Bless - Neowiz on Buy to Play, the Item Shop, Emissaries & More - MMORPG.com

SBFord

Bless - Neowiz on Buy to Play, the Item Shop, Emissaries & More - MMORPG.com

Today is a huge day for fans of Bless Online with the announcement of the May Steam Early Access program and the debut of the new site. We managed to corral the devs to ask them a few questions on a wide array of subjects. You won't want to miss this one!

Read the full story here

alooi_m

I really hoped to have Mystic on EA o well gotta think of a class to play with until Mystic comes out

Albatroes

Wanting that money up front incase it fails for a third time, I can't blame them, but maybe it'll pull a BDO or something and not be that big of a barrier to entry. BDO started out as 30$ then dropped quick to 10$ with stat based costumes that cost triple the price of the base game, but no one seems to be complaining.

Sovrath

Torval said:

I hope this signals the advent of raising the entry bar for players. I think that is risky for developers wanting mass appeal, but I also think it's best for the industry and players overall. The problem is I don't have a lot of confidence pvp players can or will keep a game afloat, but that is a systemic issue and not a problem with Bless alone.

Mandatory pvp and the pve pill system. It's great that they're actually listening and trying to accomodate fans interested in the game. I don't think that system is going to work well or be a long term solution.

I'm a pve player. Say I buy the game, the only outlook I see for the future is an endless money hole of pve pills. That's not an attractive feature than inspires me to purchase the game. It's also clunky to manage in the long run. It's a pvp game and they should stand on that or make adjustments. It's futile for them to hope pve players will become enlightened and want to pvp. The same way it's not realistic for players to expect the game to eventually change and become pve while still retaining its core design.

Neowiz still has a mass appeal mindset but their game and revenue system work for more niche games.

The game does have raids and dungeons so that "should" work for pve players. As long as they continue to add that content I don't necessarily see a problem.

MadFrenchie

Sovrath said:

Torval said:

I hope this signals the advent of raising the entry bar for players. I think that is risky for developers wanting mass appeal, but I also think it's best for the industry and players overall. The problem is I don't have a lot of confidence pvp players can or will keep a game afloat, but that is a systemic issue and not a problem with Bless alone.

Mandatory pvp and the pve pill system. It's great that they're actually listening and trying to accomodate fans interested in the game. I don't think that system is going to work well or be a long term solution.

I'm a pve player. Say I buy the game, the only outlook I see for the future is an endless money hole of pve pills. That's not an attractive feature than inspires me to purchase the game. It's also clunky to manage in the long run. It's a pvp game and they should stand on that or make adjustments. It's futile for them to hope pve players will become enlightened and want to pvp. The same way it's not realistic for players to expect the game to eventually change and become pve while still retaining its core design.

Neowiz still has a mass appeal mindset but their game and revenue system work for more niche games.

The game does have raids and dungeons so that "should" work for pve players. As long as they continue to add that content I don't necessarily see a problem.

It's adding an additional tax to players who want a certain experience.  That's fairly discouraging.

I agree with @Torval, if they want to release a PvP game, by all means.  While adding this consumable system may net them some extra cash, I can't see it ending well in terms of player experience.

Dragnelus

Bless Online Team: There will not be separate PVE or PVP servers, but we understand that many players do not wish to partake in PVP until it’s on their own terms. To help with this, there will be a consumable item that players can buy in-game to make them non-PVP enabled. This will work all the way to the level cap, last for a time, and has no cooldown. At the level cap, the item will still be obtainable, but via the Cash Shop


Good news for pvers

Sovrath

MadFrenchie said:

Sovrath said:

Torval said:

I hope this signals the advent of raising the entry bar for players. I think that is risky for developers wanting mass appeal, but I also think it's best for the industry and players overall. The problem is I don't have a lot of confidence pvp players can or will keep a game afloat, but that is a systemic issue and not a problem with Bless alone.

Mandatory pvp and the pve pill system. It's great that they're actually listening and trying to accomodate fans interested in the game. I don't think that system is going to work well or be a long term solution.

