I'm always confused when someone says they want "skill" tested in a video game. Just exactly which "skill" are we talking about?
Are we talking about physical skills like Reflexes and Hand eye coordination? Is it Proper posture and the ability to keep your hands on the home row? Is it just basic Typing skills? There aren't a lot of physical "skills" that a video game can tap into. The truth is given the current state of computer inter-phase (keyboard, mouse, game-pad etc) a true test of "skill", at least physical skill is nearly impossible. In the end, to the extent it is possible, people deride the game as "twitchy" and that "he with the fastest inter-phase and graphics card/processor wins."
Perhaps they mean mental "skills" like Logic and Reasoning or Observation and Learning. Those could be tested giving the current state of inter-phase, but then there wouldn't be any reason to add complex graphics. If this was the case then puzzle games would be the most popular thing ever. In fact I'm pretty sure most video games wouldn't have been invented because pencils and paper are enough to play most logic and puzzle games.
Perhaps they mean Social "skills" like communication and cooperation. To test these all we need is a mic and/or a keyboard. However I think that if people really wanted this "skill" tested then the game, which is a MASSIVE MULTIPLAYER online game would require you to build the biggest faction to "win". In other words it would focus more on politics/interpersonal relationships and power bloc building rather than the ability to defeat a given number of foes by saying the proper words to one another at the proper time. Truthfully the group is more efficient if everyone knows what to do and when to do it without being told, so these "skills" aren't really being tested.
So, for starters lets see just exactly which "skills" to which we are referring.
Simply put the "skills" that are tapped into by a standard video game are; 1) the ability to recognize a situation in which you should mash a certain button on your inter-phase; 2) If you can't recognize the situation or mash the proper button with your own faculties, then you should consult one of many wikis for answers and clues; 3) Finally, if you are in a game that requires group play (something I sometimes wonder if people really want in their gaming) you need to find a group of people who will tolerate your presence and with whom you can achieve common goals with as little actual communication as possible.
Ok, now that we've defined our terms why isn't "skill" being tested in video games.
Well first off the definition kind of answers that question for us already. The current state of computing inter-phase doesn't allow for too much in the way of "skill" to be tested without the game turning into some kind of math test or logic game test.
Also the stereotypical gamer might not be the most "social" animal roaming around out there. Lets face facts here. If they truly made a game that was everything we hoped for the video game would become our social life, while true social animals are out in the real world meeting one another and reproducing. Think I'm lying? Ever try to tell your non gaming friends about your in game experiences? Give that a try and watch their eyes glaze over just like yours did when your friend who is into beads told you about their latest beading project or you friend who loves Fantasy Sports told you about his latest Fantasy Sports draft. More to the point, do you have non gaming friends? (This isn't a "bad" thing necessarily since people tend to hang out with people who share common interests, so don't get your back up. I'm not calling you anti-social. I'm calling you selectively social.)
But the real point has been mentioned above. If we had a true skill based competition then there could, by definition be only one winner. The terrible thing is that they would probably be the same people who were the best at that "skill" in Real Life. If the video game tested the "skill" of individual straight line speed for 100 meters, Usaine Bolt would win every time and the rest of us would be 20 seconds behind him and screaming for a Bolt Nerf. Sword and Axe "skill" would be won by Fencers and Lumberjacks or maybe LARPers. Scientists and PhDs would win the battles of brain "skills" and politicians and prom queens would win the social "skills" battles. In other words the people that have natural talent for a certain "skill" and put in the required 10,000 hours of practice to reach pro-level proficiency in that "skill" will "win" the game and the rest of us would be labeled as "casuals" because we've got jobs and kids and unlike the tippy top people of any "skill" we don't sacrifice EVERYTHING ELSE to be the best at that "skill".
So be careful about wishing for "skills" tests. First off its just not possible given the current state of computing to test much in the way of "skill" and I'm not looking to break a sweat during my horse around time. If I was I'd have taken up wrestling or MMA. Second if we went to a "skill" based standard the same people who win in Real Life would dominate the cyber world as well. And thus maybe our dumb-down fantasy games where everyone gets to be a hero isn't so bad. Its the one place where everyone can be a star and that, beyond the fact you get to live out your sword swinging and gun toting fantasies, is the biggest draw of the cyber world.
Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising.
So new players can ease into the game. If the game is too hard or complicated less people will play it. Most gamers now a days want a fun rewarding experience without the brain training.
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
As others have mentioned, RPGs are often largely based on your character's skill more than the player's.
The point that I'd make, that probably seems obvious to some but not so much to others(particularly twitch gamers) is that the building of the character's abilities requires knowledge, and then requires skill to execute the advantages of the build. The better you know how to build, the less skill you "require" to overcome a challenge. So if you know how to stack, min-max, and synergize your character's abilities, the less you'll have to run around like an idiot kiting and avoiding "red zones" to survive. And if you can do that anyway, then sure, X game seems remarkably easy.
The only important thing for me is that knowledge and skill DOES matter in the MMORPG I'm playing. Sure, I can spam a bunch of skills to eventually drop a mob. Or I can know what I'm doing and drop it in half the time. I avoid games where you level and "new abilities" are just your old abilities which do 10% more damage. Fortunately, those games are fewer and fewer.
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
I've had the opposite experience. With the exception of a few rare instances, I've found almost every EQ/WOW style MMO over the past few years to be completely faceroll until cap when the game suddenly shifts to raiding. Some notable exceptions:
LOTRO Fellowship combos
Chronicle of Spellborn's combat wheel
Guild Wars 2 combos and finishers
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
I've had the opposite experience. With the exception of a few rare instances, I've found almost every EQ/WOW style MMO over the past few years to be completely faceroll until cap when the game suddenly shifts to raiding. Some notable exceptions:
LOTRO Fellowship combos
Chronicle of Spellborn's combat wheel
Guild Wars 2 combos and finishers
Sure. Because you're not unskilled at playing MMO's. Years of personal experience have made it fairly easy for you to pick up a new MMORPG and build competent characters early on and formidable ones as you get more and more familiar. Your skill and knowledge matters.
Meanwhile, I suspect you, or anyone else would have a different experience if they logged into the game as their first MMO.
Which leads to my answer to the OP's post. MMO developers don't just want vets paying; they want new players, too. And unlike single player games, difficulty sliders are a tricky proposition for MMO's. IMO CoX is probably the best of but a few MMO's that have pulled it off, and did so by being heavily instanced.
Not to say it's impossible to do it otherwise. Seems to me GW2 could do this by allowing you to control your capped level more when you return to lower level areas, for example. Allow you to run a level 50 area at level 45 for bigger loot drops, for example.
Because the RPG as a whole was more important than the 'G' part. Old MMO's were built to emulate table top RPG's and their turn based combat systems - rolling dice isn't much of a skill. Combat was really about who your character was and how they had been built and the story behind them. The idea of MMORPG's being more gamey is recent. But as MMO's simplified the character building aspect, the entire purpose of being an RPG started to get lost. The 'skill' used to be in building a character, but the interest changed that by allowing people to pop on to the internet, find the "best" build and everyone became the same. Then we got dps meters, so everyone played the same build, but now they also pressed the same buttons in specific orders.
So now people are looking to action/arcade style combat as "skill" because they've forgotten why MMO's existed in the first place. For people to play a virtual table top RPG.
Exactly.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
I've had the opposite experience. With the exception of a few rare instances, I've found almost every EQ/WOW style MMO over the past few years to be completely faceroll until cap when the game suddenly shifts to raiding. Some notable exceptions:
LOTRO Fellowship combos
Chronicle of Spellborn's combat wheel
Guild Wars 2 combos and finishers
Sure. Because you're not unskilled at playing MMO's. Years of personal experience have made it fairly easy for you to pick up a new MMORPG and build competent characters early on and formidable ones as you get more and more familiar. Your skill and knowledge matters.
Meanwhile, I suspect you, or anyone else would have a different experience if they logged into the game as their first MMO.
Which leads to my answer to the OP's post. MMO developers don't just want vets paying; they want new players, too. And unlike single player games, difficulty sliders are a tricky proposition for MMO's. IMO CoX is probably the best of but a few MMO's that have pulled it off, and did so by being heavily instanced.
