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XP gets penalized....
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I been logged on beta since yesterday morning, is 8;30 AM here right now.I dont have surplus anythin yet .guess is around 24h maybe ?Or maybe is a bug on my char . who knows.I dont think is such a big deal, the exp penalty from what i have heard is not that big .If your playing no stop that long you should reconsider to be playing at all , honestly.
So let me get this straight.....
A game like FFXI that penalizes casual players by making it harder to level is cool, but a game like FFXIV that penalizes hardcore players by slowing down the leveling process is bunk?
I thought mmos were suppose to be about the journey and enjoying the leveling process but all I hear is how much fail this is. It seems like it's in place to keep people from rushing through tons of cool lore/story/environments that devs slaved over for the past few years.
Better yet hardcore FF fans got their game with FFXI and casual gamers get their version with FFXIV.....is it their fault that the hardcore version came first? All along many of us have been saying that this would be a casual experience.....I guess now you have no choice but to listen.....
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
I think you're so far up SE's butt you're not reading what you write. As you just said, it screws you when the healer leaves. Well as it is now, the company will be doing that to you, themselves, on purpose. Oh sure one guy can switch to healer and he can switch to what that guy was doing, in a perfect world. We're newbs with nearly 0 equipment killing random normal monsters right outside of town. What happens when you have full sets of equipment for different classes/builds? We have like 15 slots for equipment or more, how many full sets will you need to carry on you at all times just to not get screwed by surplus xp? What about fighting elite monsters, you might be a decent healer but not top of the line, how are you going to sub out for the guy now? Will you need to keep ALL your classes at the same level while gearing them all up equally or face wrath when a group member complains you're only doing 95% dps of the last guy? That sounds worse than XI's timesink.
Stop spinning a mechanic that is PUNISHING PLAYERS at the moment. There are constructive ways to get players to do what you want without putting up roadblocks. I'd figure a development studio as old as they are would know a few more tricks than this.
I'm sorry, but I have to agree here. The ability to cycle out classess exists with our without the penality. The penalty (which has been labeled by SE themselves), does just that, it penalized / hinders players. While I can't agree that I think people should play games for days on end, I also don't think it's any of our responsibilities to police that. Different players have different needs and it's ultimately their responsibility to decide what's the right amount of play time for them.
Also consider not everyone is able to work. For some people the only fun they can have in the day might be in playing games. I have met a few people who are in such an unfortunate position.
On top of this, I have to wonder (and this goes towards you Disdena). If such a mechanic can be implemented, that clearly is designed to harm players, and you are able to smile and say "please sir may I have another", then what isn't okay in your book? Are you one of the few remaining fanboys who are still willing to sit there and take any crap SE throws as grade A news with a smile? Because they are losing fans over this, fans that were pretty die-hard about FFXIV up until now. All they want to do is play the game and be able to enjoy it, and this directly goes against that for many people.
- I think it's important to realize that while this is supposedly targetting hardcore gamers, it's effects don't limit themselves to that demographic. A change such as this can and will have wide-spread reprocussions, which is why so many people are angry about it. I know not everyone can see this, and I'm not allowed to comment on it, but this is a hot issue on the beta forums.
I can't see this being an issue, other games have implemented the same thing - its just that they called it bonus xp - for a short period of time before you return to normal xp rate.
Its a way of extending the life of a game, which is a good thing. Once you hit Cap whats the problem? At least you won't get there in 5 minutes like WOW or AOC!
If you don't like the concept don't buy it. But seriously the people trying to make this into a deal breaker - get real!
Core i5 13600KF, BeQuiet Pure Loop FX 360, 32gb DDR5-6000 XPG, WD SN850 NVMe ,PNY 3090 XLR8, Asus Prime Z790-A, Lian-Li O11 PCMR case (limited ed 1045/2000), 32" LG Ultragear 4k Monitor, Logitech G560 LightSync Sound, Razer Deathadder V2 and Razer Blackwidow V3 Keyboard
I've defended a lot of what SE are doing for different reasons, the UI to keep parity between console and PC players I think is the right thing to do, leaving out the AH to try and get a different sort of economy going is something I think is at least worth a shot.
