Man lol, im not gay, nor lesbian , but marriage has evolved out of any conventional religous sense, marriage in the modern day is more about 1. the tax breaks and the benifits of what may be applied to a married couple.
2.marriage is also a pact made between 2 people in whatever way they believe to make a lifelong partnership to eachother.
so seeing that marriage is a bond between a cple and has tax benifits and such for being married, i dont see why any couple cant get married regardless of race color gender, with state and religion supposedly to be 2 seperate entities, i dont think christians have a right to push there mostly archaic scriptures upon someone else when it is clearly not in there right to do so. I am in no means religion bashing, but come on, the basic skeletal rules, commandments or whatever you want to call it for whatever said religion does not proclaim to deny any couple from marriage, as far as i know all religions and basic beliefs say generally to treat your partner with respect and dont cheat on them ect. ect., gahhh im gonna ramble on forever about this so ill stop now.
ireki i take it you wont be having sex till you get married...what if no one marries you...haha 40 year old virgin. funny though that the bible is full of orgies...but i never hear priest talk about the mass orgies in church.....oh yes and remember not to wear a condom when ur having sex because the church doesnt believe in contraception.
this is a really interesting subject to argue/debate about. sure its probably creepy but its something we cant ignore. i'll tell you guys what i told iReki on MSN;
"not everyone is religious, so they cant do much about it. also its not their fault if they're born with that kinda defect. sure christians and catholics will find this a big issue..but we cant do anything to change their minds if they wanna go off and marry a guy/women, then thats their problem. they probably dont even know what the difference is. if thats a choice they wanna make, then we shouldnt step in and make this such a big case."
im not christian..and i am catholic. but thats beside the point. im not a fan of religion, or the bible. but from what i read, god doesnt care what we do for some reason. even now he doesnt care. in the old testament, he gets mad and smites people for their actions. in the new testament, he just doesnt care anymore. even if someone likes another person in the same gender, there could probably be a few reasons. one might be that they were born with a defect in their brain, so they have some sort of issue with their interests with people. i mean thats why there are bisexuals right? another reason, could be that they've made a choice in their life to be gay/lesbian (which is probably a bad choice in for some people )
what people are doing these days, are flaming other people for their actions. just like how people get flamed on forums for their opinions. cept in forums, people are being jerks, and in this gay/lesbian situation, people just find it disgusting, despite the fact that the person who chose to be gay isnt their fault. we cant just constantly bash someone (not literally) for a choice they've made. even what they did is probably wrong/disgusting, that doesnt make them any less of a person. everyone should still be treated the same. i know someone in my school who is gay. and he acts like a normal person. i actually didnt think he was gay, until one of my friends told me this.
something i dont get is why these guys get treated so unfairly. we're taking this "gay/lesbian" issue as if its like a crime..or something beyond that..almost like if its racism and discrimination, or their religion even. im not saying we should avoid them at all. im saying we should give them a chance and accept the fact that they still are like everyone else.
i dont care if you look at this from the religion/science point of view, you should realize by now, that everyone really should be treated fairly rather than disrespecting them and that, everyone has their own right to what they chose to do in life.
I think the religious right is just afraid that gay people will have more successful marriages then straight people. hell look at the divorce rates. if gay people want to get married, more power to them. not like marriage is any longer some holy sanctum (if it ever was)
and the arguement that gay people will raise gay childeren.. consider the fact that all people that are gay were raised by straight parents.
cheers!
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
Originally posted by iReki Originally posted by ronan32 there is no god.... and if there is a god we are all screwed.......as it states in the bible that we are gods foresaken children.......god doesnt exist....any logical person would agree that there is no god. if there is where is he.
ahh but if you read the bible and actaully belief, he loves all of his children note: gay or not, men or women,
crazy or sane, rich and poor. the reason the bible says that we are his forsaken children is because of our
original sin, wen adam and even ate the apple from the forbidden tree (free will). You cant prove that he exist
but our faith for him is as strong as ever. you'd have to be illogical to say god exist i guess. you cant put god
and logic together because he's supernatural which means natural thing cant see him.
Original sin. A concept brought about by St. Augustine in the later 4th century. And an idea that split the Eastern and Western Orthodox Churches (among other things). The first schism. So it's an idea that is left up to interpretation, and is traceable to the fabrication of a single man.
