Originally posted by hadz Originally posted by pirrg The point is that if those 17000 people wanted to meet in one place they could do so. In guild wars, everything is instanced so even if they had 60205010 players on concurrently it would matter anymore then when WoW or EQ2 has 520502 players on concurrently. Sorry? Who said that was the point? You're neatly sidestepping what, most people would agree, is the real issue with players on the same server...and that is being able to meet up with friends (WoW, EQ2 if they're on a different server you can't, plain and simple), but GW and perhaps EVE if you're willing to wait for them to get to you, you can. Plus, when would all 17000 people want to meet up anyway, and you can't tell me if they all decided to do so that it would actually succeed...I mean if it lags with 300 in one area...how is it going to handle 17000? In GW if you hear one of your friends is playing you can meet up with them...NO TROUBLE at all. In EVE if your friend is on the other side of the galaxy...forget it! Or maybe arrange to meet in 5 hours...5 hours where you'd be able to do almost nothing because you would be travelling the whole time.
All people in guild wars can't meet in 1 instance either. Even if it takes 5 hours to meet your friend in Eve, you still can meet him. In GW you can't always meet your friend in the District you want too. If your friend is in European distric 32 and it's full you can't join him there. Instead you both have to go to European District 53. In Eve all player are in the same universe. If they decide to they can meet in one region, server might not handle it, but they would all be in that 1 region. Just like all players on a Wow server can meet in 1 place. In GW all the players can NEVER be in the same place, because every District has a hardware limit of 100 people or so.
Originally posted by Azirophos The day when GW starts to show how many players are on your current shard/server this discussion can be based on facts and hard numbers. EVE is one of the few games, where you see how many players are online on the server - I know no other major mmo (correct me if there is one) that shows you the current number of players on your server. If that changes the claim of EVE (which based on up to todays information is correct) can be discussed again, until then its only theorizing and senseless bashing, by EVE lovers and EVE "critics".
DAOC
I don't consider myself either an EVE lover nor an EVE critic. I do find it annoying that they feel it's necessary to report a new "record" every time 1 more player than before logged in. And, frankly, I could give a rip if 17,000 people are in the same universe. In the end it doesn't really matter to me. The only people I ever really give a crap about are my friends and my guildmates in a game. The other ##### people are just targets in a PVP game and just annoyances in a PVE game (for the most part).
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Originally posted by Elnator DAOCI don't consider myself either an EVE lover nor an EVE critic. I do find it annoying that they feel it's necessary to report a new "record" every time 1 more player than before logged in. And, frankly, I could give a rip if 17,000 people are in the same universe. In the end it doesn't really matter to me. The only people I ever really give a crap about are my friends and my guildmates in a game. The other ##### people are just targets in a PVP game and just annoyances in a PVE game (for the most part).
You are correct regarding DAoC. However, for someone who doesn't give a rip, you sure seem to be quite vocal about how you don't care. And they only report it when it goes up by 1000 from the previous record. Either way, having 17,000 people logged in on one server is something worthy of mention. Something else worthy of mention is that a solar system in EVE can't take more than several hundred people without players experiencing extreme lag or crashing the server.
Originally posted by Ranma13 Originally posted by Elnator DAOCI don't consider myself either an EVE lover nor an EVE critic. I do find it annoying that they feel it's necessary to report a new "record" every time 1 more player than before logged in. And, frankly, I could give a rip if 17,000 people are in the same universe. In the end it doesn't really matter to me. The only people I ever really give a crap about are my friends and my guildmates in a game. The other ##### people are just targets in a PVP game and just annoyances in a PVE game (for the most part).
You are correct regarding DAoC. However, for someone who doesn't give a rip, you sure seem to be quite vocal about how you don't care. And they only report it when it goes up by 1000 from the previous record. Either way, having 17,000 people logged in on one server is something worthy of mention. Something else worthy of mention is that a solar system in EVE can't take more than several hundred people without players experiencing extreme lag or crashing the server.
