Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
I don’t think you understand how this thing works. Discussions and arguments require 2 sides. Otherwise you just have an echo chamber. That’s why I have never blocked anyone... even you. I would welcome 100 CoE diehards. Especially if they joined the greater forums.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
OK.. list me the crowdfunded MMORPGs that have launched where the defenders were proven right and the game was a big hit (that matched the hype). You said you could state a "bunch of games" so I'll wait.
1) My statement was "I can also state a bunch of game names that people said similar statements about and were proven right" which was in regards to hyped games. There are plenty of widely successful crowdfunding games that live up to the hype, my favorite of which is Divinity 2.
Crowdfunding is still relatively new. Any MMO game funded on this new platforms are still well within the typical 5-7 year MMO development timeframe.
3) AoC is not a crowdfunding game by classic definition. It's a triple A start up that utilized the crowdfunding platform to bring people on board. AoC is not reliant on the backers money to finish the game, it's already funded. So you restricting it to crowdfunding comparison is beyond dishonest.
TL;DR You shouldn't make sweeping generalizations about different projects and judge them all as the same based on one attribute they may or may not share.
You really wriggle to defend your game. It’s much easier to be game agnostic
For number 1, we are clearly discussing MMORPGs so mentioning Divinity is silly.
For number 2, I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype. While we do have plenty that clearly did not: PFO, SotA, Mortal Online, The Exiled... I think the only one treading water is Albion Online but even that didn’t get close to the Hype.
For number 3, do you have any proof at all other than someone’s non-binding comment that they have $30M of their own money to invest? Might I remind you also that Star Citizen has about $200,000,000. Might I remind you that CU only got a piece of funding from backers and the rest (the majority) came from MJ and investors? Crowfall also raised a bunch of money from actual VC and investors and nod backers. Those are all Crowdfunded games. So is AoC.
The fans of CoE, CU and Crowfall feel the same way about their game as you do about AoC. You are at the “Hopes and Dreams” point if development. We Harbingers have seen this story play out many times. It’s OK to have your hope, but don’t get blinded by it.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
The biggest joke is all of the AoC white knights / affiliate junkies who run around saying the game is fully funded at $30M despite zero evidence and that it is the largest MMO in development even tough Amazon, NC Soft and maybe CCP are working on MMOs.
The oldest trick in the MLM book is to throw around big impressive numbers about your operation like $30M and 100+ staff to pass themselves off as legitimate even though these numbers cannot be verified.
We will see if the decision to use UE4 which has given them good marketing montages and a development head start will pan out.
@Jacobin You are right about MLM guys, never trust & always doublecheck. Say, if you go to their team page (https://www.ashesofcreation.com/the-team/) you'll see a small team of 28 people enlisted, furthermore with only 4 programmers(!) - heroically trying to make an MMORPG in UE4.
You'll also notice that skeleton crew is mostly made of designers, animators and artists!?
You really wriggle to defend your game. It’s much easier to be game agnostic
For number 1, we are clearly discussing MMORPGs so mentioning Divinity is silly.
For number 2, I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype. While we do have plenty that clearly did not: PFO, SotA, Mortal Online, The Exiled... I think the only one treading water is Albion Online but even that didn’t get close to the Hype.
For number 3, do you have any proof at all other than someone’s non-binding comment that they have $30M of their own money to invest? Might I remind you also that Star Citizen has about $200,000,000. Might I remind you that CU only got a piece of funding from backers and the rest (the majority) came from MJ and investors? Crowfall also raised a bunch of money from actual VC and investors and nod backers. Those are all Crowdfunded games. So is AoC.
The fans of CoE, CU and Crowfall feel the same way about their game as you do about AoC. You are at the “Hopes and Dreams” point if development. We Harbingers have seen this story play out many times. It’s OK to have your hope, but don’t get blinded by it.
1) We are discussing HYPED games, that is the whole topic of the OP.
