Originally posted by reavo Originally posted by slapme7times i'm not trying to demonize jefferson, i'm saying that we should logically confront our ideologies, rather than hold to them ignorantly.
Ideals are something that you hold with you and that you apply to the situation at hand. At the time of Jefferson, slavery and such were normal. He didn't abuse his slaves as others did. They were like live in maids. He even fell in love with one of them.
Jeffersonian ideals and enlightenment ideals can stand the test of time. But you've got to maintain historical perspective when looking at figures like Jefferson. He was not a bad man. He loved his country and wanted to setup a lasting form of government that would benefit generation after generation. And one that would promote the advancement of the application of knowledge. Knowledge like slavery is wrong and women are as smart as men. He left complete room for those ideas to flourish. And others to come.
yes he screwed his slaves, and was a revolutionary for his time. i dont think there can be a lasting form a government, when will there be a time when enlightenment and technology doesnt continue to force us to lose our beliefs?
i would consider poor blacks and whites from the american industrial revolution to be just as equally enslaved... the rich will always control and abuse the poor.
but really... hasnt that always been the point of government?
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
Originally posted by slapme7times Originally posted by lardmouth Rofl, to even try to equate the US to Nazi germany, because we took out a mass murdering regime, who invaded a nation (which is friendly to many) and then had failed over and over to comply with the resulting ceasefire agreement....lol.
what country did iraq invade?
wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
Yes, Kuwait. And they signed a cease fire to be left in power.
failed to comply with the ceasefire? no they didnt.
Are you joking? And lower below you ask me to get an education? Are you that ignorant of the historical noncompliant attitude and actions Saddam had with the ceasefire? Wow...
you know who the mass murders are? the ones who put the trade embargo on iraq. america anyone?
You mean Saddam for showing that he was a threat to nations at peace and refusing to comply, therefore, forcing the need for such sanctions? Is that what you mean? Oh, I forgot, you don't even know the history of the inspections....
those sanctions killed hundreds of thousands of CHILDREN.
So, let's get this straight. You were for allowing Saddam to operate COMPLETELY undeterred. To own kuwait and not have to comply at all with the cease fire? Wow.....
get an education.
Get a clue moron before you suggest that anyone get an education. I don't throw insults around usually, but I'm not afraid to point and laugh at your ignorance if you're going to be throwing out insults
yea, it's alot easier when your arent born into a family with no money, that has been torn apart my america's white superiority drug war.
exchange of money... for goods and services.... so people, in poverty, with no money, have a fair shake...
oh right... yea just like those sweat shops in bangledesh. look how poor non whites do there...
i'm sorry... where is the equality in that? it'd make sense if everyone was alloted the same goods, but there not, and some poor non whites have to die because they have nothing.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
Originally posted by lardmouth Originally posted by slapme7times Originally posted by lardmouth Rofl, to even try to equate the US to Nazi germany, because we took out a mass murdering regime, who invaded a nation (which is friendly to many) and then had failed over and over to comply with the resulting ceasefire agreement....lol.
what country did iraq invade?
wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
Yes, Kuwait. And they signed a cease fire to be left in power.
failed to comply with the ceasefire? no they didnt.
Are you joking? And lower below you ask me to get an education? Are you that ignorant of the historical noncompliant attitude and actions Saddam had with the ceasefire? Wow...
you know who the mass murders are? the ones who put the trade embargo on iraq. america anyone?
You mean Saddam for showing that he was a threat to nations at peace and refusing to comply, therefore, forcing the need for such sanctions? Is that what you mean? Oh, I forgot, you don't even know the history of the inspections....
those sanctions killed hundreds of thousands of CHILDREN.
So, let's get this straight. You were for allowing Saddam to operate COMPLETELY undeterred. To own kuwait and not have to comply at all with the cease fire? Wow.....
get an education.