Ranma,
That may be true now but as recently as 2 or 3 months ago they were posting "new records" every couple weeks, And it was only in differences of a couple hundred concurrent users. Hell... I'd get EMAILS from the site about it till I put them on my block list.
As to the solar system situation: I think it's VERY important that people know that any given solar system starts lagging at about 250 users in EVE. And over about 300 users and the solar systems are nearly unplayable with rubber banding or the server just flat out not responding to requests. Even chat lags when you get over 300 people in 1 'zone'.
I keep hoping to hear that they've fixed that particular nuissance.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
That may be true now but as recently as 2 or 3 months ago they were posting "new records" every couple weeks, And it was only in differences of a couple hundred concurrent users. Hell... I'd get EMAILS from the site about it till I put them on my block list.
As to the solar system situation: I think it's VERY important that people know that any given solar system starts lagging at about 250 users in EVE. And over about 300 users and the solar systems are nearly unplayable with rubber banding or the server just flat out not responding to requests. Even chat lags when you get over 300 people in 1 'zone'.
I keep hoping to hear that they've fixed that particular nuissance.
If you are recieving the emails you must be signed up to recieve newsletters from them. You could just unsubscribe! EVE's concurrent user figure is also quite specific, its users online at the same time in a single non-instanced universe. WoW/EQ2/SWG all have no chance in that as their server architecture cant handle more than a few thousand on a single server cluster (hence the many seperate shards/servers) and Guild Wars is eliminated because of its heavy reliance on instancing to provide a single server. Will be interesting to see what happens when DnL is released.
As for the users in a single solar system, thats a problem with every MMO I have played. Its down to either the machine serving that area not being able to handle the load (normally results in a crash), or the network bandwidth gets used up (rubber banding, chat lag, etc). As I said, this is a common issue ...
1) I remember DAoC crashing in keep raids with moe than a couple of hundred people.
2) Busy planets in SWG would start rubber banding and areas would crash with more than a few hundred people in close proximity.
3) Orgrimmar in WoW lags all the time with a few hundred people in town. Servers would crash if too many people were in certain instances, i.e. too many groups doing BRS and the instance server would lag/crash. The SS/TM fights of old would cause crashes also, because the WoW server code cant handle more than a hundred or so players in close proximity (the main reason I suspect they are so set on pushing BGs).
Originally posted by pirrg The point is that if those 17000 people wanted to meet in one place they could do so. In guild wars, everything is instanced so even if they had 60205010 players on concurrently it would matter anymore then when WoW or EQ2 has 520502 players on concurrently.
Sorry? Who said that was the point? You're neatly sidestepping what, most people would agree, is the real issue with players on the same server...and that is being able to meet up with friends (WoW, EQ2 if they're on a different server you can't, plain and simple), but GW and perhaps EVE if you're willing to wait for them to get to you, you can. Plus, when would all 17000 people want to meet up anyway, and you can't tell me if they all decided to do so that it would actually succeed...I mean if it lags with 300 in one area...how is it going to handle 17000? In GW if you hear one of your friends is playing you can meet up with them...NO TROUBLE at all. In EVE if your friend is on the other side of the galaxy...forget it! Or maybe arrange to meet in 5 hours...5 hours where you'd be able to do almost nothing because you would be travelling the whole time.
All people in guild wars can't meet in 1 instance either. Even if it takes 5 hours to meet your friend in Eve, you still can meet him. In GW you can't always meet your friend in the District you want too. If your friend is in European distric 32 and it's full you can't join him there. Instead you both have to go to European District 53. In Eve all player are in the same universe. If they decide to they can meet in one region, server might not handle it, but they would all be in that 1 region. Just like all players on a Wow server can meet in 1 place. In GW all the players can NEVER be in the same place, because every District has a hardware limit of 100 people or so.
NICELY put Phoenixs !
I want to add to your on target definition of what it means when players are truly in the same universe/shard/server.......
