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So hardcore hype with massive boxsales is the new thing?
Torgrim
Member CommonPosts: 2,088
Whatever happend to a game you could stay for atleast a year or even more, now what do we have?
People drop after a month, after 2 month more people drop, It's not like the old days when you were a kid or even older and you played a game and you played it a lot but after many tries and many weeks you completed it and you feelt joy and a sence of a accomplichement , yeah i did it, what happened to that era of gaming?
It's gone, MMO has been mainstream for so many years and what they are doing is mass produced it, do massive hype, tell people to pree order and live and laugh all the way to the bank with all the box sales.
1 month later 50% dropped who don't want to resub, second months even more drops.
Who cares really the gaming studio earned the money before the drop via massive hype and box sales and can turn back and plan for the next big thing to sucker the gamers into forking out money.
Sad that this industry going this way, quality is one thing of the past, mass production and mass consumers ride ticket is here to stay.
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
Comments
That does seem to be the trend rather its by design or just how it is working out recently I don't know. Sell a ton of box's, milk subs for as long as you can, than relaunch as F2P.
The only MMORPG that I have seen hyped, in it's true sense, recently is SWtOR... what others have helped you come to this conclusion?
Interested players talking about the game excitedly on a forum doesn't count as 'hardcore hype' btw imo.
Because games are being released more frequently..back in the day there were only 3 or 4 mmo's to choose from now there are hundreds.
Well, it's easier for the devs to do it that way then just building a game that retains people I guess.
I think the word "retain" is forgotten.
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
Lots of hype, lots of promises, no delivery. It seems a lot of companies are getting their money up front through new unscroupulous practices. Once the game goes live, everything falls apart and people leave in droves after a month or 2. After Cataclysm I quit a month after release. Since then , Ive only been able to play a few games, Rift, SWTOR and Diablo 3 ... every one for just a month.
At this point, Id just soon sell my computer. The only game even remotely interesting to me is Archeage and that is a ways off for NA. Every other GD MMO is basically the same s hit with a little twist that just isn't enough to set it apart from any game before it. Ah well, enough b itcing I guess ....
People complained about games. How long it took to progress, mob grinding, quest grinding, gear grinding, skill point grinding, travel times and such. Changes were made, now nobody should be surprised that games are too short. Now someone might open their piehole about "just adding more content rather than grinds". Duh, content is EXPENSIVE TO CREATE.
If anyone ever complained about those things I mentioned, then you are part of the problem.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
The whole culture of mmo's has changed over the years. It used to be just for mature or geeky players but nowadays its pretty much a mix of all types. including the 'wow kiddies'. Theres also so many available and news ones coming out all the time that people just come and go and play them inbetween single players.
I remember playing daoc back in its prime, you would happily hand items over to random strangers on your servers city to mule them to another character. Everyone was trustworthy and the community was nothing like what you see on mmo's today. Im certian if i handed anything of value to anyone in stormwind on wow i wouldnt get it back.
Huh? and what exactly was hyped, if you don't mind me asking?
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
- in the beginning there weren't many MMO's to choose from at all, so people stuck longer with the MMO they were playing. Just like in the old days you had whole nations watching a television show when there was only a few channels.
- people were new to MMO's, you're a lot more forgiving and less jaded when it's all new and fresh to you and therefore exciting.
- MMO's of old used mechanics that most MMO gamers, even the oldtimers, won't tolerate anymore or consider just ok these days. The most obvious one, mob grinding. You could spend 1000+ hours grinding away to level cap by killing mobs, yet most people, oldtimers as well, won't be satisfied with that anymore.Simply put, people these days including the MMO vets need more to stay with the same MMORPG, they're not as easily thrilled anymore as they were in their early MMO years and the flood of MMO's has become abundant.
Huh? and what exactly was hyped, if you don't mind me asking?
Maybe he just means that only for TOR the hype was artificial or false, where for all other MMO's (probably he means GW2) the hype is justified and therefore no hype but sincere excitement. Or something like that... >.>You know, WoW wasn't full of WoW kiddies all the time.
The first year after launch, when there weren't even a few million members there were no WoW kiddies at all.
The community was very different from what it is now.
Even if GW2 is the best thing ever, people will still leave to check out ES:O and perhaps Archeage and Titan and EQ3 when they're released. Let's face it, we're all MMO tourists, and unlike the old days, nothing coming out soon looks so vastly superior to the competition that it won't stay that way.
The old adage, gameplay over graphics still stands. However, I can't believe how piss poor graphics and gameplay have gotten over the years. Ive yet to see an MMO with better spell graphics then City of Heroes., or smoother gameplay then WoW. I understand that these games are polished, but come on it's 2012, are we regressing technologically or what?
But that's the bad thing with hype and getting hyped.
When you're to much anticipating, chances are little it'll keep your attention cause they will wake up that same hype in you for another game 3 months later.
Better to let it come by surprise.
