With respect to lore, you're comparing a game (and sequel, which borrows lore) which is 4 and a half years older, so naturally, there is more lore. While the Warcraft universe has been around for longer, it existed as a game where lore wasn't really important - and even changed based on your actions; campaigns in Warcraft 1 and 2 had a different ending depending on which faction you played (iirc). So I don't think the comparison is entirely fair. But I do agree that EQ1 has more depth, but I don't think that justifies calling Warcraft lore shallow.
As for EVE. Well, that's a single-shard, PvP world. It's PvE content sucks. PvP wise, I think you are probably right - however WoW is better in some areas even here. In EvE, the battles are often determined before they're fought, can get incredibly laggy, and are mostly ganked - there are no controlled battlegrounds (except rare CCP events).
But this is all subjective.
Criticism of WoW in this thread has been simply false most of the time, and highly subjective and exaggerated at best.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
This is too all the people upset about their gear being obsolete with the release of TBC. Welcome to online MMOs. This is the norm. The sooner you can get over it, the happier person you will be. The next time an expansion comes out, take steps to deal with it in the game.
Honestly people what did you expect? It was no secret the level cap was going to 70. That meant level 70 min requirements on gear. Much better gear than the old world stuff.
Anyone complaining they did BGs for 2 months to get all the purples out of there, what did you expect? That gear was obsolete by green items the day TBC was released. The pre-TBC raiding gear lasted until 65, what else do you want?
WoW - I never thought I would find a place where u can actually say what u want about game without the makers banning u if its not positive. Here ppl can tell the truth about WoW and tbh the truth isn't pretty. IMHO Blizzard have ruined WoW in the latest 5 months or so. They have taken pretty much everything that made the game what it was and changed it around. No special classes as horde or Alliance. 2 years of 40 man raid content ruined in 2 weeks long before TBC ever came out. And now a patch that is ruining the rest with a last ditch effort to balance a Expansion that was put out without fully tested. TBC had so much potentials.. but it actually brought nothing new to the game. Absolutly nothing. For me its just a proof that its time to move on and find something new and exiting in a diffrent game. WoW is over !
1) Your opinion is not "the truth". It's your opinion. Clearly there are many players and experts who disagree with you.
2) How exactly have the classic 40 man raids been "ruined"? Is it that the gear from those instances isn't the top tier anymore? If so, then you simply sound like someone who's jealous they don't have the newest and best toys anymore.
3) The expansion was tested for months prior to release. The launch of TBC was very smooth. I don't remember any major bugs cropping up in the months following its release.
4) Nothing new? Like zones, quests, gear, skills, instances, or races? You must've gotten a defective set of discs.
5) Last time I checked WoW is still up and running with a fairly large player base. Your definition of "over" is way off.
6) You should really take a break until AoC or WAR are released. Go play in the sunlight. Read a book. Develop an eating disorder. Whatever you do please stay away from LotRO.
The most important part of reading is reading between the lines.
1) Your opinion is not "the truth". It's your opinion. Clearly there are many players and experts who disagree with you.
2) How exactly have the classic 40 man raids been "ruined"? Is it that the gear from those instances isn't the top tier anymore? If so, then you simply sound like someone who's jealous they don't have the newest and best toys anymore.
3) The expansion was tested for months prior to release. The launch of TBC was very smooth. I don't remember any major bugs cropping up in the months following its release.
4) Nothing new? Like zones, quests, gear, skills, instances, or races? You must've gotten a defective set of discs.
5) Last time I checked WoW is still up and running with a fairly large player base. Your definition of "over" is way off.
6) You should really take a break until AoC or WAR are released. Go play in the sunlight. Read a book. Develop an eating disorder. Whatever you do please stay away from LotRO.
1) Where did I say it was the truth ? Some disagree some agree
2) 40 man raids were ruined about 2 months before TBC came out. Then blizzard put out a patch that changed 3 things that made pretty much every 40 man raider give up raiding and go for diffrent things. a) they changed loot meaning ally could be getting shammy loot for instance b) Some bosses that had been unchanged for over a year were changed and even bugged like for instance Fankriss just to name one. Most ppl stopped AQ at the same time so that bug might actually still be there. 3) they changed the macro system meaning many fights were totally new learning cruve - and witch many didn't bother learning again. All this combined ruinded 40 man raids even before TBC came out. It proofed to many Blizzard were not thinking much about how their changes in game were affecting the players but more about their own development . Many desided to stay for TBC cause they knew that the 40 man raids were worthless anyway. But the naive disission to destroy content way before it was needed still hurt alot of ppl.
