Those people who do not think this will turn into a huge cash grab are naive...it's developed by AA developers, it has a labor type system, it has RNG gear that makes 1000% the difference in PvP...and if you think they are looking at Trion's management of AA as a failure you are mistaken...Trion has managed to milk every last penny out of the players and made massive profits on what would be a minor blip of a game on the market.
Remember, Archeage was all about "No tricks, No traps" zero cash grab incentives at release until rumbling archeum.....and then it tumbled into horseshit afterwards.
There was plenty of cash grabbing at the start of AA. It opened with a full-on p2w cash shop with limited labor, selling labor potions and upgrade enhancers for endgame gear.
Then they went even further.
This game is starting B2P with no p2w in the cash shop.
At the VERY LEAST, these 2 games are opening very differently so I'm not sure why everyone thinks they're destined for the same ending.
B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House ).
I would strongly suggest to watch out for this game. It can suck you in, and since the grind is long and the game is base around competitive PvP, you would be very tempted to buy that costume or pets in Cash Shop, and sell them in Auction House, to get an instant +15 items, or tons of Silver for further upgrades.
It's good to see that at least one region is currently working on first and only None P2W B2P server for Black Desert game, that will launch in Russian in February this year. They have a rule there, No Cash Shop items will ever be sold on Auction House, and a big portion of Korean Cash shop was transferred to an NPC in the game, to be sold for silver, for everyone.
I was hopping we might get the same since our is also B2P, but unfortunately it's just a label here. Daum EU is the same as Daum KR, same game model, just new tricks.
At the VERY LEAST, these 2 games are opening very differently so I'm not sure why everyone thinks they're destined for the same ending.
Because that is how they have run every single game they have been involved in, and that is how every single game that has been ported over from Korea has worked.
Only gullible people accept marketing speak as credible in an industry that is chalk full of broken promises.
I am curious, would you leave your kids with a convicted felon if he promised this time everything would be different?
At the VERY LEAST, these 2 games are opening very differently so I'm not sure why everyone thinks they're destined for the same ending.
Because that is how they have run every single game they have been involved in, and that is how every single game that has been ported over from Korea has worked.
Only gullible people accept marketing speak as credible in an industry that is chalk full of broken promises.
I am curious, would you leave your kids with a convicted felon if he promised this time everything would be different?
So what is it exactly that you are trying to tells us? To trust what you are telling us and not play the game at all?
Like the poster said, we get it ... you have peeked into your crystal ball and are apprehensive based on your own preconceived notion that this is going to happen. But your belief is not going to discourage anyone from buying the game. If it turns out to be P2W six months from now you can come back and tell us "I told you so." By the same token if doesn't, will you come back and apologize and tell us you were wrong?
That said, I still don't know what your motivation is to keep repeating the same crystal ball prediction. All I can think of is that you are trying to discourage people from even trying the game. Is that it? I sincerely want know so I can lay my OCD to rest here.
At the VERY LEAST, these 2 games are opening very differently so I'm not sure why everyone thinks they're destined for the same ending.
Because that is how they have run every single game they have been involved in, and that is how every single game that has been ported over from Korea has worked.
Only gullible people accept marketing speak as credible in an industry that is chalk full of broken promises.
I am curious, would you leave your kids with a convicted felon if he promised this time everything would be different?
No game ported from Korea has opened B2P with a non-p2w cash shop. None of them has "worked" like BDO is going to work, if for no other reason then it's a different pay model.
Nobody is buying "marketing speak". Unlike you, I'm actually looking at what BDO is going to be released with, and it's different than say, Archeage.
In any case, your entire premise that all Korean ports are f2p p2w fests is just wrong. Aion and Tera both released as subscription model games and stayed that way for a long time.
I'm sad to hear that there are no tactics involved in solo PvE. Faceroll PvE is not fun. It should be a dangerous world with risk vs reward. Oh well, another no challenge aoe snoozefest to write off.
I really don't understand how anyone who has had any experience in an RNG based crafting system (Especially Where RMT items are avialable to modify that) can look at any other MMORPG with an RNG based crafting system and not even have even a slightly raised level of suspicion.
