Nothing can kill EVE but CCP. Unlike other MMO's EVE's population keeps growing, while every other game population is shrinking (over time). There's a reason for this inverse trend that EVE continues to enjoy. I'll sum it up in two words: Learning curve. There is basically something new to learn in EVE every single tme you log in. Talk about a carrot on a stick, the ability to learn something new and cool vs. a new shiny is EVE's trademark.
EVE is also capturing the crowd of mature gamers that are looking for more of a challenge then the typical fare of WOW, Guild Wars, etc. have offered. I know that's how it got me for a time (and even tho my account isnt active atm, does one really ever leave EVE?) and I know at some point in the future I will resub and go out there in that great, vast expanse of space and mine my heart away. Till then I'm enjoying FE, but I always keep my ear to the ground with EVE. EVE continues to innovate, excite and offer challenges to gamers seeking something out of the ordinary.
I think since EVE Online is such a late bloomer that it would actually make it more resilient to other games trying to come out trying to do similar things.
First of all, it looks like they are finally able to work and develop some of their better ideas (or flesh particular aspects out such as the null sec environment) and continue to do so since they have picked up steam (not sure what year that was, but it looks like they have plenty of great ideas and not just on the horizon, for years to come).
They actually try to listen to the players with the voices of player representatives which very few gaming companies even try to do (at least in the way EVE Online has set up with their council).
The game is very niche and specialized. It is definitely for a specific type of player and type of crowd as well. Pretty much people into sci fi and spaceships (for now) and doesn't mind or even likes playing a slower pace relative to most other MMO's. People that can appreciate the strategic side of the MMO and not worry about having a faster action based game.
Why are we even speculating against a game with only 300k subs, finally?
EVE has the most fanatically devoted fanbase in the entire MMORPG genre. no game that isn't made by CCP will ever be capable of pulling a significant amount of players from EVE.
Back in 2004 we think the same of EQ.
There is a difference, SOE started destroying its own game in 2002 with retarded expansions. CCP isn't destroying EVE.
"Social improvements are coming, more pve is coming, planetary conquest, Dust, new mining mechanics, on foot missions, new ship classes, fleet formations for more tactical gameplay."....
Is this in the plan or something player wish for? I have been in EVE for 1 year almost, and the setup is getting boring sadly. Walking in stations, on planets, really looking at something else than starts and planets would be a HUGE boost... but when? Not in the coming expansion...
"Social improvements are coming, more pve is coming, planetary conquest, Dust, new mining mechanics, on foot missions, new ship classes, fleet formations for more tactical gameplay.".... Is this in the plan or something player wish for? I have been in EVE for 1 year almost, and the setup is getting boring sadly. Walking in stations, on planets, really looking at something else than starts and planets would be a HUGE boost... but when? Not in the coming expansion...
Rome wasn't built in a day either
I think this is what many players within the MMORPG realm lack is that sort of patience and acknowledgement that human beings are far from perfect and anything worthwhile is going to take time. I'm sure like every other game company, CCP is looking to make sure they do things right and not release so slapped together version of what people are seeking. Who knows what things might of came up, could be difficult to implement, other projects getting in the way, they don't feel its up to snuff, etc. It could be a myriad of things and you wouldn't know since we are only watching what they are doing from the outside. I'm sure of one thing in that it will come out (they promised the feature to us at least) and when it does, it would be that much more worthwhile having to wait so long for it
The potential that EVE has for the future is undeniable and we all can perceive the improvements that can be added to the game and I'm sure they're thinking of it as well. However, everything takes time to do and thats why they are being put to work to this day (and also be thankful they don't charge for their expansions either unlike most other games).
I hadn't realized that Eve owned a thrown. I tried playing it a couple years ago, and couldn't gwt into it. At all. Most boring and confusing experience I ever had with gameware. For two days. I would guess that any Sc-Fi game that is fun out of the box and has intuitive gameplay will "dethrown" it.
I would like to see a sandbox game that you can play casually and not fidget around with inventory items, setups and so forth - user friendly one that is enjoyable, I really liked DF combat but death, re-gearing and getting back to field gave me RSI which was exactly same reason I quit EVE, too much fidgeting with excel and no play.
Perhaps we will see a casual sandbox mmo someday that doesn't suck.
I hadn't realized that Eve owned a thrown. I tried playing it a couple years ago, and couldn't gwt into it. At all. Most boring and confusing experience I ever had with gameware. For two days. I would guess that any Sc-Fi game that is fun out of the box and has intuitive gameplay will "dethrown" it.
There's the problem; you need to know the difference between thrown and throne to avoid being totally confused by a complex game.
