Some of us also like end games that don't involve beating on things.
edit coming soon...
---------------------------------- MMOs Retired From: Earth and Beyond, Project Entropia, There, A Tale in the Desert, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, Eve Online, City of Heroes/Villains.
i dont think anyone can really dispute WoW is a great game.
i liked it for awhile too. the thing with it is, its not built for the power gamer. tradeskills are easily maxed, lvl is easy to get to.
its just not built for the people who play >40 hours a week, and fortunatly for them 99% of the players dont play that much. personaly, i do play that much and im bored with it but i understand i play too much and im the minority, and most likely most people who spend time reading a site about mmorpgs are pretty hardcore too.
so for every one of us who think that the game is severly lacking in alot of areas, there are 1000 people who are oblivious to what those areas even are.
Originally posted by Agent_X7 Opinion: o·pin·ion - n - A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof. (World of Warcraft sucks, WoW has no endgame, WoW let me down, Blizzard just takes fanboys' money) Fact: - n - Knowledge or information based on real occurrences, Something demonstrated to exist or known to have existed. (World of Warcraft has over 2 million paying subscribers.) I find a continual source of amusement to come to these forums and see people just throwing their opinion out, trying to convert other people to their way of thinking. It's almost like a religion for some of you people. Your game sucks, mine rocks, you are wrong, I am right. Give it a rest. Some people love WoW, some people don't. That's life, boys and girls, it happens with anything. However, I don't really see a need for people who don't like it to bash it every chance they get. In fact, you look rather silly and immature for doing so. Especially since you come in here throwing your opinions around like they are God's honest truth against the cold, hard fact that over 2 million people must find the game somewhat palatable, or they wouldn't be paying for it month after month. I didn't like like Everquest II. I found it to contain too much downtime for my taste, and I wasn't thrilled with the crafting system. I will tell anyone why I didn't like the game, but I won't start attacking people who do like it and shoving my opinion on them like some sort of raving, religious converter. I don't see why anyone with an ounce of maturity should act like that. So when someone posts up something like this, try to do what your mothers taught you (or should have, anyway): If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. Or even come here and just say, "Gee, 2 million subscribers, Nice job, but I didn't like the game because..." Don't come in here and call everyone who likes the game a drooling fanboy, because it just isn't true, and you have no facts to back it up with.
i could not have said this better in my wildest dreams hehe, i agree 100% with this post.... i would just like to add that it seems like the people that like to bash games like wow or gw are just bitter because the game they like to play dosent get the same publicity or ratings their game gets so they feel the need to bash it. i could be wrong but thats just my opinion =]
Originally posted by boboslave You have said that you DID like it, and then you DIDN'T. Which i find interesting, sorry for badgering
OK, let me spell it out for you. Read slowly and carefully............................
I was led to believe by Blizzard that the endgame would be extremely exciting and enjoyable. During this period, I enjoyed playing WoW immensely, because I was looking forward to the implementation of the endgame and I enjoyed developing characters to play in said endgame. This was the period that I DID like the game.
With me so far? OK. Now on to the next part..................................
When it started to become apparent that Blizzard had no intention of ever implementing anything like the endgame they'd advertised, I realised I had a selection of high level characters that were completely useless unless I wanted to spend months doing mindlessly dull instance runs and farming "honor". This resulted in me NO LONGER LIKING THE GAME.
I hope I've made it nice and simple for you to understand.
Originally posted by boboslave Indeed you have firemagic, there was however, no need to be so condescending, i am merely attempting to understand the opinions of others.Have a good one, and i hope you find what you are looking for out of your entertainment.Cheers
Please accept my apologies for any hard feelings. However I felt there was a very real need to be condescending since you were effectively asking me to repeat myself.