2) Kickstarter was founded in 2009 so 9 years ago. Shadow Run was Kickstarted in 2012, Camelot Unchained in 2013, Pantheon in 2014, Crowfall in 2015, CoE in 2016, AoC in 2017. Notice a trend? Oh yah they all are in the timeframe I gave of 5-7 years to develop an MMO. "I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype" was your argument. You're hiding behind a self imposed sample size that's in its infancy. Now apply that same statement to MMO's as a whole outside of crowdfunding and your whole position falls apart.
3)Do you have any proof at all other than someone's non-binding comment for ANY game in development? Even big company games like Amazon's New World? Outside of a number on a website "tracking" funding numbers, I doubt you'll find any "proof" that any game has the funding they claim if you're going to become a full blown conspiracy theorist.
AAA games are typically at the $60 mil mark and above. Crowfall and Camelot are just barely at $20 mil with the combined funds and years of crowdfunding. AoC sold 10,000 of their $500 pre-order packs in the few months they opened the shop back up. That's an additional 5 mil from just one package tier alone. If that trend continues they'll easily smash the 60 mil mark if they haven't already.
You really wriggle to defend your game. It’s much easier to be game agnostic
For number 1, we are clearly discussing MMORPGs so mentioning Divinity is silly.
For number 2, I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype. While we do have plenty that clearly did not: PFO, SotA, Mortal Online, The Exiled... I think the only one treading water is Albion Online but even that didn’t get close to the Hype.
For number 3, do you have any proof at all other than someone’s non-binding comment that they have $30M of their own money to invest? Might I remind you also that Star Citizen has about $200,000,000. Might I remind you that CU only got a piece of funding from backers and the rest (the majority) came from MJ and investors? Crowfall also raised a bunch of money from actual VC and investors and nod backers. Those are all Crowdfunded games. So is AoC.
The fans of CoE, CU and Crowfall feel the same way about their game as you do about AoC. You are at the “Hopes and Dreams” point if development. We Harbingers have seen this story play out many times. It’s OK to have your hope, but don’t get blinded by it.
1) We are discussing HYPED games, that is the whole topic of the OP.
2) Kickstarter was founded in 2009 so 9 years ago. Shadow Run was Kickstarted in 2012, Camelot Unchained in 2013, Pantheon in 2014, Crowfall in 2015, CoE in 2016, AoC in 2017. Notice a trend? Oh yah they all are in the timeframe I gave of 5-7 years to develop an MMO. "I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype" was your argument. You're hiding behind a self imposed sample size that's in its infancy. Now apply that same statement to MMO's as a whole outside of crowdfunding and your whole position falls apart.
3)Do you have any proof at all other than someone's non-binding comment for ANY game in development? Even big company games like Amazon's New World? Outside of a number on a website "tracking" funding numbers, I doubt you'll find any "proof" that any game has the funding they claim if you're going to become a full blown conspiracy theorist.
AAA games are typically at the $60 mil mark and above. Crowfall and Camelot are just barely at $20 mil with the combined funds and years of crowdfunding. AoC sold 10,000 of their $500 pre-order packs in the few months they opened the shop back up. That's an additional 5 mil from just one package tier alone. If that trend continues they'll easily smash the 60 mil mark if they haven't already.
1. Hyped MMORPGs... Its the Hype meter on MMORPG.COM...
2. I will take that as confirmation that we only have negatives and zero that have lived up to the hype.
3. So we agree that AoC is in the same boat as the others mentioned. All Crowdfunded games.
Thanks
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
I don’t think you understand how this thing works. Discussions and arguments require 2 sides. Otherwise you just have an echo chamber. That’s why I have never blocked anyone... even you. I would welcome 100 CoE diehards. Especially if they joined the greater forums.
Eh, well... With discussions and arguments you still usually end up with an echo chamber. With 2 sides, you just have twice as many echoes
A conversation between you and Ungood is a good example of a 2-sided echo chamber
Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
I don’t think you understand how this thing works. Discussions and arguments require 2 sides. Otherwise you just have an echo chamber. That’s why I have never blocked anyone... even you. I would welcome 100 CoE diehards. Especially if they joined the greater forums.
