Man, MMO Doubter, how many times have people attacked you based on your name? I think I've seen it happen a good half-dozen times at least.
I am curious about your thoughts regarding alternatives to gear-based systems. I do think a lot of MMOs have too much of a focus on gear (or perhaps they just make getting gear too difficult instead of providing other activities).
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
Man, MMO Doubter, how many times have people attacked you based on your name? I think I've seen it happen a good half-dozen times at least.
LOL. You have no idea.
I am curious about your thoughts regarding alternatives to gear-based systems. I do think a lot of MMOs have too much of a focus on gear (or perhaps they just make getting gear too difficult instead of providing other activities).
Well, I am in favour of something like the achievements in WoW and the 'brags' and Tome of Knowledge in WH Online. I would be a big fan of WoW's achievements - IF they had been tied to some actual character improvement, whether new abilities or stat boosts. I would have been all over those achievements - IF they had not just been a waste of time.
In the latter, you can list ten entries from your Tome of Knowledge on a page that others can view (like the similar option in WoW). Listing the top dungeons you have cleared is cool, as well as some good PvP accomplishments.
I'd like something that involves re-filling the lower level areas - like a gear set for which you get one piece for each alt you level to maximum.
Another thing you could do is - alt stones. Gain a transferrable (within account) one-shot item which gives a permanent stat boost at every 10 levels. You could beef up your main with them, as one use.
I am also a big fan of expendable items as top-end rewards. Gain an UBER sword that is unique, has low durability, and cannot be repaired - so you have to choose when you use it. That makes it special. You could have locations like an entry point to a special dungeon that can only be opened by sacrificing that special piece of gear.
I could probably come up with 1/2 a dozen forms of alternate progression rather than just grinding the current highest dungeon for loot.
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
Thanks for that, but you're putting a target on your own back.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
ToR is not Star Wars - MMO_Doubter
Opinion, well thought-out? I'm sure he is the same guy that told me Star Wars was all space, no planets. I'm not bashing him, but I rarely see anything come from him that actually makes any sense.
It's not Star Wars to anyone who doesn't know TOR - which is most Star Wars fans, who only know the movies. You can bet there are going to be a lot of players wondering where Han, Chewy, Luke, Leiea, and Vader are.
Opinion, well thought-out? I'm sure he is the same guy that told me Star Wars was all space, no planets.
I never said that. I said it's not Star Wars without space battles. They are a vital aspect of Star Wars, but I am worried that SWTOR might not even have space combat.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
It's not Star Wars to anyone who doesn't know TOR - which is most Star Wars fans, who only know the movies. You can bet there are going to be a lot of players wondering where Han, Chewy, Luke, Leiea, and Vader are.
No. You have said multiple times that ToR and KOTOR are not Star Wars, you said this as a personal opinion. You were not speaking for anyone else. Not once did I see Han Solo in the newer films, was that not Star Wars either?
Opinion, well thought-out? I'm sure he is the same guy that told me Star Wars was all space, no planets.
I never said that. I said it's not Star Wars without space battles. They are a vital aspect of Star Wars, but I am worried that SWTOR might not even have space combat.
Again, no. I asked the question "then what does star wars look like" this was commenting on the planets, the person I was speaking to said it didn't look like star wars, this person was refering to many of the planets (apparantly since that's all that is revealed). YOU then tell me a star field. Not once did you touch on the planets.
No. You have said multiple times that ToR and KOTOR are not Star Wars, you said this as a personal opinion. You were not speaking for anyone else. Not once did I see Han Solo in the newer films, was that not Star Wars either?
Ah, but Obi-Wan, C3P0, R2D2, the Emperor, and Darth Vader were in them.
Not to mention the nice tie-in at the end of RotS, which is set in the same ship from the opening of Star Wars. That was sweet.
Again, no. I asked the question "then what does star wars look like" this was commenting on the planets, the person I was speaking to said it didn't look like star wars, this person was refering to many of the planets (apparantly since that's all that is revealed). YOU then tell me a star field. Not once did you touch on the planets.
