Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I'd rather just not play the same game you and others with your mindset play lol.
What are you going to make of value that in any way approximates what a good game makes and sells for the cost of buying it or playing it? Are you a game artist or developer?
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I'd rather just not play the same game you and others with your mindset play lol.
What are you going to make of value that in any way approximates what a good game makes and sells for the cost of buying it or playing it? Are you a game artist or developer?
Aaah I see.
Weaponsmith makes bows. Alchemist makes potions ect. Normal stuff. You thought I was talking about some NFT i created on my laptop
Nah talking I'm the exaxct same things you would normally do in mmorpgs. Listing it the exact same way.
Some games in game currency can be swapped for other currencies like ETH or USDC. Other games have items priced in just ETH or the native currency of the chain they run on.
bcbully said: If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I produced some jewelry in LOTRO. I was paid with in-game, non-immersion breaking, gold coins.
Nothing wrong with getting paid for an item but we all see what happens when real world money gets mixed in with gaming. You've got "luminaries" like Raph Koster extoling pay to win, you get gold-spammers, you get duplication bugs and cheating, and you get angry people (see the SC rants).
And for the record: I want game developers to get paid because I want them to keep producing content for and improving upon the game.
I don't want to be gaming with people trying to scare up enough cash to make their next car payment.
I think if you try real hard you can understand why someone wouldn't want to be near a grifter. I think you can also understand why people would want a game world where effort put into the game, and not a Master Card, determine the outcomes in the world.
I'm preeety sure that's what we've been getting right now.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I'd rather just not play the same game you and others with your mindset play lol.
What are you going to make of value that in any way approximates what a good game makes and sells for the cost of buying it or playing it? Are you a game artist or developer?
Aaah I see.
Weaponsmith makes bows. Alchemist makes potions ect. Normal stuff. You thought I was talking about some NFT i created on my laptop
Nah talking I'm the exaxct same things you would normally do in mmorpgs. Listing it the exact same way.
Some games in game currency can be swapped for other currencies like ETH or USDC. Other games have items priced in just ETH or the native currency of the chain they run on.
I'll give you an example of RMT and P2E in a game. It's not the only example of RMT/P2E and it could be used in other genre's.
If your a fan of flying you can go to where ever fan website you wish and find somebody to create any airport, building, vehicle. Almost anything your imagination can come up with. You can make a deal with that person for what ever you want, Crypto included.
Depending on the deal agreed to the customer, creator, or anyone could publish the works and make a fabulous living doing so or give it away for nothing more than the adoration of the community.
That's the type of model that I'm a fan of. One that nourishes creativity and community.
bcbully said: If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I produced some jewelry in LOTRO. I was paid with in-game, non-immersion breaking, gold coins.
Nothing wrong with getting paid for an item but we all see what happens when real world money gets mixed in with gaming. You've got "luminaries" like Raph Koster extoling pay to win, you get gold-spammers, you get duplication bugs and cheating, and you get angry people (see the SC rants).
And for the record: I want game developers to get paid because I want them to keep producing content for and improving upon the game.
I don't want to be gaming with people trying to scare up enough cash to make their next car payment.
I think if you try real hard you can understand why someone wouldn't want to be near a grifter. I think you can also understand why people would want a game world where effort put into the game, and not a Master Card, determine the outcomes in the world.
I'm preeety sure that's what we've been getting right now.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
People who want to play that game, no problemo.
However, supposedly FTP wasn't supposed to have a big impact on LOTRO when it first arrived - but it did. Now I've got store prompts all over the UI, pay to win aspects, and a little "hobbit present" it get every day to remind me to do more shopping in the store. These guys love to add grind - and then sell you the fix.
I watched all the LOTRO movies. I don't recall the Fellowship getting hobbit presents every day, do you?
I'd rather just pay a monthly fee and have all the immersion breaking nonsense go away.
Now then, if your ideal game is funded by NFTs (2.5%) then the developer is going to be motivated to make the buying and selling of NFTs and important part of the game. That doesn't make the developer evil, or the players evil, it is just if the game is going to be funded those things must change hands.
I don't want a game where I'm getting pressured to trade NFTs for real money. I don't want a developer that is thinking about that most of the time.
I want a developer thinking "How can I make the next DLC so compelling, so mind blowing, so wonderful that the players will really want it?" It is a matter of what the developer is focused upon. If you want to see this win, see No Man's Sky. Those guys did the work.