Eh, well... With discussions and arguments you still usually end up with an echo chamber. With 2 sides, you just have twice as many echoes
A conversation between you and Ungood is a good example of a 2-sided echo chamber
Thus I really try not to respond
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
1. Hyped MMORPGs... Its the Hype meter on MMORPG.COM...
2. I will take that as confirmation that we only have negatives and zero that have lived up to the hype.
3. So we agree that AoC is in the same boat as the others mentioned. All Crowdfunded games.
Thanks
1. We're going in circles here. I said I can name Hyped MMORPG's that succeeded, I can name Hyped Games that have succeeded, the original argument wasn't for exclusively hyped crowdfunding mmo games. Now you're changing it to Hyped MMORPG's? Can you stop moving the goal post to distract from the fact that you have no arguments?
2. Plenty of games have lived up to the hype, some even exceeding expectations. Stop treating all games like they are the same when they clearly aren't.
3. Calling AoC crowdfunded is a bit of a stretch so no, we don't agree and I dare say we never will.
1. Hyped MMORPGs... Its the Hype meter on MMORPG.COM...
2. I will take that as confirmation that we only have negatives and zero that have lived up to the hype.
3. So we agree that AoC is in the same boat as the others mentioned. All Crowdfunded games.
Thanks
1. We're going in circles here. I said I can name Hyped MMORPG's that succeeded, I can name Hyped Games that have succeeded, the original argument wasn't for exclusively hyped crowdfunding mmo games. Now you're changing it to Hyped MMORPG's? Can you stop moving the goal post to distract from the fact that you have no arguments?
2. Plenty of games have lived up to the hype, some even exceeding expectations. Stop treating all games like they are the same when they clearly aren't.
3. Calling AoC crowdfunded is a bit of a stretch so no, we don't agree and I dare say we never will.
Nice attempt at straw-manning my argument though.
You are right it's a circular discussion. You won't even admit that AoC is Crowdfunded while talking about the missions of dollars in funds they have raised from the crowd. This is why it is difficult to have a serious discussion with a diehard.
So back to your earlier point- It's not that everyone here is not addressing your questions head on. It's that you are ignoring everyone else's answers but your own even when your own answers conflict with each other. I tried. I'm not even a guy that is offended by people being directed to come to the site for the silly Hype Meter (which is just pointless), but you seem intent on arguing for arguing's sake.
I will make one last attempt here since the thread is about the Hype Meter:
You yourself gave these numbers: 400,000 registered accounts. 20k active daily Discord users who share articles such as going to vote for the Hype Meter. There are a total of 261 Hype votes for AoC. Is 261 out of 400,000 showing a lot of hype? Is 261 out of 20,000 ACTIVE DAILY Discord members showing a lot of hype? What exact conclusions should I draw from the fact that 261 out of 400,000 registered people cared enough to come vote?
You want to show some hype? Get the other 19,739 people that are supposed to be active in your Discord every day to come join the forums here and Hype the game. Not just a drive by vote, but actually engaging the community here. That would show something.
Right now 261 out of 400k or 20k shows me nothing. Nothing positive. Nothing negative. It's meaningless.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Easy. Ashes and Chronicles are promising the world and haven’t disappointed yet because all they’ve shown is tech demos for Ashes. Chronicles doesn’t even have that to show.
Crowfall and Camelot are both doing something well within the expectations/limitations/feasibility of today.
Its natural for people to be more hyped for something revolutionary; even if it most likely won’t be.
@Jacobin You are right about MLM guys, never trust & always doublecheck. Say, if you go to their team page (https://www.ashesofcreation.com/the-team/) you'll see a small team of 28 people enlisted, furthermore with only 4 programmers(!) - heroically trying to make an MMORPG in UE4.
You'll also notice that skeleton crew is mostly made of designers, animators and artists!?
The entire project is all about shiny lights built on sand but some people lap it up due to the visuals which they can project their dream game onto.
As soon as the alpha is viewable and the hollow shell is revealed it will go into sleeper mode just like every other KS MMO. Considering Steven Sharif has never shipped a piece of software and everything out of SOE/Daybreak has been garbage for years there is zero chance the game will impress people once the curtain is withdrawn.
@Jacobin You are right about MLM guys, never trust & always doublecheck. Say, if you go to their team page (https://www.ashesofcreation.com/the-team/) you'll see a small team of 28 people enlisted, furthermore with only 4 programmers(!) - heroically trying to make an MMORPG in UE4.