And when it comes to original sin you might want to check in on what the jews believe. They don't believe in original sin and have studied the original texts more than anyone. They also don't believe in a hell. Maybe that's why they are called "the most optimistic religion" there is.
That's the problem when you start taking social situations and try to apply your particular religious beliefs to them. Not everyone shares your religious beliefs. Even within your own religion you will find different denominations and sects. It's why we have a clause in the Constitution that has been interpreted repeatedly by the Supreme Court to mean a seperation of church and state. Or as Thomas Jefferson called it, a wall between church and state.
Government is involved in marriage. Therefore it is no longer just a religious matter. So at this point, trying to apply religion is to try to persuade the government to think as you do religiously.
Want to read some really good advice? Here, this is from CATO Institute. I like to call them a Libertarian think tank.
Religion has no place in divorce, and therefore no sway over whether or not gays and lesbians should be married. If you really want religion to have a part in marriage, consider this:
Divorce is a sin. Well, technically it's not, but in the context it's used today, it is. The Bible says that divorcing someone and remarrying is a sin and is adultery. If a woman sleeps with anyone but her original husband, with only one expection (The Bible says she must marry her husband's brother, if her original husband dies, and cannot remarry if he has no brother), then she is an adulterer. Divorce is allowed, but neither one is allowed to remarry. It was not until King Henry the VIII, which was famous for marrying multiple woman to try and save his bloodline, invented, yes, invented his own church at which he was the head so he could delcare divorcing and remarrying legal.
Divorce as we know it today is because of one man's selfish desires leaded him to manipulate religion. And this practice has become popular among Christians, too.
Modern marriage isn't very much related to religion anymore and therefore all of these religious people trying to push their agenda have no ground to stand on. Even so, it is none of their business what these people do on their own, and it does not affect them. The arguments they are using might very well be used to argue that women have no right to vote. Why? Well, because it's a crime against nature! Or whatever else they want to argue.
Originally posted by iReki actually tamalan, people DO chose to be gay or not. If i ask you are you gay or not you would say no (if you were straight) and so that was you choice! you chose straight, now gay people chose gay. Who says you cant have free will?
are you a retard? PEOPLE DON'T CHOSE TO BE GAY, are all you christians that BLIND and Stupid!? homosexuality is something that you are at BIRTH. you DON'T CHOSE TO BE GAY. Christians always get on my nerves. them and their stupid fairy tales book.
there has NEVER been found any proof that anything the bible says is true or happened.
to quote a person who is obviously of higher inteligence then you:
"Many have made a trade of delusions and false miracles, deceiving the stupid multitude."
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretche mortals, open your eyes!"
-Leonardo Da Vinci. a man way ahead of its time.
You believe in a BOOk that has been written by MANKIND! its NOT send by God from the heavens!
". why would 2 men come together? its just not right! It isn't suppose to be 2 of the same sex. thats not
natural! If thers such thing as men, women, and homosexuals that were created i would understand much
better but it's just men and woman and thats how it should be!"
Why is it not right? Because the BIBLE, a BOOK, Written by MANKIND, says its wrong? Why is it not natural? its nature that created it. you believe in a god, right? well if homosexuality is wrong (Note that it is GIVEN AT BIRTH, it is NOT something people chose for) then why is there homosexuality in the first place? I will let you think about that one for a while.
Originally posted by iReki If men want to marry men let them? what is wrong with you? this is the problem with people today they just want to think about themselves
iReki do you realize you just showed your colors enough to set off red warning flags in my mind with that statement? That sentence alone told me "this person right here has been brought up with some backwards teaching".
So I clicked on your user info and this is what I see:
You do realize that Canadaians are Socialists right? You do know that Socialists are widely reguarded by most to be the next closest thing to Communism right?
Do you also understand when truly free thinking human being see things like "this is the problem with people today they just want to think about themselves" you are showing your true colors as being a very young 14 year brainwashed individual.
Now you may not see this but it's clear as day. I truly pity you for having peers that are truly raising you in the dark side.
it would be wrong to blame iReki for this. he is obviously raised with the christian lies. he simply doesn't know any better. its the reason there are so many christians. only so little of them open their eyes and think for a moment "hey, how is this possible?" and not only the christial religion. same thing for the islam.
