Depends on what you think the "mistake" is. He apoloigised for "not listening" and "marketing", not the actual CHANGE in and of itself. So to "fix" a mistake involving a CHANGE, you again, CHANGE the entire game again. Just do it over the cource of a year instead of 1 massive patch. Nope, they just don't "get it" even now.
that will never happen and you know it
a) LA has a say in what goes on and has just renewed an IP and contract with them and nothing has ever occured that even hints that LA is unhappy at Sony. LA has the last word and yet nothing changes, but they are STILL paying the bills.
b) your asking them to make the same mistake twice. When he was asked about that and yes he was interveiwed about it that's exactly what his response was. That mistake was made with the game once and they now have a subscriber base to make the same mistake again and do to customers what everyone is angry abuot them once would not make much sense.
Well you know if Lucas Arts did not have a part in it they would have taken the entire project for SOE. The good news is todays SWG is getting better,as a recently returned vet I can see it and the future looks bright for SWG now.The OP asks what would it take and my response to this is let them keep improving the game like they are doing now.I do not think they can ever go back to Pre-Cu which I do admit I miss alot,But mainly the Ui is all I miss of the old game and the multiple profs it had. In the end whats been done is done hopefully as the future moves on the game will continue to add better content while bringing back some of the good things the old version had.As for me now I am having a pretty fun time since returning and it brings a nice change to the wow grind I had for the last 2 years:P
Depends on what you think the "mistake" is. He apoloigised for "not listening" and "marketing", not the actual CHANGE in and of itself. So to "fix" a mistake involving a CHANGE, you again, CHANGE the entire game again. Just do it over the cource of a year instead of 1 massive patch. Nope, they just don't "get it" even now.
that will never happen and you know it
a) LA has a say in what goes on and has just renewed an IP and contract with them and nothing has ever occured that even hints that LA is unhappy at Sony. LA has the last word and yet nothing changes, but they are STILL paying the bills.
b) your asking them to make the same mistake twice. When he was asked about that and yes he was interveiwed about it that's exactly what his response was. That mistake was made with the game once and they now have a subscriber base to make the same mistake again and do to customers what everyone is angry abuot them once would not make much sense.
Fraid you got your "facts" mixed up on "licensing". SOE pays LA, not the other way around. And the rumor is that LA has forgave SOE it's "licensing fees" for the last 2 years.
And my 2nd paragraph is not a request for a CHANGE, rather a comment on past history. SOE has, again, CHANGED SWG in the last year. From the Chapter 6 Combat Downgrade to current, the game was CHANGED again. Another NGE, just this time completed in increments. It's easy for them to justify their actions when they still appearently believe that the CHANGE wasn't the "bad" thing that happened with NGE.
And on the subject of a classic server, that is about the only thing that might even have a chance of re-populating SWG now. (Oh, I'm not a pre-CU or even a CU vet, I started NGE and had the game I got used to CHANGED on me, also) It's so clear that even a NGE starter can see it.
Originally posted by ummax Originally posted by Terranah They said they didn't care if they lost customers over the NGE, so since they don't care if they lose money, they should have a few precu servers. Even if no one subscribed the gesture would go along way.
well it appears LA doesn't agree that those servers are necessary. YOu see your beef is with LA not Sony your complaining about the wrong company at this point in time.
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
Depends on what you think the "mistake" is. He apoloigised for "not listening" and "marketing", not the actual CHANGE in and of itself. So to "fix" a mistake involving a CHANGE, you again, CHANGE the entire game again. Just do it over the cource of a year instead of 1 massive patch. Nope, they just don't "get it" even now.
that will never happen and you know it
a) LA has a say in what goes on and has just renewed an IP and contract with them and nothing has ever occured that even hints that LA is unhappy at Sony. LA has the last word and yet nothing changes, but they are STILL paying the bills.
b) your asking them to make the same mistake twice. When he was asked about that and yes he was interveiwed about it that's exactly what his response was. That mistake was made with the game once and they now have a subscriber base to make the same mistake again and do to customers what everyone is angry abuot them once would not make much sense.
Analogy time. You are driving in your car to a friend's house and you turn north which is a wrong turn. That was a mistake. Turning around to head south in the direction of your friend's house is not making the same mistake twice. It's course correcting to put you back on track. And what does it matter how much time and gas you spent going the wrong direction if you will never get to where you are going.
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes.
We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption.
Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal.
Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it.
Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again.