It is okay if we want different things. I hope you find the NFT superstore of your dreams. I hope I can get a monthly sub of a carefully curated game.
If we both get what we want we'll never run into each other in game.
this is the silver lining. It will not only remove the $$$ people to greener pastures, so to speak, but there will also be developers who will not have any part in this. Those are the games i will play, should there be any games left to play.
bcbully said: If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I produced some jewelry in LOTRO. I was paid with in-game, non-immersion breaking, gold coins.
Nothing wrong with getting paid for an item but we all see what happens when real world money gets mixed in with gaming. You've got "luminaries" like Raph Koster extoling pay to win, you get gold-spammers, you get duplication bugs and cheating, and you get angry people (see the SC rants).
And for the record: I want game developers to get paid because I want them to keep producing content for and improving upon the game.
I don't want to be gaming with people trying to scare up enough cash to make their next car payment.
I think if you try real hard you can understand why someone wouldn't want to be near a grifter. I think you can also understand why people would want a game world where effort put into the game, and not a Master Card, determine the outcomes in the world.
I'm preeety sure that's what we've been getting right now.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
People who want to play that game, no problemo.
However, supposedly FTP wasn't supposed to have a big impact on LOTRO when it first arrived - but it did. Now I've got store prompts all over the UI, pay to win aspects, and a little "hobbit present" it get every day to remind me to do more shopping in the store. These guys love to add grind - and then sell you the fix.
I watched all the LOTRO movies. I don't recall the Fellowship getting hobbit presents every day, do you?
I'd rather just pay a monthly fee and have all the immersion breaking nonsense go away.
Now then, if your ideal game is funded by NFTs (2.5%) then the developer is going to be motivated to make the buying and selling of NFTs and important part of the game. That doesn't make the developer evil, or the players evil, it is just if the game is going to be funded those things must change hands.
I don't want a game where I'm getting pressured to trade NFTs for real money. I don't want a developer that is thinking about that most of the time.
I want a developer thinking "How can I make the next DLC so compelling, so mind blowing, so wonderful that the players will really want it?" It is a matter of what the developer is focused upon. If you want to see this win, see No Man's Sky. Those guys did the work.
It is okay if we want different things. I hope you find the NFT superstore of your dreams. I hope I can get a monthly sub of a carefully curated game.
If we both get what we want we'll never run into each other in game.
this is the silver lining. It will not only remove the $$$ people to greener pastures, so to speak, but there will also be developers who will not have any part in this. Those are the games i will play, should there be any games left to play.
This is how I feel about full loot open world PvP titles. Get everyone of that bent away from my game.... have fun, sociopaths.
mooost the time it's the pve types going to pvp games then asking for flags & safe zones while calling pvpr sociopaths.
bcbully said: If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I produced some jewelry in LOTRO. I was paid with in-game, non-immersion breaking, gold coins.
Nothing wrong with getting paid for an item but we all see what happens when real world money gets mixed in with gaming. You've got "luminaries" like Raph Koster extoling pay to win, you get gold-spammers, you get duplication bugs and cheating, and you get angry people (see the SC rants).
And for the record: I want game developers to get paid because I want them to keep producing content for and improving upon the game.
I don't want to be gaming with people trying to scare up enough cash to make their next car payment.
I think if you try real hard you can understand why someone wouldn't want to be near a grifter. I think you can also understand why people would want a game world where effort put into the game, and not a Master Card, determine the outcomes in the world.
I'm preeety sure that's what we've been getting right now.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
People who want to play that game, no problemo.
However, supposedly FTP wasn't supposed to have a big impact on LOTRO when it first arrived - but it did. Now I've got store prompts all over the UI, pay to win aspects, and a little "hobbit present" it get every day to remind me to do more shopping in the store. These guys love to add grind - and then sell you the fix.
I watched all the LOTRO movies. I don't recall the Fellowship getting hobbit presents every day, do you?
I'd rather just pay a monthly fee and have all the immersion breaking nonsense go away.
Now then, if your ideal game is funded by NFTs (2.5%) then the developer is going to be motivated to make the buying and selling of NFTs and important part of the game. That doesn't make the developer evil, or the players evil, it is just if the game is going to be funded those things must change hands.
I don't want a game where I'm getting pressured to trade NFTs for real money. I don't want a developer that is thinking about that most of the time.
