As someone who played and loved UO for many years I was really looking forward to DarkFall. Let's face it, once WAR and AoC hit the market I don't think many people are going to care much about it at all. If for some reason those two "somehow" fail then I think I'll stop playing MMO's alltogether.
I'm not against Darkfall at all and would love to have seen it been released but it's just never going to happen or at least no time in the near future.
I also have a few friends who seem to prefer the time played/stat over skill and lots of safe zones etc and I think the majority of the market is the same regardless of what anyones opinion is of this, it's just the way it is.
Even if they sold some bonds, this is either a scam or a over zealous developer. I'm guessing the latter.
From what I've seen and read one of two things is happening here:
1. A group of guys bit off way more then they could chew and now they are trying to sell an idea that nobody will buy. Why won't they buy it? Because the product is untested, the target market will be too small to recoup the costs of development & publishing, it's just a group of guys that bit off more then they could chew.
2. A group of guys forgot to go to their business ethics class and are stringing people along with a piece of crap game they know will never get off the ground. While they are doing this for 7 some years guess what? They are getting loans, selling bonds, probably selling emails to lead vendors, basically getting paid for minimal work. Just enough to produce proof that they did try to run a business with the money they were being loaned. Once all the investors disappear they will file for bankruptcy and laugh about how they duped so many people into funding their 7+ year vacation.
Give me a 27 million dollar loan and I will give you a handful of wayyyy over paid employees and one worthless piece of software np, it's what I do.
Even if they sold some bonds, this is either a scam or a over zealous developer. I'm guessing the latter. From what I've seen and read one of two things is happening here: 1. A group of guys bit off way more then they could chew and now they are trying to sell an idea that nobody will buy. Why won't they buy it? Because the product is untested, the target market will be too small to recoup the costs of development & publishing, it's just a group of guys that bit off more then they could chew. 2. A group of guys forgot to go to their business ethics class and are stringing people along with a piece of crap game they know will never get off the ground. While they are doing this for 7 some years guess what? They are getting loans, selling bonds, probably selling emails to lead vendors, basically getting paid for minimal work. Just enough to produce proof that they did try to run a business with the money they were being loaned. Once all the investors disappear they will file for bankruptcy and laugh about how they duped so many people into funding their 7+ year vacation. Give me a 27 million dollar loan and I will give you a handful of wayyyy over paid employees and one worthless piece of software np, it's what I do.
Maybe they are leaning towards self-publishing and need alot of money to buy the servers maitnence and other such things?
Product has been tested and no the target market isnt that small. This game will appeal to both MMORPG and FPS players. How many games do that?
2. is just so completely idiotic that it doesnt even deserve a dignified answer. If you actually believe that than i feel very sorry for you.
As someone who played and loved UO for many years I was really looking forward to DarkFall. Let's face it, once WAR and AoC hit the market I don't think many people are going to care much about it at all. If for some reason those two "somehow" fail then I think I'll stop playing MMO's alltogether.
I'm not against Darkfall at all and would love to have seen it been released but it's just never going to happen or at least no time in the near future.
I also have a few friends who seem to prefer the time played/stat over skill and lots of safe zones etc and I think the majority of the market is the same regardless of what anyones opinion is of this, it's just the way it is.
Well ok you can quit MMO's based on two games or you could just play another game to something you like comes out. Though its your choice.
All they need is a publisher or to self-publish(Thats whats keeping them back) than beta will be out.
Yes a FEW and few is not majority. Some people will like safe zones etc. but there are those who want a game with a little excitment.
beta or it will never happen. i dont care if its open or closed.
Playing: EVE Online Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2 KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
It's been backed up for many reasons. The staff at the DarkFall forums are some of the most ridiculous people I've ever met. Who knows when this game is comming out, whenever it does, it's graphics will be tired and old. Hopefully more better games will with similar style will come out as well. Rennaissance is one game to look out for it seems like it will surpass Darkfall in a number of ways whenever it is released.
They take most of those screenshots in the LOWEST settings because they want as many people as possible to have the abillity to run the game, so you can still crank up the video settings if you want(check out the Aerdin Mount video, thats probably on high quality).
I LOL at this post.
Looking at a screen shot has nothing NOTHING to do with performance... Are you seriously suggesting that they are taking bad screen shots to show how bad the graphics can be?
You release the best screens you can for your game to highlight the only thing screens show... graphics.
You release minimum reqs to show what systems can run the game. They are mutually exclusive.
Hate to tell you this... but those screens more then likely are the high end for their engine... Not that any of you fanboys will believe me... I have seen religious cults with more independent thought... From now on I will just call you sheeple. Yes DF will come out... it will just be crap. It is destined to be shadowbane 2.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
It's been backed up for many reasons. The staff at the DarkFall forums are some of the most ridiculous people I've ever met. Who knows when this game is comming out, whenever it does, it's graphics will be tired and old. Hopefully more better games will with similar style will come out as well. Rennaissance is one game to look out for it seems like it will surpass Darkfall in a number of ways whenever it is released.
They take most of those screenshots in the LOWEST settings because they want as many people as possible to have the abillity to run the game, so you can still crank up the video settings if you want(check out the Aerdin Mount video, thats probably on high quality).
I LOL at this post.
Looking at a screen shot has nothing NOTHING to do with performance... Are you seriously suggesting that they are taking bad screen shots to show how bad the graphics can be?
You release the best screens you can for your game to highlight the only thing screens show... graphics.
You release minimum reqs to show what systems can run the game. They are mutually exclusive.
Hate to tell you this... but those screens more then likely are the high end for their engine... Not that any of you fanboys will believe me... I have seen religious cults with more independent thought... From now on I will just call you sheeple. Yes DF will come out... it will just be crap. It is destined to be shadowbane 2.
The screens also show other things and yes the screenshots are on lower settings. Look it up. Just because majority does it doesnt mean they all. If they did than Darkfall would have been a point-click game.
From what they have said its not. Who are you to say it is? Some random guy with no knowledge on game engines?
Well whether DF will be good or not is subjective and no one can say it will be great but no one can say it will be crap. Also you dont seem to read that much about DF so please do a little more research before you try to shoot down a post.
The screens also show other things and yes the screenshots are on lower settings. Look it up. Just because majority does it doesnt mean they all. If they did than Darkfall would have been a point-click game.
From what they have said its not. Who are you to say it is? Some random guy with no knowledge on game engines? Well whether DF will be good or not is subjective and no one can say it will be great but no one can say it will be crap. Also you dont seem to read that much about DF so please do a little more research before you try to shoot down a post.
Please elaborate... what else do screens show, especially DF screens. Show me a screen that has the UI or any info about the mechanics in a shot. You read what the PR people say about DF like it is gospel. Right now they can say anything they want... They have not proven anything to their fan base. Like I said your worse then a cult fanatic. Show me another game that ONLY released low end graphics screens from their game for four years... Just one other game... please.
What else are the Devs going to say when they release pics like that... You think the Devs always tell you the truth?
I have a great MMO built.. took me 5 years to complete... It will revolutionize everything known in the industry... Currently my friends and family are testing it for bugs... Now by your own arguments you have to believe me because you cannot PROVE what I say is untrue. Since you have no experience in the industry you are not even qualified to comment on my game... but it will be great... no really cutting edge graphics, open PvP, 15,000 players per server, completely destructible buildings, complete player economy, 140 races, open skill trees with point system so no set classes... It will be great... Site will be up tomorrow... You can pre-order for $49.99 with $15 monthly fee... Beta starts soon.
