i like how people always say WaR does PvP right...it doesnt...it doesnt even get RvR right and it sad. I dont sub to either game right now but WoW's combat is *WORLDS* smoother and fuild than WaRs. and right now RvR is barren and dead and even when its alive its break down door 1 break down door 2 run in keep take a left kill the lord. whooppieee, i cant belive thats all mythic could come up with ....Old School AV was words better than any of the RvR zones Mythic came up and that was 4 years ago !
wtf
WAR does do PvP right, by giving players incentive to fight. What did WoW give before the latest patch for killing opposing forces? NOTHING! Stop saying WoW PvP was anything more than a gankfest, cause it wasn't.
WAR launched with gear drops on player kills, XP gain and Reknown gain. WoW had Arena for PvP and 4 BGs, omg, thats just so awesome.
Ya, Blizzard tried to get people to fight with the BC expansion but guess what, it didn't happen. Please don't post here thinking you know what your talking about when obviously you don't. By the way, 900+ hours in WoW myself gives me the right to say just how retarded PvP was in that game.
I will admit, RvR was probably setup better in Dark Age of Camelot, but in no world I live in does WoW PvP compare to WAR RvR, except maybe since WoW's last patch. So, you can probably thank WAR's launch for making Blizzard wake the hell up and fix their piece of crap PvP system.
It is funny how all your post is concerned about is incentives for doing PvP and not how much FUN the actual fights are. The one point you make about fun factor in the game you admit it was done better in Mythics previous game. What does that tell you?
I could care less if game A showers me with gold, items and treasure if game B offers a more challenging, entertaining and engaging PvP experience. I could give fuck all care about grinding out points so that my team can raid a city. That is just pure grind to me. What I consider important is the actual COMBAT of PvP, not some point system or loot rewards. Using your logic, if WoW put a point system into the game that allowed people to raid Stormwind/Orgrimar it would somehow change the entire PvP system to something great?
There is a lot wrong in this game right now that just does not work. RvR for one, the synergy between tank-dps-healer, scenarios [which I enjoy], population balances all over the place, even incentives and rewards.
I just can't agree that Mythic has gotten anything right yet. Who cares if the game is only out a month, it should not have so many issues and expect people to sit around and hope for fixes. There are a lot of issues that just should not have made it to live. When something is crippling the game in the first couple of weeks then they should not be talking about fixing it in December.
Originally posted by Daffid011 Before you go crying a river about WoW ripping off the tome from Warhammer, perhaps you should take a quick trip over to LOTRO and see where both games got their ideas from. Sorry mate, but neither game came up with this idea first.
Of course, neither did LOTRO, but that's OK. Good ideas should survive and be reused, even if they are decades old. The goal is to make fun games; though the constant bickering over who ripped-off who is kind of entertaining in its own right, I suppose.
I have played many mmos (Ultima Online, Anarchy Online, EVE Ragnarok, RYL, Knight Online, Silkroad etc etc etc etc) but when I started playing wow with my friends it was like AWESOME!!! The gigantic world, the Quests, the instances, all the content and PvE was awesome ( and i'm a PvP guy), the content was just overwhelming. Then I reached 70 with my warrior and the game turned into world of workcraft, I didn't even read more the story behind quests, I had fu**** program to show me the aggro on mobs (WTF? too technical there, no fun...), the arenas are fu**** boring, and whats with locks having 20k of HP, and whats with resilence? Its all ridiculous and wrong, and then there's just grind to get gear for more grind, ppl may like killing bosses in the instances, but thats not for me because the urge for PvP started to re-surface due to the boring end game grinding and farming crap. I wanted good PvP and WoW pvp is just BLARGH and doesnt deliver what I want.
One of the most things I hate is ppl that only played WoW dare to say that WoW PvP is good / or the best... WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU?!!!
I don't think WoW is a bad game, its just that it doesnt deliver what I want.
I have a lvl 40 white lion in WAR, yes there is scenario grinds, yes there are bugs everywhere, yes many ppl stay away from RvR ( loot actually sucks), but never the less I find WAR with an awesome potential, the classes are UNIQUE and with mechanics very well conceived, the tome is a good addition even if some ppl dont care. The tanks here are pure awesomeness, you can imagine a handful of black orcs / chosen making an impenetrable wall in front of you ( the collision system is a bit buggy but refined with time it will become good), also everything you do in WAR is twice as fast than WoW, the drops in the quests always drop, using the flight paths are instant ( in wow you can go have dinner and come back to see your char still flying), the mount is cheap and you get it at lvl 20, you get a mark on the map showing where quests mobs/items/finishes and that cuts alot of grind. Too much care bear? So what? At least when I start playing with my alt I dont get bored pretty fast. I think you just have to experience the game to a certain point to see if it delivers what YOU want, and don't go around "badmouthing" it with your low lvl char (my char started to shine at R40 and its underpowered).
I don't have much to do in WAR, been doing some instances for gear, I really hope with the coming patch (culminating bugfix patch) and classes (December) the game gets lively again, because it has an awesome potential.
Most of the bad things ppl pointed out here about WAR are time related, the game has been out like 1 month? WoW has been out like 4 LONG YEARS of patching, fixing, content add, bla bla bla...