The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
Originally posted by ummax Originally posted by Fishermage Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes. We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption. Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal. Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it. Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again. The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
You have to wonder why then if smedley is so evil if after all this time he is still in charge. He is a part of a coorporation. He is the CEO which is an elected position usually. Obvious his board of directors who are capable of unseating him think otherswise. Unlesss of course maybe he actualy holds enough shares to control the entire sony corporation, but I dont think so .
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
When you jump into threads and tell people they are wrong, you should at least try to present information that substantiates your position. You have not done that in this thread a single time. You have dismissed what Fisher has posted to substantiate his position (what the folks actually involved in what is being discussed have said about it) because it goes against your 'feelings'. It isn't a trial or court, it is mainly one side presenting their opinion backed by facts (Fisher) and the other side repeating the same nonsense, which contradicts all the known information from the folks actually involved in what is being discussed, backed by nothing (you).
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
Huh? So you can make any statement you like and it's up to someone to disprove it? I believe that was done via SOE on NGE also. It is commonly called , here, lies. I had no idea that SOE was force-feeding the kool-aid, now.
And, I can certainly disprove your theroy. On a personal tel-con with Lorin Jameson, SOE, he told me that they HAD brought up CU on their internal servers with a "classic server" in mind to do. The reason he gave me for not doing it, is, CU was "buggy" and would require a lot of dev time to fix. He did say that pre-CU was not an option but did not say why.
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
When you jump into threads and tell people they are wrong, you should at least try to present information that substantiates your position. You have not done that in this thread a single time. You have dismissed what Fisher has posted to substantiate his position (what the folks actually involved in what is being discussed have said about it) because it goes against your 'feelings'. It isn't a trial or court, it is mainly one side presenting their opinion backed by facts (Fisher) and the other side repeating the same nonsense, which contradicts all the known information from the folks actually involved in what is being discussed, backed by nothing (you).
I haven't told anyone they are wrong and actualy no one in this thread has presented any "facts" just information to the best of their ability. (just one guy seems to demand more information then needed on a regular basis in a discussion thread). I"m sorry but not everyone thinks the way this small group does and I"m habitually known for not giving into "group think" which is basicaly what goes on in this board. I think for myself and "the evidence" such as it is says differently. I have given my point of view and that is all there is to it nothing more and nothing less. I simply asked why does no one put blame on LA ... see now you said you do ,but you dont. This entire thread is only about what would it take to get you guys back. Given what has gone on and how you guys adress the issue. I would say that nothing anyone does in relation to that game as long as its hosted and maintained by sony corporation will get you guys to play it again because of utter total hatred towards a company with absolutely no forgivness even in light of the apologies issued and the fact that the game is in fact improving. NO classic servers would help nothing. Because this is not an I hate what was done to SWG forum this is in fact an "i hate sony forum" period. I dont care what you think its okay to think that way. I dont expect to convince anyone of anything. Unlike those here who take this ooo so seriously I truly don't. I just want to know why no one places any heat at all on LA they had the opportunity to not renew the IP just recently yet guess what they did? IN light of that move made by LA all I can think is they in fact AGREE with what is going on and are no better or worse then sony. (at the very least they are not particularly concerned with what has transpired in the past or they would have done something about it and had the opportunity to drive a steak through the heart of SOE just recently but did not)
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes. We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption. Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal. Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it. Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again. The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
Wait so Julio gets a pass if Force Unleashed is any good ?
I think you're kind of using a bit of selective forgiveness in this post , Based on being a fan of Star Wars.Smedly is as responsible for NGE as he is for EQ2 and VG , Which arguably are decent games that have both been turned around(According to general internet information) .He's also as responsible for the improvements made to NGE you claim to have been made(the latest game update , Story teller etc..). Yet you say nothing about SOE has changed ? I'd argue their reputation is improving in the eyes of many(not mine).
L.A. may have got rid of Ward, I doubt that has much to do with galaxies however. The many failures L.A. released while he was in control were a direct cause (Deadlines are more impotant than quality ring a bell?). Star wars as a whole is of questionable quiality these days , L.A. is far from redeemed in my book as is SOE, They both have leaps and bounds of ground to cover before anything changes in my overall outlook of both companies.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes. We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption. Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal. Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it. Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again. The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
Wait so Julio gets a pass if Force Unleashed is any good ?
I think you're kind of using a bit of selective forgiveness in this post , Based on being a fan of Star Wars.Smedly is as responsible for NGE as he is for EQ2 and VG , Which arguably are decent games that have both been turned around(According to general internet information) .He's also as responsible for the improvements made to NGE you claim to have been made(the latest game update , Story teller etc..). Yet you say nothing about SOE has changed ? I'd argue their reputation is improving in the eyes of many(not mine).