Something like SWG except without the crappyness :P. A very good crafting system, set up shops and take orders and hire people to go hunting for hides or special parts you need. There are also player cities, cruising down the neighborhood and have a friend wave you down and tell you he is having a party in the local cantina, or get a message from the mayor that the city needs you because the evil imperials are attacking a base. I also like things a bit more dynamic, taking over cities and destroying buildings, organized raids that actaully accomplish something instead of killing off NPCs that respawn in 5 minutes :P. Pretty much I like to have an effect on the game world, be a famous crafter or take over areas or destroy things essential to the other faction(s). Ok I've gotten a bit disorganized but here is what I'm getting at:
Little sense of community(WoW is very solo friendly so this I should have expected) Little sense of accomplishment/ownership(we have our equipment and our level, not much else)
---------------------------------- MMOs Retired From: Earth and Beyond, Project Entropia, There, A Tale in the Desert, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, Eve Online, City of Heroes/Villains.
I think many people would like WoW to be more dynamic, myself included, Bliz has said though that it's not really possible for them, as it would be difficult to manage and a little un-fair to players who are impacted by others' actions (such as burning a town to the ground - that would be fun though).
Given the money that they are racking in, you'd think they could do something!!
Their less than spectacular world events haven't really rocked my world that's for sure.
Given the size of WoW (number of servers and players) I can understand why it would be difficult for them, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't work towards reaching their limitations. At the moment, Bliz doesn't seem to be anywhere near their limits, even within their own rules.
* Instanced housing for guilds in particular, should be possible. * More Quest triggers (like stitches - god i love that guy) - i.e. raid group hands in onyxia head in orgrammar - everyone gets their buff - and then dragonkin spawn in retalliation for you killing their beloved uber bad-ass. I don't know - that may not work but yeah, more random stuff. * They really need to upgrade their GM client - it doesn't seem to be able to do much. I loved being DM in Neverwinter nights, simply for the ability to spawn stuff and cause havoc.
Shops would be an interesting idea, though that may impact the use of the Auction House, which i do like as a feature. That may cut down on the trade channel spam, which I would welcome. There is a mod which allows you to setup a shop, and people just need to click on you to open up a window similar to any other merchant. One downside is they need to be running the mod as well though.
Roleplayers in particular, seem to be calling for many changes to give more life and vibrance to the world.
* I'd love to see Bounty Hunting put in for PVP. There's a certain mage on my server i wouldn't mind parting with some gold to make him dead. A number of times even.
* Mini-Games: One suggestion i've seen is for them to add mini-games to inns, such as darts, cards, dice.
I love WoW - I'm enjoying it - haven't hit end-game but i can see the problems there, they seem like problems that many other games have though. Not an excuse for WoW however, being the most successful mmo, they should strive to be better. I've decided to not hold my breath tho, don't feel like dying.
meh, I played open beta and that was enough for me
it was basically daoc with more verbose quests that lead you around better, imo
but to each their own, 2mil paying subscribers is pretty good
I know a score of people playing but as each of them lvl out their toons they are getting a bored look with the game, several seem to be just going through the motions
one who was a top skald in daoc got fed up with lagged out pvp and went back to City of Heroes...starting guild wars soon as well
I am not sure how they can really have 2mil paying subscribers when I probably know as many people that lvled out and quit as who are still playing...
The game lacks ANY depth.It must be that every casual gamer on the damn planet is playing this.I tried this game for about 4.5 weeks and became bored rather quickly.
I just dont get it.I soloed to level 35 and i didnt talk to 1 person nor did i join a guild.SWG is a much better game but i quit playing that as well because of the immense lag and ive got a pretty heavy duty system.
No content for the top levels and nothing more than rumors as far as expansions go and yet they have 2 million subscribers?
Oh well more power to them if its even true.
Want to ENJOY an mmo?
Dont start a guild and dont be a leader or volunteer to be coleader or captain.
Originally posted by Puoltry Frickin amazing.How is it even possible?
