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Group-lovers: the REAL freaks in the MMO world...?
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Wrong on point A, but kudos for recognizing the truth of point B.
I can't speak for other people, but my preference to solo rather than group is because I prefer the solo playstyle to performing a group role. I always join guilds, I often chat in channels (I can't count the number of times I've given directions to Mankrik's wife) on vent and post on forums.
I just prefer playing a class rather than a role.
In practical terms, if I am playing a mage in a group then my role is, in most games, that of a ranged DPS class that might also have some debuff or CC abilities. In some fights, that can amount to spamming one or two buttons for several minutes until the target dies or we wipe. My contribution to the fight might be important, but it doesn't feel significant.
Playing the same mage solo is a very different experience. I'm responsible for pulling. I'm resposible for dealing damage. I'm responsible for survivability. I'm responsible for damage mitigation. The fight is won or lost by my actions alone.
It's just more fun (for me).
Exactly. I used to be a healer back in AO days. Now it just doesnt appeal to me mashing 3, 4 & 5 for countless hrs. It is braindead interaction to me.
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
Interesting discussion.
As a long time MMO player (since MUDs then UO) I just have a few things to add from my own experiences.
I see some people talked about UO being a solo game or a group game. UO wasn't either. It was just a game. People chose their own path and were able to advance with no penalty either grouping or soloing. UO is the only two game that you can truly play how you want and not feel like you are missing something. (Maybe EvE as well, but I could never get into that game)
The great thing about UO was that there was no penalty for grouping or soloing. You got full experience (skill gain in UO) while in a group or while you were soloing.
Grouping was encouraged in UO because you had people to watch your back and you could kill faster but it was never forced. It was always a choice you had and I think that's really what's missing from today's MMO games. The sense of freedom and choice.
Honestly, the gameplay UO had before the Renaissance expansion can never be understood by someone who came into the genre after. It's like trying to explain to kids today what you felt like when JFK got shot, or being a kid during the Cold War, or watching the first man walk on the moon, or watching your first child be born. It's not something that can be explained with words, it's something that has to be experienced.
EQ was a completely different game than UO. I'm not really sure what some of the posters are talking about here when they said you could solo in EQ. Yea, maybe it was possible but it definitely was not a normal thing for people to solo in EQ, at least not in the beginning, when I played.
The forced grouping that EQ introduced was not my cup of tea, but lots of people liked it. Saying there's not a market for another game that forces grouping like EQ is just ignorant. Over 500,000 people subscribed to EQ at it's peak and over 1 million people subscribed to FFXI (another forced group game). The only solo-oriented game to surpass these numbers is WoW. No other solo MMO game has even come close.
Another forced grouping game, DAoC also did very well in its prime, as good as any of the solo games we have on the market today.
WoW was successful because it perfectly merged the solo and group gameplay aspects into a game that still followed the EQ leveling model. Something no game since 2004 has been able to match.
What's my point with all of this?
This whole groupers vs soloers feud is just so stupid. We used to just be "gamers". Both options are perfectly legitimate and have been included since the beginning of the genre (MUDs, Meridian 59, then UO). I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that most MMO gamers dabble in all aspects of gameplay, not just strictly stick to one or the other.
What the genre needs do to is get back to it's roots. Give the players the tools to do what they want and don't reward one style of gameplay over another. Getting rid of the arbitrary XP gain penalty when in a group would be nice step in the right direction.
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
More soloer venom. You guys really hate that some people work together and achieve things you could never even attempt. That's ok though, you can have your shit games mechanics that act 100% as a timesink and nothing else, I'll be playing real games like L4D2 or Borderlands having a blast in Coop.
I play MMO's for the fun. Tell me, when did soloing become trivial and non-challenging? Afaik EVERYTHING is harder in any MMO if you plan to stay alone... Killing bosses, PvP, instances etc etc...