In addition to having the possibility of meeting anyone in the game, there is -
-> Also having the possibility of economically directly and in directly interacting with every single person. By this I mean the ingame economy. This is truly where EvE shines. Heck, even outshinesallothermmorpgs. Only SWG comes closest in 2nd place. (in SWG each server caps at 12,000 players.) IMHO AO currently is next in 3rd place since it has only 2 main servers and 1 minor server (it is German only.)
With 17k players online at the same time, it comes as close as possible to simulating real life economics with buy and sell, buy, sell, etc... 17k potiential customers to buy, sell, and interact economically with one. New players who think, can litterally make 1 million ISK in minimum time by simply playing the market. Vet players who think, can litterally make upwards of 50 million, 100 million+ ISK in minimum time. The more you make, THE MORE YOU MAKE. (Just like the real life saying "It takes money, to make money.")
This was how back when I was a newbie I made my first 25 million credits in SWG - by playing the market. It was sooo easy it was insane. (This would be during the first 4 months SWG released, when every single server was filled to the brim. ALL SWG servers had 12k players online at the same time. ). It is also fun as heck, because it works exactly like playing the real life stock markets. But with much quicker results LOL! Hey proof computer games are as educational as they are entertaining!!!
One of the NICEST real life examples of doing this, was a teenager in New Jersey, USA. A few years ago, he made over $100,000.oo (USA) from nothing, in a few months by playing penny stocks. The kid was still in High School. He was playing a market with roughly 1 million+ potiential buyers, sellers.
Originally posted by Elnator That may be true now but as recently as 2 or 3 months ago they were posting "new records" every couple weeks, And it was only in differences of a couple hundred concurrent users. Hell... I'd get EMAILS from the site about it till I put them on my block list.
As far as I can remember, they only updated the PCU every thousand players, so there was one for 12,000, 13,000, 14,000, etc... I also don't recall getting any e-mails about it.
As to the solar system situation: I think it's VERY important that people know that any given solar system starts lagging at about 250 users in EVE. And over about 300 users and the solar systems are nearly unplayable with rubber banding or the server just flat out not responding to requests. Even chat lags when you get over 300 people in 1 'zone'.
I think it's also VERY important to point out that any MMORPG that has that many people in one place will lag that badly. It's not specific to EVE Online.
Thats great for Eve, 17k users on one server at one time.
I really think Dark and Light will easily beat 17k though. Dark and Light will have I believe two servers, one for the Chinese cause of their Communist laws that you can only play what is it 3 hours of mmoprgs a day (they will ban all Chinese IPs)? And a server for the rest of the world. You can go go dark and lights website and see that they are pushing 700-800 people at primetime on all their forums and the game isn't even out yet. 700 people just reading and waiting in anticipation of the Prelude release to Dark and Light. Thats crazy.
Anyways I just refuse to play Eve, where i understand you can never catch up to the players that started the game before you.
I've always found the fact they make a big deal out of pcu funny. Lets be honest here. While Eve might have 17,000 players on at the same time in the same world, I can log into EQ2 and have a ton more people to play with than pretty much any place in Eve. I also see other people all the time, unlike Eve were you only see people right next to the gates.
Originally posted by Radshak Anyways I just refuse to play Eve, where i understand you can never catch up to the players that started the game before you.
Here's a perfect example of a gamer (sorry, I mean no offense here Radshak) who has been isolated to the WOW/EQ MMO architecture while being exposed to misinformation regarding EVE.
The truth is that within a month you're a valuable asset to you team. Within 3 months you are competitive with 80% of the population. In 5-6 months, you are pretty much on the same level as someone who has started 2 years earlier.
Since EVE has no formal character classes and no character levels, the only measuring stick to compare yourself agianst an older player is based on wealth, assests, and your social network. So the assertion that you can never catch up to older players is false, not only is it possible but it is encouraged and frequently demonstrated.
Finnaly here is a shard of truth about allmighty EVE.
It proves not only that EVE concurrent users record is a FAKE. But also that many players meeting on the same place SERIOUSLY CRUSHES EVE SERVERS!!