Here is a screen shot of my game... shows housing and cutting edge weather. (Displays lowest settings) here.
Sheeple... seriously use your brain.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
The screens also show other things and yes the screenshots are on lower settings. Look it up. Just because majority does it doesnt mean they all. If they did than Darkfall would have been a point-click game.
From what they have said its not. Who are you to say it is? Some random guy with no knowledge on game engines? Well whether DF will be good or not is subjective and no one can say it will be great but no one can say it will be crap. Also you dont seem to read that much about DF so please do a little more research before you try to shoot down a post.
Please elaborate... what else do screens show, especially DF screens. Show me a screen that has the UI or any info about the mechanics in a shot. You read what the PR people say about DF like it is gospel. Right now they can say anything they want... They have not proven anything to their fan base. Like I said your worse then a cult fanatic. Show me another game that ONLY released low end graphics screens from their game for four years... Just one other game... please.
What else are the Devs going to say when they release pics like that... You think the Devs always tell you the truth?
I have a great MMO built.. took me 5 years to complete... It will revolutionize everything known in the industry... Currently my friends and family are testing it for bugs... Now by your own arguments you have to believe me because you cannot PROVE what I say is untrue. Since you have no experience in the industry you are not even qualified to comment on my game... but it will be great... no really cutting edge graphics, open PvP, 15,000 players per server, completely destructible buildings, complete player economy, 140 races, open skill trees with point system so no set classes... It will be great... Site will be up tomorrow... You can pre-order for $49.99 with $15 monthly fee... Beta starts soon.
Here is a screen shot of my game... shows housing and cutting edge weather. (Displays lowest settings) here.
If you believe from what they've shown in SS and videos than yes they have proven things but if you dont then the problem isnt their's but yours. I do not know but even if they are the best graphics who cares? Graphics does not = gameplay.
How about these are some pics of DF? They really dont need to lie about graphics because no one really expects the graphics to be number 1 but what they lack in graphics they can make up in gameplay. Do they always tell you the truth? No. No one does.
No actually i dont believe that because 1. you do not have the funds which aventurine has explained. 2. You have no SS and no videos proving that there is actually a game. 3. Show me the rights to the use of your game's name. 4. Have people go threw your company and watch you while you work. Those are just things off the top of my head that you have no proof of while DF shows. Also DF has had someone else who was not from teh company play the game, though of course he went to jail for it. The only thing aventurine requires from us is time. They have never asked for anything else.
beta or it will never happen. i dont care if its open or closed.
Its in internal beta so technically its a closed beta but i know what your asking and then your just going to have to wait.
its in alpha testing, in closed beta they actually have sign-ups and ect. (the guild invite sheet is shit, they havent invitied any guilds)
Playing: EVE Online Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2 KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
If you believe from what they've shown in SS and videos than yes they have proven things but if you dont then the problem isnt their's but yours. I do not know but even if they are the best graphics who cares? Graphics does not = gameplay. How about these are some pics of DF? They really dont need to lie about graphics because no one really expects the graphics to be number 1 but what they lack in graphics they can make up in gameplay. Do they always tell you the truth? No. No one does. No actually i dont believe that because 1. you do not have the funds which aventurine has explained. 2. You have no SS and no videos proving that there is actually a game. 3. Show me the rights to the use of your game's name. 4. Have people go threw your company and watch you while you work. Those are just things off the top of my head that you have no proof of while DF shows. Also DF has had someone else who was not from teh company play the game, though of course he went to jail for it. The only thing aventurine requires from us is time. They have never asked for anything else. The only one not using his brain here is you. Come on this is too easy.
You ah... do realize the pic you linked was from their model interface right... not the game interface. Notice how they could pull up any item or SFX but nothing had any stats. So that proves they have a Dev interface to animate objects in a 3d environment... That is some cutting edge game mechanics right there... you got me.
1) You mean the funds that Tasos is lamenting the company does not have to buy servers with?
2) Neither does DF... they have pics and movies of animated models... You can find that at any college with digital art courses.
3) You ah do realize that the rights to a name mean you only own a name right?
4) If ANYONE had gone through their company and played their game and was able to comment about it... we would not be having this discussion.
Please post the jail birds name... Do you really think someone broke into their corporate headquarters to play an alpha build of an MMO? Seriously do you really think like that? *updated after looking up this info* lmao... the only thing I could find was an excuse by tasos saying beta was delayed because their WEBSERVER was hacked. There is nothing... I repeat nothing on that web server that would allow him to play the game. Tasos does not even state this though he does imply it... It appears tasos thinks the fans are idiots. so either you getting so desperate you are lieing or you can provide me the link to the OTHER hacker that infiltrated and played DF.
From Tasos own mouth he said they did not have the equipment for the beta. Since I do know about high end production networks and server administration I can tell you this... If they don't have the equipment even bought yet beta is at least 3 months away if not more. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt that they have a server crew that can do more then look at instruction on which way a server blade goes.
In the same article this "developer" stated they could release beta today... Right there is a direct lie.
I will give these guys one thing... they know how to spin... Reading their articles all they do is spin... No facts... no time frames... nothing to pin their slippery sleazy skins to the floor. They are even pissed at their fan base (this means you) because you did not scream like a little girl and faint at their latest "official" movie.
I understand your challenged right now with all your hormones and public school really dumbs the kids down... Ignore the older people that have been around the block a few times... Keep that pure wide eye ignorance... er I mean innocence that you have.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
If you believe from what they've shown in SS and videos than yes they have proven things but if you dont then the problem isnt their's but yours. I do not know but even if they are the best graphics who cares? Graphics does not = gameplay. How about these are some pics of DF? They really dont need to lie about graphics because no one really expects the graphics to be number 1 but what they lack in graphics they can make up in gameplay. Do they always tell you the truth? No. No one does. No actually i dont believe that because 1. you do not have the funds which aventurine has explained. 2. You have no SS and no videos proving that there is actually a game. 3. Show me the rights to the use of your game's name. 4. Have people go threw your company and watch you while you work. Those are just things off the top of my head that you have no proof of while DF shows. Also DF has had someone else who was not from teh company play the game, though of course he went to jail for it. The only thing aventurine requires from us is time. They have never asked for anything else. The only one not using his brain here is you. Come on this is too easy.
You ah... do realize the pic you linked was from their model interface right... not the game interface. Notice how they could pull up any item or SFX but nothing had any stats. So that proves they have a Dev interface to animate objects in a 3d environment... That is some cutting edge game mechanics right there... you got me.
1) You mean the funds that Tasos is lamenting the company does not have to buy servers with?
2) Neither does DF... they have pics and movies of animated models... You can find that at any college with digital art courses.
3) You ah do realize that the rights to a name mean you only own a name right?
4) If ANYONE had gone through their company and played their game and was able to comment about it... we would not be having this discussion.
