Maybe i missed something, but when did rift say it was next gen combat? If it did, that's pretty laughable on their part.
Is it boring compared to fps sort of twitch? Of course. But it seems to be a normal MMO combat system to me.
For a MMORPG, I consider it next-gen. For most that is, of this style. Compare it to titles like WoW.
I'm not really sure what even constitutes the term "next generation" but they have borrowed heavily from the best parts of other games that did well or not so well. All I know is that the gameplay is very enjoyable and aside from all the WoW comparisons in chat the chatter is okay as well.
The fluidity and pace of combat in WoW has forever spoiled me. Aion was pretty good too. I don't think the combat in Rift is boring. It's very status-quo for the genre, but what were people expecting? It's an MMO... exciting combat doesn't really happen in MMO's. My bigger gripe is with the animations for character movement and attacks.
i know when i playing RIFT im having lots of fun and do not find the combat boring at all. I tried DCUonline it was tooo much fast pace and i really didnt like it, as for WoW (LMAO) im not gonna go there because combat there is wayyyy too easy.
What do you mean too easy?
I found combat extremely boring/easy, especially as pyromancer. You start with fireball, you spam fireball, enemy dies... No need for other spells... Only other useful thing is that instant cast single target spell you get at beggining as well... I dont see how it can get easier: 1,1,2,1,1,2,1,1... (1-FB, 2-insta spell, whatever its name)
The combat is alright i'd compare it to WAR and EQ2 but with no interface lag (which was nice). It's definitely not as smooth as WoW or Aion, but really those are the only two modern mmo's where I would consider the combat top notch. I'm only level 10 so can't say i'm an expert with the game but a few things I thought weren't the greatest.
1) Music - the music in this game is pretty bad, I know its not really a factor for most people but for me personally it was noticeable.
2) The "soul system" although i'm pretty happy with the mass array of spells (i'm a necro/warlock/demolisher) it seems the mix between the three makes some spells redundant.
3) Its not as polished as I was expecting as so many people have been saying on these forums. Same as the combat its better than EQ 2/WAR/AoC but behind Aion and WoW.
On the other hand I was impressed how well the game played on my comp, I have a single core 3.6 ghz 2gm ram and 712 mb vid card, not the greatest system by any means but still played the game fairly well.
I logged into Rift for 20 minutes, played and promptly logged out.
I'm sorry, but were you all taking this guy seriously, as if he had some knowledge or something? Did you miss this one line in his opening post? Really, 20 minutes, did he even get out of the freaking tutorial before he stopped playing, and came HERE to tell us all how the combat was?? And all these people jumping on his bandwagon to support him? Your all as bad as he is.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
While i will agree that Rift combat and classes do not have the depth of a game like Vanguard but then it also is not as simplistic and easy as a game like AoC where one just follows the arrows. I know a lot of the ADHD kiddies do not like thoughtful combat and push for systems that require less thought like AoC. But those players will never have the patience to play a MMO longer than a few months anyway. Rather they will spend their time bashing games on message boards.
Frankly, if you don't like the combat in Rift, then you probably don't like it in WOW, EQ, EQ2, WAR, AC2, DAOC, FFXI, Lineage 2, LOTRO, etc... I'm sure there are more but these are the only ones I've played that share this identical combat system.
I like it alright. Certainly not the best MMO combat I've experienced but it does the job.
Here's the thing, I like Strawberry Ice Cream, but if all I ate was Strawberry Ice Cream over the last 8 years I might get sick of it.... Doesn't change the fact that I used to like it once upon a time
Here's the thing. If you ate Strawberry Ice Cream for 8 years and started wating hamburgers, then you would no longer be eating ice cream.
There are many different kinds of people in this world and it is no different when it comes to gamers and mmo players.
Some people are are ok with what you give them and just accept that this is the way mmo's play. Some people like to play the same way and enjoy getting the same experience in games and other things. Some people like new experiences and get bored of the same thing over and over again.
I am one of those people who gets tired of the same thing over and over again and wants a new experience. For myself and those like me, Rift is probably not the game for them.
I do think that those people who make excuses and say that this is typical mmo combat instead of saying that this is just what they like or are used to, have no real imagination and don't really believe that a genre can evolve. One of my favorite rpg's is the Mass Effect series cause they gave me a new rpg experience. That is what I am looking for in my mmo's now a days and some others are too.
So to me the combat in Rift is boring and more of the same. Is it a problem for some people? Nope, but it is a problem for others. If you are not having fun with the most important part of a themepark mmo and that is combat, then your not gonna have fun with the game as a whole.