I mean, I am seeing a straight up P2W mechanic here and yet people are arguing that it will be different.
No game ported from Korea has opened B2P with a non-p2w cash shop. None of them has "worked" like BDO is going to work, if for no other reason then it's a different pay model.
Nobody is buying "marketing speak". Unlike you, I'm actually looking at what BDO is going to be released with, and it's different than say, Archeage.
In any case, your entire premise that all Korean ports are f2p p2w fests is just wrong. Aion and Tera both released as subscription model games and stayed that way for a long time.
I am pretty sure Aion and Tera were box price + sub + cash shop so using them as examples of 'good guy' Korean ports is completely laughable since they were even worse than AA's model at release.
Your entire premise is that since on Day 1 BDO will not be as P2W as AA it gets a pass. If people only played for 1 day that might make sense.
Since the game revolves around grinding for months, the future direction of the design decisions is of major concern to people thinking about investing that much time and Daum has a poor track record in all of its other games.
Because that is how they have run every single game they have been involved in, and that is how every single game that has been ported over from Korea has worked.
Only gullible people accept marketing speak as credible in an industry that is chalk full of broken promises. ......... Since the game revolves around grinding for months, the future direction of the design decisions is of major concern to people thinking about investing that much time and ANY GAME COMPANY has a poor track record in all of its other games.
With that logic, can you tell me one Developer, Publisher, or individual Dev that you give any credit to for not being a flat out liar bent on milking us for every last dime or that hasn't been part of fairly large game changes that resulted in fans loosing faith, enjoyment, or whatever with the product?
You seem to be fairly anti-KR, but I know of zero Western companies doing much better in regards to sticking to a pay model, not making drastic game changes after launch, living up to their hype, etc.
Curious why you seem so focused on BDO and why you don't spend as much time pointing out the flaws of other games, such as the one you are financially backing and actually could have some impact on.
BDO is B2P with zero P2W cash shop at launch. Yes, there is no guarantee it will stay that way. There's also no guarantee anyone will stick around to play another ArcheAge catastrophe. However, aside from buying the game, there is no other investment in order to play BDO, now is there? So even if they decide to add P2W elements, people can decide then if they want to invest money or not, unlike AA who pulled the bait switch right off the bat at launch.
But clearly you'll be addicted after day 1 (even though the game is terrible) and won't be able to see the terrible P2W system being implemented and will be forced to sell a kidney to stay competitive with the whales dominating PVP because no one has common sense except for a few brave souls speaking up on this forum...
At the VERY LEAST, these 2 games are opening very differently so I'm not sure why everyone thinks they're destined for the same ending.
Because that is how they have run every single game they have been involved in, and that is how every single game that has been ported over from Korea has worked.
Only gullible people accept marketing speak as credible in an industry that is chalk full of broken promises.
I am curious, would you leave your kids with a convicted felon if he promised this time everything would be different?
A - i doubt you know many of the games Daum has actually been involved in unless you are playing primarily Korean market mmorpgs that never came out in the west period as they have never published in the west at all until Black Desert Online where they actually formed Daum Games Europe to publish in the US and Europe.
B - Pearl Abyss has also "not been involved" in any other games unless you are speaking of some of their developers on a personal level which is kind of asinine. The head of the company was just a developer at NhN gaming and Hangame which very little they have release has rarely if EVER been a p2w cash grab at any point in time.
C - It is very clear you are either a troll or someone who just has a grudge against every single korean mmorpg no matter what is done. Not all are created the same and there are many that are not P2W cash grabs.
Daum/Pearl Abyss have not been using any sort of "marketing" double speak or anything of the sort and do no have any sort of track record here at all in the west other than what they are now doing with Black Desert. Basing your judgement just because the game has come from Korea is freaking meaningless. We have a new developer and a subsidiary of another company that has not published in the western world yet that is clearly trying to tailor markets. Daum knows the markets they are operating in thus far.