Get a clue moron before you suggest that anyone get an education. I don't throw insults around usually, but I'm not afraid to point and laugh at your ignorance.
so wait, whats ignorant about NOT banning medical supplies from children? please explain what BANNING MED SUPP> FROM CHILDREN HAD TO DO WITH SADDAM AND THE CEASEFIRE.
please explain that now. it's in caps so you can read it.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
Originally posted by lardmouth Originally posted by slapme7times Originally posted by lardmouth Rofl, to even try to equate the US to Nazi germany, because we took out a mass murdering regime, who invaded a nation (which is friendly to many) and then had failed over and over to comply with the resulting ceasefire agreement....lol.
what country did iraq invade?
wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
Yes, Kuwait. And they signed a cease fire to be left in power.
failed to comply with the ceasefire? no they didnt.
Are you joking? And lower below you ask me to get an education? Are you that ignorant of the historical noncompliant attitude and actions Saddam had with the ceasefire? Wow...
you know who the mass murders are? the ones who put the trade embargo on iraq. america anyone?
You mean Saddam for showing that he was a threat to nations at peace and refusing to comply, therefore, forcing the need for such sanctions? Is that what you mean? Oh, I forgot, you don't even know the history of the inspections....
those sanctions killed hundreds of thousands of CHILDREN.
So, let's get this straight. You were for allowing Saddam to operate COMPLETELY undeterred. To own kuwait and not have to comply at all with the cease fire? Wow.....
get an education.
Get a clue moron before you suggest that anyone get an education. I don't throw insults around usually, but I'm not afraid to point and laugh at your ignorance if you're going to be throwing out insults
What I told you is the facts...get out of lala land and look around. You need to go to school. I on the other hand, college educated, world traveller, in politics, military experience. What you got? Nothing. Get some world exp.
Originally posted by slapme7times yea, it's alot easier when your arent born into a family with no money, that has been torn apart my america's white superiority drug war. How about not getting involved with drugs? exchange of money... for goods and services.... so people, in poverty, with no money, have a fair shake... Oh please, I grew up poor as dirt. The single wide trailer family? That was me. I didn't cry and look for handouts. Every tool is available to get out of poverty without a single dime from the government. oh right... yea just like those sweat shops in bangledesh. look how poor non whites do there... Ok, let's close down the sweatshops then. Omg, now they have lost their jobs! i'm sorry... where is the equality in that? it'd make sense if everyone was alloted the same goods, but there not, and some poor non whites have to die because they have nothing.
Originally posted by slapme7times i think someone's scarred? got nothing to say about why we banned medical supplies to the children do you?
Colateral Damage.Gotta play hard to win a war..we can kill iraqi children or we can wait and have american children killed. We know you hate America so we know your choice.
Originally posted by lardmouth Originally posted by slapme7times yea, it's alot easier when your arent born into a family with no money, that has been torn apart my america's white superiority drug war. How about not getting involved with drugs? exchange of money... for goods and services.... so people, in poverty, with no money, have a fair shake... Oh please, I grew up poor as dirt. The single wide trailer family? That was me. I didn't cry and look for handouts. Every tool is available to get out of poverty without a single dime from the government. oh right... yea just like those sweat shops in bangledesh. look how poor non whites do there... Ok, let's close down the sweatshops then. Omg, now they have lost their jobs! i'm sorry... where is the equality in that? it'd make sense if everyone was alloted the same goods, but there not, and some poor non whites have to die because they have nothing.
Look comrade. The tools are there. I'm not afraid of work..are you? And we are talking America not any other country..way to ttry to change the suject again.
What I told you is the facts...get out of lala land and look around. You need to go to school. I on the other hand, college educated, world traveller, in politics, military experience. What you got? Nothing. Get some world exp.
You wouldn't know facts if they bit you on the ass. Instead of lying on the internet, go try to accomplish those things.
look, if your family is doing it (drug trade), who do you call when theres an emergency? the police?
any economist will tell you that the inner city slums are created and perpetuated by making drugs sales illegal.
capitalism REQUIRES unemployment. the economy begins to decline toward recession when there isnt anyone looking for work, because it stilfes the ability for the economy to grow. as such we have to plan in preparation for this, it's a necessary part of the economy.
i'm not advocated closing them down. i'm advocating the 80 hour work week, and a 20cent hourly wage minimum. i realize people are now dependent on the jobs, but seriously, we should give them more for the work they do. it'd only take a 6 cent increase in the price of say, a 60 dollar shirt to double their standard of living. is that so hard?