3. The expansion wasn't tested to balance out the classes, the diffrent instances regarding group setup and definelty regarding overall raidingcontent ingame. You are mabye able to walk and fly through in outlands without getting obvious buggs (If u leave out things like some classes were able to use flying mounts in instances and so on)- but the Gameplay - the thing that really matterts was not tested longterm. This leaves us now with Blizzard doing major changes in balancing the game like removing Elixirs, nerfing some classes, changing all gear and so on. That doesn't only prove that TBC wasn't fully tested but also means that the makers had pretty much no idea where they were taking the game after it came out. Dunno if ur in Europe or US m8 - but if u were in Europe u might also remember 3 weeks before launch that major lag issues and world servers down on pretty much all realms cause of installment of new hardware + content. Other than 4 or 5 worldserver down on the realeasing day and the game ran fine - but thats not how I measure succsess of new launch.
4) The new things that came into the game was flying mounts - races were not new - they were the same (actually took one of the uniqe thing out of the game). Quests were pretty much based on the same thing (killing mobs) apart from the bombing runs that aparently will be alot more coming next patch. New instances were pretty much same old things. U did them once, twice, or ten times and they became boring. The heroic idea was nice but I heared some ppl were talking about grinding here before. When I left I had all the items from the badges and it was just a grind every 1 hour per night to get 3-7 more. No use when u have 70 extra anyway.
5) Blizzard has lost alot of the socalled hardcore players from the game cause of poor expansion. There might be quite alot of 8-12 year olds running around with their trial accounts. I dont doubt u can call that playerbase - but not sure about longterm.
6) Like I said before - Im playing LOTOR atm with over 20 ppl that were playing wow - its a nice change to wow but fearing that the raiding content will be abit off for longterm gameplay - so we are waiting for Age of Conan witch is quite promising in mature content for serious hardcore guilds. Thats just one of many things were WoW failed horribly in the last expansion making it a hoppalong 12 year old emote spaming mediocer game.
And again - thats just my opinion. U dont have to agree.
What exactly were you talking about? I was merely replying on a point you made. Namely the many hours of raids gone to waste. Need I quote you? And by the way: What on earth does "lal" mean? You seem one of the l337 kiddies that plague the WoW community. Stop harassing people and start discussing your topic.
Yes plz quite me where I say many hours of raiding gone to waste.
lal = kek = lol
Your first comment kinda made it obvious you were not here for discussing m8
Here we go: "2 years of 40 man raid content ruined in 2 weeks". Your first post, you fruit.
Here we go: "2 years of 40 man raid content ruined in 2 weeks". Your first post, you fruit. And kek = lol. lal = nothing.
2) 40 man raids were ruined about 2 months before TBC came out. Then blizzard put out a patch that changed 3 things that made pretty much every 40 man raider give up raiding and go for diffrent things. a) they changed loot meaning ally could be getting shammy loot for instance b) Some bosses that had been unchanged for over a year were changed and even bugged like for instance Fankriss just to name one. Most ppl stopped AQ at the same time so that bug might actually still be there. 3) they changed the macro system meaning many fights were totally new learning cruve - and witch many didn't bother learning again. All this combined ruinded 40 man raids even before TBC came out. It proofed to many Blizzard were not thinking much about how their changes in game were affecting the players but more about their own development . Many desided to stay for TBC cause they knew that the 40 man raids were worthless anyway. But the naive disission to destroy content way before it was needed still hurt alot of ppl.
It had nothing to do with gear m8 like u implied - I had full tier 4 and 2 tier 5 when I quit 2 weeks ago.
Fruit = apple
Well we could have lal= laughing at looser if u want Ye sound about rigth
Here we go: "2 years of 40 man raid content ruined in 2 weeks". Your first post, you fruit. And kek = lol. lal = nothing.
2) 40 man raids were ruined about 2 months before TBC came out. Then blizzard put out a patch that changed 3 things that made pretty much every 40 man raider give up raiding and go for diffrent things. a) they changed loot meaning ally could be getting shammy loot for instance b) Some bosses that had been unchanged for over a year were changed and even bugged like for instance Fankriss just to name one. Most ppl stopped AQ at the same time so that bug might actually still be there. 3) they changed the macro system meaning many fights were totally new learning cruve - and witch many didn't bother learning again. All this combined ruinded 40 man raids even before TBC came out. It proofed to many Blizzard were not thinking much about how their changes in game were affecting the players but more about their own development . Many desided to stay for TBC cause they knew that the 40 man raids were worthless anyway. But the naive disission to destroy content way before it was needed still hurt alot of ppl.
It had nothing to do with gear m8 like u implied - I had full tier 4 and 2 tier 5 when I quit 2 weeks ago.
Fruit = apple
Well we could have lal= laughing at looser if u want Ye sound about rigth
Again with the insults.