The game lacks ANY depth.It must be that every casual gamer on the damn planet is playing this.I tried this game for about 4.5 weeks and became bored rather quickly. I just dont get it.I soloed to level 35 and i didnt talk to 1 person nor did i join a guild.SWG is a much better game but i quit playing that as well because of the immense lag and ive got a pretty heavy duty system. No content for the top levels and nothing more than rumors as far as expansions go and yet they have 2 million subscribers? Oh well more power to them if its even true.
I think a lot of people would have quit if they solo'd to 35. LOL, did you solo all the elite quests, deadmines, bfd, stockades, sfk, gnomer, and sm?
Originally posted by boboslave * I'd love to see Bounty Hunting put in for PVP. There's a certain mage on my server i wouldn't mind parting with some gold to make him dead. A number of times even.
I know this isn't what you mean, but there isn't anything stopping you from doing that now. Actually I'm sure people would kill for free!
There was a thread on the official forums where you could ask for someone to be killed and send a message. They had it set up so that after you got killed, someone on your side would say "You have just been killed by so-and-so and here's the message". And they would provide you with a screenshot. I have no idea how they coordinated it all and I don't remember what payment for the services was. But quite a few people had good fun with it.
Originally posted by Puoltry Frickin amazing.How is it even possible? The game lacks ANY depth.It must be that every casual gamer on the damn planet is playing this.I tried this game for about 4.5 weeks and became bored rather quickly. I just dont get it.I soloed to level 35 and i didnt talk to 1 person nor did i join a guild.SWG is a much better game but i quit playing that as well because of the immense lag and ive got a pretty heavy duty system. No content for the top levels and nothing more than rumors as far as expansions go and yet they have 2 million subscribers? Oh well more power to them if its even true.
Hey, you only get out of a game what you put into it. You solo'd to 35. Did it ever occur to you to get to know players and maybe do a little grouping?
I'm also curious about the 'no content for the top level' comment, especially since you quit when you were L35!
Lol, no I wasn't joking around about L2. If PvP is the direction you want your end game to go toward, L2 has one of the best systems. Granted you may have to grow some thicker skin, since it's open PvP.
PS. Bill O'Rielly sucks, lol.
Ico Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
Actually everybody does say when u hit lv60 (and some get there very fast) theres little else to do. It is true that wow is a very polished and overall good game, but it is more so a wonder of marketing than anything else..
Things will change in years too come but the fact is this is a dark age of pc computer games where graphics and marketing rule... if only the companies like Microprose, DID, Cavedog, Infrogames and virtual world mmorpg`s like UO dominated the market, those would be great times.
Though its nice to see Take2, Rockstar games and even Atari are producing some quality stuff.
Man...people bash SOE for being money grubbing but all Blizzard does is localize their client for other regions of the world instead of fixing problems with the game.
Until you cancel your subscription, you are only helping to continue the cycle of mediocrity.
Originally posted by TookyG Man...people bash SOE for being money grubbing but all Blizzard does is localize their client for other regions of the world instead of fixing problems with the game.
Rofl. What problems exactly? And by the way, ALL of these companyes (SoE, NCSoft, etc) have seperate departments that work on expansions, dungeons, artwork, quality control, etc. So basically, just because a company puts out an expansion or announces they are working on new things doesn't mean other aspects of the game are being neglected.
Played WoW for over 6 months now. Development is slow but when they release it, they make sure its worth the wait. Server lag issues/stability are almost non existent at this point. Can not tell you how much I started enjoying this game recently. I bought Guild Wars, but really dont feel like getting away from WoW anytime soon. There is so much to be done, gotta get ready for Molte Core.
I got burnt out beta testing WoW and gave up on it before it went live but it was a well designed game but just not for me (not a big fan of level based mmog's these days). I have over 20 long time gaming friends in it still and they are having a blast with it and as a group they tend to be pretty picky so Blizzard must be doing something right. And if you have a game company you had better be a money grubbing enterprise if you want to stay in business long term.
Originally posted by D0ZeR Maybe so but 2 mil play it.