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by iReki actually tamalan, people DO chose to be gay or not. If i ask you are you gay or not you would say no (if you were straight) and so that was you choice! you chose straight, now gay people chose gay. Who says you cant have free will?
are you a retard? PEOPLE DON'T CHOSE TO BE GAY, are all you christians that BLIND and Stupid!? homosexuality is something that you are at BIRTH. you DON'T CHOSE TO BE GAY. Christians always get on my nerves. them and their stupid fairy tales book.
there has NEVER been found any proof that anything the bible says is true or happened.
to quote a person who is obviously of higher inteligence then you:
"Many have made a trade of delusions and false miracles, deceiving the stupid multitude."
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretche mortals, open your eyes!"
-Leonardo Da Vinci. a man way ahead of its time.
You believe in a BOOk that has been written by MANKIND! its NOT send by God from the heavens!
". why would 2 men come together? its just not right! It isn't suppose to be 2 of the same sex. thats not
natural! If thers such thing as men, women, and homosexuals that were created i would understand much
better but it's just men and woman and thats how it should be!"
Why is it not right? Because the BIBLE, a BOOK, Written by MANKIND, says its wrong? Why is it not natural? its nature that created it. you believe in a god, right? well if homosexuality is wrong (Note that it is GIVEN AT BIRTH, it is NOT something people chose for) then why is there homosexuality in the first place? I will let you think about that one for a while.
I see that you believed a man, a normal human being, and you are so much, strongly, believing what he is saying, isn't that written in a book he wrote too?
so what makes you different from these christians you are blaming?
your arguement has ZERO proof or whatsoever that it is true, if the bible is a man written book, which it is, so is what you are reading from that Da Vinci guy.
so what's the big deal? you can't see the things that have mentioned in the bible? well hello, more than 2000 years, if there was any evidence it would be little.
but what makes Da Vinci correct either? blind men can't see anything, does that mean everything doesn't exist to them?
there is no arguement in what you're saying here gameloading, no logic at all.
Originally posted by OneMuslim Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by iReki actually tamalan, people DO chose to be gay or not. If i ask you are you gay or not you would say no (if you were straight) and so that was you choice! you chose straight, now gay people chose gay. Who says you cant have free will?
are you a retard? PEOPLE DON'T CHOSE TO BE GAY, are all you christians that BLIND and Stupid!? homosexuality is something that you are at BIRTH. you DON'T CHOSE TO BE GAY. Christians always get on my nerves. them and their stupid fairy tales book.
there has NEVER been found any proof that anything the bible says is true or happened.
to quote a person who is obviously of higher inteligence then you:
"Many have made a trade of delusions and false miracles, deceiving the stupid multitude."
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretche mortals, open your eyes!"
-Leonardo Da Vinci. a man way ahead of its time.
You believe in a BOOk that has been written by MANKIND! its NOT send by God from the heavens!
". why would 2 men come together? its just not right! It isn't suppose to be 2 of the same sex. thats not
natural! If thers such thing as men, women, and homosexuals that were created i would understand much
better but it's just men and woman and thats how it should be!"
Why is it not right? Because the BIBLE, a BOOK, Written by MANKIND, says its wrong? Why is it not natural? its nature that created it. you believe in a god, right? well if homosexuality is wrong (Note that it is GIVEN AT BIRTH, it is NOT something people chose for) then why is there homosexuality in the first place? I will let you think about that one for a while.
I see that you believed a man, a normal human being, and you are so much, strongly, believing what he is saying, isn't that written in a book he wrote too?
so what makes you different from these christians you are blaming?
your arguement has ZERO proof or whatsoever that it is true, if the bible is a man written book, which it is, so is what you are reading from that Da Vinci guy.
I see you mis-understood Da Vinci's quote. what he basicly said in that quote: "Look, there is no evidence! you dedicate all your life to simple words of old men" also, you can't compare the Bible to Da Vinci's quote. he didn't write stuff: "Ok, this is what happend, how absurd it may sound, it happened, I have no proof, but it did! this is how you should live and blabla" like the bible did.
so what's the big deal? you can't see the things that have mentioned in the bible? well hello, more than 2000 years, if there was any evidence it would be little.