And you better read it all again; we do NOT hate grouping. In fact, it is the opposite; it is individuals like YOU who hate the soloing part. In fact, I will go so far I would LOVE the grouping part, so I dont have to interact too much with persons similar to your attitude. Thank goodness that you are outnumbered as well as we have the game designers on our 'soloers' side.
Have a cookie & bai bai. You will not be missed.
/bearhug
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
I play MMO's for the fun. Tell me, when did soloing become trivial and non-challenging? Afaik EVERYTHING is harder in any MMO if you plan to stay alone... Killing bosses, PvP, instances etc etc...
And you better read it all again; we do NOT hate grouping. In fact, it is the opposite; it is individuals like YOU who hate the soloing part. In fact, I will go so far I would LOVE the grouping part, so I dont have to interact too much with persons similar to your attitude. Thank goodness that you are outnumbered as well as we have the game designers on our 'soloers' side.
Have a cookie & bai bai. You will not be missed.
/bearhug
Awesome that you know me so well you can put words in my mouth. Perhaps you should read the previous post I made in this thread, where I state that as a former MMO player I soloed as much as I grouped. You don't know anything about me in the slightest, who are you to judge my attitude. Oh but that's right all you know is I'm not on your side so of course I am just an enemy.
To be honest, I'll thank the devs for that. This solo dependence has only opened my eyes on how bad the gameplay mechanics really are in MMOs. It restored my faith in single player games being superior to MMOs in almost every single way.
/enjoy the ratrace
I underlined your hate. Enough said. This tells me that you are full of it.
Now, let's get back to the topic, which is my question that maybe it is the 'group-lovers' who are the REAL freaks in the MMO world. Right now, with all your anger, I have few problems picturing you in that little box.
PS: your tears makes excellent polish for my armor.
/bearhug
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
I play MMO's for the fun. Tell me, when did soloing become trivial and non-challenging? Afaik EVERYTHING is harder in any MMO if you plan to stay alone... Killing bosses, PvP, instances etc etc...
And you better read it all again; we do NOT hate grouping. In fact, it is the opposite; it is individuals like YOU who hate the soloing part. In fact, I will go so far I would LOVE the grouping part, so I dont have to interact too much with persons similar to your attitude. Thank goodness that you are outnumbered as well as we have the game designers on our 'soloers' side.
Have a cookie & bai bai. You will not be missed.
/bearhug
It's ok to have different opinions.
My opinion is the exact opposite of yours.
I think EVERYTHING is 100x easier solo than being in a group.
I think maybe you are comparing killing Mob A solo to killing Mob A in a group?
But groups don't kill solo Mob A, because it doesn't give them any experience.
Groups kill Group Mob B, while solo players kill Solo Mob A.
IMO, working in a group to kill a mob that is at the very top of your abilities as a group, especially in a game designed for group play, is 100 x more difficult than killing a mob that is at the very top of your abilities solo.
Solo, it's just mash the buttons.
Group, in a good group game mind you, not something that isn't designed for groups like WoW, you can come up with multiple strategies depending on the size of your group, and the classes, and levels. You must coordinate very closely, or you will get a party wipe.
That was the game play in EQ and DAoC classic. In a game like WoW, for example, you are right. Being in a group before the raid, just means running around like chickens with your heads cut off, and you still beat the mob.
you need to play a real grouping game to actually compare the difference. Try DAoC classic server.
WOW is no more a soloers game than UO was. In both you can level up solo, craft solo, pvp solo...basically don't most things solo, EXCEPT go to places too dangerous for a solo player like dungeons. You're not getting the BEST gear in WOW solo, sorry. You need to hit some dungeons or do arenas, neither a solo experience. You're not the best player only playing by yourself. You're not going to see a significan't portion of the game solo either. So, people need to get their facts straight=) All WOW does is give you a choice, which isn't a bad thing at all. FREAKS want a game to force you down one path. Normal people want people to have a choice.
The thing is with most mmo's now days there is really no need to group up most of the time. If you can solo quests then why group up and make the game even easier. Im guessing people want a challenge because I sure am looking for a challenge when I play a game and group up. Most of the time when I group up in a game I feel like im in God mode which really isn't fun.