Not to say it's impossible to do it otherwise. Seems to me GW2 could do this by allowing you to control your capped level more when you return to lower level areas, for example. Allow you to run a level 50 area at level 45 for bigger loot drops, for example.
Not to mention the parents who buy MMO's for their kids or let them play on their accounts. There are nine years olds playing some MMO's, would it be fair to expect them to play like someone who's twentythree and been playing MMO's for five or more years. They do have to make it accessible to a general audience or else it can become niche hardcore.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
There are plenty of games MMORPGs that require skill. They just aren't the popular ones. Wanting difficult content, is a niche trait. Once a player gets over the realization that they do not want what the masses want, life is much better.
I can fly higher than an aeroplane. And I have the voice of a thousand hurricanes. Hurt - Wars
I think Wildstar would like to have a word with the OP. They featured some of the most difficult raiding in the history of MMOs... and went down in flames. People say they want hard content until someone actually offers hard content.
Well, that or they bitch about how it's not the right type of hard content like those nerds that feel leveling should be extremely difficult but don't care about how hard endgame is. For them if your leveling is easy then the whole game is a joke and you're contributing to the degeneration of society by letting "unworthy" people reach max level.
I never played Wildstar and know close to nothing about it. But do you really think it's doing poorly because it's difficult? Other genres have some very difficult games that are also very popular.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
I think Wildstar would like to have a word with the OP. They featured some of the most difficult raiding in the history of MMOs... and went down in flames. People say they want hard content until someone actually offers hard content.
Well, that or they bitch about how it's not the right type of hard content like those nerds that feel leveling should be extremely difficult but don't care about how hard endgame is. For them if your leveling is easy then the whole game is a joke and you're contributing to the degeneration of society by letting "unworthy" people reach max level.
I never played Wildstar and know close to nothing about it. But do you really think it's doing poorly because it's difficult? Other genres have some very difficult games that are also very popular.
As someone who played it, yes. I think it wouldn't have lost so many players at the start if the attunement requirements weren't so crazy. You needed a gold on every dungeon in order to attune, and that meant perfect runs.
In WoW that's no problem, but as mentioned before, the game is difficult. I know a lot of people who have been playing mmos for a long time that still had a rough go of attunement in the game.
Also, that would require someone to get to the point where attunement was the goal and again, the content is difficult.
People are very vocal about wanting a game with a challenge, but when they get it? Ragequits.
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
I've had the opposite experience. With the exception of a few rare instances, I've found almost every EQ/WOW style MMO over the past few years to be completely faceroll until cap when the game suddenly shifts to raiding. Some notable exceptions:
LOTRO Fellowship combos
Chronicle of Spellborn's combat wheel
Guild Wars 2 combos and finishers
Sure. Because you're not unskilled at playing MMO's. Years of personal experience have made it fairly easy for you to pick up a new MMORPG and build competent characters early on and formidable ones as you get more and more familiar. Your skill and knowledge matters.
Meanwhile, I suspect you, or anyone else would have a different experience if they logged into the game as their first MMO.
Which leads to my answer to the OP's post. MMO developers don't just want vets paying; they want new players, too. And unlike single player games, difficulty sliders are a tricky proposition for MMO's. IMO CoX is probably the best of but a few MMO's that have pulled it off, and did so by being heavily instanced.
Not to say it's impossible to do it otherwise. Seems to me GW2 could do this by allowing you to control your capped level more when you return to lower level areas, for example. Allow you to run a level 50 area at level 45 for bigger loot drops, for example.
Not to mention the parents who buy MMO's for their kids or let them play on their accounts. There are nine years olds playing some MMO's, would it be fair to expect them to play like someone who's twentythree and been playing MMO's for five or more years. They do have to make it accessible to a general audience or else it can become niche hardcore.
Yep! That's why every ski resort has a bunny slope. And why, if a ski resort only had one hill, it would probably look more like the bunny slope than it would Murder Mountain.
