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Should 'Gay' Be Banned in Game?
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^^HAHAH^^
Though I am a vocal supporter of LGTBQ rights, I think dealing with people being offended about language in MMOs is a waste of GMs time. If you are homophobic or offensive I will 1. ignore you 2. not team with you and 3. kick you from or leave a guild that you are in. In other words, I already have the tools to deal with this on my own and my solutions don't take GM time that could be used to resolve real bugs or run community content.
But I agree that most often these words are not used out of overt homophobia. More a subconscious bigotry, I am guessing often by people that voice support for LGBTQ persons. I have many times asked people nicely to use words other than 'gay', 'fag' or 'rape' (usually in guilds sometimes in PUGs) and 90% of the time they said something to the effect of "ya, you're right, I shouldn't be insensitive. never know who is on." And they can think of other words.
"Never met a pack of humans that were any different. Look at the idiots that get elected every couple of years. You really consider those guys more mature than us? The only difference between us and them is, when they gank some noobs and take their stuff, the noobs actually die." - Madimorga
You are an ignorant bigot ....you don't even know the difference between a homosexual and a paedophile .Seriously you should try get an education before you partake in adult discussion .
"after the time of dice came the day of mice "
Is it ignorance or idiocy. I don't know.
When someone says "people who are gay don't need to talk about themselves in game."
Right so when you listen to general game chat or join a group and people are talking about their girlfriend or the NPCs big boobs or some female pron star in the news or some sexual joke can you just tell them not to bring the heterosexual talk into the game. The fact is that sexuality is woven into a lot of what people talk about, and by default its usually heterosexual since that's about 80 to 90 percent of the gamer population. If a game is rated teen, why not keep all explicit talk out of the game?
When someone says "kids don't need to know that two people of the same gender can be in a relationship."
Uh if a kid can watch tv and see two cartoon characters kissing, or even two adults kissing in a sitcom, I think they're old enough to know that two people of the same gender can kiss too. How can someone shield their kids from that? That's like back in the old Old days when parents shielded their teenagers from any talk about sex, and the daughter would get married and be terrified on the honeymoon because she had never learned anything about details of sex. Or worse, shielding your teenagers from any talk of sexuality or sex and they go catch a deadly std or get pregnant at 14. I think a teenager is far old enough to know that sometimes two people of the same gender can be attracted to each other.
When someone says "i don't want any of my teens or children to know that gay people exist."
Uh you're crazy. These are usually the people that kick their kid out onto the street if they happen to be gay, or send the kid involuntarily to correction therapy to try to "cure" them (which doesn't work). These parents don't care about the thousands of suicides and attempted suicides each year of kids who think they are gay but are flooded with the negative stereotypes and homophobia daily, often from their own parents. These kids have no support or information on what they are going through because some parts of society have problems showing that "Hey, gay people exist! They have relationships, they have kids, they raise families!" These parents are sad, pathetic, shameful. But the good side is things are changing.
Your totally missing the point .This thread isn't about sexual preferences at all . Its about using words that are offencive .For example would you use the N word to describe a black person ? Would you find that acceptable in a game chat ? Because its exactly the same thing .
Incidently explicit chat in open chat channels already warrents a ban or suspension in most mmos so your not even right on that level .
I do take your meaning about political correctness though . I don't agree with that but theres a huge difference between that and what we are talking about .
I don't??... thanks for clearing that up with me... I was losing sleep over it.
An ignorant bigot too? I think my friends that enjoy that lifestyle would differ...
That would probably be way too much for you to wrap your head around though right? You obviously missed the whole point of my post which honestly doesn't surprise me!
Good job.
lol yep, biggest "in your face" I can think of
Okay I missed your point ...I read your post again and I still don't see a different point ...
Care to explain ?
"after the time of dice came the day of mice "
I've worked in child abuse as a social worker and then an attorney for over a decade. Being gay has absolutely nothing to do with being a pedophile. That is a myth made up by closeted knuckle-dragging australopithecines that don't believe in evolution but still believe in santa claus.
"Never met a pack of humans that were any different. Look at the idiots that get elected every couple of years. You really consider those guys more mature than us? The only difference between us and them is, when they gank some noobs and take their stuff, the noobs actually die." - Madimorga
Should you ban the word gay from being used in a MMO?