Read it and weep
Taken from EVE forums
.....for those of you who were wondering WHY the servers went down last night, ill explain.....
.....because of this, 4S and the entire NBSI alliance (and anyone else who thought this was unfair) were to stage a protest in Jita (one of the most populated systems in the game) in the form of turning up as many people as possible in shuttles, and sit outside the M4 station to cause extreme lag, to the point the node would crash.
and, suprisingly enough, it worked. and well. not just one node but half of the nodes crashed, the login server crashed for both the main server AND the test server.casuing 50% of the game to drop and be unable to log back in for hours, whilst the half unaffected stayed ingame never to log back in if they quit.
my personal view on the situation is that 4S should pick thier toys up off the floor and get lost, because taking down half the games nodes just for a name( all of which couldve been solved on the QT very easily). a few people have been banned, i think they all should be.
but me being me, i also am opposed to the way the GMs and ISD handled the situation. by rampaging around the forums, trying to cover it up by forum banning everyone who asked why the servers were down and claiming that everything was in control (when it clearly wasnt, and down for approximatley 6 hours, it takes an exact 10 minute count to start up the servers)
i was one of the fmany who got forum ban, because i made and posted this.
So, in EVE is theoretically possible to meet all 17K in one place, but is not physically possible.
In GW, you CAN'T, even theoretically, meet all the others in same place.
Does it makes a difference? I don't see it. I can very well see that the GW thing is a developer decision to actually avoid server crashed causated by too many people in same place as it is much easier in GW to actually change place than in EVE.
Can you speak to all people online if you wish so? yes for both.
It is true that in GW you can't, for example, sell an item to everybody on the server, while in EVE is theoretically possible trough the player selling system (forgot the name of those missions).
So, in the end, it all boils down to perspective.
I think the real point of this thread (as the OP has expressed in previous occasions) is the hostility some EVE fans express toward everybody else. This is the same phenomenon you have with WoW bashers, but opposite. Instead of bashing a game, you bash who don't play it.
Both cases are pretty childish and in no way my (or anybody else) abilities, skills and intelligence levels can be evalued by the GAME i choose to play in my free time. I wish people would start to understand that.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Originally posted by Volkmar I think the real point of this thread (as the OP has expressed in previous occasions) is the hostility some EVE fans express toward everybody else. This is the same phenomenon you have with WoW bashers, but opposite. Instead of bashing a game, you bash who don't play it.
Yes Volkmar that is my point, in general, when I talk about EVE. I seldom disparage the game itself, because people obviously enjoy it. My problem is with 1) those who promote it even in threads where it DOESN'T apply at all (happens very seldom now) and 2) those who belittle others who may not enjoy the game by pre-labeling them with a harsh generalisation.
But...for this post my point was...and still is...that the PCU has probably been beaten by GW and maybe by a number of other games. The 17,000 users all being able to meet up (which has been the main point of others in this thread) is NOT part of a PCU debate because there is no cause or need that would ever make this happen (unless it was for a stunt).
The whole POINT of having a single server (or shared servers that act like a single server/shard) is so that there is NO limitation on who you can play with.
That being said the EVE site has pretty much retracted their record anyway, by limiting it to non-instanced games now (as well as non-sharded), and also saying that to their knowledge it is a record. So, basically the whole discussion moot.
Originally posted by Ranma13 Originally posted by Elnator That may be true now but as recently as 2 or 3 months ago they were posting "new records" every couple weeks, And it was only in differences of a couple hundred concurrent users. Hell... I'd get EMAILS from the site about it till I put them on my block list.
As far as I can remember, they only updated the PCU every thousand players, so there was one for 12,000, 13,000, 14,000, etc... I also don't recall getting any e-mails about it.
As to the solar system situation: I think it's VERY important that people know that any given solar system starts lagging at about 250 users in EVE. And over about 300 users and the solar systems are nearly unplayable with rubber banding or the server just flat out not responding to requests. Even chat lags when you get over 300 people in 1 'zone'.