But this is simply stupidity in it's purest form, the way I would probably play this game is I'd chill out crafting and exploring when I come from work on the week days but at the weekend I'd go hardcore levelling and maybe put 12 hours plus in on a Sunday on my main but with this I'd basically be screwed after what, 5 hours or so it sounds like?
Surely this can't go live and it's simply for Beta to try and get people to test different classes? Personally I won't pay a monthly fee and then be told after a few hours that I've played to much and I have to go do something else now, this is nothing like the rested system in WOW and I can't see how anyone could defend this.
I'll say again, this surely can't go live can it?
Let me ask you a question... why the rush to get to the level cap?? Is this the way everybody now thinks - rush to max out as quick as possible.......then what??? Enjoy the experience don't just race over it ffs.
And its not just about this game - its the entire mentality about players lately not wanting to put in any effort, there is no sense of achievement.
I know ..... why not just start at level cap, skip the levelling entirely and let you distribute skills ect....is that what you want!! As thats what it seems like your saying. But guess what, its not a MMORPG then..;.. Maybe your playing the wrong genre.
Core i5 13600KF, BeQuiet Pure Loop FX 360, 32gb DDR5-6000 XPG, WD SN850 NVMe ,PNY 3090 XLR8, Asus Prime Z790-A, Lian-Li O11 PCMR case (limited ed 1045/2000), 32" LG Ultragear 4k Monitor, Logitech G560 LightSync Sound, Razer Deathadder V2 and Razer Blackwidow V3 Keyboard
Y'know I find it interesting. I've read on these forums that top end FFXI guilds won't let you in unless you have several different jobs at max to fill different roles, I'm assuming based on the encounter. What FFXIV is doing with the declining xp gain over time is more or less exactly the same thing just a different way of doing it. Why you ask? Because you can pull skills from every job. This means that for end game, when it happens, you will likely need skills from many different jobs to be the best, tank, healer, dps whatever. Grinding one job out hardcore is not really going to get you anywhere any faster than say systematically leveling 3 or 4 jobs. Not to mention serious end game won't be in at launch if I read the current info correctly which means you might as well enjoy the ride.
On another note, having raided hardcore in WoW for too long, I think people grind out their class, go hardcore gear grinding just to make it into raiding and then find out they hate their class. I've seen more turn over due to "I can't play my warlock anymore because I hate pressing x over and over" or "I refuse to play my main when I have more fun with my alt" than pretty much anything else except loot drama. Consider this extremely effective incentive to try different jobs and find one you really like, not that it really matters I suppose with the ability to draw skills from so many different jobs, but still the idea is sound.
Its also nice for people like me who can be compulsive gamers. If I don't have a reason to stay and play I can reasonably enjoy doing something else, and while a lot of people can't admit to themselves that their behavior just might be unhealthy, if it does help those people it might be worth it. The designers might be looking out for you just as much as they're looking out for themselves.
Who says I want to rush? what if it happens like I said, I simply want to do all my levelling in big chunks. I could very well spend less time during a week levelling than some one who might do 2-3 hours a night but as I like to do it in sessions at the weekend I'm basically screwed.
It's not about racing to the cap, it's about playing how I want to.
So besides levelling speed (which you just said are not rushing anyway) , how are you screwed?
Core i5 13600KF, BeQuiet Pure Loop FX 360, 32gb DDR5-6000 XPG, WD SN850 NVMe ,PNY 3090 XLR8, Asus Prime Z790-A, Lian-Li O11 PCMR case (limited ed 1045/2000), 32" LG Ultragear 4k Monitor, Logitech G560 LightSync Sound, Razer Deathadder V2 and Razer Blackwidow V3 Keyboard
You can still do it, a small penalty to exp for power leveling for long is not gonna stop you from power leveling.While i dont agree with the decision i think you all are overreacting.Seriously.
From the interview:
Hate to say it but... it's RIGHT THERE in black and white although few in this thread even mentioned it.
People WHINED incessantly about FFXI not being "solo friendly" for the "casuals" and what is the result? Almost as if the Japanese said "Oh.. you Westerners WANT solo, huh? Well, here you go! Choke on it!"