You'll also notice that skeleton crew is mostly made of designers, animators and artists!?
The entire project is all about shiny lights built on sand but some people lap it up due to the visuals which they can project their dream game onto.
As soon as the alpha is viewable and the hollow shell is revealed it will go into sleeper mode just like every other KS MMO. Considering Steven Sharif has never shipped a piece of software and everything out of SOE/Daybreak has been garbage for years there is zero chance the game will impress people once the curtain is withdrawn.
I think that's likely, and I really dislike the tactics he has used... BUT... he has shown what appears to be progress, and faster than other peers. Time will tell if it's true progress or smoke and mirrors but for now, as long as he seems to be doing what he said he will do I think he gets some benefit of the doubt.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
I don’t think you understand how this thing works. Discussions and arguments require 2 sides. Otherwise you just have an echo chamber. That’s why I have never blocked anyone... even you. I would welcome 100 CoE diehards. Especially if they joined the greater forums.
and yet.. all you ever did to the ones that did come here and respond to your rant posts was launch accusations on them, call them names and do everything you could to get them banned, hell this is not even the first time you have accused me of being someone from the CoE community.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
@Jacobin You are right about MLM guys, never trust & always doublecheck. Say, if you go to their team page (https://www.ashesofcreation.com/the-team/) you'll see a small team of 28 people enlisted, furthermore with only 4 programmers(!) - heroically trying to make an MMORPG in UE4.
You'll also notice that skeleton crew is mostly made of designers, animators and artists!?
The entire project is all about shiny lights built on sand but some people lap it up due to the visuals which they can project their dream game onto.
As soon as the alpha is viewable and the hollow shell is revealed it will go into sleeper mode just like every other KS MMO. Considering Steven Sharif has never shipped a piece of software and everything out of SOE/Daybreak has been garbage for years there is zero chance the game will impress people once the curtain is withdrawn.
My previous AoC site check was almost surreal; maybe six months ago I remember seeing a dozen workers enlisted without a single programmer among them! So this seems like some kind of progress, no matter how small; Anyway, what amused me was that noone is talking about this - to me it seems as something worth of shouting from all the rooftops. So much about gaming journalism.
Speaking of hype, fans are throwing money on it due to visuals, old story, but I'd say that their pyramid-ish referral program is the main motor; without investing a single cent, Steven motivated tens of thousands of people to hype and defend his shady project very aggressively.
Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
I don’t think you understand how this thing works. Discussions and arguments require 2 sides. Otherwise you just have an echo chamber. That’s why I have never blocked anyone... even you. I would welcome 100 CoE diehards. Especially if they joined the greater forums.
and yet.. all you ever did to the ones that did come here and respond to your rant posts was launch accusations on them, call them names and do everything you could to get them banned, hell this is not even the first time you have accused me of being someone from the CoE community.
Do you dream about me? I seem to be in all your posts
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Hmm, so when you initially replied to the OP and stated "It's Easy:" you should have mentioned posting of the hype meter link in the Ashes Discord and stopped there as question was answered, right?
Instead you offered observations on all 4 titles which you claim you factually reported on.
1) CU - "production quality is so low they keep their Beta 1 under NDA" - You know for a fact this is true? Perhaps the performance and quality is only good and Mark wants to be sure it is great before the NDA comes down. Slag #1.
2) Crowfall - " while at the same time still having Unity assets they need to replace" - Yeah, anytime Unity comes up in a MMO discussion its an attempt to cast aspersions (aka slag #2) the devs for using it. Are you sure they must replace these before going live? (Source plz)
3) COE - "Did some shady things with the money shell game. Unsure how this game still has votes. Probably vaproware and will never release." - er, multiple slags here, but I wonder if you recall Steven was involved in his own "money shell game" with regards to Kickstarter and how the referral bonus program "really" works. (Slap will be more than happy to share I'm sure) Be careful throwing stones.