I am kinda enjoying the game at the moment but it is pretty much because my girlfriend is out of town and I am sooooooo bored and probably cause it is beta. Where everything is new and shiny. I liked WAR during beta too so.....
"...I am one of those people who gets tired of the same thing over and over again...."
Yet you prefer MMORPGs? Odd...
You have to remember thtat 95% of the posters here most likely do not play MMO's except under the most liberal definition of "play." Rather they are forum warriors who lack the patience to play any MMO except in very small doses. They are "wannabe players" who will always tell you they know best as they hype a game until they play it and realize they don't like mmo's so they move on to trashing that game for not being innovative enough before they move on to hypeing their next game.
"...I am one of those people who gets tired of the same thing over and over again...."
Yet you prefer MMORPGs? Odd...
Which is why I am not paying to play any MMORPG's at the moment and am waiting patiently for GW2. Doing wall of text kill and collect quests was fun for the first 8 years I played MMORPG's. If thats what you like then by all means do your thing but I have been waiting for something different for a while now.
Also I play pretty much every genre of video game out there. So I don't prefer MMORPG's over any other genre of games. Although I have an mmo itch that needs to be scratched currently.
Stiff... I'm not too impressed with the next gen combat at all.
I'm playing DC Universe this week instead of playing Rift.
I logged into Rift for 20 minutes, played and promptly logged out.
Rift is a "better" game, but DC Universe is more "fun", DCU movement and combat feels more fluid and alive.
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
"...I am one of those people who gets tired of the same thing over and over again...."
Yet you prefer MMORPGs? Odd...
Which is why I am not paying to play any MMORPG's at the moment and am waiting patiently for GW2. Doing wall of text kill and collect quests was fun for the first 8 years I played MMORPG's. If thats what you like then by all means do your thing but I have been waiting for something different for a while now.
Also I play pretty much every genre of video game out there. So I don't prefer MMORPG's over any other genre of games. Although I have an mmo itch that needs to be scratched currently.
Yes, I like MMOs, I have been playing them for over a decade now and while some more innovation would be nice it's a new world with new stories despite following the exact same dynamics other previous MMOs have. I also like comedies and I can tell you for a fact that my video library would be very small indeed if I got upset every time a comedy recycled dick and fart jokes.
Stiff... I'm not too impressed with the next gen combat at all.
I'm playing DC Universe this week instead of playing Rift.
I logged into Rift for 20 minutes, played and promptly logged out.
Rift is a "better" game, but DC Universe is more "fun", DCU movement and combat feels more fluid and alive.
Explaining what classes you were playing would help your opinion a bit.
For me? the many multi-classes of cleric and mage I played up to todays beta were all extremely fun. Even the bard has a pretty high fun factor to it especially melded with a ranger/pet. So I completely disagree even though I played a bit more than 20 minutes
Stiff... I'm not too impressed with the next gen combat at all.
I'm playing DC Universe this week instead of playing Rift.
I logged into Rift for 20 minutes, played and promptly logged out.
Rift is a "better" game, but DC Universe is more "fun", DCU movement and combat feels more fluid and alive.
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
But who is to say that slow paced dice rolling combat is what makes an MMORPG an MMORPG? In my opinion, that is not one of the staple features in MMORPG's like shooting and getting shot is in FPS's. There are other games trying to do something different as far as combat goes. If they succeed are people going to continue to believe that this is all that MMORPG's have to offer when it comes to combat?
Stiff... I'm not too impressed with the next gen combat at all. I'm playing DC Universe this week instead of playing Rift. I logged into Rift for 20 minutes, played and promptly logged out. Rift is a "better" game, but DC Universe is more "fun", DCU movement and combat feels more fluid and alive.
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
agree mmo combat has always been a favorite of mine. I struggle to get Into games with crappy Targetting systems.
While i will agree that Rift combat and classes do not have the depth of a game like Vanguard but then it also is not as simplistic and easy as a game like AoC where one just follows the arrows. I know a lot of the ADHD kiddies do not like thoughtful combat and push for systems that require less thought like AoC. But those players will never have the patience to play a MMO longer than a few months anyway. Rather they will spend their time bashing games on message boards.
This is kind of off topic but how was AoC's combat more simplistic than your normal MMOPRG combat? In your normal MMOPRG you have auto attack, in AoC you had to press different directional buttons to attack (tryimg to connect on each attack) while moving and casting spells.