L.A. may have got rid of Ward, I doubt that has much to do with galaxies however. The many failures L.A. released while he was in control were a direct cause (Deadlines are more impotant than quality ring a bell?). Star wars as a whole is of questionable quiality these days , L.A. is far from redeemed in my book as is SOE, They both have leaps and bounds of ground to cover before anything changes in my overall outlook of both companies.
This is probably the most reasonable response on the issue in the entire thread. I respect you for your clearheadedness on the issue and wish more people were as honest as this.
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
Huh? So you can make any statement you like and it's up to someone to disprove it? I believe that was done via SOE on NGE also. It is commonly called , here, lies. I had no idea that SOE was force-feeding the kool-aid, now.
And, I can certainly disprove your theroy. On a personal tel-con with Lorin Jameson, SOE, he told me that they HAD brought up CU on their internal servers with a "classic server" in mind to do. The reason he gave me for not doing it, is, CU was "buggy" and would require a lot of dev time to fix. He did say that pre-CU was not an option but did not say why.
and like cause you post this to a message board that makes it true? Listen this is to my knowledge a discussion thread. So according to the book of fishermage I should be now asking you to prove that you had this conversation perhaps a recording would be a good start?
It's obvious that we all at one point loved SWG, so here's the million dollar question: Would you even ever consider going back and if you would, what would be the required changes?
Being on the EMU requires to have the SWG client. Durring free vet month (last month) I tried SWG out again and to my supprise (although I still prefer pre cu) I am having alot of fun. I EVEN RESUBD!
I truely never thought I would. I feel a bit dirty for enjoying it. A bunch of my old time friends have also been returning and joined up in the guild I did.
There are things I don't like, but I really enjoy being back. NGE is MUCH improved from when I left back when it first released.
Beast master is back, you no longer need to keep your pointer on target to attack, expertise gives some variation to the classes. The new heroic quests are lots of fun. You can even level with terminal missions again. Foraging maps is even back.
It is no longer "god mode" of buffed pre cu where you can basically just solo mobs of anything, but BUFFS ROCK AGAIN!
Entertainers give nice custom buffs that can last over 5 hours. Medics in the Doctor expertise buff again and the buffs are nice.
I really never thought I would be back in SWG. No other MMO has ever taken the place of the game I missed. I am glad I am having fun in SWG now. The community although smaller on Gorath is still a great bunch of people.
4: SOE to post a vid on youtube with all responsible for the NGE/ToOW spinning on flaming may-poles
5: my level of self-loathing to reach record lows and for me to gouge my eyes out with a spork
6: for this universe to converge with the "evil-goatee" mirror universe
7: a time machine and an ice-cream scoop made of solid neutronium
8: the entire cast of "One Tree Hill" to rise up, surround the producers of that show, and slay them
9: a puppy
10: my entire nervous system to suffer catastrophic failure resulting in a neural feedback burst culminating in the utter and complete implosive destruction of not only my brain, but also Leo DiCaprio's face.
...in...that...order.
'nuff said.
Yes, I have anger issues. They taste like chocolate bunnies.
Originally posted by Malickiebloo Originally posted by Fishermage We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes. We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption. Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal. Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it. Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again. The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
Wait so Julio gets a pass if Force Unleashed is any good ? I think you're kind of using a bit of selective forgiveness in this post , Based on being a fan of Star Wars.Smedly is as responsible for NGE as he is for EQ2 and VG , Which arguably are decent games that have both been turned around(According to general internet information) .He's also as responsible for the improvements made to NGE you claim to have been made(the latest game update , Story teller etc..). Yet you say nothing about SOE has changed ? I'd argue their reputation is improving in the eyes of many(not mine). L.A. may have got rid of Ward, I doubt that has much to do with galaxies however. The many failures L.A. released while he was in control were a direct cause (Deadlines are more impotant than quality ring a bell?). Star wars as a whole is of questionable quiality these days , L.A. is far from redeemed in my book as is SOE, They both have leaps and bounds of ground to cover before anything changes in my overall outlook of both companies. remember I forgave everyone concerned long ago. This is about what would make things better for other people, NOT ME. Julio doesn't get a pass for anything; but Smedley should be fired, since HE was the executive decision maker, as was Ward.
We do NOT know why LA got rid of ward, but the fact is HE IS GONE. We DO know that Smedley is still there. In that we can on;y go by what direct evidence we have, we have what we have -- and it looks like LA has actually made some good moves in response to the NGE and SOE has not.