No. I really don't see why you would want to. If you feel someone is making fun of you, you can block them and/or report them to a GM for abuse. There are people that use the word gay as a insult, there are people that use the word stupid as an insult, doesn't mean you should ban the word stupid, if someone is insulting, deal with the person, don't be passive aggressive and ban the language.
And if you don't want to expose children to "teh ghey" then don't let them go on the internet nor talk to other people at all so you can shelter them as much as possible, if you want to be a super conservative protective parent then use some common sense.
There is no reason to prevent intelligent and mature people from using a word because some people are hybersensitive.
All men think they're fascinating. In my case, it's justified
What does that have to do with it?
If a gay person wants to share that with his peers, that is a legitimate reason to use the word "gay", without any connotations involved.
I know severel gay people who have no trouble whatsoever telling others about that if they' happen to be discussing what they like / don't like in others (which happens pretty often).
And please, I know I never grew up believing birds flew in the babies, being a doctors son, I pretty much knew the terms from the moment I heard them, which was pretty dang early and if I may say so, I didn't grow up to be different than others; same deal with all the little farmer boys who kept their eyes open when walking around on the property.
All this 'angst' to prevent kids from knowing how it works does more bad than good in these times.
If they have to ban it, let them do so because of its use as a deragotary term by some nitwits, not because of what it means.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
I don't think they should ban it but when either the word "gay" or the f word are used maybe right under the player who say's it's chat message they just also include said person's email address? and while it sounds funny it actually could work out let's say I have a friend in game and during conversation I say "yes I met Tina in real life but we aren't going to go out because she's gay" well obviously that friend won't feel a need to confront me because it was during conversation but of course for the teens and other ignorant people who throw that word around to demean they will think twice about using that kind of language when ranting about getting pwnd.
I obviously say this half in gest but I think it is one real way to condem all the racisim and separatism that still exists in this country and world. It's pretty detestable how in this information age it is so easy to spit this kind of vitriol with no fear of consequence. Equal rights will never be achieved as long as we are unable to confront our accusers.
Nicely stated Spanky and your comments show me that one day we may all frolic in merriment and be gay together haha!!!!!!!!!
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Hmmm whenever I see someone use that word in an MMO, 9 times out of 10 it's meant as a derogatory remark.
ie). "That's Gay" (implying something sucks)
Now, looks at these examples, which are meant to convey the same expression of something sucking:
"Dude, That's Female"
"Wow, that was totally Hispanic"
"OMG, you are such an Asian"
As insane as those examples are, if someone were to actually same them in common speech...most of us would think them ignorant trash. I mean, No one really has a choice about being Female, or Hispanic, or Asain, etc.
However, even though using the word Gay should involke the same response, it seems to be more tolerated. I am not a gay man, so I cannot speak from experience, but I think being gay, like any other inherent trait, is not something you have a choice about.
For example, I find women attractive. I don't really know why, I just do. In that same spirit, I cannot look at a man in the same way...It simply does nothing for me. I mean, I think you are either gay or you are not. It's not a choice. Sure, you can choose to not act on the impulse, but that's like asking a bird not to chip.
That said, ridiculing someone for something about themselves that they can do nothing to change is the height of ignorant.
Now, in the world of MMORPGs, where idiots are shouting all over global chat how 'Gay' something is...I can imagine that SOMEONE reading that chat is Gay...statistically, it has to happen. I imagine that they might be offended, if not right away, then over time.
So they quit the game. That's money lost for the developer. Maybe they sue the developer for allowing such language to be used, thats a LOT of money lost....and bad PR.
Simple solution, prohibit the word "Gay". That means the Ignorant idiots will have to find another explicative to use, and the gay player who wishes to express his/her preference will have to do so in more than one word. It's not a 100% perfect solution. But until the world is 100% perfect, there will be no such thing,
Anyway, Unless you are gay or talking about someone who actually is, why else does one need to use this word in the common language (no one says gay to express happiness anymore, so don't even go there).