I hadn't realized that Eve owned a thrown. I tried playing it a couple years ago, and couldn't gwt into it. At all. Most boring and confusing experience I ever had with gameware. For two days. I would guess that any Sc-Fi game that is fun out of the box and has intuitive gameplay will "dethrown" it.
There's the problem; you need to know the difference between thrown and throne to avoid being totally confused by a complex game.
Just because you can point out spelling errors doesn't mean what your posting is actual relevant to the topic. He was merely representing his opinion and you understood exactly what he meant despite the fact he used the wrong word and it is the beauty of language. He isn't hired as a professional forum writer so who cares how he uses his grammar or the words used as long as he's understood. At least you have half the brain to figure out that he was in fact using "throne" even if it was spelled "thrown". Try to stay on topic and take in what is being said rather than literally what's written with the letters. Forum noobs ftl -_-
I'm waiting for JGE, it's the closes thing to freelancer mmo that I have seen.
TBH, my 100% perfect game would be EvE with twitch based flight mechancis, but the engine is not designed for that so would never happen, and the only reason I am not playing EvE right now is I think the subscription price is to high and I dont like their way of handling time codes with all these thrid party retailers. very annoying spam still arrives in my in box from them.
"Social improvements are coming, more pve is coming, planetary conquest, Dust, new mining mechanics, on foot missions, new ship classes, fleet formations for more tactical gameplay.".... Is this in the plan or something player wish for? I have been in EVE for 1 year almost, and the setup is getting boring sadly. Walking in stations, on planets, really looking at something else than starts and planets would be a HUGE boost... but when? Not in the coming expansion...
The coming expansion is the long-awaited revamp of 0.0 Dominion
The next expansion, due in the first half of 2010 is Incarna, which will be the one that brings us the long awaited ambulation and planetary interaction - kind of a sim-city in space thing, as far as I know, which will tie in with...
"On planets" will actually be the Dust 5-14 console MMOFPS - your guess as to when that will launch is as good as mine.
CCP dont have to answer to external shareholders or a greedy parent company like AE, so they dont have to rush their expansions out half-finished (they like to rush them out 90% finished with a hilariously obvious bug or two instead *rimshot*).
Yeah dont get me wrong, I enjoyed it, but after a while, point and click, orbit x distance and spamming shields or webs or vamps, just. well. pvp to me felt like pvp in monkey island, if you follow my drift.
To be honest I cant wait to jump into a cockpit and actually pilot my ship and dogfight enemy ships.
Oh as for those talking about STO, it's gameplay is very much like eve's ship control. so im told. so their more alike than you might want to think.
What will be the next Major Sandbox |or| PvP MMORPG |or| Sci-Fi MMORPG to dethrown EvE? And Why? MO maybe?
Hmm dethrone EVE as in how? There will never be a game released that takes 100 percent of another games population save maybe a sequal to said game with the that original closing down. As far as the sci fi games on the horizon I don't see any of them being developed to serve EVE's audience so I doubt they will have any effect on the game. EVE is truly in a class by itself unlike some people claim about the game they like with EVE it is totally true and again it is a perfect storm of features that made EVE what it is and it is not a very large market on top of that so I don't think you will find many companies interested in trying to be the EVE killer.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Why do people take pleasure in having to see something fail, unless you were victimized, lied to and potentially scammed by the organization delivering a product. I dont feel that way about Eve, so more power to-em. The only game in my 15 years of gaming mmo's, that I felt so violated about was Darkfall and the Aventurine scammers.
Yeah in terms of content, nothing can come close, lets not forget they have had 6+ years of content being added, giving them a head start.
Most gamers can see this however so a new game only has to offer players what they want, with the promise of adding content at a later date to be able to grab players away from EvE.
I am sure I am not the only ex EvE player to want something a bit more twitch.
I think the topic starts off with a bad title since EvE online is still a niche game and has not enjoyed worldwide success in the same way a game like WoW does. Like any other game it probably has a finite lifespan. That written being niche game it could well start to appeal to the retro gaming market as well as more modern SciFi mmo and real-time online strategy games come out next year.
There sure are allot of post coming through the pub that go on and on (and finally have to be moved then locked) for a niche game. (I'm just saying!)
Also CCP and EVE started from very humble beginnings and have consistently grown an evolved across genera, platforms, and borders. I don't think you can casually say its appeal is finite.
I do think there is room for an EVE killer, but it will have to be a one world sandbox that takes the experience beyond space combat.