I agree with OP that Rifts combat could be more fun but the same goes for every single MMO that is ever made.
Rifts combat is not better nor worse than Wow, EQ 1 & 2s, LOTROs and the rest. The most fun combat I ever had in MMORPGs/CORPGs is still in Guildwars and it's combat system is very spartan and far from perfect.
AoC and TCoS both tried to improve combat but neither succeded. GW2 and TERA is next that will try, I hope at least one of them do better.
I am the first one to say that MMO combat should be more fun, but I don't see the point of singeling out Rifts combat mechanics. MMOs need more fun combat, we spend so much of the game time fighting that it should be more fun.
I will make a thread later about how I think MMO combat should be improved, no need to spamm this thread with loads of text.
Stiff... I'm not too impressed with the next gen combat at all.
I'm playing DC Universe this week instead of playing Rift.
I logged into Rift for 20 minutes, played and promptly logged out.
Rift is a "better" game, but DC Universe is more "fun", DCU movement and combat feels more fluid and alive.
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
But who is to say that slow paced dice rolling combat is what makes an MMORPG an MMORPG? In my opinion, that is not one of the staple features in MMORPG's like shooting and getting shot is in FPS's. There are other games trying to do something different as far as combat goes. If they succeed are people going to continue to believe that this is all that MMORPG's have to offer when it comes to combat?
No, they'll probably play a game they enjoy instead of being upset that a game doesn't have what they enjoy.
This is kind of off topic but how was AoC's combat more simplistic than your normal MMOPRG combat? In your normal MMOPRG you have auto attack, in AoC you had to press different directional buttons to attack (tryimg to connect on each attack) while moving and casting spells.
That didn't impress me at all. AoCs combat do have one really great thing however: The collision detection. No need to aim, if your sword hits you hit the oponent if not you miss. That part is brilliant and something other MMOs should add as well.
The directions were a rather bad compromize of the original idea and what other games have. It were supposed to be closer to Tekken originally but the Alpha testers didn't like that.
Well I don't know. I find the combat a heck of a lot better than in LotRO (for example).
wow they both share the same combat system click action bars. click and click nothing new to me. it even has the same UI as everquest 2 and wow click bars to hit and use spells.......
I happen to have no problem with the actual mechanics of Rift's WoW-like combat. Those mechanics work just fine for an RPG.
My problem with Rift's combat is that the combat animations and sound are pretty lame. It makes a difference. In my opinion, Aion, which uses the same basic mechanics, has much more satisfying combat simply because the animation and sounds are better.
I agree with OP that Rifts combat could be more fun but the same goes for every single MMO that is ever made.
Rifts combat is not better nor worse than Wow, EQ 1 & 2s, LOTROs and the rest. The most fun combat I ever had in MMORPGs/CORPGs is still in Guildwars and it's combat system is very spartan and far from perfect.
AoC and TCoS both tried to improve combat but neither succeded. GW2 and TERA is next that will try, I hope at least one of them do better.
I am the first one to say that MMO combat should be more fun, but I don't see the point of singeling out Rifts combat mechanics. MMOs need more fun combat, we spend so much of the game time fighting that it should be more fun.
I will make a thread later about how I think MMO combat should be improved, no need to spamm this thread with loads of text.
I never said Rift was a bad game. I just said the combat is the same MMO combat that I have played before and its old to me now. I agree with what he said because he doesn't believe that the combat in an MMO has to always be the same thing over and over again and that it can different or even more fun instead of just accepting that it is what it is.
Frankly, if you don't like the combat in Rift, then you probably don't like it in WOW, EQ, EQ2, WAR, AC2, DAOC, FFXI, Lineage 2, LOTRO, etc... I'm sure there are more but these are the only ones I've played that share this identical combat system.
I like it alright. Certainly not the best MMO combat I've experienced but it does the job.
Here's the thing, I like Strawberry Ice Cream, but if all I ate was Strawberry Ice Cream over the last 8 years I might get sick of it.... Doesn't change the fact that I used to like it once upon a time
Right, as if you wouldn't eat another bowl of Strawberry Ice Cream tomorrow if that's the only flavor there was to eat. It's still ice cream and still good.
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
The pace in itself does not matter that much. The real difference should be more about strategy.
I agree that FPS like twitch combat isn't more fun than current combat.
MMOs needs a new and more strategic way of handeling combat. Because frankly do I think tactics matters too little.
MMO combat is made by someone who never even lifted a real sword. You usually click your keys in more or less the same way every combat, with some possible defense skill against certain things. That is not enough.