I think it's also VERY important to point out that any MMORPG that has that many people in one place will lag that badly. It's not specific to EVE Online.
Agree, but in EVE the fact that everyone is on the same "server" means that those high concentrations of players happen a LOT more often. Most MMORPG's only have about 4000 players online on any given server at any given time. During Peak. EVE, on the other hand, while it has fewer total players online has 17,000 on at peak time on the same server. Therefore the 'popular' areas tend to get overcrowded a LOT faster.
I run into lag in EVE due to high player count a LOT more often than I do in DAOC, EQ2 or even WOW. Simply because the *server* population is lower
Also, in SWG, DAOC and other games the lag from high concentrations of players is usually client side. In EVE it's server side.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Comments
All people in guild wars can't meet in 1 instance either. Even if it takes 5 hours to meet your friend in Eve, you still can meet him. In GW you can't always meet your friend in the District you want too. If your friend is in European distric 32 and it's full you can't join him there. Instead you both have to go to European District 53. In Eve all player are in the same universe. If they decide to they can meet in one region, server might not handle it, but they would all be in that 1 region. Just like all players on a Wow server can meet in 1 place. In GW all the players can NEVER be in the same place, because every District has a hardware limit of 100 people or so.
DAOC
I don't consider myself either an EVE lover nor an EVE critic. I do find it annoying that they feel it's necessary to report a new "record" every time 1 more player than before logged in. And, frankly, I could give a rip if 17,000 people are in the same universe. In the end it doesn't really matter to me. The only people I ever really give a crap about are my friends and my guildmates in a game. The other ##### people are just targets in a PVP game and just annoyances in a PVE game (for the most part).
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
You are correct regarding DAoC. However, for someone who doesn't give a rip, you sure seem to be quite vocal about how you don't care. And they only report it when it goes up by 1000 from the previous record. Either way, having 17,000 people logged in on one server is something worthy of mention. Something else worthy of mention is that a solar system in EVE can't take more than several hundred people without players experiencing extreme lag or crashing the server.
Ranma,
That may be true now but as recently as 2 or 3 months ago they were posting "new records" every couple weeks, And it was only in differences of a couple hundred concurrent users. Hell... I'd get EMAILS from the site about it till I put them on my block list.
As to the solar system situation:
I think it's VERY important that people know that any given solar system starts lagging at about 250 users in EVE. And over about 300 users and the solar systems are nearly unplayable with rubber banding or the server just flat out not responding to requests. Even chat lags when you get over 300 people in 1 'zone'.
I keep hoping to hear that they've fixed that particular nuissance.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
If you are recieving the emails you must be signed up to recieve newsletters from them. You could just unsubscribe! EVE's concurrent user figure is also quite specific, its users online at the same time in a single non-instanced universe. WoW/EQ2/SWG all have no chance in that as their server architecture cant handle more than a few thousand on a single server cluster (hence the many seperate shards/servers) and Guild Wars is eliminated because of its heavy reliance on instancing to provide a single server. Will be interesting to see what happens when DnL is released.
As for the users in a single solar system, thats a problem with every MMO I have played. Its down to either the machine serving that area not being able to handle the load (normally results in a crash), or the network bandwidth gets used up (rubber banding, chat lag, etc). As I said, this is a common issue ...
1) I remember DAoC crashing in keep raids with moe than a couple of hundred people.
2) Busy planets in SWG would start rubber banding and areas would crash with more than a few hundred people in close proximity.
3) Orgrimmar in WoW lags all the time with a few hundred people in town. Servers would crash if too many people were in certain instances, i.e. too many groups doing BRS and the instance server would lag/crash. The SS/TM fights of old would cause crashes also, because the WoW server code cant handle more than a hundred or so players in close proximity (the main reason I suspect they are so set on pushing BGs).