I'm a pve player. Say I buy the game, the only outlook I see for the future is an endless money hole of pve pills. That's not an attractive feature than inspires me to purchase the game. It's also clunky to manage in the long run. It's a pvp game and they should stand on that or make adjustments. It's futile for them to hope pve players will become enlightened and want to pvp. The same way it's not realistic for players to expect the game to eventually change and become pve while still retaining its core design.

Neowiz still has a mass appeal mindset but their game and revenue system work for more niche games.

The game does have raids and dungeons so that "should" work for pve players. As long as they continue to add that content I don't necessarily see a problem.

It's adding an additional tax to players who want a certain experience.  That's fairly discouraging.

I agree with @Torval, if they want to release a PvP game, by all means.  While adding this consumable system may net them some extra cash, I can't see it ending well in terms of player experience.

I guess this is a half empty/half full scenario. I don't look at it as "adding a tax to players who want a certain experience". Though it's not a bad analogy for some.

I look at it as "hey, there's a game that I want to play but a portion of it is not to my liking. There is a way to bypass that so I CAN enjoy the game in a way that I desire even though it's not how the game was originally intended."

Asm0deus

Dragnelus said:

Bless Online Team: There will not be separate PVE or PVP servers, but we understand that many players do not wish to partake in PVP until it’s on their own terms. To help with this, there will be a consumable item that players can buy in-game to make them non-PVP enabled. This will work all the way to the level cap, last for a time, and has no cooldown. At the level cap, the item will still be obtainable, but via the Cash Shop


Good news for pvers

Meh.. so you will have to pay in game money to toggle pvp off and at cap you will have to pay cash shop money to toggle pvp off.


As a mostly pve player I find this a turn off an feel it doesn't bode well for pvers, they should have just added a pvp toggle/flag.

Kumapon

At endgame you should have a flying mount. So if your a PVE player that is a good way to avoid pvp. Also most dungeons and raids you can port to, so that is another way of avoiding pvp. 

It's not the best, but it is a solution if you just want to pve.  

Sovrath

Kumapon said:

At endgame you should have a flying mount. So if your a PVE player that is a good way to avoid pvp. Also most dungeons and raids you can port to, so that is another way of avoiding pvp. 

Nah, I don't think that's going to be true at all.

You eventually have to land and "do things" so that's where you are going to get attacked. And if they add a way that one can do combat in the air then that takes care of the other part.

Nope, this is a pvp game that has decided that if pve players want to play and NOT do pvp then they need to purchase something to bypass the system and only pvp on their terms.

I personally don't have an issue with it but I would suggest that pve players who aren't interested in a pvp game should go elsewhere (well, more so if they have an issue with purchasing an item to bypass the system).

ConstantineMerus

Torval said:

Sovrath said:

Torval said:

I hope this signals the advent of raising the entry bar for players. I think that is risky for developers wanting mass appeal, but I also think it's best for the industry and players overall. The problem is I don't have a lot of confidence pvp players can or will keep a game afloat, but that is a systemic issue and not a problem with Bless alone.

Mandatory pvp and the pve pill system. It's great that they're actually listening and trying to accomodate fans interested in the game. I don't think that system is going to work well or be a long term solution.

I'm a pve player. Say I buy the game, the only outlook I see for the future is an endless money hole of pve pills. That's not an attractive feature than inspires me to purchase the game. It's also clunky to manage in the long run. It's a pvp game and they should stand on that or make adjustments. It's futile for them to hope pve players will become enlightened and want to pvp. The same way it's not realistic for players to expect the game to eventually change and become pve while still retaining its core design.

Neowiz still has a mass appeal mindset but their game and revenue system work for more niche games.

The game does have raids and dungeons so that "should" work for pve players. As long as they continue to add that content I don't necessarily see a problem.

Because without the pill you're flagged. Up until you hit level cap it's just an in game gold sink. After that it becomes a constant trip to the cash shop for them. I'm a pve player and jumping through those hoops to play my mmo how I like is a problem. I doubt I'm alone in that.

What I wouldn't ask them to do is change their game. I do think they should hear that while I think their idea is thinking in the right direction, it won't likely work for this pve player.