Please post the jail birds name... Do you really think someone broke into their corporate headquarters to play an alpha build of an MMO? Seriously do you really think like that? *updated after looking up this info* lmao... the only thing I could find was an excuse by tasos saying beta was delayed because their WEBSERVER was hacked. There is nothing... I repeat nothing on that web server that would allow him to play the game. Tasos does not even state this though he does imply it... It appears tasos thinks the fans are idiots. so either you getting so desperate you are lieing or you can provide me the link to the OTHER hacker that infiltrated and played DF.
From Tasos own mouth he said they did not have the equipment for the beta. Since I do know about high end production networks and server administration I can tell you this... If they don't have the equipment even bought yet beta is at least 3 months away if not more. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt that they have a server crew that can do more then look at instruction on which way a server blade goes.
In the same article this "developer" stated they could release beta today... Right there is a direct lie.
I will give these guys one thing... they know how to spin... Reading their articles all they do is spin... No facts... no time frames... nothing to pin their slippery sleazy skins to the floor. They are even pissed at their fan base (this means you) because you did not scream like a little girl and faint at their latest "official" movie.
I understand your challenged right now with all your hormones and public school really dumbs the kids down... Ignore the older people that have been around the block a few times... Keep that pure wide eye ignorance... er I mean innocence that you have.
Explain it please.
1. If they buy servers that means less servers for launch and they are still deciding whether to go with a publisher or self-publish.
2. Of course but what proof do u have that those are fake? None? Unless you get some evidence that those are fake you cant say they are.
3. They have the right to use the term "darkfall" in thier product which they will sell. They also have to have proof of said project.
4. Yes. They stole the username and password of a tester account. Now tell me if there was no game why would they ahve a username and password?
He does not have the equipment but he does have the game. Those are two different things and you should learn that. You really need to work on your reading comprehension skills because this is getting a little ridiculous.
Once again they did that because they bitched and complained because they got what they asked for. So please try again.
The only one being ignorant is you. I'll admit theres a slight chance that it may be vaporware but i realized that before i even signed up but theres a much greater chance that this game actually exists. Its funny how you have nothing backing up your statements but your own words.
1. If they buy servers that means less servers for launch and they are still deciding whether to go with a publisher or self-publish. 2. Of course but what proof do u have that those are fake? None? Unless you get some evidence that those are fake you cant say they are. 3. They have the right to use the term "darkfall" in thier product which they will sell. They also have to have proof of said project. 4. Yes. They stole the username and password of a tester account. Now tell me if there was no game why would they ahve a username and password? http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/142187. Dont be so stupid. Many bigger compaines have been hacked(valve with HL 2) so what makes you think this didnt happen? He does not have the equipment but he does have the game. Those are two different things and you should learn that. You really need to work on your reading comprehension skills because this is getting a little ridiculous. Once again they did that because they bitched and complained because they got what they asked for. So please try again. The only one being ignorant is you. I'll admit theres a slight chance that it may be vaporware but i realized that before i even signed up but theres a much greater chance that this game actually exists. Its funny how you have nothing backing up your statements but your own words.
Your logic clearly lives up to your name.
Concerning the pics... I did not say they were FAKE. I said they showed no game mechanics... aka pretty pictures that are just model renderings. You seem to think I am claiming DF is vaporware... I am not. I am stating that what the devs are telling you is a bunch of spin. If you read between the lines you would see TASOS LIED TO EVERYONE in his last article. He directly contradicts himself several times.
You really REALLY need to research trademark laws... anyone can get a trademarked name without a product. That was my point.
You conveniently left out where he said the webserver was hacked in your little quote. Let me ask you a question... do you have a username and password to get into these forums? Is it related in any way to playing an MMO directly? A guy hacked into their webserver... got a user/pass for a restricted area or a shell login to the server. It has nothing NOTHING to do with access to their game servers. You need to understand how networks and servers work which you have already indicated you do not. The web server most certainly does not equal the game server. The most the guy may have gotten is some notes and media that was not released to the public yet... hardly the same thing as HL2 which Tasos knows and again spun to appease people.
Once again I will ask you to post a link where the community asked for a shader movie... I go to the official forums quite a bit and never came across such a post... Your desperation and blind faith has obviously made you delusional.
I was not calling you ignorant... For all I know you may be a bright kid... What I was saying is that your ignorance (lack of knowledge) about certain things that several people have patiently explained to you is getting in the way of understanding that DF is in serious trouble. It is your right to blindly follow without questioning... Just realize people with more knowledge on the subject will point out your errors. It is wisdom which brings understanding that you should head those warnings.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
Maybe they are leaning towards self-publishing and need alot of money to buy the servers maitnence and other such things?
Product has been tested and no the target market isnt that small. This game will appeal to both MMORPG and FPS players. How many games do that?
2. is just so completely idiotic that it doesnt even deserve a dignified answer. If you actually believe that than i feel very sorry for you.
The product has been tested? Really? That's pretty impressive since they don't have a product mockup and this type of product has never been made prior. Market isn't that small? Ok, how big is the estimated market? (Hint, I know the answer since I work in marketing research, but feel free to make something up.)
This game will not appeal to the core mmo players, period. All market research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings. This game, if it ever sees the light of day, will be a free for all gank fest, nothing more. You will not see large scale meaningful pvp in this game, you will see gankage upon gankage and low populations.
2. Do you even know how many class action law suits are being pursued every day for this kind of crap? Well me either, but our legal says a lot. You can feel sorry for me all you want, but it won't change the fact this game is vaporware plain and simple, sorry kid.
This game will not appeal to the core mmo players, period. All market research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings. This game, if it ever sees the light of day, will be a free for all gank fest, nothing more. You will not see large scale meaningful pvp in this game, you will see gankage upon gankage and low populations. What your analysis fail to adress is the costs of developing the game. If the game is cheaper to produce, you don't need to appeal to "majority of mmo players". Also, if you can hold onto 400.000 of players for 5 years, it is better than 2 millions for 6 months. Your analysis also seem to fail to understand that you are not going to see much ganking near cities where NPC guards are. The chance of ganking may be higher outside your faction's area of influence but so will will the rewards. I'm actually feeling sorry for you. If I am wrong, i will not get a game I would love to play. If you are wrong, you actually are terrible at what you do. I guess, time will show he kid ?
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
This game will not appeal to the core mmo players, period. All market research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings. This game, if it ever sees the light of day, will be a free for all gank fest, nothing more. You will not see large scale meaningful pvp in this game, you will see gankage upon gankage and low populations. What your analysis fail to adress is the costs of developing the game. If the game is cheaper to produce, you don't need to appeal to "majority of mmo players". Also, if you can hold onto 400.000 of players for 5 years, it is better than 2 millions for 6 months. Your analysis also seem to fail to understand that you are not going to see much ganking near cities where NPC guards are. The chance of ganking may be higher outside your faction's area of influence but so will will the rewards. I'm actually feeling sorry for you. , i will not get a game I would love to play. If you are wrong, you actually are terrible at what you do. I guess, time will show he kid ?
This response fails on so many levels I almost don't want to waste time on a reply, but I don't like you so I will.
What your analysis fail to adress is the costs of developing the game. If the game is cheaper to produce, you don't need to appeal to "majority of mmo players
What your statement fails to address is the kind of game Adventurine is "developing" is not cheap and would require a high subscriber base to sustain profitability. The customer base needed does not exist at this point in time to cover the costs of developing and maintaining this game. Do I know the cost numbers? No, I only know what we've told our bean counters and they decided they don't feel like losing money.
