.....to extent play time till they inevitably quite. Working as intended?
Seriously what is the future of this game if so many people plan to quite or avoid the game all together due to the design choices of Daum? I have no problem with PvP (I play all aspects of a game) and enjoy a good fight, though I can understand PvE players dilemma here. The gate quest is off, and no where on the main site does it state "be ganked at 45" as a selling point.
This game is sorta like a Venus fly trap for PvE players. They want to compete against the environment only and do the crafting side of the game; but in the end their immersion will be broken by toxic players who only want to drink their tears. I have no problem with the level 50 gate quest being fixed and I do not think it will destroy the game like some people suggest. Telling people to just go play Farmville; or calling them Carebears like I have seen is for the most part...toxic and will destroy a community, yet it is allowed to persist by their moderators. Will this game go down in flames in a year?
Should Daum fix this before they lose this PvE playerbase or keep it as is? (turning the gate quest back on, toggle for PvP or separate servers)
Should PvE players just deal with or move on?
Are PvE players important to games like this in general? why?
I agree with you. I like PvE only and hate PvP. The PvE, crafting, nodes system, fishing, conversations, housing etc is much better than I've seen in another MMO, but when I get to 45, if all I do is spend time getting ganked, then I'll have considered that I have had value for money for my $30 and find another game.
That's just how it is for me. If they make some servers PvE only, then I will probably remain.
Or you could you know, shrug off the occasional gank and keep playing?
As a certified carebear and full time EVE player I know what I speak of.
Losing occasionally, it will make you a better person.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Reminds me about something I read about people who purposely sabotage their own success. Deep down they think they don't deserve to be totally successful so they do things to stop that success. This is BDO removing the pvp quest.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
What they should do, and has been wanted for a long time, is put in the quest at level 49 fromt he black spirit, that if you finish it you can get level 50 and pvp, if you don't , you stay level 49 for ever. Pve people are happy, pvp people are happy. I myself have my main at level 43 at the moment, but Artisan 3 in Training because I love to train and breed horses. I don't want to pvp with her because the chances of having my horses killed. But, I want my new Plum to be able to pvp. So it would be nice to have a choice.
This is a retarded suggestion and its stupid how many agrees you got for it. Seriously? That's your suggestion? Make it so that pve players are 1 level below pvp players just so they don't have to worry about owpvp? There isn't a simpler, easier to implement, and well established system they could use? Oh i don't know, like pvp flagging?
What they should do, and has been wanted for a long time, is put in the quest at level 49 fromt he black spirit, that if you finish it you can get level 50 and pvp, if you don't , you stay level 49 for ever. Pve people are happy, pvp people are happy. I myself have my main at level 43 at the moment, but Artisan 3 in Training because I love to train and breed horses. I don't want to pvp with her because the chances of having my horses killed. But, I want my new Plum to be able to pvp. So it would be nice to have a choice.
This is a retarded suggestion and its stupid how many agrees you got for it. Seriously? That's your suggestion? Make it so that pve players are 1 level below pvp players just so they don't have to worry about owpvp? There isn't a simpler, easier to implement, and well established system they could use? Oh i don't know, like pvp flagging?
The real dumbasses are those with really poor reading comprehension that don't get that this is how the game is in Korea, Japan and Russia and that the change was made just for our version.
All Kyarra is doing is describing the game as it is everywhere else.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Pearl Abyss and Daum are at odds with the concept of what BDO is and isn't. You can hear the confusion the project manager has about the game's own direction in the interview. The game isn't confusing though.
It's just not the game he (the project manager) wants. And seeing how he's the project lead for Daum, that is bound to cause some confusion on the development side. It also explains the variances from the NA/EU version and the Korean version.
Oh and Ninja is not coming out in May too, if you didn't know that already.
Linky:
How about a synopsis of this difference in design desires as I don't feel like listening to a 40 minute video of people babbling about their game. Ever... Thanks.
... I have no sympathy any PVE players that bought into this game. It was advertised as a PVP game not PVE from the start. It is there own fault for playing a game that was advertised as a PVP. ...
That wasn't advertised very well then. It took me a couple of days of researching before I could find out that it did in fact have non-consensual PvP. Lots of things are considered PvP, but they are consensual. There is a very important difference.
