Originally posted by Denmar This isn't about believing press releases, this is about facts. The fact is that, at this time, SOE co-publishing Vanguard has 0 impact on the game. Also, your list of games that "SOE absorbed and tried to ruin" doesn't make much sense. SWG and EQ2 were their own projects from the start, unless my memory is failing me. Also, again.. co-publishing a game is not the same as buying out a company. Could SOE buyout Sigil at some point? Yes, but this co-publishing move has nothing to do with it. Lastly, I mentioned 2 other games being co-published by SOE in a similar agreement to Sigil's.. if Vanguard's demise is so absolute at this point, why aren't those other games suffering the same fate?
EQ2 was in development when SoE took over control of development (or that was when Brad and company left SoE, either way, SoE took over)....hence why it came out so simplified and unfinished compared to what was being promised
Lucas Arts had creative control over SWG...SoE basicly couldnt do anything major to the game without getting approval. Now they can (and have) do whatever they want.
And this is considered dreadful news to most people due to MMORPGs being long term games, EQ/Vanguard are games that are played for years, and people dont feel like wasting $50+ a year worth of subscription and their time just to have the game sold to SoE which then procedes to make the game easy as hell and pump out forgetable (but vital to have due to exp nerfs in old content and overpowered items/exp areas in new content) expantions every 2 months.
Oh well, *now* $OE's decision to raise its All-Access rate makes perfect sense. Couldn't figure it out before when they only had EQ2 (good) SWG (puke) MxO (dead) EQ1 (old) and Planetside (free). But throw Vangard in there and it adds up . . . to more money for $OE.
btw I dont count the 2d side-scrollers or wutever thatre bundled in all-access.
I don''t really know when Humankind will die out but i''m guessing about 6 years before WOW. -BarCrow
Vanguard comes out. In 3-5 months 1st "expension". By the time game is 1 year old we will already have 3 "expensions" and still shit load of bugs from beta.
Since game will be very hard they will dumb it down and turn it in to WoW with better graphics + 2 more "expension".
Cya @ some other game
Every time I read your post, I die a little inside...
Who really knows at this stage. But why does it always seem like something has been defiled when SoE steps in and takes a part of it..?
So true. SOE really got a reputation from SWG and it's justly deserved. That game is such a joke, it's not even funny. Last game to have this much contraversy over major overhauls was UO. Guess what? Same guy (Raph Koster) was at the helm of them both! Raph is head MMO guy at SOE, so guess what that means to Vanguard?!?!
Apparently, this fella is the guru or MMORPGs, but for some ungodly reason, after a game is released it needs serious revamp resulting in cheesing off half the players making them quit.
Brad left the EQ project because he wanted to make a game his way, but now he's tying himself back to SOE which is gonna end of tying his hands again.
I haven't read through *all* of the posts on this thread, but wow are there a lot of people freaking out over this move.
On the one hand, how many people REALLY think MS would be a solid publishing choice ? For example, how many people are reading this thread in Firefox rather than IE ?
On the other hand, I still play EQ2 on and off though not as any kind of hardcore player by any means. The in-game community is possibly the best I've seen in an MMO since the early days of EQ ( before the power-gamer guilds took the game over -- remember, it wasnt SoE that *ruined* the original game as so many claim, but rather all of the hardcore 24/7 raiding guilds that would go to the Fan Faire and demand the game suit their growing raiding addictions .. SoE is only guilty of giving the players what they asked for ) It's the *offline* community for EQ2 though, that's got a royal bug up it's butt. Just like the WoW forums it's not about discussion but rather "OMG make this game be exactly what I, a single player demand it to be or I'll sue you !!!"
It's the forum jockies of the gaming world that tend to vent all of their daily frustrations towards a game / dev team rather than just play a game for the enjoyment factor. It's that same mentality I see behind the many negative comments here.
In EQ2, had any of the staff been online during peak hours in the past few months they'd have surely noticed the most common 'buzz' topic has been how many people intend to play Vanguard upon release. No big shock that SoE would be interrested in a game developed by the same core group of people who created EQ in the first place thus being the entire reason SoE is known in the MMO space to begin with.
