And I wonder how the guy caught that small change that in the end means the same thing xD
He had nothing better to do? Or he simply reads guildwars2guru where everything gets blown out of proportions. The people over there overanalyse everything. Hell if an employee from ArenaNet spelt the word overanalyze as overanalyse they would analyse that too!
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
This statement clearly opens the door for selling of weapons, armor, traits, titles, and other things you obtain while playing the game.
And judging by their past actions, do you think this is a realistic proposition?
what past action? GW2 bears almost not relation to the costs and model of GW1, and they wouldn't have changed it to remove the keyword cosmetic if they weren't at least leaving it open to consideration.
The changed the wording but it pretty much means the same thing. I assume it will be very similar to the GW1 shop. Never shopped from it but never felt like I was underpowered for not doing so. Which is part of the point being made here - the whole p2w nonsense. Nobody mentions that WoW has a perfectly FINE shop that doesn't sell power.
All I think of is Blizzard throwing around their money in order to discredit GW 2.
Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?
It sounds like they changed from cosmetic only cash shop, to a "pay to skip" cash shop where you can spend money to buy items that you can get by otherwise grinding.
It may sound innocent, but a lot of games that do this will make it take DAYS of grinding to get an item that you can pay $2.50 for instead. So the danger is really that the cash shop can negatively affect the game design.
I must say, I'm worried. I just hope that ANet doesn't implement a cash shop that hurts the game.
I will also say though, that it is possible to have a cash shop like this that doesn't really hurt the game. Like say, LoL. I think LoL's cash shop is fine...they sell you characters that they put actual work into making. As long as this is how GW2's cash shop works, then I will have no problem with it.
I just don't want ANet to come out with a new weapon every month that has a "+1" over the previous weapon and sell it for $. But, I will have faith in them not to do this until they prove otherwise.
"I can spend hours in game getting stuff before you because I can afford the time"
says the student/unemployed/house-bound/retired/reprobate
versus
"I can spend cash in game getting stuff before you because I can afford the cash"
says the family man/employed/busy/working/egomaniac
Sounds like balance at last!
That's all great in theory...
The problem occurs if and when the developer starts developing content to be more and more time consuming and tedious, with the intent of trying to get more players to just use the cash shop.
Considering that this MMO, and pretty much every other MMO, are made and run by a for profit companies, I think it's fairly safe to assume that there is a definite conflict of interest when it comes to "convenience" based cash shops in MMOs.
As usual, everybody just needs to calm down a bit. This change was done to actually make the wording easier to understand – seems like that was not the case.
But the statement in it is still the same: Nothing you will be able to buy in the in-game store will give you an advantage over people who are not buying anything. That is the baseline.
Tbh, I don't really give a damn about cash shops in any game, as long as I'm not paying excessive amounts just to play. I get that for some people cash shops may be a principle thing, but I just don't care if other people feel the need to blow huge amounts of money into them. Wasn't troubled by cash shops in any of the former MMO's I played incl GW, and don't plan to in the future.
Sweet another "let's blow everything out of proportion" thread. *bringing out the popcorn*
+1 I love this thread. Someone at the back of the ship shouts 'iceberg ahead' and everyone jumps over board; then they remember the ship is built by Arena-net and comes with a safety guarantee.
I noticed that previously it pretty much encompassed just cosmetic items. Now they updated it to include your character slots, bank slots, extra content. I think this was the main reason for the change. If it said only cosmetic items, you know people would have a fit if they seen new content in the store and the faq just said "cosmetic additions".
"A-net lied about what is in the shop!" Guaranteed rage thread created on the day some extra content show up.
You fanboys realize this statement means 1 thing. You can buy items that drop in game or go camp that item for a few hours.
Look at the wording.
Will there be micro-transactions or things to buy which don't come with the box, like character slots?
Yes, micro-transactions will exist. Be assured goods and items bought for cash in GW2 do not offer any advantage over those available in the game through the investment of time.
I bolded what is key here.
MEANING weapons, armor etc will be sold on the cash shop but they will be the same items that drop IN GAME. Yah not buying this one anymore. Even SOE hasnt sold in game armor/weapons on their cash shop yet and people bash them.
The meaning is the same it's just differently worded. All that statement is saying is that there will be cosmetics.. its just they won't have any STATS.
cosmetics is fine aslong they keep statted items out of the shop.