All people in guild wars can't meet in 1 instance either. Even if it takes 5 hours to meet your friend in Eve, you still can meet him. In GW you can't always meet your friend in the District you want too. If your friend is in European distric 32 and it's full you can't join him there. Instead you both have to go to European District 53. In Eve all player are in the same universe. If they decide to they can meet in one region, server might not handle it, but they would all be in that 1 region. Just like all players on a Wow server can meet in 1 place. In GW all the players can NEVER be in the same place, because every District has a hardware limit of 100 people or so.
NICELY put Phoenixs !
I want to add to your on target definition of what it means when players are truly in the same universe/shard/server.......
In addition to having the possibility of meeting anyone in the game, there is -
-> Also having the possibility of economically directly and in directly interacting with every single person. By this I mean the ingame economy. This is truly where EvE shines. Heck, even outshines all other mmorpgs. Only SWG comes closest in 2nd place. (in SWG each server caps at 12,000 players.) IMHO AO currently is next in 3rd place since it has only 2 main servers and 1 minor server (it is German only.)
With 17k players online at the same time, it comes as close as possible to simulating real life economics with buy and sell, buy, sell, etc... 17k potiential customers to buy, sell, and interact economically with one. New players who think, can litterally make 1 million ISK in minimum time by simply playing the market. Vet players who think, can litterally make upwards of 50 million, 100 million+ ISK in minimum time. The more you make, THE MORE YOU MAKE. (Just like the real life saying "It takes money, to make money.")
This was how back when I was a newbie I made my first 25 million credits in SWG - by playing the market. It was sooo easy it was insane. (This would be during the first 4 months SWG released, when every single server was filled to the brim. ALL SWG servers had 12k players online at the same time.
). It is also fun as heck, because it works exactly like playing the real life stock markets. But with much quicker results LOL! Hey proof computer games are as educational as they are entertaining!!! 
One of the NICEST real life examples of doing this, was a teenager in New Jersey, USA. A few years ago, he made over $100,000.oo (USA) from nothing, in a few months by playing penny stocks. The kid was still in High School. He was playing a market with roughly 1 million+ potiential buyers, sellers.
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As far as I can remember, they only updated the PCU every thousand players, so there was one for 12,000, 13,000, 14,000, etc... I also don't recall getting any e-mails about it.
I think it's also VERY important to point out that any MMORPG that has that many people in one place will lag that badly. It's not specific to EVE Online.
Thats great for Eve, 17k users on one server at one time.
I really think Dark and Light will easily beat 17k though. Dark and Light will have I believe two servers, one for the Chinese cause of their Communist laws that you can only play what is it 3 hours of mmoprgs a day (they will ban all Chinese IPs)? And a server for the rest of the world. You can go go dark and lights website and see that they are pushing 700-800 people at primetime on all their forums and the game isn't even out yet. 700 people just reading and waiting in anticipation of the Prelude release to Dark and Light. Thats crazy.
Anyways I just refuse to play Eve, where i understand you can never catch up to the players that started the game before you.
I've always found the fact they make a big deal out of pcu funny. Lets be honest here. While Eve might have 17,000 players on at the same time in the same world, I can log into EQ2 and have a ton more people to play with than pretty much any place in Eve. I also see other people all the time, unlike Eve were you only see people right next to the gates.
Here's a perfect example of a gamer (sorry, I mean no offense here Radshak) who has been isolated to the WOW/EQ MMO architecture while being exposed to misinformation regarding EVE.
The truth is that within a month you're a valuable asset to you team. Within 3 months you are competitive with 80% of the population. In 5-6 months, you are pretty much on the same level as someone who has started 2 years earlier.
Since EVE has no formal character classes and no character levels, the only measuring stick to compare yourself agianst an older player is based on wealth, assests, and your social network. So the assertion that you can never catch up to older players is false, not only is it possible but it is encouraged and frequently demonstrated.
Finnaly here is a shard of truth about allmighty EVE.
It proves not only that EVE concurrent users record is a FAKE. But also that many players meeting on the same place SERIOUSLY CRUSHES EVE SERVERS!!
Read it and weep
Taken from EVE forums
.....for those of you who were wondering WHY the servers went down last night, ill explain.....