How exactly am I to know this if you do not state it to begin with?
a) Not a gamekiller by far.
b) New bugs are born in every patch (In every freakin game). Also not a gamekiller.
3 (You meant "c", right?) The macro system change was minimal. Anyone not daring to do it differently is a fruit as well. The macro system now is not a gamekiller.
40-man raids were killed because that is what Blizzard had in mind. They went for more casual-friendly content instead of seeing to the needs of the so called "hardcore-raiders", which would be about less than 10% of the entire WoW gaming communtiy.
I do agree, however, that TBC is a weak expansion. It could have easilly been a free update. Nevertheless, it added new features and a new world to explore. I'm happy with it. I would have wanted more, but I'm happy.
And on a sidenote: You were happy with it as well, seeing as how you "did it all. Good riddance anyway.
And on a sidenote: You were happy with it as well, seeing as how you "did it all. Good riddance anyway.
Nope - I wasn't happy. I payed same amount for WOW as I did for TBC - I finished TBC in 3 months doing pretty much all the content. It offered noting new - nothing exiting and is producing the same endgame material that the orginal game brought. Only 25 man instead of 40 with loot not worth getting.
And if u really think that 25 man raids are more thought of as casual then think again m8. Its exactly the oposite. But Im afraid not many hardcore players will hang around after Blizzard has shown their claws in destroying prebuild content.
WoW is a decent game for a 12 year old - Happy u like it. I will be watching your posts here in 6 months time and see if ur still enjoying yourself. Or in 2 years just before next expansion comes out
And on a sidenote: You were happy with it as well, seeing as how you "did it all. Good riddance anyway.
Nope - I wasn't happy. I payed same amount for WOW as I did for TBC - I finished TBC in 3 months doing pretty much all the content. It offered noting new - nothing exiting and is producing the same endgame material that the orginal game brought. Only 25 man instead of 40 with loot not worth getting.
And if u really think that 25 man raids are more thought of as casual then think again m8. Its exactly the oposite. But Im afraid not many hardcore players will hang around after Blizzard has shown their claws in destroying prebuild content.
WoW is a decent game for a 12 year old - Happy u like it. I will be watching your posts here in 6 months time and see if ur still enjoying yourself. Or in 2 years just before next expansion comes out
You played the expansion for 3 months and didnt enjoy yourself? You actually payed for it for 3 whole months? While not enjoying yourself? Heh...
And yes, 25-man is more casual friendly than 40. Way less waiting times to get a frikkin group together. And I don't care about the hardcore players to begin with. Like I said, I'm casual, and so are all my mates (We work most of the day, you know).
Wow is decent for anyone willing to play it, not just 12 year olds. Now youre just being rude. In 6 months I won't be playing wow anymore. New and better games will be released by then. Where did I state I would be playing for years to come?
I have played since open beta, got a supscription since launchday and never stopped it. The game still appeals to me. I still enjoy myself. Why? A) It is still THE most polished MMO on the market. And I like plished shinyness. Because of the people I have met ingame (And the reallife mates that started playing with me). We make the game fun for ourselves. We will move on when something better comes along, thats for sure. But just not yet.
wow has always been unbalanced, all games are unbalanced, the most popular games of all time are unbalanced.
you just put up with it because the game was fun and exciting.
you're right, the expansion just added more of the same grind, but that's what all expansions do, except SWG, swg expansions turn a good game into a POS warcraft clone in a shameless attempt to gather money.
my point is, you're just bored of the games mechanics... no expansion could change that, no matter how good.
expansions have always been, and will always be money milkers. from a publisher's viewpoint, they're low cost add ons that continue the grind and generate massive profit... nothing more.
wow was fun for the first 2 months, and then it progressively got less and less fun.
now that the game itself has lost all it's luster, you can't deal with the flaws that all games have... the real problem isn't the lack of balance, or even lack of content, it's that the game is simply no longer appealing, fresh, or free to you...
time for a new mmo to take it's place, a better one. wow will slowly die off as all games do.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
The Lore is shallow and doesn't really draw you in.
Dude gtfo with that bs. Read the books, play WC 1 through 3 plus the expansions and if that isn't some of the best lore you've ever gotten into I don't know what is.
And WoW isn't dead or dieing, you guys are just maybe the ones who got screwed with the expansion, all your tier 2/3 gone... /cry. Or maybe you got bored and that's your fault. Many people are still playing, not being bored, even after 2 years, so just go away with your asshattery. Have fun with LotRO, pfffft, or waiting months for AoC or WAR. /wrist
The Lore is shallow and doesn't really draw you in.
Dude gtfo with that bs. Read the books, play WC 1 through 3 plus the expansions and if that isn't some of the best lore you've ever gotten into I don't know what is.