Right. I mentioned the important aspect which everyone else was ignoring - space battles.
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
ToR is not Star Wars - MMO_Doubter
Opinion, well thought-out? I'm sure he is the same guy that told me Star Wars was all space, no planets. I'm not bashing him, but I rarely see anything come from him that actually makes any sense.
I looked at that link you gave. I think you are taking Doubter too literally at times. He has used both hyperbole and irony to make his points in the past, and the link you gave is an example of the former, imhoI read his space comment as him emphasizing that ToR seems like lack that important Star Wars element. I think we all agree that it is possible ToR will come out without space combat that players participate in. It's not unreasonable for someone to feel that ToR is missing an essential element if it doesn't have this. You might not feel the same way, and I know I don't feel the same way (I am ok if space comes later), but that doesn't mean other stances on the matter aren't reasonable.
There are enough real trolls on the forum, we don't need to act like there are more. Talking to Doubter about his concerns and viewpoint and understanding his position is more productive than trying to argue over turns of phrase.
No. You have said multiple times that ToR and KOTOR are not Star Wars, you said this as a personal opinion. You were not speaking for anyone else. Not once did I see Han Solo in the newer films, was that not Star Wars either?
Ah, but Obi-Wan, C3P0, R2D2, the Emperor, and Darth Vader were in them.
Not to mention the nice tie-in at the end of RotS, which is set in the same ship from the opening of Star Wars. That was sweet.
The point of the post above was the highlight that the latest 3 films were before the originals in timeline. SWTOR is no different, it is still Star Wars, star wars was not only defined by the characters you encountered in it, but the environment, the war, origins and many, many other things. Do you know what ToR is? How about KoTOR. Apparently you're here, so you certainly understand ToR is Star Wars.
Again, no. I asked the question "then what does star wars look like" this was commenting on the planets, the person I was speaking to said it didn't look like star wars, this person was refering to many of the planets (apparantly since that's all that is revealed). YOU then tell me a star field. Not once did you touch on the planets.
Right. I mentioned the important aspect which everyone else was ignoring - space battles.
I can jump on mspaint, select black, dump it onto the screen and select white while using a fine circular brush to paint in stars, I'll select orange and brush in some explosions and paint in some ships, does that help any? What are you expecting space to look like other then space? I don't recall space in Star Wars being pink with unicorns doing barrel rolls (just gave SoE ideas). Space will look like space.
Now what was being talked about, planets, is what you should comment on. Does the planets seem to capture that Star Wars feel? Or should they get pointers from SoE and make planets that maybe took a day to go around randomly hightening and lowering the terrain? The planets are not bland, they're very well done. Not all of the planets look "cheery", some do, which is no different then the Movies.
Man, MMO Doubter, how many times have people attacked you based on your name? I think I've seen it happen a good half-dozen times at least.
LOL. You have no idea.
I am curious about your thoughts regarding alternatives to gear-based systems. I do think a lot of MMOs have too much of a focus on gear (or perhaps they just make getting gear too difficult instead of providing other activities).
Well, I am in favour of something like the achievements in WoW and the 'brags' and Tome of Knowledge in WH Online. I would be a big fan of WoW's achievements - IF they had been tied to some actual character improvement, whether new abilities or stat boosts. I would have been all over those achievements - IF they had not just been a waste of time.
In the latter, you can list ten entries from your Tome of Knowledge on a page that others can view (like the similar option in WoW). Listing the top dungeons you have cleared is cool, as well as some good PvP accomplishments.
I'd like something that involves re-filling the lower level areas - like a gear set for which you get one piece for each alt you level to maximum.
Another thing you could do is - alt stones. Gain a transferrable (within account) one-shot item which gives a permanent stat boost at every 10 levels. You could beef up your main with them, as one use.