I believe that you can mix strategy and wits into a new and interesting combat system. The winner of a RPG combat should not be the one that clicks slightly faster but the one with best strategy.
Now it feels like strategy have little importance, the 2 things that matters is mainly gear and levels. You rarely get surprised in combat and that goes from both PvP and PvE.
Comments
I'm not really sure what even constitutes the term "next generation" but they have borrowed heavily from the best parts of other games that did well or not so well. All I know is that the gameplay is very enjoyable and aside from all the WoW comparisons in chat the chatter is okay as well.
The fluidity and pace of combat in WoW has forever spoiled me. Aion was pretty good too. I don't think the combat in Rift is boring. It's very status-quo for the genre, but what were people expecting? It's an MMO... exciting combat doesn't really happen in MMO's. My bigger gripe is with the animations for character movement and attacks.
What do you mean too easy?
I found combat extremely boring/easy, especially as pyromancer. You start with fireball, you spam fireball, enemy dies... No need for other spells... Only other useful thing is that instant cast single target spell you get at beggining as well... I dont see how it can get easier: 1,1,2,1,1,2,1,1... (1-FB, 2-insta spell, whatever its name)
The combat is alright i'd compare it to WAR and EQ2 but with no interface lag (which was nice). It's definitely not as smooth as WoW or Aion, but really those are the only two modern mmo's where I would consider the combat top notch. I'm only level 10 so can't say i'm an expert with the game but a few things I thought weren't the greatest.
1) Music - the music in this game is pretty bad, I know its not really a factor for most people but for me personally it was noticeable.
2) The "soul system" although i'm pretty happy with the mass array of spells (i'm a necro/warlock/demolisher) it seems the mix between the three makes some spells redundant.
3) Its not as polished as I was expecting as so many people have been saying on these forums. Same as the combat its better than EQ 2/WAR/AoC but behind Aion and WoW.
On the other hand I was impressed how well the game played on my comp, I have a single core 3.6 ghz 2gm ram and 712 mb vid card, not the greatest system by any means but still played the game fairly well.
I'm sorry, but were you all taking this guy seriously, as if he had some knowledge or something? Did you miss this one line in his opening post? Really, 20 minutes, did he even get out of the freaking tutorial before he stopped playing, and came HERE to tell us all how the combat was?? And all these people jumping on his bandwagon to support him? Your all as bad as he is.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
While i will agree that Rift combat and classes do not have the depth of a game like Vanguard but then it also is not as simplistic and easy as a game like AoC where one just follows the arrows. I know a lot of the ADHD kiddies do not like thoughtful combat and push for systems that require less thought like AoC. But those players will never have the patience to play a MMO longer than a few months anyway. Rather they will spend their time bashing games on message boards.
Here's the thing. If you ate Strawberry Ice Cream for 8 years and started wating hamburgers, then you would no longer be eating ice cream.
There are many different kinds of people in this world and it is no different when it comes to gamers and mmo players.
Some people are are ok with what you give them and just accept that this is the way mmo's play. Some people like to play the same way and enjoy getting the same experience in games and other things. Some people like new experiences and get bored of the same thing over and over again.
I am one of those people who gets tired of the same thing over and over again and wants a new experience. For myself and those like me, Rift is probably not the game for them.
I do think that those people who make excuses and say that this is typical mmo combat instead of saying that this is just what they like or are used to, have no real imagination and don't really believe that a genre can evolve. One of my favorite rpg's is the Mass Effect series cause they gave me a new rpg experience. That is what I am looking for in my mmo's now a days and some others are too.
So to me the combat in Rift is boring and more of the same. Is it a problem for some people? Nope, but it is a problem for others. If you are not having fun with the most important part of a themepark mmo and that is combat, then your not gonna have fun with the game as a whole.
I am kinda enjoying the game at the moment but it is pretty much because my girlfriend is out of town and I am sooooooo bored and probably cause it is beta. Where everything is new and shiny. I liked WAR during beta too so.....
Yet you prefer MMORPGs? Odd...
You have to remember thtat 95% of the posters here most likely do not play MMO's except under the most liberal definition of "play." Rather they are forum warriors who lack the patience to play any MMO except in very small doses. They are "wannabe players" who will always tell you they know best as they hype a game until they play it and realize they don't like mmo's so they move on to trashing that game for not being innovative enough before they move on to hypeing their next game.