Also competition will be good for WoW (it already started didnt it? )
WAR has, over WoW, much much more fast pace...BORINGNESS. To add to that, it's impressive shitty graphics that manages to sustain crappy performance. Sorry but it's such a steaming pile I can't help but mention it so.
Edit: oh btw, I don't even have an active account for WoW right now.
i like how people always say WaR does PvP right...it doesnt...it doesnt even get RvR right and it sad. I dont sub to either game right now but WoW's combat is *WORLDS* smoother and fuild than WaRs. and right now RvR is barren and dead and even when its alive its break down door 1 break down door 2 run in keep take a left kill the lord. whooppieee, i cant belive thats all mythic could come up with ....Old School AV was words better than any of the RvR zones Mythic came up and that was 4 years ago !
wtf
WAR does do PvP right, by giving players incentive to fight. What did WoW give before the latest patch for killing opposing forces? NOTHING! Stop saying WoW PvP was anything more than a gankfest, cause it wasn't.
WAR launched with gear drops on player kills, XP gain and Reknown gain. WoW had Arena for PvP and 4 BGs, omg, thats just so awesome.
Ya, Blizzard tried to get people to fight with the BC expansion but guess what, it didn't happen. Please don't post here thinking you know what your talking about when obviously you don't. By the way, 900+ hours in WoW myself gives me the right to say just how retarded PvP was in that game.
I will admit, RvR was probably setup better in Dark Age of Camelot, but in no world I live in does WoW PvP compare to WAR RvR, except maybe since WoW's last patch. So, you can probably thank WAR's launch for making Blizzard wake the hell up and fix their piece of crap PvP system.
is that your pre-written WaR defense? that had nothing to do with what i said....all i said was WoW COMBAT is smoother and more fluid and it is....period
If WaR is supposed to be amazing player vs player experince they should have make the combat feel better right now its clunky it was clunky in beta and it will be clunky for a long while.
Before you go crying a river about WoW ripping off the tome from Warhammer, perhaps you should take a quick trip over to LOTRO and see where both games got their ideas from. Sorry mate, but neither game came up with this idea first.
Of course, neither did LOTRO, but that's OK. Good ideas should survive and be reused, even if they are decades old. The goal is to make fun games; though the constant bickering over who ripped-off who is kind of entertaining in its own right, I suppose.
Exactly! Your post says exactly what I was trying to get across. Thank you.
OP: you're right. Absolutely nothing. I canceled WAR after two days. Couldn't stand the grind, the ridiculously piss-poor animations, and all the bugs. By the time I got to level 3 I knew the game was going downhill from there. (after 3 levels? ohh please) The battlegrounds are worse than WoW's (over 12 scenarios to 4 WoW BGs.. umm .. yea). The scenarios are meaningless because they don't affect the real world (they do influence zone control, sorry you missed the memo). Thank God WoW doesn't have a grind (HAHAH WTF? are you serious? Rep, honor, Arena points, Experience it is ALL a grind). WoW has MUCH better RvR too - it's called ARENA (Do you know what RvR is? Areana is NOT RVR, Realm vs Realm where each realm. can openly go against each other over open world objectives to influence the world around them,; areana is NOT that) - the single greatest PvP mode in MMO history (LOL wow.. this is an opinion that only someone who ONLY played WoW would have). Fun, exciting, BALANCED (every class is equally represented, as it should be) - unlike the horribly imbalanced mess that is WAR. (Wow balanced? Tanks can't do anything in PVP.. how many TANKS do you see in arenas? Protection specced tanks? .. ZERO.. cause they can't protect crap.. sure they are represented perfectly.. LOL.. )
WoW.. that post started out like you had a valid reason to not like War. Then your credibility went down the drain when you mentioned the scenarios and WoW NOT being a Grind. So you kind of lost any validity to your post. Well. it was a hilarious read so I thank you for making my day. Come back when you are of full brain compacity so we can seriously discuss the shortcomings of both games.
*sigh* The first time I log into this forum to check out the posts and instantly I remember why I stopped posting....fanboys. If people voice their opinion, it is almost 100% likely that someone is going to just say exactly the opposite, but add an offensive tone to it as if the first person's opinion means nothing, as Pangaea has done here.
I haven't actually tried WAR yet although it does look fairly fun, to me the differences are fairly obvious, but I guess what the OP meant was that when you strip it down to the bone it's essentially the same game, which is incredibly likely to stir up the fan-men/women out there!
And agreeing with Daffid, even though we have had our disagreements in the past, people concerntrate too intensely on the new ways to make gaining points seem worthwhile, but surely the gameplay being fun should be the thing people are most interested in?
Back to answering the OP - the biggest differnce between WAR and WoW is this: WoW is *only* about end-game activity. I know a lot of people who have been playing WoW for years, and for them the grind to level cap is just that, a grind to get to what they call The Real Game. WoW has trained millions of people to accept grinding as a play mechanic, so they get through it and then to The Real Game, which is END GAME. Arenas, raiding, instances, even crafting (most valuable recipies only drop in raids!) are all designed for end game level players, where progression is then reset to the real goal of WoW: getting better gear. WoW is a digital item collecting game, just ask anyone who's been in the same Alterac Valley over and over again with players don't even want to fight because a 10 minute loss is more honor efficient than a 1-hour win. There has been no meaninful content added to the quest grind up to Level 70, and soon Outland will be just another level grinding zone. I'm finishing up my level 64 Rogue, and I just don't think I have it in me to ever level up another alt again!