Also, if you can hold onto 400.000 of players for 5 years, it is better than 2 millions for 6 months.
That's great, what exactly is your point? Oh I see, you think that this bs out of nowhere comparison will somehow add validity to your post. Nope, sorry.
Your analysis also seem to fail to understand that you are not going to see much ganking near cities where NPC guards are. The chance of ganking may be higher outside your faction's area of influence but so will will the rewards.
Let me refer you back to "marketing research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings." I'm sure players will love the fact they can chill in the city in safety when 95% of content is outside the city. Oh that's right, those players will never even bother buying the game or subscribe for a month and quit.
I'm actually feeling sorry for you.
I'm actually feeling sorry for myself, because this game is vapor which means I don't get to gank suckers like you.
If I am wrong
There is no if, you are wrong plain and simple at this point in time.
If you are wrong, you actually are terrible at what you do.
I'm not wrong because all I do is keep my eye on the trends, gather surveys and purchase market research from other providers. If the boys in charge of the cash don't want to take a risk and make this game because cost/benefit doesn't look good, then that's on them.
Look, most people here are here because they want to see a game like this created and I am one of them. Unfortunately that little thing they call reality seems to be getting in the way.
This response fails on so many levels I almost don't want to waste time on a reply, but I don't like you so I will. Mmmm....you know nothing about me except I disagrees with you. Yet, you have developed some kind of dislike of me. So it is not perhaps me you dislike but my opinions ??? This openmindedness of yours must truly serve you well in your job as a researcher. What your analysis fail to adress is the costs of developing the game. If the game is cheaper to produce, you don't need to appeal to "majority of mmo players What your statement fails to address is the kind of game Adventurine is "developing" is not cheap and would require a high subscriber base to sustain profitability. The customer base needed does not exist at this point in time to cover the costs of developing and maintaining this game. Do I know the cost numbers? No, I only know what we've told our bean counters and they decided they don't feel like losing money. Let me break it down for you as you truly haven't done your homework on Aventurine. I'm guessing that you not even getting the name on the firm correctly, is just a typo. But seeing what you have managed to "research" so far, I wouldn't put it past you to getting even that wrong. Anyhow, lets take a look at one of the biggest expences a firm can have, labour cost. By using AoC vs DF as an example (they started to develop their games at the same time-around the beginning of 2003). Aventurine has had about 20-30 employees working full time on the project. Funcom has about 233 employees. If 150 of those has worked on AoC, it means that AoC has to have 5 times more subscribers than DF, just to cover the expences. Then I haven't even covered the reduced cost due to lower taxes. By the way, not many companies have a customer base during the development of a game. No sense paying for an unfinished product, right ? Just ask the Vanguard crowd Also, if you can hold onto 400.000 of players for 5 years, it is better than 2 millions for 6 months. That's great, what exactly is your point? Oh I see, you think that this bs out of nowhere comparison will somehow add validity to your post. Nope, sorry. The point is as following. A stable customer base over time can earn more cash than an unstable customer base, even if the unstable one starts at a higher level in the beginning. Sorry if the numbers confused you. Your analysis also seem to fail to understand that you are not going to see much ganking near cities where NPC guards are. The chance of ganking may be higher outside your faction's area of influence but so will will the rewards. Let me refer you back to "marketing research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings." I'm sure players will love the fact they can chill in the city in safety when 95% of content is outside the city. Oh that's right, those players will never even bother buying the game or subscribe for a month and quit. How do you know 95% of the content is outside the city ? You are making things up to make a point, aren't you ? What a great quality for a researcher! An alignment system will be in place so that it will give a penalty to kill a player of your own race. That means that if you gank enough players of your own race, you will not be able to trade or get quests for your race's NPC's. You may even be attacked by one. Of course you can move to another race's territory but they may have a "kill all other races at no penalty" policy. So yeah, same race gankers will not be a big problem. Other races may gank you ? Of course they may but DF world being as big as germany, you may have to travel for a long while getting there. The locals will get support for their area NPC's so i do not belive it will be a big diffrent race ganking problem either. In fact an foreign invasion will probably been seen as fun! The majority of MMO gamers have never experienced the freedom of a sandbox game. They belive a MMO must be levelbased and the only endgame is raiding or reroll. My experience indicate that after doing that for a while, you get bored easily. Lotro is a nice game but many don't even level one character to endgame. Why ? They have probably leveled 2-3 characters to endgame in WoW already and are now ready for a more challenging MMO. So yeah, people may enjoy limited pvp in a stuctured setting but I belive they will enjoy the freedom of DF even more. I'm actually feeling sorry for you. I'm actually feeling sorry for myself, because this game is vapor which means I don't get to gank suckers like you. Haha what a lame comeback. You are welcome to try kid but the odds will solidly be against you. If I am wrong There is no if, you are wrong plain and simple at this point in time. I am wrong at this point in time ? What does that mean ? How can you be right, now, when the future event even have had the chance to happen ? You can travel to the future now and "know" what will happen ? If you are wrong, you actually are terrible at what you do. I'm not wrong because all I do is keep my eye on the trends, gather surveys and purchase market research from other providers. If the boys in charge of the cash don't want to take a risk and make this game because cost/benefit doesn't look good, then that's on them. Yeah, when you have trends, surveys and market reasearch you can never be wrong. Unless your trends are based on bad data, your survey people asks the wrong questions or the market research is done by you. LOL you are even more naive than I thought Look, most people here are here because they want to see a game like this created and I am one of them. Unfortunately that little thing they call reality seems to be getting in the way. When reality hits it will affect you more than me. You may want to update your resume, just in case.
My original post,
jensen_34's comment
My reply
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
Mmmm....you know nothing about me except I disagrees with you. Yet, you have developed some kind of dislike of me.
So it is not perhaps me you dislike but my opinions ??? This openmindedness of yours must truly serve you well in your job as a researcher.
From your post you show that you're an idiot, ignorant, or just playing devils advocate. All of which I don't like. Your opinions essentially make up who you are hence why I don't like you. I'm open to all opinions and willing to listen, doesn't mean I have to like them or the person who supports them.
Aventurine has had about 20-30 employees working full time on the project. Funcom has about 233 employees. If 150 of those has worked on AoC, it means that AoC has to have 5 times more subscribers than DF, just to cover the expences.
So all I have to do to increase my profit margin is reduce my human capital? Great, I'm sure I won't have to worry about things like production dropping or extended dev time if I cut my staff by 80%. Or is it that Greece has magical devs that code 500% faster then everyone else? Ahhhh, that makes sense, I'll just outsource all my software development to Greece and save a boat load of cash. Great idea man! Those suckers outsourcing to India are retarded lol.
The point is as following. A stable customer base over time can earn more cash than an unstable customer base, even if the unstable one starts at a higher level in the beginning. Sorry if the numbers confused you.
The point is as following. You're numbers are complete BS, you are pulling them out of the air. I'm not debating your leet math skills, I'm debating the fact that you are just using random numbers to validate your post. Sorry if the logic confused you.
How do you know 95% of the content is outside the city ? You are making things up to make a point, aren't you ? blah blah blah blah, I like to use a belief system and personal theories to back up my statements, I don't worry about things like statistical research or actually trying to consolidate others preferences.
