Guild wars is NOT a MMORPG!

fgauer · May 2005

Originally posted by severius

Instago... through a couple of your posts I can tell you have not played Guild Wars. You say that an mmorpg involves making wide sweeping changes to a game world. There is no game out there that does this. How would you like to get into a game 3 months after everyone and have everything finished so you cant do anythin? You wouldnt, nor would anyone else. Yet with guild wars I go through a particular area and I complete x, y, and z quests that make vast changes to the instances that were spawned with me. I then later go through the same area with a couple other players. They will see that the charr have been driven back and no longer spawn in an area because of the changes that I wrought upon the game world etc. Then if they want to go and drive back the charr themselves they can without me as their instance will be different.
There is no way to make a true mmorpg. Most of those that are out there dont even have RP as part of the game and are nothing more than Massively Multiplayer TreadMills that have a crappy veneer of a story slapped on top as a means to get you to pay x amount of dollars per month to come back and continue doing the same thing over and over again.
The one thing that makes Guild Wars really shine is that numb nut pale basement dwelling leet dweebs arent the end all be all because it doesnt matter so much what phat lewt you sat there camping for several hundred hours to get you will get your ass handed to you by a more skillful player. And that player may have 1/100th of the time invested than the jobless scum that infest most of these games.
Is guild wars perfect, no far from it. But it is a step ahead whereas most of the games released have been nothing but clones made by lazy dev teams that are driven more by the dollar then the coders of old who were there to tell a story. Go back to your Everquests and WoWs your opinions are biased and your logic is faulty.
No game out there can live up to your definition of what an mmo should be so, to follow your argument, this site should be shut down. Just because if you come through where I am grinding on beasties and you see that I killed a goblin does not make for a change to the entire game world. I can go and kill the mother of all goblins but 10 or 15 minutes later she'll be back. Go think about it and the holes in your argument if you want to have a discussion. Otherwise you are a troll. Good day.

Nice post Severius.

No matter how much anyone argues the point, Guild Wars is a brilliant work - and much deserving of any rank it gets.

Mentat · May 2005

Originally posted by Oscillate

If guild wars isn't a " MMORPG " then take the stupied game off mmorpg.com ! and put WoW back as #1

LMAO - The users/voters on the website are the ones that are promoting Guild Wars. I was playing wow till I topped out - once you reach 60 it kinda got old quick...

Tried matrix online - looks decent - I love the world but, still a little buggy and the learning curve makes it one that I can only play for an hour or 2 at a time max.

Might give this game a shot - It got a bad rap on my end cause I tried to play an enchanter at first during the world premiere - they made the casting animations completely faggy. Hopefully they changed that.

MurdocVD · May 2005

Desperado that was a short post might i say that you are wrong......why do you think it sucks?

Classicstar · May 2005

guildwars is just a game for casual who have 1 hour a day to play and wont have dis advantage with other players.

How many hours you put in guildwars those not realy matter if you manage to use right skills with right character you can win from player who spend zillion hours in guildwars.

Just play guildwars for fun instance in instance out pvp instance in pvp instance out fast play with small amount of peeps.

You dont have to grind dont have to explore(there is nothing to explore anyways like you can in real mmorpgs.

So login instance play have fun and no monthly fee you can play it easely next to real emersive exploring massive game world like eq2 or wow or lineage2 or others like that.

But always peeps who will like this game and hate other games or peeps who like wow and hate guildwars you never win the discussion.

ikra · May 2005

how i hate people who criticize it without even playing it even to the part where you finish the northwall mission.. grrrrrrrrrrr......... and mostly to those people who havent played the game... always say, it sucks blah blah... they even barely touched pre searing ascalon... PRE-SEARING not even POST-SEARING!!!!