So having dungeons and raid instances aren't a pve selling point to me. That's not pve mmo gameplay for me. To me those are like the reductive and somewhat perverted distillation of mmo pve gameplay in a tiny little instanced package. For me that is akin to trying fine art with 4 colors and a paint-by-numbers canvas. It might be fun for a one off experience but it's not where I'd want to spend my creative energies.

I'm not the mainstream mmo gamer type either. I'm the kind that creates characters and personas that inhabit virtual worlds, not the person who makes toons to grind dailes. Maybe for them this will work great. For my type of antiquated dinosaur it probably won't.

Well we dinosaurs have been leading our PvE lives in PvP servers for long. When WoW came PvE servers had no PvE progression and you had to roll on a PvP server. I remember many nagged about this situation and after 5 years and 7 billion free migrations the game came to a balance between servers. It was annoying, but not game breaking or joy shattering.

What I mean is when you like a game, that problem is tolerable. And the rare times it gives you a headache, take a magic pill. I'd take the real life version because it is more fun (wheee) but now there's a virtual one, too. 

Diegoboi02

I think one line people are over looking in regards to the pvp off potion at max level is that you can earn cash shop currency in game. You don't have to use irl currency to pay for it. Which I believe is a well thought out compromise. Now, we'll have to see the cash shop prices and how much cash shop currency we can earn in game.

Kumapon

Sovrath said:

Kumapon said:

At endgame you should have a flying mount. So if your a PVE player that is a good way to avoid pvp. Also most dungeons and raids you can port to, so that is another way of avoiding pvp. 

Nah, I don't think that's going to be true at all.

You eventually have to land and "do things" so that's where you are going to get attacked. And if they add a way that one can do combat in the air then that takes care of the other part.

Nope, this is a pvp game that has decided that if pve players want to play and NOT do pvp then they need to purchase something to bypass the system and only pvp on their terms.

I personally don't have an issue with it but I would suggest that pve players who aren't interested in a pvp game should go elsewhere (well, more so if they have an issue with purchasing an item to bypass the system).

Sovrath said:

Kumapon said:

At endgame you should have a flying mount. So if your a PVE player that is a good way to avoid pvp. Also most dungeons and raids you can port to, so that is another way of avoiding pvp. 

Nah, I don't think that's going to be true at all.

You eventually have to land and "do things" so that's where you are going to get attacked. And if they add a way that one can do combat in the air then that takes care of the other part.

Nope, this is a pvp game that has decided that if pve players want to play and NOT do pvp then they need to purchase something to bypass the system and only pvp on their terms.

I personally don't have an issue with it but I would suggest that pve players who aren't interested in a pvp game should go elsewhere (well, more so if they have an issue with purchasing an item to bypass the system).

No I can totally understand. This is a PVP game first and foremost. But PVP is faction based. Your own faction can't kill you. 

Dauzqul

So you can buy a drink that will enable PvP Protection?

"Excuse me, Merchant. I would like to buy a "Expresso latté pussé".

slowz2secret

Thanks for the buy to play model, If i were free to play i would not touch it.

Sovrath

Torval said:

Sovrath said:

Torval said:

I hope this signals the advent of raising the entry bar for players. I think that is risky for developers wanting mass appeal, but I also think it's best for the industry and players overall. The problem is I don't have a lot of confidence pvp players can or will keep a game afloat, but that is a systemic issue and not a problem with Bless alone.

Mandatory pvp and the pve pill system. It's great that they're actually listening and trying to accomodate fans interested in the game. I don't think that system is going to work well or be a long term solution.

I'm a pve player. Say I buy the game, the only outlook I see for the future is an endless money hole of pve pills. That's not an attractive feature than inspires me to purchase the game. It's also clunky to manage in the long run. It's a pvp game and they should stand on that or make adjustments. It's futile for them to hope pve players will become enlightened and want to pvp. The same way it's not realistic for players to expect the game to eventually change and become pve while still retaining its core design.

Neowiz still has a mass appeal mindset but their game and revenue system work for more niche games.