Stop picking at straws, ok so it's 90%. Doesn't really matter since a bulk of the game you will be in a gankable area, your faction or not. Basically you are projecting your opinions and beliefs on the rest of the MMO community. Sorry that does not constitute what we call accurate market research. If I went to my boss and said, "Hey guys, I'm really bored of level system so everyone else must be too, that will be $10,000 dollars for my input, thanks." They would laugh at me because they know I like to joke around.
I am wrong at this point in time ? What does that mean ? How can you be right, now, when the future event even have had the chance to happen ? You can travel to the future now and "know" what will happen ?
According to actual opinions from MMO players, I'm talking about 50,000 players sampled from a variety of mmo games and gamer sites, you are wrong today and most likely wrong for a long time to come. Oh, were you going to use your belief/opinion argument as an excuse again? Here's another statement, the sun will rise tomorrow. How do I know for sure? Well I don't, but I use things like stats, probabilities and logic to determine right and wrong(not in the metaphysical sense).
Yeah, when you have trends, surveys and market reasearch you can never be wrong. Unless your trends are based on bad data, your survey people asks the wrong questions or the market research is done by you. LOL you are even more naive than I thought
Yeah, when you have beliefs and your own blind opinion who needs little things like the written opinions of thousands of other mmo gamers. I'm sure they all just take the time to lie on surveys because they love to see software developers continue to put out features they don't enjoy.
LOL you are even more naive than I thought
I just submitted this to wikipedia under hypocrisy and they thanked me whole heartedly. Go check it out.
When reality hits it will affect you more than me. You may want to update your resume, just in case.
Of course it will, because obviously I live in it whereas you seem to have no concept of the term.
Unfortunately I won't be able to continue this debate if you reply because it has simply eaten up too much time and I doubt it will ever be resolved. I applaud you mr. troll, you have taken up to 30 minutes of my life, congrats. If you aren't trolling, then umm.. good luck on life.
Mmmm....you know nothing about me except I disagrees with you. Yet, you have developed some kind of dislike of me. So it is not perhaps me you dislike but my opinions ??? This openmindedness of yours must truly serve you well in your job as a researcher. From your post you show that you're an idiot, ignorant, or just playing devils advocate. All of which I don't like. Your opinions essentially make up who you are hence why I don't like you. I'm open to all opinions and willing to listen, doesn't mean I have to like them or the person who supports them. I stand by my original assesment. You dislike me because I disagree with you. That isn't very "open to all opinions" or show that you are "willing to listen". Your "facts" are still based on "non presented data", and your own opinions. If you have the facts, link it or present it. Show the surveys, show how many who were asked when, where. Show me the questions asked. Show me the trend data and research material. Convince me I am wrong with facts. Because frankly, I'm not taking your word for it. Aventurine has had about 20-30 employees working full time on the project. Funcom has about 233 employees. If 150 of those has worked on AoC, it means that AoC has to have 5 times more subscribers than DF, just to cover the expences. So all I have to do to increase my profit margin is reduce my human capital? Yes, if you can live with the drop in quality. Great, I'm sure I won't have to worry about things like production dropping or extended dev time if I cut my staff by 80%. Yes you have to worry about it. That is why you don't hire more people you need to begin with. Or is it that Greece has magical devs that code 500% faster then everyone else? No they don't. But their ambision level for the game is lower than that of FUNCOM. They are not making a WoW clone where you will need to make content to railroad a player through 80 levels. You just have to worry about the physics, the world building, the mobs, the crafting system and the skill system. Because everyone starts up with almost the same abilities and possibilities, you don't need to worry much about balance issues as well. Most of the content you leave to your players. It's easier and cheaper to make a sandboxgame compared to a themepark game. Ahhhh, that makes sense, I'll just outsource all my software development to Greece and save a boat load of cash. Great idea man! Those suckers outsourcing to India are retarded lol. I see your ironic attempt but you fail to be funny. In fact, it made you sound like a racist. The point is as following. A stable customer base over time can earn more cash than an unstable customer base, even if the unstable one starts at a higher level in the beginning. Sorry if the numbers confused you. The point is as following. You're numbers are complete BS, you are pulling them out of the air. I'm not debating your leet math skills, I'm debating the fact that you are just using random numbers to validate your post. Sorry if the logic confused you. Eh...Of course I pulled them out of the air. The numbers where used to show a scenario where high subnumbers in the beginning not neccesary will be the most profitable in the end. They were never presented as facts. i understand now why you must have failed your math class. Teacher: 1+1 = 2 You; Um, Sir, you pulled those numbers from the air, didn't you ? You must be lying and just trying to validate your claim! How do you know 95% of the content is outside the city ? You are making things up to make a point, aren't you ? blah blah blah blah, I like to use a belief system and personal theories to back up my statements, I don't worry about things like statistical research or actually trying to consolidate others preferences. Stop picking at straws, ok so it's 90%. No it's not, stop making things up. And editing my comments , while a little funny, tells me that you actually are willing to falseify other people's opinions and statements to make your opinions more valid. Ref. your hypocrisy comment below. Doesn't really matter since a bulk of the game you will be in a gankable area, your faction or not. Don't you see ? If the ganking don't pay off, most players will not do it. You don't steal from others because the price is too high on your integrity, your reputation or other things you value more. Its the same mechanics in work here. Basically you are projecting your opinions and beliefs on the rest of the MMO community. Sorry that does not constitute what we call accurate market research. Unless you present facts, all we do here is projecting opinions and beliefs. What is "accurate" marked research worth anyways ? Get back to me when you interview ALL MMO players. Until then, you are just gathering OPINIONS from a limited number of selfdeclared MMO players. Basically just making educated guesses and trying to use them to prove the view you had before you started the survey. If I went to my boss and said, "Hey guys, I'm really bored of level system so everyone else must be too, that will be $10,000 dollars for my input, thanks." Then you show them this mmorpg thread http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/143157 Perhaps they would take you more serios ? It is not science or even "accurate" market research but more and more people has stated this opinion. Laughing at it would be arrogant towards the customers of your customers. And that is no laughing matter. I am wrong at this point in time ? What does that mean ? How can you be right, now, when the future event even have had the chance to happen ? You can travel to the future now and "know" what will happen ? According to actual opinions from MMO players, I'm talking about 50,000 players sampled from a variety of mmo games and gamer sites, you are wrong today and most likely wrong for a long time to come. Oh, were you going to use your belief/opinion argument as an excuse again? It is not possible to be right or wrong now about this. Period. Most likely wrong for a long time, now that we can discuss. Link or publish the survey if you dare! By the way what is an actual opinion ? Is i an opinion that matters more ? Opinions are very subjective and easily manipulated by how the questions are formed. It's not science and you cannot formally proove that I am wrong. Q: Did you enjoy any of the PvP in WoW or any other skillbased themepark game you have tried ? A: Yes (If 10% of 10 million players playing wow answer, you have 1 million positive answers) Q: Can you remember a PvP combat you enjoyed in a sandbox game ? A: Yes (If 50% of the 1 million people tried EVE answered this, 500,000 Conclusion: 1 miilion >> 0.5 million. Most people must enjoy a limited PvP game, right ? Yeah, when you have trends, surveys and market reasearch you can never be wrong. Unless your trends are based on bad data, your survey people asks the wrong questions or the market research is done by you. LOL you are even more naive than I thought Yeah, when you have beliefs and your own blind opinion who needs little things like the written opinions of thousands of other mmo gamers. I'm sure they all just take the time to lie on surveys because they love to see software developers continue to put out features they don't enjoy. What is the difference between a blind opinion and other opinions ? Does it have a cane and a dog ? Must I eat s*it because thousands of flies cannot be wrong ? Have you seen how opinions are shared on the "hype war" in here ? How many voted a 1 on AoC because they liked WAR better ? Yeah, people cheat, lie, calling bluffs or even dare to disagree to get their opinion across. LOL you are even more naive than I thought I just submitted this to wikipedia under hypocrisy and they thanked me whole heartedly. Go check it out. Man, I didn't find it Where is it ? I though I was famous like George W. Bush and stuff! Damn, did you just make a joke ? Let me try! I just submitted this to wikipedia under arrogant and they thanked me whole heartedly. Go check it out. When reality hits it will affect you more than me. You may want to update your resume, just in case. Of course it will, because obviously I live in it whereas you seem to have no concept of the term. You obviously live in it ? Prove it formally then. Prove to me that you are not a simulated AI living in an simulated universe. Unfortunately I won't be able to continue this debate if you reply because it has simply eaten up too much time and I doubt it will ever be resolved. I applaud you mr. troll, you have taken up to 30 minutes of my life, congrats. If you aren't trolling, then umm.. good luck on life. Yes, run away brave Sir Robin! Us trolls will be waiting until the owner of the only truth returns again. ! corrected: for a blatant incorrect use of other people's opinions
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
it will come out! for sure! thay spend too much time to waste that game! waste it = waste 6 years of live! by the way... im falowing this game.... and each month thay give report about they r job! that MMORPG would be on 1st place! belive me! as soon it would be developed, as soon they will get first money... thay will invest it in game, and future work with applaing pathces and addons, fixing bugs for example will go much faster! Just give a chance to this Game!