I don't follow games anymore untill the last month or so. Following games before release makes me sick.
thats seems to be the model of the future. every game will have cash-shop, ready for conversion latest after 12 month, when subs dropped enough. conversion will already be planned and prepared pre-launch. its a very appropriate model in order to siphon off profits.
played: Everquest I (6 years), EVE (3 years)
months: EQII, Vanguard, Siedler Online, SWTOR, Guild Wars 2
weeks: WoW, Shaiya, Darkfall, Florensia, Entropia, Aion, Lotro, Fallen Earth, Uncharted Waters
days: DDO, RoM, FFXIV, STO, Atlantica, PotBS, Maestia, WAR, AoC, Gods&Heroes, Cultures, RIFT, Forsaken World, Allodds
But SWTOR didnt have any hype beyond the fact it was SW ip and made by Bioware, which is pretty obvious.
also not to forget the hype about the story focus, which it is.
I want to know what was hyped about TOR... because if anybody were hyped about the stuff above, than thats their own fault...
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
You ought to use "IMO" more often. I was a little offended as I am sure many "MMO vets" are that you said MMOs arent made with old style mechanics because they are no longer wanted. When in my opinion, its just an influx of new gamers who dont want the old hard work=accomplishment anymore. I believe there are still a number of people who would enjoy a hardcore game if it had the depth that older games had. Its developers trying to drive the market in a new direction and new players and a whole other slew of things that is changing the MMO market.
It might be your desire to press an easy button to hit level 80 and then expect a plethora of new and interesting instances to experience over and over, in "endgame". But with fun party dynamics and jobs/classes that are a thrill to play, I really enjoy grinding hardcore to lvl 80 over the course of a few months and enjoying periodic level appropriate content througout such a journey. I also liek that I can work hard at farming or crafting or something to make money, or benefit from having a longtime playing friend, and have interesting gear on my lvl 15 character, that won't be useless in a few hours or less.
I could ramble for hours...
I love snails.
I love every kinda snail.
I just want to hug them all, but I cant.
Cant hug every snail.
Just checking, so I am clear on it, you are asking me how SWtOR was massively commercially hyped?
I am checking because I don't get how anyone could be unaware of the fact
Wow. So this is one of the fabled 'vets' of the MMO industry. You talk about 'hard work' and 'hardcore grinding' for a 'few months'. MMORPGs are not a job dude. They are games, and should be fun. Not 2% of the time when you're not grinding, not only after 500 hours of boredom, but the *whole* way through. That is what modern MMOs get wrong. Quite frankly, for most people, SPRPGs are more fun, and have moved forward, while MMORPGs have not.
The whole concept of an MMO revolves around timesinks, but fun ones.
I think its interesting that you think a game should be made up only of the 2% of the fun content that used to be in these horrible MMOs of the past. Thats one of the biggest issues with MMOs nowadays.
Nothing worthwhile is ever easy. Thats why playing the "fun" content in an MMO only is not going to be successful...but we'll see how long that takes to sink in. If ever.
I love snails.
I love every kinda snail.
I just want to hug them all, but I cant.
Cant hug every snail.
With respect....those games died for a reason, did they not?
I agree with you an MMO should be fun. Tinesinks, however, were never anything else other than a way to hel a company make money. They made money by sub sales, they kept you for longer by making it take longer to get what you wanted. Therefor by feeding you timesinks, they made more money.
That's not to say I can't appreciate time spent. I remember grinding reps in EQ. I once camped a rare spawn for 28 hours nearly consecutively. And the accomplishment of that effort paying off is something I still carry with me. But for every moment like that,I have 15 horror stories about corpse runs gone wrong, spending hours begging for a port, spending MORE hours begging for a spot in a mob spawn camp in Commons or Karnor's or Curshbone or...well you get it. I remember missing a boat because I went to pee and making my team wait over 40 minutes longer before we coulds tart playing.
That's not to say we should take the Fast Food/WoW Express route and hand everything off in a few minutes. But I think a better balance needs to be reached. Keep me in your game for as long as you want...but design me an experience that I will enjoy ALL the time.
No it is not sad. In the old days, there are so few MMOs that you have no choice but to play one for a long time. That is no longer the case.
Any game gets old. Obviously your tolerance is different from me. However, given a single player game last like a week, and a good one last only a few weeks, a year is a LONG LONG time in gaming.
I don't see any value in sticking with one game for a long time, unless it is really good, and have very frequent content update. It is simply, for me and probably for many, more fun to play different games, instead of sticking to one.
And technology like the battlenet (and other social networking like steam) let friends stay together even if you are playing different games.
You said it yourself, narius. If it is a really good game that is adequately updated, there is "value" in sticking around. This genre is about progressing your character, so why bother in the first place if it's ultimately just a disposable title? A great mmo keeps people wanting more. Crap mmos do not.
While you may fancy the trendy behaviour of game hopping, it is a serious sign that something is wrong with the industry. Remember, we're not talking about SPGs here. You shouldn't want to skip around like a school girl from game to game.
Sad only begins to describe the current state of the genre.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Yeah, but the converse is not true. If it is a good game but with limited content, why wouldn't i play a few hours and move on? There is no reason why i shouldn't have a few weeks, or days of fun?
Sticking around is an option, not a must.
And why would game hopping be bad? Seeking variety is a human nature. Certainly i am not saying there is anything wrong to stick with a game, but i don't see it as a must-have for a good game.
So what is wrong to play many games, and having fun at each of them?