terstax · May 2005

Originally posted by fgauer
Originally posted by severius
Instago... through a couple of your posts I can tell you have not played Guild Wars. You say that an mmorpg involves making wide sweeping changes to a game world. There is no game out there that does this. How would you like to get into a game 3 months after everyone and have everything finished so you cant do anythin? You wouldnt, nor would anyone else. Yet with guild wars I go through a particular area and I complete x, y, and z quests that make vast changes to the instances that were spawned with me. I then later go through the same area with a couple other players. They will see that the charr have been driven back and no longer spawn in an area because of the changes that I wrought upon the game world etc. Then if they want to go and drive back the charr themselves they can without me as their instance will be different.
There is no way to make a true mmorpg. Most of those that are out there dont even have RP as part of the game and are nothing more than Massively Multiplayer TreadMills that have a crappy veneer of a story slapped on top as a means to get you to pay x amount of dollars per month to come back and continue doing the same thing over and over again.
The one thing that makes Guild Wars really shine is that numb nut pale basement dwelling leet dweebs arent the end all be all because it doesnt matter so much what phat lewt you sat there camping for several hundred hours to get you will get your ass handed to you by a more skillful player. And that player may have 1/100th of the time invested than the jobless scum that infest most of these games.
Is guild wars perfect, no far from it. But it is a step ahead whereas most of the games released have been nothing but clones made by lazy dev teams that are driven more by the dollar then the coders of old who were there to tell a story. Go back to your Everquests and WoWs your opinions are biased and your logic is faulty.
No game out there can live up to your definition of what an mmo should be so, to follow your argument, this site should be shut down. Just because if you come through where I am grinding on beasties and you see that I killed a goblin does not make for a change to the entire game world. I can go and kill the mother of all goblins but 10 or 15 minutes later she'll be back. Go think about it and the holes in your argument if you want to have a discussion. Otherwise you are a troll. Good day.
Nice post Severius.
No matter how much anyone argues the point, Guild Wars is a brilliant work - and much deserving of any rank it gets.

I also think his post is excellent. Keep up the good work Severius.

Sanctus_Mors · May 2005

<_<

>_>

SHHH, don't tell anyone, but GW is actually NWN 2.0 without the player created modules.

Compare and contrast NWN to GW: NWN does have player made persistant worlds that accomplish the exact thing that GW offers.

Class system is a bit different, but combat is the same.

I'm not saying it's bad, but when your feeling for something different from your current MMO, it's a nice escape.

BobCrazyton · May 2005

Why are you complaining about this? Just play the frigen game!!! It don't matter if this game doesn't have the characteristics of other MMO's.

IT'S STILL THE BEST FREAKIN GAME IN THE WORLD!!!

so shut up...

EDIT:What I don't get is how they keep the game so lag free with no monthly fees,1 server,and kick ass graphics

they must be using magic or somethin...

elite_texan · May 2005

i think mmorpg.com will keep whatever game they want to up on the site, none of us pay for the site or built the site, so we have no say in what they do, plus it think a multi-million dollar company has the power to call a game an mmorpg, seeing how they have in the past built other mmorpgs. i think this argument is pretty lame, its just a game, lets just play the thing and let it be that. who cares if its a mmorpg or not. i mean what are you gonna gain by arguing over it? i know for a fact you are not gonna persuade a huge company to change the games genre. just because YOU think it lacks the characteristics of an mmorpg. i belive GW is an mmorpg and i will stick with that. other people may have different ideas, im fine with that, but its not gonna change my mind a bit.

fgauer · May 2005

Yeah - the key is just to have fun with it. There is no need to flog these things to death. The Guild Wars box deserves a place on your shelf - with a copy of it obviously loaded up and ready to go - when you get sick of grinding away in WoW or EQ or whatever...

...the key is fun. This title is a classic already and is worth the box price right out of the chute...

Instago · May 2005

DISCLAIMER: THE INDIVIDUAL TYPING THIS IS MERELY PUTTING OUT HIS OWN INSIGHT UNTO THE TOPIC AT HAND. MOST, IF NOT ALL OF THIS INFORMATION, IS OPINION. (why do I refer to myself in third person? I know not. What is wrong with me telling you what I think? I know not)

#1- assuming is bad. I have played Guild Wars and I believe I have already said that I have- also, I told you that if you wanted to discuss this topic seriously, then you should read through all posts in the discussion- not one, not two, all.

#2- you are correct in saying that there is no true MMORPG. Well, I should say massively multiplayer online persistant world.

#3- nothing is impossible, merely improbable.

#4- if there was a truely persistant world there would be no end to content- look at our world now as we know it. I don't know about you but I love our real world and I always enjoy everything; no boredom here.