One thing people rarely talk about, and the reason this has not been done before, is that it would require an incredibly massive and complex operation to do this. All the things that people hate about EVE (spread sheets, no walking, PVE combat) are the exact reason CCP is able to create a massive open one world space ship sandbox. Moving beyond this will not be cheap or easy.
Eve is built in such a unique way that it can keep expanding. There are no real environments so they can update the spaceships and asteroids easily, as long as the engine can handle it. The game is EXTREMELY lite on the technical end when you really look at it. Space ships use very few polys and can look so much better just using textures, compared to animated avatars. Since every environment is just a sphere with a map, expanding is cake. Besides, when battles begin, you're not looking at anything close up. You're zoomed out fighting blips(dots), NOT ships. Its fans really don't care about the graphics all that much. It could be a bunch of + and - and they would probably still be happy
Also, its playerbase is grown MORE due to selling multiple accounts to the same people then NEW players. We all know it=) Eve has the most multi boxers of any MMO out there due to the time based leveling structure. You can play many characters at the same time very efficiently compared to your typical MMO and CCP keeps pushing everyone to buy multiple accounts. You're at a major disadvantage being stuck to only one account in Eve if you really want to accomplish anything above simple casual play.
Eve is so unique and different there really isn't competition. If a sci fi space MMO with a more exciting battle system came along it would steal some, but in Eve, its more about the politics and what you OWN than about how fun the game actually is to play. Its one of those games that people will have a hard time putting down due to such an extreme amount of time investment....even more so than early MMOs.
Space doesn't change so Eve doesn't have to change all that much either to stay current.
I've always been curious... how many people played "Earth and Beyond" before migrating to "EVE"?
The only thing that "really" kills games is themselves. Everquest isn't dead, UO isn't dead, nor is Asheron's call. They've survived since the beginning and have done so in their own way to keep a decent player base. Shadowbane killed itself, Tabula Rasa killed itself, and Helgate: London killed itself. I only say those because those were games I played and can honestly say they did.
That being said, Eve is major founding father of modern space MMO's (save for E&B, but it belonged to EA so it wasn't meant to last forever.) If the fantasy market can be flooded for 12 years, and EQ, UO, and AC still be kicking to this day... I don't see EVE going anywhere for a long time, especially with the lack of space MMO's.
"There is only one thing of which I am certain, and that's nothing is certain."
If the definition of "niche" is "not succeeding like WoW does", then virtually all MMOs are "niche". >300 subs is a pretty big niche.
Eves subscription numbers do not make it a niche game, but rather the genre and aspects of the game do. Space shooter, sandbox, full loot pvp, sci-fi game is rather niche in comparison to the entire mmo genre which numbers in the tens of millions and favor other types of games. That is not a knock on eves gameplay, just a statement of how things are.
Eve is competing for a drastically smaller segment of the market and yet it out performs almost every game that is aiming for the mainstream market. That is a very telling sign of how same the market is.
Comments
Nothing can kill EVE but CCP. Unlike other MMO's EVE's population keeps growing, while every other game population is shrinking (over time). There's a reason for this inverse trend that EVE continues to enjoy. I'll sum it up in two words: Learning curve. There is basically something new to learn in EVE every single tme you log in. Talk about a carrot on a stick, the ability to learn something new and cool vs. a new shiny is EVE's trademark.
EVE is also capturing the crowd of mature gamers that are looking for more of a challenge then the typical fare of WOW, Guild Wars, etc. have offered. I know that's how it got me for a time (and even tho my account isnt active atm, does one really ever leave EVE?) and I know at some point in the future I will resub and go out there in that great, vast expanse of space and mine my heart away. Till then I'm enjoying FE, but I always keep my ear to the ground with EVE. EVE continues to innovate, excite and offer challenges to gamers seeking something out of the ordinary.
Current Games: WOW, EVE Online
I think since EVE Online is such a late bloomer that it would actually make it more resilient to other games trying to come out trying to do similar things.
First of all, it looks like they are finally able to work and develop some of their better ideas (or flesh particular aspects out such as the null sec environment) and continue to do so since they have picked up steam (not sure what year that was, but it looks like they have plenty of great ideas and not just on the horizon, for years to come).
They actually try to listen to the players with the voices of player representatives which very few gaming companies even try to do (at least in the way EVE Online has set up with their council).
The game is very niche and specialized. It is definitely for a specific type of player and type of crowd as well. Pretty much people into sci fi and spaceships (for now) and doesn't mind or even likes playing a slower pace relative to most other MMO's. People that can appreciate the strategic side of the MMO and not worry about having a faster action based game.
Why are we even speculating against a game with only 300k subs, finally?
Back in 2004 we think the same of EQ.
There is a difference, SOE started destroying its own game in 2002 with retarded expansions. CCP isn't destroying EVE.
"Social improvements are coming, more pve is coming, planetary conquest, Dust, new mining mechanics, on foot missions, new ship classes, fleet formations for more tactical gameplay."....
Is this in the plan or something player wish for? I have been in EVE for 1 year almost, and the setup is getting boring sadly. Walking in stations, on planets, really looking at something else than starts and planets would be a HUGE boost... but when? Not in the coming expansion...
Rome wasn't built in a day either
I think this is what many players within the MMORPG realm lack is that sort of patience and acknowledgement that human beings are far from perfect and anything worthwhile is going to take time. I'm sure like every other game company, CCP is looking to make sure they do things right and not release so slapped together version of what people are seeking. Who knows what things might of came up, could be difficult to implement, other projects getting in the way, they don't feel its up to snuff, etc. It could be a myriad of things and you wouldn't know since we are only watching what they are doing from the outside. I'm sure of one thing in that it will come out (they promised the feature to us at least) and when it does, it would be that much more worthwhile having to wait so long for it
The potential that EVE has for the future is undeniable and we all can perceive the improvements that can be added to the game and I'm sure they're thinking of it as well. However, everything takes time to do and thats why they are being put to work to this day (and also be thankful they don't charge for their expansions either unlike most other games).
In my opinion it would be:
Star Trek Online
or
Perpetuum
Im leaning more towards Perpetuum since its allot like Eve except Mech's vice Ship's!
I hadn't realized that Eve owned a thrown. I tried playing it a couple years ago, and couldn't gwt into it. At all. Most boring and confusing experience I ever had with gameware. For two days. I would guess that any Sc-Fi game that is fun out of the box and has intuitive gameplay will "dethrown" it.
I would like to see a sandbox game that you can play casually and not fidget around with inventory items, setups and so forth - user friendly one that is enjoyable, I really liked DF combat but death, re-gearing and getting back to field gave me RSI which was exactly same reason I quit EVE, too much fidgeting with excel and no play.
Perhaps we will see a casual sandbox mmo someday that doesn't suck.
Thanks for the tip !
Perpetuum looks great !
Finally a robot/mech online game with good graphics .
There's the problem; you need to know the difference between thrown and throne to avoid being totally confused by a complex game.
I am looking forward to Earthrise myself. I think that game looks promising, then again so have many other games these past few years.
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
There's the problem; you need to know the difference between thrown and throne to avoid being totally confused by a complex game.
Just because you can point out spelling errors doesn't mean what your posting is actual relevant to the topic. He was merely representing his opinion and you understood exactly what he meant despite the fact he used the wrong word and it is the beauty of language. He isn't hired as a professional forum writer so who cares how he uses his grammar or the words used as long as he's understood. At least you have half the brain to figure out that he was in fact using "throne" even if it was spelled "thrown". Try to stay on topic and take in what is being said rather than literally what's written with the letters. Forum noobs ftl -_-
I'm waiting for JGE, it's the closes thing to freelancer mmo that I have seen.
TBH, my 100% perfect game would be EvE with twitch based flight mechancis, but the engine is not designed for that so would never happen, and the only reason I am not playing EvE right now is I think the subscription price is to high and I dont like their way of handling time codes with all these thrid party retailers. very annoying spam still arrives in my in box from them.
Free expansions = EvE
EvE = win
The coming expansion is the long-awaited revamp of 0.0 Dominion
The next expansion, due in the first half of 2010 is Incarna, which will be the one that brings us the long awaited ambulation and planetary interaction - kind of a sim-city in space thing, as far as I know, which will tie in with...
"On planets" will actually be the Dust 5-14 console MMOFPS - your guess as to when that will launch is as good as mine.
CCP dont have to answer to external shareholders or a greedy parent company like AE, so they dont have to rush their expansions out half-finished (they like to rush them out 90% finished with a hilariously obvious bug or two instead *rimshot*).
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Yeah dont get me wrong, I enjoyed it, but after a while, point and click, orbit x distance and spamming shields or webs or vamps, just. well. pvp to me felt like pvp in monkey island, if you follow my drift.
To be honest I cant wait to jump into a cockpit and actually pilot my ship and dogfight enemy ships.
Oh as for those talking about STO, it's gameplay is very much like eve's ship control. so im told. so their more alike than you might want to think.
There is no sci-fi MMO even close enough to take on EVE or take out. As much updating and content as their is in EVE i see no one even coming close.