I want a developer thinking "How can I make the next DLC so compelling, so mind blowing, so wonderful that the players will really want it?" It is a matter of what the developer is focused upon. If you want to see this win, see No Man's Sky. Those guys did the work.
It is okay if we want different things. I hope you find the NFT superstore of your dreams. I hope I can get a monthly sub of a carefully curated game.
If we both get what we want we'll never run into each other in game.
this is the silver lining. It will not only remove the $$$ people to greener pastures, so to speak, but there will also be developers who will not have any part in this. Those are the games i will play, should there be any games left to play.
This is how I feel about full loot open world PvP titles. Get everyone of that bent away from my game.... have fun, sociopaths.
mooost the time it's the pve types going to pvp games then asking for flags & safe zones while calling pvpr sociopaths.
I think that by observing human behavior inside of anonymous, multiplayer, video games over the last 30 years or so, is that....
bcbully said: If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I produced some jewelry in LOTRO. I was paid with in-game, non-immersion breaking, gold coins.
Nothing wrong with getting paid for an item but we all see what happens when real world money gets mixed in with gaming. You've got "luminaries" like Raph Koster extoling pay to win, you get gold-spammers, you get duplication bugs and cheating, and you get angry people (see the SC rants).
And for the record: I want game developers to get paid because I want them to keep producing content for and improving upon the game.
I don't want to be gaming with people trying to scare up enough cash to make their next car payment.
I think if you try real hard you can understand why someone wouldn't want to be near a grifter. I think you can also understand why people would want a game world where effort put into the game, and not a Master Card, determine the outcomes in the world.
I'm preeety sure that's what we've been getting right now.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
People who want to play that game, no problemo.
However, supposedly FTP wasn't supposed to have a big impact on LOTRO when it first arrived - but it did. Now I've got store prompts all over the UI, pay to win aspects, and a little "hobbit present" it get every day to remind me to do more shopping in the store. These guys love to add grind - and then sell you the fix.
I watched all the LOTRO movies. I don't recall the Fellowship getting hobbit presents every day, do you?
I'd rather just pay a monthly fee and have all the immersion breaking nonsense go away.
Now then, if your ideal game is funded by NFTs (2.5%) then the developer is going to be motivated to make the buying and selling of NFTs and important part of the game. That doesn't make the developer evil, or the players evil, it is just if the game is going to be funded those things must change hands.
I don't want a game where I'm getting pressured to trade NFTs for real money. I don't want a developer that is thinking about that most of the time.
I want a developer thinking "How can I make the next DLC so compelling, so mind blowing, so wonderful that the players will really want it?" It is a matter of what the developer is focused upon. If you want to see this win, see No Man's Sky. Those guys did the work.
It is okay if we want different things. I hope you find the NFT superstore of your dreams. I hope I can get a monthly sub of a carefully curated game.
If we both get what we want we'll never run into each other in game.
this is the silver lining. It will not only remove the $$$ people to greener pastures, so to speak, but there will also be developers who will not have any part in this. Those are the games i will play, should there be any games left to play.
This is how I feel about full loot open world PvP titles. Get everyone of that bent away from my game.... have fun, sociopaths.
mooost the time it's the pve types going to pvp games then asking for flags & safe zones while calling pvpr sociopaths.
I think that by observing human behavior inside of anonymous, multiplayer, video games over the last 30 years or so, is that....
We are all sociopaths
naa I don't think so, but it don't take many rotten apples to spoil the whole cart and there's a few more bad apples every day until its all destroyed.
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
bcbully said: If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
I produced some jewelry in LOTRO. I was paid with in-game, non-immersion breaking, gold coins.
Nothing wrong with getting paid for an item but we all see what happens when real world money gets mixed in with gaming. You've got "luminaries" like Raph Koster extoling pay to win, you get gold-spammers, you get duplication bugs and cheating, and you get angry people (see the SC rants).
And for the record: I want game developers to get paid because I want them to keep producing content for and improving upon the game.
I don't want to be gaming with people trying to scare up enough cash to make their next car payment.
I think if you try real hard you can understand why someone wouldn't want to be near a grifter. I think you can also understand why people would want a game world where effort put into the game, and not a Master Card, determine the outcomes in the world.
I'm preeety sure that's what we've been getting right now.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
People who want to play that game, no problemo.