With WAR, I was having fun in RvR and scenarios at level 5, when I dared to step in - how cool is that?! I've never felt the need to level up or acquire better lootz, I'm just always looking for a good PvP fight or even a Public Quest, which I also enjoy. I just pull up the menu which shows Open Groups in my zone, and join one and pitch in.
Unfortunately, a lot of this mentality has spilled over into many WAR players, who also want to rush through the content and are discouraged because they want an item collecting game and WAR is not itemized as extensively or as significantly as WoW. WAR is population dependent, and they also (mistakenly IMO) emphasized Scenarios too much, so it can be hard to find RvR or PQ activity on a lower population server. They need to fix this ASAP, or they're going to loose a lot of population. I plan on sticking with this game for a while, because I think it has enormous potentional. To those who say potential doesn't mean anything with polished games like WoW as competition, I say this: WoW is as good as it's ever going to get, and I'm sorry but it's not good enough to keep me around much longer (unless Wotlk is way more amazing than I expect it to be). WAR might fail, but it's worth a try, at least to me, because when it's all working, it's effin' great. Sorry about the Wall Of Text ...
OP: you're right. Absolutely nothing. I canceled WAR after two days. Couldn't stand the grind, the ridiculously piss-poor animations, and all the bugs. By the time I got to level 3 I knew the game was going downhill from there. The battlegrounds are worse than WoW's. The scenarios are meaningless because they don't affect the real world. Thank God WoW doesn't have a grind. WoW has MUCH better RvR too - it's called ARENA - the single greatest PvP mode in MMO history. Fun, exciting, BALANCED (every class is equally represented, as it should be) - unlike the horribly imbalanced mess that is WAR.
This post is obvioucly a joke.
As they say in the WOW forums, 'Obvious troll is obvious!'
7 pages of Internet rage. Seriously what the hell is the point of this thread. Its all opinions and no one is going to convert anyone. Its like that DR. Suess book. Enjoy ur butter side down. Ill take my butter on top.
Spot on. This thread represents about 90% of the content on MMORPG.com's forums. Useless biased opinion packaged in flames for our collective hobby. Makes you wonder why most of these people even bother to play games at all.
MMOs Played: EQ 1&2, DAoC, SWG, Planetside, WoW, GW, CoX, DDO, EVE, Vanguard, TR Playing: WAR Awaiting 40k Online and wishing for Battletech Online
Back to answering the OP - the biggest differnce between WAR and WoW is this: WoW is *only* about end-game activity. I know a lot of people who have been playing WoW for years, and for them the grind to level cap is just that, a grind to get to what they call The Real Game. WoW has trained millions of people to accept grinding as a play mechanic, so they get through it and then to The Real Game, which is END GAME. Arenas, raiding, instances, even crafting (most valuable recipies only drop in raids!) are all designed for end game level players, where progression is then reset to the real goal of WoW: getting better gear. WoW is a digital item collecting game, just ask anyone who's been in the same Alterac Valley over and over again with players don't even want to fight because a 10 minute loss is more honor efficient than a 1-hour win. There has been no meaninful content added to the quest grind up to Level 70, and soon Outland will be just another level grinding zone. I'm finishing up my level 64 Rogue, and I just don't think I have it in me to ever level up another alt again! With WAR, I was having fun in RvR and scenarios at level 5, when I dared to step in - how cool is that?! I've never felt the need to level up or acquire better lootz, I'm just always looking for a good PvP fight or even a Public Quest, which I also enjoy. I just pull up the menu which shows Open Groups in my zone, and join one and pitch in. Unfortunately, a lot of this mentality has spilled over into many WAR players, who also want to rush through the content and are discouraged because they want an item collecting game and WAR is not itemized as extensively or as significantly as WoW. WAR is population dependent, and they also (mistakenly IMO) emphasized Scenarios too much, so it can be hard to find RvR or PQ activity on a lower population server. They need to fix this ASAP, or they're going to loose a lot of population. I plan on sticking with this game for a while, because I think it has enormous potentional. To those who say potential doesn't mean anything with polished games like WoW as competition, I say this: WoW is as good as it's ever going to get, and I'm sorry but it's not good enough to keep me around much longer (unless Wotlk is way more amazing than I expect it to be). WAR might fail, but it's worth a try, at least to me, because when it's all working, it's effin' great. Sorry about the Wall Of Text ...
Gary, the end game mindset has been around long before WoW was even a concept. I would put it as the main driving force starting around the Kunark era of Everquest. Surely it existed before then, but it became the primary goal around that time for most players. Most MMOs are built on this premise now.
I don't know if I want to blame the players for not following the path Mythic designed, because honestly it doesn't seem to work right now. There is little information on the hows or why of RvR. Scenarios are fun and are the closest thing the game offers to a fair fight. Other than that everything else seems to be misfiring.
Like you said, doing scenarios at level 5 was pretty cool, but it was also cool in WoW at level 10-19, etc. It also has the side effect of end game being almost identical to level 5. I think the mentality of most MMOers is that they are working toward something. A time when doing tasks and chores to move an experience bar isn't the primary goal and once that job is done some new avenues of adventure open up.