.....because of this, 4S and the entire NBSI alliance (and anyone else who thought this was unfair) were to stage a protest in Jita (one of the most populated systems in the game) in the form of turning up as many people as possible in shuttles, and sit outside the M4 station to cause extreme lag, to the point the node would crash.
and, suprisingly enough, it worked. and well. not just one node but half of the nodes crashed, the login server crashed for both the main server AND the test server.casuing 50% of the game to drop and be unable to log back in for hours, whilst the half unaffected stayed ingame never to log back in if they quit.
my personal view on the situation is that 4S should pick thier toys up off the floor and get lost, because taking down half the games nodes just for a name( all of which couldve been solved on the QT very easily). a few people have been banned, i think they all should be.
but me being me, i also am opposed to the way the GMs and ISD handled the situation. by rampaging around the forums, trying to cover it up by forum banning everyone who asked why the servers were down and claiming that everything was in control (when it clearly wasnt, and down for approximatley 6 hours, it takes an exact 10 minute count to start up the servers)
i was one of the fmany who got forum ban, because i made and posted this.
http://foob.mysite.freeserve.com/ccp.html
"Before this battle is over all the world will know that few...stood against many." - King Leonidas
So, in EVE is theoretically possible to meet all 17K in one place, but is not physically possible.
In GW, you CAN'T, even theoretically, meet all the others in same place.
Does it makes a difference? I don't see it. I can very well see that the GW thing is a developer decision to actually avoid server crashed causated by too many people in same place as it is much easier in GW to actually change place than in EVE.
Can you speak to all people online if you wish so? yes for both.
It is true that in GW you can't, for example, sell an item to everybody on the server, while in EVE is theoretically possible trough the player selling system (forgot the name of those missions).
So, in the end, it all boils down to perspective.
I think the real point of this thread (as the OP has expressed in previous occasions) is the hostility some EVE fans express toward everybody else. This is the same phenomenon you have with WoW bashers, but opposite. Instead of bashing a game, you bash who don't play it.
Both cases are pretty childish and in no way my (or anybody else) abilities, skills and intelligence levels can be evalued by the GAME i choose to play in my free time. I wish people would start to understand that.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Yes Volkmar that is my point, in general, when I talk about EVE. I seldom disparage the game itself, because people obviously enjoy it. My problem is with 1) those who promote it even in threads where it DOESN'T apply at all (happens very seldom now) and 2) those who belittle others who may not enjoy the game by pre-labeling them with a harsh generalisation.
But...for this post my point was...and still is...that the PCU has probably been beaten by GW and maybe by a number of other games. The 17,000 users all being able to meet up (which has been the main point of others in this thread) is NOT part of a PCU debate because there is no cause or need that would ever make this happen (unless it was for a stunt).
The whole POINT of having a single server (or shared servers that act like a single server/shard) is so that there is NO limitation on who you can play with.
That being said the EVE site has pretty much retracted their record anyway, by limiting it to non-instanced games now (as well as non-sharded), and also saying that to their knowledge it is a record. So, basically the whole discussion moot.
So...mods...feel free to lock.
As far as I can remember, they only updated the PCU every thousand players, so there was one for 12,000, 13,000, 14,000, etc... I also don't recall getting any e-mails about it.
I think it's also VERY important to point out that any MMORPG that has that many people in one place will lag that badly. It's not specific to EVE Online.
Agree, but in EVE the fact that everyone is on the same "server" means that those high concentrations of players happen a LOT more often. Most MMORPG's only have about 4000 players online on any given server at any given time. During Peak. EVE, on the other hand, while it has fewer total players online has 17,000 on at peak time on the same server. Therefore the 'popular' areas tend to get overcrowded a LOT faster.
I run into lag in EVE due to high player count a LOT more often than I do in DAOC, EQ2 or even WOW. Simply because the *server* population is lower
Also, in SWG, DAOC and other games the lag from high concentrations of players is usually client side. In EVE it's server side.
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