However, supposedly FTP wasn't supposed to have a big impact on LOTRO when it first arrived - but it did. Now I've got store prompts all over the UI, pay to win aspects, and a little "hobbit present" it get every day to remind me to do more shopping in the store. These guys love to add grind - and then sell you the fix.
I watched all the LOTRO movies. I don't recall the Fellowship getting hobbit presents every day, do you?
I'd rather just pay a monthly fee and have all the immersion breaking nonsense go away.
Now then, if your ideal game is funded by NFTs (2.5%) then the developer is going to be motivated to make the buying and selling of NFTs and important part of the game. That doesn't make the developer evil, or the players evil, it is just if the game is going to be funded those things must change hands.
I don't want a game where I'm getting pressured to trade NFTs for real money. I don't want a developer that is thinking about that most of the time.
I want a developer thinking "How can I make the next DLC so compelling, so mind blowing, so wonderful that the players will really want it?" It is a matter of what the developer is focused upon. If you want to see this win, see No Man's Sky. Those guys did the work.
It is okay if we want different things. I hope you find the NFT superstore of your dreams. I hope I can get a monthly sub of a carefully curated game.
If we both get what we want we'll never run into each other in game.
this is the silver lining. It will not only remove the $$$ people to greener pastures, so to speak, but there will also be developers who will not have any part in this. Those are the games i will play, should there be any games left to play.
This is how I feel about full loot open world PvP titles. Get everyone of that bent away from my game.... have fun, sociopaths.
mooost the time it's the pve types going to pvp games then asking for flags & safe zones while calling pvpr sociopaths.
I think that by observing human behavior inside of anonymous, multiplayer, video games over the last 30 years or so, is that....
We are all sociopaths
You take that back or I'll boil your dog in a stew pot! .... er ... Oh hell the man's right.
Its sad how anonymity plus an internet audience effects even the most normal of people. Given an arena to make an ass of one's self often makes those of us who do enjoy open PVP look like the kids who never stopped pulling the wings off of files. Which kind of segues nicely into how I feel about the crypto/blockchain/NFT crowd. So many just seem like soulless shills, similar to Jordan Belfort who talked many people into investing in toxic stocks, knowing full well the investors would never see a profit.
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
Because they get a percentage of your very real money and not this Monopoly money bitcoin bullshit. Its very telling how BC and many others in the blockchain racket get indignant and offended when people call it a pyramid scheme. As if it could be anything else. It reminds me of the scene in Thor Ragnarok where the Grandmaster is visibly uncomfortable when Topaz uses the term slave, but is placated when she edits herself and uses the phrase "the prisoners with jobs".
You're thinking of far too blatant of an example of insider trading.
Imagine that it's 2027. Suppose that the Riot/LoL MMORPG has launched and displaced WoW as the top MMORPG on the market. Further suppose that the Riot MMO has NFTs attached to all epic items to make them tradeable, with 5% of the sale price going to Riot. And furthermore, suppose that I work for Riot.
As part of my job, I overhear some people mentioning that a particular epic sword is getting nerfed. It's widely considered the best in slot sword in the game, and valued at $500 on the open market. Of course, the reason it's best in slot is that a special effect on the sword ended up being more powerful than intended due to a bug, and they're going to fix the bug. After the patch, it's no longer going to be best in slot. The nerf is entirely justified.
I don't play the game, of course. But I go to mmorpg.com, where I contact my buddy, BlockChainBilly, who I know plays the game and has the sword that is about to be nerfed. So I send him a private message saying offering to sell him some highly profitable insider information about the game for $50. He doesn't believe me, but asks me to just tell him what I know, and if I'm right, he'll pay me the $50 after the fact. I tell him that his sword is about to be nerfed and exactly how. He sells it for $500, and buys the other sword that will become best in slot for $200. A few days later, the patch goes live, and he sends $50 in some cryptocurrency to the wallet I specify. Meanwhile, as a result of the patch, the sword that he sold for $500 drops in value to $100, and the sword that he bought for $200 rises to $500.
So basically, we just stole $700 from the system. BlockChainBilly keeps $650 of it, but sends me the promised $50 kickback and promises more if I have more hot tips in the future. Neither the communication in question nor the payment was on anything that Riot can see. As far as they know, and as far as the general public knows, nothing happened. But we just stole $700 from the system and no one is the wiser.