Now if quests would change for how many people in the group to give challenge that would be awesome, so if the people want to solo they can but if people want a challenge and group up it will get harder. Thats the way to do it because ive experienced games where its just a solofest where you can only find a party to get phat loot and nobody else wanted to group up after that because they didnt really need to.
So if ur lazy and only read this part this is what it all comes down to. It seems that people will only group up unless they are forced to group up because im sure if people were able to solo dungeons they would.
I play MMO's for the fun. Tell me, when did soloing become trivial and non-challenging? Afaik EVERYTHING is harder in any MMO if you plan to stay alone... Killing bosses, PvP, instances etc etc...
And you better read it all again; we do NOT hate grouping. In fact, it is the opposite; it is individuals like YOU who hate the soloing part. In fact, I will go so far I would LOVE the grouping part, so I dont have to interact too much with persons similar to your attitude. Thank goodness that you are outnumbered as well as we have the game designers on our 'soloers' side.
Have a cookie & bai bai. You will not be missed.
/bearhug
It's ok to have different opinions.
My opinion is the exact opposite of yours.
I think EVERYTHING is 100x easier solo than being in a group.
I think maybe you are comparing killing Mob A solo to killing Mob A in a group?
But groups don't kill solo Mob A, because it doesn't give them any experience.
Groups kill Group Mob B, while solo players kill Solo Mob A.
IMO, working in a group to kill a mob that is at the very top of your abilities as a group, especially in a game designed for group play, is 100 x more difficult than killing a mob that is at the very top of your abilities solo.
Solo, it's just mash the buttons.
Group, in a good group game mind you, not something that isn't designed for groups like WoW, you can come up with multiple strategies depending on the size of your group, and the classes, and levels. You must coordinate very closely, or you will get a party wipe.
That was the game play in EQ and DAoC classic. In a game like WoW, for example, you are right. Being in a group before the raid, just means running around like chickens with your heads cut off, and you still beat the mob.
you need to play a real grouping game to actually compare the difference. Try DAoC classic server.
Poor game mechanics. Dont blame the soloers for that. Soloers want, are right about it too, the same end levels phat lewt as groupers. We pay for the game too you know. No playstyles should be rewarded more than the other.
This IS in change, it all basically started with WoW. We are just seeing the beginning of this. Nothing you can do about it. As long as there is a demand for it, there WILL be a supply.
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
You have obviously never done heroic ToC 25 man. There are fights in that raid that if ONE PERSON does something idiotic, like what you're describing, you very well may NOT succeed.
Not every single fight and instance in WoW is "easy breezy peasy pie." The people who go around SAYING so....are making it breathtakingly apparent that they have either never run those instances, never succeeded, or were the ONLY person in the raid that didn't know what they were doing and got LUCKY that the other 24 people could carry their dead weight.
Edit: I apologize for this being a bit off topic, but there was no way I was going to let that comment slide by unaddressed.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
You have obviously never done heroic ToC 25 man. There are fights in that raid that if ONE PERSON does something idiotic, like what you're describing, you very well may NOT succeed.
Not every single fight and instance in WoW is "easy breezy peasy pie." The people who go around SAYING so....are making it breathtakingly apparent that they have either never run those instances, never succeeded, or were the ONLY person in the raid that didn't know what they were doing and got LUCKY that the other 24 people could carry their dead weight.
Edit: I apologize for this being a bit off topic, but there was no way I was going to let that comment slide by unaddressed.
group =/= raid
raid =/= group
I like to group. I don't raid.
I play MMO's for the fun. Tell me, when did soloing become trivial and non-challenging? Afaik EVERYTHING is harder in any MMO if you plan to stay alone... Killing bosses, PvP, instances etc etc...
And you better read it all again; we do NOT hate grouping. In fact, it is the opposite; it is individuals like YOU who hate the soloing part. In fact, I will go so far I would LOVE the grouping part, so I dont have to interact too much with persons similar to your attitude. Thank goodness that you are outnumbered as well as we have the game designers on our 'soloers' side.