You hit the nail on the head. there is no evidence. and nobody even knows if there ever was. I don't know about you but, I haven't seen god create anything lately. I haven't seen men walk on water, I haven't seen staves turn into snakes, I haven't seen talking bushes, I haven't seen water turn into blood. and I can say for sure, Neither have you. also, lets not forget the bible was written in a time where lies and deceive were the order of the day.
but what makes Da Vinci correct either? blind men can't see anything, does that mean everything doesn't exist to them?
Because Da Vinci looks at the FACTS. there are no talking bushes. there are no snake-staves. there are no people who can walk on water
there is no arguement in what you're saying here gameloading, no logic at all.
There is an arguement and everything I say here makes perfect sense. because I base it on facts. you on the other hand believe in a book which explains things that don't exist and that has been written by men with too much fantasy. I have evidence. you don't.
because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets.
are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple.
BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen.
Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate.
isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is.
Originally posted by OneMuslim because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets. are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple. BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen. Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate. isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is.
There are prophets nowadays in truest Church of them all..The Church of Later Day Saints=P.
Originally posted by OneMuslim because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets. are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple. and that, my friend, is what we call an EXCUSE for not believing the obvious. lets start with the base: God. How do you know there is a god in the first place? its simple. you read it in a book that has been created by man. a man who can LIE. its written in an era where lying and deceiving were very normal and it happened all the time. there is no proof those so called miracles ever happened. its just the words of a man. in fact, lets compare the book with Harry Potter. there is only one diffrence between Harry potter and the bible: the person who wrote Harry Potter didn't yell: "THIS IS THE TRUTH! THIS IS THE TRUTH!". BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen. Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate. isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is. The only thing I see among those people is that they believe what the bible and the qur'an say. just because a lot of people are deceived by it does not make it the truth. far from it. remember Da Vinci's words.
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by OneMuslim because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets. are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple. and that, my friend, is what we call an EXCUSE for not believing the obvious. lets start with the base: God. How do you know there is a god in the first place? its simple. you read it in a book that has been created by man. a man who can LIE. its written in an era where lying and deceiving were very normal and it happened all the time. there is no proof those so called miracles ever happened. its just the words of a man. in fact, lets compare the book with Harry Potter. there is only one diffrence between Harry potter and the bible: the person who wrote Harry Potter didn't yell: "THIS IS THE TRUTH! THIS IS THE TRUTH!". ever looked up in the sky, in a clear day, and saw all of those billions of stars and wondered what made this? BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen. Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate. isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is. The only thing I see among those people is that they believe what the bible and the qur'an say. just because a lot of people are deceived by it does not make it the truth. far from it. remember Da Vinci's words. umm no? ever heared of archeology, archeologists and what they have discovered? no? ok go to video.google.com and type perished nations. and check out Harun Yahya, and see what the archeologists, athiest ones and Christian ones have discovered.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Originally posted by OneMuslim Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by OneMuslim because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets. are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple. and that, my friend, is what we call an EXCUSE for not believing the obvious. lets start with the base: God. How do you know there is a god in the first place? its simple. you read it in a book that has been created by man. a man who can LIE. its written in an era where lying and deceiving were very normal and it happened all the time. there is no proof those so called miracles ever happened. its just the words of a man. in fact, lets compare the book with Harry Potter. there is only one diffrence between Harry potter and the bible: the person who wrote Harry Potter didn't yell: "THIS IS THE TRUTH! THIS IS THE TRUTH!". ever looked up in the sky, in a clear day, and saw all of those billions of stars and wondered what made this? Yes I did. but does that prove that a god made it? No. just because we can't explain it does not mean that its the work of a god. also, this goes completely against your own saying. both the bible and qor an are against homosexualyt. its is PROVEn that homosexuality is not a choice. you are homosexual, or your not. just like straigth. if indeed a god made all of this, then WHY did he also made homosexuality if its wrong? again, remember one thing: Homosexuality is NOT a choice. BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen. Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate. isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is. The only thing I see among those people is that they believe what the bible and the qur'an say. just because a lot of people are deceived by it does not make it the truth. far from it. remember Da Vinci's words. umm no? ever heared of archeology, archeologists and what they have discovered? no? ok go to video.google.com and type perished nations. and check out Harun Yahya, and see what the archeologists, athiest ones and Christian ones have discovered. I will watch the video now, as you say. its quite a long video. once I am done watching it, i will post my oppinion here.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by OneMuslim