So tell me, how do you propose to stop that? I didn't alter the game database. I couldn't even see the game database. Nothing illicit that I did is in any place that Riot can see it. BlockChainBilly doesn't even even know who I am, as I could be any one of hundreds of people who work for Riot. And besides, he keeps his mouth shut, as he wants future tips to cheat the system for hundreds of dollars again.
And if you can't stop that, then how do honest players trying to "play to earn" hope to compete with people who can take advantage of insider information to buy and sell before prices change? I'll tell you how Blizzard stops it today: binds when picked up.
They will most certainly need to hire P.I. Wizzical undercover insider agency firm to keep an eye on things from the inside.
But absolutely nothing suspicious happened on the inside. There's nothing for Riot to track in my example. The only place that anything illicit happened was on the outside where Riot can't track it unless they're going to put all of their employees under 24-hour surveillance. The mere hundreds of dollars involved isn't going to attract the attention of the criminal justice system, either.
I've a hard time seeing this as game breaking.
The game breaking probably doesn't happen until the developer does this kind of thing on purpose and automates thousands of transactions to skim money from the consumers. Heck, they could go back and forth on the power of the sword.
What happens to the sword if you hide it in another game (NFT)? This is all so stupid.
Given that developers already add grinds to games to sell 'grind removers' in their stores would this surprise anyone? Especially coming from these fly-by night games that are selling NFTs before there is a game to play?
If all you want to do is play a game and have fun, this probably won't make much difference to you. But if you're trying to "play to earn", then one employee stealing from the system once won't wreck it, but this becoming common sure will. It's very hard to be better than average at buying low and selling high when you're competing against other people who have inside information about things that will affect prices in predictable ways. There are good reasons why insider trading is a criminal offense on the real-life stock markets. The same logic will apply to NFT games, but without the prospect of being criminally prosecuted able to keep employees honest.
It reminds me of the scene in Thor Ragnarok where the Grandmaster is visibly uncomfortable when Topaz uses the term slave, but is placated when she edits herself and uses the phrase "the prisoners with jobs".
I have a general principle in life. Sometimes there is a dispute that one side wants to describe accurately in clear and straightforward terms. The other side objects to the use of clear language, but insists that it can only be described in ridiculous euphemisms that obfuscate not merely which side they're on, but what the dispute is even about. When this happens, the former side is right and the latter side is wrong, and it generally is that simple.
There are a whole lot of disputes (likely even most disputes) that this principle won't settle. But when it applies, it's nearly always correct.
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
What kind of mmorpg would that be if all items were purchsed from an in game vendor?
Instead of a crafter making a piece of armor, the developer just would sell it?
It reminds me of the scene in Thor Ragnarok where the Grandmaster is visibly uncomfortable when Topaz uses the term slave, but is placated when she edits herself and uses the phrase "the prisoners with jobs".
I have a general principle in life. Sometimes there is a dispute that one side wants to describe accurately in clear and straightforward terms. The other side objects to the use of clear language, but insists that it can only be described in ridiculous euphemisms that obfuscate not merely which side they're on, but what the dispute is even about. When this happens, the former side is right and the latter side is wrong, and it generally is that simple.
There are a whole lot of disputes (likely even most disputes) that this principle won't settle. But when it applies, it's nearly always correct.
I believe the late great comedian George Carlin called this occourence "Soft Language".
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
What kind of mmorpg would that be if all items were purchsed from an in game vendor?
Instead of a crafter making a piece of armor, the developer just would sell it?
No, no, no. Not all items. Just all items that should be attached to NFTs. If players are going to get items by pulling out their wallet, why give that money to someone else rather than the developers who brought the game into existence?
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
What kind of mmorpg would that be if all items were purchsed from an in game vendor?
Instead of a crafter making a piece of armor, the developer just would sell it?
No, no, no. Not all items. Just all items that should be attached to NFTs. If players are going to get items by pulling out their wallet, why give that money to someone else rather than the developers who brought the game into existence?
We would be talking about limited cash shop items in this case correct?
WoW mints a limited set of 5000 armor skins all unique . Each skin sells for $50. They all sell out. 250k is made. Forever for the life of thes rare items Blizzard will receive 2.5%
Let's try to imagine a limted set of Armor from Vanilla WoW. A nearly 20 year old item form the most popular mmorpg ever, selling today. $2500? $5000? What about the rarest one out of that set. $50000? Something like this would mean the world to some degen WoW player who's put in a 1000 hours a year for the past 17 years. Pretty damn cool if you ask me. Now factor in how many times that item has been sold and resold of the years. This is how value can be built for both the gamer and the developer from a top down approach.