I noticed that previously it pretty much encompassed just cosmetic items. Now they updated it to include your character slots, bank slots, extra content. I think this was the main reason for the change. If it said only cosmetic items, you know people would have a fit if they seen new content in the store and the faq just said "cosmetic additions".
"A-net lied about what is in the shop!" Guaranteed rage thread created on the day some extra content show up.
Exactly... Yet people will believe that this new FAQ will mean that ArenaNet will start selling power.
Eitherway I'll give it a few days before all this blows over. Will be getting a ton of beta news, footage and articles soon, so this will be forgotten very soon. I guess it was the perfect timing for this FAQ change. lol
The meaning is the same it's just differently worded. All that statement is saying is that there will be cosmetics.. its just they won't have any STATS.
cosmetics is fine aslong they keep statted items out of the shop.
The meaning isnt the same they took out the word cosmetics on purpose. Read it again anyone who doesnt see what it means is blind.
The meaning is the same it's just differently worded. All that statement is saying is that there will be cosmetics.. its just they won't have any STATS.
No advantage doesn't exactly mean no stats, they could just be equal to those you find in the field.
lol, is anyone surprised that this is being misrepresented
I'm not saying that will happen, I also wouldn't care if it did. That's the thing with possibilities, they're all possible...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I noticed that previously it pretty much encompassed just cosmetic items. Now they updated it to include your character slots, bank slots, extra content. I think this was the main reason for the change. If it said only cosmetic items, you know people would have a fit if they seen new content in the store and the faq just said "cosmetic additions".
"A-net lied about what is in the shop!" Guaranteed rage thread created on the day some extra content show up.
Exactly... Yet people will believe that this new FAQ will mean that ArenaNet will start selling power.
Eitherway I'll give it a few days before all this blows over. Will be getting a ton of beta news, footage and articles soon, so this will be forgotten very soon. I guess it was the perfect timing for this FAQ change. lol
Yes, micro-transactions will exist. Be assured goods and items bought for cash in GW2 do not offer any advantage over those available in the game through the investment of time.
YOU CANNOT get extra character slots through time investment nor can you get extra content or bank slots through TIME INVESTMENT. Do you not see what it means ? Look what i bolded and think what does it mean again what items can you get IN GAME through the investment of time. This opens the door for them to sell ANY item through the cash shop that you can get through the investmente of time IN GAME.
I'm actually glad they broadened the definition. GW2 is much more expensive to produce than GW1 and they need to generate that revenue. I keep throwing money at my monitor but ArenaNet isn't taking it yet.
I think people need to take the blinders off. This statement clearly says no item on the cash shop will be better then what you can get in game through the investment of time. Meaning if item x drops in game they can sell item x on the cash shop.
I'm actually glad they broadened the definition. GW2 is much more expensive to produce than GW1 and they need to generate that revenue. I keep throwing money at my monitor but ArenaNet isn't taking it yet.
I actually think its smart i just wont be buying it.
You want content updates ? You want patches and expansions ? They need money and with no monthly fee they have no revenue stream to fund these things. Simply put people the box price doesnt even cover development cost for most MMOs let alone content updates and future patching/expansions.
I noticed that previously it pretty much encompassed just cosmetic items. Now they updated it to include your character slots, bank slots, extra content. I think this was the main reason for the change. If it said only cosmetic items, you know people would have a fit if they seen new content in the store and the faq just said "cosmetic additions".
"A-net lied about what is in the shop!" Guaranteed rage thread created on the day some extra content show up.
Exactly... Yet people will believe that this new FAQ will mean that ArenaNet will start selling power.
Eitherway I'll give it a few days before all this blows over. Will be getting a ton of beta news, footage and articles soon, so this will be forgotten very soon. I guess it was the perfect timing for this FAQ change. lol
Yes, micro-transactions will exist. Be assured goods and items bought for cash in GW2 do not offer any advantage over those available in the game through the investment of time.
YOU CANNOT get extra character slots through time investment nor can you get extra content or bank slots through TIME INVESTMENT. Do you not see what it means ? Look what i bolded and think what does it mean again what items can you get IN GAME through the investment of time. This opens the door for them to sell ANY item through the cash shop that you can get through the investmente of time IN GAME.
The existing CS in GW sell exactly what you say and all GW players are fine with it. Who cares, anyway.
You fanboys realize this statement means 1 thing. You can buy items that drop in game or go camp that item for a few hours.
Look at the wording.