This is a good move IMO ~ they're not outright selling the title, but rather co-publishing.
For anyone who thinks this is bad news though ~~ Take 5 minutes and read through the Vanguard FAQ page on their website. Scroll down towards the end where they get fairly long-winded about it being a good thing to simply create a game and then sell the studio to a large company. Though not what they're doing for the time being, it's still no suprise to me that they'd go with a company they've worked with directly in the past, one that for a long time was THE biggest MMO publisher in the industry and has extremely large amounts of resources for distribution etc that currently aren't being put to use to push a specific title.
Vanguard = created to appeal to the original players of EQ, remeber that as well.
It doesn't suprise me that Sigil and Microsoft have parted company. Perhaps Microsoft got a good look at the current state of Vanguard and panicked (who wouldn't, I've seen it and it is not impressive!) or maybe there was a disagreement over the future direction with regard to XBox360 etc.
Sigil are positioning this as a good move for Vanguard, but I'm not so sure. It was Sigil who were in a position of weakness, with no publisher for their game. Based on their past record, SOE would have had Sigil over a barrel during the negotiations and exploited this. Or have SOE suddenly changed overnight ? I doubt Brad and Smed's friendship would go that far, or that Brad has enough juicy stories to blackmail Smed to get a better deal
SOE are in this to make money and will do whatever it takes. That should be no suprise to anyone. In my view, if that means closing the servers and the game down after 6 months because Sigil won't put in the additional content that SOE ask for, then this will happen.
I don't for a second think that anyone other than SOE and John Smedley control the future of this game.
P.S. When Microsoft were publishing the game there was lots of talk about a version for the XBOX360. Now that Sony are in charge, maybe we will see a PS3 version ?
Originally posted by DrSmaSh There goes the Vanguard.
It will go like this:
Vanguard comes out. In 3-5 months 1st "expension". By the time game is 1 year old we will already have 3 "expensions" and still shit load of bugs from beta.
Since game will be very hard they will dumb it down and turn it in to WoW with better graphics + 2 more "expension".
Cya @ some other game
Good, cause if you trying to say EQ2 sucks because it has 2 expansions and 2 packs you are freaking nuts. Bugs? Please don't use the "fix all the bugs before new content" crap. I've been playing EQ2 since release and yet to encounter some bug that keeps me from playing or causing massive issues.
You guys all whining and moaning about SoE taking over and not buying it? Good, you and the pre-CU SWG folks can all go join a club somewhere and cry cause you can't get "your" game back.
Originally posted by Celestian Good, cause if you trying to say EQ2 sucks because it has 2 expansions and 2 packs you are freaking nuts. Bugs? Please don't use the "fix all the bugs before new content" crap. I've been playing EQ2 since release and yet to encounter some bug that keeps me from playing or causing massive issues.
You guys all whining and moaning about SoE taking over and not buying it? Good, you and the pre-CU SWG folks can all go join a club somewhere and cry cause you can't get "your" game back.
Dumbed down? Yeap you sure are.
You've been playing EQ2 since release and have never encountered bugs that keep you from playing or cause massive issues?
I played it for a year and was constantly experiencing gameplay issues and bugs. Let's talk about just a few that I can remember:
1. The Merchant issues
2. The LAG issues
3. The crashing to desktop issues
4. Broken spells and combat arts
5. The constant nerfing of loot, professions and quests
6. Lack of any type of reliable Customer Service
7. Developer's attitudes
8. Mob pathing problems, de-spawning and lock out timers
9. Server downtime
10. Tradeskill recipes being added months after promise
Those are just a FEW of the problems SoE has with EQ2. Let's not even mention what they did to SWG.
Just because you can't see the problems that SoE has in maintaining their games and customers, doesn't mean that others don't have problems with them. Maybe you've been playing SoE games so long, that you actually don't know how a decent, honest company operates? ;P
_________________________________ JonMichael
Currently: AION, an MMO Beta under NDA Played: WAR, LOTRO, Hellgate: London, CoX, GW, SotNW, DAOC, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AO, Horizons, Second Life, There, TSO Beta'd: There, Second Life, EQ2, DAOC:LotM, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, Gods and Heroes, Hellgate: London, Requiem:Bloodymare, AoC, WAR, DDO, Fallen Earth
Originally posted by schmootzig remember, it wasnt SoE that *ruined* the original game as so many claim, but rather all of the hardcore 24/7 raiding guilds that would go to the Fan Faire and demand the game suit their growing raiding addictions ..