Now lets look at a bottom up approach where players craft NFTs the same market principles and conditions that govern in game economies still apply. The way in which this can/is/will be done wil vary. These items could be sold for ETH or USDC which is a RMT system, or they can be sold for in game currencies with ETH USDC conversion rations driven by real world market conditions. In both scenarios Blizzard will receive a fee from the conversion of currencies.
Both of these methods generate long term value for the player and the developer. Where as the current system we are in delivers no value for the player and diminishing returns in value for the developer.
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
What kind of mmorpg would that be if all items were purchsed from an in game vendor?
Instead of a crafter making a piece of armor, the developer just would sell it?
No, no, no. Not all items. Just all items that should be attached to NFTs. If players are going to get items by pulling out their wallet, why give that money to someone else rather than the developers who brought the game into existence?
We would be talking about limited cash shop items in this case correct?
WoW mints a limited set of 5000 armor skins all unique . Each skin sells for $50. They all sell out. 250k is made. Forever for the life of thes rare items Blizzard will receive 2.5%
Let's try to imagine a limted set of Armor from Vanilla WoW. A nearly 20 year old item form the most popular mmorpg ever, selling today. $2500? $5000? What about the rarest one out of that set. $50000? Something like this would mean the world to some degen WoW player who's put in a 1000 hours a year for the past 17 years. Pretty damn cool if you ask me. Now factor in how many times that item has been sold and resold of the years. This is how value can be built for both the gamer and the developer from a top down approach.
Now lets look at a bottom up approach where players craft NFTs the same market principles and conditions that govern in game economies still apply. The way in which this can/is/will be done wil vary. These items could be sold for ETH or USDC which is a RMT system, or they can be sold for in game currencies with ETH USDC conversion rations driven by real world market conditions. In both scenarios Blizzard will receive a fee from the conversion of currencies.
Both of these methods generate long term value for the player and the developer. Where as the current system we are in delivers no value for the player and diminishing returns in value for the developer.
If Blizzard is getting paid 100% for the skins up front, and then gets a 2.5% commission on any subsequent resales later, then I would see that as no worse than if they had the same sale but the skins were bind on pickup.
But let's not forget how we got to this discussion. Seven quote indents back was your post saying:
"If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?"
So in your proposal, are you the artist who created the skin? Are you buying and reselling NFTs? What is your role that makes you think you should get paid for the limited edition skins?
Gamers have been earning money from gaming for a long time. Not just sponsored esports gamers but twitch and YT gamers as well. And no there's nothing wrong with that.
What is wrong are all the current sales pitches associated with blockchain games that tell everyone they too can make money by gaming in what is essentially pyramid schemes.
So no, nothing wrong with making money by gaming when it's real. Scams are something else altogether.
Honest product for an honest price.
Thats what has been forgotten. Everyone is in for as much as they can get and that sucks for games and everything else in this world these days.
Imho
The block chain games are all about some gamers making money from other gamers. Whether anyone makes money at all remains to be seen but regardless, that creates a totally different gaming environment that IMO, is very messed up.
If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?
Are you actually creating something of value that wouldn't exist if you hadn't done it? Or are you just doing something that results in changing some bits in the game database that developers could trivially do themselves if they wanted to? And if the latter, why should the developers want you to get paid for it, rather than cutting out the middleman and selling the items directly themselves?
The royalty.
And why would developers prefer a 2.5% royalty from your selling an item over keeping 100% of the purchase price by selling it themselves? If you make it 10% or 20% or anything that isn't 100%, the same argument still applies.
What kind of mmorpg would that be if all items were purchsed from an in game vendor?
Instead of a crafter making a piece of armor, the developer just would sell it?
No, no, no. Not all items. Just all items that should be attached to NFTs. If players are going to get items by pulling out their wallet, why give that money to someone else rather than the developers who brought the game into existence?
We would be talking about limited cash shop items in this case correct?
WoW mints a limited set of 5000 armor skins all unique . Each skin sells for $50. They all sell out. 250k is made. Forever for the life of thes rare items Blizzard will receive 2.5%
Let's try to imagine a limted set of Armor from Vanilla WoW. A nearly 20 year old item form the most popular mmorpg ever, selling today. $2500? $5000? What about the rarest one out of that set. $50000? Something like this would mean the world to some degen WoW player who's put in a 1000 hours a year for the past 17 years. Pretty damn cool if you ask me. Now factor in how many times that item has been sold and resold of the years. This is how value can be built for both the gamer and the developer from a top down approach.