Will there be micro-transactions or things to buy which don't come with the box, like character slots?
Yes, micro-transactions will exist. Be assured goods and items bought for cash in GW2 do not offer any advantage over those available in the game through the investment of time.
I bolded what is key here.
MEANING weapons, armor etc will be sold on the cash shop but they will be the same items that drop IN GAME. Yah not buying this one anymore. Even SOE hasnt sold in game armor/weapons on their cash shop yet and people bash them.
First, I would argue that the part in red is not necessarily true. Their statement is that whatever is sold in the shop, it won't offer an advantage. There's no guarantee they'll sell ANY items in the store, much less the same items that drop in game.. For one thing, there's such a thing as a Transmutation Stone which allows you to combine the stats of one piece of armor with the look of another. It will be available both in game though Karma vendors as well as in the store. There's no advantage inherent to them.
Secondly, even if it were true, GW2 is not a gear based progression game. You can get max power pretty easily, then you do hard dungeons (or grind Karma or PVP or craft or whatever) to get a badass skin. Even IF they sold level 80 armor (and you couldn't wear it until 80) then it would be almost entirely meaningless. It's not Pay to Win and it's almost imperceptible Pay to Skip. It's like Pay to Wear Armor From The Store So We Can All Laugh At You For Having Paid Real Money For It.
The Hall of Monuments gives people unique skins for their achievements in GW1. There will be no advantage to having them. It's essentially the same thing. Get unique skins for having busted your ass in GW1, or get them because you want to pay to look cool. There's no advantage there.
If GW2 turns out to be Pay to Win or even significant Pay to Skip, I'll be the first one to turn on it. Until then, people are really blowing this out of proportion, especially when, as they say, their intent was to clarify the meaning of the original message, not change the message.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Comments
that change seems to indicate that there will be content related cash shop stuff u could purchase similar to gw1.
Looking forward to EQL and EQN.
It's a case of
"I can spend hours in game getting stuff before you because I can afford the time"
says the student/unemployed/house-bound/retired/reprobate
versus
"I can spend cash in game getting stuff before you because I can afford the cash"
says the family man/employed/busy/working/egomaniac
Sounds like balance at last!
He had nothing better to do? Or he simply reads guildwars2guru where everything gets blown out of proportions. The people over there overanalyse everything. Hell if an employee from ArenaNet spelt the word overanalyze as overanalyse they would analyse that too!
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
what past action? GW2 bears almost not relation to the costs and model of GW1, and they wouldn't have changed it to remove the keyword cosmetic if they weren't at least leaving it open to consideration.
LOL! +1 to you sir.
Sorroe, Human Mesmer
Jade Quarry Server
The changed the wording but it pretty much means the same thing. I assume it will be very similar to the GW1 shop. Never shopped from it but never felt like I was underpowered for not doing so. Which is part of the point being made here - the whole p2w nonsense. Nobody mentions that WoW has a perfectly FINE shop that doesn't sell power.
All I think of is Blizzard throwing around their money in order to discredit GW 2.
Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?
Hmmm...I don't like it.
It sounds like they changed from cosmetic only cash shop, to a "pay to skip" cash shop where you can spend money to buy items that you can get by otherwise grinding.
It may sound innocent, but a lot of games that do this will make it take DAYS of grinding to get an item that you can pay $2.50 for instead. So the danger is really that the cash shop can negatively affect the game design.
I must say, I'm worried. I just hope that ANet doesn't implement a cash shop that hurts the game.
I will also say though, that it is possible to have a cash shop like this that doesn't really hurt the game. Like say, LoL. I think LoL's cash shop is fine...they sell you characters that they put actual work into making. As long as this is how GW2's cash shop works, then I will have no problem with it.
I just don't want ANet to come out with a new weapon every month that has a "+1" over the previous weapon and sell it for $. But, I will have faith in them not to do this until they prove otherwise.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
That's all great in theory...
The problem occurs if and when the developer starts developing content to be more and more time consuming and tedious, with the intent of trying to get more players to just use the cash shop.
Considering that this MMO, and pretty much every other MMO, are made and run by a for profit companies, I think it's fairly safe to assume that there is a definite conflict of interest when it comes to "convenience" based cash shops in MMOs.
According to Anet community manager here:
As usual, everybody just needs to calm down a bit. This change was done to actually make the wording easier to understand – seems like that was not the case.
