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Should a Players PC be "Scanned" to control Hacking?
anwar
Member UncommonPosts: 108
Recently a major MMORPG was found to be scanning PCs to control Hackers, I found this question asked on a gamesite and the following was my response, it was a very low traffic website and I found myself wanting to see how more people felt.
So, how do you feel about this?
Not without a court order.
First off, I have no idea how people "hack", but I would assume that someone who can hack also has the know-how to hide it...assuming he knows that the game company might scan.
Second, it seems to me that anyone who developes something as epic as a modern MMORPG should be able to design protections against hackers without resorting to scanning personal computers.
third, I HATE all hackers, botters, cheat sites, etc....seems a game could block usage to ALL 3rd party programs, custom hotkeys, custom UIs, outside voice programs (provide their own so everyone can use if in a group or raid).....block everything that people use to get an "edge", programmers KNOW what hotkeys etc. are needed, provide what they want gamers to use and outlaw everything else....perhaps that would get gamers to learn to use only what tools are provided and even the playing field for the geeks and the normal player.
BUT...when all is said and done...absolutely no scanning without a court order...computers are getting to be used too much for everything locked filing cabinets and safes and under the mattress used to be for,.......your bills, your bank accounts, your p0rn, your plans to overtake the government, your own MMORPG you are developing, your second set of books for your business, your diary, your gameplan to become irresistable to the opposite or same sex......you get the point....computer privacy should be protected just as other rights to privacy....even if it means the bad guy gets away occasionally.
Anwar
Second, it seems to me that anyone who developes something as epic as a modern MMORPG should be able to design protections against hackers without resorting to scanning personal computers.
third, I HATE all hackers, botters, cheat sites, etc....seems a game could block usage to ALL 3rd party programs, custom hotkeys, custom UIs, outside voice programs (provide their own so everyone can use if in a group or raid).....block everything that people use to get an "edge", programmers KNOW what hotkeys etc. are needed, provide what they want gamers to use and outlaw everything else....perhaps that would get gamers to learn to use only what tools are provided and even the playing field for the geeks and the normal player.
BUT...when all is said and done...absolutely no scanning without a court order...computers are getting to be used too much for everything locked filing cabinets and safes and under the mattress used to be for,.......your bills, your bank accounts, your p0rn, your plans to overtake the government, your own MMORPG you are developing, your second set of books for your business, your diary, your gameplan to become irresistable to the opposite or same sex......you get the point....computer privacy should be protected just as other rights to privacy....even if it means the bad guy gets away occasionally.
Anwar
Comments
As long as they are looking only for hacking software then I have no problem with that. I have nothing illegal on my computer and am more then willing to open my system up to be scanned if it means a better server without hacks. Now if they are scanning other things and using that for marketing or ill then yes I am against it. But just scanning for hacks is fine with me.
Think about it like this. There are some hacks people use in MMOs that can also scan other people's computers while they are playing. You prefer your system being scanned by the company or some hacker because you refused to let the company scan your computer? Which do you think will do more harm?
They cant completely protect their system from hackers. Even the top of the line game with all the best and latest protections will be compromise the moment it hits the market.
Kai
I understand where you are coming from, one hacker who shares his find can destroy, or at least diminish, the fun of thousands...but how far should personal freedom be compromised in return for public security? Saying it's ok if they are only looking for hacker software kinda demands a lot of faith, that they even do it means it is probably legal in some way. Who knows what scruples or personal agenda that person running the scans has? What if it's something simple like the player's real identity is a celebrity and it gets out? What if the scanee is on a mission from God and he sees "teen" nudes and thinks teen=underage and reacts appropriately? The "what ifs" could be endless.
Personallly I'd like to see it as a criminal act to scan any computer for any reason without a specific court order...but then again I sure wouldn't like my favorite MMORPG compromised by a hacker either.
Just seems there should be a way to isolate the game from manipulation without resorting to going into a random customer's PC.
I dont see it much different when scanning comp before game or checking race car before competion to check, if it have something against rules.
They would only have to scan running processes and possible if wow client have been alterred illegaly.
I dont see it much different when scanning comp before game or checking race car before competion to check, if it have something against rules.
They would only have to scan running processes and possible if wow client have been alterred illegaly.
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Well, checking a race car before competition doesn't have the ability, then, to get my personal information and use it -- if you use your computer for online banking, they can leech that data; and so forth. It's not what a so-called scrupulous company does with it; it's what the unscrupulous do with it.