EQ2 is a good game, but it is not a successful game, exactly for the same reason SWG is not a successful game, and for many of the same reasons that vanguard is not successful. each game was released in poor shape, and each game required changes to be made to the game that the players who liked the game they started playing did not like.
that shows they are a consistently bad game developer, even though they CAN make a game that *I* like. Had I been a longstanding player of EQ or EQ2, I bet I would not feel the same way.
To reiterate this has nothing to do with MY FORGIVENESS, I have long ago forgiven everyone concerned. That does not mean that I will lie for them now. Being honest is not the same thing as forgiveness, or saying what SHOULD happen.
Those are all different things and I have slightly different positions on all of those.
The subject here is what could they do to bring people back. that is the one I am discussing
Originally posted by ummax Originally posted by Esquire1980 Originally posted by ummax Originally posted by Fishermage
Originally posted by ummax
Originally posted by Fishermage
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this.. so and so says such and such the other guy says no its like this instead you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
Huh? So you can make any statement you like and it's up to someone to disprove it? I believe that was done via SOE on NGE also. It is commonly called , here, lies. I had no idea that SOE was force-feeding the kool-aid, now. And, I can certainly disprove your theroy. On a personal tel-con with Lorin Jameson, SOE, he told me that they HAD brought up CU on their internal servers with a "classic server" in mind to do. The reason he gave me for not doing it, is, CU was "buggy" and would require a lot of dev time to fix. He did say that pre-CU was not an option but did not say why.
and like cause you post this to a message board that makes it true? Listen this is to my knowledge a discussion thread. So according to the book of fishermage I should be now asking you to prove that you had this conversation perhaps a recording would be a good start?
Th difference I know him from the past to be an honest guy. if YOU said that you had a private conversation with anyone attesting to any facts, I would take it with a little bit more of a grain of salt. That being said, HAVE YOU had any private conversations with anyone involved that told you that SOE would love to give us classic servers, but LEC won't let them?
Credibility anywhere is determined by track record. Esquire has a good one, and I think mine is pretty good as well. I always try and source what I share, giving background information, and I strictly abide by the NDA I signed in relation to things I know. I also keep confidence things which have been told to me in confidence and use that purely for investigatory purposes.
I have never knowngly lied on these forums, but I have been in error. Every once in awhile, when someone presents facts that change my opinion (Obee has done that in regards to LEC and what they permet being published under the term of "fan art," for example), I will change my opinion on a dime.
When the facts as I know them change, then my opinion may change accordingly.
So, if you have had any private conversations that lead you to believe what you believe, please share it.
!: a movie, dinner and lube 2: Complete frontal lobotomy 3: Parietal lobotomy for good measure 4: SOE to post a vid on youtube with all responsible for the NGE/ToOW spinning on flaming may-poles 5: my level of self-loathing to reach record lows and for me to gouge my eyes out with a spork 6: for this universe to converge with the "evil-goatee" mirror universe 7: a time machine and an ice-cream scoop made of solid neutronium 8: the entire cast of "One Tree Hill" to rise up, surround the producers of that show, and slay them 9: a puppy 10: my entire nervous system to suffer catastrophic failure resulting in a neural feedback burst culminating in the utter and complete implosive destruction of not only my brain, but also Leo DiCaprio's face. ...in...that...order.
Even if they brought back pre-cu or even the CU version of swg, I'd never go back as long as soe had anything to do with it. Besides, I'm having too much fun with another mmo right now and don't really care that much about swg, or Star Wars in general, anymore.
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
Even if they brought back pre-cu or even the CU version of swg, I'd never go back as long as soe had anything to do with it. Besides, I'm having too much fun with another mmo right now and don't really care that much about swg, or Star Wars in general, anymore.
Exactly...what would be the point of going back and spending time building up another character just to have SOE screw me over again?
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes. We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption. Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal. Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it. Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again. The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
Bioware made 1 good game Kotor,the 2nd game was not as good as the 1st,Bioware has yet to make a mmorpg to my knowlage so its yet to be said if they are a trustworthy company or not. I have not met many trustworthy corp. of any sort they are in it for themselves in most cases.Even Blizzard has shown already that they cannot betrusted that much either,they already have to largest mmo in History and all they ever add is More Rep,More Dungeons lol. It is still early on what this Bioware game will be like as well,which will most likly be Cartoony and WoW like since the new movie and future TV series is Cartoony.I agree with you on the Force Unleashed this will be very interesting to see how it turns out,but keep in mind a console game is nothing compared to a mmorpg so even if it turns out awesome it will be hard for me to give much credit to Julio.
