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Bioware is disappointing.
Autarch
Member Posts: 86
Bioware is a disappointing. Nowadays, at the very least.
Giving them credit where it's due: Their voice acting is of top quality, the combat is ( usually ) quite well designed and the graphical style of their games allows them to run on pretty much any system.
But, their plot lines are cliché and pretty much exactly the same ( the only exception was Neverwinter Nights, and that was milked to hell ), the out-of-company sequels to their games are far better than their in company ones ( and the only reason they're considered not comparable is because those companies get rushed due to not being Bioware ) and they steal concepts from other books and games, such as Dragon Age - the Darkspawn of which are a blatant rip of R. Scott Bakker's Prince of Nothing series.
All Bioware is capable of these days is repeating their same old crap sequel after sequel after new franchise. Character suffers tragedy, goes into universe / world, joins extra-special order, recruits companions, does series of pretty much linear zones interspered with "side quests", fights disappointing boss, saves day.
And, if you're expecting anything seriously different from SW:TOR, you're sadly mistaken.
Comments
It's so true, bioware sucks at storylines. It's like they take them from a book of cliché.
That's nice.
And then they brag about their storylines in interviews with crap like, "Man, our new storyline is so cool and dark and edgy and original. It has tits AND ass. ( Covered with underwear, of course. )"
At first your post sounded like an absolute whine. Its against the law to say bad stuff about bioware. But I think you're right about the stories though, they are too cliche. They are well done, but still a huge cliche. And I think kotor2's story was kind of better than kotor1's. It was more imaginative imo.
And another thing about their latest RPGs, I absolutely hate the main characters, I fucking hate Shepard, he looks and sounds like a retarded jock. And Dragon Age, elf human and dwarf, really bioware? Oh and then rogue mage and warrior? cmon...
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
I miss the akward stuff the Black Isle ppl came up with. Main hero going out of character and such. http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/Torment/image.php?image=modroncube.jpg - for example.
Heh I have to disagree about KotOR2's story being better than KotOR1's. Considering you were the "last Jedi" in KotOR2 you sure seemed to run into a bunch of them during your journey, plus all the force sensitives you encounter that you manage to train to be Jedi in an extremely short timeframe. Not to say that KotOR1's was original or anything, but I thought it was fairly well written, and had some darn good dialog and characters, like a lot of Bioware's games.
Needless to say, I disagree with the OP. No, nothing I've seen from Bioware story-wise would be what I'd call original, but I can't say I've seen anything I'd call original from any other entertainment media lately, either. I certainly don't think they're talentless. I'd like to know who he thinks does better out of curiousity.
All stories have already been told. The only thing that changes is the names.
Presentation matters. Originality only means YOU haven't heard the story before.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I agree. BioWare's stories need to be nonsensical and totally unpredictable. I want green fairies and pink elephants leading the charge!
Glad I'm not the only one who sees this. Personally I find little point playing a story-driven game where you already know how it will end, more or less.
Mind you...I'm not a fan of bioware combat systems either; having played baldurs gate, mass effect, and dragon age. I found them to be stale and repetitive.
Any combat system with a pause function must be a joke. unless its a strategy game.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
Why don't you name 2 companies that are better then?
Or maybe you havn't noticed, you only have to be better then your competition to win. This means that if everyone else is producing products well below average, you only need to produce a product that is average to be the best.
I'd say your stuck dealing more with market vs imagination across the board. Go into any investor meeting with something radical, new, and out there and they will throw hundreds of examples of failures to your handful of sucess stories. Tried, true, and tired is something a bunch of suits can get behind. Do I feel the games were unduely short and that I saw the shockers coming a mile away, on most of them yeah. On the same token though they new are owned by EA which means you gota get it passed the big guys to get it to the line. At least for now.