I am also a big fan of expendable items as top-end rewards. Gain an UBER sword that is unique, has low durability, and cannot be repaired - so you have to choose when you use it. That makes it special. You could have locations like an entry point to a special dungeon that can only be opened by sacrificing that special piece of gear.
I could probably come up with 1/2 a dozen forms of alternate progression rather than just grinding the current highest dungeon for loot.
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
Thanks for that, but you're putting a target on your own back.
Heh, that achievement idea sounds pretty cool. It certainly explains how Luke becomes so awesome in the books.
I don't know of anything more definitive than that. Maybe Greed does though.
This does not give me reason to be optimistic:
"Walton's explanation of the retention backlash SWG received over Jump To Lightspeed makes us confident that if space combat is in the game, it will be in at launch"
That's a roundabout way of saying that space combat might never be in the game.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
actually bioware stated that they will not reveal anything until it is 100% finished...so it may be in game cause otherwise they would have just said No.
Man, MMO Doubter, how many times have people attacked you based on your name? I think I've seen it happen a good half-dozen times at least.
I am curious about your thoughts regarding alternatives to gear-based systems. I do think a lot of MMOs have too much of a focus on gear (or perhaps they just make getting gear too difficult instead of providing other activities).
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
I agree. Even though we disagree 95% of the time, he has an interesting perspective on the state of things.
Lets go over some key points we can surmise by going to the Old Republic Forums and reading the Dev Blog.
1: Gear Based.
2: Themepark.
3: Easy PVE content.
4: Carebear PVP content.
5: Lore will get tossed aside for end game Progression.
6: Crafting will be bad or non existant.
7: Class balance is going to be laughable.
Thats just a few but honestly other than being Star Wars, what will the game offer that WOTLK doesn't already have?
A themepark with no crafting, bad class balance issues, Over the top progression loot and Burst issues, Soft or easy Raid content and bad PVP balance. ITs not just going to be a themepark the PVE and PVP content will be laugable.
I mean can you think of a reason OTHER than it being Star Wars to play this game?
I have been on the Forums over there since 08 and the only meaningful Dev posts are a interview reassuring Ensidia the game will have heavy raid content, and some blog posts about how exited they are over the loot drops, and if you watch any of the videos, the combat looks a rediculously one deminsional auto attack system.
1. yes it is gear based but people like gear based games, look at wow and other successful games.
2. no it is not completely themepark, they have stated time and time again this game is a mix of themepark and sandbox, if you want to explore and adventure and find things you can, you just wont see the story that they have planeed.
3. nowhere do they say the pve content is easy, matter of fact they have stated time and time again they are attempting to make the pve content challenging and engaging so you feel like a hero.
4. not enough information to go on there, they havent stated what pvp will be like, pretty sure its not ffa full loot pvp though, so if that is what you mean by carebear i guess it is, i call that good game design.
5. once again an outright lie, they have stated the story will mean more than anything else in this game and they story will be incorporated into the endgame content.
6. the community dev dispatch from a few weeks ago talked a little about crafting and it basically said they want to make crafting so where you can be famous just for being a good crafter, dont know how that means boring or nonexistant.
7. another lie, bioware has stated time and time again that their classes will be balanced and balance is one of the things they are striving to get right, only time will tell if they do get it right, but they are trying.
as for what the game will offer that wow doesnt, great storylines, full voice over for every class and npc in the game, way more content than wow, unique storylines for every character, not just going to the barrens for each and every character you create, more zones and more worlds, fun heroic combat, cinematic combat not just swing your weapon and hit or miss based on some behind the scenes die rolls and the character never even act like they got hit, animated facial features, more than just raid or pvp endgame. if that isnt enough for you then i guess you shouldnt play this game, but it will be much different from wow.
Lets go over some key points we can surmise by going to the Old Republic Forums and reading the Dev Blog.
1: Gear Based.
2: Themepark.
3: Easy PVE content.
4: Carebear PVP content.