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes. We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption. Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal. Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it. Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again. The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
Bioware made 1 good game Kotor,the 2nd game was not as good as the 1st,Bioware has yet to make a mmorpg to my knowlage so its yet to be said if they are a trustworthy company or not. I have not met many trustworthy corp. of any sort they are in it for themselves in most cases.Even Blizzard has shown already that they cannot betrusted that much either,they already have to largest mmo in History and all they ever add is More Rep,More Dungeons lol. It is still early on what this Bioware game will be like as well,which will most likly be Cartoony and WoW like since the new movie and future TV series is Cartoony.I agree with you on the Force Unleashed this will be very interesting to see how it turns out,but keep in mind a console game is nothing compared to a mmorpg so even if it turns out awesome it will be hard for me to give much credit to Julio.
Bioware has a reputation of being HONERABLE. SOE has a reputation of well -- the exact opposite. That was my point. We KNOW they are not trustworthy, we KNOW they are unethical, we KNOW they broke their word to LEC and to all of us. We KNOW that they continue to do so, in all their games. Even their GOOD games are developed in an unethical manner. which is why they aren't successful.
That was my point but I guess you completely missed that because nothing you wrote actually deals with what I wrote.
Comments
that will never happen and you know it
a) LA has a say in what goes on and has just renewed an IP and contract with them and nothing has ever occured that even hints that LA is unhappy at Sony. LA has the last word and yet nothing changes, but they are STILL paying the bills.
b) your asking them to make the same mistake twice. When he was asked about that and yes he was interveiwed about it that's exactly what his response was. That mistake was made with the game once and they now have a subscriber base to make the same mistake again and do to customers what everyone is angry abuot them once would not make much sense.
Well you know if Lucas Arts did not have a part in it they would have taken the entire project for SOE. The good news is todays SWG is getting better,as a recently returned vet I can see it and the future looks bright for SWG now.The OP asks what would it take and my response to this is let them keep improving the game like they are doing now.I do not think they can ever go back to Pre-Cu which I do admit I miss alot,But mainly the Ui is all I miss of the old game and the multiple profs it had. In the end whats been done is done hopefully as the future moves on the game will continue to add better content while bringing back some of the good things the old version had.As for me now I am having a pretty fun time since returning and it brings a nice change to the wow grind I had for the last 2 years:P
that will never happen and you know it
a) LA has a say in what goes on and has just renewed an IP and contract with them and nothing has ever occured that even hints that LA is unhappy at Sony. LA has the last word and yet nothing changes, but they are STILL paying the bills.
b) your asking them to make the same mistake twice. When he was asked about that and yes he was interveiwed about it that's exactly what his response was. That mistake was made with the game once and they now have a subscriber base to make the same mistake again and do to customers what everyone is angry abuot them once would not make much sense.
Fraid you got your "facts" mixed up on "licensing". SOE pays LA, not the other way around. And the rumor is that LA has forgave SOE it's "licensing fees" for the last 2 years.
And my 2nd paragraph is not a request for a CHANGE, rather a comment on past history. SOE has, again, CHANGED SWG in the last year. From the Chapter 6 Combat Downgrade to current, the game was CHANGED again. Another NGE, just this time completed in increments. It's easy for them to justify their actions when they still appearently believe that the CHANGE wasn't the "bad" thing that happened with NGE.
And on the subject of a classic server, that is about the only thing that might even have a chance of re-populating SWG now. (Oh, I'm not a pre-CU or even a CU vet, I started NGE and had the game I got used to CHANGED on me, also) It's so clear that even a NGE starter can see it.
well it appears LA doesn't agree that those servers are necessary. YOu see your beef is with LA not Sony your complaining about the wrong company at this point in time.
Please share your evidence where SOE said they want to give us classic servers, but LA won't let them.
fishermage.blogspot.com
that will never happen and you know it
a) LA has a say in what goes on and has just renewed an IP and contract with them and nothing has ever occured that even hints that LA is unhappy at Sony. LA has the last word and yet nothing changes, but they are STILL paying the bills.
b) your asking them to make the same mistake twice. When he was asked about that and yes he was interveiwed about it that's exactly what his response was. That mistake was made with the game once and they now have a subscriber base to make the same mistake again and do to customers what everyone is angry abuot them once would not make much sense.
Analogy time. You are driving in your car to a friend's house and you turn north which is a wrong turn. That was a mistake. Turning around to head south in the direction of your friend's house is not making the same mistake twice. It's course correcting to put you back on track. And what does it matter how much time and gas you spent going the wrong direction if you will never get to where you are going.