Which is why I am not paying to play any MMORPG's at the moment and am waiting patiently for GW2. Doing wall of text kill and collect quests was fun for the first 8 years I played MMORPG's. If thats what you like then by all means do your thing but I have been waiting for something different for a while now.
Also I play pretty much every genre of video game out there. So I don't prefer MMORPG's over any other genre of games. Although I have an mmo itch that needs to be scratched currently.
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
Yes, I like MMOs, I have been playing them for over a decade now and while some more innovation would be nice it's a new world with new stories despite following the exact same dynamics other previous MMOs have. I also like comedies and I can tell you for a fact that my video library would be very small indeed if I got upset every time a comedy recycled dick and fart jokes.
Explaining what classes you were playing would help your opinion a bit.
For me? the many multi-classes of cleric and mage I played up to todays beta were all extremely fun. Even the bard has a pretty high fun factor to it especially melded with a ranger/pet. So I completely disagree even though I played a bit more than 20 minutes
But who is to say that slow paced dice rolling combat is what makes an MMORPG an MMORPG? In my opinion, that is not one of the staple features in MMORPG's like shooting and getting shot is in FPS's. There are other games trying to do something different as far as combat goes. If they succeed are people going to continue to believe that this is all that MMORPG's have to offer when it comes to combat?
I like slower paced combat, it's one of the reasons why I love MMOs so much. If I wanted fast paced, console style gameplay, I'd like play on a console or gasp, jump into first person shooters. There's a reason why games like Rift are labeled as MMORPGs. You don't go to a baseball field and expect them to play football, do you?
agree mmo combat has always been a favorite of mine. I struggle to get Into games with crappy Targetting systems.Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
This is kind of off topic but how was AoC's combat more simplistic than your normal MMOPRG combat? In your normal MMOPRG you have auto attack, in AoC you had to press different directional buttons to attack (tryimg to connect on each attack) while moving and casting spells.
I agree with OP that Rifts combat could be more fun but the same goes for every single MMO that is ever made.
Rifts combat is not better nor worse than Wow, EQ 1 & 2s, LOTROs and the rest. The most fun combat I ever had in MMORPGs/CORPGs is still in Guildwars and it's combat system is very spartan and far from perfect.
AoC and TCoS both tried to improve combat but neither succeded. GW2 and TERA is next that will try, I hope at least one of them do better.
I am the first one to say that MMO combat should be more fun, but I don't see the point of singeling out Rifts combat mechanics. MMOs need more fun combat, we spend so much of the game time fighting that it should be more fun.
I will make a thread later about how I think MMO combat should be improved, no need to spamm this thread with loads of text.
No, they'll probably play a game they enjoy instead of being upset that a game doesn't have what they enjoy.
That didn't impress me at all. AoCs combat do have one really great thing however: The collision detection. No need to aim, if your sword hits you hit the oponent if not you miss. That part is brilliant and something other MMOs should add as well.
The directions were a rather bad compromize of the original idea and what other games have. It were supposed to be closer to Tekken originally but the Alpha testers didn't like that.
wow they both share the same combat system click action bars. click and click nothing new to me. it even has the same UI as everquest 2 and wow click bars to hit and use spells.......
.....
I happen to have no problem with the actual mechanics of Rift's WoW-like combat. Those mechanics work just fine for an RPG.
My problem with Rift's combat is that the combat animations and sound are pretty lame. It makes a difference. In my opinion, Aion, which uses the same basic mechanics, has much more satisfying combat simply because the animation and sounds are better.
Anyway, that's my two cents.
I never said Rift was a bad game. I just said the combat is the same MMO combat that I have played before and its old to me now. I agree with what he said because he doesn't believe that the combat in an MMO has to always be the same thing over and over again and that it can different or even more fun instead of just accepting that it is what it is.
Right, as if you wouldn't eat another bowl of Strawberry Ice Cream tomorrow if that's the only flavor there was to eat. It's still ice cream and still good.
The pace in itself does not matter that much. The real difference should be more about strategy.
I agree that FPS like twitch combat isn't more fun than current combat.
MMOs needs a new and more strategic way of handeling combat. Because frankly do I think tactics matters too little.
MMO combat is made by someone who never even lifted a real sword. You usually click your keys in more or less the same way every combat, with some possible defense skill against certain things. That is not enough.
I believe that you can mix strategy and wits into a new and interesting combat system. The winner of a RPG combat should not be the one that clicks slightly faster but the one with best strategy.
Now it feels like strategy have little importance, the 2 things that matters is mainly gear and levels. You rarely get surprised in combat and that goes from both PvP and PvE.