5: Lore will get tossed aside for end game Progression.
6: Crafting will be bad or non existant.
7: Class balance is going to be laughable.
Thats just a few but honestly other than being Star Wars, what will the game offer that WOTLK doesn't already have?
A themepark with no crafting, bad class balance issues, Over the top progression loot and Burst issues, Soft or easy Raid content and bad PVP balance. ITs not just going to be a themepark the PVE and PVP content will be laugable.
I mean can you think of a reason OTHER than it being Star Wars to play this game?
I have been on the Forums over there since 08 and the only meaningful Dev posts are a interview reassuring Ensidia the game will have heavy raid content, and some blog posts about how exited they are over the loot drops, and if you watch any of the videos, the combat looks a rediculously one deminsional auto attack system.
Yeah if thats all your seeing with this game then plz dont play the game, I dont want to be hearing this crap in global all day everytime you feel like giving a sermon on your soapbox. If you cant find something worth playing in the game then its not for you, so please stop trying to justify your dislikes by using shallow labels and applying them to game features which some havent even been released or talked about publicly in depth yet like crafting. If you are asking "why play TOR?" then how about asking yourself "why do I even care?".
Lets go over some key points we can surmise by going to the Old Republic Forums and reading the Dev Blog.
1: Gear Based.
2: Themepark.
3: Easy PVE content.
4: Carebear PVP content.
5: Lore will get tossed aside for end game Progression.
6: Crafting will be bad or non existant.
7: Class balance is going to be laughable.
Thats just a few but honestly other than being Star Wars, what will the game offer that WOTLK doesn't already have?
A themepark with no crafting, bad class balance issues, Over the top progression loot and Burst issues, Soft or easy Raid content and bad PVP balance. ITs not just going to be a themepark the PVE and PVP content will be laugable.
I mean can you think of a reason OTHER than it being Star Wars to play this game?
I have been on the Forums over there since 08 and the only meaningful Dev posts are a interview reassuring Ensidia the game will have heavy raid content, and some blog posts about how exited they are over the loot drops, and if you watch any of the videos, the combat looks a rediculously one deminsional auto attack system.
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
Lets go over some key points we can surmise by going to the Old Republic Forums and reading the Dev Blog.
1: Gear Based.
2: Themepark.
3: Easy PVE content.
4: Carebear PVP content.
5: Lore will get tossed aside for end game Progression.
6: Crafting will be bad or non existant.
7: Class balance is going to be laughable.
Thats just a few but honestly other than being Star Wars, what will the game offer that WOTLK doesn't already have?
A themepark with no crafting, bad class balance issues, Over the top progression loot and Burst issues, Soft or easy Raid content and bad PVP balance. ITs not just going to be a themepark the PVE and PVP content will be laugable.
I mean can you think of a reason OTHER than it being Star Wars to play this game?
I have been on the Forums over there since 08 and the only meaningful Dev posts are a interview reassuring Ensidia the game will have heavy raid content, and some blog posts about how exited they are over the loot drops, and if you watch any of the videos, the combat looks a rediculously one deminsional auto attack system.
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
not every game will be made for every player. Some look forward towards games, others do not.
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
Dude, this is probably the WRONG game to play for PVP.
Originally posted by Wharg0ul Originally posted by Faelsun
Originally posted by Maverz290
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said. I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol. Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs. And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite. Dude, this is probably the WRONG game to play for PVP. Just sayin'.
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
Exactly what video were you watching? Did you get a special edition video just for you, that showed every aspect of pvp combat? Apparently we didn't watch the same video, because I didn't see how the pvp was fail. Would you care to explain to me in detail how this combat system is indeed fail? And if it is indeed fail, what are we comparing this to that is a success in terms of pvp?
You can't just say this is fail, fail compared to what? Fail compared to an fps twitched base game? Yeah I agree, you're never going to get the same pvp experience in an mmo, like you will with U3.