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone
www.spankybus.com
-3d Artist & Compositor
-Writer
-Professional Amature
Dude having gay friends doesn't mean you aren't homophobic. lol Haven't you heard the old story of the racist that says "I'm not racist, some of my best friends are blacks." It's not how you treat your gay friends, its how you treat the gay people who aren't your friends.
And you seem to think that being more relaxed about gay people in a game means that there will be more pedophiles. That would be homophobic because most pedophiles label themselves as straight anyway. By the way it's kind of funny that they don't talk too much about all the thousands of girls that were molested by priests in the catholic church. And girls don't even spend as much time as boys around the catholic priests.
Why should a straight teen be allowed to talk about his girls, his girlfriend, whatever. But a gay teen can't talk about his life? And you want to link who a gay teen is to pedophilia? You, that would be ignorant bigot.
Well said. +1
"Never met a pack of humans that were any different. Look at the idiots that get elected every couple of years. You really consider those guys more mature than us? The only difference between us and them is, when they gank some noobs and take their stuff, the noobs actually die." - Madimorga
Sorry Spanky, but this is where I chime in with some South Park wisdom and tell you that "it's either all ok to say, or nothing is".
The word "Jew" is also used all over the place in the same derogatory fashion, and it's not likely to end up censored either. I don't even think you should have to be Jewish to be able to say it, unlike being black and using the N-word, but being 1/32nd Jew myself, maybe I'll choose to blow it out of proportion the next time I hear it.
"you can't use that word! Only [we] can use that word!"
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Word only have the power we give them. Words in themselves have no meaning, we give them the meaning. To illustrate this take the word "gay" it meant happy in the 1930's, now it means homosexual.
Gay is not an insult in itself unless you think that there is something wrong with being homosexual.
So if someone uses the term gay as an insult then it is up to the individual concerned to take it as an insult or not.
A couple of reasons why this is a pointless argument.
1. Games are privately owned. They follow the rulers set down by the game companies Terms of Service. They are not a public forum, and have no legal reason to be forced to allow people complete freedom of speech.
2. Groups like GLAAD's overzealous knee-jerk reactions are just as much to blame for making the word gay verboten as when it is used by insensitive or bigoted morons. Anyone remember the pissy pants furor over the movie 'Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back'? Or the pointless bullsh*t (and probably hoped for) outrage over Eminem's comments and lyrics that ended up being surprisingly defused by none other than the (annoying prima donna) gay icon Sir Elton John. Freedom of speech is a double edged sword. Until you are willing to allow another individual to freely talk about something you hate, you have invalidated any right for others to respect your own opinions.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
I agree 100 %
I think in this case Manjunk was using some kind of reverse logic as you pointed out
But for many people they don't know or understand the difference but base there blatant homophobia and bigotry on this
"australopithecines"..brilliant word...make me laugh (I had to lookup the meaning
)
"after the time of dice came the day of mice "
I don't give a **** what you want to talk about in game. It doesn't bother me... what does bother me is when people make a f'ing problem out of nothing. You have all these protesters coming out of the woodwork saying how wrong this is... and they pretty much demand retribution. I personally think that is beyond retarded.
Should you be banned? Of course not.
Should you be censored? Of course not.
Should you change your lifestyle? Of course not.
Should you stop beating the dead horse? Yes.
There is nothing to be gained out of this. Nothing.
That is my point!
There a re a few problems with your statement the first one is that people who are homosexual rarely if ever throw around phrases like "that is so gay" and that is by and large, wait that is the only context I have ever seen the word used in a mmo. These are not openly gay people these are homophobic people so this issue isn't so gay people can have gay marriages in game. I've had a few people I played with in game that I found out were gay and I have never seen those people bring up the issue of sexuality in a video game, they did not have in game boyfriends etc.. The second problem is you equating homosexuality to pedophelia, it is not and never will be the same thing my friend god gave you enough brain cells to honestly know the difference. If you don't believe me do a little research with all the pedophiles of the world find one who is forthcoming and open about his preference and he will tell you that he does not and never had an interest in relations with a grown up whether male or female. Pedophiles are attracted to pre pubescent girls and boys homosexuals (gay people) are attracted to the same sex as opposed to the opposite sex.