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
Originally posted by J0kerr1 Originally posted by lardmouth Originally posted by slapme7times yea, it's alot easier when your arent born into a family with no money, that has been torn apart my america's white superiority drug war. How about not getting involved with drugs? exchange of money... for goods and services.... so people, in poverty, with no money, have a fair shake... Oh please, I grew up poor as dirt. The single wide trailer family? That was me. I didn't cry and look for handouts. Every tool is available to get out of poverty without a single dime from the government. oh right... yea just like those sweat shops in bangledesh. look how poor non whites do there... Ok, let's close down the sweatshops then. Omg, now they have lost their jobs! i'm sorry... where is the equality in that? it'd make sense if everyone was alloted the same goods, but there not, and some poor non whites have to die because they have nothing.
Look comrade. The tools are there. I'm not afraid of work..are you? And we are talking America not any other country..way to ttry to change the suject again. Change the subject? what are you talking about? I quoted you and responded....Maybe, I'm confuse as to who you were talking about.
Originally posted by slapme7times look, if your family is doing it (drug trade), who do you call when theres an emergency? the police? What? any economist will tell you that the inner city slums are created and perpetuated by making drugs sales illegal. You sound confident. You have a survey of economists to back this? You did say any. capitalism REQUIRES unemployment. the economy begins to decline toward recession when there isnt anyone looking for work, because it stilfes the ability for the economy to grow. as such we have to plan in preparation for this, it's a necessary part of the economy. Um, any form of economy is going to have unemployment. I'm not sure what your point is? What is your point? i'm not advocated closing them down. i'm advocating the 80 hour work week, and a 20cent hourly wage minimum. i realize people are now dependent on the jobs, but seriously, we should give them more for the work they do. it'd only take a 6 cent increase in the price of say, a 60 dollar shirt to double their standard of living. is that so hard? Why don't you march up to those nations and demand that they pass occupational and employment laws to better protect their citizens. Let us know how it goes. Until then, businesses are going to look for the cheapest route of production. As they should.
I'm not going to even validate Joker's psot with a reply.
You've proved you're a brainwashed right-wing fanatic. I didn't even mention my standing, and you attacked me for informing you that any ignorant goat and their mother can tell you Fox News is right-wing.
Just goes to show you who the brainwashed drone is. You can't even see the obvious, not unless they tell you 'We at Fox News are a right wing news station'.
Pathetic.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
so wait, whats ignorant about NOT banning medical supplies from children? please explain what BANNING MED SUPP> FROM CHILDREN HAD TO DO WITH SADDAM AND THE CEASEFIRE.
please explain that now. it's in caps so you can read it.
I called your entire post ignorant, not any one specific issue. Remember, the claim you made that Saddam had been compliant? Yeah, ignorant. I don't think there should have been any sanctions, as Saddam should have been toppled during the Gulf War. They eventually did attempt to provide relief through the Oil for Food programs. And we saw Saddam hold back and misuse funds and the program. See the oil for food program scandal. I haven't, and didn't, support the entire list of sanctions. I can understand anything that might be "dual use." Even if it had medical applications. But then again, like I said, we should have dethroned Saddam in the first place.
Have at look at these links for another perspective.
This is just a little informational post. I took the time to look some stuff up but i would urge some of you to read the UN resolution history on Iraq. 70 plus Resolutions from 1980 when the Iraq Iran crisis was going on till 2003 when the UNSC gave authorization to invade Iraq. http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html#1990
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1998/sres1194.htm Condemns the decision by Iraq ... to suspend cooperation with [Unscom] and the IAEA", demands that the decisions be reversed and cancels October 1998 scheduled sanctions review.
what country did iraq invade? wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
The coalition was not willing to invade Iraq. There was no international will to remove him. The only countries up for invading Iraq 1993 were the same people up for it in 2003. George Bush (Snr) tried to get everyone to go in with him, but no one would. The coalition collapsed.