Fail compared to full loot pvp games? They both share the same aspects to be perfectly honest, both games are gear based, and everyone is a cookie cutter skill wise to be competitive in pvp, so having classes = fail? Not sure how you could draw that conclusion.
Fail compared to fighting games? Sure I mean its a fighting game, its suppose to be pvp only.
Fail compared to wow arenas? Have you played in the world wow competitions? Because clearly really pvps should be dominating that and winning all the money, but...clearly they aren't by your logic. So real pvpers have a sense of honor, and dignity that they won't play wow pvp even for a boatload of cash and fame? Give me a break.
So what makes this game fail? As far as I've seen with videos it has the same basic gameplay of any other mmo, minus how rogues play, and how healing works. We do not know how healing works so I can't judge nor can you if this pvp is going to be good. Unless you have some sort of press access, we saw the same video, so where are you basing your claims from?
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
Exactly what video were you watching? Did you get a special edition video just for you, that showed every aspect of pvp combat? Apparently we didn't watch the same video, because I didn't see how the pvp was fail. Would you care to explain to me in detail how this combat system is indeed fail? And if it is indeed fail, what are we comparing this to that is a success in terms of pvp?
You can't just say this is fail, fail compared to what? Fail compared to an fps twitched base game? Yeah I agree, you're never going to get the same pvp experience in an mmo, like you will with U3.
Fail compared to full loot pvp games? They both share the same aspects to be perfectly honest, both games are gear based, and everyone is a cookie cutter skill wise to be competitive in pvp, so having classes = fail? Not sure how you could draw that conclusion.
Fail compared to fighting games? Sure I mean its a fighting game, its suppose to be pvp only.
Fail compared to wow arenas? Have you played in the world wow competitions? Because clearly really pvps should be dominating that and winning all the money, but...clearly they aren't by your logic. So real pvpers have a sense of honor, and dignity that they won't play wow pvp even for a boatload of cash and fame? Give me a break.
So what makes this game fail? As far as I've seen with videos it has the same basic gameplay of any other mmo, minus how rogues play, and how healing works. We do not know how healing works so I can't judge nor can you if this pvp is going to be good. Unless you have some sort of press access, we saw the same video, so where are you basing your claims from?
That he thinks the combat video was a PvP video should speak volumes. No one knows what PvP will be like and his points are always shallow and he doesn't seem to be able to back them up. At least in other threads over the combat video you had mostly honest points about what they were actually seeing, but instead he knocks it over PvP that no one has seen extensive footage of yet. He doesn't have any real reason why the PvP is "fail" he's just trolling.
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
Dude, this is probably the WRONG game to play for PVP.
Just sayin'.
Indeed.
Darkfail -------->
You dont understand the pvp on TOR is going to be so bad there wont be a viable reason to leave WOW. Lets face it with their 1v1 class balancing they are doing there wont be a holy trinity raiding system, so that will leave raiders out, there wont be a decent pvp system, WOWs is probably better lol. So there is not reason to not just play Cataclysm.
You dont understand the pvp on TOR is going to be so bad there wont be a viable reason to leave WOW. Lets face it with their 1v1 class balancing they are doing there wont be a holy trinity raiding system, so that will leave raiders out, there wont be a decent pvp system, WOWs is probably better lol. So there is not reason to not just play Cataclysm.
For what a story? right.
You don't understand people like and look forward to different things for different reasons. Secondly you don't understand some of us don't play WOW. I didn't spend the last 6 years playing WOW, I spent about 2 weeks playing it into the 50's in 04' that's about it. Reason being WOW's lore, world and art style didn't appeal to my taste. TOR does...
Im not interested in TOR due to PVP I'm interested for a few reasons, number one I'm a Star Wars fan, number two I love biowares story telling style, number three, the combat looks unique in how they are handling animations and abilities and most of all I loved KOTOR. I see no reason why I shouldn't be interested considering all of this.