2 million play it??? Hardly..... the trend is for people who like a game to have multiple accounts.... we ALL know people with 3 or more accounts in one game.... I personally find it silly, but I've never been that hardcore even at my peak in the games I lived in. If I needed to mule something to another character, there is always friends and guildies to help with that. And every game allows for more than 1 character. Some don't allow more than 1 char per server tho, and that's the only time I could see a reason to do that, but still......
Like I said, hardcore people just have to have more than 1 account for whatever reasons...... and the games devs don't mind that, it's actually better for them, less people playing at one time, easier load on servers, but subscription numbers still high.
IRVINE, California - June 14, 2005 - Blizzard Entertainment® today announced that World of Warcraft®, the company's highly acclaimed subscription-based massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG), has surpassed two million paying subscribers worldwideIRVINE, California
Either way 2 mil play it. I have 2 accounts in some games, not wow but others. Heck in UO I had 3 for awhile there. Still have one open at all times. It don't matter when I had the 3 I would play all 3 at the same time. Really isn't hard to do. So even if there are people with more than one account that is open yes it would count to 2 million subs. I fail to see exactly what the point is you are making. As you can see Blizzard is counting the subs not the people. You really need to chill on that point alone. If you hate WOW I can deal with that. Heck I have some bad hate for Horizons and there CEO DB. But if they would come out and say they had an actual 100 people playing the game I would accept it. After all corporations have to tell the truth when it comes to acutal financial numbers.
Take no thought of who is right or wrong or who is better than. Be not for or against. Bruce Lee
Comments
Some of us also like end games that don't involve beating on things.
edit coming soon...
----------------------------------
MMOs Retired From: Earth and Beyond, Project Entropia, There, A Tale in the Desert, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, Eve Online, City of Heroes/Villains.
MMOs Currently (worth) Playing: None.
MMO hopefuls: Age of Conan.
No worries firemagic,
thanks for your response.
You are most correct in saying that some people like it, some don't.
You have said that you DID like it, and then you DIDN'T.
Which i find interesting, sorry for badgering
i dont think anyone can really dispute WoW is a great game.
i liked it for awhile too. the thing with it is, its not built for the power gamer. tradeskills are easily maxed, lvl is easy to get to.
its just not built for the people who play >40 hours a week, and fortunatly for them 99% of the players dont play that much.
personaly, i do play that much and im bored with it but i understand i play too much and im the minority, and most likely most people who spend time reading a site about mmorpgs are pretty hardcore too.
so for every one of us who think that the game is severly lacking in alot of areas, there are 1000 people who are oblivious to what those areas even are.
read this http://www.vanguardsoh.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1044304#post1044304 then come back and talk to me about the vanguard/soe fiasco.....
OK, let me spell it out for you. Read slowly and carefully............................
I was led to believe by Blizzard that the endgame would be extremely exciting and enjoyable. During this period, I enjoyed playing WoW immensely, because I was looking forward to the implementation of the endgame and I enjoyed developing characters to play in said endgame. This was the period that I DID like the game.
With me so far? OK. Now on to the next part..................................
When it started to become apparent that Blizzard had no intention of ever implementing anything like the endgame they'd advertised, I realised I had a selection of high level characters that were completely useless unless I wanted to spend months doing mindlessly dull instance runs and farming "honor". This resulted in me NO LONGER LIKING THE GAME.
I hope I've made it nice and simple for you to understand.
Indeed you have firemagic, there was however, no need to be
so condescending, i am merely attempting to understand the
opinions of others.
Have a good one, and i hope you find what you are looking for
out of your entertainment.
Cheers
Please accept my apologies for any hard feelings. However I felt there was a very real need to be condescending since you were effectively asking me to repeat myself.
All the best.