Comments
*wrist*
As someone who played and loved UO for many years I was really looking forward to DarkFall. Let's face it, once WAR and AoC hit the market I don't think many people are going to care much about it at all. If for some reason those two "somehow" fail then I think I'll stop playing MMO's alltogether.
I'm not against Darkfall at all and would love to have seen it been released but it's just never going to happen or at least no time in the near future.
I also have a few friends who seem to prefer the time played/stat over skill and lots of safe zones etc and I think the majority of the market is the same regardless of what anyones opinion is of this, it's just the way it is.
Even if they sold some bonds, this is either a scam or a over zealous developer. I'm guessing the latter.
From what I've seen and read one of two things is happening here:
1. A group of guys bit off way more then they could chew and now they are trying to sell an idea that nobody will buy. Why won't they buy it? Because the product is untested, the target market will be too small to recoup the costs of development & publishing, it's just a group of guys that bit off more then they could chew.
2. A group of guys forgot to go to their business ethics class and are stringing people along with a piece of crap game they know will never get off the ground. While they are doing this for 7 some years guess what? They are getting loans, selling bonds, probably selling emails to lead vendors, basically getting paid for minimal work. Just enough to produce proof that they did try to run a business with the money they were being loaned. Once all the investors disappear they will file for bankruptcy and laugh about how they duped so many people into funding their 7+ year vacation.
Give me a 27 million dollar loan and I will give you a handful of wayyyy over paid employees and one worthless piece of software np, it's what I do.
Product has been tested and no the target market isnt that small. This game will appeal to both MMORPG and FPS players. How many games do that?
2. is just so completely idiotic that it doesnt even deserve a dignified answer. If you actually believe that than i feel very sorry for you.
All they need is a publisher or to self-publish(Thats whats keeping them back) than beta will be out.
Yes a FEW and few is not majority. Some people will like safe zones etc. but there are those who want a game with a little excitment.
beta or it will never happen. i dont care if its open or closed.
Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2
KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
I LOL at this post.Looking at a screen shot has nothing NOTHING to do with performance... Are you seriously suggesting that they are taking bad screen shots to show how bad the graphics can be?
You release the best screens you can for your game to highlight the only thing screens show... graphics.
You release minimum reqs to show what systems can run the game. They are mutually exclusive.
Hate to tell you this... but those screens more then likely are the high end for their engine... Not that any of you fanboys will believe me... I have seen religious cults with more independent thought... From now on I will just call you sheeple. Yes DF will come out... it will just be crap. It is destined to be shadowbane 2.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
I LOL at this post.Looking at a screen shot has nothing NOTHING to do with performance... Are you seriously suggesting that they are taking bad screen shots to show how bad the graphics can be?
You release the best screens you can for your game to highlight the only thing screens show... graphics.
You release minimum reqs to show what systems can run the game. They are mutually exclusive.
Hate to tell you this... but those screens more then likely are the high end for their engine... Not that any of you fanboys will believe me... I have seen religious cults with more independent thought... From now on I will just call you sheeple. Yes DF will come out... it will just be crap. It is destined to be shadowbane 2.
The screens also show other things and yes the screenshots are on lower settings. Look it up. Just because majority does it doesnt mean they all. If they did than Darkfall would have been a point-click game.From what they have said its not. Who are you to say it is? Some random guy with no knowledge on game engines?
Well whether DF will be good or not is subjective and no one can say it will be great but no one can say it will be crap. Also you dont seem to read that much about DF so please do a little more research before you try to shoot down a post.
Its in internal beta so technically its a closed beta but i know what your asking and then your just going to have to wait.
Please elaborate... what else do screens show, especially DF screens. Show me a screen that has the UI or any info about the mechanics in a shot. You read what the PR people say about DF like it is gospel. Right now they can say anything they want... They have not proven anything to their fan base. Like I said your worse then a cult fanatic. Show me another game that ONLY released low end graphics screens from their game for four years... Just one other game... please.
What else are the Devs going to say when they release pics like that... You think the Devs always tell you the truth?
I have a great MMO built.. took me 5 years to complete... It will revolutionize everything known in the industry... Currently my friends and family are testing it for bugs... Now by your own arguments you have to believe me because you cannot PROVE what I say is untrue. Since you have no experience in the industry you are not even qualified to comment on my game... but it will be great... no really cutting edge graphics, open PvP, 15,000 players per server, completely destructible buildings, complete player economy, 140 races, open skill trees with point system so no set classes... It will be great... Site will be up tomorrow... You can pre-order for $49.99 with $15 monthly fee... Beta starts soon.
Here is a screen shot of my game... shows housing and cutting edge weather. (Displays lowest settings) here.
Sheeple... seriously use your brain.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
Please elaborate... what else do screens show, especially DF screens. Show me a screen that has the UI or any info about the mechanics in a shot. You read what the PR people say about DF like it is gospel. Right now they can say anything they want... They have not proven anything to their fan base. Like I said your worse then a cult fanatic. Show me another game that ONLY released low end graphics screens from their game for four years... Just one other game... please.
What else are the Devs going to say when they release pics like that... You think the Devs always tell you the truth?