The game does have raids and dungeons so that "should" work for pve players. As long as they continue to add that content I don't necessarily see a problem.

Because without the pill you're flagged. Up until you hit level cap it's just an in game gold sink. After that it becomes a constant trip to the cash shop for them. I'm a pve player and jumping through those hoops to play my mmo how I like is a problem. I doubt I'm alone in that.

What I wouldn't ask them to do is change their game. I do think they should hear that while I think their idea is thinking in the right direction, it won't likely work for this pve player.

So having dungeons and raid instances aren't a pve selling point to me. That's not pve mmo gameplay for me. To me those are like the reductive and somewhat perverted distillation of mmo pve gameplay in a tiny little instanced package. For me that is akin to trying fine art with 4 colors and a paint-by-numbers canvas. It might be fun for a one off experience but it's not where I'd want to spend my creative energies.

I'm not the mainstream mmo gamer type either. I'm the kind that creates characters and personas that inhabit virtual worlds, not the person who makes toons to grind dailes. Maybe for them this will work great. For my type of antiquated dinosaur it probably won't.

Torval, are you a Black Desert player by chance?

Sovrath

Torval said:

Sovrath said:

Torval said:

Sovrath said:

The game does have raids and dungeons so that "should" work for pve players. As long as they continue to add that content I don't necessarily see a problem.

Because without the pill you're flagged. Up until you hit level cap it's just an in game gold sink. After that it becomes a constant trip to the cash shop for them. I'm a pve player and jumping through those hoops to play my mmo how I like is a problem. I doubt I'm alone in that.

What I wouldn't ask them to do is change their game. I do think they should hear that while I think their idea is thinking in the right direction, it won't likely work for this pve player.

So having dungeons and raid instances aren't a pve selling point to me. That's not pve mmo gameplay for me. To me those are like the reductive and somewhat perverted distillation of mmo pve gameplay in a tiny little instanced package. For me that is akin to trying fine art with 4 colors and a paint-by-numbers canvas. It might be fun for a one off experience but it's not where I'd want to spend my creative energies.

I'm not the mainstream mmo gamer type either. I'm the kind that creates characters and personas that inhabit virtual worlds, not the person who makes toons to grind dailes. Maybe for them this will work great. For my type of antiquated dinosaur it probably won't.

Torval, are you a Black Desert player by chance?

I did buy BDO. I've not played it much. It was going to mention it in a post, but I think I edited that out because it got long. 

It's an example of a game with eventual mandatory pvp where I like how they set it that system. They seem to have changed their game a little without really changing their core focus, but they don't make you jump through hoops to play the way you like.

Also there is so much to do outside of themepark style instance runs that it feels like much more than "just a pvp game". I think it's quite an amazing game in many ways. I've not played much since I bought (it was on sale a month or so ago) simply due to work and other games I'm working through. I am very much looking forward to digging into it. 

I consider myself a pve player, but it's not entirely true. I have enjoyed a couple open pvp games (Lineage 1 was my first MMO), but I'm very picky and it's more accurate to say most pvp setups/rulesets don't appeal to me at all. It's easier just to say I'm a pve player.

Yeah, I was going to suggest that you try it as there really is quite a lot to do in the game. Oh sure there are issues (in my opinion) with the enchanting system but I pretty much just purchase already enchanted gear as I'm done with dealing with failstacks.

Someone mentioned (at some point) that the enchanting system was going to be reworked but I've seen no evidence of that.

Albatroes

I mean if they can implement an item to make it so you're not flagged for pve, they can just as easily put in a toggle. This isn't something that should be on the side if you're buying to play the title, nor will it hinder the game if its toggled. Not everyone likes to pvp all the time which is why games with pve servers and battlegrounds for pvp tend to be more successful. Even wow has more populated pve only servers compared to pvp only (which wont matter in BfA since they are adopting a toggle system as well which will just phase you onto a pvp/pve version of the area).

bamwalla

I like their choices so far. Buy to play does help with the bots and people that come to a F2P just to poop on it. Help -- not eliminate of course. PvP flagging is an interesting take, it's something I hope they keep a close eye on in EA. I guess we will see if the EA is just a cash grab or if they are really looking to improve the game and make it work for their western audience.

