Am I the only one who dislikes separate PvP servers?

Vermillion_Raventhal

When I was reading about Dark and Light it's one thing that is kind of off putting.  It's not that I want to gank people who don't want to be.  It's that generally PvP servers are poorly done. Just kind of a bone to the hardcore with little to no point but ganking in a PvE game.  They are usually empty unless you have hard factions separating the players with few areas of open world PVP.  

SEANMCAD

I have found two separate servers with two separate rule sets allows for more features possible without there being problems.

Wurm Online does the two different rulesets rather well in my mind but to be fair I dont play pvp I have seen enough to understand why it works well.

SEANMCAD

Rhoklaw said:

PvE players and PvP players don't even enjoy the same things in MMO's. The only reason a developer tries to include both on the same server is to give PvP players easy targets. ....

agreed.

that and not wanting to invest in good AI.

Vermillion_Raventhal

SEANMCAD said:

I have found two separate servers with two separate rule sets allows for more features possible without there being problems.

Wurm Online does the two different rulesets rather well in my mind but to be fair I dont play pvp I have seen enough to understand why it works well.

In my experiences the rule sets generally are you can kill each other in what is mostly a PvE game.  I feel like PvP games need to be crafted around it.

coercer02

Whats the problem? I dont get it.. PVP'rs get a PVP server. People that wanna hit brainless mobs all day get their own server. Everyone is happy. 

SEANMCAD

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

SEANMCAD said:

I have found two separate servers with two separate rule sets allows for more features possible without there being problems.

Wurm Online does the two different rulesets rather well in my mind but to be fair I dont play pvp I have seen enough to understand why it works well.

In my experiences the rule sets generally are you can kill each other in what is mostly a PvE game.  I feel like PvP games need to be crafted around it.

yes developers try to craft PvP around a PvE game which is my point in that it doesnt work.

I have found a rule set that is 100% focused on the PvP player with total disregard to the desires and a PvE player to make a very good outstanding PvP game.


the two camps really can not coexist in a game that is outstanding for either.

flizzer

Actually it is my preferred method of playing in a game.  Keep the gankfest/psycho types on the PvP server and leave the rest of us alone.  I wish more games would implement this idea. 

Vermillion_Raventhal

Rhoklaw said:

PvE players and PvP players don't even enjoy the same things in MMO's. The only reason a developer tries to include both on the same server is to give PvP players easy targets. It's really that simple. The only way you will make PvE players happy in an MMO with any sort of PvP is either A - safe zones or B - PvP flag system and we don't see many PvP players promoting those types of games. I wonder why that is.

Of course, most advocates are going to want it their way and be more hardcore PvE or PvP.  

Flag systems and security levels seem to be the easiest ways to have inclusive PvP.  A loy of players will PvP but nobody wants to be ganked and hounded with no recourse.  A system needs to give unwarranted PvP accountable.  

Amaranthar

I'd much prefer one server. But these games aren't willing to do what it takes to remove, or drastically reduce, rampant PKing, which is to put a real Justice System in. Something that works.
Or alternately, a system that depends on a social order of things and gives players an incentive to defend against that sort of lawless, chaotic, unrealistic, constant "king of the hill" stuff.

So, assuming someone makes a game I want to play (and I've become much more hard to please since I've found I don't need an MMO anymore), I'll stay away from that sort of PvP. And I love good PvP with meaning and not stalking me at all times.

Vermillion_Raventhal

coercer02 said:

Whats the problem? I dont get it.. PVP'rs get a PVP server. People that wanna hit brainless mobs all day get their own server. Everyone is happy. 

Some of us rather not play a PvE game that let's us pointlessly just gank.  It also cuts out a lot of participants who only dabble leaving small server populations.

 

SavageHorizon

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

When I was reading about Dark and Light it's one thing that is kind of off putting.  It's not that I want to gank people who don't want to be.  It's that generally PvP servers are poorly done. Just kind of a bone to the hardcore with little to no point but ganking in a PvE game.  They are usually empty unless you have hard factions separating the players with few areas of open world PVP.  

Lol poor you! 