Have a cookie & bai bai. You will not be missed.
/bearhug
It's ok to have different opinions.
My opinion is the exact opposite of yours.
I think EVERYTHING is 100x easier solo than being in a group.
I think maybe you are comparing killing Mob A solo to killing Mob A in a group?
But groups don't kill solo Mob A, because it doesn't give them any experience.
Groups kill Group Mob B, while solo players kill Solo Mob A.
IMO, working in a group to kill a mob that is at the very top of your abilities as a group, especially in a game designed for group play, is 100 x more difficult than killing a mob that is at the very top of your abilities solo.
Solo, it's just mash the buttons.
Group, in a good group game mind you, not something that isn't designed for groups like WoW, you can come up with multiple strategies depending on the size of your group, and the classes, and levels. You must coordinate very closely, or you will get a party wipe.
That was the game play in EQ and DAoC classic. In a game like WoW, for example, you are right. Being in a group before the raid, just means running around like chickens with your heads cut off, and you still beat the mob.
you need to play a real grouping game to actually compare the difference. Try DAoC classic server.
Poor game mechanics. Dont blame the soloers for that. Soloers want, are right about it too, the same end levels phat lewt as groupers. We pay for the game too you know. No playstyles should be rewarded more than the other.
This IS in change, it all basically started with WoW. We are just seeing the beginning of this. Nothing you can do about it. As long as there is a demand for it, there WILL be a supply.
Everyone that plays a subscription based game pays the subscription fee.
That does not mean you can make a game that please everyone at the same time.
Any play style that the devs want to encourage, because the players find that encouragement makes them enjoy the game more, should be rewarded.
if you want to encourage PvP, you can reward that. If you want to encourage solo play, you can reward that. If you want to encourage group play, you can reward that. If you want to encourage raid play, you can reward that. If you want to encourage PvE, you can reward that.
Unfortunately, sometimes these will be mutually exclusive, as in rewarding one is a disincentive to the other.
I play MMO's for the fun. Tell me, when did soloing become trivial and non-challenging? Afaik EVERYTHING is harder in any MMO if you plan to stay alone... Killing bosses, PvP, instances etc etc...
And you better read it all again; we do NOT hate grouping. In fact, it is the opposite; it is individuals like YOU who hate the soloing part. In fact, I will go so far I would LOVE the grouping part, so I dont have to interact too much with persons similar to your attitude. Thank goodness that you are outnumbered as well as we have the game designers on our 'soloers' side.
Have a cookie & bai bai. You will not be missed.
/bearhug
It's ok to have different opinions.
My opinion is the exact opposite of yours.
I think EVERYTHING is 100x easier solo than being in a group.
I think maybe you are comparing killing Mob A solo to killing Mob A in a group?
But groups don't kill solo Mob A, because it doesn't give them any experience.
Groups kill Group Mob B, while solo players kill Solo Mob A.
IMO, working in a group to kill a mob that is at the very top of your abilities as a group, especially in a game designed for group play, is 100 x more difficult than killing a mob that is at the very top of your abilities solo.
Solo, it's just mash the buttons.
Group, in a good group game mind you, not something that isn't designed for groups like WoW, you can come up with multiple strategies depending on the size of your group, and the classes, and levels. You must coordinate very closely, or you will get a party wipe.
That was the game play in EQ and DAoC classic. In a game like WoW, for example, you are right. Being in a group before the raid, just means running around like chickens with your heads cut off, and you still beat the mob.
you need to play a real grouping game to actually compare the difference. Try DAoC classic server.
Poor game mechanics. Dont blame the soloers for that. Soloers want, are right about it too, the same end levels phat lewt as groupers. We pay for the game too you know. No playstyles should be rewarded more than the other.
This IS in change, it all basically started with WoW. We are just seeing the beginning of this. Nothing you can do about it. As long as there is a demand for it, there WILL be a supply.