We also have to look at what the two companies have done. Smed is still right where he is. Ward of LA, the guy that Smed claimed had a lot to do with the NGE, one interview where he was shifting blame, is GONE. Julio was pulled off the project and placed in a place more similar to his last success -- a console, jedi-based game. Immediately upon taking over the project of the Force Unleashed, the date was pushed back, showing PERHAPS he has learned from SOME of the past mistakes.
We'll see how good or bad the Force Unleashed is -- that's HIS chance at redemption.
Once again, note that Smed is still RIGHT where he is, shifting blame as always. Now Blix and company continue to erase players' efforts every few patches, and Blixtev tells them to get over it and deal.
Meanwhile it appears that LA has gone and made a new deal with a more trustworthy company for the next go around, a good move I'd say. I hope, as does almost everyone here, that we get a great game out of it.
Once company has made actual CHANGES in the way they do things, including letting go the man in charge. They have evidently made steps to ensure it won't happen again.
The other has made a weak, nebulous apology and changed nothing in their behavior.
fishermage.blogspot.com
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
fishermage.blogspot.com
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
You have to wonder why then if smedley is so evil if after all this time he is still in charge. He is a part of a coorporation. He is the CEO which is an elected position usually. Obvious his board of directors who are capable of unseating him think otherswise. Unlesss of course maybe he actualy holds enough shares to control the entire sony corporation, but I dont think so .
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
When you jump into threads and tell people they are wrong, you should at least try to present information that substantiates your position. You have not done that in this thread a single time. You have dismissed what Fisher has posted to substantiate his position (what the folks actually involved in what is being discussed have said about it) because it goes against your 'feelings'. It isn't a trial or court, it is mainly one side presenting their opinion backed by facts (Fisher) and the other side repeating the same nonsense, which contradicts all the known information from the folks actually involved in what is being discussed, backed by nothing (you).
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
Huh? So you can make any statement you like and it's up to someone to disprove it? I believe that was done via SOE on NGE also. It is commonly called , here, lies. I had no idea that SOE was force-feeding the kool-aid, now.
And, I can certainly disprove your theroy. On a personal tel-con with Lorin Jameson, SOE, he told me that they HAD brought up CU on their internal servers with a "classic server" in mind to do. The reason he gave me for not doing it, is, CU was "buggy" and would require a lot of dev time to fix. He did say that pre-CU was not an option but did not say why.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
When you jump into threads and tell people they are wrong, you should at least try to present information that substantiates your position. You have not done that in this thread a single time. You have dismissed what Fisher has posted to substantiate his position (what the folks actually involved in what is being discussed have said about it) because it goes against your 'feelings'. It isn't a trial or court, it is mainly one side presenting their opinion backed by facts (Fisher) and the other side repeating the same nonsense, which contradicts all the known information from the folks actually involved in what is being discussed, backed by nothing (you).
I haven't told anyone they are wrong and actualy no one in this thread has presented any "facts" just information to the best of their ability. (just one guy seems to demand more information then needed on a regular basis in a discussion thread). I"m sorry but not everyone thinks the way this small group does and I"m habitually known for not giving into "group think" which is basicaly what goes on in this board. I think for myself and "the evidence" such as it is says differently. I have given my point of view and that is all there is to it nothing more and nothing less. I simply asked why does no one put blame on LA ... see now you said you do ,but you dont. This entire thread is only about what would it take to get you guys back. Given what has gone on and how you guys adress the issue. I would say that nothing anyone does in relation to that game as long as its hosted and maintained by sony corporation will get you guys to play it again because of utter total hatred towards a company with absolutely no forgivness even in light of the apologies issued and the fact that the game is in fact improving. NO classic servers would help nothing. Because this is not an I hate what was done to SWG forum this is in fact an "i hate sony forum" period. I dont care what you think its okay to think that way. I dont expect to convince anyone of anything. Unlike those here who take this ooo so seriously I truly don't. I just want to know why no one places any heat at all on LA they had the opportunity to not renew the IP just recently yet guess what they did? IN light of that move made by LA all I can think is they in fact AGREE with what is going on and are no better or worse then sony. (at the very least they are not particularly concerned with what has transpired in the past or they would have done something about it and had the opportunity to drive a steak through the heart of SOE just recently but did not)
Wait so Julio gets a pass if Force Unleashed is any good ?
I think you're kind of using a bit of selective forgiveness in this post , Based on being a fan of Star Wars.Smedly is as responsible for NGE as he is for EQ2 and VG , Which arguably are decent games that have both been turned around(According to general internet information) .He's also as responsible for the improvements made to NGE you claim to have been made(the latest game update , Story teller etc..). Yet you say nothing about SOE has changed ? I'd argue their reputation is improving in the eyes of many(not mine).