Just an observation, I've been to 3 Fan Faire's and never once was I asked my opinion on where the game should go.
The sessions were very structured and there wasn't any room for that kind of back and forth discussion with the developers.
Maybe people were approaching them outside of the sessions and flooding them with their ideas for the game, but I didn't get that impression.
The most heated the discussions ever got was when one nerd smuggly told the developers he would be playing WoW due to the lack of pvp (pre-EQ2 release). And that guy's courage was met with silence on the part of the audience and he just appeared rude and arrogant. Remember, it's easy to spout off platitudes and ideology behind the safety of your own screen, but in reality it would be very difficult for anyone of you to actually walk up to a developer and say, 'you're game sucks for the following reasons...' Those of you who do that don't look like the heroic paladin, willing to sacrifice himself to the good of the community, you look like the idiot from the Simpson's; "Worst episode, ever".
My personal opinion is this. SOE is a big money grubbing corporation. If SOE wasn't publishing it, then some other big money grubbing corporation would be. Stop crying foul at inconsiquential matters such as a computer game. If you wanna be a hater and bash the way big business works in this country, pick one that is doing some actual harm, like exploiting poor people, loop holing out of their taxes or destroying our natural resources. The fact that some of you are driven to revolution because your bp got nerfed from 20 ac to 18 ac make me laugh. You are all ideal Roman cititzens. You have your bread and circuses, so the only time you scream is when the circus stops. So you feel like SOE 'stole' your 14.95 fee (or whatever it is)? How much are you paying for ENRON's crimes? Probably more than you know. Yet I bet most have spent their precious indignation time on SOE while there are other corp's out there robbing you blind and leaving you for dead, in reality rather than figuratively. At least I got to kill some cool dragons when SOE robbed me.
Priorities folks; if the worst thing that happened to you today is Sigil 'merging' with SOE, you have a pretty good life.
Originally posted by JonMichael Originally posted by Celestian Good, cause if you trying to say EQ2 sucks because it has 2 expansions and 2 packs you are freaking nuts. Bugs? Please don't use the "fix all the bugs before new content" crap. I've been playing EQ2 since release and yet to encounter some bug that keeps me from playing or causing massive issues.
You guys all whining and moaning about SoE taking over and not buying it? Good, you and the pre-CU SWG folks can all go join a club somewhere and cry cause you can't get "your" game back.
Dumbed down? Yeap you sure are.
You've been playing EQ2 since release and have never encountered bugs that keep you from playing or cause massive issues?
I played it for a year and was constantly experiencing gameplay issues and bugs. Let's talk about just a few that I can remember:
1. The Merchant issues
2. The LAG issues
3. The crashing to desktop issues
4. Broken spells and combat arts
5. The constant nerfing of loot, professions and quests
6. Lack of any type of reliable Customer Service
7. Developer's attitudes
8. Mob pathing problems, de-spawning and lock out timers
9. Server downtime
10. Tradeskill recipes being added months after promise
Those are just a FEW of the problems SoE has with EQ2. Let's not even mention what they did to SWG.
Just because you can't see the problems that SoE has in maintaining their games and customers, doesn't mean that others don't have problems with them. Maybe you've been playing SoE games so long, that you actually don't know how a decent, honest company operates? ;P
Those are all personal issues "you" apparently had. I personally didn't experience anything on that list which in any way negatively impacted my gameplay. EQ2 is a very very good game. If you haven't played in the last several months, you probably have not experienced what the game really has to offer.
Do me a favor and don't bother responding to this post. Nothing I, nor anyone else, says is going to change your apparent biased dislike for SOE.
eq2 ran great the last time i played it, let this thread die....you people are not going to play it and you are going to keep speculting(sp?) on what might happen, thats fine.
there are quite a few people that obviously still love soe games no matter how bad of a company soe is so whatever happens i assume vanguard will be there no matter how much you complain and pretend it is dead, to you it is dead to many others it is very much alive.