In 1993 as in 2003 it just wasn't in many peoples intrests to invade Iraq. September the 11th changed all that. America was fired up and looking for payback. No more mister nice guy. The world was going to learn some respect. All unfinished business was back on the menu. Pick an enemy, any enemy, say he bombed New York and bingo! we're in business.
Originally posted by lardmouth Rofl, to even try to equate the US to Nazi germany, because we took out a mass murdering regime, who invaded a nation (which is friendly to many) and then had failed over and over to comply with the resulting ceasefire agreement....lol.
Did you think the German soldiers were fighting for evil, injustice and to bring hell on earth?
Or do you think they were fighting for Freedom and God and the German way life which they truely believed was superior to the way of life af all other people. They all thought they were doing everyone a favour too. They were perfectly able to given rational justifications for each and every invasion. invaders always can, they had an excellent propaganda machine also, complete with war movies and a litany of complaints against their victims.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are easy. The whole world is making them, even Germany.
Originally posted by baff Originally posted by lardmouth Rofl, to even try to equate the US to Nazi germany, because we took out a mass murdering regime, who invaded a nation (which is friendly to many) and then had failed over and over to comply with the resulting ceasefire agreement....lol.
Did you think the German soldiers were fighting for evil, injustice and to bring hell on earth?
Or do you think they were fighting for Freedom and God and the German way life which they truely believed was superior to the way of life af all other people. They all thought they were doing everyone a favour too. They were perfectly able to given rational justifications for each and every invasion. invaders always can, they had an excellent propaganda machine also, complete with war movies and a litany of complaints against their victims.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are easy. The whole world is making them, even Germany.
Except for the fact that Iraq was the invader, obligated to abide by a cease fire, upon it's defeat. Swing and a miss once again on the Nazi Germany and US comparison.
Furthermore, it's not our policy to round up and gas Iraqi's. Have murders and crimes happened? Sure, but not by policy. They have been and will be convicted. No, instead of doing this our guys risk being killed, mutilated, and their corpses booby trapped in an attempt to protect Iraqi's from being killed by the dozens and dumped in ditches. To try to protect them from mosque and market bombs. To try to protect them from having their heads sawed off with a knife because they taught democratic ideals at a university. To try to protect them because they were ELECTED by the people.
Iraq had a turnout that should shame "democratic" nations. Of course we're nazis for trying to protect those same people that defiantly voted, and the elected. Yeah, that makes sense. Sounds alot like how Nazi germany set up and protected elections and their elected governments. Our guys are trying to keep islamic-fascists from usurping a FAR more democratic system of government than the extremists would replace it with. You know what Europe's real problem is? It's that the oppressed in this case, aren't Europeans. It's not europeans that would be abandoned to live under these maniacs. No, the only maniacs worth starting World Wars over are Europe's maniacs.
Our soldiers and our allies are fighting this generation's Nazi Germany. This time it's not the US asleep at the wheel.
Originally posted by baff Originally posted by lardmouth Rofl, to even try to equate the US to Nazi germany, because we took out a mass murdering regime, who invaded a nation (which is friendly to many) and then had failed over and over to comply with the resulting ceasefire agreement....lol.
Did you think the German soldiers were fighting for evil, injustice and to bring hell on earth?
Or do you think they were fighting for Freedom and God and the German way life which they truely believed was superior to the way of life af all other people. They all thought they were doing everyone a favour too. They were perfectly able to given rational justifications for each and every invasion. invaders always can, they had an excellent propaganda machine also, complete with war movies and a litany of complaints against their victims.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are easy. The whole world is making them, even Germany.
In 1933 approximately nine million Jews lived in the countries of Europe that would be occupied by Germany during the war. By 1945 two out of every three European Jews had been killed by the SS Men. The Holocaust was the systematic annihilation of six million Jews.
1.5 million children were murdered during World War 2. This figure includes more than 1.2 million Jewish children, tens of thousands of Gypsy children and thousands of handicapped children. http://www.deathcamps.info/testimonies/
I'd like to hear your " rational justifications" and easy parallels.