And, I'm not willing to have that much intrusion into my privacy. Am I willing to allow the concept of this type of invasion of privacy in order to play a game? The very question is ridiculous, made moreso by the fact that it's unnecessary. Scanning the GAME's files ONLY and agreeing to that in order to play the game is one thing; agreeing that they're allowed to scan the entirety of your hard drive is NOT.
SOE tried something like what WoW is doing awhile back, and when the players ROARED, SOE caved... and implemented a different methodology for preventing hacks/etc. Again, the tech is there to do this WITHOUT the privacy issues, which begs the question of why this is even an issue... and the answer is, because too many games (like Blizzard) are insisting on doing what SOE abandoned and found a different solution to. (this isn't to hold up SOE as a paragon of virtue, which they aren't; but they were in exactly the same situation as Blizzard is now, using a similar scanning method, and they abandoned it and found a better way, so should Blizzard).
I see the paranoid idiots have returned to the WoW community. If you believe this load of bull the second you read it, you're a bigger moron then I thought. No, WoW is not scanning HD's for "Sposed hacking Information" No, they aren't going to hack into your pc and reveal your 5 page essay on Napoleon to the public.
All games and all internet sites that have and host jpegs, gif's, png, ect. These have a thing called tracking cookies its pretty common. I ran a virus/spyware/adware/trojan/backdoor. It all came up with nothing on WoW. Hell, the setup should be clear enough to you noobs that nothing's going on.
If you want to really know what's going on in the world that may effect your gaming experience and such take a look at what the FCC is planning on doing. This doesn't really apply to international communities.
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/08/06/2157202&tid=172&tid=158&tid=103&tid=218&tid=219
Read it.
Professor Hubert Farnsworth - That question is less stupid but, you asked it in a profoundly stupid way.
Personally, I think it is a great idea. And to those who disagree, and scream about privacy. Does the murder not scream of privacy when a cop busts into their house to search and find a murder weapon. Is it not the criminals who scream out about their rights.
I believe reference to it should be in EULA. And I highly doubt that they would open files or even read anything, it would basically be just to see what programs are being run simultaneously with the game. And I highly doubt a multi-million dollar company would risk it all to get a customer's bank account information.
I vote for it, better gaming experience for us all.
I do not think there is a single thing wrong with them scanning your PC (if they even do that). If they do then it is stated within the CONTRACT (EULA) that everyone agrees to when they both install the software and sign into the world of warcraft service. If you do not like the idea then I suggest you just dont play the game. Apparently you must have something to hide if you do not agree with it. But in all legal situations they are allowed to do anything stated within the EULA that is legal within the country the game was made.
I suggest everyone takes the time to read the EULAs rather then just clicking the ok I agree button to get into the game faster. You agree to alot of stuff that you might not agree with simply because you didnt take the time to read it.
Personally I don't have a problem with them scanning for any hacks but I wonder how practical it is. With as large as MMO communitys are modders can adjust there hacks to avoid the software that searchs for them rather quickly.
If it COULD work, do it.
They can get rid of hackers other ways. They're just lazy, that's all. I don't like the, "what do you have to hide?" argument, semi-recent political agendas use that argument too. *cough* PATRIOT ACT *cough* not to start a political debate, but I think you know where i'm going with that.
I'm certainly not subscribing to WoW now (not that I really wanted to) and I guess I'll have to read the EULA from now on. 
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-Anarchyart
All you friggin suburban white kid wannabe poobutts that are in love with G-Unit are sad and pathetic. Find your own identity
Erm they all scan your Harddrive :S
CS/CSS does it! Infact all online games to check for hacks!
EQ2 gives you the option of allowing them to collect for data etc etc.
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Don't click here...no2
Infact the goverment knows whats on your pc and what your downloading :S They know if your downloading illegal stuff and they might come round.
Saw a program (UK) they say they be careful because we can check anytime :P
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Don't click here...no2
What can i tell you , this is horrible news
Blizzard turned from one of most respected companies - to very lowest mud !
I was subscribed to WoW for wopping 2 months after which I had to cancel - because of apsolutely rude , lying and anti player support. I can tell you the people playing WoW are the same sheep we see in everyday life constantly licking the a** of the boss or being the favorit student. They take constant beating - and they like it. Makes you wonder
BUT THIS , scaning the computer. It has to be the worst thing a company ever made! Heck even Microsoft does not dare!