Edit: Care to explain in depth what you mean by "TOR is going to be so bad there wont be a viable reason to leave WOW. Lets face it with their 1v1 class balancing they are doing there wont be a holy trinity raiding system, so that will leave raiders out, there wont be a decent pvp system, WOWs is probably better lol. So there is not reason to not just play Cataclysm." ?
Seriously none of this has been spoken of in any informative manner outside of "we will have it". Give it a rest you have nothing, absolutely nothing to back up anything you're saying here, outside of hyperbole and naysaying you have no ground to stand on. Give it up.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Comments
Man, MMO Doubter, how many times have people attacked you based on your name? I think I've seen it happen a good half-dozen times at least.
I am curious about your thoughts regarding alternatives to gear-based systems. I do think a lot of MMOs have too much of a focus on gear (or perhaps they just make getting gear too difficult instead of providing other activities).
And for those not familiar with Doubter, he does have well thought-out opinions, reasonable wants, and understandable concerns.
Thanks for that, but you're putting a target on your own back.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
ToR is not Star Wars - MMO_Doubter
Opinion, well thought-out? I'm sure he is the same guy that told me Star Wars was all space, no planets. I'm not bashing him, but I rarely see anything come from him that actually makes any sense.
I never said that. I said it's not Star Wars without space battles. They are a vital aspect of Star Wars, but I am worried that SWTOR might not even have space combat.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I looked at that link you gave. I think you are taking Doubter too literally at times. He has used both hyperbole and irony to make his points in the past, and the link you gave is an example of the former, imhoI read his space comment as him emphasizing that ToR seems like lack that important Star Wars element. I think we all agree that it is possible ToR will come out without space combat that players participate in. It's not unreasonable for someone to feel that ToR is missing an essential element if it doesn't have this. You might not feel the same way, and I know I don't feel the same way (I am ok if space comes later), but that doesn't mean other stances on the matter aren't reasonable.
There are enough real trolls on the forum, we don't need to act like there are more. Talking to Doubter about his concerns and viewpoint and understanding his position is more productive than trying to argue over turns of phrase.
Darth Hater had something about it. I don't really consider it highly confirmed though. It's a bit speculative. Here's the article:
http://darthhater.com/2010/04/15/speculation-retention-as-it-relates-to-star-wars-the-old-republic/
I don't know of anything more definitive than that. Maybe Greed does though.
Heh, that achievement idea sounds pretty cool. It certainly explains how Luke becomes so awesome in the books.
This does not give me reason to be optimistic:
"Walton's explanation of the retention backlash SWG received over Jump To Lightspeed makes us confident that if space combat is in the game, it will be in at launch"
That's a roundabout way of saying that space combat might never be in the game.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
actually bioware stated that they will not reveal anything until it is 100% finished...so it may be in game cause otherwise they would have just said No.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Yeah if thats all your seeing with this game then plz dont play the game, I dont want to be hearing this crap in global all day everytime you feel like giving a sermon on your soapbox. If you cant find something worth playing in the game then its not for you, so please stop trying to justify your dislikes by using shallow labels and applying them to game features which some havent even been released or talked about publicly in depth yet like crafting. If you are asking "why play TOR?" then how about asking yourself "why do I even care?".
HEAVEN OR HELL
Duel 1
Lets ROCK!
Story focused. Enough said. There is no story focused MMORPG on the market. This will be the first one.
What he said.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
not every game will be made for every player. Some look forward towards games, others do not.
Dude, this is probably the WRONG game to play for PVP.
Just sayin'.
I feel that the story side of things will amplify everything you do. Only thing better than doing PvP or a PvE area, is when it actually feels like it matters. Maybe we'll all be brainwashed into violently fighting for the Republic and Sith factions by the time this comes out lol.