Originally posted by Gameloading
Originally posted by OneMuslim because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets. are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple. and that, my friend, is what we call an EXCUSE for not believing the obvious. lets start with the base: God. How do you know there is a god in the first place? its simple. you read it in a book that has been created by man. a man who can LIE. its written in an era where lying and deceiving were very normal and it happened all the time. there is no proof those so called miracles ever happened. its just the words of a man. in fact, lets compare the book with Harry Potter. there is only one diffrence between Harry potter and the bible: the person who wrote Harry Potter didn't yell: "THIS IS THE TRUTH! THIS IS THE TRUTH!". ever looked up in the sky, in a clear day, and saw all of those billions of stars and wondered what made this? Yes I did. but does that prove that a god made it? No. just because we can't explain it does not mean that its the work of a god. also, this goes completely against your own saying. both the bible and qor an are against homosexualyt. its is PROVEn that homosexuality is not a choice. you are homosexual, or your not. just like straigth. if indeed a god made all of this, then WHY did he also made homosexuality if its wrong? again, remember one thing: Homosexuality is NOT a choice. BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen. Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate. isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is. The only thing I see among those people is that they believe what the bible and the qur'an say. just because a lot of people are deceived by it does not make it the truth. far from it. remember Da Vinci's words. umm no? ever heared of archeology, archeologists and what they have discovered? no? ok go to video.google.com and type perished nations. and check out Harun Yahya, and see what the archeologists, athiest ones and Christian ones have discovered. I will watch the video now, as you say. its quite a long video. once I am done watching it, i will post my oppinion here.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
Originally posted by cloudoffire Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by OneMuslim
Originally posted by Gameloading
Originally posted by OneMuslim because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets. are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple. and that, my friend, is what we call an EXCUSE for not believing the obvious. lets start with the base: God. How do you know there is a god in the first place? its simple. you read it in a book that has been created by man. a man who can LIE. its written in an era where lying and deceiving were very normal and it happened all the time. there is no proof those so called miracles ever happened. its just the words of a man. in fact, lets compare the book with Harry Potter. there is only one diffrence between Harry potter and the bible: the person who wrote Harry Potter didn't yell: "THIS IS THE TRUTH! THIS IS THE TRUTH!". ever looked up in the sky, in a clear day, and saw all of those billions of stars and wondered what made this? Yes I did. but does that prove that a god made it? No. just because we can't explain it does not mean that its the work of a god. also, this goes completely against your own saying. both the bible and qor an are against homosexualyt. its is PROVEn that homosexuality is not a choice. you are homosexual, or your not. just like straigth. if indeed a god made all of this, then WHY did he also made homosexuality if its wrong? again, remember one thing: Homosexuality is NOT a choice. BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen. Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate. isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is. The only thing I see among those people is that they believe what the bible and the qur'an say. just because a lot of people are deceived by it does not make it the truth. far from it. remember Da Vinci's words. umm no? ever heared of archeology, archeologists and what they have discovered? no? ok go to video.google.com and type perished nations. and check out Harun Yahya, and see what the archeologists, athiest ones and Christian ones have discovered. I will watch the video now, as you say. its quite a long video. once I am done watching it, i will post my oppinion here.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language. it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
I also found: "The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
I also found: "The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
I also found: "The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
I also found: "The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
I watched the movie about these so called cities destroyed by god. the video proves us the city is destoryed by a volcano and earthquake. do I need to say more? the qor'an says its the work of god, while there is a complete logical explenation for the destruction of the city. let me state I do not say there is a god, but I don't deny there is one either. I am saying that there is no proof a god exists.
Comments
Man lol, im not gay, nor lesbian , but marriage has evolved out of any conventional religous sense, marriage in the modern day is more about 1. the tax breaks and the benifits of what may be applied to a married couple.
2.marriage is also a pact made between 2 people in whatever way they believe to make a lifelong partnership to eachother.
so seeing that marriage is a bond between a cple and has tax benifits and such for being married, i dont see why any couple cant get married regardless of race color gender, with state and religion supposedly to be 2 seperate entities, i dont think christians have a right to push there mostly archaic scriptures upon someone else when it is clearly not in there right to do so. I am in no means religion bashing, but come on, the basic skeletal rules, commandments or whatever you want to call it for whatever said religion does not proclaim to deny any couple from marriage, as far as i know all religions and basic beliefs say generally to treat your partner with respect and dont cheat on them ect. ect., gahhh im gonna ramble on forever about this so ill stop now.
playing eq2 and two worlds
thanks guys for the great argument, cant stay anymore cuz my mom says i wasted too many times in the
internet. currently in indonesia and internet there is dial up! thanks again guys see ya later!
sure its probably creepy
"not everyone is religious, so they cant do much about it. also its not their fault if they're born with that kinda defect. sure christians and catholics will find this a big issue..but we cant do anything to change their minds
if they wanna go off and marry a guy/women, then thats their problem. they probably dont even know what the difference is. if thats a choice they wanna make, then we shouldnt step in and make this such a big case."
im not christian..and i am catholic. but thats beside the point.
im not a fan of religion, or the bible. but from what i read, god doesnt care what we do for some reason. even now he doesnt care. in the old testament, he gets mad and smites people for their actions. in the new testament, he just doesnt care anymore.
even if someone likes another person in the same gender, there could probably be a few reasons. one might be that they were born with a defect in their brain, so they have some sort of issue with their interests with people. i mean thats why there are bisexuals right?
another reason, could be that they've made a choice in their life to be gay/lesbian (which is probably a bad choice in for some people
what people are doing these days, are flaming other people for their actions. just like how people get flamed on forums for their opinions. cept in forums, people are being jerks, and in this gay/lesbian situation, people just find it disgusting, despite the fact that the person who chose to be gay isnt their fault.
we cant just constantly bash someone (not literally) for a choice they've made.
even what they did is probably wrong/disgusting, that doesnt make them any less of a person. everyone should still be treated the same.
i know someone in my school who is gay. and he acts like a normal person. i actually didnt think he was gay, until one of my friends told me this.
something i dont get is why these guys get treated so unfairly. we're taking this "gay/lesbian" issue as if its like a crime..or something beyond that..almost like if its racism and discrimination, or their religion even.
im not saying we should avoid them at all. im saying we should give them a chance and accept the fact that they still are like everyone else.
i dont care if you look at this from the religion/science point of view, you should realize by now, that everyone really should be treated fairly rather than disrespecting them and that, everyone has their own right to what they chose to do in life.
and thats my rant for now.
http://advent-retribution.deviantart.com/
I think the religious right is just afraid that gay people will have more successful marriages then straight people. hell look at the divorce rates. if gay people want to get married, more power to them. not like marriage is any longer some holy sanctum (if it ever was)
and the arguement that gay people will raise gay childeren.. consider the fact that all people that are gay were raised by straight parents.
cheers!
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
ahh but if you read the bible and actaully belief, he loves all of his children note: gay or not, men or women,
crazy or sane, rich and poor. the reason the bible says that we are his forsaken children is because of our
original sin, wen adam and even ate the apple from the forbidden tree (free will). You cant prove that he exist
but our faith for him is as strong as ever. you'd have to be illogical to say god exist i guess. you cant put god
and logic together because he's supernatural which means natural thing cant see him.
Original sin. A concept brought about by St. Augustine in the later 4th century. And an idea that split the Eastern and Western Orthodox Churches (among other things). The first schism. So it's an idea that is left up to interpretation, and is traceable to the fabrication of a single man.
And when it comes to original sin you might want to check in on what the jews believe. They don't believe in original sin and have studied the original texts more than anyone. They also don't believe in a hell. Maybe that's why they are called "the most optimistic religion" there is.
That's the problem when you start taking social situations and try to apply your particular religious beliefs to them. Not everyone shares your religious beliefs. Even within your own religion you will find different denominations and sects. It's why we have a clause in the Constitution that has been interpreted repeatedly by the Supreme Court to mean a seperation of church and state. Or as Thomas Jefferson called it, a wall between church and state.
Government is involved in marriage. Therefore it is no longer just a religious matter. So at this point, trying to apply religion is to try to persuade the government to think as you do religiously.
Want to read some really good advice? Here, this is from CATO Institute. I like to call them a Libertarian think tank.
Gay Marriage & TR
Divorce is a sin. Well, technically it's not, but in the context it's used today, it is. The Bible says that divorcing someone and remarrying is a sin and is adultery. If a woman sleeps with anyone but her original husband, with only one expection (The Bible says she must marry her husband's brother, if her original husband dies, and cannot remarry if he has no brother), then she is an adulterer. Divorce is allowed, but neither one is allowed to remarry. It was not until King Henry the VIII, which was famous for marrying multiple woman to try and save his bloodline, invented, yes, invented his own church at which he was the head so he could delcare divorcing and remarrying legal.
Divorce as we know it today is because of one man's selfish desires leaded him to manipulate religion. And this practice has become popular among Christians, too.
Modern marriage isn't very much related to religion anymore and therefore all of these religious people trying to push their agenda have no ground to stand on. Even so, it is none of their business what these people do on their own, and it does not affect them. The arguments they are using might very well be used to argue that women have no right to vote. Why? Well, because it's a crime against nature! Or whatever else they want to argue.
there has NEVER been found any proof that anything the bible says is true or happened.
to quote a person who is obviously of higher inteligence then you:
"Many have made a trade of delusions and false miracles, deceiving the stupid
multitude."
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretche mortals, open your eyes!"
-Leonardo Da Vinci. a man way ahead of its time.
You believe in a BOOk that has been written by MANKIND! its NOT send by God from the heavens!
". why would 2 men come together? its just not right! It isn't suppose to be 2 of the same sex. thats not
natural! If thers such thing as men, women, and homosexuals that were created i would understand much
better but it's just men and woman and thats how it should be!"
Why is it not right? Because the BIBLE, a BOOK, Written by MANKIND, says its wrong? Why is it not natural? its nature that created it. you believe in a god, right? well if homosexuality is wrong (Note that it is GIVEN AT BIRTH, it is NOT something people chose for) then why is there homosexuality in the first place? I will let you think about that one for a while.
iReki do you realize you just showed your colors enough to set off red warning flags in my mind with that statement? That sentence alone told me "this person right here has been brought up with some backwards teaching".
So I clicked on your user info and this is what I see:
Chinese/Indonesian guy
----------
You do realize that Canadaians are Socialists right? You do know that Socialists are widely reguarded by most to be the next closest thing to Communism right?
Do you also understand when truly free thinking human being see things like "this is the problem with people today they just want to think about themselves" you are showing your true colors as being a very young 14 year brainwashed individual.
Now you may not see this but it's clear as day. I truly pity you for having peers that are truly raising you in the dark side.
there has NEVER been found any proof that anything the bible says is true or happened.
to quote a person who is obviously of higher inteligence then you:
"Many have made a trade of delusions and false miracles, deceiving the stupid multitude."
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretche mortals, open your eyes!"
-Leonardo Da Vinci. a man way ahead of its time.
You believe in a BOOk that has been written by MANKIND! its NOT send by God from the heavens!
". why would 2 men come together? its just not right! It isn't suppose to be 2 of the same sex. thats not
natural! If thers such thing as men, women, and homosexuals that were created i would understand much
better but it's just men and woman and thats how it should be!"
Why is it not right? Because the BIBLE, a BOOK, Written by MANKIND, says its wrong? Why is it not natural? its nature that created it. you believe in a god, right? well if homosexuality is wrong (Note that it is GIVEN AT BIRTH, it is NOT something people chose for) then why is there homosexuality in the first place? I will let you think about that one for a while.
I see that you believed a man, a normal human being, and you are so much, strongly, believing what he is saying, isn't that written in a book he wrote too?
so what makes you different from these christians you are blaming?
your arguement has ZERO proof or whatsoever that it is true, if the bible is a man written book, which it is, so is what you are reading from that Da Vinci guy.
so what's the big deal? you can't see the things that have mentioned in the bible? well hello, more than 2000 years, if there was any evidence it would be little.
but what makes Da Vinci correct either? blind men can't see anything, does that mean everything doesn't exist to them?
there is no arguement in what you're saying here gameloading, no logic at all.
believing one man and disregarding the other.
there has NEVER been found any proof that anything the bible says is true or happened.
to quote a person who is obviously of higher inteligence then you:
"Many have made a trade of delusions and false miracles, deceiving the stupid multitude."