The sad truth is that new in todays world tends to lead to just that, people label it as edgey or innovative but to a lot of people in an economic down turn that means I may of may not like it. Most fans of fantasy games know they like fantasy, most fans of sci fi know they like that. Your also stuck in a world of a whole lot of books, media, and blogs where people are writing stories, so a lot of things are going to be similar. I realized this when I started to work on trying to a a writer, spending months on a book, only to have a friend read it and say it reminded him of some other book. Which led me to delete the whole thing and start over. At some point you have to say oh well I'm going to be cliche to someone somewhere, all I can hope to do is entertain the people who have not read or seen that thing others will say I am ripping off, and maybe do something else that will make it stand out on it's own.
Even the best speed reader couldn't read every work of fantasy, sci-fi, and fiction, after all.
I thought I was the only one. I dislike mass effect even though it was so highly regarded and I absolutely HATED dragon age. I torrented that piece of linear trash and STILL couldnt be bothered to finish it before uninstalling. Gameplay in a straight ahead tube, no thank you. If i want a story Ill rent a movie man. I game, and rpg game specifically , to explore and be immersed. Nothing immersive about being herded down a set path.
Well, to be fair, the OP is only talking about story telling, and when it comes to that, we can step outside the genre too. The competition just got larger.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
Knowing BioWare's speciality in storytelling, why'd you buy their game in the first place? I just have to ask. It's like saying, "A speeding ticket? I didn't know the Speed Limit was 55!" when you're pulled over under a Speed Limit: 55 sign.
Just saying.
Wow, a Bioware fanboi, I am amazingly surprised.
@MMO_Doubter: I always find that originality speech funny. I mean, there's being original, and then there's copying and pasting the same storyline for each and every single one of your games.
@Darth_Osor: KotOR2's original plotline was amazing, until it got cut short. You weren't the only Jedi left, you were just one of the few ones not in complete hiding.
On originality and good plotwork: Planescape : Torment as an example. You were basically an immortal guy ( you lost all your memories every time you died and came back ) and your goal within the game was to find your way back to mortality. It was a REAL adult game, as it dealt with a lot of issues on morality, philosophy and immortality whilst still being absolutely hilarious. The plotline and deconstruction of the fantasy genre was absolutely amazing and it's still considered one of the best RPGs of all time.
Bioware comparing themselves to Black Isle just makes me feel a bit ill.
I would attempt to construct an argument, but the critical and commercial success of every recent BioWare game does that for me.
I would attempt to construct an argument, but the critical and commercial success of Twilight does that for me.
EDIT:@Comnitus: So, Bioware specialise at storylines, and yet all their plotlines are the same boring crap?
Two companies that do plotlines better than Bioware: Blizzard and Black Isle back in the day. And Bethesda. And whoever the guys that did Bioshock are. Wait, that's far more than two. =D
I'm not sure what you're all expecting from Bioware. Most form of story telling is cliched at this point in our societies development. We've mostly heard it all, and more often than not newer iterations are just rehased epics. You can't necessarily blame a company for following traditional avenues that obviously please most people, and this business is all about majorities... Something an MMO player should know above all else.
You never really specified what, exactly, you wanted instead in your OP. You were too busy attacking BioWare. I agree that it's a bit cliche - I never said I didn't - but now that you've described more of what you're looking for, I say that's cool. Doesn't mean BioWare should stop what they're doing, though, because they're still pretty successful. I think the Witcher had one of the best fantasy RPG storylines, but that doesn't mean I think BioWare are a bunch of talentless hacks. Just me, I guess.
LOL.
Well played.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
last time I checked, Twilight got raped critically. http://uk.rottentomatoes.com/m/twilight_saga_new_moon/
not an apt comparison.
BW have commercial AND critical success, so calling them talentless is completely illogical.
I played final fantasy 7. It had a good story and nice open world. Probably in the top 5 best rpg's of all time. I played final fantasy 13. Linear piece of crap. See how Im showing that what a company did in the past doesnt necesarily mean its what they do now?
also , was pretty sure i said in my post that I torrented it. had to doublecheck. I wopulda been PISSED if I had dropped 60 bucks on it!
The movies did, the books seem to have a pretty avid following.
Also, to be perfectly honest, 90% of video game reviewers don't have a clue what they're talking about.