And WoW isn't dead or dieing, you guys are just maybe the ones who got screwed with the expansion, all your tier 2/3 gone... /cry. Or maybe you got bored and that's your fault. Many people are still playing, not being bored, even after 2 years, so just go away with your asshattery. Have fun with LotRO, pfffft, or waiting months for AoC or WAR. /wrist
If you had actually read any of my other posts you would have seen that i own ALL the Warcraft rts games and their expansions. The lore in them is alright but you could forgive them for that as they were RTS games. They never even really got into the lore from the rts games in WoW.
By the way don't even bother slagging off The Lord of The Rings, the lore in that is unbeatable by any other game bar Warhammer. If it wasn't for The Lord of The Rings, Dungeons and Dragons and Warhammer there wouldn't even be a WoW. Where did all the Orc, Elf and Dwarf thing start? Tolkien. Where did WoW get most of it's artwork? Warhammer.
I ain't slaggin on shit, never said which lore was better. I said WoW had some of the best. You just don't have good taste. I'm sorry but 4 midgets taking a ring to a volcano escorted by lame heroes being chased by even more lame villains, while it's entertaining it's all the same. And Tolkien didn't start that, all that was around long before him. And WoW looks nothing like WAR, not graphics wise but artwise. MOST of their artwork comes from fans and the ones they make is all their own, you need to look at that shit again buddy. I believe one of the warlock fanarts is being made into T6, not sure. I think that's awesome. There is always gonna be influence on people's work but you can't say that it was stolen and that it doesn't compare just cause you don't like it. Of course it comes down to opinion but I don't know why I bother when your post is irrelevant.
why? why argue about this shit? Go play your respective games and shut the fuck up WoW and LOTRO fans alike. WoW will have the most subs of the two not that that means anything and Lotro will have the Most lore "not that its that good " <--- MY OPINION NOT A STATEMENT OF FACT OR NEED FOR ARGUMENT I dont like WoW i dont like LOTRO i think they are both shallow. I also think if you like your game you should stay in your own damn forum or play your own damn game.
I agree with mcharj11 on lore. I played mostly on an rp server, and most people there didn't really have too much to do with the actual lore in regards to their backstory. All the really good ones pretty much had nothing to do with WoW at all.
Pretty much the only thing the guild i was in, which was a heavy rp guild... did with the lore was make sure our backstories were plausible. They didn't really have to fit into any of the games storylines, because there are so few that are complete enough with history, we would have to fill in a bunch of gaps each time with our own lore additionally, and that gets messy if we find someone els who used the same base lore in a different way.
About the most complete aspect of the lore I've seen in WoW is the overarching storyline. The second closest thing was the Blood Elf monarchy, which we still had debated on several rp forums about how exactly it would logically be run.
EDIT: Another thing, you really should be able to tell that the lore sucks when they pretty much accidentally rewrite the entire premise of the Warcraft history and end up publicly saying "oops" about it.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
well wow is far from over even for chars hit 70 with all full reps and tier 5 armors well new patch is on way with new in game content new tier sets new dungeon to explore its the same circular advance strategy all games go for
wow has always been unbalanced, all games are unbalanced, the most popular games of all time are unbalanced.
you just put up with it because the game was fun and exciting.
you're right, the expansion just added more of the same grind, but that's what all expansions do, except SWG, swg expansions turn a good game into a POS warcraft clone in a shameless attempt to gather money.
my point is, you're just bored of the games mechanics... no expansion could change that, no matter how good.
expansions have always been, and will always be money milkers. from a publisher's viewpoint, they're low cost add ons that continue the grind and generate massive profit... nothing more.
wow was fun for the first 2 months, and then it progressively got less and less fun.
now that the game itself has lost all it's luster, you can't deal with the flaws that all games have... the real problem isn't the lack of balance, or even lack of content, it's that the game is simply no longer appealing, fresh, or free to you...
time for a new mmo to take it's place, a better one. wow will slowly die off as all games do.
Good post m8 - Totally agree
TBC had chance to fix quite a few things that would make the game better imo. What I saw and what is coming in next patch is on the otherhand making things worse, with changing factors that really dont need change and then leaving out stuff that really needs changes.
This is why I said WoW was over - now we are just waiting for the next mmorpg.. LOTRO is getting more and more support and many unhappy wow players are taking a look atm. Warhammer looks very promising and Age of Conan could be the new hardcore sandbox mmorpg if its done right.
At least its 100% certain that WOW will never be sandbox game in any way.... ATM BLizzard are trying to get full control of everything, making sure that they don't have to put to much more content into the game for the next year. Just like they made bosses in Karazhan abit harder when they saw that more than just the hardcore guilds were killing em.
I think you've got a point there but i dont believe the game is over for everyone, Maybe just perhaps for some of the higher levels in the game there isn't much of a point anymore but it is still a great game pre level 70 and you should not leave atleast before that stage.