If you don't like korean mmorpgs at all just stop getting involved in threads/articles about them. And no your convicted felon analogy fails because it'd be like assuming everyone from a given area is a convicted felon proven to be one or not. We have different people in charge at Daum Europe vs their korean branch that feel that a less p2w strategy is going to bring them in more money in the long run right now. There is no denying the game could turn out to be a cash grab, but then so could anything else that is out there including WoW and any other MMORPG.
You seem to think that just because people are optimistic they believe every little word of someone, one can remain cautiously optimistic and see the generalized direction of development and publishing and go from there. They have made a ton of changes in the western launch already. They did in fact REMOVE those items and it's not for PR reasons it is simply because of a different market mentality (you are kind of proving the point here) wherein P2W is looked at unfavorably in the market they are moving into. It is called doing a little market research which a good publisher will do.
Just because you want to be a pessimist simply based around the region/country of origin of the developer/publisher doesn't mean we are all going to be.
I really don't understand how anyone who has had any experience in an RNG based crafting system (Especially Where RMT items are avialable to modify that) can look at any other MMORPG with an RNG based crafting system and not even have even a slightly raised level of suspicion.
I mean, I am seeing a straight up P2W mechanic here and yet people are arguing that it will be different.
I'm not seeing that though. There has been nothing stated that you'd even be able to sell in game cash shop costumes as RMT, in fact the only thing that has been said to be able to be sold at all thus far that we've seen is simply excess energy you might have if you opt to not use it. People are arguing that it will be different simply because those of us following the development or founders etc have seen left and right that daum and pearl abyss are listening to player feedback heavily and making changes both based off player feedback and the western markets.
We are being cautiously optimistic in the long run, but they have yet to show that they are doing anything RMT based or p2w based thus far. Also I never got the point of how selling a costume item for in game money simply because you can get that item for real money. It is actually kind of funny when you consider that prices in BDO actually fluctuate based on saturation of an item for anything involving the auction house system (you only have a set price range outside of market fluctuation which happens now and then to change that range) effective making mass use of selling costumes in mass quantities kind of useless as they will eventually cause price range of that item to go down the more they try and sell
And while people may frown on that method it does still allow some more casual players to get a foot in the door as well. The only real thing that system even allows for is more tries at unsafe crafting, there is very little guarantee that stuff could still go your way with that scenario simply based off the RNG possibility. That said yes people dislike RMT quite a bit, but at the same time unless they add in a gifting system for costumes it's going to be a bit of a meh situation if you want to get a friend/girlfriend'boyfriend a gift in game.
Regardless of Daum/Pearl Abyss seem dead set on listening to their player base here in the west as well as tailoring the game to fit out market so there may be changes that remove "rmt" elements entirely (again i have no real issue with costume sales but some do, you being one of them cuz you all act like it somehow magically makes RMT go away or those powerful items just for use at everyone's fingertips right away, it'd take a huge amount of costume sales to afford anything on the korean version of the game as is)
No game ported from Korea has opened B2P with a non-p2w cash shop. None of them has "worked" like BDO is going to work, if for no other reason then it's a different pay model.
Nobody is buying "marketing speak". Unlike you, I'm actually looking at what BDO is going to be released with, and it's different than say, Archeage.
In any case, your entire premise that all Korean ports are f2p p2w fests is just wrong. Aion and Tera both released as subscription model games and stayed that way for a long time.
I am pretty sure Aion and Tera were box price + sub + cash shop so using them as examples of 'good guy' Korean ports is completely laughable since they were even worse than AA's model at release.
Your entire premise is that since on Day 1 BDO will not be as P2W as AA it gets a pass. If people only played for 1 day that might make sense.
Since the game revolves around grinding for months, the future direction of the design decisions is of major concern to people thinking about investing that much time and Daum has a poor track record in all of its other games.
Tera didn't open with a cash shop. It was purely box and sub. Eventually it went f2p with a cash shop but that was after a really long time (years I think). Even after the conversion not many would say that TERA is p2w.
Not sure about Aion but TERA alone proves that not every Korean import is Archeage.
"Your entire premise is that since on Day 1 BDO will not be as P2W as AA it gets a pass. If people only played for 1 day that might make sense. "
No, my entire premise is that BDO is opening very different than Archeage so there's no reason to think that it will become another Archeage.
It's clear that Daum at least realizes we're a different market by opening B2P with no p2w. That is a good sign that they won't implode their own game down the line by going full Archeage.
You've got this theory that they're just waiting to flip the tables and go full p2w after some months, but that would be a really dumb idea. They'd lose tons of players and money.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
In all MMORPG's you grind whether that is leveling, raiding for gear or crafting for gear and potions you will do repetive things all the time but it all depends how much fun you have while doing it and only one way to find out is too try the game yourself.
There will be great players that didn't spend a dime besides box.
Those great players will be cannon fodder. A super awesome skilful great player two-shotted and spawn camped....by a mouthbreather armed with daddy's walet.. Can't wait.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
There will be great players that spen a lot of money. There will be great players that didn't spend a dime besides box.
There will be TONS of bad players that run to the forums and scream P2W. It doesn't matter who they are killed by.
And there will be even more bad players who spend lots of money or time grinding to get OP gear claiming that the game is balanced, that their ability to rolf stomp several players at once is because they are pro, and that anyone who complains about gear-imbalance on the forum is a baddie who just needs to L2P.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
Actually....
I had zero interest in this game as I just wrote it off as another asian cash shop grinder, No offence to anyone, but I really have not been a fan of asian games. Now, because of this very thread, I've actually researched the game and the plans for the EU/NA release. It's peaked my interest enough to make me preorder. From what I've read I kind of see the game as sort of a UO2016.
Anyways I'm sure I'll get my $50 worth out of it, no matter.
Thanks for creating this thread and turning my son and I onto this game.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
Almost 200k preorders at the moment, which is a lot for game with no marketing in EU or NA. It's currently going by word-of-mouth only and honestly, that's damn impressive.
The whole idea that a game NEEDS 500k players to survive is also false - This is a misconception which has been around since WoW first released it's record subscriber numbers. You must be a marketeer who only wants to see WoW killers and kills a profitable game because it hasn't reached 1m active players before launch :P
Also, BDO RU never had 500k players. No clue where you're getting that number from.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
At this point our conversation is pretty much pointless. Both of us are speculating.
How about in 6 months we come back to this thread and one of us tells the other "I told you so."
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
Almost 200k preorders at the moment, which is a lot for game with no marketing in EU or NA. It's currently going by word-of-mouth only and honestly, that's damn impressive.
The whole idea that a game NEEDS 500k players to survive is also false - This is a misconception which has been around since WoW first released it's record subscriber numbers. You must be a marketeer who only wants to see WoW killers and kills a profitable game because it hasn't reached 1m active players before launch :P
Also, BDO RU never had 500k players. No clue where you're getting that number from.
They are not really pre-orders. All the players that upgraded and cancelled also counts in to that number. The real numbers are much lower. And that's for 2 Regions. So what ever the real number is, you should divide it in two. It's basically a Fail launch.
This game had all the advertising it wanted.
I know it's hard to understand, but this game needs a constant income of fresh players to keep it alive. And seeing how it's already not popular for the start, keeping this game locked behind a B2P pay wall, will not attract any players. In Other regions the game is F2P, so they have a constant income of fresh players to battle the decline, yet it didn't helped them. Now look at our pay wall, and you will see, this game is already falling off a cliff due to poor management.
RU BDO had more than 500k players, because it started with 40 FULL channels, that's equal to 40 servers, and a lot of player where waiting for the launch of B2P Server, so many didn't played, yet still 40 channels where at FULL status for weeks.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
Almost 200k preorders at the moment, which is a lot for game with no marketing in EU or NA. It's currently going by word-of-mouth only and honestly, that's damn impressive.
The whole idea that a game NEEDS 500k players to survive is also false - This is a misconception which has been around since WoW first released it's record subscriber numbers. You must be a marketeer who only wants to see WoW killers and kills a profitable game because it hasn't reached 1m active players before launch :P
Also, BDO RU never had 500k players. No clue where you're getting that number from.
They are not really pre-orders. All the players that upgraded and cancelled also counts in to that number. The real numbers are much lower. And that's for 2 Regions. So what ever the real number is, you should divide it in two.It's basically a Fail launch.
This game had all the advertising it wanted.
I know it's hard to understand, but this game needs a constant income of fresh players to keep it alive. And seeing how it's already not popular for the start, keeping this game locked behind a B2P pay wall, will not attract any players. In Other regions the game is F2P, so they have a constant income of fresh players to battle the decline, yet it didn't helped them. Now look at our pay wall, and you will see, this game is already falling off a cliff due to poor management.
RU BDO had more than 500k players, because it started with 40 FULL channels, that's equal to 40 servers, and a lot of player where waiting for the launch of B2P Server, so many didn't played, yet still 40 channels where at FULL status for weeks.
Man I can't believe they're even going to release this game considering it's already failed, even before closed beta 2!
You guys must be right. In fact this game's launch that hasn't happened yet seems so bad I'm not sure the game even ever existed.
Jonas_SG said: "B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
Almost 200k preorders at the moment, which is a lot for game with no marketing in EU or NA. It's currently going by word-of-mouth only and honestly, that's damn impressive.
The whole idea that a game NEEDS 500k players to survive is also false - This is a misconception which has been around since WoW first released it's record subscriber numbers. You must be a marketeer who only wants to see WoW killers and kills a profitable game because it hasn't reached 1m active players before launch :P
Also, BDO RU never had 500k players. No clue where you're getting that number from.
They are not really pre-orders. All the players that upgraded and cancelled also counts in to that number. The real numbers are much lower. And that's for 2 Regions. So what ever the real number is, you should divide it in two.It's basically a Fail launch.
This game had all the advertising it wanted.
I know it's hard to understand, but this game needs a constant income of fresh players to keep it alive. And seeing how it's already not popular for the start, keeping this game locked behind a B2P pay wall, will not attract any players. In Other regions the game is F2P, so they have a constant income of fresh players to battle the decline, yet it didn't helped them. Now look at our pay wall, and you will see, this game is already falling off a cliff due to poor management.
RU BDO had more than 500k players, because it started with 40 FULL channels, that's equal to 40 servers, and a lot of player where waiting for the launch of B2P Server, so many didn't played, yet still 40 channels where at FULL status for weeks.
Man I can't believe they're even going to release this game considering it's already failed, even before closed beta 2!
You guys must be right. In fact this game's launch that hasn't happened yet seems so bad I'm not sure the game even ever existed.
That's actually true ^^ The game failed in Korea and then in Russia this is their last chance if doesn't make it here it never will.
Comments
B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House ).
I would strongly suggest to watch out for this game. It can suck you in, and since the grind is long and the game is base around competitive PvP, you would be very tempted to buy that costume or pets in Cash Shop, and sell them in Auction House, to get an instant +15 items, or tons of Silver for further upgrades.
It's good to see that at least one region is currently working on first and only None P2W B2P server for Black Desert game, that will launch in Russian in February this year. They have a rule there, No Cash Shop items will ever be sold on Auction House, and a big portion of Korean Cash shop was transferred to an NPC in the game, to be sold for silver, for everyone.
I was hopping we might get the same since our is also B2P, but unfortunately it's just a label here. Daum EU is the same as Daum KR, same game model, just new tricks.
Only gullible people accept marketing speak as credible in an industry that is chalk full of broken promises.
I am curious, would you leave your kids with a convicted felon if he promised this time everything would be different?
So what is it exactly that you are trying to tells us? To trust what you are telling us and not play the game at all?
Like the poster said, we get it ... you have peeked into your crystal ball and are apprehensive based on your own preconceived notion that this is going to happen. But your belief is not going to discourage anyone from buying the game. If it turns out to be P2W six months from now you can come back and tell us "I told you so." By the same token if doesn't, will you come back and apologize and tell us you were wrong?
That said, I still don't know what your motivation is to keep repeating the same crystal ball prediction. All I can think of is that you are trying to discourage people from even trying the game. Is that it? I sincerely want know so I can lay my OCD to rest here.
Nobody is buying "marketing speak". Unlike you, I'm actually looking at what BDO is going to be released with, and it's different than say, Archeage.
In any case, your entire premise that all Korean ports are f2p p2w fests is just wrong. Aion and Tera both released as subscription model games and stayed that way for a long time.
I mean, I am seeing a straight up P2W mechanic here and yet people are arguing that it will be different.
Your entire premise is that since on Day 1 BDO will not be as P2W as AA it gets a pass. If people only played for 1 day that might make sense.
Since the game revolves around grinding for months, the future direction of the design decisions is of major concern to people thinking about investing that much time and Daum has a poor track record in all of its other games.
You seem to be fairly anti-KR, but I know of zero Western companies doing much better in regards to sticking to a pay model, not making drastic game changes after launch, living up to their hype, etc.
Curious why you seem so focused on BDO and why you don't spend as much time pointing out the flaws of other games, such as the one you are financially backing and actually could have some impact on.
B - Pearl Abyss has also "not been involved" in any other games unless you are speaking of some of their developers on a personal level which is kind of asinine. The head of the company was just a developer at NhN gaming and Hangame which very little they have release has rarely if EVER been a p2w cash grab at any point in time.
C - It is very clear you are either a troll or someone who just has a grudge against every single korean mmorpg no matter what is done. Not all are created the same and there are many that are not P2W cash grabs.
Daum/Pearl Abyss have not been using any sort of "marketing" double speak or anything of the sort and do no have any sort of track record here at all in the west other than what they are now doing with Black Desert. Basing your judgement just because the game has come from Korea is freaking meaningless. We have a new developer and a subsidiary of another company that has not published in the western world yet that is clearly trying to tailor markets. Daum knows the markets they are operating in thus far.
If you don't like korean mmorpgs at all just stop getting involved in threads/articles about them. And no your convicted felon analogy fails because it'd be like assuming everyone from a given area is a convicted felon proven to be one or not. We have different people in charge at Daum Europe vs their korean branch that feel that a less p2w strategy is going to bring them in more money in the long run right now. There is no denying the game could turn out to be a cash grab, but then so could anything else that is out there including WoW and any other MMORPG.
You seem to think that just because people are optimistic they believe every little word of someone, one can remain cautiously optimistic and see the generalized direction of development and publishing and go from there. They have made a ton of changes in the western launch already. They did in fact REMOVE those items and it's not for PR reasons it is simply because of a different market mentality (you are kind of proving the point here) wherein P2W is looked at unfavorably in the market they are moving into. It is called doing a little market research which a good publisher will do.
Just because you want to be a pessimist simply based around the region/country of origin of the developer/publisher doesn't mean we are all going to be.
I'm not seeing that though. There has been nothing stated that you'd even be able to sell in game cash shop costumes as RMT, in fact the only thing that has been said to be able to be sold at all thus far that we've seen is simply excess energy you might have if you opt to not use it. People are arguing that it will be different simply because those of us following the development or founders etc have seen left and right that daum and pearl abyss are listening to player feedback heavily and making changes both based off player feedback and the western markets.
We are being cautiously optimistic in the long run, but they have yet to show that they are doing anything RMT based or p2w based thus far. Also I never got the point of how selling a costume item for in game money simply because you can get that item for real money. It is actually kind of funny when you consider that prices in BDO actually fluctuate based on saturation of an item for anything involving the auction house system (you only have a set price range outside of market fluctuation which happens now and then to change that range) effective making mass use of selling costumes in mass quantities kind of useless as they will eventually cause price range of that item to go down the more they try and sell
And while people may frown on that method it does still allow some more casual players to get a foot in the door as well. The only real thing that system even allows for is more tries at unsafe crafting, there is very little guarantee that stuff could still go your way with that scenario simply based off the RNG possibility. That said yes people dislike RMT quite a bit, but at the same time unless they add in a gifting system for costumes it's going to be a bit of a meh situation if you want to get a friend/girlfriend'boyfriend a gift in game.
Regardless of Daum/Pearl Abyss seem dead set on listening to their player base here in the west as well as tailoring the game to fit out market so there may be changes that remove "rmt" elements entirely (again i have no real issue with costume sales but some do, you being one of them cuz you all act like it somehow magically makes RMT go away or those powerful items just for use at everyone's fingertips right away, it'd take a huge amount of costume sales to afford anything on the korean version of the game as is)
DONT LIKE A CASH SHOP? Then i have a tip for you. HAVE SOME SELF CONTROL!
Not sure about Aion but TERA alone proves that not every Korean import is Archeage.
"Your entire premise is that since on Day 1 BDO will not be as P2W as AA it gets a pass. If people only played for 1 day that might make sense. "
No, my entire premise is that BDO is opening very different than Archeage so there's no reason to think that it will become another Archeage.
It's clear that Daum at least realizes we're a different market by opening B2P with no p2w. That is a good sign that they won't implode their own game down the line by going full Archeage.
You've got this theory that they're just waiting to flip the tables and go full p2w after some months, but that would be a really dumb idea. They'd lose tons of players and money.
Jonas_SG said:
"B2P is just a label. The game we are getting is the same as in Korea. Same Cash shop, same P2W ( Selling Cash shop items on Auction House )."
It's not label- it's a payment model. Our cash shop is significantly different and no you can't sell cash shop items on the marketplace.
There will be TONS of bad players that run to the forums and scream P2W. It doesn't matter who they are killed by.
A super awesome skilful great player two-shotted and spawn camped....by a mouthbreather armed with daddy's walet..
Can't wait.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
Come on you can't be this naive.
It is a label, since not long it will switch to F2P model. If you haven't noticed, the number of players interested in this game are Extremely low with B2P model. I have never seen a AAA game launches with 70-80k players pr region. Even in Russia it launched with at least 500k players. The only way to get new players in is to switch to F2P model.
This is why they didn't changed the Cash Shop from Korean version much. They are already preparing for the switch to F2P. And this is why they are only temporarily disable selling cash shop items on Auction House. It's to lure in naive players like your self with empty hope of having No P2W game.
I had zero interest in this game as I just wrote it off as another asian cash shop grinder, No offence to anyone, but I really have not been a fan of asian games. Now, because of this very thread, I've actually researched the game and the plans for the EU/NA release. It's peaked my interest enough to make me preorder. From what I've read I kind of see the game as sort of a UO2016.
Anyways I'm sure I'll get my $50 worth out of it, no matter.
Thanks for creating this thread and turning my son and I onto this game.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
The whole idea that a game NEEDS 500k players to survive is also false - This is a misconception which has been around since WoW first released it's record subscriber numbers. You must be a marketeer who only wants to see WoW killers and kills a profitable game because it hasn't reached 1m active players before launch :P
Also, BDO RU never had 500k players. No clue where you're getting that number from.
Playing: WF
Played: WoW, GW2, L2, WAR, AoC, DnL (2005), GW, LotRO, EQ2, TOR, CoH (RIP), STO, TSW, TERA, EVE, ESO, BDO
Tried: EQ, UO, AO, EnB, TCoS, Fury, Ryzom, EU, DDO, TR, RF, CO, Aion, VG, DN, Vindictus, AA
How about in 6 months we come back to this thread and one of us tells the other "I told you so."
They are not really pre-orders. All the players that upgraded and cancelled also counts in to that number. The real numbers are much lower. And that's for 2 Regions. So what ever the real number is, you should divide it in two. It's basically a Fail launch.
This game had all the advertising it wanted.
I know it's hard to understand, but this game needs a constant income of fresh players to keep it alive. And seeing how it's already not popular for the start, keeping this game locked behind a B2P pay wall, will not attract any players. In Other regions the game is F2P, so they have a constant income of fresh players to battle the decline, yet it didn't helped them. Now look at our pay wall, and you will see, this game is already falling off a cliff due to poor management.
RU BDO had more than 500k players, because it started with 40 FULL channels, that's equal to 40 servers, and a lot of player where waiting for the launch of B2P Server, so many didn't played, yet still 40 channels where at FULL status for weeks.
You guys must be right. In fact this game's launch that hasn't happened yet seems so bad I'm not sure the game even ever existed.
That's actually true ^^ The game failed in Korea and then in Russia this is their last chance if doesn't make it here it never will.