Alright screw the edit:
Something like SWG except without the crappyness :P. A very good crafting system, set up shops and take orders and hire people to go hunting for hides or special parts you need. There are also player cities, cruising down the neighborhood and have a friend wave you down and tell you he is having a party in the local cantina, or get a message from the mayor that the city needs you because the evil imperials are attacking a base. I also like things a bit more dynamic, taking over cities and destroying buildings, organized raids that actaully accomplish something instead of killing off NPCs that respawn in 5 minutes :P. Pretty much I like to have an effect on the game world, be a famous crafter or take over areas or destroy things essential to the other faction(s). Ok I've gotten a bit disorganized but here is what I'm getting at:
Little sense of community(WoW is very solo friendly so this I should have expected)
Little sense of accomplishment/ownership(we have our equipment and our level, not much else)
----------------------------------
MMOs Retired From: Earth and Beyond, Project Entropia, There, A Tale in the Desert, Star Wars Galaxies, World of Warcraft, Eve Online, City of Heroes/Villains.
MMOs Currently (worth) Playing: None.
MMO hopefuls: Age of Conan.
No Worries
Nobody likes repeating themselves.
I guess i'm interested in thinking about
what solutions there are to such a problem.
Of course, Blizzard could stop lying for a start
but yeah, curiosity has killed the cat in this case.
No, 2 mil have bought it. I don't get what's so fun about it. To each his own, I guess.
NO, they have OVER 2 million paying subscribers! Not just people who bought the game. And that doesnt count the release in China.
Dinion,
I think many people would like WoW to be more dynamic, myself included,
Bliz has said though that it's not really possible for them, as it would be difficult to
manage and a little un-fair to players who are impacted by others' actions
(such as burning a town to the ground - that would be fun though).
Given the money that they are racking in, you'd think they could do something!!
Their less than spectacular world events haven't really rocked my world that's for sure.
Given the size of WoW (number of servers and players) I can understand why it would be difficult for
them, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't work towards reaching their limitations. At the
moment, Bliz doesn't seem to be anywhere near their limits, even within their own rules.
* Instanced housing for guilds in particular, should be possible.
* More Quest triggers (like stitches - god i love that guy) - i.e. raid group hands in onyxia head in orgrammar - everyone gets their buff - and then dragonkin spawn in retalliation for you killing their beloved uber bad-ass. I don't know - that may not work but yeah, more random stuff.
* They really need to upgrade their GM client - it doesn't seem to be able to do much. I loved being DM in Neverwinter nights, simply for the ability to spawn stuff and cause havoc.
Shops would be an interesting idea, though that may impact the use of the Auction House, which i do like as a feature. That may cut down on the trade channel spam, which I would welcome. There is a mod which allows you to setup a shop, and people just need to click on you to open up a window similar to any other merchant. One downside is they need to be running the mod as well though.
Roleplayers in particular, seem to be calling for many changes to give more life and vibrance to the world.
* I'd love to see Bounty Hunting put in for PVP. There's a certain mage on my server i wouldn't mind parting with some gold to make him dead. A number of times even.
* Mini-Games: One suggestion i've seen is for them to add mini-games to inns, such as darts, cards, dice.
I love WoW - I'm enjoying it - haven't hit end-game but i can see the problems there, they seem like problems that many other games have though. Not an excuse for WoW however, being the most successful mmo, they should strive to be better. I've decided to not hold my breath tho, don't feel like dying.
edit: spelling
meh, I played open beta and that was enough for me
it was basically daoc with more verbose quests that lead you around better, imo
but to each their own, 2mil paying subscribers is pretty good
I know a score of people playing but as each of them lvl out their toons they are getting a bored look with the game, several seem to be just going through the motions
one who was a top skald in daoc got fed up with lagged out pvp and went back to City of Heroes...starting guild wars soon as well
I am not sure how they can really have 2mil paying subscribers when I probably know as many people that lvled out and quit as who are still playing...
perendengue
Frickin amazing.How is it even possible?
The game lacks ANY depth.It must be that every casual gamer on the damn planet is playing this.I tried this game for about 4.5 weeks and became bored rather quickly.