Wait so I though PVP was the in thing now in mmo lol,  ah I get it you need PVE players to make your server feel more alive because there is not enough of you pvp lol. 

Well unfortunately for Dnl will have separate servers, don't like  it then don't play the game. At last devs are going back to how it used to be. 

You like PVP then go play on a PVP server and the same goes for PVE player's. 

nariusseldon

Amaranthar said:

I'd much prefer one server. But these games aren't willing to do what it takes to remove, or drastically reduce, rampant PKing, which is to put a real Justice System in. Something that works.

Why bother when you can just make pvp consensual? These are games. If players don't want any pvp in their game, is there a reason not to give it to them? And for those who are willing to risk pvp, give it to them too.

Even if you don't give them different servers, people will just choose games. No one can force me to play a pve/pvp game. 

SEANMCAD

Amaranthar said:

I'd much prefer one server. But these games aren't willing to do what it takes to remove, or drastically reduce, rampant PKing, which is to put a real Justice System in. Something that works.
Or alternately, a system that depends on a social order of things and gives players an incentive to defend against that sort of lawless, chaotic, unrealistic, constant "king of the hill" stuff.

So, assuming someone makes a game I want to play (and I've become much more hard to please since I've found I don't need an MMO anymore), I'll stay away from that sort of PvP. And I love good PvP with meaning and not stalking me at all times.

I dont think that would work well.

The end result would be pvp gankers who are unhappy because their toon is permanently in jail, PvE and territorial pvp players unhappy while the gankers were not in jail and when they are in jail its as if the system didnt exist in the first place. leaving a lot of code written for nothing

SirBalin

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

When I was reading about Dark and Light it's one thing that is kind of off putting.  It's not that I want to gank people who don't want to be.  It's that generally PvP servers are poorly done. Just kind of a bone to the hardcore with little to no point but ganking in a PvE game.  They are usually empty unless you have hard factions separating the players with few areas of open world PVP.  

The problem is that companies have to make two totally different styles of players happy and in the end neither side will be content.  By having a pve server with consensual pvp you make the pvers happy and the casual pvp core or arena pvp group happy.  Your owpvp group is going to need a ruleset that the most pvers won't like...so...you just can't make both sides happy.  

Ikeda

You stay in your PvP happy land.  Every time you've invaded my PvE-centric realm the PvP'rs have ruined it completely with their asshattery.

Vermillion_Raventhal

SEANMCAD said:

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

SEANMCAD said:

I have found two separate servers with two separate rule sets allows for more features possible without there being problems.

Wurm Online does the two different rulesets rather well in my mind but to be fair I dont play pvp I have seen enough to understand why it works well.

In my experiences the rule sets generally are you can kill each other in what is mostly a PvE game.  I feel like PvP games need to be crafted around it.

yes developers try to craft PvP around a PvE game which is my point in that it doesnt work.

I have found a rule set that is 100% focused on the PvP player with total disregard to the desires and a PvE player to make a very good outstanding PvP game.


the two camps really can not coexist in a game that is outstanding for either.

I think even most PvP games are designed poorly. Too many play to crush,  might makes right types who wonder why their low budget games never pick up steam.  Sorry if I don't trust a developer who is making two rule sets.  

I rather have SWG style than separate servers if it's going to amount to hitting you can now be killed switch as the different rule set.

SavageHorizon

Perhaps you PVP should play there other game coming out. 

Age Of Wushu 2

SEANMCAD

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

SEANMCAD said:

I have found two separate servers with two separate rule sets allows for more features possible without there being problems.

Wurm Online does the two different rulesets rather well in my mind but to be fair I dont play pvp I have seen enough to understand why it works well.

In my experiences the rule sets generally are you can kill each other in what is mostly a PvE game.  I feel like PvP games need to be crafted around it.

yes developers try to craft PvP around a PvE game which is my point in that it doesnt work.

I have found a rule set that is 100% focused on the PvP player with total disregard to the desires and a PvE player to make a very good outstanding PvP game.


the two camps really can not coexist in a game that is outstanding for either.

I think even most PvP games are designed poorly. Too many play to crush,  might makes right types who wonder why their low budget games never pick up steam.  Sorry if I don't trust a developer who is making two rule sets.  