All those people who whined on and on about FFXI and "too hard soloing"..., well congratulations. You've ruined the next level FF because you wanted to solo.
Your group scenario above has NO merit when they just admitted that the basis for this FF MMO is now going to be SOLO play. (I am a group player myself and I hate the dumbing down for soloers and casuals)
But as the quote goes, "Be careful what you wish for".
*not directed at you personally, Edeus
"TO MICHAEL!"
I think what they ment is you can exp solo, not do everythin else solo. Unlike FFXI, were exp solo was for most part/classes a second option becouse they simply werent as usefull on parties. And dont give me the smn bst could solo shit, im not buying it . Exp parties were 100% faster.And yes i had smn and bst on 70.
I dont really know how to feel about the game leting you solo to cap, but it was kinda expected , since it was going for casual friendly.There will still be a lot of group content , but nothin like ffxi.
Are we overreacting? On my main job I'm already at 20% surplus, with no signs of it slowing down. By the time I reach level 30 (I'm 16 now on my main job) if it keeps up it's current rate it's going to hit 100%. I also have surplus starting on 3 other jobs now. I haven't noticed surplus rates dropping either, even when I don't play for almost a full 24 hours. A month of play and I'll have all surplus capped in battle jobs. Sure, I could do crafting too, but right now in beta crafting is a mess and even slower to level (due to bugs), but I guess if this surplus system stays in place I'll be forced to at least until I cap the surplus on those.
Hint to SE: If you want to bring in more casuals, don't put in punishing gameplay. Making it harder for your "hardcore" to level up isn't going to make casuals want to play the game more. WoW's rested EXP system had it right.
You dont seem to get how the system works.
From what I can read here , you can get to a point where you get no xp at all , that means casual or hardcore players will level at the same pace. So it does make a huge difference to poeple who plays a lot.
It's not that lvl are longer in term of XP to grind , they just block it so you cant XP anymore. Hardcore players however will have few classes max lvl in end game , while casual will have only one.
If I understood what poeple wrote here , that's how it's gonna be.
edit : forgot to quote ^^
Until they say "We meant to say this but it got lost in translation".. gotta take them at their word, no? They had a chance to read the final draft before it was submitted I'm sure and they didn't choose to correct anything. When a company does that, it usually means the person being interviewed was accurately relaying the feelings of the company or the gamemaker.
When I see a retraction about this game NOT being designed for solo play, then I'll kind of believe what you say, but I was in beta so... I know what I see there.
"TO MICHAEL!"
It was also said in recent interviews they are exploring ways to incentivize grouping since its not where they want it yet. With the way grouping is in MMO's it will almost never cater enough to casuals to fit in the "get something done in 30 minutes" kind of time frame. That means soloing has to be viable, and viable enough its not pointless to play for only 30 minutes. Not to mention for every person with 8 hours+ to kill every day playing there's 5 who only manage that 30 minutes if that. Companies have a vested interest in doing everything they can to keep those 5, even if it means punishing ever so bloody slightly that 1. I honestly think its closer to 10:1 though if not more.
You say why punish the people who have 8 hours a day to play? My question... why cater to them?
You need to try beta then post on these forums like you know what you are talking about. You have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about Skieve, and you know it. You're just guessing and guessing.. badly.
There is no "small penalty" in the beta once you hit that wall. Its friggin dinosaur. Someone could stand there off healing you all day but if you've hit surplus exp cap, that doesn't mean jackshit.
Also, it doesn't come off like in an hour. It can stay on for several hours where you don't get exp that could be upwards of a 90% loss. This mechanic WILL be in the game at launch, but it may not be at 90%. Either way, it shouldn't be in there at all. Why are they penalizing a person who is doing what they bought the game for.. leveling?
You claim you "don't know how to feel about this".. Suggest you think about it really clearly.. then post an opinion of how you feel.
"TO MICHAEL!"
Theres was bunch of group play on the last game convention. The beta have 0 content, so cant really judge anythin past the leveing grind until release.Just wait and see.