4) Ashes - well as you didn't self identify as a fan (aka white knight) we clearly can see where your loyalties are. Let's break down the "positives"
"Goes into development full funded to a viable core product." - No actual proof the full funding exists, but since they came out like gang busters I'm willing to take Steven at his word. (For now)
"Uses Kickstarter and early sales to ramp up additional products." - Yeah, not sure I buy that as he never published a solid list of features to he included in the minimum marketable product or his other explanation of giving fans the "opportunity" to join in the excitement.
"Within 1 year expands development team to 100 people working on the project."
Very true, though some are in Manilla and its a bit questionable how good those resources are and being roughly 15 hrs into the future it makes coordination with them difficult, especially if part of an agile project which I thought was the model being used.
"Put a playable version in the hands of their players 5 months post kickstarter. " Playable version, I'd be interested in that definition, was it Minimum Viable Product or something less? Also which user group got to test then and in what situations? (Trade show demo or from their homes?)
"Anticipates putting their first true Alpha into the hands within 18/19 months of Kickstarter." Meh, whatever the term "true alpha" means. Alpha 1, Alpha 3, Alpha 15.654?
So, lets see.
Do I need to mention that I hype games when I comment in MMORPG threads? Nope, I don't think I do. I have hyped Camelot Unchained, Crowfall, Chronicles of Elyria and Ashes of Creation over the years. So, no despite your opinion that I need present that I linked the hype meter to the Ashes Discord I'm really under no obligation to. You seem to have backed away from the "vote manipulation" thing pretty quick after a simple cut and paste of what the sites own definition of what vote manipulation is. Your augment fell apart pretty quickly after that.
1) Do I know for a fact that the state of Camelot Unchained is so low that they are keeping it under NDA? Yes, by CSE's own words:
"You undersatnd that this game is currently in an "Old School" Beta 1....." "That means you are not going to play anything close to a finished/polished game immediately..." The fact they are keeping the NDA in place means this game at 5 years in development isn't ready to be showcased.
Now, you can continue to try to twist or turn what I've said into a slam on CSE or CU, but again I've just reported straight facts.
2) I"m not quite sure you are good at the reading comprehension thing because I didn't say anything negative about them using the Unity engine. What I said was:
"while at the same time still having Unity assets they need to replace"
You wanted a source? Clearly you don't read the things that are even posted on this website:
The next big change we plan to make is moving more of the processing to the export phase. Here’s a breakdown of what that means: When artists finish making a chunk of a map, they export it and we have a script that breaks down some of the information into a format more friendly to actually running the client. Right now, that does a lot of things like stripping out stuff the client doesn’t need to know. Read more at https://www.mmorpg.com/crowfall/news/framerate-improvements-have-arrived-in-v57-1000049216#gTWtr1gpYwPAX51v.99
3) You didn't really make a point here just threw some words on the page.
As far as your statement about there being no proof that the full funding exists, well now I will turn it back to you. Can you please provide me source documentation of all income and expenditures for Camelot Unchained, Crowfall, and Chronicles of Elyria since I know of no business that makes their accounting ledgers public.
I do have to laugh about this statement:
Very true, though some are in Manilla and its a bit questionable how good those resources are and being roughly 15 hrs into the future it makes coordination with them difficult, especially if part of an agile project which I thought was the model being used.
You think being in a different time zone makes communication with people difficult? They aren't 15 hours in the future by the way in case you didn't understand the base level mechanic of how time functions. You do realize that you can pick up the phone and call someone in Asia and speak in real time? Works just as good via email, discords, fax, AIM. Do people still use AIM?
About the playable version, since again you don't seem to know anything about anything, yes back in December of 2017 there was a public Alpha 0 testing of Ashes of Creation. Yes, those people were chosen from the community to test, and yes they tested from their homes. The rest? Sorry, its under NDA.
But don't worry, when Ashes puts out their Alpha in Q4 of this year, it won't be under NDA, you can see it for yourself.
Oh, and even though I'm not really in the mood to explain what a pyramid scheme is to someone who clearly has trouble with simple reading comprehension issues since you've basically butchered your entire understanding of my argument, I will happily help you out with understanding pyramid schemes.