I dont want my computer to be scaned. I do have all kind of dubious things on my HD. And who ever claims he has not , is lying. (or doesnt know) - Dont you know that even a simple mp3 that you downloaded from some site could be illegal? And what than... It is not what they will do with the information (although they showed to be very evil company) , it is what they could do!
Man they can blackmail almost 90% of WoW players now.
Thanks for the warning. I am going to burn my copy of WoW
"Before this battle is over all the world will know that few...stood against many." - King Leonidas
lol
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=4439675&p=1&tmp=1#post4439675
Read their statement. Like it has been pointed out in the other thread about this, the one on 13 pages, they don't scan you files, they just check if a program interfeers with Wow.exe
And you agree on them to scan your files. You can't complain that they do it, since you personally said "yes, blizzard I want you to check if I run any hack/cheat programs" when you signed the EULA.
The fact that the cheater can pass and adept to these things doesn't mean they should stop doing it. Because then the cheaters would go back to their old cheating methods. A company working against cheats has to always come up with new methods and keep the old methods too. Always making it alittle harder for the cheater and maybe one day they will win.
Now your just being dumb. A true Llama.
If you sign a contract that says I can use your phone to make local calls then guess what? I can use your phone. If you sign one that says I can use your bathroom then I can. If you sign a contract that says they can search your closet then guess what? They can.
Murder is a felony and cant be contracted. But scanning your computer isnt a felony and if you give them permission then they can.
Kai
well in my opinion thats putting one hell of a lot of faith in a commercial company
its like using a nuke to kill one soldier...wouldnt a grenade be better?
if they were only going to scan the games installation folder then fine and dandy but your whole drive is a different matter as it also includes your windows folder,your personal documents,your pr0n.
if they do that theyre no better than the companys that spread spyware...
You know it is funny people act like this is something entirely new.
Little do people realise is that Microsoft DOES scann your computer when you update windows. CounterStrike Scanns your computer while you are playing it to prevent cheating on certain servers. Americas Army has the sam functions (They can even take screenshots of your computer). Any online game that has a nProtect protection scanns your computer. Any SOE game where you check to allow the company to geather infomation about your computer (scanns your computer).
This isnt something that Blizzard just came up with. It has been around alot longer then most people realise. I should also mention that the new Windows OS that will be coming out soon has the built into the core of it. It is all part of microsofts new anti-piracy prevention campaign.
And the sadest part of it all is that everyone of us agrees to it when we click that OK / I Agree button.
Also a EULA can do anything that is 'legal' within the country the product was programmed in. Currently there is no LAW that prevents a company from scanning your computer if you agree to let them do it. It has ALWAYS been clearly stated in there EULA that could do this. It is also stated that they can end the WOW service at any time they choose without refunding you.
Even if they do know, with the billions of people online every second of everyday. All that traffic adds up to one rather large pile of paperwork, and it is impossable to sort through it all to find out who is doing some bad, and who isn't.
This is just bullshit. It doesn't scan your files. It seams that everyone posting is listening to rumors instead of reading the statement from Blizzard or looking at the facts. It doesn't scan your files.
Unfortunatly having your PC scanned does seem like an invasion. however many of us give these very game companies our credit card numbers. Your worried bout them scanning your PC!!?? They already got your info.
The thing that bothers me most is all the keyloggers, backdoor,adware, virus,trojans and the like, not a legit company that wants to stay in buisness and keep it's clients and reputation.
You may think that you should have privacy being on your PC at home but as long as your connected to the internet,and linked with many other computers; your not gonna have total privacy. And i really doubt having virus scanners, firewalls really totally protect you against every threat.
As far as game companies go, " A company you already gave credit card number to" really is the least of your worries.
Even if they do know, with the billions of people online every second of everyday. All that traffic adds up to one rather large pile of paperwork, and it is impossable to sort through it all to find out who is doing some bad, and who isn't.
What he is saying is true. Infact Usa has a huuge pile of computer checking every single mail for information that can lead to terrorists and stop terror attacks before they happen. Since it's all done by computers there is no paperwork. The paperwork starts when the computer start giving warnings.
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This is just bullshit. It doesn't scan your files. It seams that everyone posting is listening to rumors instead of reading the statement from Blizzard or looking at the facts. It doesn't scan your files.
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Well the rumor of Blizzard scanning files might have started this topic, the topic is "Should a Players PC be "Scanned" to control Hacking?" We aren't talking about Blizzard, we are talking should it happen in general