I just dont get it.I soloed to level 35 and i didnt talk to 1 person nor did i join a guild.SWG is a much better game but i quit playing that as well because of the immense lag and ive got a pretty heavy duty system.
No content for the top levels and nothing more than rumors as far as expansions go and yet they have 2 million subscribers?
Oh well more power to them if its even true.
Want to ENJOY an mmo?
Dont start a guild and dont be a leader or volunteer to be coleader or captain.
Just play the damn game:)
I think a lot of people would have quit if they solo'd to 35. LOL, did you solo all the elite quests, deadmines, bfd, stockades, sfk, gnomer, and sm?
I know this isn't what you mean, but there isn't anything stopping you from doing that now. Actually I'm sure people would kill for free!
There was a thread on the official forums where you could ask for someone to be killed and send a message. They had it set up so that after you got killed, someone on your side would say "You have just been killed by so-and-so and here's the message". And they would provide you with a screenshot. I have no idea how they coordinated it all and I don't remember what payment for the services was. But quite a few people had good fun with it.
Hey, you only get out of a game what you put into it. You solo'd to 35. Did it ever occur to you to get to know players and maybe do a little grouping?
I'm also curious about the 'no content for the top level' comment, especially since you quit when you were L35!
Lol, no I wasn't joking around about L2. If PvP is the direction you want your end game to go toward, L2 has one of the best systems. Granted you may have to grow some thicker skin, since it's open PvP.
PS. Bill O'Rielly sucks, lol.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
Actually everybody does say when u hit lv60 (and some get there very fast) theres little else to do. It is true that wow is a very polished and overall good game, but it is more so a wonder of marketing than anything else..
Things will change in years too come but the fact is this is a dark age of pc computer games where graphics and marketing rule... if only the companies like Microprose, DID, Cavedog, Infrogames and virtual world mmorpg`s like UO dominated the market, those would be great times.
Though its nice to see Take2, Rockstar games and even Atari are producing some quality stuff.
Until you cancel your subscription, you are only helping to continue the cycle of mediocrity.
Played WoW for over 6 months now. Development is slow but when they release it, they make sure its worth the wait. Server lag issues/stability are almost non existent at this point. Can not tell you how much I started enjoying this game recently. I bought Guild Wars, but really dont feel like getting away from WoW anytime soon. There is so much to be done, gotta get ready for Molte Core.
Laterz
2 million play it??? Hardly..... the trend is for people who like a game to have multiple accounts.... we ALL know people with 3 or more accounts in one game.... I personally find it silly, but I've never been that hardcore even at my peak in the games I lived in. If I needed to mule something to another character, there is always friends and guildies to help with that. And every game allows for more than 1 character. Some don't allow more than 1 char per server tho, and that's the only time I could see a reason to do that, but still......
Like I said, hardcore people just have to have more than 1 account for whatever reasons...... and the games devs don't mind that, it's actually better for them, less people playing at one time, easier load on servers, but subscription numbers still high.
IRVINE, California - June 14, 2005 - Blizzard Entertainment® today announced that World of Warcraft®, the company's highly acclaimed subscription-based massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG), has surpassed two million paying subscribers worldwideIRVINE, California
Either way 2 mil play it. I have 2 accounts in some games, not wow but others. Heck in UO I had 3 for awhile there. Still have one open at all times. It don't matter when I had the 3 I would play all 3 at the same time. Really isn't hard to do. So even if there are people with more than one account that is open yes it would count to 2 million subs. I fail to see exactly what the point is you are making. As you can see Blizzard is counting the subs not the people. You really need to chill on that point alone. If you hate WOW I can deal with that. Heck I have some bad hate for Horizons and there CEO DB. But if they would come out and say they had an actual 100 people playing the game I would accept it. After all corporations have to tell the truth when it comes to acutal financial numbers.
Take no thought of who is right or wrong or who is better than. Be not for or against.
Bruce Lee