I have a great MMO built.. took me 5 years to complete... It will revolutionize everything known in the industry... Currently my friends and family are testing it for bugs... Now by your own arguments you have to believe me because you cannot PROVE what I say is untrue. Since you have no experience in the industry you are not even qualified to comment on my game... but it will be great... no really cutting edge graphics, open PvP, 15,000 players per server, completely destructible buildings, complete player economy, 140 races, open skill trees with point system so no set classes... It will be great... Site will be up tomorrow... You can pre-order for $49.99 with $15 monthly fee... Beta starts soon.
Here is a screen shot of my game... shows housing and cutting edge weather. (Displays lowest settings) here.
Sheeple... seriously use your brain.
I'm guessing you dont even look at the website eh? http://www.darkfallonline.com/gallery/visuals/javaw_2006_12_15_16_56_03_36?full=1
If you believe from what they've shown in SS and videos than yes they have proven things but if you dont then the problem isnt their's but yours. I do not know but even if they are the best graphics who cares? Graphics does not = gameplay.
How about these are some pics of DF? They really dont need to lie about graphics because no one really expects the graphics to be number 1 but what they lack in graphics they can make up in gameplay. Do they always tell you the truth? No. No one does.
No actually i dont believe that because 1. you do not have the funds which aventurine has explained. 2. You have no SS and no videos proving that there is actually a game. 3. Show me the rights to the use of your game's name. 4. Have people go threw your company and watch you while you work. Those are just things off the top of my head that you have no proof of while DF shows. Also DF has had someone else who was not from teh company play the game, though of course he went to jail for it. The only thing aventurine requires from us is time. They have never asked for anything else.
The only one not using his brain here is you.
Come on this is too easy.
Its in internal beta so technically its a closed beta but i know what your asking and then your just going to have to wait.
its in alpha testing, in closed beta they actually have sign-ups and ect. (the guild invite sheet is shit, they havent invitied any guilds)
Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2
KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
Its in internal beta so technically its a closed beta but i know what your asking and then your just going to have to wait.
its in alpha testing, in closed beta they actually have sign-ups and ect. (the guild invite sheet is shit, they havent invitied any guilds)
If i remember they stated internal beta but i will look it up and i will correct it if im wrong.
You ah... do realize the pic you linked was from their model interface right... not the game interface. Notice how they could pull up any item or SFX but nothing had any stats. So that proves they have a Dev interface to animate objects in a 3d environment... That is some cutting edge game mechanics right there... you got me.
1) You mean the funds that Tasos is lamenting the company does not have to buy servers with?
2) Neither does DF... they have pics and movies of animated models... You can find that at any college with digital art courses.
3) You ah do realize that the rights to a name mean you only own a name right?
4) If ANYONE had gone through their company and played their game and was able to comment about it... we would not be having this discussion.
Please post the jail birds name... Do you really think someone broke into their corporate headquarters to play an alpha build of an MMO? Seriously do you really think like that? *updated after looking up this info* lmao... the only thing I could find was an excuse by tasos saying beta was delayed because their WEBSERVER was hacked. There is nothing... I repeat nothing on that web server that would allow him to play the game. Tasos does not even state this though he does imply it... It appears tasos thinks the fans are idiots. so either you getting so desperate you are lieing or you can provide me the link to the OTHER hacker that infiltrated and played DF.
From Tasos own mouth he said they did not have the equipment for the beta. Since I do know about high end production networks and server administration I can tell you this... If they don't have the equipment even bought yet beta is at least 3 months away if not more. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt that they have a server crew that can do more then look at instruction on which way a server blade goes.
In the same article this "developer" stated they could release beta today... Right there is a direct lie.
I will give these guys one thing... they know how to spin... Reading their articles all they do is spin... No facts... no time frames... nothing to pin their slippery sleazy skins to the floor. They are even pissed at their fan base (this means you) because you did not scream like a little girl and faint at their latest "official" movie.
I understand your challenged right now with all your hormones and public school really dumbs the kids down... Ignore the older people that have been around the block a few times... Keep that pure wide eye ignorance... er I mean innocence that you have.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
You ah... do realize the pic you linked was from their model interface right... not the game interface. Notice how they could pull up any item or SFX but nothing had any stats. So that proves they have a Dev interface to animate objects in a 3d environment... That is some cutting edge game mechanics right there... you got me.
1) You mean the funds that Tasos is lamenting the company does not have to buy servers with?
2) Neither does DF... they have pics and movies of animated models... You can find that at any college with digital art courses.
3) You ah do realize that the rights to a name mean you only own a name right?
4) If ANYONE had gone through their company and played their game and was able to comment about it... we would not be having this discussion.
Please post the jail birds name... Do you really think someone broke into their corporate headquarters to play an alpha build of an MMO? Seriously do you really think like that? *updated after looking up this info* lmao... the only thing I could find was an excuse by tasos saying beta was delayed because their WEBSERVER was hacked. There is nothing... I repeat nothing on that web server that would allow him to play the game. Tasos does not even state this though he does imply it... It appears tasos thinks the fans are idiots. so either you getting so desperate you are lieing or you can provide me the link to the OTHER hacker that infiltrated and played DF.
From Tasos own mouth he said they did not have the equipment for the beta. Since I do know about high end production networks and server administration I can tell you this... If they don't have the equipment even bought yet beta is at least 3 months away if not more. That is giving them the benefit of the doubt that they have a server crew that can do more then look at instruction on which way a server blade goes.
In the same article this "developer" stated they could release beta today... Right there is a direct lie.
I will give these guys one thing... they know how to spin... Reading their articles all they do is spin... No facts... no time frames... nothing to pin their slippery sleazy skins to the floor. They are even pissed at their fan base (this means you) because you did not scream like a little girl and faint at their latest "official" movie.
I understand your challenged right now with all your hormones and public school really dumbs the kids down... Ignore the older people that have been around the block a few times... Keep that pure wide eye ignorance... er I mean innocence that you have.
Explain it please.
1. If they buy servers that means less servers for launch and they are still deciding whether to go with a publisher or self-publish.
2. Of course but what proof do u have that those are fake? None? Unless you get some evidence that those are fake you cant say they are.
3. They have the right to use the term "darkfall" in thier product which they will sell. They also have to have proof of said project.
4. Yes. They stole the username and password of a tester account. Now tell me if there was no game why would they ahve a username and password?
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/142187. Dont be so stupid. Many bigger compaines have been hacked(valve with HL 2) so what makes you think this didnt happen?
He does not have the equipment but he does have the game. Those are two different things and you should learn that. You really need to work on your reading comprehension skills because this is getting a little ridiculous.
Once again they did that because they bitched and complained because they got what they asked for. So please try again.
The only one being ignorant is you. I'll admit theres a slight chance that it may be vaporware but i realized that before i even signed up but theres a much greater chance that this game actually exists. Its funny how you have nothing backing up your statements but your own words.
Concerning the pics... I did not say they were FAKE. I said they showed no game mechanics... aka pretty pictures that are just model renderings. You seem to think I am claiming DF is vaporware... I am not. I am stating that what the devs are telling you is a bunch of spin. If you read between the lines you would see TASOS LIED TO EVERYONE in his last article. He directly contradicts himself several times.
You really REALLY need to research trademark laws... anyone can get a trademarked name without a product. That was my point.