#5- perfection is very unlikely and very improbable

#6- this site should not be shut down- people have the right to believe anything they wish to believe. There is no right or wrong.

I completely agree with your second paragraph and in your third- yes, I think the more skilled player should have a greater chance against another player with possibly better gear, higher attributes, and/or what ever have you. As for your fourth paragraph- I would have taken you more seriously if you would have left out the insults (I think this is where all your great comments go down the hill because you start inserting your anger towards me in the form of insults)

Earlier, much earlier, I requested that this be moved to the general topic because this has become more of a 'what is a mmorpg?' post rather than a 'Guid Wars is NOT a MMORPG! post' like what was originally thought of.

Games can be fun- and who care's otherwise if it's great and all but I thought I'd give my opinion and insight (notice the words OPINION and INSIGHT) on Guild Wars and MMORPGs in general. I'd like to request that you, the reader, realise that this is my opinion, and I am entitled to it just as much as you are.

You're right when you say no game can live up to what SHOULD be (should- this implies that this is my opinion!)

I can go and kill the mother of all goblins but 10 or 15 minutes later she'll be back.

In my world of 'should,' another goblin will rise up to become the new mother of goblins- there are usually followers of leaders, and some follower usually rises up to become the leader.

Go think about it and the holes in your argument if you want to have a discussion. Otherwise you are a troll. Good day.

You haven't even read my entire argument- in fact, I stated that if you wanted to discuss it, you should read the entire thread not merely 'some' as you put it. You are trolling a troll so you are also one.

Here's a quick English lesson (learned this one back in 9th grade!): Opinions can be stated like facts-
We are losing this war.
We are winning this war.
The president is stupid.
The president is intelligent.

Using words like 'my, 'I think,' or 'in my opinion' causes an 'opinion' statement to be precieved as weak- it also causes the speaker to not firmly hold his or her own beliefs strongly. Here are some examples (bad first, better second):

In my opinion, we are losing this war.
We are losing this war

I've thought about this and I have determined that the president is stupid.
The president is stupid.

Now, the tricky part is that sometimes it is hard to tell whether a statement is an opinion or not. This is usually why people get caught up so much in discussions like ones over politics and religion- it is because the person cannot identify whether a statement is the speaker's opinion or not.

I'd like to add this for people who think I have some ungodly obsession against Guild Wars or something: I have played the game during the various beta events and such. I have also played it frequently at a computer cafe. It is fun, in fact- I am considering purchasing it.

FoeHammer101 · May 2005

I understand why he could be upset, but all i want to know is what the point of it all is. True it shouldnt be called an mmorpg, but why make such a big fuss and then dont make any effort to explain why.

Instago · May 2005

There is no true point or reason to anything, including the universe it self, so asking 'whats the point?' is irrelevant to the discussion at hand but that is another argument. Nothing really matters- and no, I am not some strange, suicidal, depressed person. I am very happy and content with my life, I simply see what is in front of me and I try to avoid speculation on what will be.

Though one could say that I wish to know other's opinions on this subject and gain further knowledge on everything- I like to learn.

I am a sentient being and I might as well make the best of what I have and have a little fun while I'm at it!

(yes, I have fun even though people insult me- it can be quite funny though)

::::39::

jd269 · May 2005

Just curious.. what games do you play? Everquest? Is board troll more fun than everquest now?

Instago · May 2005

I play too many games to list, and have played too many games to list. I play a wide spectrum of genres. I have played EverQuest. Social interactions are usually fun- but EverQuest also has social interactions. I do not know.

Atomicus · May 2005

Originally posted by FoeHammer101
I understand why he could be upset, but all i want to know is what the point of it all is. True it shouldnt be called an mmorpg, but why make such a big fuss and then dont make any effort to explain why.

The original poster did not make a fuss at all. He stated an opinion which clearly has turned into something controversial. The lesson to be learned here is that no opinion can be left uncriticized because there will always be someone else that values or believes the opposite. I think the MMORPG term used to define the genre for the games we play needs to be more definitive.