Colateral Damage.Gotta play hard to win a war..we can kill iraqi children or we can wait and have american children killed. We know you hate America so we know your choice.
By Iraqi's?
A third woirld country was going to invade America, or emabrgo the U.S. out of medication?
Who are you trying to imply was going to kill American children? I don't know if you've heard but America is a super power. Iraq is a third world country with no ICBM's, no airforce and no navy. Iraq has never been a threat to U.S. security ever.
.
I really think this whole you disagree with me, so "you hate America" nonsense is very old.
I think you are looking for people to hate your nation. You want it. You enjoy the confrontation.
Everytime someone refuses to buy into idiotic propaganda of the most obvious stupidity, it's "You hate America". It's tired mate. Give it a rest please. The whole world hates America. The whole world is ignorant and poor and foreign and weak and corrupt. Blah blah blah.
In 1933 approximately nine million Jews lived in the countries of Europe that would be occupied by Germany during the war. By 1945 two out of every three European Jews had been killed by the SS Men. The Holocaust was the systematic annihilation of six million Jews.
1.5 million children were murdered during World War 2. This figure includes more than 1.2 million Jewish children, tens of thousands of Gypsy children and thousands of handicapped children. http://www.deathcamps.info/testimonies/
I'd like to hear your " rational justifications" and easy parallels.
The rational justifications aren't mine. I'm not a memeber of the SS.
What is the rational justification for buggering Islamics with dogs in Abu Gharaib? or shooting children in the head in Haditha.
Germany isn't the only country ever to have crack stormtroopers dehumanised by war and it isn't the only country ever to target people by their religion and it isn't the only country ever to have run secret concentration camps.
America isn't the only country I can easily parallel to the Nazi's my own has plenty of opportunity too. But recent events do draw easy comparison. Whether you like it or not, those comparisons exist and are being made. many of the lessons that should have been learnt from history are being ignored.
Neither is Germany the only country ever to have systematically wiped out vast segements of it's own society based on ethnic divisions. How many of those indians that were massacred were children, did anybody even bother to count?
Comments
Jeffersonian ideals and enlightenment ideals can stand the test of time. But you've got to maintain historical perspective when looking at figures like Jefferson. He was not a bad man. He loved his country and wanted to setup a lasting form of government that would benefit generation after generation. And one that would promote the advancement of the application of knowledge. Knowledge like slavery is wrong and women are as smart as men. He left complete room for those ideas to flourish. And others to come.
yes he screwed his slaves, and was a revolutionary for his time. i dont think there can be a lasting form a government, when will there be a time when enlightenment and technology doesnt continue to force us to lose our beliefs?
i would consider poor blacks and whites from the american industrial revolution to be just as equally enslaved... the rich will always control and abuse the poor.
but really... hasnt that always been the point of government?
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
what country did iraq invade?
wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
Yes, Kuwait. And they signed a cease fire to be left in power.
failed to comply with the ceasefire? no they didnt.
Are you joking? And lower below you ask me to get an education? Are you that ignorant of the historical noncompliant attitude and actions Saddam had with the ceasefire? Wow...
you know who the mass murders are? the ones who put the trade embargo on iraq. america anyone?
You mean Saddam for showing that he was a threat to nations at peace and refusing to comply, therefore, forcing the need for such sanctions? Is that what you mean? Oh, I forgot, you don't even know the history of the inspections....
those sanctions killed hundreds of thousands of CHILDREN.
So, let's get this straight. You were for allowing Saddam to operate COMPLETELY undeterred. To own kuwait and not have to comply at all with the cease fire? Wow.....
get an education.