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
I've had the opposite experience. With the exception of a few rare instances, I've found almost every EQ/WOW style MMO over the past few years to be completely faceroll until cap when the game suddenly shifts to raiding. Some notable exceptions:
LOTRO Fellowship combos
Chronicle of Spellborn's combat wheel
Guild Wars 2 combos and finishers
Sure. Because you're not unskilled at playing MMO's. Years of personal experience have made it fairly easy for you to pick up a new MMORPG and build competent characters early on and formidable ones as you get more and more familiar. Your skill and knowledge matters.
Meanwhile, I suspect you, or anyone else would have a different experience if they logged into the game as their first MMO.
Which leads to my answer to the OP's post. MMO developers don't just want vets paying; they want new players, too. And unlike single player games, difficulty sliders are a tricky proposition for MMO's. IMO CoX is probably the best of but a few MMO's that have pulled it off, and did so by being heavily instanced.
Not to say it's impossible to do it otherwise. Seems to me GW2 could do this by allowing you to control your capped level more when you return to lower level areas, for example. Allow you to run a level 50 area at level 45 for bigger loot drops, for example.
Ok, in that light, I can see your point.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Maybe it's not that MMORPGs require no skill, maybe it's just that you are SO skilled that it seems easy. I remember when Mario was like super difficult. Now I beat it in like 15 minutes.
Sometimes we need to manufacture our own difficulty. For me, I play laying down in bed when presents a couple unique challenges. First is that you're lying down. Second is that the mouse slopes toward your body. Third, sometimes the dogs just lay down on your mouse randomly (DBM does not help with this). Fourth, depending on your view distance, chat can be completely illegible. Fifth, you can't vent because your wife can somehow wake up out of a dead sleep when you whisper, yet sleeps through an entire action movie, no problem. Finally, if you play late enough, you will fall asleep, people will get angry, hilarity will ensue, and if you manage to survive you'll have fun stories to tell. That requires skill.
People are very vocal about wanting a game with a challenge, but when they get it? Ragequits.
Because people want different things from games .. and difficulties are in the eyes of the beholder. It is silly to assume every player, even if they are capable, want to spend time learning a mere game.
It is better to put in a slider, and let people choose.
MMO's are easy because they want the most amount of people to play their game as possible, of course they would like to give something for everyone, but hardcore gaming is a very niche market. I like hardcore gaming or insane difficulties but I play that with single player games like Dark Souls and I get the freedom to turn it off and on when I please. MMO's do not have that luxery, if you're raiding, you're kinda committed.
Yes, it is all about the money in this decision, its to their benefit also, it basically means they can continue to grow the game and secure years and years worth of work. They all have families to feed bare in mind.
As much as I always see the require no skill comments, or hard difficulty it just makes me shake my head. There is no money in you, not long term and for a niche community with a game that requires large injections of cash to one it just isnt viable.
Checkers has been around since 3000BC and it really can't get any simpler than that, yet it withstood the test of time and is still going on strong. People have more than enough complications in real life, why add to it with something that supposed to be enjoyed?
Sure. Because you're not unskilled at playing MMO's. Years of personal experience have made it fairly easy for you to pick up a new MMORPG and build competent characters early on and formidable ones as you get more and more familiar. Your skill and knowledge matters.
Meanwhile, I suspect you, or anyone else would have a different experience if they logged into the game as their first MMO.
Which leads to my answer to the OP's post. MMO developers don't just want vets paying; they want new players, too. And unlike single player games, difficulty sliders are a tricky proposition for MMO's. IMO CoX is probably the best of but a few MMO's that have pulled it off, and did so by being heavily instanced.
Not to say it's impossible to do it otherwise. Seems to me GW2 could do this by allowing you to control your capped level more when you return to lower level areas, for example. Allow you to run a level 50 area at level 45 for bigger loot drops, for example.
Ok, in that light, I can see your point.
Pretend you're a new player. You don't know what a mezz is. You don't know what a root is. To you, a DoT is a Warner Sister, a HoT is also a Warner Sister (you know you wanted her), and "A pot" is what you're smoking when you're playing.
A buff is something gamers generally aren't, and a debuff is something that a-hole Shia is.