Warhammer kind of falls into the middle of that area. The end game is almost identical to the early levels of the game. However all that content prior to max level does almost nothing to advance development of your character. There really is no incentive or reasoning to raid keeps other than the off chance you might meet an evenly matched team for some great RvR. Leveling also has the negative affect of making T1-T3 just temporary stops along the path to max level. They are almost meaningless and at the very best disposable content even though it was supposed to be meaningful. There is little reason to go there, because in a few weeks they just won't matter and even if it changes to matter there is nothing you can do about it thanks to chicken mechanics.
Warhammer is an item game even for those who want to believe otherwise. The trouble is that the itemization is pretty aweful right now. I don't think Mythic has come up with the magic elixir to cure MMOs of their item centric nature and we will see gear become more and more of a factor in the game.
Dude theres no grind in WAR unless you grind. Grinding is probably the slowest way to gain anything in WAR and the whole purpose of WAR is to not have to grind. If you wanna grind, go play WOW or final fantasy, those are good grinding games.
As for the animations, stop trying to play the game on your texas instruments calculator. Or at least check the system requirements next time you pay 50$ for something, because its your fault you can't get the game to run properly.
Seriously, WOW people, go away, if you love WOW so much, go F***ing play WOW and stop flooding the forums with your bullcrap.
Back to answering the OP - the biggest differnce between WAR and WoW is this: WoW is *only* about end-game activity. I know a lot of people who have been playing WoW for years, and for them the grind to level cap is just that, a grind to get to what they call The Real Game. WoW has trained millions of people to accept grinding as a play mechanic, so they get through it and then to The Real Game, which is END GAME. Arenas, raiding, instances, even crafting (most valuable recipies only drop in raids!) are all designed for end game level players, where progression is then reset to the real goal of WoW: getting better gear. WoW is a digital item collecting game, just ask anyone who's been in the same Alterac Valley over and over again with players don't even want to fight because a 10 minute loss is more honor efficient than a 1-hour win. There has been no meaninful content added to the quest grind up to Level 70, and soon Outland will be just another level grinding zone. I'm finishing up my level 64 Rogue, and I just don't think I have it in me to ever level up another alt again! With WAR, I was having fun in RvR and scenarios at level 5, when I dared to step in - how cool is that?! I've never felt the need to level up or acquire better lootz, I'm just always looking for a good PvP fight or even a Public Quest, which I also enjoy. I just pull up the menu which shows Open Groups in my zone, and join one and pitch in. Unfortunately, a lot of this mentality has spilled over into many WAR players, who also want to rush through the content and are discouraged because they want an item collecting game and WAR is not itemized as extensively or as significantly as WoW. WAR is population dependent, and they also (mistakenly IMO) emphasized Scenarios too much, so it can be hard to find RvR or PQ activity on a lower population server. They need to fix this ASAP, or they're going to loose a lot of population. I plan on sticking with this game for a while, because I think it has enormous potentional. To those who say potential doesn't mean anything with polished games like WoW as competition, I say this: WoW is as good as it's ever going to get, and I'm sorry but it's not good enough to keep me around much longer (unless Wotlk is way more amazing than I expect it to be). WAR might fail, but it's worth a try, at least to me, because when it's all working, it's effin' great. Sorry about the Wall Of Text ...
Like you said, doing scenarios at level 5 was pretty cool, but it was also cool in WoW at level 10-19, etc. It also has the side effect of end game being almost identical to level 5. I think the mentality of most MMOers is that they are working toward something. A time when doing tasks and chores to move an experience bar isn't the primary goal and once that job is done some new avenues of adventure open up.
Warhammer kind of falls into the middle of that area. The end game is almost identical to the early levels of the game. However all that content prior to max level does almost nothing to advance development of your character. There really is no incentive or reasoning to raid keeps other than the off chance you might meet an evenly matched team for some great RvR. Leveling also has the negative affect of making T1-T3 just temporary stops along the path to max level. They are almost meaningless and at the very best disposable content even though it was supposed to be meaningful. There is little reason to go there, because in a few weeks they just won't matter and even if it changes to matter there is nothing you can do about it thanks to chicken mechanics.
Warhammer is an item game even for those who want to believe otherwise. The trouble is that the itemization is pretty aweful right now. I don't think Mythic has come up with the magic elixir to cure MMOs of their item centric nature and we will see gear become more and more of a factor in the game.
I don't know what WoW Battlegroup you're in, but in mine if you're not a Level 19 twink, you're dog meat in the 10-19 battlegrounds, of which there is exactly one: Warsong Gulch. My brother is in a guild that consists 100% of level 19 twinks, which are built by - you guessed it - extensive grinding. I gave up on the BGs when leveling my current alt after going 0-20 just trying to earn my PvP trinket. At end game I'll be back in, which is the only time they're even remotely balanced.
Anyone who plays WAR primarily as an item game is going to be disappointed at this point. I like getting new gear, but I don't worry about it too much. I know that when I step into an RvR lake or a Scenario, I can contribute to my team and not feel gimped. I'm just getting into Tier 3 now, but so far I've found each tier to have a different feel and play style. Variety also comes from the people and classes you play with, and the players you fight against. I've been in several memorable small skirmishes and big battles, more than in 6 months of WoW on a PvP server. And I can start a new alt anytime and have some fun right away on Tier 1. In WoW, it's back to grinding out another 70 levels. Bleh, just can't do it anymore.