Get a clue moron before you suggest that anyone get an education. I don't throw insults around usually, but I'm not afraid to point and laugh at your ignorance if you're going to be throwing out insults
yea, it's alot easier when your arent born into a family with no money, that has been torn apart my america's white superiority drug war.
exchange of money... for goods and services.... so people, in poverty, with no money, have a fair shake...
oh right... yea just like those sweat shops in bangledesh. look how poor non whites do there...
i'm sorry... where is the equality in that? it'd make sense if everyone was alloted the same goods, but there not, and some poor non whites have to die because they have nothing.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
what country did iraq invade?
wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
Yes, Kuwait. And they signed a cease fire to be left in power.
failed to comply with the ceasefire? no they didnt.
Are you joking? And lower below you ask me to get an education? Are you that ignorant of the historical noncompliant attitude and actions Saddam had with the ceasefire? Wow...
you know who the mass murders are? the ones who put the trade embargo on iraq. america anyone?
You mean Saddam for showing that he was a threat to nations at peace and refusing to comply, therefore, forcing the need for such sanctions? Is that what you mean? Oh, I forgot, you don't even know the history of the inspections....
those sanctions killed hundreds of thousands of CHILDREN.
So, let's get this straight. You were for allowing Saddam to operate COMPLETELY undeterred. To own kuwait and not have to comply at all with the cease fire? Wow.....
get an education.
Get a clue moron before you suggest that anyone get an education. I don't throw insults around usually, but I'm not afraid to point and laugh at your ignorance.
so wait, whats ignorant about NOT banning medical supplies from children? please explain what BANNING MED SUPP> FROM CHILDREN HAD TO DO WITH SADDAM AND THE CEASEFIRE.
please explain that now. it's in caps so you can read it.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
what country did iraq invade?
wtf you mean the gulf war? we left saddam in power for a reason.
Yes, Kuwait. And they signed a cease fire to be left in power.
failed to comply with the ceasefire? no they didnt.
Are you joking? And lower below you ask me to get an education? Are you that ignorant of the historical noncompliant attitude and actions Saddam had with the ceasefire? Wow...
you know who the mass murders are? the ones who put the trade embargo on iraq. america anyone?
You mean Saddam for showing that he was a threat to nations at peace and refusing to comply, therefore, forcing the need for such sanctions? Is that what you mean? Oh, I forgot, you don't even know the history of the inspections....
those sanctions killed hundreds of thousands of CHILDREN.
So, let's get this straight. You were for allowing Saddam to operate COMPLETELY undeterred. To own kuwait and not have to comply at all with the cease fire? Wow.....
get an education.
Get a clue moron before you suggest that anyone get an education. I don't throw insults around usually, but I'm not afraid to point and laugh at your ignorance if you're going to be throwing out insults
What I told you is the facts...get out of lala land and look around. You need to go to school. I on the other hand, college educated, world traveller, in politics, military experience. What you got? Nothing. Get some world exp.
i think someone's scarred?
got nothing to say about why we banned medical supplies to the children do you?
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
what? wouldnt helping little kids help our image in the mideast? comon man.
we can prevent future wars by not giving peeps a reason to distrust us.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
Look comrade. The tools are there. I'm not afraid of work..are you? And we are talking America not any other country..way to ttry to change the suject again.
You wouldn't know facts if they bit you on the ass. Instead of lying on the internet, go try to accomplish those things.
look, if your family is doing it (drug trade), who do you call when theres an emergency? the police?
any economist will tell you that the inner city slums are created and perpetuated by making drugs sales illegal.
capitalism REQUIRES unemployment. the economy begins to decline toward recession when there isnt anyone looking for work, because it stilfes the ability for the economy to grow. as such we have to plan in preparation for this, it's a necessary part of the economy.
i'm not advocated closing them down. i'm advocating the 80 hour work week, and a 20cent hourly wage minimum. i realize people are now dependent on the jobs, but seriously, we should give them more for the work they do. it'd only take a 6 cent increase in the price of say, a 60 dollar shirt to double their standard of living. is that so hard?
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
Look comrade. The tools are there. I'm not afraid of work..are you? And we are talking America not any other country..way to ttry to change the suject again.
Change the subject? what are you talking about? I quoted you and responded....Maybe, I'm confuse as to who you were talking about.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
You've proved you're a brainwashed right-wing fanatic. I didn't even mention my standing, and you attacked me for informing you that any ignorant goat and their mother can tell you Fox News is right-wing.