You know the funniest thing? Most of the "Haters" of ANY GAME, not just WoW, normally are just "Fanboi's" of other games and have never truly tried the game (for any real length of time) they are bashing (and i'm not saying ALL do this, so don't get me wrong). Its a psychological issue with the gaming community, young males, and competition. Where they can't just feel good about the the game they play and leave it at that, they have to bash and belittle the games they don't play, particularlly if what they don't choose to play, out performs (subscriptions, reviews, etc.) what they have choosen to play. Most are willing to exaggerate the truth or just out and out lie about the games they do play. They feel that by doing this, it will mystically make others stop playing their own games and start playing the detractors game. Its this whole competitive culture of "Mine is bigger better and faster than yours". Thats a LARGE part of why you don't see many females chime in to these forums, (and again i'm not saying that NONE do) they are too busy out there playing the games they actually enjoy and don't get into stupid, childish pissing matches on the forums.
"You know the funniest thing? Most of the "Haters" of ANY GAME, not just WoW, normally are just "Fanboi's" of other games and have never truly tried the game"
I fail to see how that is funny. And the reason most people "bash" is because they really want the game to do well but it falls short of there expectations. And WoW seams to be falling further and further only leaving what it has at its core and thats small groups and alot of grinding. And even that is tainted by botters.
"You know the funniest thing? Most of the "Haters" of ANY GAME, not just WoW, normally are just "Fanboi's" of other games and have never truly tried the game" I fail to see how that is funny. And the reason most people "bash" is because they really want the game to do well but it falls short of there expectations. And WoW seams to be falling further and further only leaving what it has at its core and thats small groups and alot of grinding. And even that is tainted by botters.
Thanks for making my point and adding your opinion zack702, its good for people to voice opposing opinions, doesn't mean either is wrong or right.
Also what about the rest of my post? You didn't comment on the rest of what I stated. Do you fit the bill on what I was saying (just curious, not trying to argue about it)?
WoW - I never thought I would find a place where u can actually say what u want about game without the makers banning u if its not positive. Here ppl can tell the truth about WoW and tbh the truth isn't pretty. IMHO Blizzard have ruined WoW in the latest 5 months or so. They have taken pretty much everything that made the game what it was and changed it around. No special classes as horde or Alliance. 2 years of 40 man raid content ruined in 2 weeks long before TBC ever came out. And now a patch that is ruining the rest with a last ditch effort to balance a Expansion that was put out without fully tested. TBC had so much potentials.. but it actually brought nothing new to the game. Absolutly nothing. For me its just a proof that its time to move on and find something new and exiting in a diffrent game. WoW is over !
WoW is over? I think 8 million subscribers say different, but I could be wrong.
Blood elves,Draenae, new zones, outland, new spells, and talents, new types of pets. Other than that nothing huh?
Before you decide to post at least try to offer some example of what you're talking about you didn't site anything, you only generalized everything.
Quite a pointless thread. (not even sure why i bothered....)
Comments
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
As for EVE. Well, that's a single-shard, PvP world. It's PvE content sucks. PvP wise, I think you are probably right - however WoW is better in some areas even here. In EvE, the battles are often determined before they're fought, can get incredibly laggy, and are mostly ganked - there are no controlled battlegrounds (except rare CCP events).
But this is all subjective.
Criticism of WoW in this thread has been simply false most of the time, and highly subjective and exaggerated at best.
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
This is too all the people upset about their gear being obsolete with the release of TBC. Welcome to online MMOs. This is the norm. The sooner you can get over it, the happier person you will be. The next time an expansion comes out, take steps to deal with it in the game.
Honestly people what did you expect? It was no secret the level cap was going to 70. That meant level 70 min requirements on gear. Much better gear than the old world stuff.
Anyone complaining they did BGs for 2 months to get all the purples out of there, what did you expect? That gear was obsolete by green items the day TBC was released. The pre-TBC raiding gear lasted until 65, what else do you want?
2) How exactly have the classic 40 man raids been "ruined"? Is it that the gear from those instances isn't the top tier anymore? If so, then you simply sound like someone who's jealous they don't have the newest and best toys anymore.
3) The expansion was tested for months prior to release. The launch of TBC was very smooth. I don't remember any major bugs cropping up in the months following its release.
4) Nothing new? Like zones, quests, gear, skills, instances, or races? You must've gotten a defective set of discs.
5) Last time I checked WoW is still up and running with a fairly large player base. Your definition of "over" is way off.
6) You should really take a break until AoC or WAR are released. Go play in the sunlight. Read a book. Develop an eating disorder. Whatever you do please stay away from LotRO.
The most important part of reading is reading between the lines.