SoE and Vanguard eh heh, well it will be one less form to fill out, since I allready have an SoE account. Don't really care who publishes the game, after all I didn't stop reading Steven King when he changed publishers.
Originally posted by Aramodin SoE and Vanguard eh heh, well it will be one less form to fill out, since I allready have an SoE account. Don't really care who publishes the game, after all I didn't stop reading Steven King when he changed publishers.
Did the puplisher do you wrong? Of course not. Thats why you kept on reading. But what if they did you wrong, or did not care about anything but $$ and did not listen to the majority? You might think twice..
So many of you are just blindly assuming that the current deal with SOE will remain the way it is. What most of us with experience dealing with SOE are saying is that things start off innocently with them, and then before you know it ...BAM....your game has been bought out, the original Devs have quit or been fired, there are at lest two or three game "revamps" being worked on, you get continual nerfs and unfinished expansions, and before you know it most people have quit and the game you fell in love with and devoted so much time to has disappeared and you are cold and bitter and posting on MMORPG.com.........
But go ahead and blindly follow them into the abyss....what do I care.
"The man who exchanges Liberty for Iconic classes is a fool deserving of neither." - Me and Ben Franklin
Nice one chesterwiz, three posts in a row of pure ignorance and speculation.
SoE owned the rights to EQ when they started developing eq:luclin all the way up to eq2. I'm pretty sure Sigil dropped microsoft and grabbed SoE (but they are doing some self-publishing as well) in order to have bother creative and economic control over their game. Believe me, Brad McQuaid is not a dumb guy, and if he's at all active in the MMO community he saw what happened to SWG, and won't let it happen to Vanguard.
chlaos: I assume your referring to SWG? Well that wasn't entirely SoE's fault (where I'm not freeing them from blame) but it was also Lucas Art's fault... I also want to know what kind of "Experience" you have with SoE to know the way they operate business.
Well, lets just hang back and see what happens. SOE has no control over the games content, customer service , or creative control. So it might not be so bad. I DO NOT like $OE at all, I will not play a game they own, BUT if they are just handleing pr packaging and stuff like that and not the game itself, then im willing to give it a look.
Going to throw my 2cp in this one. Have not read through every page of this but heres what i have to say. Being someone that has played just about every major MMO SOE has been involved with going back to pre-kunark EQ up to EQ2, i have to say as a company i despise them. Given the circumstances with Vanguard and Brad McQuaid though, i highly doubt this is a bad move on Sigil's part. Keep in mind that Sigil was in bed with the devil to begin with (Microsoft) so SOE can't really be to much worse. Now, i'm sure that SOE has some sort of eye out to see if Sigil gets itself into a position to be bought out just like Verant was, thats just how SOE does things. But honestly if Microsoft was trying to pressure Sigil right now to do something they didnt want to do with Vanguard, how could SOE doing the same thing 2 years from now be worse? Least we will have those 2 years of Vanguard the way its supposed to be. We all know SOE took a dump on Brad's "Vision" with EQ1, personally i doubt hes going to let them do it again soon.
Hehe cant believe there are still people trusting SoE, vanguard might not be doomed yet but in no way SoE will ever get one dollar from me again. They cheat their customers. The forum fanboys (who also have a moderator position on another name...admitted by one of them on their guild chat dear Kenny-boy) make sure only the positive threads stay up. I cant believe Brad sold his soul to the devil.....
SOE is Publishing the game. Has absolutely NOTHING to do with gameplay. . .
Really? Will they still have nothing to do with the gameplay if Vanguard doesn't get off to a good start? I'm beating a dead horse here but there are plenty of classic MMOs that didn't start off well and are still great games. Saga of Ryzom and Anarchy Online being just two of them.
Will SOE still have no say in the game when money looks low? Business changes every day, a year into the game SOE might have nothing to do with the game and they could have everything to do with the game.
People being closed minded might make you sick but people thinking that everything we're told is the full truth and that everything stays the same in business makes me laugh.