I won't for a moment say that MMO's aren't a bit easy(Like DoT), but so far, IMO, they seem on par with easy versions of single player games.
All MMOs require skill. Sure some are easier than others but like it was mentioned before, years of experience in other games make it easier.
Look at it this way. Why do a lot of people not do PUGs, but try to do a guild group? The answer I hear mostly is because the players suck. If they suck, that means the game requires some skill.
I remember I went back to WoW a couple years ago, think it was for panda expansion. I started a new character, had a few heritage items, leveled up by doing dungeons. Even in the low/mid level dungeons, some people sucked. Couldn't heal, couldn't tank. Some of these people were even in full sets of heritage (or is it legacy) gear. They just didn't know how to play their characters. They didn't know when to use certain skills.
I guess you and I aren't playing the same game. I just got out of a 24 man raid in FFXIV that's supposed to be for the casual gamers and supposed to be fairly easy, and there were people screwing up left and right. We had a wipe on every boss and eventually a vote to abandon the instance passed because it was so terrible.
Our idea of skill doesn't always align with the 99%.
Its rather easy: Casuals. Its where the market is now, and casuals tend to be the whinest bunch of players in gaming these days. If anything is remotely diffcult they whine and moan until it gets dumbed down for them. Casuals also hate to have to spend any time commitment, its why most mmo's these days you hit lv cap in like 2 days.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Comments
I'm always confused when someone says they want "skill" tested in a video game. Just exactly which "skill" are we talking about?
Are we talking about physical skills like Reflexes and Hand eye coordination? Is it Proper posture and the ability to keep your hands on the home row? Is it just basic Typing skills? There aren't a lot of physical "skills" that a video game can tap into. The truth is given the current state of computer inter-phase (keyboard, mouse, game-pad etc) a true test of "skill", at least physical skill is nearly impossible. In the end, to the extent it is possible, people deride the game as "twitchy" and that "he with the fastest inter-phase and graphics card/processor wins."
Perhaps they mean mental "skills" like Logic and Reasoning or Observation and Learning. Those could be tested giving the current state of inter-phase, but then there wouldn't be any reason to add complex graphics. If this was the case then puzzle games would be the most popular thing ever. In fact I'm pretty sure most video games wouldn't have been invented because pencils and paper are enough to play most logic and puzzle games.
Perhaps they mean Social "skills" like communication and cooperation. To test these all we need is a mic and/or a keyboard. However I think that if people really wanted this "skill" tested then the game, which is a MASSIVE MULTIPLAYER online game would require you to build the biggest faction to "win". In other words it would focus more on politics/interpersonal relationships and power bloc building rather than the ability to defeat a given number of foes by saying the proper words to one another at the proper time. Truthfully the group is more efficient if everyone knows what to do and when to do it without being told, so these "skills" aren't really being tested.
So, for starters lets see just exactly which "skills" to which we are referring.
Simply put the "skills" that are tapped into by a standard video game are; 1) the ability to recognize a situation in which you should mash a certain button on your inter-phase; 2) If you can't recognize the situation or mash the proper button with your own faculties, then you should consult one of many wikis for answers and clues; 3) Finally, if you are in a game that requires group play (something I sometimes wonder if people really want in their gaming) you need to find a group of people who will tolerate your presence and with whom you can achieve common goals with as little actual communication as possible.
Ok, now that we've defined our terms why isn't "skill" being tested in video games.
Well first off the definition kind of answers that question for us already. The current state of computing inter-phase doesn't allow for too much in the way of "skill" to be tested without the game turning into some kind of math test or logic game test.
Also the stereotypical gamer might not be the most "social" animal roaming around out there. Lets face facts here. If they truly made a game that was everything we hoped for the video game would become our social life, while true social animals are out in the real world meeting one another and reproducing. Think I'm lying? Ever try to tell your non gaming friends about your in game experiences? Give that a try and watch their eyes glaze over just like yours did when your friend who is into beads told you about their latest beading project or you friend who loves Fantasy Sports told you about his latest Fantasy Sports draft. More to the point, do you have non gaming friends? (This isn't a "bad" thing necessarily since people tend to hang out with people who share common interests, so don't get your back up. I'm not calling you anti-social. I'm calling you selectively social.)