1) Where did I say it was the truth ? Some disagree some agree
2) 40 man raids were ruined about 2 months before TBC came out. Then blizzard put out a patch that changed 3 things that made pretty much every 40 man raider give up raiding and go for diffrent things. a) they changed loot meaning ally could be getting shammy loot for instance b) Some bosses that had been unchanged for over a year were changed and even bugged like for instance Fankriss just to name one. Most ppl stopped AQ at the same time so that bug might actually still be there. 3) they changed the macro system meaning many fights were totally new learning cruve - and witch many didn't bother learning again. All this combined ruinded 40 man raids even before TBC came out. It proofed to many Blizzard were not thinking much about how their changes in game were affecting the players but more about their own development . Many desided to stay for TBC cause they knew that the 40 man raids were worthless anyway. But the naive disission to destroy content way before it was needed still hurt alot of ppl.
3. The expansion wasn't tested to balance out the classes, the diffrent instances regarding group setup and definelty regarding overall raidingcontent ingame. You are mabye able to walk and fly through in outlands without getting obvious buggs (If u leave out things like some classes were able to use flying mounts in instances and so on)- but the Gameplay - the thing that really matterts was not tested longterm. This leaves us now with Blizzard doing major changes in balancing the game like removing Elixirs, nerfing some classes, changing all gear and so on. That doesn't only prove that TBC wasn't fully tested but also means that the makers had pretty much no idea where they were taking the game after it came out. Dunno if ur in Europe or US m8 - but if u were in Europe u might also remember 3 weeks before launch that major lag issues and world servers down on pretty much all realms cause of installment of new hardware + content. Other than 4 or 5 worldserver down on the realeasing day and the game ran fine - but thats not how I measure succsess of new launch.
4) The new things that came into the game was flying mounts - races were not new - they were the same (actually took one of the uniqe thing out of the game). Quests were pretty much based on the same thing (killing mobs) apart from the bombing runs that aparently will be alot more coming next patch. New instances were pretty much same old things. U did them once, twice, or ten times and they became boring. The heroic idea was nice but I heared some ppl were talking about grinding here before. When I left I had all the items from the badges and it was just a grind every 1 hour per night to get 3-7 more. No use when u have 70 extra anyway.
5) Blizzard has lost alot of the socalled hardcore players from the game cause of poor expansion. There might be quite alot of 8-12 year olds running around with their trial accounts. I dont doubt u can call that playerbase - but not sure about longterm.
6) Like I said before - Im playing LOTOR atm with over 20 ppl that were playing wow - its a nice change to wow but fearing that the raiding content will be abit off for longterm gameplay - so we are waiting for Age of Conan witch is quite promising in mature content for serious hardcore guilds. Thats just one of many things were WoW failed horribly in the last expansion making it a hoppalong 12 year old emote spaming mediocer game.
And again - thats just my opinion. U dont have to agree.
Yes plz quite me where I say many hours of raiding gone to waste.
lal = kek = lol
Your first comment kinda made it obvious you were not here for discussing m8
Here we go: "2 years of 40 man raid content ruined in 2 weeks". Your first post, you fruit.
And kek = lol. lal = nothing.
2) 40 man raids were ruined about 2 months before TBC came out. Then blizzard put out a patch that changed 3 things that made pretty much every 40 man raider give up raiding and go for diffrent things. a) they changed loot meaning ally could be getting shammy loot for instance b) Some bosses that had been unchanged for over a year were changed and even bugged like for instance Fankriss just to name one. Most ppl stopped AQ at the same time so that bug might actually still be there. 3) they changed the macro system meaning many fights were totally new learning cruve - and witch many didn't bother learning again. All this combined ruinded 40 man raids even before TBC came out. It proofed to many Blizzard were not thinking much about how their changes in game were affecting the players but more about their own development . Many desided to stay for TBC cause they knew that the 40 man raids were worthless anyway. But the naive disission to destroy content way before it was needed still hurt alot of ppl.
It had nothing to do with gear m8 like u implied - I had full tier 4 and 2 tier 5 when I quit 2 weeks ago.
Fruit = apple
Well we could have lal= laughing at looser if u want
Ye sound about rigth 
2) 40 man raids were ruined about 2 months before TBC came out. Then blizzard put out a patch that changed 3 things that made pretty much every 40 man raider give up raiding and go for diffrent things. a) they changed loot meaning ally could be getting shammy loot for instance b) Some bosses that had been unchanged for over a year were changed and even bugged like for instance Fankriss just to name one. Most ppl stopped AQ at the same time so that bug might actually still be there. 3) they changed the macro system meaning many fights were totally new learning cruve - and witch many didn't bother learning again. All this combined ruinded 40 man raids even before TBC came out. It proofed to many Blizzard were not thinking much about how their changes in game were affecting the players but more about their own development . Many desided to stay for TBC cause they knew that the 40 man raids were worthless anyway. But the naive disission to destroy content way before it was needed still hurt alot of ppl.