All I ask is that we start with you clearly defining what a pyramid scheme is and what the key highlights of a pyramid scheme vs MLM are. I find it easier to understand what someone knows before trying to explain...sometimes you have a lot of stuff to unteach first.
Sorry mate maybe I wasn't clear. I was asking for a rational argument, not personal feelings--
You asked Slapshot for a rational argument? You poor bastard. Let me get some popcorn ready this should be good.
As usual, you jumped the gun. If you read down he and I actually agree
But at least you kept your futility streak going!
PS: Please tell us honestly... are you secretly Caspien? There can't be 2 different people that I have gotten so far under their skin with... can there?
LOL.. You should read more and talk out your ass less.
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
I don’t think you understand how this thing works. Discussions and arguments require 2 sides. Otherwise you just have an echo chamber. That’s why I have never blocked anyone... even you. I would welcome 100 CoE diehards. Especially if they joined the greater forums.
and yet.. all you ever did to the ones that did come here and respond to your rant posts was launch accusations on them, call them names and do everything you could to get them banned, hell this is not even the first time you have accused me of being someone from the CoE community.
Do you dream about me? I seem to be in all your posts
You know.. now you have made me wonder if you dream about Caspian.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Crowfall and Camelot are more PvP games, people on this site are PvE Carebears by majority I'd say, so the more classic PvE default ones will get more attention.
I'm assuming you use Carebear as an insult, knowingly against what you yourself state is the majority of the users on this site. And you think that is ok?
Thinking about primarily PvP MMORPGs, I don't think they are really viable, and are likely the smallest niche of the MMORPG class. PvP works better and is obviously more popular where you are on a level playing field.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Hint: If I have to scroll 5 times to get to the bottom of a wall of text I generally skip it.
Sometimes the level of fanboyism is so extreme any attempt to penetrate it is largely futile.
You guys are just straight up delusional here. Not even 5 posts earlier you both were writing novels yourselves as anti-fanboys. At least Jahlons rant is based in reality and facts, not just feelings.
Don't you just love these MMO penis measuring threads? Especially fun when it's all about penii in development with no set maturity date.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Don't you just love these MMO penis measuring threads? Especially fun when it's all about penii in development with no set maturity date.
Penii in development
Good name for a sleazy sitcom
Constantine, The Console Poster
"One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
Hint: If I have to scroll 5 times to get to the bottom of a wall of text I generally skip it.
Sometimes the level of fanboyism is so extreme any attempt to penetrate it is largely futile.
You guys are just straight up delusional here. Not even 5 posts earlier you both were writing novels yourselves as anti-fanboys. At least Jahlons rant is based in reality and facts, not just feelings.
In case you missed it or someone else wants to step in for you and actually discuss the thread topic:
I will make one last attempt here since the thread is about the Hype Meter:
You yourself gave these numbers: 400,000 registered accounts. 20k active daily Discord users who share articles such as going to vote for the Hype Meter. There are a total of 261 Hype votes for AoC. Is 261 out of 400,000 showing a lot of hype? Is 261 out of 20,000 ACTIVE DAILY Discord members showing a lot of hype? What exact conclusions should I draw from the fact that 261 out of 400,000 registered people cared enough to come vote?
You want to show some hype? Get the other 19,739 people that are supposed to be active in your Discord every day to come join the forums here and Hype the game. Not just a drive by vote, but actually engaging the community here. That would show something.
Comments
He said "You want fans to come here and contribute".. hilarious, given you attack anyone that does not agree to your continual butthurt cry fest about CoE..
and.. oh.. look.. accusing me of being a part of CoE.. AGAIN.. I might add.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
You really wriggle to defend your game. It’s much easier to be game agnostic
For number 1, we are clearly discussing MMORPGs so mentioning Divinity is silly.
For number 2, I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype. While we do have plenty that clearly did not: PFO, SotA, Mortal Online, The Exiled... I think the only one treading water is Albion Online but even that didn’t get close to the Hype.
For number 3, do you have any proof at all other than someone’s non-binding comment that they have $30M of their own money to invest? Might I remind you also that Star Citizen has about $200,000,000. Might I remind you that CU only got a piece of funding from backers and the rest (the majority) came from MJ and investors? Crowfall also raised a bunch of money from actual VC and investors and nod backers. Those are all Crowdfunded games. So is AoC.