You conveniently left out where he said the webserver was hacked in your little quote. Let me ask you a question... do you have a username and password to get into these forums? Is it related in any way to playing an MMO directly? A guy hacked into their webserver... got a user/pass for a restricted area or a shell login to the server. It has nothing NOTHING to do with access to their game servers. You need to understand how networks and servers work which you have already indicated you do not. The web server most certainly does not equal the game server. The most the guy may have gotten is some notes and media that was not released to the public yet... hardly the same thing as HL2 which Tasos knows and again spun to appease people.
Once again I will ask you to post a link where the community asked for a shader movie... I go to the official forums quite a bit and never came across such a post... Your desperation and blind faith has obviously made you delusional.
I was not calling you ignorant... For all I know you may be a bright kid... What I was saying is that your ignorance (lack of knowledge) about certain things that several people have patiently explained to you is getting in the way of understanding that DF is in serious trouble. It is your right to blindly follow without questioning... Just realize people with more knowledge on the subject will point out your errors. It is wisdom which brings understanding that you should head those warnings.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
This game will not appeal to the core mmo players, period. All market research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings. This game, if it ever sees the light of day, will be a free for all gank fest, nothing more. You will not see large scale meaningful pvp in this game, you will see gankage upon gankage and low populations.
2. Do you even know how many class action law suits are being pursued every day for this kind of crap? Well me either, but our legal says a lot. You can feel sorry for me all you want, but it won't change the fact this game is vaporware plain and simple, sorry kid.
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And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
If you've read this far into the post you either really hate darkfall or you really love it.
Or... You really love the concept and have consuming hatred for the company butchering it with incompetence and megalomania.
If this game was developed by a professional company with the attitude of the WAR staff... There is no question this game would have been a success.
-Atziluth-
- Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.
This response fails on so many levels I almost don't want to waste time on a reply, but I don't like you so I will.
What your analysis fail to adress is the costs of developing the game. If the game is cheaper to produce, you don't need to appeal to "majority of mmo players
What your statement fails to address is the kind of game Adventurine is "developing" is not cheap and would require a high subscriber base to sustain profitability. The customer base needed does not exist at this point in time to cover the costs of developing and maintaining this game. Do I know the cost numbers? No, I only know what we've told our bean counters and they decided they don't feel like losing money.
Also, if you can hold onto 400.000 of players for 5 years, it is better than 2 millions for 6 months.
That's great, what exactly is your point? Oh I see, you think that this bs out of nowhere comparison will somehow add validity to your post. Nope, sorry.
Your analysis also seem to fail to understand that you are not going to see much ganking near cities where NPC guards are. The chance of ganking may be higher outside your faction's area of influence but so will will the rewards.
Let me refer you back to "marketing research indicates that a majority of mmo players enjoy limited pvp in structured settings." I'm sure players will love the fact they can chill in the city in safety when 95% of content is outside the city. Oh that's right, those players will never even bother buying the game or subscribe for a month and quit.
I'm actually feeling sorry for you.
I'm actually feeling sorry for myself, because this game is vapor which means I don't get to gank suckers like you.
If I am wrong
There is no if, you are wrong plain and simple at this point in time.
If you are wrong, you actually are terrible at what you do.
I'm not wrong because all I do is keep my eye on the trends, gather surveys and purchase market research from other providers. If the boys in charge of the cash don't want to take a risk and make this game because cost/benefit doesn't look good, then that's on them.
Look, most people here are here because they want to see a game like this created and I am one of them. Unfortunately that little thing they call reality seems to be getting in the way.
My original post,
jensen_34's comment
My reply
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And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
Mmmm....you know nothing about me except I disagrees with you. Yet, you have developed some kind of dislike of me.
So it is not perhaps me you dislike but my opinions ??? This openmindedness of yours must truly serve you well in your job as a researcher.
From your post you show that you're an idiot, ignorant, or just playing devils advocate. All of which I don't like. Your opinions essentially make up who you are hence why I don't like you. I'm open to all opinions and willing to listen, doesn't mean I have to like them or the person who supports them.
Aventurine has had about 20-30 employees working full time on the project. Funcom has about 233 employees. If 150 of those has worked on AoC, it means that AoC has to have 5 times more subscribers than DF, just to cover the expences.
So all I have to do to increase my profit margin is reduce my human capital? Great, I'm sure I won't have to worry about things like production dropping or extended dev time if I cut my staff by 80%. Or is it that Greece has magical devs that code 500% faster then everyone else? Ahhhh, that makes sense, I'll just outsource all my software development to Greece and save a boat load of cash. Great idea man! Those suckers outsourcing to India are retarded lol.
The point is as following. A stable customer base over time can earn more cash than an unstable customer base, even if the unstable one starts at a higher level in the beginning. Sorry if the numbers confused you.
The point is as following. You're numbers are complete BS, you are pulling them out of the air. I'm not debating your leet math skills, I'm debating the fact that you are just using random numbers to validate your post. Sorry if the logic confused you.
How do you know 95% of the content is outside the city ? You are making things up to make a point, aren't you ? blah blah blah blah, I like to use a belief system and personal theories to back up my statements, I don't worry about things like statistical research or actually trying to consolidate others preferences.
Stop picking at straws, ok so it's 90%. Doesn't really matter since a bulk of the game you will be in a gankable area, your faction or not. Basically you are projecting your opinions and beliefs on the rest of the MMO community. Sorry that does not constitute what we call accurate market research. If I went to my boss and said, "Hey guys, I'm really bored of level system so everyone else must be too, that will be $10,000 dollars for my input, thanks." They would laugh at me because they know I like to joke around.
I am wrong at this point in time ? What does that mean ? How can you be right, now, when the future event even have had the chance to happen ? You can travel to the future now and "know" what will happen ?
According to actual opinions from MMO players, I'm talking about 50,000 players sampled from a variety of mmo games and gamer sites, you are wrong today and most likely wrong for a long time to come. Oh, were you going to use your belief/opinion argument as an excuse again? Here's another statement, the sun will rise tomorrow. How do I know for sure? Well I don't, but I use things like stats, probabilities and logic to determine right and wrong(not in the metaphysical sense).
Yeah, when you have trends, surveys and market reasearch you can never be wrong. Unless your trends are based on bad data, your survey people asks the wrong questions or the market research is done by you. LOL you are even more naive than I thought
Yeah, when you have beliefs and your own blind opinion who needs little things like the written opinions of thousands of other mmo gamers. I'm sure they all just take the time to lie on surveys because they love to see software developers continue to put out features they don't enjoy.
LOL you are even more naive than I thought
I just submitted this to wikipedia under hypocrisy and they thanked me whole heartedly. Go check it out.
When reality hits it will affect you more than me. You may want to update your resume, just in case.
Of course it will, because obviously I live in it whereas you seem to have no concept of the term.
Unfortunately I won't be able to continue this debate if you reply because it has simply eaten up too much time and I doubt it will ever be resolved. I applaud you mr. troll, you have taken up to 30 minutes of my life, congrats. If you aren't trolling, then umm.. good luck on life.
edited: for a blatant incorrect use of "You're."
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And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
it will come out! for sure! thay spend too much time to waste that game! waste it = waste 6 years of live! by the way... im falowing this game.... and each month thay give report about they r job! that MMORPG would be on 1st place! belive me! as soon it would be developed, as soon they will get first money... thay will invest it in game, and future work with applaing pathces and addons, fixing bugs for example will go much faster! Just give a chance to this Game!