But the real point has been mentioned above. If we had a true skill based competition then there could, by definition be only one winner. The terrible thing is that they would probably be the same people who were the best at that "skill" in Real Life. If the video game tested the "skill" of individual straight line speed for 100 meters, Usaine Bolt would win every time and the rest of us would be 20 seconds behind him and screaming for a Bolt Nerf. Sword and Axe "skill" would be won by Fencers and Lumberjacks or maybe LARPers. Scientists and PhDs would win the battles of brain "skills" and politicians and prom queens would win the social "skills" battles. In other words the people that have natural talent for a certain "skill" and put in the required 10,000 hours of practice to reach pro-level proficiency in that "skill" will "win" the game and the rest of us would be labeled as "casuals" because we've got jobs and kids and unlike the tippy top people of any "skill" we don't sacrifice EVERYTHING ELSE to be the best at that "skill".
So be careful about wishing for "skills" tests. First off its just not possible given the current state of computing to test much in the way of "skill" and I'm not looking to break a sweat during my horse around time. If I was I'd have taken up wrestling or MMA. Second if we went to a "skill" based standard the same people who win in Real Life would dominate the cyber world as well. And thus maybe our dumb-down fantasy games where everyone gets to be a hero isn't so bad. Its the one place where everyone can be a star and that, beyond the fact you get to live out your sword swinging and gun toting fantasies, is the biggest draw of the cyber world.
Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising.
Other than during the first introductory levels of an MMORPG, where the game is purposefully made "faceroll easy", I don't think I've played an MMO that didn't require at least some rudimentary skill to play. And more importantly, rewarded those who knew how to build, and knew how to play what they built.
As others have mentioned, RPGs are often largely based on your character's skill more than the player's.
The point that I'd make, that probably seems obvious to some but not so much to others(particularly twitch gamers) is that the building of the character's abilities requires knowledge, and then requires skill to execute the advantages of the build. The better you know how to build, the less skill you "require" to overcome a challenge. So if you know how to stack, min-max, and synergize your character's abilities, the less you'll have to run around like an idiot kiting and avoiding "red zones" to survive. And if you can do that anyway, then sure, X game seems remarkably easy.
The only important thing for me is that knowledge and skill DOES matter in the MMORPG I'm playing. Sure, I can spam a bunch of skills to eventually drop a mob. Or I can know what I'm doing and drop it in half the time. I avoid games where you level and "new abilities" are just your old abilities which do 10% more damage. Fortunately, those games are fewer and fewer.
I've had the opposite experience. With the exception of a few rare instances, I've found almost every EQ/WOW style MMO over the past few years to be completely faceroll until cap when the game suddenly shifts to raiding. Some notable exceptions:
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Sure. Because you're not unskilled at playing MMO's. Years of personal experience have made it fairly easy for you to pick up a new MMORPG and build competent characters early on and formidable ones as you get more and more familiar. Your skill and knowledge matters.
Meanwhile, I suspect you, or anyone else would have a different experience if they logged into the game as their first MMO.
Which leads to my answer to the OP's post. MMO developers don't just want vets paying; they want new players, too. And unlike single player games, difficulty sliders are a tricky proposition for MMO's. IMO CoX is probably the best of but a few MMO's that have pulled it off, and did so by being heavily instanced.
Not to say it's impossible to do it otherwise. Seems to me GW2 could do this by allowing you to control your capped level more when you return to lower level areas, for example. Allow you to run a level 50 area at level 45 for bigger loot drops, for example.
Exactly.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Not to mention the parents who buy MMO's for their kids or let them play on their accounts. There are nine years olds playing some MMO's, would it be fair to expect them to play like someone who's twentythree and been playing MMO's for five or more years. They do have to make it accessible to a general audience or else it can become niche hardcore.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I can fly higher than an aeroplane.
And I have the voice of a thousand hurricanes.