The fans of CoE, CU and Crowfall feel the same way about their game as you do about AoC. You are at the “Hopes and Dreams” point if development. We Harbingers have seen this story play out many times. It’s OK to have your hope, but don’t get blinded by it.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
You'll also notice that skeleton crew is mostly made of designers, animators and artists!?
2) Kickstarter was founded in 2009 so 9 years ago. Shadow Run was Kickstarted in 2012, Camelot Unchained in 2013, Pantheon in 2014, Crowfall in 2015, CoE in 2016, AoC in 2017. Notice a trend? Oh yah they all are in the timeframe I gave of 5-7 years to develop an MMO. "I take it you have none that were released that lived up to the hype" was your argument. You're hiding behind a self imposed sample size that's in its infancy. Now apply that same statement to MMO's as a whole outside of crowdfunding and your whole position falls apart.
3)Do you have any proof at all other than someone's non-binding comment for ANY game in development? Even big company games like Amazon's New World? Outside of a number on a website "tracking" funding numbers, I doubt you'll find any "proof" that any game has the funding they claim if you're going to become a full blown conspiracy theorist.
AAA games are typically at the $60 mil mark and above. Crowfall and Camelot are just barely at $20 mil with the combined funds and years of crowdfunding. AoC sold 10,000 of their $500 pre-order packs in the few months they opened the shop back up. That's an additional 5 mil from just one package tier alone. If that trend continues they'll easily smash the 60 mil mark if they haven't already.
2. I will take that as confirmation that we only have negatives and zero that have lived up to the hype.
3. So we agree that AoC is in the same boat as the others mentioned. All Crowdfunded games.
Thanks
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Eh, well... With discussions and arguments you still usually end up with an echo chamber. With 2 sides, you just have twice as many echoes
A conversation between you and Ungood is a good example of a 2-sided echo chamber
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
2. Plenty of games have lived up to the hype, some even exceeding expectations. Stop treating all games like they are the same when they clearly aren't.
3. Calling AoC crowdfunded is a bit of a stretch so no, we don't agree and I dare say we never will.
Nice attempt at straw-manning my argument though.
So back to your earlier point- It's not that everyone here is not addressing your questions head on. It's that you are ignoring everyone else's answers but your own even when your own answers conflict with each other. I tried. I'm not even a guy that is offended by people being directed to come to the site for the silly Hype Meter (which is just pointless), but you seem intent on arguing for arguing's sake.
I will make one last attempt here since the thread is about the Hype Meter:
You yourself gave these numbers: 400,000 registered accounts. 20k active daily Discord users who share articles such as going to vote for the Hype Meter. There are a total of 261 Hype votes for AoC. Is 261 out of 400,000 showing a lot of hype? Is 261 out of 20,000 ACTIVE DAILY Discord members showing a lot of hype? What exact conclusions should I draw from the fact that 261 out of 400,000 registered people cared enough to come vote?
You want to show some hype? Get the other 19,739 people that are supposed to be active in your Discord every day to come join the forums here and Hype the game. Not just a drive by vote, but actually engaging the community here. That would show something.
Right now 261 out of 400k or 20k shows me nothing. Nothing positive. Nothing negative. It's meaningless.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Crowfall and Camelot are both doing something well within the expectations/limitations/feasibility of today.
Its natural for people to be more hyped for something revolutionary; even if it most likely won’t be.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Speaking of hype, fans are throwing money on it due to visuals, old story, but I'd say that their pyramid-ish referral program is the main motor; without investing a single cent, Steven motivated tens of thousands of people to hype and defend his shady project very aggressively.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
So, lets see.
Do I need to mention that I hype games when I comment in MMORPG threads? Nope, I don't think I do. I have hyped Camelot Unchained, Crowfall, Chronicles of Elyria and Ashes of Creation over the years. So, no despite your opinion that I need present that I linked the hype meter to the Ashes Discord I'm really under no obligation to. You seem to have backed away from the "vote manipulation" thing pretty quick after a simple cut and paste of what the sites own definition of what vote manipulation is. Your augment fell apart pretty quickly after that.