Where do you think T1-T2-T3 will be in 3-4 months when everyone is level 40? Some people really enjoy twinking, but you are right it isn't the playground for new players anymore. It was still fun back in the day however. Will Warhammer offer the same in a couple of months? It doesn't look good. The game is struggling to offer much beside scenarios as it is right now.
Also level 19 twink in WoW is "exstensive grinding"? Even for a twink that is an overstatement if ever there was one. Though I agree with leveling alts. Not anywhere near as much fun the second time around.
This post is nothing but a post full of WoW trolls who needed a place to talk about their beloved game.
I'm sick and tired of the WoW v War comparisons. If you like WoW, go play it. The people playing WAR are here to talk about WAR things, not comparisons of the two. The WoW trolls need to get a life. I know that there are WAR trolls who hit up the WoW forums.. but two wrongs dont' make a right.
ATTN MODS... YOU NEED TO LOCK THIS THREAD. IT IS A CESSPOOL.
Also level 19 twink in WoW is "exstensive grinding"? Even for a twink that is an overstatement if ever there was one. Though I agree with leveling alts. Not anywhere near as much fun the second time around.
Heh, my brother's 19 twink hunter cost him close to 2000 gold for the necessary gear, plus a lot of off-time gear-drop research and being run through crucial quests by his friends. That's too much grinding for me, thanks!
WAR does do PvP right, by giving players incentive to fight. What did WoW give before the latest patch for killing opposing forces? NOTHING!
And you know what ? People in WOW actually pvped for fun without any rewards, before a ranking system etc. came out !
Orly? I played wow for 4 years, and I can tell you 90% of all pvp activity on a pvp server in WoW was done out of kill griefing. Thats right...and anyone saying otherwise is a liar. You had level 70's going to Tarren Mill and South Shore camping 20-35's and killing the npc quest givers and guards. I know this for a fact because Leveling an alt on a pvp server was hell. No gains or punishments for it either which made it worse. What pvp did we have to work with? Lets see....we had Nagrand and Zangermarsh...Nagrand had pvp here and there because you gained access to merchants and rewards if you held it...and allowed you to throw bombs on flying mounts (blizz made it somewhat fun). In Zangermarsh it gave you a 5% damage bonus if you controlled the spires...whooopdee friggin doo. WoW pvp if it ever becomes great will be because War came out and is starting to scare Blizz. You want to know how I know their scared? After 4 years and 1 expansion they are NOW incorporating ideas from WAR. Funny how they never did it before while DAOC was out and had the simmilar concepts.
World pvp in WOW really died with the inclusion of dishonor kills. That was a big slap in the face for the pvp community with the developers pretty much saying go do our new bgs or you have no chance to be competive.
Personally i am investing more hope and my sub in War over Wow right now because this new game atleast appears to have a focus and a direction. It took Warcraft years to settle on a pvp direction....arena. Frankly when i play the game now i dont even feel like im at war with the others, more like we are in rival highschool gangs fighting over nothing. Hell we are so friendly we agree to participate in little sparring matches with each other. Alliance shouldn't agro guards in Org any longer if they are invited to fight in their arena. Might as well add gnome tossing olympics and let us all sing kumbaya together.
Comments
WAR does do PvP right, by giving players incentive to fight. What did WoW give before the latest patch for killing opposing forces? NOTHING! Stop saying WoW PvP was anything more than a gankfest, cause it wasn't.
WAR launched with gear drops on player kills, XP gain and Reknown gain. WoW had Arena for PvP and 4 BGs, omg, thats just so awesome.
Ya, Blizzard tried to get people to fight with the BC expansion but guess what, it didn't happen. Please don't post here thinking you know what your talking about when obviously you don't. By the way, 900+ hours in WoW myself gives me the right to say just how retarded PvP was in that game.
I will admit, RvR was probably setup better in Dark Age of Camelot, but in no world I live in does WoW PvP compare to WAR RvR, except maybe since WoW's last patch. So, you can probably thank WAR's launch for making Blizzard wake the hell up and fix their piece of crap PvP system.
It is funny how all your post is concerned about is incentives for doing PvP and not how much FUN the actual fights are. The one point you make about fun factor in the game you admit it was done better in Mythics previous game. What does that tell you?
I could care less if game A showers me with gold, items and treasure if game B offers a more challenging, entertaining and engaging PvP experience. I could give fuck all care about grinding out points so that my team can raid a city. That is just pure grind to me. What I consider important is the actual COMBAT of PvP, not some point system or loot rewards. Using your logic, if WoW put a point system into the game that allowed people to raid Stormwind/Orgrimar it would somehow change the entire PvP system to something great?
There is a lot wrong in this game right now that just does not work. RvR for one, the synergy between tank-dps-healer, scenarios [which I enjoy], population balances all over the place, even incentives and rewards.
I just can't agree that Mythic has gotten anything right yet. Who cares if the game is only out a month, it should not have so many issues and expect people to sit around and hope for fixes. There are a lot of issues that just should not have made it to live. When something is crippling the game in the first couple of weeks then they should not be talking about fixing it in December.