L.A. may have got rid of Ward, I doubt that has much to do with galaxies however. The many failures L.A. released while he was in control were a direct cause (Deadlines are more impotant than quality ring a bell?). Star wars as a whole is of questionable quiality these days , L.A. is far from redeemed in my book as is SOE, They both have leaps and bounds of ground to cover before anything changes in my overall outlook of both companies.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Wait so Julio gets a pass if Force Unleashed is any good ?
I think you're kind of using a bit of selective forgiveness in this post , Based on being a fan of Star Wars.Smedly is as responsible for NGE as he is for EQ2 and VG , Which arguably are decent games that have both been turned around(According to general internet information) .He's also as responsible for the improvements made to NGE you claim to have been made(the latest game update , Story teller etc..). Yet you say nothing about SOE has changed ? I'd argue their reputation is improving in the eyes of many(not mine).
L.A. may have got rid of Ward, I doubt that has much to do with galaxies however. The many failures L.A. released while he was in control were a direct cause (Deadlines are more impotant than quality ring a bell?). Star wars as a whole is of questionable quiality these days , L.A. is far from redeemed in my book as is SOE, They both have leaps and bounds of ground to cover before anything changes in my overall outlook of both companies.
This is probably the most reasonable response on the issue in the entire thread. I respect you for your clearheadedness on the issue and wish more people were as honest as this.
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
Huh? So you can make any statement you like and it's up to someone to disprove it? I believe that was done via SOE on NGE also. It is commonly called , here, lies. I had no idea that SOE was force-feeding the kool-aid, now.
And, I can certainly disprove your theroy. On a personal tel-con with Lorin Jameson, SOE, he told me that they HAD brought up CU on their internal servers with a "classic server" in mind to do. The reason he gave me for not doing it, is, CU was "buggy" and would require a lot of dev time to fix. He did say that pre-CU was not an option but did not say why.
and like cause you post this to a message board that makes it true? Listen this is to my knowledge a discussion thread. So according to the book of fishermage I should be now asking you to prove that you had this conversation perhaps a recording would be a good start?
Being on the EMU requires to have the SWG client. Durring free vet month (last month) I tried SWG out again and to my supprise (although I still prefer pre cu) I am having alot of fun. I EVEN RESUBD!
I truely never thought I would. I feel a bit dirty for enjoying it. A bunch of my old time friends have also been returning and joined up in the guild I did.
There are things I don't like, but I really enjoy being back. NGE is MUCH improved from when I left back when it first released.
Beast master is back, you no longer need to keep your pointer on target to attack, expertise gives some variation to the classes. The new heroic quests are lots of fun. You can even level with terminal missions again. Foraging maps is even back.
It is no longer "god mode" of buffed pre cu where you can basically just solo mobs of anything, but BUFFS ROCK AGAIN!
Entertainers give nice custom buffs that can last over 5 hours. Medics in the Doctor expertise buff again and the buffs are nice.
I really never thought I would be back in SWG. No other MMO has ever taken the place of the game I missed. I am glad I am having fun in SWG now. The community although smaller on Gorath is still a great bunch of people.
SHOHADAKU
Let's see....what would it take?
!: a movie, dinner and lube
2: Complete frontal lobotomy
3: Parietal lobotomy for good measure
4: SOE to post a vid on youtube with all responsible for the NGE/ToOW spinning on flaming may-poles
5: my level of self-loathing to reach record lows and for me to gouge my eyes out with a spork
6: for this universe to converge with the "evil-goatee" mirror universe
7: a time machine and an ice-cream scoop made of solid neutronium
8: the entire cast of "One Tree Hill" to rise up, surround the producers of that show, and slay them
9: a puppy
10: my entire nervous system to suffer catastrophic failure resulting in a neural feedback burst culminating in the utter and complete implosive destruction of not only my brain, but also Leo DiCaprio's face.
...in...that...order.
'nuff said.
Yes, I have anger issues. They taste like chocolate bunnies.
I think you're kind of using a bit of selective forgiveness in this post , Based on being a fan of Star Wars.Smedly is as responsible for NGE as he is for EQ2 and VG , Which arguably are decent games that have both been turned around(According to general internet information) .He's also as responsible for the improvements made to NGE you claim to have been made(the latest game update , Story teller etc..). Yet you say nothing about SOE has changed ? I'd argue their reputation is improving in the eyes of many(not mine).