Hurt - Wars
I never played Wildstar and know close to nothing about it. But do you really think it's doing poorly because it's difficult? Other genres have some very difficult games that are also very popular.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
As someone who played it, yes. I think it wouldn't have lost so many players at the start if the attunement requirements weren't so crazy. You needed a gold on every dungeon in order to attune, and that meant perfect runs.
In WoW that's no problem, but as mentioned before, the game is difficult. I know a lot of people who have been playing mmos for a long time that still had a rough go of attunement in the game.
Also, that would require someone to get to the point where attunement was the goal and again, the content is difficult.
People are very vocal about wanting a game with a challenge, but when they get it? Ragequits.
Yep! That's why every ski resort has a bunny slope. And why, if a ski resort only had one hill, it would probably look more like the bunny slope than it would Murder Mountain.
Ok, in that light, I can see your point.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Maybe it's not that MMORPGs require no skill, maybe it's just that you are SO skilled that it seems easy. I remember when Mario was like super difficult. Now I beat it in like 15 minutes.
Sometimes we need to manufacture our own difficulty. For me, I play laying down in bed when presents a couple unique challenges. First is that you're lying down. Second is that the mouse slopes toward your body. Third, sometimes the dogs just lay down on your mouse randomly (DBM does not help with this). Fourth, depending on your view distance, chat can be completely illegible. Fifth, you can't vent because your wife can somehow wake up out of a dead sleep when you whisper, yet sleeps through an entire action movie, no problem. Finally, if you play late enough, you will fall asleep, people will get angry, hilarity will ensue, and if you manage to survive you'll have fun stories to tell. That requires skill.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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Because people want different things from games .. and difficulties are in the eyes of the beholder. It is silly to assume every player, even if they are capable, want to spend time learning a mere game.
It is better to put in a slider, and let people choose.
The topic is a bit extreme.
Most mmorpg I play have skill element in it.
Eventhough 90% of the content require no skill, there is still those 10% that require skill.
If it is too easy buy 5 account and try play all of them at same time.
MMO's are easy because they want the most amount of people to play their game as possible, of course they would like to give something for everyone, but hardcore gaming is a very niche market. I like hardcore gaming or insane difficulties but I play that with single player games like Dark Souls and I get the freedom to turn it off and on when I please. MMO's do not have that luxery, if you're raiding, you're kinda committed.
Yes, it is all about the money in this decision, its to their benefit also, it basically means they can continue to grow the game and secure years and years worth of work. They all have families to feed bare in mind.
As much as I always see the require no skill comments, or hard difficulty it just makes me shake my head. There is no money in you, not long term and for a niche community with a game that requires large injections of cash to one it just isnt viable.
Pretend you're a new player. You don't know what a mezz is. You don't know what a root is. To you, a DoT is a Warner Sister, a HoT is also a Warner Sister
(you know you wanted her), and "A pot" is what you're smoking when you're playing.
A buff is something gamers generally aren't, and a debuff is something that a-hole Shia is.
I won't for a moment say that MMO's aren't a bit easy(Like DoT), but so far, IMO, they seem on par with easy versions of single player games.
All MMOs require skill. Sure some are easier than others but like it was mentioned before, years of experience in other games make it easier.
Look at it this way. Why do a lot of people not do PUGs, but try to do a guild group? The answer I hear mostly is because the players suck. If they suck, that means the game requires some skill.
I remember I went back to WoW a couple years ago, think it was for panda expansion. I started a new character, had a few heritage items, leveled up by doing dungeons. Even in the low/mid level dungeons, some people sucked. Couldn't heal, couldn't tank. Some of these people were even in full sets of heritage (or is it legacy) gear. They just didn't know how to play their characters. They didn't know when to use certain skills.
I guess you and I aren't playing the same game. I just got out of a 24 man raid in FFXIV that's supposed to be for the casual gamers and supposed to be fairly easy, and there were people screwing up left and right. We had a wipe on every boss and eventually a vote to abandon the instance passed because it was so terrible.
Our idea of skill doesn't always align with the 99%.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!
Because these days the time it takes to learn a game can't be too much greater than the time it takes before you start enjoying it.
Otherwise people will just give up.
This isn't work you are talking about mate. It is a GAME. You are not trying to learn Brazilian Jujitsu or something here.