Of course, neither did LOTRO, but that's OK. Good ideas should survive and be reused, even if they are decades old. The goal is to make fun games; though the constant bickering over who ripped-off who is kind of entertaining in its own right, I suppose.
I have played many mmos (Ultima Online, Anarchy Online, EVE Ragnarok, RYL, Knight Online, Silkroad etc etc etc etc) but when I started playing wow with my friends it was like AWESOME!!! The gigantic world, the Quests, the instances, all the content and PvE was awesome ( and i'm a PvP guy), the content was just overwhelming. Then I reached 70 with my warrior and the game turned into world of workcraft, I didn't even read more the story behind quests, I had fu**** program to show me the aggro on mobs (WTF? too technical there, no fun...), the arenas are fu**** boring, and whats with locks having 20k of HP, and whats with resilence? Its all ridiculous and wrong, and then there's just grind to get gear for more grind, ppl may like killing bosses in the instances, but thats not for me because the urge for PvP started to re-surface due to the boring end game grinding and farming crap. I wanted good PvP and WoW pvp is just BLARGH
and doesnt deliver what I want.
One of the most things I hate is ppl that only played WoW dare to say that WoW PvP is good / or the best... WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU?!!!
I don't think WoW is a bad game, its just that it doesnt deliver what I want.
I have a lvl 40 white lion in WAR, yes there is scenario grinds, yes there are bugs everywhere, yes many ppl stay away from RvR ( loot actually sucks), but never the less I find WAR with an awesome potential, the classes are UNIQUE and with mechanics very well conceived, the tome is a good addition even if some ppl dont care. The tanks here are pure awesomeness, you can imagine a handful of black orcs / chosen making an impenetrable wall in front of you ( the collision system is a bit buggy but refined with time it will become good), also everything you do in WAR is twice as fast than WoW, the drops in the quests always drop, using the flight paths are instant ( in wow you can go have dinner and come back to see your char still flying), the mount is cheap and you get it at lvl 20, you get a mark on the map showing where quests mobs/items/finishes and that cuts alot of grind. Too much care bear? So what? At least when I start playing with my alt I dont get bored pretty fast. I think you just have to experience the game to a certain point to see if it delivers what YOU want, and don't go around "badmouthing" it with your low lvl char (my char started to shine at R40 and its underpowered).
I don't have much to do in WAR, been doing some instances for gear, I really hope with the coming patch (culminating bugfix patch) and classes (December) the game gets lively again, because it has an awesome potential.
)
Most of the bad things ppl pointed out here about WAR are time related, the game has been out like 1 month? WoW has been out like 4 LONG YEARS of patching, fixing, content add, bla bla bla...
Also competition will be good for WoW (it already started didnt it?
Just my 1€, regards.
Flameshield ON
WAR has, over WoW, much much more fast pace...BORINGNESS. To add to that, it's impressive shitty graphics that manages to sustain crappy performance. Sorry but it's such a steaming pile I can't help but mention it so.
Edit: oh btw, I don't even have an active account for WoW right now.
WAR does do PvP right, by giving players incentive to fight. What did WoW give before the latest patch for killing opposing forces? NOTHING! Stop saying WoW PvP was anything more than a gankfest, cause it wasn't.
WAR launched with gear drops on player kills, XP gain and Reknown gain. WoW had Arena for PvP and 4 BGs, omg, thats just so awesome.
Ya, Blizzard tried to get people to fight with the BC expansion but guess what, it didn't happen. Please don't post here thinking you know what your talking about when obviously you don't. By the way, 900+ hours in WoW myself gives me the right to say just how retarded PvP was in that game.
I will admit, RvR was probably setup better in Dark Age of Camelot, but in no world I live in does WoW PvP compare to WAR RvR, except maybe since WoW's last patch. So, you can probably thank WAR's launch for making Blizzard wake the hell up and fix their piece of crap PvP system.
is that your pre-written WaR defense? that had nothing to do with what i said....all i said was WoW COMBAT is smoother and more fluid and it is....period
If WaR is supposed to be amazing player vs player experince they should have make the combat feel better right now its clunky it was clunky in beta and it will be clunky for a long while.
Of course, neither did LOTRO, but that's OK. Good ideas should survive and be reused, even if they are decades old. The goal is to make fun games; though the constant bickering over who ripped-off who is kind of entertaining in its own right, I suppose.
Exactly! Your post says exactly what I was trying to get across. Thank you.
WoW.. that post started out like you had a valid reason to not like War. Then your credibility went down the drain when you mentioned the scenarios and WoW NOT being a Grind. So you kind of lost any validity to your post. Well. it was a hilarious read so I thank you for making my day. Come back when you are of full brain compacity so we can seriously discuss the shortcomings of both games.
*sigh* The first time I log into this forum to check out the posts and instantly I remember why I stopped posting....fanboys. If people voice their opinion, it is almost 100% likely that someone is going to just say exactly the opposite, but add an offensive tone to it as if the first person's opinion means nothing, as Pangaea has done here.
I haven't actually tried WAR yet although it does look fairly fun, to me the differences are fairly obvious, but I guess what the OP meant was that when you strip it down to the bone it's essentially the same game, which is incredibly likely to stir up the fan-men/women out there!
And agreeing with Daffid, even though we have had our disagreements in the past, people concerntrate too intensely on the new ways to make gaining points seem worthwhile, but surely the gameplay being fun should be the thing people are most interested in?