Just goes to show you who the brainwashed drone is. You can't even see the obvious, not unless they tell you 'We at Fox News are a right wing news station'.
Pathetic.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
so wait, whats ignorant about NOT banning medical supplies from children? please explain what BANNING MED SUPP> FROM CHILDREN HAD TO DO WITH SADDAM AND THE CEASEFIRE.
please explain that now. it's in caps so you can read it.
I called your entire post ignorant, not any one specific issue. Remember, the claim you made that Saddam had been compliant? Yeah, ignorant. I don't think there should have been any sanctions, as Saddam should have been toppled during the Gulf War. They eventually did attempt to provide relief through the Oil for Food programs. And we saw Saddam hold back and misuse funds and the program. See the oil for food program scandal. I haven't, and didn't, support the entire list of sanctions. I can understand anything that might be "dual use." Even if it had medical applications. But then again, like I said, we should have dethroned Saddam in the first place.
Have at look at these links for another perspective.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/05/25/wirq25.xml
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/09/07/wun07.xml
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/08/09/woil09.xml
This is just a little informational post. I took the time to look some stuff up but i would urge some of you to read the UN resolution history on Iraq. 70 plus Resolutions from 1980 when the Iraq Iran crisis was going on till 2003 when the UNSC gave authorization to invade Iraq. http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html#1990
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html#pre90 You can see a pattern of none compliance with the UN.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/scriraq.html#1990 Iraq now invades Kuwait. UN sets forth multiple resolutions.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/gopher/s91/16 This is the one that starts it all. UN telling Iraq give up the MWD. Paragraph 8a and 9a .
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/gopher/s91/24 Here come the Violations and the start of Iraq turning its nose up toward the UN. They were given 15days to comply with Resolution 687.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/gopher/s91/32 Oh Iraq agrees to monitoring, on November 26 , 1993!?
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1994/9440171e.htm Iraq messin with Kuwait again?! UN says no no.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1996/9614681e.htm This is about Iraq's refusing access to sites.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1997/9716832e.htm Refusal again.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1997/9728387e.htm Ditto
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1997/9731347e.htm Ditto
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1998/sres1154.htm This agreement put off US and British bombing threats.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1998/sres1194.htm Condemns the decision by Iraq ... to suspend cooperation with [Unscom] and the IAEA", demands that the decisions be reversed and cancels October 1998 scheduled sanctions review.
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/1999/99sc1284.htm
http://www.casi.org.uk/info/undocs/scres/2002/res1441e.pdf
Last one is a must read.
The coalition was not willing to invade Iraq. There was no international will to remove him. The only countries up for invading Iraq 1993 were the same people up for it in 2003. George Bush (Snr) tried to get everyone to go in with him, but no one would. The coalition collapsed.
In 1993 as in 2003 it just wasn't in many peoples intrests to invade Iraq. September the 11th changed all that. America was fired up and looking for payback. No more mister nice guy. The world was going to learn some respect. All unfinished business was back on the menu. Pick an enemy, any enemy, say he bombed New York and bingo! we're in business.
Did you think the German soldiers were fighting for evil, injustice and to bring hell on earth?
Or do you think they were fighting for Freedom and God and the German way life which they truely believed was superior to the way of life af all other people. They all thought they were doing everyone a favour too. They were perfectly able to given rational justifications for each and every invasion. invaders always can, they had an excellent propaganda machine also, complete with war movies and a litany of complaints against their victims.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are easy. The whole world is making them, even Germany.
Did you think the German soldiers were fighting for evil, injustice and to bring hell on earth?
Or do you think they were fighting for Freedom and God and the German way life which they truely believed was superior to the way of life af all other people. They all thought they were doing everyone a favour too. They were perfectly able to given rational justifications for each and every invasion. invaders always can, they had an excellent propaganda machine also, complete with war movies and a litany of complaints against their victims.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are easy. The whole world is making them, even Germany.