I rather have SWG style than separate servers if it's going to amount to hitting you can now be killed switch as the different rule set.

lol...

no low budget games dont get more players almost always because of marketing.

Having said that I cant speak much to PvP specifically but i do feel comfortable that PvP and PvE do not mix well like ever.

as a side note if i was a pvp player I would play this:
http://store.steampowered.com/app/327090/

Grunty

One of the main benefits of creating separate PVE and PVP servers is the removal of the PVPer's non-stop verbal abuse of others from the chat.  

Vermillion_Raventhal

SavageHorizon said:

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

When I was reading about Dark and Light it's one thing that is kind of off putting.  It's not that I want to gank people who don't want to be.  It's that generally PvP servers are poorly done. Just kind of a bone to the hardcore with little to no point but ganking in a PvE game.  They are usually empty unless you have hard factions separating the players with few areas of open world PVP.  

Lol poor you! 

Wait so I though PVP was the in thing now in mmo lol,  ah I get it you need PVE players to make your server feel more alive because there is not enough of you pvp lol. 

Well unfortunately for Dnl will have separate servers, don't like  it then don't play the game. At last devs are going back to how it used to be. 

You like PVP then go play on a PVP server and the same goes for PVE player's. 

PvP in MMORPG is different.  Simply taking a PvE game and slapping a kill switch is not good enough to attract anyone.  Unless it does like WoW or SWTOR where you can barely tell the difference because your in faction land half the time.

Cogohi

Painting all PvP'er's as gankers is a bit broad.  If one looks at the rise of MOBAs it seems that even most PvP fans aren't all that enamored of gank-style play either.

Maurgrim

I'm all for PVP, I used to PVP a lot in EVE both in alliance wars, small ganker gangs in low sec to just pure random killing, but thats in EVE, I havent played one good single fantasy setting MMO were both PVP and PVE works side by side and I really doubt It will work in D&L either so i will play on a PVE server.

There are way to many wannabe hardcore PVPers and psychos in fantasy setting MMOs that has open world PVP that the games gets ruined by them and most of the PVErs move on to another game.

So seperate PVE and PVP in D&L is a really good call from the devs If they want to keep as many players as possible.

SavageHorizon

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

SavageHorizon said:

Vermillion_Raventhal said:

When I was reading about Dark and Light it's one thing that is kind of off putting.  It's not that I want to gank people who don't want to be.  It's that generally PvP servers are poorly done. Just kind of a bone to the hardcore with little to no point but ganking in a PvE game.  They are usually empty unless you have hard factions separating the players with few areas of open world PVP.  

Lol poor you! 

Wait so I though PVP was the in thing now in mmo lol,  ah I get it you need PVE players to make your server feel more alive because there is not enough of you pvp lol. 

Well unfortunately for Dnl will have separate servers, don't like  it then don't play the game. At last devs are going back to how it used to be. 

You like PVP then go play on a PVP server and the same goes for PVE player's. 

PvP in MMORPG is different.  Simply taking a PvE game and slapping a kill switch is not good enough to attract anyone.  Unless it does like WoW or SWTOR where you can barely tell the difference because your in faction land half the time.

It's not going to change, you will have to go find a mmo that has what you want. So how is PVPers doing PVE on your server any different. 

It's  not so what it really comes down to is not enough pvpers to fill your server. 


Suck it up lol. 

Vermillion_Raventhal

Cogohi said:

Painting all PvP'er's as gankers is a bit broad.  If one looks at the rise of MOBAs it seems that even most PvP fans aren't all that enamored of gank-style play either.

Actually I am not.  It goes along with my point that most PvP aren't gankers. But bad rule sets on PvP servers will lead to the server catering to only them.  

Aeander

PvP players need PvE players. PvE players do not need nor want PvP players. It is better for most of your community - the PvE side - that the PvP players go off to stay in their own little corner.

Vermillion_Raventhal

Aeander said:

PvP players need PvE players. PvE players do not need nor want PvP players. It is better for most of your community - the PvE side - that the PvP players go off to stay in their own little corner.

PvPs don't need PVE if there are competent rules in place.