----------------
Hello!
Back to answering the OP - the biggest differnce between WAR and WoW is this: WoW is *only* about end-game activity. I know a lot of people who have been playing WoW for years, and for them the grind to level cap is just that, a grind to get to what they call The Real Game. WoW has trained millions of people to accept grinding as a play mechanic, so they get through it and then to The Real Game, which is END GAME. Arenas, raiding, instances, even crafting (most valuable recipies only drop in raids!) are all designed for end game level players, where progression is then reset to the real goal of WoW: getting better gear. WoW is a digital item collecting game, just ask anyone who's been in the same Alterac Valley over and over again with players don't even want to fight because a 10 minute loss is more honor efficient than a 1-hour win. There has been no meaninful content added to the quest grind up to Level 70, and soon Outland will be just another level grinding zone. I'm finishing up my level 64 Rogue, and I just don't think I have it in me to ever level up another alt again!
With WAR, I was having fun in RvR and scenarios at level 5, when I dared to step in - how cool is that?! I've never felt the need to level up or acquire better lootz, I'm just always looking for a good PvP fight or even a Public Quest, which I also enjoy. I just pull up the menu which shows Open Groups in my zone, and join one and pitch in.
Unfortunately, a lot of this mentality has spilled over into many WAR players, who also want to rush through the content and are discouraged because they want an item collecting game and WAR is not itemized as extensively or as significantly as WoW. WAR is population dependent, and they also (mistakenly IMO) emphasized Scenarios too much, so it can be hard to find RvR or PQ activity on a lower population server. They need to fix this ASAP, or they're going to loose a lot of population. I plan on sticking with this game for a while, because I think it has enormous potentional. To those who say potential doesn't mean anything with polished games like WoW as competition, I say this: WoW is as good as it's ever going to get, and I'm sorry but it's not good enough to keep me around much longer (unless Wotlk is way more amazing than I expect it to be). WAR might fail, but it's worth a try, at least to me, because when it's all working, it's effin' great. Sorry about the Wall Of Text ...
This post is obvioucly a joke.
As they say in the WOW forums, 'Obvious troll is obvious!'
7 pages of Internet rage.
Seriously what the hell is the point of this thread. Its all opinions and no one is going to convert anyone.
Its like that DR. Suess book.
Enjoy ur butter side down. Ill take my butter on top.
This part made me spit up my drink!
Spot on. This thread represents about 90% of the content on MMORPG.com's forums. Useless biased opinion packaged in flames for our collective hobby. Makes you wonder why most of these people even bother to play games at all.
MMOs Played: EQ 1&2, DAoC, SWG, Planetside, WoW, GW, CoX, DDO, EVE, Vanguard, TR
Playing: WAR
Awaiting 40k Online and wishing for Battletech Online
What does WAR have that WoW doesn't?
My money, and me playing.
The sleeper awakes...and rides his dirtbike to the mall.
We are soooooooo on the wrong website for rational discussion.
Gary, the end game mindset has been around long before WoW was even a concept. I would put it as the main driving force starting around the Kunark era of Everquest. Surely it existed before then, but it became the primary goal around that time for most players. Most MMOs are built on this premise now.
I don't know if I want to blame the players for not following the path Mythic designed, because honestly it doesn't seem to work right now. There is little information on the hows or why of RvR. Scenarios are fun and are the closest thing the game offers to a fair fight. Other than that everything else seems to be misfiring.
Like you said, doing scenarios at level 5 was pretty cool, but it was also cool in WoW at level 10-19, etc. It also has the side effect of end game being almost identical to level 5. I think the mentality of most MMOers is that they are working toward something. A time when doing tasks and chores to move an experience bar isn't the primary goal and once that job is done some new avenues of adventure open up.
Warhammer kind of falls into the middle of that area. The end game is almost identical to the early levels of the game. However all that content prior to max level does almost nothing to advance development of your character. There really is no incentive or reasoning to raid keeps other than the off chance you might meet an evenly matched team for some great RvR. Leveling also has the negative affect of making T1-T3 just temporary stops along the path to max level. They are almost meaningless and at the very best disposable content even though it was supposed to be meaningful. There is little reason to go there, because in a few weeks they just won't matter and even if it changes to matter there is nothing you can do about it thanks to chicken mechanics.
Warhammer is an item game even for those who want to believe otherwise. The trouble is that the itemization is pretty aweful right now. I don't think Mythic has come up with the magic elixir to cure MMOs of their item centric nature and we will see gear become more and more of a factor in the game.
Dude theres no grind in WAR unless you grind. Grinding is probably the slowest way to gain anything in WAR and the whole purpose of WAR is to not have to grind. If you wanna grind, go play WOW or final fantasy, those are good grinding games.
As for the animations, stop trying to play the game on your texas instruments calculator. Or at least check the system requirements next time you pay 50$ for something, because its your fault you can't get the game to run properly.
Seriously, WOW people, go away, if you love WOW so much, go F***ing play WOW and stop flooding the forums with your bullcrap.
PLAY WURM ONLINE!! www.wurmonline.com
It has a world I actually care about... unlike WoW who's lack of this kept me playing for 2 hours... total.