Everyone that plays a subscription based game pays the subscription fee.
That does not mean you can make a game that please everyone at the same time.
Any play style that the devs want to encourage, because the players find that encouragement makes them enjoy the game more, should be rewarded.
if you want to encourage PvP, you can reward that. If you want to encourage solo play, you can reward that. If you want to encourage group play, you can reward that. If you want to encourage raid play, you can reward that. If you want to encourage PvE, you can reward that.
Unfortunately, sometimes these will be mutually exclusive, as in rewarding one is a disincentive to the other.
Ofc. If the MMO doesnt please me, I leave. Theres more than enough games to try. But then, I feel, the biggest "issue" regarding mainstream MMO's right now, is whether to focus more or less on the solo/group playstyle. MMO's have lots to learn from FPS, epsecially the Call of Duty series. it has MASSIVE succes, beating whatsoever game & film outthere atm when it comes to income. I was quite surprised when I logged into the COD 4 few ago for my very first time; it had both levels AND perks/traits!
Old MMO's are mastodonts in their current shape. They are a breed under threat of extinction. It is beyond doubt. Only one MMO which can claim being close to "massive" success is World of Warcraft. That game has tons of content to offer for to solo-playstyle, and I do belive thats why it has it success. And even them (Blizzard), is having hard time dealing with the game due to its sheer size. I read someplace that they will not do that again.
Well, enough of my rambling. My point is, that those MMO's that focus mainly on Grouping playstyle, are soon gone. as the MMO's are build up today, there are actually no "need" to focus on it, since its a basic feature of genre anyway. To attract more customers, you need more speedy play, for people who want to play "right now". And we all know that more customers means better games.
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
This is such a ridiculous thread.
ALL mmo's don't have to be group oriented.
ALL mmo's don't have to be solo oriented.
We need some mmo's of one kind and some mmo's of another and many mmo's with varying levels balancing the two. We need a large variety of options in game play across the mmo board to satisfy players of varying opinions. We DON"T need gamers trying to villify, catagorize or bully people into 'their' vision. We need let a free market fill the desires of a free society. No one's opinion should be bent to cator to the will of another, but rather respected as the rewards of living and let living.
MMO's should reflect our multitude of opinions, likes and dislikes. Our opinions, likes and dislikes should never conform to what one segment decides is 'the right way'.
=p on all of you.
More grouper delusion. We don't give a damn what you do, just don't try to force *US* to do it too. That means you don't deserve any extra rewards, group-only content, etc. If you want to go take on higher-level content and make extra XP, go for it. Have fun. We don't care. We'll get there in our own sweet time. But of course, it's attitudes like this that make a lot of soloers think groupers are complete assholes.
And unfortunately, a lot of them are.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
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Hope: None
More grouper delusion. We don't give a damn what you do, just don't try to force *US* to do it too. That means you don't deserve any extra rewards, group-only content, etc. If you want to go take on higher-level content and make extra XP, go for it. Have fun. We don't care. We'll get there in our own sweet time. But of course, it's attitudes like this that make a lot of soloers think groupers are complete assholes.
And unfortunately, a lot of them are.
Well if you think grouping doesn't deserve extra reward then why should solo content deserve the same reward as group? The reason why I think group content should deserve an extra reward is they are taking extra time to get a group together. They are having to work together to achieve a higher goal, there is more chance for them to mess up because there are more people.
It just doesn't make any sense for someone to solo something and get the same reward as a group, it makes grouping pointless if you can just go in and solo it. Why bother taking the extra time to get people if you can do it yourself.
Now I agree game should have solo content, like quests and stuff because I sometimes don't have the time to find a group but some things should force you to group up to get the better rewards.
Lol, Everquest has been a failure?
The problem with games that allow soloing is that the content tends to be trivial. Look at WoW or AION, you could solo through the whole game easily. It is boring.