Sovrath

Albatroes said:

I mean if they can implement an item to make it so you're not flagged for pve, they can just as easily put in a toggle. This isn't something that should be on the side if you're buying to play the title, nor will it hinder the game if its toggled. Not everyone likes to pvp all the time which is why games with pve servers and battlegrounds for pvp tend to be more successful. Even wow has more populated pve only servers compared to pvp only (which wont matter in BfA since they are adopting a toggle system as well which will just phase you onto a pvp/pve version of the area).

I think they want to make a pvp rvr game that has a lot for pve for players. I think they don't want to have to really go into a huge pve focus yet realize that their game could attract some pve oriented players so they implemented this items to do two things ...

1, allow pve oriented players to experience the game and perhaps try pvp and hopefully find it fun enough to continue and if they still don't want to pvp ...

2, allow pve oriented players to play the game and eventually at cap, make a decision to purchase an item that makes them a little money.

They "could" have  toggle but that would mean that they would still have to cater to and expand pve offerings. At end game the game is mostly a pvp game. They don't want to go into a robust pve direction.

Dragnelus

Woops just found out that item to disable pvp for a time is "peace dove" it will disable pvp 10 min, consumed on use.

Like they said on this Q&A "last for a time"


http://bless-source.com/forum/index.php/Thread/16597-pve-server/

masterboemi6

B2P. I will just wait for Crowfall

Jamar870

Well I'll be watching for everyone here that buys into the game for their take on it. If it comes off fairly good I might take the plunge.

Tiller

Asm0deus said:

Dragnelus said:

Bless Online Team: There will not be separate PVE or PVP servers, but we understand that many players do not wish to partake in PVP until it’s on their own terms. To help with this, there will be a consumable item that players can buy in-game to make them non-PVP enabled. This will work all the way to the level cap, last for a time, and has no cooldown. At the level cap, the item will still be obtainable, but via the Cash Shop





Good news for pvers

Meh.. so you will have to pay in game money to toggle pvp off and at cap you will have to pay cash shop money to toggle pvp off.


As a mostly pve player I find this a turn off an feel it doesn't bode well for pvers, they should have just added a pvp toggle/flag.

Yeah I don't understand why not one studio has ever looked at the TEF/flag system swg had as an option. It's either all PvP or all PVE with stupid arenas for PvP. Why can't we have both?

Sovrath

Tiller said:

Asm0deus said:

Dragnelus said:

Bless Online Team: There will not be separate PVE or PVP servers, but we understand that many players do not wish to partake in PVP until it’s on their own terms. To help with this, there will be a consumable item that players can buy in-game to make them non-PVP enabled. This will work all the way to the level cap, last for a time, and has no cooldown. At the level cap, the item will still be obtainable, but via the Cash Shop





Good news for pvers

Meh.. so you will have to pay in game money to toggle pvp off and at cap you will have to pay cash shop money to toggle pvp off.


As a mostly pve player I find this a turn off an feel it doesn't bode well for pvers, they should have just added a pvp toggle/flag.

Yeah I don't understand why not one studio has ever looked at the TEF/flag system swg had as an option. It's either all PvP or all PVE with stupid arenas for PvP. Why can't we have both?

Because, as I mentioned above, they would have to invest time and resources creating a robust and full pve (or in the case of other games "pvp") experience.

If a game such as this has the "option of just pve" then they are solely interested in a pvp experience but allowing others to at least dive into some sort of pve experience.

Same with games such as Lord of the Rings online that allow for pvp but the game is really a pve game.

Having a toggle is more about choice but a choice to experience either a full pvp or full pve experience.

If they aren't interested in making a full pvp as well as a full pve experience then saying they have both is just going to invite criticism from the people who expect their chosen playstyle to be great. Otherwise people will rightly say "it feels tacked on".

IceAge

masterboemi6 said:

B2P. I will just wait for Crowfall

Glad you do.

P2W over there ---> Crowfall