Like you said, doing scenarios at level 5 was pretty cool, but it was also cool in WoW at level 10-19, etc. It also has the side effect of end game being almost identical to level 5. I think the mentality of most MMOers is that they are working toward something. A time when doing tasks and chores to move an experience bar isn't the primary goal and once that job is done some new avenues of adventure open up.
Warhammer kind of falls into the middle of that area. The end game is almost identical to the early levels of the game. However all that content prior to max level does almost nothing to advance development of your character. There really is no incentive or reasoning to raid keeps other than the off chance you might meet an evenly matched team for some great RvR. Leveling also has the negative affect of making T1-T3 just temporary stops along the path to max level. They are almost meaningless and at the very best disposable content even though it was supposed to be meaningful. There is little reason to go there, because in a few weeks they just won't matter and even if it changes to matter there is nothing you can do about it thanks to chicken mechanics.
Warhammer is an item game even for those who want to believe otherwise. The trouble is that the itemization is pretty aweful right now. I don't think Mythic has come up with the magic elixir to cure MMOs of their item centric nature and we will see gear become more and more of a factor in the game.
I don't know what WoW Battlegroup you're in, but in mine if you're not a Level 19 twink, you're dog meat in the 10-19 battlegrounds, of which there is exactly one: Warsong Gulch. My brother is in a guild that consists 100% of level 19 twinks, which are built by - you guessed it - extensive grinding. I gave up on the BGs when leveling my current alt after going 0-20 just trying to earn my PvP trinket. At end game I'll be back in, which is the only time they're even remotely balanced.
Anyone who plays WAR primarily as an item game is going to be disappointed at this point. I like getting new gear, but I don't worry about it too much. I know that when I step into an RvR lake or a Scenario, I can contribute to my team and not feel gimped. I'm just getting into Tier 3 now, but so far I've found each tier to have a different feel and play style. Variety also comes from the people and classes you play with, and the players you fight against. I've been in several memorable small skirmishes and big battles, more than in 6 months of WoW on a PvP server. And I can start a new alt anytime and have some fun right away on Tier 1. In WoW, it's back to grinding out another 70 levels. Bleh, just can't do it anymore.
Hey! I'm the only DOG MEAT around here, bub!
kidding
Couldn't resist.
PLAY WURM ONLINE!! www.wurmonline.com
Where do you think T1-T2-T3 will be in 3-4 months when everyone is level 40? Some people really enjoy twinking, but you are right it isn't the playground for new players anymore. It was still fun back in the day however. Will Warhammer offer the same in a couple of months? It doesn't look good. The game is struggling to offer much beside scenarios as it is right now.
Also level 19 twink in WoW is "exstensive grinding"? Even for a twink that is an overstatement if ever there was one. Though I agree with leveling alts. Not anywhere near as much fun the second time around.
This post is nothing but a post full of WoW trolls who needed a place to talk about their beloved game.
I'm sick and tired of the WoW v War comparisons. If you like WoW, go play it. The people playing WAR are here to talk about WAR things, not comparisons of the two. The WoW trolls need to get a life. I know that there are WAR trolls who hit up the WoW forums.. but two wrongs dont' make a right.
ATTN MODS... YOU NEED TO LOCK THIS THREAD. IT IS A CESSPOOL.
Currently playing Real Life..
http://i36.tinypic.com/2uyod3k.gif
For all your stalking needs..
http://www.plurk.com/Random_
Purpose.
Heh, my brother's 19 twink hunter cost him close to 2000 gold for the necessary gear, plus a lot of off-time gear-drop research and being run through crucial quests by his friends. That's too much grinding for me, thanks!
And you know what ? People in WOW actually pvped for fun without any rewards, before a ranking system etc. came out !
Orly? I played wow for 4 years, and I can tell you 90% of all pvp activity on a pvp server in WoW was done out of kill griefing. Thats right...and anyone saying otherwise is a liar. You had level 70's going to Tarren Mill and South Shore camping 20-35's and killing the npc quest givers and guards. I know this for a fact because Leveling an alt on a pvp server was hell. No gains or punishments for it either which made it worse. What pvp did we have to work with? Lets see....we had Nagrand and Zangermarsh...Nagrand had pvp here and there because you gained access to merchants and rewards if you held it...and allowed you to throw bombs on flying mounts (blizz made it somewhat fun). In Zangermarsh it gave you a 5% damage bonus if you controlled the spires...whooopdee friggin doo. WoW pvp if it ever becomes great will be because War came out and is starting to scare Blizz. You want to know how I know their scared? After 4 years and 1 expansion they are NOW incorporating ideas from WAR. Funny how they never did it before while DAOC was out and had the simmilar concepts.
World pvp in WOW really died with the inclusion of dishonor kills. That was a big slap in the face for the pvp community with the developers pretty much saying go do our new bgs or you have no chance to be competive.
Personally i am investing more hope and my sub in War over Wow right now because this new game atleast appears to have a focus and a direction. It took Warcraft years to settle on a pvp direction....arena. Frankly when i play the game now i dont even feel like im at war with the others, more like we are in rival highschool gangs fighting over nothing. Hell we are so friendly we agree to participate in little sparring matches with each other. Alliance shouldn't agro guards in Org any longer if they are invited to fight in their arena. Might as well add gnome tossing olympics and let us all sing kumbaya together.