It had nothing to do with gear m8 like u implied - I had full tier 4 and 2 tier 5 when I quit 2 weeks ago.
Fruit = apple
Well we could have lal= laughing at looser if u want
Ye sound about rigth 
Again with the insults.
How exactly am I to know this if you do not state it to begin with?
a) Not a gamekiller by far.
b) New bugs are born in every patch (In every freakin game). Also not a gamekiller.
3 (You meant "c", right?) The macro system change was minimal. Anyone not daring to do it differently is a fruit as well. The macro system now is not a gamekiller.
40-man raids were killed because that is what Blizzard had in mind. They went for more casual-friendly content instead of seeing to the needs of the so called "hardcore-raiders", which would be about less than 10% of the entire WoW gaming communtiy.
I do agree, however, that TBC is a weak expansion. It could have easilly been a free update. Nevertheless, it added new features and a new world to explore. I'm happy with it. I would have wanted more, but I'm happy.
And on a sidenote: You were happy with it as well, seeing as how you "did it all. Good riddance anyway.
Nope - I wasn't happy. I payed same amount for WOW as I did for TBC - I finished TBC in 3 months doing pretty much all the content. It offered noting new - nothing exiting and is producing the same endgame material that the orginal game brought. Only 25 man instead of 40 with loot not worth getting.
And if u really think that 25 man raids are more thought of as casual then think again m8. Its exactly the oposite. But Im afraid not many hardcore players will hang around after Blizzard has shown their claws in destroying prebuild content.
WoW is a decent game for a 12 year old - Happy u like it. I will be watching your posts here in 6 months time and see if ur still enjoying yourself. Or in 2 years just before next expansion comes out
Nope - I wasn't happy. I payed same amount for WOW as I did for TBC - I finished TBC in 3 months doing pretty much all the content. It offered noting new - nothing exiting and is producing the same endgame material that the orginal game brought. Only 25 man instead of 40 with loot not worth getting.
And if u really think that 25 man raids are more thought of as casual then think again m8. Its exactly the oposite. But Im afraid not many hardcore players will hang around after Blizzard has shown their claws in destroying prebuild content.
WoW is a decent game for a 12 year old - Happy u like it. I will be watching your posts here in 6 months time and see if ur still enjoying yourself. Or in 2 years just before next expansion comes out
You played the expansion for 3 months and didnt enjoy yourself? You actually payed for it for 3 whole months? While not enjoying yourself? Heh...
And yes, 25-man is more casual friendly than 40. Way less waiting times to get a frikkin group together. And I don't care about the hardcore players to begin with. Like I said, I'm casual, and so are all my mates (We work most of the day, you know).
Wow is decent for anyone willing to play it, not just 12 year olds. Now youre just being rude. In 6 months I won't be playing wow anymore. New and better games will be released by then. Where did I state I would be playing for years to come?
I have played since open beta, got a supscription since launchday and never stopped it. The game still appeals to me. I still enjoy myself. Why? A) It is still THE most polished MMO on the market. And I like plished shinyness.
Because of the people I have met ingame (And the reallife mates that started playing with me). We make the game fun for ourselves. We will move on when something better comes along, thats for sure. But just not yet.
you just put up with it because the game was fun and exciting.
you're right, the expansion just added more of the same grind, but that's what all expansions do, except SWG, swg expansions turn a good game into a POS warcraft clone in a shameless attempt to gather money.
my point is, you're just bored of the games mechanics... no expansion could change that, no matter how good.
expansions have always been, and will always be money milkers. from a publisher's viewpoint, they're low cost add ons that continue the grind and generate massive profit... nothing more.
wow was fun for the first 2 months, and then it progressively got less and less fun.
now that the game itself has lost all it's luster, you can't deal with the flaws that all games have... the real problem isn't the lack of balance, or even lack of content, it's that the game is simply no longer appealing, fresh, or free to you...
time for a new mmo to take it's place, a better one. wow will slowly die off as all games do.
--people who believe in abstinence are unsurprisingly also some of the ugliest most sexually undesired people in the world.--
And WoW isn't dead or dieing, you guys are just maybe the ones who got screwed with the expansion, all your tier 2/3 gone... /cry. Or maybe you got bored and that's your fault. Many people are still playing, not being bored, even after 2 years, so just go away with your asshattery. Have fun with LotRO, pfffft, or waiting months for AoC or WAR. /wrist
"Starting with The Burning Crusade, every year thereafter we plan on bringing out a new expansion set - so every 12 months."