Except for the fact that Iraq was the invader, obligated to abide by a cease fire, upon it's defeat. Swing and a miss once again on the Nazi Germany and US comparison.
Furthermore, it's not our policy to round up and gas Iraqi's. Have murders and crimes happened? Sure, but not by policy. They have been and will be convicted. No, instead of doing this our guys risk being killed, mutilated, and their corpses booby trapped in an attempt to protect Iraqi's from being killed by the dozens and dumped in ditches. To try to protect them from mosque and market bombs. To try to protect them from having their heads sawed off with a knife because they taught democratic ideals at a university. To try to protect them because they were ELECTED by the people.
Iraq had a turnout that should shame "democratic" nations. Of course we're nazis for trying to protect those same people that defiantly voted, and the elected. Yeah, that makes sense. Sounds alot like how Nazi germany set up and protected elections and their elected governments. Our guys are trying to keep islamic-fascists from usurping a FAR more democratic system of government than the extremists would replace it with. You know what Europe's real problem is? It's that the oppressed in this case, aren't Europeans. It's not europeans that would be abandoned to live under these maniacs. No, the only maniacs worth starting World Wars over are Europe's maniacs.
Our soldiers and our allies are fighting this generation's Nazi Germany. This time it's not the US asleep at the wheel.
Did you think the German soldiers were fighting for evil, injustice and to bring hell on earth?
Or do you think they were fighting for Freedom and God and the German way life which they truely believed was superior to the way of life af all other people. They all thought they were doing everyone a favour too. They were perfectly able to given rational justifications for each and every invasion. invaders always can, they had an excellent propaganda machine also, complete with war movies and a litany of complaints against their victims.
The parallels to Nazi Germany are easy. The whole world is making them, even Germany.
In 1933 approximately nine million Jews lived in the countries of Europe that would be occupied by Germany during the war. By 1945 two out of every three European Jews had been killed by the SS Men. The Holocaust was the systematic annihilation of six million Jews.
1.5 million children were murdered during World War 2. This figure includes more than 1.2 million Jewish children, tens of thousands of Gypsy children and thousands of handicapped children.
http://www.deathcamps.info/testimonies/
I'd like to hear your " rational justifications" and easy parallels.
By Iraqi's?
A third woirld country was going to invade America, or emabrgo the U.S. out of medication?
Who are you trying to imply was going to kill American children? I don't know if you've heard but America is a super power. Iraq is a third world country with no ICBM's, no airforce and no navy. Iraq has never been a threat to U.S. security ever.
.
I really think this whole you disagree with me, so "you hate America" nonsense is very old.
I think you are looking for people to hate your nation. You want it. You enjoy the confrontation.
Everytime someone refuses to buy into idiotic propaganda of the most obvious stupidity, it's "You hate America". It's tired mate. Give it a rest please. The whole world hates America. The whole world is ignorant and poor and foreign and weak and corrupt. Blah blah blah.
In 1933 approximately nine million Jews lived in the countries of Europe that would be occupied by Germany during the war. By 1945 two out of every three European Jews had been killed by the SS Men. The Holocaust was the systematic annihilation of six million Jews.
1.5 million children were murdered during World War 2. This figure includes more than 1.2 million Jewish children, tens of thousands of Gypsy children and thousands of handicapped children.
http://www.deathcamps.info/testimonies/
I'd like to hear your " rational justifications" and easy parallels.
The rational justifications aren't mine. I'm not a memeber of the SS.
What is the rational justification for buggering Islamics with dogs in Abu Gharaib? or shooting children in the head in Haditha.
Germany isn't the only country ever to have crack stormtroopers dehumanised by war and it isn't the only country ever to target people by their religion and it isn't the only country ever to have run secret concentration camps.
America isn't the only country I can easily parallel to the Nazi's my own has plenty of opportunity too. But recent events do draw easy comparison. Whether you like it or not, those comparisons exist and are being made. many of the lessons that should have been learnt from history are being ignored.
Neither is Germany the only country ever to have systematically wiped out vast segements of it's own society based on ethnic divisions. How many of those indians that were massacred were children, did anybody even bother to count?