players or something. MMO's aren't exactly thriving lately. Also I wish to add the gameplay video was not lagging due to poor specs on the streamers side as claimed, but instead due too poor optimization. It honestly looks like a game that was made over 7+ years ago, and any computer would be able to handle it. [last sentence; is just what I believe] xD
-----Tapping out!-----
OhhPaigey; you need to watch everything after 1:00:00~ lol~ srsly! >:
Wait, wait, wait. So of the seven people on that video, there are you, Joel, John, Tyler and Paul. That's five of the seven. The other two are Dark (who's covering it for rpgcodex) and PFO (who wasn't even a backer). You did a hangout for the members of your community and literally none of them showed up. The first law of holes applies here: if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.
___________________________
Have flask; will travel.
To be fair, they only posted the news on the official website just minutes before the Hangout actually started. As poorly as this reflects on the current interest in the game's development, it's largely their own fault. They also never pointed the readers of the news to the Hangout stream or linked the YouTube video. Even Joel commented on how short-notice it was in the video. Anyone who uses the official website or forums as a source of news still either doesn't know the Hangout happened, and/or has no idea where there YouTube video for it is located.
There were only two people in the Hangout that weren't part of the "team", and neither of them were backers apparently.
The only member of the "team" who even spoke was Joel. James didn't even have the gumption to keep his video live, much less actually speak to people who had questions for him.
It was less of a "Hangout" and more like the "Joel and PFO Show".
I'd pay for more PFO, honestly.
To James and Joel:
Everything has been said about the project that can be said. James and Joel you have been given advise by total strangers you don't know. But if you take a few steps back you will realise your names will forever be tainted by the Greedmonger debacle. Instead of staying in the pit of tar, you should step out of it, and wash it of your skins. Staying in the pit will just let you sink further and further.
Give the IP back to Jason Appleton. It's his problem, and his problem alone.
You counted the money and saw that $75,000 could not be accounted for. If you really want to help the backers you contact Kickstarter, show them your contract with Appleton, and tell them about the missing money. Ask them for legal advise, heck they might even help you.
As long as you keep developing Greedmonger you are hindering any legal actions backers of the project might ever want to take.
It's been several days since the Hangout originally aired, and there's still no news updates on the official website or forums and Joel is still just as absent as before.
Guess you intend to continue keeping your backers in the dark. They shouldn't be surprised by now, after three years and no playable alpha and only a slap-shod video to show for all their money ...
(EDIT: Looks like Joel at least commented on the YouTube video of the hangout, just to apologize for his sniffles, though. Guess he still can't be bothered to actually post to the official forums to update backers on their recent "considerations".)
SWTOR Referral Link
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If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
So ... How was the weekly hangout this week?
Or was there one?
"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)
LOL
Last update I see is that they have a new delay in shipping the shirts. Now they need to get bags to ship them in...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Had to come here and show you guys this:
PS: This is another 10 Minute asset store template done with Unity.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
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That is kind of disappointing. I have no interest in GM but I did believe that James genuinely wants to get the game done.
Now he starts some other random project...
After all i have seen i think they neither have the money nor the knowledge to develop any type of game, much less an open world survival or mmorpg.
It will be interesting to see if they are going to try to crowd fund that "survival game".
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
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I do/did want to get the game done... The vast majority of the community that we talk to however seems to want us to drop GM and work on our own IP that would actually stand a chance of being Successful. However all of that aside we are doomed to fail with out doing something to get funding. There fore we are looking into doing some smaller side Projects... They will help us to get some projects complete, see how our team works together, and hopefully be good enough to start bringing in some funding for larger projects like GM.
The post that was posted here about my Zombie Survival prototype was a post I made to my Friends on my personal Facebook page just showing my friends what I've been up to. It was NOT meant for public viewing. But since it was made public first of all YES it started out as a Template from the Asset Store. It was a really good foundation for the type of Game I am prototyping. I have put in hours of work over the last couple days networking it and adding features. It's FAR more then what the template comes with. I have Networked the entire Character Controller Player Movement is completely synced up, I added UniStorm to it and created a Networking Plugin for UniStorm so the Server controls the entire Day/Night cycle and Weather Generation. I've added a Command Console and started added Commands that can be used to change the weather and other things from the Client. I added a Chat System with support for different Chat Channels, Custom Text Colors, ect. I created a Custom Mob Spawning System so that the Server can spawn the mobs and sync it all up with the clients. You can shoot and kill Zombies and once they are dead they will despawn after 20 seconds. I have started on a Inventory and Loot System though I still have a ways to go on it.
Company Owner
MMO Interactive