What is the point of these meaningless and boring grinds, because they surely aren't challenging at all? When I started WoW, I solod my shaman to 60 within 1 month of the game coming out. It was really boring and pointless. I mean, the content wasn't challenging, it was a worse grind than EQ. In EQ, when I was leveling, we actually had to have competent groups to hold down camps, such as camping an FBSS in LGuk.
If a game has solo content, then it should require some challenge. Spamming shocks and eating some food/drink isn't challenging, its a meaningless grind.
Games should have content like EQ, where you pretty much have to group and socialize with other players. EQ required coordination, skilled players, etc. Your warrior or MT had to chain pull, your chanter had to mez adds, clerics had to be awake.
Only complete newbies enjoy solo games because they tend to be dumbed down enough for every class to solo. Why even have leveling systems when the content has been dumbed down so much.
I won't play any MMORPG that has solo content, i'm sick of companies making single player MMORPGs with instanced content and MMORPGs where you don't even interact with other players at all. Fuck them
I am fine with soloing and grouping in MMOs. The issue is there is more incentive to level by solo than grouping and their should not be in most MMOs. I think solo should be viable and all classes be able to easily. I also believe you should receive the same amount of xp per kill whether in a group or solo. I think that would be the thing that would make grouping leveling a viable option. There has to be incentive to forming groups or everyone will just solo.
If you received the same amount of xp per kill as someone soloing does, the incentive would be killing faster with a group. This doesn't not hurt soloing because you don't have to find anyone to solo, there needs no incentive. The incentive would be there though, solo you would receive all loot without rolling.
Yup.
Group content should warrent getting a group. Camping mob spawns and running the same dungeons over and over are just not worth it. Thats why they added loot rewards, which is nice for the people who group. But there is another problem, not everyone really cares about this uber loot thing, specially at lower than raid level. When it comes to early and middle game experience, a lot of people end up skipping those dungeons because the loot you would get, while better than anything else its level, would only last you about 5 levels at max.
Now look at low/mid level dungeon loot drops from games like EQ. You could pretty much always use that item (say about 10-20 levels worth of use) and it would last a while because the levels were just long enough that even while group blitzing mob spawns it still took forever to level.
New games try to hint at leveling by offering up neat shiney items at below raid level (low/mid game levels) but the items themselves really have no value because you out grow them faster than my kid out grows shoes. That in itself lends to people not really bothering with grouping because teh reward isnt something worth shooting for. This is where game design and itemization fails the group player. Its not the solo palyers fault, its just lazy game design. People like me who like to solo really dont care if groupers get better loot (they put in the effort thus they deserve it). But when the reward isnt worth it, grouping loses its draw and more people just go about soloing.
So dont blame the soloer, blame the designers. All we solo types want is content, but not at the cost of killing a whole playstyle.
Excellent post, and I agree completely.
I am all for groups getting better loot than someone can obtain solo. Like you said, they deserve it because they worked for it. I would be content with a lesser version obtainable solo.
Acidon
Right on, thats exactly the point ive been trying to make. Sure let them have their solo time, but make it SO much better to group in terms of xp and loot that it makes it painful to solo.
See? Again your only objective in this thread is to illicit a negative response from someone else.
What I was stating is that solo people shouldnt suffer severe XP penalaties and soloing shouldnt be painful in the least. Soloing should present a challenge, but it shouldnt be painful in the least.
As for grouping, there is always a better XP gain through grouping than via solo play. Anyone who says otherwise is spewing BS. The difference is while soloing, the player isnt stuck with waiting for people to come back from bio breaks, phone calls or internet interruptions. Thats why it seems like they gain XP faster because they really are not hindered by other people.
Now do I feel people should be able to solo dungeons and such for loot drops? Nope. Dungeons are where groups come into play, hence why they deserve the reward (loot and/or money). And when I talk about loot, I'm talking about something thats actually worth spending the time to get, not something that will be awesome for that level and maybe the next and then made completely useless a day later when you've leveled a third time. In games like WoW instance loot before raid level isnt really worth the effort, hence why grouping is pretty light all the way to max (raid) level. The reward just doesnt fit the time investment at all.