What number defines massive? By definition the word according to Merriam-Webster's Dictionary:

Pronunciation: 'ma-siv
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English massiffe, from Middle French massif, from masse mass
1 : forming or consisting of a large mass: a : BULKY b : WEIGHTY, HEAVY <massive walls> <a massive volume> c : impressively large or ponderous d : having no regular form but not necessarily lacking crystalline structure <massive sandstone>
2 a : large, solid, or heavy in structure <massive jaw> b : large in scope or degree <the feeling of frustration, of being ineffectual, is massive -- David Halberstam> c (1) : large in comparison to what is typical <massive dose of penicillin> (2) : being extensive and severe <massive hemorrhage> <massive collapse of a lung> (3) : imposing in excellence or grandeur : MONUMENTAL <massive simplicity>
3 : having mass <a massive boson>

By definition we can call MuDs, which is used to define text based online games, a MMORPG because it supports or can support a large number of players.

claith · May 2005

think what he is sayin is these leeches for game designers have made a skeltal version of a fantasy game,with very cheap design,and have put a mask on it calling it an MMORPG so they can screw and mislead the MMORPG community as to the nature/type of game they are selling and rape them/us of our money,only to be disappointed 5 minutes after you load the game...and you guys think Your smart,lmao

Alexy · May 2005

As soon as it is a good game that ppl like, I dont mind how ppl define the game.

bobozelinsky · May 2005

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Suave · May 2005

Originally posted by Instago

#3- nothing is impossible, merely improbable.

I find it impossible for you to leave this topic alone. Quite frankly your "insights" and side comments are confusing everyone as far as the aspects of MMORPGs are concerned. In fact, I'm not really sure what this topic is about anymore - a thread on Guild Wars MMO legitimacy... or a discussion on the the meaning of life, what colors mean (a pre-school discussion) and how "nothing really matters". I lost the translation after about page 3. I'm sorry to say that the only thing I've gained from this "discussion" is that you now consider purchasing Guild Wars (and sincerely hope that you do so). Perhaps then you could see that your ideals for an MMORPG with complete dynamic changes and real life drama are very far from ever becoming a reality.

And that Guild Wars is simply a game, something to play with. I'd list the definition of game here, but I think it's a bit unneccesary. Because "nothing really matters" anyway, right?

But prove me wrong. Prove that nothing's impossible, don't make another point.

Perhaps then we can all just move on.

dspeed12 · May 2005

I think you can still consider it an MMO but its extremely borderline. I like to think it isn't... but it's considered otherwise....

Instago · May 2005

People ask me questions, I answer them honestly. My ideals are very unique and this may be why you are confused.

If you wish to be further confused read on:

Because "nothing really matters" anyway, right?

I do not know, it is possible.

But prove me wrong. Prove that nothing's impossible, don't make another point.

One cannot prove things however one can show support or nonsupport.

If you talk to a person like me and ask many questions which are relative to 'why' and 'what gives' you will get strange answers because I, unlike other people, do answer them honestly- to me they are not expressions, they are questions to be answered.

fartking7 · May 2005

Will you can the philosophy of science 101 bit? Nothing can be proven -- wow, at least you've got one up on 98% of the bible belt. But c'mon man, don't bring your 11th grade education to a 3rd grade party.

Instago · May 2005

Originally posted by fartking7
Will you can the philosophy of science 101 bit? Nothing can be proven -- wow, at least you've got one up on 98% of the bible belt. But c'mon man, don't bring your 11th grade education to a 3rd grade party.

Please elaborate and put the drugs down ::::31:: .

Oscillate · May 2005

Originally posted by Mentat

Originally posted by Oscillate

If guild wars isn't a " MMORPG " then take the stupied game off mmorpg.com ! and put WoW back as #1

LMAO - The users/voters on the website are the ones that are promoting Guild Wars. I was playing wow till I topped out - once you reach 60 it kinda got old quick...

Tried matrix online - looks decent - I love the world but, still a little buggy and the learning curve makes it one that I can only play for an hour or 2 at a time max.

Might give this game a shot - It got a bad rap on my end cause I tried to play an enchanter at first during the world premiere - they made the casting animations completely faggy. Hopefully they changed that.

That part about reaching 60 in WoW I belive it to be true aswell, but... they have added things to make this better like Raid Instances and The new Honor System

Witch makes this game pleasurable after 60

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