L.A. may have got rid of Ward, I doubt that has much to do with galaxies however. The many failures L.A. released while he was in control were a direct cause (Deadlines are more impotant than quality ring a bell?). Star wars as a whole is of questionable quiality these days , L.A. is far from redeemed in my book as is SOE, They both have leaps and bounds of ground to cover before anything changes in my overall outlook of both companies.
remember I forgave everyone concerned long ago. This is about what would make things better for other people, NOT ME. Julio doesn't get a pass for anything; but Smedley should be fired, since HE was the executive decision maker, as was Ward.
We do NOT know why LA got rid of ward, but the fact is HE IS GONE. We DO know that Smedley is still there. In that we can on;y go by what direct evidence we have, we have what we have -- and it looks like LA has actually made some good moves in response to the NGE and SOE has not.
EQ2 is a good game, but it is not a successful game, exactly for the same reason SWG is not a successful game, and for many of the same reasons that vanguard is not successful. each game was released in poor shape, and each game required changes to be made to the game that the players who liked the game they started playing did not like.
that shows they are a consistently bad game developer, even though they CAN make a game that *I* like. Had I been a longstanding player of EQ or EQ2, I bet I would not feel the same way.
To reiterate this has nothing to do with MY FORGIVENESS, I have long ago forgiven everyone concerned. That does not mean that I will lie for them now. Being honest is not the same thing as forgiveness, or saying what SHOULD happen.
Those are all different things and I have slightly different positions on all of those.
The subject here is what could they do to bring people back. that is the one I am discussing
Get it?
fishermage.blogspot.com
still just making it up as you go along, I see. Thanks for trolling by.
conversations usualy go like this..
so and so says such and such
the other guy says no its like this instead
you dont have conversations you put people on trial. Perhaps the better approach would be to "give evidence" in reply with actual information to disprove what I have jsut said instead of what you do which adds nothing to the conversataion and is just silly period.
Huh? So you can make any statement you like and it's up to someone to disprove it? I believe that was done via SOE on NGE also. It is commonly called , here, lies. I had no idea that SOE was force-feeding the kool-aid, now.
And, I can certainly disprove your theroy. On a personal tel-con with Lorin Jameson, SOE, he told me that they HAD brought up CU on their internal servers with a "classic server" in mind to do. The reason he gave me for not doing it, is, CU was "buggy" and would require a lot of dev time to fix. He did say that pre-CU was not an option but did not say why.
and like cause you post this to a message board that makes it true? Listen this is to my knowledge a discussion thread. So according to the book of fishermage I should be now asking you to prove that you had this conversation perhaps a recording would be a good start?
Th difference I know him from the past to be an honest guy. if YOU said that you had a private conversation with anyone attesting to any facts, I would take it with a little bit more of a grain of salt. That being said, HAVE YOU had any private conversations with anyone involved that told you that SOE would love to give us classic servers, but LEC won't let them?
Credibility anywhere is determined by track record. Esquire has a good one, and I think mine is pretty good as well. I always try and source what I share, giving background information, and I strictly abide by the NDA I signed in relation to things I know. I also keep confidence things which have been told to me in confidence and use that purely for investigatory purposes.
I have never knowngly lied on these forums, but I have been in error. Every once in awhile, when someone presents facts that change my opinion (Obee has done that in regards to LEC and what they permet being published under the term of "fan art," for example), I will change my opinion on a dime.
When the facts as I know them change, then my opinion may change accordingly.
So, if you have had any private conversations that lead you to believe what you believe, please share it.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Thought I might just add this for shit's and giggles.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/195307
Even if they brought back pre-cu or even the CU version of swg, I'd never go back as long as soe had anything to do with it. Besides, I'm having too much fun with another mmo right now and don't really care that much about swg, or Star Wars in general, anymore.
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
Exactly...what would be the point of going back and spending time building up another character just to have SOE screw me over again?
Bioware made 1 good game Kotor,the 2nd game was not as good as the 1st,Bioware has yet to make a mmorpg to my knowlage so its yet to be said if they are a trustworthy company or not. I have not met many trustworthy corp. of any sort they are in it for themselves in most cases.Even Blizzard has shown already that they cannot betrusted that much either,they already have to largest mmo in History and all they ever add is More Rep,More Dungeons lol. It is still early on what this Bioware game will be like as well,which will most likly be Cartoony and WoW like since the new movie and future TV series is Cartoony.I agree with you on the Force Unleashed this will be very interesting to see how it turns out,but keep in mind a console game is nothing compared to a mmorpg so even if it turns out awesome it will be hard for me to give much credit to Julio.
That was my point but I guess you completely missed that because nothing you wrote actually deals with what I wrote.
Not sure why you even brought up Blizzard.
fishermage.blogspot.com