But the statement in it is still the same: Nothing you will be able to buy in the in-game store will give you an advantage over people who are not buying anything. That is the baseline.
EDIT: Oh for pete's sake, BBCode should work.
+1 I love this thread. Someone at the back of the ship shouts 'iceberg ahead' and everyone jumps over board; then they remember the ship is built by Arena-net and comes with a safety guarantee.
I think you were a little late. But agreed, and can I have some popcorn? *Leans over to take a handfull*
I noticed that previously it pretty much encompassed just cosmetic items. Now they updated it to include your character slots, bank slots, extra content. I think this was the main reason for the change. If it said only cosmetic items, you know people would have a fit if they seen new content in the store and the faq just said "cosmetic additions".
"A-net lied about what is in the shop!" Guaranteed rage thread created on the day some extra content show up.
BOOYAKA!
You fanboys realize this statement means 1 thing. You can buy items that drop in game or go camp that item for a few hours.
Look at the wording.
Will there be micro-transactions or things to buy which don't come with the box, like character slots?
Yes, micro-transactions will exist. Be assured goods and items bought for cash in GW2 do not offer any advantage over those available in the game through the investment of time.
I bolded what is key here.
MEANING weapons, armor etc will be sold on the cash shop but they will be the same items that drop IN GAME. Yah not buying this one anymore. Even SOE hasnt sold in game armor/weapons on their cash shop yet and people bash them.
cosmetics is fine aslong they keep statted items out of the shop.
Exactly... Yet people will believe that this new FAQ will mean that ArenaNet will start selling power.
Eitherway I'll give it a few days before all this blows over. Will be getting a ton of beta news, footage and articles soon, so this will be forgotten very soon. I guess it was the perfect timing for this FAQ change. lol
The meaning isnt the same they took out the word cosmetics on purpose. Read it again anyone who doesnt see what it means is blind.
I'm not saying that will happen, I also wouldn't care if it did. That's the thing with possibilities, they're all possible...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Yes, micro-transactions will exist. Be assured goods and items bought for cash in GW2 do not offer any advantage over those available in the game through the investment of time.
YOU CANNOT get extra character slots through time investment nor can you get extra content or bank slots through TIME INVESTMENT. Do you not see what it means ? Look what i bolded and think what does it mean again what items can you get IN GAME through the investment of time. This opens the door for them to sell ANY item through the cash shop that you can get through the investmente of time IN GAME.
I'm actually glad they broadened the definition. GW2 is much more expensive to produce than GW1 and they need to generate that revenue. I keep throwing money at my monitor but ArenaNet isn't taking it yet.
I think people need to take the blinders off. This statement clearly says no item on the cash shop will be better then what you can get in game through the investment of time. Meaning if item x drops in game they can sell item x on the cash shop.
I actually think its smart i just wont be buying it.
You want content updates ? You want patches and expansions ? They need money and with no monthly fee they have no revenue stream to fund these things. Simply put people the box price doesnt even cover development cost for most MMOs let alone content updates and future patching/expansions.
The existing CS in GW sell exactly what you say and all GW players are fine with it. Who cares, anyway.
First, I would argue that the part in red is not necessarily true. Their statement is that whatever is sold in the shop, it won't offer an advantage. There's no guarantee they'll sell ANY items in the store, much less the same items that drop in game.. For one thing, there's such a thing as a Transmutation Stone which allows you to combine the stats of one piece of armor with the look of another. It will be available both in game though Karma vendors as well as in the store. There's no advantage inherent to them.
Secondly, even if it were true, GW2 is not a gear based progression game. You can get max power pretty easily, then you do hard dungeons (or grind Karma or PVP or craft or whatever) to get a badass skin. Even IF they sold level 80 armor (and you couldn't wear it until 80) then it would be almost entirely meaningless. It's not Pay to Win and it's almost imperceptible Pay to Skip. It's like Pay to Wear Armor From The Store So We Can All Laugh At You For Having Paid Real Money For It.
The Hall of Monuments gives people unique skins for their achievements in GW1. There will be no advantage to having them. It's essentially the same thing. Get unique skins for having busted your ass in GW1, or get them because you want to pay to look cool. There's no advantage there.
If GW2 turns out to be Pay to Win or even significant Pay to Skip, I'll be the first one to turn on it. Until then, people are really blowing this out of proportion, especially when, as they say, their intent was to clarify the meaning of the original message, not change the message.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007