Now lets look at a bottom up approach where players craft NFTs the same market principles and conditions that govern in game economies still apply. The way in which this can/is/will be done wil vary. These items could be sold for ETH or USDC which is a RMT system, or they can be sold for in game currencies with ETH USDC conversion rations driven by real world market conditions. In both scenarios Blizzard will receive a fee from the conversion of currencies.
Both of these methods generate long term value for the player and the developer. Where as the current system we are in delivers no value for the player and diminishing returns in value for the developer.
If Blizzard is getting paid 100% for the skins up front, and then gets a 2.5% commission on any subsequent resales later, then I would see that as no worse than if they had the same sale but the skins were bind on pickup.
But let's not forget how we got to this discussion. Seven quote indents back was your post saying:
"If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?"
So in your proposal, are you the artist who created the skin? Are you buying and reselling NFTs? What is your role that makes you think you should get paid for the limited edition skins?
I am the gamer who crafted the NFT.
To your post on why, on a top down cash shop approach. I would be the gamer who bought the limited NFT 20 years ago.
Comments
What are you going to make of value that in any way approximates what a good game makes and sells for the cost of buying it or playing it? Are you a game artist or developer?
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Weaponsmith makes bows. Alchemist makes potions ect. Normal stuff. You thought I was talking about some NFT i created on my laptop
Nah talking I'm the exaxct same things you would normally do in mmorpgs. Listing it the exact same way.
Some games in game currency can be swapped for other currencies like ETH or USDC. Other games have items priced in just ETH or the native currency of the chain they run on.
For the record you better believe they game devs will be getting paid too. As things stand, the normal royalty on NFTs are 2.5%. Every single time that NFT changes hands is sold the studio would get that royalty. What's even better for them that's 2.5% from something that would not be there if a player had not produced it.
And yeah I wouldn't group with the drug addict trying to speed run to hurry up and get to his dealer either lol
If your a fan of flying you can go to where ever fan website you wish and find somebody to create any airport, building, vehicle. Almost anything your imagination can come up with. You can make a deal with that person for what ever you want, Crypto included.
Depending on the deal agreed to the customer, creator, or anyone could publish the works and make a fabulous living doing so or give it away for nothing more than the adoration of the community.
That's the type of model that I'm a fan of. One that nourishes creativity and community.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
We are all sociopaths
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
There are a whole lot of disputes (likely even most disputes) that this principle won't settle. But when it applies, it's nearly always correct.
Instead of a crafter making a piece of armor, the developer just would sell it?
I believe the late great comedian George Carlin called this occourence "Soft Language".
WoW mints a limited set of 5000 armor skins all unique . Each skin sells for $50. They all sell out. 250k is made. Forever for the life of thes rare items Blizzard will receive 2.5%
Let's try to imagine a limted set of Armor from Vanilla WoW. A nearly 20 year old item form the most popular mmorpg ever, selling today. $2500? $5000? What about the rarest one out of that set. $50000? Something like this would mean the world to some degen WoW player who's put in a 1000 hours a year for the past 17 years. Pretty damn cool if you ask me. Now factor in how many times that item has been sold and resold of the years. This is how value can be built for both the gamer and the developer from a top down approach.
Now lets look at a bottom up approach where players craft NFTs the same market principles and conditions that govern in game economies still apply. The way in which this can/is/will be done wil vary. These items could be sold for ETH or USDC which is a RMT system, or they can be sold for in game currencies with ETH USDC conversion rations driven by real world market conditions. In both scenarios Blizzard will receive a fee from the conversion of currencies.
Both of these methods generate long term value for the player and the developer. Where as the current system we are in delivers no value for the player and diminishing returns in value for the developer.
But let's not forget how we got to this discussion. Seven quote indents back was your post saying:
"If I produce something of value in game, something you find value in, and you buy it. What in the world is wrong me getting paid for that item? You'd rather just pay Amazon?"
So in your proposal, are you the artist who created the skin? Are you buying and reselling NFTs? What is your role that makes you think you should get paid for the limited edition skins?
To your post on why, on a top down cash shop approach. I would be the gamer who bought the limited NFT 20 years ago.