Hmm dethrone EVE as in how? There will never be a game released that takes 100 percent of another games population save maybe a sequal to said game with the that original closing down. As far as the sci fi games on the horizon I don't see any of them being developed to serve EVE's audience so I doubt they will have any effect on the game. EVE is truly in a class by itself unlike some people claim about the game they like with EVE it is totally true and again it is a perfect storm of features that made EVE what it is and it is not a very large market on top of that so I don't think you will find many companies interested in trying to be the EVE killer.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Why do people take pleasure in having to see something fail, unless you were victimized, lied to and potentially scammed by the organization delivering a product. I dont feel that way about Eve, so more power to-em. The only game in my 15 years of gaming mmo's, that I felt so violated about was Darkfall and the Aventurine scammers.
Yeah in terms of content, nothing can come close, lets not forget they have had 6+ years of content being added, giving them a head start.
Most gamers can see this however so a new game only has to offer players what they want, with the promise of adding content at a later date to be able to grab players away from EvE.
I am sure I am not the only ex EvE player to want something a bit more twitch.
I don't understand this fixation of having one game 'killing' another. If people like a game, they will play it. Simple as that.
Main characters:
Jinn Gone Quiet (Guild Wars)
Princess Pudding (Guild Wars)
I think the topic starts off with a bad title since EvE online is still a niche game and has not enjoyed worldwide success in the same way a game like WoW does. Like any other game it probably has a finite lifespan. That written being niche game it could well start to appeal to the retro gaming market as well as more modern SciFi mmo and real-time online strategy games come out next year.
There sure are allot of post coming through the pub that go on and on (and finally have to be moved then locked) for a niche game. (I'm just saying!)
Also CCP and EVE started from very humble beginnings and have consistently grown an evolved across genera, platforms, and borders. I don't think you can casually say its appeal is finite.
I do think there is room for an EVE killer, but it will have to be a one world sandbox that takes the experience beyond space combat.
One thing people rarely talk about, and the reason this has not been done before, is that it would require an incredibly massive and complex operation to do this. All the things that people hate about EVE (spread sheets, no walking, PVE combat) are the exact reason CCP is able to create a massive open one world space ship sandbox. Moving beyond this will not be cheap or easy.
Eve is built in such a unique way that it can keep expanding. There are no real environments so they can update the spaceships and asteroids easily, as long as the engine can handle it. The game is EXTREMELY lite on the technical end when you really look at it. Space ships use very few polys and can look so much better just using textures, compared to animated avatars. Since every environment is just a sphere with a map, expanding is cake. Besides, when battles begin, you're not looking at anything close up. You're zoomed out fighting blips(dots), NOT ships. Its fans really don't care about the graphics all that much. It could be a bunch of + and - and they would probably still be happy
Also, its playerbase is grown MORE due to selling multiple accounts to the same people then NEW players. We all know it=) Eve has the most multi boxers of any MMO out there due to the time based leveling structure. You can play many characters at the same time very efficiently compared to your typical MMO and CCP keeps pushing everyone to buy multiple accounts. You're at a major disadvantage being stuck to only one account in Eve if you really want to accomplish anything above simple casual play.
Eve is so unique and different there really isn't competition. If a sci fi space MMO with a more exciting battle system came along it would steal some, but in Eve, its more about the politics and what you OWN than about how fun the game actually is to play. Its one of those games that people will have a hard time putting down due to such an extreme amount of time investment....even more so than early MMOs.
Space doesn't change so Eve doesn't have to change all that much either to stay current.
I've always been curious... how many people played "Earth and Beyond" before migrating to "EVE"?
The only thing that "really" kills games is themselves. Everquest isn't dead, UO isn't dead, nor is Asheron's call. They've survived since the beginning and have done so in their own way to keep a decent player base. Shadowbane killed itself, Tabula Rasa killed itself, and Helgate: London killed itself. I only say those because those were games I played and can honestly say they did.
That being said, Eve is major founding father of modern space MMO's (save for E&B, but it belonged to EA so it wasn't meant to last forever.) If the fantasy market can be flooded for 12 years, and EQ, UO, and AC still be kicking to this day... I don't see EVE going anywhere for a long time, especially with the lack of space MMO's.
"There is only one thing of which I am certain, and that's nothing is certain."
Eves subscription numbers do not make it a niche game, but rather the genre and aspects of the game do. Space shooter, sandbox, full loot pvp, sci-fi game is rather niche in comparison to the entire mmo genre which numbers in the tens of millions and favor other types of games. That is not a knock on eves gameplay, just a statement of how things are.
Eve is competing for a drastically smaller segment of the market and yet it out performs almost every game that is aiming for the mainstream market. That is a very telling sign of how same the market is.