-- Paul Sams, Blizzard COO
Link - www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php
Anymore?????
And WoW isn't dead or dieing, you guys are just maybe the ones who got screwed with the expansion, all your tier 2/3 gone... /cry. Or maybe you got bored and that's your fault. Many people are still playing, not being bored, even after 2 years, so just go away with your asshattery. Have fun with LotRO, pfffft, or waiting months for AoC or WAR. /wrist
If you had actually read any of my other posts you would have seen that i own ALL the Warcraft rts games and their expansions. The lore in them is alright but you could forgive them for that as they were RTS games. They never even really got into the lore from the rts games in WoW.
By the way don't even bother slagging off The Lord of The Rings, the lore in that is unbeatable by any other game bar Warhammer. If it wasn't for The Lord of The Rings, Dungeons and Dragons and Warhammer there wouldn't even be a WoW. Where did all the Orc, Elf and Dwarf thing start? Tolkien. Where did WoW get most of it's artwork? Warhammer.
I ain't slaggin on shit, never said which lore was better. I said WoW had some of the best. You just don't have good taste. I'm sorry but 4 midgets taking a ring to a volcano escorted by lame heroes being chased by even more lame villains, while it's entertaining it's all the same. And Tolkien didn't start that, all that was around long before him. And WoW looks nothing like WAR, not graphics wise but artwise. MOST of their artwork comes from fans and the ones they make is all their own, you need to look at that shit again buddy. I believe one of the warlock fanarts is being made into T6, not sure. I think that's awesome. There is always gonna be influence on people's work but you can't say that it was stolen and that it doesn't compare just cause you don't like it. Of course it comes down to opinion but I don't know why I bother when your post is irrelevant.Pretty much the only thing the guild i was in, which was a heavy rp guild...
About the most complete aspect of the lore I've seen in WoW is the overarching storyline. The second closest thing was the Blood Elf monarchy, which we still had debated on several rp forums about how exactly it would logically be run.
EDIT: Another thing, you really should be able to tell that the lore sucks when they pretty much accidentally rewrite the entire premise of the Warcraft history and end up publicly saying "oops" about it.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
Just Laugh No Matter What!
Good post m8 - Totally agree
TBC had chance to fix quite a few things that would make the game better imo. What I saw and what is coming in next patch is on the otherhand making things worse, with changing factors that really dont need change and then leaving out stuff that really needs changes.
This is why I said WoW was over - now we are just waiting for the next mmorpg.. LOTRO is getting more and more support and many unhappy wow players are taking a look atm. Warhammer looks very promising and Age of Conan could be the new hardcore sandbox mmorpg if its done right.
At least its 100% certain that WOW will never be sandbox game in any way.... ATM BLizzard are trying to get full control of everything, making sure that they don't have to put to much more content into the game for the next year. Just like they made bosses in Karazhan abit harder when they saw that more than just the hardcore guilds were killing em.
Thats just how it will be
You know the funniest thing? Most of the "Haters" of ANY GAME, not just WoW, normally are just "Fanboi's" of other games and have never truly tried the game (for any real length of time) they are bashing (and i'm not saying ALL do this, so don't get me wrong). Its a psychological issue with the gaming community, young males, and competition. Where they can't just feel good about the the game they play and leave it at that, they have to bash and belittle the games they don't play, particularlly if what they don't choose to play, out performs (subscriptions, reviews, etc.) what they have choosen to play. Most are willing to exaggerate the truth or just out and out lie about the games they do play. They feel that by doing this, it will mystically make others stop playing their own games and start playing the detractors game. Its this whole competitive culture of "Mine is bigger better and faster than yours". Thats a LARGE part of why you don't see many females chime in to these forums, (and again i'm not saying that NONE do) they are too busy out there playing the games they actually enjoy and don't get into stupid, childish pissing matches on the forums.
"You know the funniest thing? Most of the "Haters" of ANY GAME, not just WoW, normally are just "Fanboi's" of other games and have never truly tried the game"
I fail to see how that is funny. And the reason most people "bash" is because they really want the game to do well but it falls short of there expectations. And WoW seams to be falling further and further only leaving what it has at its core and thats small groups and alot of grinding. And even that is tainted by botters.
Thanks for making my point and adding your opinion zack702, its good for people to voice opposing opinions, doesn't mean either is wrong or right.
Also what about the rest of my post? You didn't comment on the rest of what I stated. Do you fit the bill on what I was saying (just curious, not trying to argue about it)?
Blood elves,Draenae, new zones, outland, new spells, and talents, new types of pets. Other than that nothing huh?
Before you decide to post at least try to offer some example of what you're talking about you didn't site anything, you only generalized everything.
Quite a pointless thread. (not even sure why i bothered....)
Raven