Your post more than anything though actually takes up the cause of homosexuals so preach on you speak as if you want the word filtered and that is the same thing that homosexuals want because again it is not being used to convey happiness (as it's dictionary definition implies) but inferiority.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I would not want to hurt anyone's feelings, but this is why I think prohibiting the word "Gay" is not a solution.
First of all this word has certain connotations: when we think of gay men we tend to think about men who are also more in touch with their feminine side (oversimplification, I know, but true to some degree). That is why in a rough, competitive background like computer games or sports being called gay means the same as being called "not strong enough", "not manly" enough because, not surprisingly, manliness is associated with strength and reproductivity (in the most basic, biological sense). We have moved away from this in the course of our civilisation's evolution, but this is really that simple I think. If you ban this word, other words will appear that may be even more brutal.
In the same vein you could ban words like eg. "fatso" - some fat people are fat because they are sick and may feel wronged if someone refers to them in this way. The same applies to texts like "you drive like a woman", "you smell like a farmer" etc.
It should be easy to ignore people. There should be an ignore button, so you don't even have to type /ignore.
You just click on the person's name, then click ignore, and you no longer see any text from that person.
Let the players handle it by ignoring whomever they wish.
This is exactly why TableTop Roleplaying is light years ahead of MMORPGs.
I don't have to pay a monthly fee to actually roleplay with other people our characters. I don't need to be restricted in the use of language or personality. The level of content itself can be kept at whatever level and the story can be as extreme as possible. Mortality exists and playercharacters arent about being super-characters or being raised to super-character status and finally, I don't have to burn years away grinding in a game and can be satisfied in a few hours. Finally, roleplaying demands real skill, unlike getting into a party, standing 10 feet away from a monster and having everyone press a few keys in a "Certain Order" in which if I break the order, the entire party dies...So yeah, pressing a few keys in order, yeah! I can do that! Shows great skill!
I can not stand the entire restrictions placed on most MMORPGs today. The fact that one GM may warn me for using language and another may let it slide. I've played many MMOs and find that for the last 10 years they have been mostly the same and everyone throws some crap on how to behave. I would boycott any game that limits me on language.
BTW the same is true when I play Shooters and someone tells me I should not SWEAR in a Modern Warfare I or II forum or server. Sure, the age restriction is 13+ for most forumboards, but the game rating is MATURE. Designed for 17+ and the game experience is ruined by a bunch of underaged players who ruin it for the people who are old enough to actually play.
If a game tells you in the licensing agreement "You must be 18 years or older to play this game" and they want to ban and restrict language because they a supporting their "YOUNGER PLAYERS" who are NOT EVEN 18, But have parential permission, I would actually sue. Parential Permission means their kids are trained to HANDLE anything that the minimum age requires for playing online.
This topic is popping up all over the place. For the record IDGFF about one's choice of lifestlye, it is thiers dont force it on me, i wont force mine on yours ...
Since the 50's the world is changing and people are finding thier own voices, now they want to be hyper sensitive when "Feelings" get hurt ... Grow up people are cruel and harsh, some just like to hurt others via mental abuse or physical ... it happens ...
But to force ones issue down one throat well i am just going to turn and say stop right there ... Now does that make me all the negative connotations of a person ... to some yes .. but as i stated above IDGFF ..
Grow a set and make sound decisions and move on, respect goes both was. It is a shame that the online gaming is affected by stuff in the rl that in the end has been proven to be stupid (civil rights movement in the 60s was not just about the rise of colored americans).
I have a great many friends of alternate lifestyle and skin color ... what do i see another person. Till this world stops categorizing people, we wont move on. That starts with you ..
I do not like either side of the discussion and i am just tired of seeing people inside thier little bubbles getting hurt because someone was mean to them ...
Artorus Giltanus - Ranger EQ1 Retired
Arturien - 90 Deathknight WoW
'Should' the word be banned in game? No, I 'm against banning anything but extremely offiensive words which most of us clearly understand are inappropriate.
But, and this is the key point, MMO's are virtual worlds and the people who build them are the totalitarian rulers of them. They have the right to ban whatever they feel like, regardless of what the playerbase thinks of it.
We have the right to not play their game if it really bothers us that much.
It doesn't bother me either way, I'd never skip playing a game over its chat filter.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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