I'm beating a dead horse, I think they maybe didn't see just how many people had started out their interest in Vanguard because they wanted nothing to do with SOE and didn't want to play WoW. I doubt in the end it will really have that much of an effect on game sales.
Originally posted by ginfress01 The forum fanboys (who also have a moderator position on another name...admitted by one of them on their guild chat dear Kenny-boy) make sure only the positive threads stay up. I cant believe Brad sold his soul to the devil.....
It's funny but when you hear stuff like this you think it's a joke or people making stuff up, but then you play an SOE game like SWG and watch the forums and it can be a shock to the system.
Say something bad about the game, *zip* your post is gone. Not really that much of a big deal but it kinda shows how SOE deal with things, it's a big change from the WoW boards which are full of whining but at least Blizzard let people have their say.
Comments
EQ2 was in development when SoE took over control of development (or that was when Brad and company left SoE, either way, SoE took over)....hence why it came out so simplified and unfinished compared to what was being promised
Lucas Arts had creative control over SWG...SoE basicly couldnt do anything major to the game without getting approval. Now they can (and have) do whatever they want.
And this is considered dreadful news to most people due to MMORPGs being long term games, EQ/Vanguard are games that are played for years, and people dont feel like wasting $50+ a year worth of subscription and their time just to have the game sold to SoE which then procedes to make the game easy as hell and pump out forgetable (but vital to have due to exp nerfs in old content and overpowered items/exp areas in new content) expantions every 2 months.
Oh well, *now* $OE's decision to raise its All-Access rate makes perfect sense. Couldn't figure it out before when they only had EQ2 (good) SWG (puke) MxO (dead) EQ1 (old) and Planetside (free). But throw Vangard in there and it adds up . . . to more money for $OE.
btw I dont count the 2d side-scrollers or wutever thatre bundled in all-access.
I don''t really know when Humankind will die out but i''m guessing about 6 years before WOW.
-BarCrow
Well fuck me Freddy.
There goes the Vanguard.
It will go like this:
Vanguard comes out. In 3-5 months 1st "expension". By the time game is 1 year old we will already have 3 "expensions" and still shit load of bugs from beta.
Since game will be very hard they will dumb it down and turn it in to WoW with better graphics + 2 more "expension".
Cya @ some other game
So true. SOE really got a reputation from SWG and it's justly deserved. That game is such a joke, it's not even funny. Last game to have this much contraversy over major overhauls was UO. Guess what? Same guy (Raph Koster) was at the helm of them both! Raph is head MMO guy at SOE, so guess what that means to Vanguard?!?!
Apparently, this fella is the guru or MMORPGs, but for some ungodly reason, after a game is released it needs serious revamp resulting in cheesing off half the players making them quit.
Brad left the EQ project because he wanted to make a game his way, but now he's tying himself back to SOE which is gonna end of tying his hands again.
On the one hand, how many people REALLY think MS would be a solid publishing choice ? For example, how many people are reading this thread in Firefox rather than IE ?
On the other hand, I still play EQ2 on and off though not as any kind of hardcore player by any means. The in-game community is possibly the best I've seen in an MMO since the early days of EQ ( before the power-gamer guilds took the game over -- remember, it wasnt SoE that *ruined* the original game as so many claim, but rather all of the hardcore 24/7 raiding guilds that would go to the Fan Faire and demand the game suit their growing raiding addictions .. SoE is only guilty of giving the players what they asked for ) It's the *offline* community for EQ2 though, that's got a royal bug up it's butt. Just like the WoW forums it's not about discussion but rather "OMG make this game be exactly what I, a single player demand it to be or I'll sue you !!!"
It's the forum jockies of the gaming world that tend to vent all of their daily frustrations towards a game / dev team rather than just play a game for the enjoyment factor. It's that same mentality I see behind the many negative comments here.
In EQ2, had any of the staff been online during peak hours in the past few months they'd have surely noticed the most common 'buzz' topic has been how many people intend to play Vanguard upon release. No big shock that SoE would be interrested in a game developed by the same core group of people who created EQ in the first place thus being the entire reason SoE is known in the MMO space to begin with.
This is a good move IMO ~ they're not outright selling the title, but rather co-publishing.
For anyone who thinks this is bad news though ~~ Take 5 minutes and read through the Vanguard FAQ page on their website. Scroll down towards the end where they get fairly long-winded about it being a good thing to simply create a game and then sell the studio to a large company. Though not what they're doing for the time being, it's still no suprise to me that they'd go with a company they've worked with directly in the past, one that for a long time was THE biggest MMO publisher in the industry and has extremely large amounts of resources for distribution etc that currently aren't being put to use to push a specific title.
Vanguard = created to appeal to the original players of EQ, remeber that as well.
Win / Win I say.
It doesn't suprise me that Sigil and Microsoft have parted company. Perhaps Microsoft got a good look at the current state of Vanguard and panicked (who wouldn't, I've seen it and it is not impressive!) or maybe there was a disagreement over the future direction with regard to XBox360 etc.
Sigil are positioning this as a good move for Vanguard, but I'm not so sure. It was Sigil who were in a position of weakness, with no publisher for their game. Based on their past record, SOE would have had Sigil over a barrel during the negotiations and exploited this. Or have SOE suddenly changed overnight ? I doubt Brad and Smed's friendship would go that far, or that Brad has enough juicy stories to blackmail Smed to get a better deal
SOE are in this to make money and will do whatever it takes. That should be no suprise to anyone. In my view, if that means closing the servers and the game down after 6 months because Sigil won't put in the additional content that SOE ask for, then this will happen.
I don't for a second think that anyone other than SOE and John Smedley control the future of this game.
P.S. When Microsoft were publishing the game there was lots of talk about a version for the XBOX360. Now that Sony are in charge, maybe we will see a PS3 version ?
You guys all whining and moaning about SoE taking over and not buying it? Good, you and the pre-CU SWG folks can all go join a club somewhere and cry cause you can't get "your" game back.
Dumbed down? Yeap you sure are.
http://www.greycouncil.org/
You've been playing EQ2 since release and have never encountered bugs that keep you from playing or cause massive issues?
I played it for a year and was constantly experiencing gameplay issues and bugs. Let's talk about just a few that I can remember:
Those are just a FEW of the problems SoE has with EQ2. Let's not even mention what they did to SWG.
Just because you can't see the problems that SoE has in maintaining their games and customers, doesn't mean that others don't have problems with them. Maybe you've been playing SoE games so long, that you actually don't know how a decent, honest company operates? ;P
_________________________________
JonMichael
Currently: AION, an MMO Beta under NDA
Played: WAR, LOTRO, Hellgate: London, CoX, GW, SotNW, DAOC, EQ2, SWG, WoW, AO, Horizons, Second Life, There, TSO
Beta'd: There, Second Life, EQ2, DAOC:LotM, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, Gods and Heroes, Hellgate: London, Requiem:Bloodymare, AoC, WAR, DDO, Fallen Earth
You've been playing EQ2 since release and have never encountered bugs that keep you from playing or cause massive issues?
I played it for a year and was constantly experiencing gameplay issues and bugs. Let's talk about just a few that I can remember:
Those are just a FEW of the problems SoE has with EQ2. Let's not even mention what they did to SWG.
Just because you can't see the problems that SoE has in maintaining their games and customers, doesn't mean that others don't have problems with them. Maybe you've been playing SoE games so long, that you actually don't know how a decent, honest company operates? ;P
Those are all personal issues "you" apparently had. I personally didn't experience anything on that list which in any way negatively impacted my gameplay. EQ2 is a very very good game. If you haven't played in the last several months, you probably have not experienced what the game really has to offer.
Do me a favor and don't bother responding to this post. Nothing I, nor anyone else, says is going to change your apparent biased dislike for SOE.
eq2 ran great the last time i played it, let this thread die....you people are not going to play it and you are going to keep speculting(sp?) on what might happen, thats fine.
there are quite a few people that obviously still love soe games no matter how bad of a company soe is so whatever happens i assume vanguard will be there no matter how much you complain and pretend it is dead, to you it is dead to many others it is very much alive.
read this http://www.vanguardsoh.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1044304#post1044304 then come back and talk to me about the vanguard/soe fiasco.....
SOE is Publishing the game. Has absolutely NOTHING to do with gameplay. . .it's going to be the same Vanguard it was 2 weeks ago.
AND
If you don't want to "give" your money to SOE, fine. . .but everyone is so damn closed minded about this it makes me sick.
Total time played: 9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds
Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
"I want Evercrack on Steroids"
If in the future SOE offers the right amount of $$ then they will have control.
I dont think Sigil will refuse an offer if it was a good one.
Then what?
See its like we thought. Back to square 1.
Chesterwiz
Did the puplisher do you wrong? Of course not. Thats why you kept on reading. But what if they did you wrong, or did not care about anything but $$ and did not listen to the majority? You might think twice..
Not a good comparison.
Chesterwiz
Station Exchange.
Enough said.
Chesterwiz.
So many of you are just blindly assuming that the current deal with SOE will remain the way it is. What most of us with experience dealing with SOE are saying is that things start off innocently with them, and then before you know it ...BAM....your game has been bought out, the original Devs have quit or been fired, there are at lest two or three game "revamps" being worked on, you get continual nerfs and unfinished expansions, and before you know it most people have quit and the game you fell in love with and devoted so much time to has disappeared and you are cold and bitter and posting on MMORPG.com.........
But go ahead and blindly follow them into the abyss....what do I care.
"The man who exchanges Liberty for Iconic classes is a fool deserving of neither." - Me and Ben Franklin
Nice one chesterwiz, three posts in a row of pure ignorance and speculation.
SoE owned the rights to EQ when they started developing eq:luclin all the way up to eq2. I'm pretty sure Sigil dropped microsoft and grabbed SoE (but they are doing some self-publishing as well) in order to have bother creative and economic control over their game. Believe me, Brad McQuaid is not a dumb guy, and if he's at all active in the MMO community he saw what happened to SWG, and won't let it happen to Vanguard.
chlaos: I assume your referring to SWG? Well that wasn't entirely SoE's fault (where I'm not freeing them from blame) but it was also Lucas Art's fault... I also want to know what kind of "Experience" you have with SoE to know the way they operate business.
Please see: http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/faq.php?faqid=791
This is one of the worst decisions ever made. Took my interest in VSOH from extremely high and very excited to non-exsistant.
Ah well.
Going to throw my 2cp in this one. Have not read through every page of this but heres what i have to say. Being someone that has played just about every major MMO SOE has been involved with going back to pre-kunark EQ up to EQ2, i have to say as a company i despise them. Given the circumstances with Vanguard and Brad McQuaid though, i highly doubt this is a bad move on Sigil's part. Keep in mind that Sigil was in bed with the devil to begin with (Microsoft) so SOE can't really be to much worse. Now, i'm sure that SOE has some sort of eye out to see if Sigil gets itself into a position to be bought out just like Verant was, thats just how SOE does things. But honestly if Microsoft was trying to pressure Sigil right now to do something they didnt want to do with Vanguard, how could SOE doing the same thing 2 years from now be worse? Least we will have those 2 years of Vanguard the way its supposed to be. We all know SOE took a dump on Brad's "Vision" with EQ1, personally i doubt hes going to let them do it again soon.
Hehe cant believe there are still people trusting SoE, vanguard might not be doomed yet but in no way SoE will ever get one dollar from me again. They cheat their customers. The forum fanboys (who also have a moderator position on another name...admitted by one of them on their guild chat dear Kenny-boy) make sure only the positive threads stay up. I cant believe Brad sold his soul to the devil.....
Will SOE still have no say in the game when money looks low? Business changes every day, a year into the game SOE might have nothing to do with the game and they could have everything to do with the game.
People being closed minded might make you sick but people thinking that everything we're told is the full truth and that everything stays the same in business makes me laugh.
I'm beating a dead horse, I think they maybe didn't see just how many people had started out their interest in Vanguard because they wanted nothing to do with SOE and didn't want to play WoW. I doubt in the end it will really have that much of an effect on game sales.
Say something bad about the game, *zip* your post is gone. Not really that much of a big deal but it kinda shows how SOE deal with things, it's a big change from the WoW boards which are full of whining but at least Blizzard let people have their say.