Sadly this is where the group and solo mentality clash. The group centric people blame the solo players for this issue, when in fact it is poor game design that has totally disregaurded the whole reason behind making grouping a viable choice before end game. You can also blame the guilds who rush to end game in the first few weeks of a games launch for this as well. These players group up and blitz the entire game so they can hit max level and then bitch about a lack of content. From here developers end up spending most of their design time and resources creating raids and high level content to keep these jokers happy, which in turn causes a lack of content control in the low/middle game.
Once that happens you end up having everyone rushing to max level because why bother with the poorly kept content in the mid/low game when all the devs resources seem to be aimed at pumping out raid content? Thats when you start seeing a game being plagued with "The real game starts at (this level)!"
So once the game becomes all about end level raiding, why bother wasting your time finding groups to level through when soloing would be a faster more viable path there? You wont have to wait for AFKers, Wont have to deal with hissy fits and wont have to sit there for hours spamming chat channels to find a group because your class isnt really a preferred class in 'Solid' group structures. Just run out, grab some quests/find a camp with fast easy spawns, throw on some music and get to work.
Well to throw a monkey wrench in your whole text wall....
My spiritmaster can solo elites in AION and gets far better xp than grouping.
In warhammer I could solo on my toons as I got far better return on xp and reknown.
In Planetside, always solo, got a lot more xp that way.
So yeah I disagree that in all games there is better rewards for grouping, thats a complete falsehood.
There are always better rewards for grouping, its not a falsehood (Most grouping mechanics allow for an XP bonus while grouped, though the true bonus is always the speed of the XP gained while grouped vs solo)
Problem is grouping involves a lot more downtime than going solo. I am not talking about downtime as in 'OOM' or healing, I am talking teh player created downtime, such as "Afk 2 min" or "Brb need to sell" or having a member drop and having to find the right class/spec replacement. Thats why you seem to get less XP while grouped and one of the major contributing factors in why many prefer to go solo. To them the BS involved with getting a group and actually getting something accomplished in a timely manor takes way more time and effort than need be.
And before you use that "I have never had that problem when grouping" line I have to call that a falsehood. Because you can ask anyone on these forums if they have ever had to wait for a group, or sit in LFG or have a group break up over a hissy fit and about 90% would agree.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
What I do not get is people's perception. If they put in group quest at the end of the game and gave some rewards for it that is good people would be happy to do it. If they put group quest all the way up through the whole game with rewards relevant for the levels of the quest people would complain.
It is all perception. Would you group up through dungeons at level 80 in World of Warcraft if your answer is yes then why not at all levels? End game is in your head. I want to play a game that focuses on slow leveling and "end game" at all levels. Each level should last a while and each level you should be trying to obtain the best gear you can get for that level. This is the exact thing you are doing now but there is an artificial wall called an expansion keeping you from the next level.
Rewards for grouping vary drastically in games, we have had people on these forums say the game they are plating gives you every thing from a penalty to a bonus. My feeling is that most games these days give you the same or less xp when you group, and that is right when you consider the problems of power levelling.
But power levelling in itself could be sorted out by an adjust of rewards for mobs and quests, solo and grouping. We could have a more harmonious system than most MMO’s seem to have currently.
We may well need different servers for those who want to group as opposed to those who want to solo, but I feel that is a bit defeatist. We need a rebalancing, more grouping but not just grouping. And that rebalancing should only occur if the proper tools are in place to group with ease. You could have a separate set of quest chains, one all solo, one all group, right up to end level. But that’s a lot of extra dev time and people tend to take the easy route, many seeing having to find a group as a problem. There is no absolute solution but there are some steps that could be taken to make MMO’s work well for more of us.
Lotro has a good combination of solo and group content. You can pretty much level to max by doing either.
I don't know why simple things are always being brought up here. Man, if you want to join or not it's up to you. Every game has an accept / deny party invitation button. Some of the advance games today even have auto decline. >.<
if you have a skill based mmo where you can play any class you want then you don't have to worry about power leveling