Btw i whant a group game as well.Im lv 27 glad on beta and i havent been in a party not once so i see your concern. Just gotta judge beta for what it is. You cant posibly belive all the content that will be added is gonna be for solo play. comon.
I fear that the party for exp days are over tought.
If you are asking me and not Skieve, I didn't say cater to people who have 8 hours a day. I didn't even suggest that.
All they have to do is give those who DON'T have 8 hours a day to play a EXP boost. That's it, and those people can stay within earshot of the majority of powergamers.
But there is no call to hit someone who is doing what they bought the game for (leveling a character) with a huge penalty and it is huge right now. It MAY change in launch but right now it's insane.
This isn't about catering to casuals.. it's about not penalizing someone for simply.. leveling in a MMO.
"TO MICHAEL!"
1- I am on the beta
2 - i never got surplus yet, and im lv 27 gladi.Yes 3 lv from cap.
3 - i never said it was a good/bad thin, i said people are overreacting , i mean im 3 lv from cap in couple of weeks.
4 - as far as im informed, it doesnt work the same for everyone so is clearly bugged.Some say it takes 90% exp after 5 hours of gameplay some say they been grinding a lot on the same class and only takes 10%, until i see actual facts of how it actually works as intended., i think all of this rant is pointless.
5- i think limiting the players to do whatever the hell they whant is a bad move.But i dont go in rage mode until is working as intended and just how bad does it really affect the game play.Your not supoused to powerlv on the beta for god´s sake , your supoused to try everythin out. Ever tought that the harshness of it is just becouse of this ?.
I still think is a BAD THIN, but it will be tweaked around to aceptable levels before release.Is clearly brokend atm.
I was not really interested in this game so i didn't really check out threads about it. The more i learn about this game the more turned off i become.
If you ask me this system is one of the other reasons this game might not succeed. People hate being restrained. . if i love playing a certain class why can't i choose to do so?
I don't know who came up with this idea but for me is a thumbs down.
They should push people to play other classes or do something else by making them attractive and meaningful and not by forcing people.
"Yes bro im gonna do some crafting since i can't level up anymore for X hours so got no choice."
That is wrong in my opinion.
When I see a retraction about this game NOT being designed for solo play, then I'll kind of believe what you say, but I was in beta so... I know what I see there.
Theres was bunch of group play on the last game convention. The beta have 0 content, so cant really judge anythin past the leveing grind until release.Just wait and see.
Btw i whant a group game as well.Im lv 27 glad on beta and i havent been in a party not once so i see your concern. Just gotta judge beta for what it is. You cant posibly belive all the content that will be added is gonna be for solo play. comon.
I fear that the party for exp days are over tought.
27 Glad. Hmmmm.. I'd sure like to see that. Not that I don't believe you... :P
Just weird someone who SHOULD have hit a MAJOR wall with a 27 Gladiator says "I don't know how to feel about the penalty" and you even calling it "small". That surplus exp penalty was SMALL to you as a 27 Glad? Really? I doubt anyone else reading this forum and playing beta would agree with that you just typed.
Heck, after 14 the first hard hits of surplus made people flip to Weaving 1 or something.
Again, if someone says something and the FULL context of what they were talking about surrounds it like in that interview, I can't see how you can say "well, they really didn't mean that". It's pretty obvious if you look at the interview and hear those past whiners about FFXI.
They made soloing the basis, and grouping secondary. I have no idea how you do not see that based on supposedly 27 levels of Gladiator when I saw it after just 21 of Thau.
My THAU was parked so much because of that bloody colored numbers, I was thinking SE would start charging me a rental space fee for all the time it was logged out there waiting for it to come down.
"TO MICHAEL!"
I never said the penalty for me was small, i said i never got a penalty on the first place, my point is that is hella bugged. So until i see how is supoused to work, i will still say this is over reacting.
From all the info i have gathered from beta forums , theres still no acurrate formula to calculate your surplus points grown becouse i see cases that just like me , never got it ( yes i lved fast , remember when u hit lv 10 with 1 lv quest couple of weeks ago , well that)Others have 90% of exp takend away, and others are siting around 10% explost.And aparently everyone with around the same grinding time.
"TO MICHAEL!"