Pearl Abyss and Daum are at odds with the concept of what BDO is and isn't. You can hear the confusion the project manager has about the game's own direction in the interview. The game isn't confusing though.
It's just not the game he (the project manager) wants. And seeing how he's the project lead for Daum, that is bound to cause some confusion on the development side. It also explains the variances from the NA/EU version and the Korean version.
Oh and Ninja is not coming out in May too, if you didn't know that already.
Linky:
How about a synopsis of this difference in design desires as I don't feel like listening to a 40 minute video of people babbling about their game. Ever... Thanks.
I would never waste my time transcribing something for someone too lazy to watch a video themselves to find the answer they seek. Ever... Thanks.
I lost the thread somewhere, but someone was whining about using PvP Flags means someone could gank you, and then flip the flag so you couldn't touch them So I have to ask, was he upset over getting ganked? Or does he not know that all the games I've played with a flag have limitations on it resetting. Everything from a set amount of time, to being in faction home territory, to actually having to go through a quest first. (Most of them these days seem to use an out of combat timer of 10-20 minutes.)
Pearl Abyss and Daum are at odds with the concept of what BDO is and isn't. You can hear the confusion the project manager has about the game's own direction in the interview. The game isn't confusing though.
It's just not the game he (the project manager) wants. And seeing how he's the project lead for Daum, that is bound to cause some confusion on the development side. It also explains the variances from the NA/EU version and the Korean version.
Oh and Ninja is not coming out in May too, if you didn't know that already.
Linky:
How about a synopsis of this difference in design desires as I don't feel like listening to a 40 minute video of people babbling about their game. Ever... Thanks.
I didn't get what barasawa said out of that interview. He just jokingly mentions that he likes to PK but sucks at it laughing while making the bigger point that he understands the PVE appeal of the game.
Every poll and discussion I've seen on their site about making it like it is everywhere else with the 49 > 50 quest that enables PVP at that level is more than 2:1 in favor of it.
The funny thing is that some PVE-only people won't be satisfied with that since what they really want is PVE servers or PVE channels, something that is not nearly as popular. Changing it back is actually a good compromise solution that won't satisfy the extremists at either pole but would likely put an end to the bickering about it for the majority.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
I lost the thread somewhere, but someone was whining about using PvP Flags means someone could gank you, and then flip the flag so you couldn't touch them So I have to ask, was he upset over getting ganked? Or does he not know that all the games I've played with a flag have limitations on it resetting. Everything from a set amount of time, to being in faction home territory, to actually having to go through a quest first. (Most of them these days seem to use an out of combat timer of 10-20 minutes.)
There is a list of reasons I have not jumped into this game. One being my wife HATES PvP when she is trying to PvE. Puts her nerves on edge knowing at any min she can be attacked. Wish more MMOs followed the DAoC model. Open world area for PvE and another to PvP. Back to SWToR for me =-)
I completely feel for you. My wife is the same. I'm not worried though. She is having a blast in Blade and Soul. So I can play BDO casually alone.
Most of my friends left when they saw the writing on the wall. If the current system remains intact the PVE'ers will pull out, leaving the remaining PVP'ers with merged server and a couple whale sized competing guilds left to support the game.......gank away.
This should end in a game mostly populated by PvPers with a sprinkling of Hybrids who enjoy both. Would be nice to see if it shakes out that way, validating that argument a little from one point of view or the other.
MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
PvE Players: We don't care about PvP, just let us play the game in peace.
PvP players: Yeah we don't care just let us do out sieges and node wars.
Troll gankers: PvE
players should just leave and they shouldn't get their own server cause
it will be empty and they will have something we don't (easy mode)..
this isn't the game for them. They shouldn't get a toggle cause they
will abuse it all the time...If they leave then we won't have to defend
our spots against masses of PvE players we can't kill and it will
destroy the game.
BDO is a PVP game. As a PVE-only player (in MMORPGs), I am saying "too bad, so sad". It was NEVER advertised as a PVE game. Frankly, I was shocked to learn that PVP was gated until level 45.
But! To the OP's point, I will play this game, make a few videos, level a few characters, do all the PVE stuff (trade activities, investment banking, etc), then move on. Another reason that will make this easy, is I typically enjoy cash shopping in games as a nice diversion, but I refuse to spend money in that gawd-awful over-priced shop for BDO. So, that will also negatively impact the game's longevity for me.
I play plenty of PVP games, like World of Tanks and Heroes of the Storm, and that's plenty PVP for me. Honestly, MMORPGs don't make competitive PVP games, and BDO is no exception there. Having said that, BDO is and always has been a PVP game.
Why do you care how others play the game? If they want to suicide to keep from the pvp so they can enjoy what they want what is it to you? All I see here are people who are salty that their easy prey is not presenting itself to them on a silver platter. Go find a real fight with someone your level.
BDO is a PVP game. As a PVE-only player (in MMORPGs), I am saying "too bad, so sad". It was NEVER advertised as a PVE game. Frankly, I was shocked to learn that PVP was gated until level 45.
But! To the OP's point, I will play this game, make a few videos, level a few characters, do all the PVE stuff (trade activities, investment banking, etc), then move on. Another reason that will make this easy, is I typically enjoy cash shopping in games as a nice diversion, but I refuse to spend money in that gawd-awful over-priced shop for BDO. So, that will also negatively impact the game's longevity for me.
I play plenty of PVP games, like World of Tanks and Heroes of the Storm, and that's plenty PVP for me. Honestly, MMORPGs don't make competitive PVP games, and BDO is no exception there. Having said that, BDO is and always has been a PVP game.
Unfortunately Daum is too retarded to figure out they are catering to a crowd like you who won't stick around long term...so you only solidified my overall point. The game is doomed. xD
Honestly, I'm old AF and I just like making fun of all these people
screaming about how they need to stop people from stealing their mobs
and grind spots, as if it's a new thing to them entirely and they are
being overrun by the mass of people strong arming them out of their
grind spots lol. Because KS is such a problem in Korea, Japan and Russia
we don't do that here in the west....Must defend rofl.
What I see on their forums is this....
PvE players should just leave and they shouldn't get their own server cause it will be empty and they will have something we don't (easy mode).. this isn't the game for them....If they leave then we won't have to defend our spots against PvE players.
And I have a problem with this logic
The really pathetic part is that at this point the only reason to PVP is to fight over grind spots and if you're really lucky, once in a blue moon, that will trigger a larger and infinitely more fun guild vs. guild conflict.
So people get wrapped up in those discussions and pull arguments and counter arguments out their rear ends while ignoring the real issue that the more legitimate reason to PVP that is part of the core game mechanics, fights over regional control and nodes, has been much delayed and is not implemented yet.
Fighting over grind spots is a pretty lame reason to PVP in an alleged PVP game if you think about it.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
It's a really easy fix. Just enable the quest that you have to do to level past 49, and make pvp 50+.
I believe I read the quest is actually still in the game. They just turned off its function.
I think they thought we were going to be a PVP crowd, so lowering the level for it was what they thought we wanted.
Turns out we just want to afk fish.
If they did as you asked, how would they handle complaints from players who already leveled past 50? Offer to roll them back? Let them flag safe at their current 50 plus level? Make them reroll to take advantage?
Not so simple then.
Huh? If they leveled past 50, then they've been pvping since 45. This isn't for them, it's for the people spending time drowning themselves over and over to avoid 45.
If all they wanted to do was afk fish like a lot of people do, they wouldn't have leveled past 45 to begin with.
Or yeah, if you consider it such a big advantage, just roll a fishing alt.
The reason they're not changing this is not because it's difficult or messy. It's actually incredibly simple. It's literally already in the game.
The reason they're not doing it is they're clinging to the hope that we'll start pvping one day. They know the game is based on it and if we don't get into it, it's not promising for the game's future. Not to mention all the content they are developing is post 50. They really want people to get on board.
Anyway, what's your proposed alternative? Make a PVE server? Have PVE channels? Ignore the very large PVE playerbase in the West?
All of these solutions seem much more negative and complicated than flicking a switch on a quest.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
No I'm not playing yet. I just mean "we" as in "the West". They are inching towards a monetization model I can deal with with the free pet thing. And the news that they are looking into adding more craftable costumes is a good sign.
IMO, they will slowly change the mechanics to cater to the PVE crowd. They know its PVE that got them all the revenue they never dreamed of.
So many good design choices were made in this game, that I am fully confident they will deal with ganking stuff properly.
Incorrect, granted they do have the pvp setting at lv45 in the west compared to lv50 in Kr. The pvp setting in the beta's was just to test the system in general, so there was never a slow change to the mechanics...
The community in the west requested and was granted the lower pvp level setting AND a lower karma hit for pking.
Kr's karma is harsh compared to the west and because of that their is hardly no ganking in korea (which i hate).
BDO is a pvp game so don't act surprised if you get melted.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Comments
As a certified carebear and full time EVE player I know what I speak of.
Losing occasionally, it will make you a better person.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!
All Kyarra is doing is describing the game as it is everywhere else.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
There's so much to do other than PvP....sorry you think that this is another PvP game....yer smarter than the rest.
Before you reply.....your sarcasm failed.
"This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."
Thanks.
Lost my mind, now trying to lose yours...
It took me a couple of days of researching before I could find out that it did in fact have non-consensual PvP.
Lots of things are considered PvP, but they are consensual. There is a very important difference.
Lost my mind, now trying to lose yours...
Thanks.
So I have to ask, was he upset over getting ganked? Or does he not know that all the games I've played with a flag have limitations on it resetting. Everything from a set amount of time, to being in faction home territory, to actually having to go through a quest first. (Most of them these days seem to use an out of combat timer of 10-20 minutes.)
Lost my mind, now trying to lose yours...
Every poll and discussion I've seen on their site about making it like it is everywhere else with the 49 > 50 quest that enables PVP at that level is more than 2:1 in favor of it.
The funny thing is that some PVE-only people won't be satisfied with that since what they really want is PVE servers or PVE channels, something that is not nearly as popular. Changing it back is actually a good compromise solution that won't satisfy the extremists at either pole but would likely put an end to the bickering about it for the majority.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/32607-pve-players-can-harass-pvp-players-we-need-proper-flagging-system/&page=1
http://forum.blackdesertonline.com/index.php?/topic/64673-pvers-are-abusing-the-flag-system-and-harassing-pvpers/&page=4 (this one has been moderated I guess)
Official forum backwash.
PvE Players: We don't care about PvP, just let us play the game in peace.
PvP players: Yeah we don't care just let us do out sieges and node wars.
Troll gankers: PvE players should just leave and they shouldn't get their own server cause it will be empty and they will have something we don't (easy mode).. this isn't the game for them. They shouldn't get a toggle cause they will abuse it all the time...If they leave then we won't have to defend our spots against masses of PvE players we can't kill and it will destroy the game.
And I have a problem with this logic.
But! To the OP's point, I will play this game, make a few videos, level a few characters, do all the PVE stuff (trade activities, investment banking, etc), then move on. Another reason that will make this easy, is I typically enjoy cash shopping in games as a nice diversion, but I refuse to spend money in that gawd-awful over-priced shop for BDO. So, that will also negatively impact the game's longevity for me.
I play plenty of PVP games, like World of Tanks and Heroes of the Storm, and that's plenty PVP for me. Honestly, MMORPGs don't make competitive PVP games, and BDO is no exception there. Having said that, BDO is and always has been a PVP game.
So people get wrapped up in those discussions and pull arguments and counter arguments out their rear ends while ignoring the real issue that the more legitimate reason to PVP that is part of the core game mechanics, fights over regional control and nodes, has been much delayed and is not implemented yet.
Fighting over grind spots is a pretty lame reason to PVP in an alleged PVP game if you think about it.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
If all they wanted to do was afk fish like a lot of people do, they wouldn't have leveled past 45 to begin with.
Or yeah, if you consider it such a big advantage, just roll a fishing alt.
The reason they're not changing this is not because it's difficult or messy. It's actually incredibly simple. It's literally already in the game.
The reason they're not doing it is they're clinging to the hope that we'll start pvping one day. They know the game is based on it and if we don't get into it, it's not promising for the game's future. Not to mention all the content they are developing is post 50. They really want people to get on board.
Anyway, what's your proposed alternative? Make a PVE server? Have PVE channels? Ignore the very large PVE playerbase in the West?
All of these solutions seem much more negative and complicated than flicking a switch on a quest.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
The community in the west requested and was granted the lower pvp level setting AND a lower karma hit for pking.
Kr's karma is harsh compared to the west and because of that their is hardly no ganking in korea (which i hate).
BDO is a pvp game so don't act surprised if you get melted.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...