1) Do I know for a fact that the state of Camelot Unchained is so low that they are keeping it under NDA? Yes, by CSE's own words:
"You undersatnd that this game is currently in an "Old School" Beta 1....." "That means you are not going to play anything close to a finished/polished game immediately..." The fact they are keeping the NDA in place means this game at 5 years in development isn't ready to be showcased.
Link for their words is here: https://i.imgur.com/YX8mygn.png
Now, you can continue to try to twist or turn what I've said into a slam on CSE or CU, but again I've just reported straight facts.
2) I"m not quite sure you are good at the reading comprehension thing because I didn't say anything negative about them using the Unity engine. What I said was:
"while at the same time still having Unity assets they need to replace"
You wanted a source? Clearly you don't read the things that are even posted on this website:
The next big change we plan to make is moving more of the processing to the export phase. Here’s a breakdown of what that means: When artists finish making a chunk of a map, they export it and we have a script that breaks down some of the information into a format more friendly to actually running the client. Right now, that does a lot of things like stripping out stuff the client doesn’t need to know.
Read more at https://www.mmorpg.com/crowfall/news/framerate-improvements-have-arrived-in-v57-1000049216#gTWtr1gpYwPAX51v.99
3) You didn't really make a point here just threw some words on the page.
As far as your statement about there being no proof that the full funding exists, well now I will turn it back to you. Can you please provide me source documentation of all income and expenditures for Camelot Unchained, Crowfall, and Chronicles of Elyria since I know of no business that makes their accounting ledgers public.
I do have to laugh about this statement:
Very true, though some are in Manilla and its a bit questionable how good those resources are and being roughly 15 hrs into the future it makes coordination with them difficult, especially if part of an agile project which I thought was the model being used.
You think being in a different time zone makes communication with people difficult? They aren't 15 hours in the future by the way in case you didn't understand the base level mechanic of how time functions. You do realize that you can pick up the phone and call someone in Asia and speak in real time? Works just as good via email, discords, fax, AIM. Do people still use AIM?
About the playable version, since again you don't seem to know anything about anything, yes back in December of 2017 there was a public Alpha 0 testing of Ashes of Creation. Yes, those people were chosen from the community to test, and yes they tested from their homes. The rest? Sorry, its under NDA.
But don't worry, when Ashes puts out their Alpha in Q4 of this year, it won't be under NDA, you can see it for yourself.
Oh, and even though I'm not really in the mood to explain what a pyramid scheme is to someone who clearly has trouble with simple reading comprehension issues since you've basically butchered your entire understanding of my argument, I will happily help you out with understanding pyramid schemes.
All I ask is that we start with you clearly defining what a pyramid scheme is and what the key highlights of a pyramid scheme vs MLM are. I find it easier to understand what someone knows before trying to explain...sometimes you have a lot of stuff to unteach first.
Paradox Gaming Network
Paradox YouTube Channel
Ashes 101
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Thinking about primarily PvP MMORPGs, I don't think they are really viable, and are likely the smallest niche of the MMORPG class. PvP works better and is obviously more popular where you are on a level playing field.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Good name for a sleazy sitcom
I will make one last attempt here since the thread is about the Hype Meter:
You yourself gave these numbers: 400,000 registered accounts. 20k active daily Discord users who share articles such as going to vote for the Hype Meter. There are a total of 261 Hype votes for AoC. Is 261 out of 400,000 showing a lot of hype? Is 261 out of 20,000 ACTIVE DAILY Discord members showing a lot of hype? What exact conclusions should I draw from the fact that 261 out of 400,000 registered people cared enough to come vote?
You want to show some hype? Get the other 19,739 people that are supposed to be active in your Discord every day to come join the forums here and Hype the game. Not just a drive by vote, but actually engaging the community here. That would show something.
Right now 261 out of 400k or 20k shows me nothing. Nothing positive. Nothing negative. It's meaningless.
Read more at https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/475319/how-does-ashes-of-creation-and-choronicles-of-elyria-has-more-votes-than-crowfall-and-camelot/p5#XHz3ZTU3ZPdaUfGT.99
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018