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretche mortals, open your eyes!"
-Leonardo Da Vinci. a man way ahead of its time.
You believe in a BOOk that has been written by MANKIND! its NOT send by God from the heavens!
". why would 2 men come together? its just not right! It isn't suppose to be 2 of the same sex. thats not
natural! If thers such thing as men, women, and homosexuals that were created i would understand much
better but it's just men and woman and thats how it should be!"
Why is it not right? Because the BIBLE, a BOOK, Written by MANKIND, says its wrong? Why is it not natural? its nature that created it. you believe in a god, right? well if homosexuality is wrong (Note that it is GIVEN AT BIRTH, it is NOT something people chose for) then why is there homosexuality in the first place? I will let you think about that one for a while.
I see that you believed a man, a normal human being, and you are so much, strongly, believing what he is saying, isn't that written in a book he wrote too?
so what makes you different from these christians you are blaming?
your arguement has ZERO proof or whatsoever that it is true, if the bible is a man
written book, which it is, so is what you are reading from that Da Vinci guy.
I see you mis-understood Da Vinci's quote. what he basicly said in that quote: "Look, there is no evidence! you dedicate all your life to simple words of old men" also, you can't compare the Bible to Da Vinci's quote. he didn't write stuff: "Ok, this is what happend, how absurd it may sound, it happened, I have no proof, but it did! this is how you should live and blabla" like the bible did.
so what's the big deal? you can't see the things that have mentioned in the bible? well hello, more than 2000 years, if there was any evidence it would be little.
You hit the nail on the head. there is no evidence. and nobody even knows if there ever was. I don't know about you but, I haven't seen god create anything lately. I haven't seen men walk on water, I haven't seen staves turn into snakes, I haven't seen talking bushes, I haven't seen water turn into blood. and I can say for sure, Neither have you. also, lets not forget the bible was written in a time where lies and deceive were the order of the day.but what makes Da Vinci correct either? blind men can't see anything, does that mean everything doesn't exist to them?
Because Da Vinci looks at the FACTS. there are no talking bushes. there are no snake-staves. there are no people who can walk on water
there is no arguement in what you're saying here gameloading, no logic at all.
There is an arguement and everything I say here makes perfect sense. because I base it on facts. you on the other hand believe in a book which explains things that don't exist and that has been written by men with too much fantasy. I have evidence. you don't.
believing one man and disregarding the other.
because my friend, these things you are talking about are Miracles, Divine interventions by God to aid his prophets.
are there any prophets nowadays? no, so there will be no more Miracles, it's just this simple.
BUT, their effect is pretty much evident of their existance, and proof that they actually did happen.
Look at the people of Sodom, Saba, Pompeii, Ad, Egypt (Pharoahs), and compare the stories about them in the Qur'an and the bible, pretty much similar, although the Qur'an is more accurate.
isn't this proof that these books speak the truth? it is.
-Cloudoffire-
they claim to be prophets, maybe the terminology of a prophet for them is different.
but what kind of miracles do they have? :}
prophets should have miracles, all of them did, if they were prophets, what were their miracles.
they claim to be prophets, maybe the terminology of a prophet for them is different.
but what kind of miracles do they have? :}
prophets should have miracles, all of them did, if they were prophets, what were their miracles.
Prove it.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
they claim to be prophets, maybe the terminology of a prophet for them is different.
but what kind of miracles do they have? :}
prophets should have miracles, all of them did, if they were prophets, what were their miracles.
If you ask them...they will claim that they do. If you ask me i say i dont see any miracles.
-Cloudoffire-
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
-Cloudoffire-
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
it is not just simply believing what's in a book, and PROOVING what's in a book, then believing it.
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/politics/2005-1821.html
I also found:
"The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language.
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/politics/2005-1821.html
I also found:
Where is your proof that homosexuality is not a choice? I would like to see this. Also which Harun Yahya are you talking about? there seems to be alot in there some in english some in another language."The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/politics/2005-1821.html
I also found:
"The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/politics/2005-1821.html
I also found:
"The best overall summary of most respected researchers is that homosexuality (like most other psychological conditions) is due to a combination of social, biological, and psychological factors."