Except I just saw the PVP video and it's as FAIL as I thought it would be. No one who pvps seriously is going to waste money on this garbage. They might as well do all PVE servers if this is what they intend to release. So the story better be pretty good becuase the PVE is going to have to be fantastic to make up for the terrible pvp mechanics. Story cannot make up for a bad game, if the PVE and PVP suck and the game is easy then it will last as long as the story does, two months and then the subs will fall off and you will just be another big IP that had a failed release and is down to 200k subs.
And there are plety of mmorpg that had compelling stories the only difference this time is TOR is saying, were the first mmorpg to have a story, and people actually believe it, but WOW kids are easy to market to. Just say WOW light minus the mayo and they always bite.
Dude, this is probably the WRONG game to play for PVP.
Just sayin'.
Indeed.
Darkfail -------->
Alltern8 Blog | Star Wars Space Combat and The Old Republic | Cryptic Studios - A Pre Post-Mortem | Klingon Preview, STO's Monster Play
Exactly what video were you watching? Did you get a special edition video just for you, that showed every aspect of pvp combat? Apparently we didn't watch the same video, because I didn't see how the pvp was fail. Would you care to explain to me in detail how this combat system is indeed fail? And if it is indeed fail, what are we comparing this to that is a success in terms of pvp?
You can't just say this is fail, fail compared to what? Fail compared to an fps twitched base game? Yeah I agree, you're never going to get the same pvp experience in an mmo, like you will with U3.
Fail compared to full loot pvp games? They both share the same aspects to be perfectly honest, both games are gear based, and everyone is a cookie cutter skill wise to be competitive in pvp, so having classes = fail? Not sure how you could draw that conclusion.
Fail compared to fighting games? Sure I mean its a fighting game, its suppose to be pvp only.
Fail compared to wow arenas? Have you played in the world wow competitions? Because clearly really pvps should be dominating that and winning all the money, but...clearly they aren't by your logic. So real pvpers have a sense of honor, and dignity that they won't play wow pvp even for a boatload of cash and fame? Give me a break.
So what makes this game fail? As far as I've seen with videos it has the same basic gameplay of any other mmo, minus how rogues play, and how healing works. We do not know how healing works so I can't judge nor can you if this pvp is going to be good. Unless you have some sort of press access, we saw the same video, so where are you basing your claims from?
That he thinks the combat video was a PvP video should speak volumes. No one knows what PvP will be like and his points are always shallow and he doesn't seem to be able to back them up. At least in other threads over the combat video you had mostly honest points about what they were actually seeing, but instead he knocks it over PvP that no one has seen extensive footage of yet. He doesn't have any real reason why the PvP is "fail" he's just trolling.
You dont understand the pvp on TOR is going to be so bad there wont be a viable reason to leave WOW. Lets face it with their 1v1 class balancing they are doing there wont be a holy trinity raiding system, so that will leave raiders out, there wont be a decent pvp system, WOWs is probably better lol. So there is not reason to not just play Cataclysm.
For what a story? right.
You don't understand people like and look forward to different things for different reasons. Secondly you don't understand some of us don't play WOW. I didn't spend the last 6 years playing WOW, I spent about 2 weeks playing it into the 50's in 04' that's about it. Reason being WOW's lore, world and art style didn't appeal to my taste. TOR does...
Im not interested in TOR due to PVP I'm interested for a few reasons, number one I'm a Star Wars fan, number two I love biowares story telling style, number three, the combat looks unique in how they are handling animations and abilities and most of all I loved KOTOR. I see no reason why I shouldn't be interested considering all of this.
Edit: Care to explain in depth what you mean by "TOR is going to be so bad there wont be a viable reason to leave WOW. Lets face it with their 1v1 class balancing they are doing there wont be a holy trinity raiding system, so that will leave raiders out, there wont be a decent pvp system, WOWs is probably better lol. So there is not reason to not just play Cataclysm." ?
Seriously none of this has been spoken of in any informative manner outside of "we will have it". Give it a rest you have nothing, absolutely nothing to back up anything you're saying here, outside of hyperbole and naysaying you have no ground to stand on. Give it up.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson