Part of the reason we put CoE up on Steam Greenlight was to gauge peoples' interest in having CoE available via Steam.
"So we posted CoE to Greenlight first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter.
Every person from the Steam community that learns about CoE and comes here and backs it, helps to make CoE a reality. "
"By putting CoE in front of more people now that we're at the 90% mark, and most of the Early Birds are gone, we've ensured a steady stream of interested backerswho will not only help to raise us above our funding goals, but will also help add value to those who've already backed us."
"Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. It means we've given the Steam community an opportunity to tell Valve whether or not they'd like us on Steam. At this point there's no commitment. It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community.
So how I understand it is that SS would have asked people to vote to get the game available on Steam, but their primary goal would have been to advertise the Kickstarter campaign to the Steam community.
It looks to me like SS is telling their CoE fans to not worry about Steam, that they share their concerns about the Steam community and use this platform primarily as advertisement, while at the same time they effectively inform the Steam community that they're interested in making the game available on their platform. (What is Steam Greenlight? Steam Greenlight is a system that enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.)
You literally bring nothing up here.
The quote you actually refer to even says "PART of the reason". Of course they wanted extra publicity for their kickstarter. Where did they say they didn't? This might blow your mind, but sometimes one action can serve two different purposes at once, like gauging interest while also increasing exposure.
Now if he had said "The ENTIRE reason we put CoE up on steam greenlight..." you might have a point.
But he didn't, so you really have got nothing but hot hair here.
PK'ers will read open world PvP and want in, no matter if they see this on Steam or KS. Goons from Eve are already interested, you know what that means.
It means they lost in EVE and need a new game to feel powerful again?
Besides, Goons like space. There is Star Citizen for that particular itch.
For all the people saying "good marketing means you should not insult your customer base!" .,.. you clearly have not been paying attention to the Republican Primaries. Getting noticed amongst the thousands of games and millions of entertainment options is what marketing is all about. So by all means keep on flogging the dead horse, indeed make up all kinds of new outrageous accusations if you want to. It worked perfectly for Star Citizen, who had everyone's attention after DS had a meltdown hissyfit.
Marketing is about getting noticed. And for that, anyone who jumps up and down in a thread like this one saying Soulbound Studios is bad at marketing should pause and realize that they already have your undivided attention. They are better than you think, and yes they make some endearing slips so they are definitely computer game makers rather than a slick marketing firm pretending to know how to code, but that just makes me really want to see this game they are making all the more.
I usually tell trolls to go away. But on second thoughts, do your worst. Indeed go all over the internet making shit up if you want. Soulbound will stand in the spotlight and patiently explain their rope design philosophy, everyone will go "hang on, this guy is really intelligent ... and honest ... and the trolls are wrong. Where can I get this game again?".
Part of the reason we put CoE up on Steam Greenlight was to gauge peoples' interest in having CoE available via Steam.
"So we posted CoE to Greenlight first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter.
Every person from the Steam community that learns about CoE and comes here and backs it, helps to make CoE a reality. "
"By putting CoE in front of more people now that we're at the 90% mark, and most of the Early Birds are gone, we've ensured a steady stream of interested backerswho will not only help to raise us above our funding goals, but will also help add value to those who've already backed us."
"Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. It means we've given the Steam community an opportunity to tell Valve whether or not they'd like us on Steam. At this point there's no commitment. It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community.
So how I understand it is that SS would have asked people to vote to get the game available on Steam, but their primary goal would have been to advertise the Kickstarter campaign to the Steam community.
It looks to me like SS is telling their CoE fans to not worry about Steam, that they share their concerns about the Steam community and use this platform primarily as advertisement, while at the same time they effectively inform the Steam community that they're interested in making the game available on their platform. (What is Steam Greenlight? Steam Greenlight is a system that enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.)
You literally bring nothing up here.
The quote you actually refer to even says "PART of the reason". Of course they wanted extra publicity for their kickstarter. Where did they say they didn't? This might blow your mind, but sometimes one action can serve two different purposes at once, like gauging interest while also increasing exposure.
Now if he had said "The ENTIRE reason we put CoE up on steam greenlight..." you might have a point.
But he didn't, so you really have got nothing but hot hair here.
I'll rephrase my message, hopefully it will help. SS writes: 1) "It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community." 2) "[...] first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter." 3) "Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. [...]"
Steam Greenlight FAQ: 1) "[...] enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.
So, as I mentioned, SS seems to use a system that is meant to let users pick new games being released on Steam, while at the same time telling their fans that the decision to go on Steam isn't made and it's mostly to get Steam users to back CoE.
I noticed this thread and wanted to take a moment to provide clarification on a few different points.
First, Lindsey's remark about the maturity of the general steam gamer wasn't meant to be a dis, trash talking, or any other slight. Most of us at Soulbound Studios are Steam gamers as well (who's not?).
When we made our announcement that we had joined the Steam Greenlight program, a non-trivial amount of concern was expressed both from within and outside of the Kickstarter community about the side-effects that might have on the game.
The concern was simple. Our game is designed for an audience that's a bit older. Systems like Bolstering, OPCs, etc. are designed to balance the game out to be equitable for people who have limited amounts of free time. As a result, our analytics continue to show we're most popular with the 30+ audience. Those people who grew up with the early MMOs like Ultima Online, or even played text-based MUDs.
That said, Steam is a huge audience, and not all of the players on Steam fall within our target demographic. The introduction of a large number of players to which the game wasn't inherently designed for can lead to negative publicity, unfair criticism, and even a shift in player dynamics away from our ideal toward something else entirely. Lindsey's remark was meant solely to re-assure players that we're aware of the impact a broader age range can have on the game, and we're considering that with regard to whether or not we ultimately sell via Steam.
That being said, while there was initially concern about the Steam player base's response to CoE, so far the responses have been nothing but positive. We're really pleased with how well received the game has been on Steam, and so far the sub-community there that has taken an interest in CoE are exactly the players we're hoping for.
With respect to us selling on Steam, we were undecided from the beginning. We made that clear in our initial announcement. Part of the reason we put CoE up on Steam Greenlight was to gauge peoples' interest in having CoE available via Steam. If there wasn't much interest, or if the response was negative or overly critical, it would suggest it wasn't the best idea. However, the response has been positive - extremely positive, and so we're taking that into consideration.
From a business standpoint, Steam is a huge market, which stands to greatly increase the number of potential players. On the other hand, sometimes more players isn't necessarily better. We're trying to build not only a game with CoE, but a community and an experience. We have to consider the impact having a larger, untargeted audience will have on the game. So far, I'm not overly concerned. Do I think we'll end up on Steam at some point? Most likely. The community response has been great thus far, and I'm confident the game's features speak for themselves. The players we attract will be the players who are truly looking for a game like CoE, which means there's really no downside to being on Steam.
Thanks! -Jeromy Walsh
Your game is designed for an audience a bit older? So how will you stop young people under 30 from playing? You can't. Steam is full of millions of gamers 30-60+ in age. They started playing on there way back in the day half life 1 and those games 15+ years ago. The ones that were young then are old gamers now and the ones that were in their 30s and 40s then are really old now.
Also the people backing your game that did not come from steam, how did you determine that they are mature people? They are the same people that we find in every game. Some are mature, some are not.
If people criticize your game, then you need to make a better game, not hide. You pretty much posted here that if Steam users gave you a bad initial response you would say "screw steam, they are too immature for our game made for older, smarter people." Pretty dumb statement. Maturity has nothing to do with a persons opinion of a game.
Eve online is on steam, Sandbox games have been on steam more than anywhere else. Stuff like DayZ, ARK, RUST and about 20+ others. It has also been a place that revived MMORPGs such as D&D Online, LOTRO, and many others after they turned F2P. It also has housed Guild Wars games, The Secret World, Age of Conan, FFXIV, etc.
Not to mention all the realistic combat games like War of the Roses, Chivalry and Life is Feudal among many others.
So Steam houses all the games that your game draws inspiration from pretty much. People play those games and have made indie hits out of many games. How could your company ever think it would be a bad idea to go on there unless you know ahead of time your game is way off target of your projected release or some other problems you have and are scared it would be taken badly on there with poor reviews?
Thanks for the reply, hopefully you guys think better before posting such nonsense that could potentially harm your game by you making generalizations about which group of gamers is mature enough to play your game..
I'll rephrase my message, hopefully it will help. SS writes: 1) "It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community." 2) "[...] first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter." 3) "Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. [...]"
Steam Greenlight FAQ: 1) "[...] enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.
So, as I mentioned, SS seems to use a system that is meant to let users pick new games being released on Steam, while at the same time telling their fans that the decision to go on Steam isn't made and it's mostly to get Steam users to back CoE.
"I'm looking at Solar Energy companies in Japan" "Does that mean you're going to do business with companies in Japan" "No. It means i'm just looking for now to see what is out there"
...
"There are some promising engineers in Japan working on Solar Energy technology I didn't know about. I'm going to do business with them after all" "But when i asked before, you said 'no!'" ----------------
I noticed this thread and wanted to take a moment to provide clarification on a few different points.
First, Lindsey's remark about the maturity of the general steam gamer wasn't meant to be a dis, trash talking, or any other slight. Most of us at Soulbound Studios are Steam gamers as well (who's not?).
When we made our announcement that we had joined the Steam Greenlight program, a non-trivial amount of concern was expressed both from within and outside of the Kickstarter community about the side-effects that might have on the game.
The concern was simple. Our game is designed for an audience that's a bit older. Systems like Bolstering, OPCs, etc. are designed to balance the game out to be equitable for people who have limited amounts of free time. As a result, our analytics continue to show we're most popular with the 30+ audience. Those people who grew up with the early MMOs like Ultima Online, or even played text-based MUDs.
That said, Steam is a huge audience, and not all of the players on Steam fall within our target demographic. The introduction of a large number of players to which the game wasn't inherently designed for can lead to negative publicity, unfair criticism, and even a shift in player dynamics away from our ideal toward something else entirely. Lindsey's remark was meant solely to re-assure players that we're aware of the impact a broader age range can have on the game, and we're considering that with regard to whether or not we ultimately sell via Steam.
That being said, while there was initially concern about the Steam player base's response to CoE, so far the responses have been nothing but positive. We're really pleased with how well received the game has been on Steam, and so far the sub-community there that has taken an interest in CoE are exactly the players we're hoping for.
With respect to us selling on Steam, we were undecided from the beginning. We made that clear in our initial announcement. Part of the reason we put CoE up on Steam Greenlight was to gauge peoples' interest in having CoE available via Steam. If there wasn't much interest, or if the response was negative or overly critical, it would suggest it wasn't the best idea. However, the response has been positive - extremely positive, and so we're taking that into consideration.
From a business standpoint, Steam is a huge market, which stands to greatly increase the number of potential players. On the other hand, sometimes more players isn't necessarily better. We're trying to build not only a game with CoE, but a community and an experience. We have to consider the impact having a larger, untargeted audience will have on the game. So far, I'm not overly concerned. Do I think we'll end up on Steam at some point? Most likely. The community response has been great thus far, and I'm confident the game's features speak for themselves. The players we attract will be the players who are truly looking for a game like CoE, which means there's really no downside to being on Steam.
Thanks! -Jeromy Walsh
Your game is designed for an audience a bit older? So how will you stop young people under 30 from playing? You can't. Steam is full of millions of gamers 30-60+ in age. They started playing on there way back in the day half life 1 and those games 15+ years ago. The ones that were young then are old gamers now and the ones that were in their 30s and 40s then are really old now.
Also the people backing your game that did not come from steam, how did you determine that they are mature people? They are the same people that we find in every game. Some are mature, some are not.
If people criticize your game, then you need to make a better game, not hide. You pretty much posted here that if Steam users gave you a bad initial response you would say "screw steam, they are too immature for our game made for older, smarter people." Pretty dumb statement. Maturity has nothing to do with a persons opinion of a game.
Eve online is on steam, Sandbox games have been on steam more than anywhere else. Stuff like DayZ, ARK, RUST and about 20+ others. It has also been a place that revived MMORPGs such as D&D Online, LOTRO, and many others after they turned F2P. It also has housed Guild Wars games, The Secret World, Age of Conan, FFXIV, etc.
Not to mention all the realistic combat games like War of the Roses, Chivalry and Life is Feudal among many others.
So Steam houses all the games that your game draws inspiration from pretty much. People play those games and have made indie hits out of many games. How could your company ever think it would be a bad idea to go on there unless you know ahead of time your game is way off target of your projected release or some other problems you have and are scared it would be taken badly on there with poor reviews?
Thanks for the reply, hopefully you guys think better before posting such nonsense that could potentially harm your game by you making generalizations about which group of gamers is mature enough to play your game..
Hmm.. there is no correlation between immaturity and criticism?
So their argument is basicly that people over 30 are more inclined to give positive feedback? Is that the bulk of their argument?
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
Did someone hurt your feelings. Devs can say whatever the hell they want say, if your offended dont buy it. We dont all need to know how sensitive you are.
I'll rephrase my message, hopefully it will help. SS writes: 1) "It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community." 2) "[...] first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter." 3) "Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. [...]"
Steam Greenlight FAQ: 1) "[...] enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.
So, as I mentioned, SS seems to use a system that is meant to let users pick new games being released on Steam, while at the same time telling their fans that the decision to go on Steam isn't made and it's mostly to get Steam users to back CoE.
"I'm looking at Solar Energy companies in Japan" "Does that mean you're going to do business with companies in Japan" "No. It means i'm just looking for now to see what is out there"
...
"There are some promising engineers in Japan working on Solar Energy technology I didn't know about. I'm going to do business with them after all" "But when i asked before, you said 'no!'" ----------------
You see how that logic falls apart?
I think it's pretty different. Steam is a platform used to distribute games. Submitting a project to Greenlight is pretty different than what your example describes I guess.
"The community has shown their interest in this game. Valve has reached out to this developer to start moving things toward release on Steam."
"Steam Greenlight is a system that enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam."
"Games are submitted to Steam Greenlight in various stages of completion. Once a game has been Greenlit, Valve will reach out to the developer to determine their timeline for finishing their game and launching on Steam."
"Once your game has been Greenlit, you will need a single individual or entity that will be paid for sales of your product."
"Once your game is Greenlit, you will receive an e-mail at the address associated with the account that posted your submission. This e-mail will notify you of your product's Greenlighting and will invite you to begin filling out the digital paperwork."
They could probably halt the process and decline to have CoE released on Steam though.
What's wrong with people nowadays? Somebody says something mildly offensive, if that, then some guy completely blows it out of proportion on a gaming forum.
Someone says the steam community is generally immature, and because you use steam, you take it as a personal attack.
How are you offended by this unless you are in fact a 5-year old steam user. Get a reality check. There are annoying youngsters all over on Steam. Inescapable. I am a frequent steam user all around and I'm an adult. Do I get offended when somebody tells me that there are immature brats on it? No. I'm actually not an immature brat myself and I'm an adult that knows right from wrong and doesn't give a shit when something isn't directed at myself. So unless you're the immature brat that game developer was referring to. What the heck are you doing? Grow up a little.
Another thing. Lots of gaming studios have no wishes to be on Steam. Hell I can assure you that 90% of the games on steam wished they didn't -have- to be on steam if they were able to keep up with the large consumer base it has due to the hefty cut Steams take on sales and so forth if you publish your game on their platform. The main reason games go on their in the first place is to increase their customer base but in no way should a big game like Elyria feel the need to get on it asap. If anything, it might be a last resort. (Look at Wildstar but I am not saying Steam is bad because it's awesome although it is not something gaming studios want to go to unless they feel it will pay off)
So it is kinda wrong to suggest from the get-go for a game like Elyria to go on Steam unless it needs the extra boost even with the downside of Steam taking a share off your game. Again unnecessary at this point.
(They went on greenlight for the free publicity btw without having to deal with Steam taking a cut. Which is only natural.)
It's one thing for an established company to have this sort of policy. If I had a designer clothing label I probably wont jump at the chance to sell it at walmart. Because you do have to worry about your brand and how people perceive it. But this isn't an established company. They have nothing to sell, just an idea. And even if you do have an established brand, this is the kind of thing that buries you on the internet. Ask the fine bros. They also had an idea to sell.
I dont think it will be all that. But thats just cause most people have never heard of or care about CoE. And apparently the devs are intent to keep it that way. Which is a strange position to take when youre standing there with your hand out.
It's one thing for an established company to have this sort of policy. If I had a designer clothing label I probably wont jump at the chance to sell it at walmart. Because you do have to worry about your brand and how people perceive it. But this isn't an established company. They have nothing to sell, just an idea. And even if you do have an established brand, this is the kind of thing that buries you on the internet. Ask the fine bros. They also had an idea to sell.
I dont think it will be all that. But thats just cause most people have never heard of or care about CoE. And apparently the devs are intent to keep it that way. Which is a strange position to take when youre standing there with your hand out.
You think because a few people on this forum are offended, for a stupid reason, it's going to bury this company? Wow.
When I judge a company, I typically judge it based on their product. If they fail to produce what they promise. The fact that this infuriated so many people is crazy.
It's one thing for an established company to have this sort of policy. If I had a designer clothing label I probably wont jump at the chance to sell it at walmart. Because you do have to worry about your brand and how people perceive it. But this isn't an established company. They have nothing to sell, just an idea. And even if you do have an established brand, this is the kind of thing that buries you on the internet. Ask the fine bros. They also had an idea to sell.
I dont think it will be all that. But thats just cause most people have never heard of or care about CoE. And apparently the devs are intent to keep it that way. Which is a strange position to take when youre standing there with your hand out.
You think because a few people on this forum are offended, for a stupid reason, it's going to bury this company? Wow.
When I judge a company, I typically judge it based on their product. If they fail to produce what they promise. The fact that this infuriated so many people is crazy.
You missed like half the post. I said I dont think it wll be that way and I never said many people are offended because most people have never even heard of this project.
Do you think the few people here saying its not a big deal also speak for anyone? Weve seen the internet tear people apart for less.
John Smedley said something on twitter to the wrong scriptkid and got his company DDoSed and a month later he was sacked.
Smeds had a shitty reputation from SOE and how they completely destroyed, underfunded, and ignored quality games. He also called out a hacker.
If someone from the steam community attacks COE devs for this, it just proves their point.
Youre missing the point. What smed said was a comment directed at one person, this was a comment directed at millions of people potentially. Nobody can say for certain what the reaction would be, but its definetly the kind of comment that gets a reaction.
I dont think theyre in the business of proving points. Theyre in the business of selling games. And the steam community buys a lot of games. Its like me starting a camo jacket business and saying rednecks are stupid. I dont think the truth of the statement really matters. But at least when I die in a hunting accident my last words can be "see, I told you theyre stupid."
They could have worded that differently as to not offend anyone. Even keeping it simple by just stating they are undecided would have been better. The majority of people who game on PC use steam. It's that simple. That statement really does affect a very large number of gamers.
Maybe it's just me. But this seems to be getting blown out of proportion. Maybe I just don't care. I usually don't give any developer attention till I see the final product. *shrug*
@Iselin: I don't think Steam is a younger audience. That's why I said: "Steam is a huge audience, and not all of the players on Steam fall within our target demographic."
It's simply a bigger audience. With a larger audience comes people of all age ranges. But as Steam makes it easy to purchase new games without need for any research, it increases the likelihood that players outside our target demographic will purchase the game and potentially be unhappy.
Huh? Steam lets you describe the game on the store page clearly. It also has forums where people go to research within steam too.
Also age does not equal maturity at all. Why do you keep saying age? A 10 year old kid is not going to buy Chronicles of Elyria, nothing in it looks interesting to a kid.
But I mean a 18-21 year old might and might also be much more mature than some of these 30-40yr olds that you say your game caters to the most. Age is only a number. Lots of older gamers are also jaded, grumpy, closed minded etc too. I am 30+ and seen many of them my age and older that are just horrible to play with or against in any game.
The steam community in general is immature. Not sure why people would be offended by someone pointing out the obvious. Then again most internet forums are immature.
You are the very proof of immature internet forum poster user. How does that feel?
That is a problem of bold swaying statements and a reason why you avoid them.
khameleon said:
Huh? Steam lets you describe the game on the store page clearly. It also has forums where people go to research within steam too.
Also age does not equal maturity at all. Why do you keep saying age? A 10 year old kid is not going to buy Chronicles of Elyria, nothing in it looks interesting to a kid.
But I mean a 18-21 year old might and might also be much more mature than some of these 30-40yr olds that you say your game caters to the most. Age is only a number. Lots of older gamers are also jaded, grumpy, closed minded etc too. I am 30+ and seen many of them my age and older that are just horrible to play with or against in any game.
Of course, that is a no brainer.
His post, and stance on subject, is wrong on many levels but the most staggering about it is that he finds there is enough offended people to warrant public announcement, yet without actual apology. Instead, he "teaches" those about their "errors" - we did not insult anyone, you do not understand what we mean(because the very same people are apparently also stupid, right?).
The most worst thing you can say.
Jason Appleton, Tim Andreson, Jeromy Walsh. Seems cool to be offensive noname developer....
Part of the reason we put CoE up on Steam Greenlight was to gauge peoples' interest in having CoE available via Steam.
"So we posted CoE to Greenlight first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter.
Every person from the Steam community that learns about CoE and comes here and backs it, helps to make CoE a reality. "
"By putting CoE in front of more people now that we're at the 90% mark, and most of the Early Birds are gone, we've ensured a steady stream of interested backerswho will not only help to raise us above our funding goals, but will also help add value to those who've already backed us."
"Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. It means we've given the Steam community an opportunity to tell Valve whether or not they'd like us on Steam. At this point there's no commitment. It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community.
So how I understand it is that SS would have asked people to vote to get the game available on Steam, but their primary goal would have been to advertise the Kickstarter campaign to the Steam community.
It looks to me like SS is telling their CoE fans to not worry about Steam, that they share their concerns about the Steam community and use this platform primarily as advertisement, while at the same time they effectively inform the Steam community that they're interested in making the game available on their platform. (What is Steam Greenlight? Steam Greenlight is a system that enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.)
You literally bring nothing up here.
The quote you actually refer to even says "PART of the reason". Of course they wanted extra publicity for their kickstarter. Where did they say they didn't? This might blow your mind, but sometimes one action can serve two different purposes at once, like gauging interest while also increasing exposure.
Now if he had said "The ENTIRE reason we put CoE up on steam greenlight..." you might have a point.
But he didn't, so you really have got nothing but hot hair here.
I'll rephrase my message, hopefully it will help. SS writes: 1) "It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community." 2) "[...] first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter." 3) "Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. [...]"
Steam Greenlight FAQ: 1) "[...] enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.
So, as I mentioned, SS seems to use a system that is meant to let users pick new games being released on Steam, while at the same time telling their fans that the decision to go on Steam isn't made and it's mostly to get Steam users to back CoE.
Yet again this argument that they misused greenlight.
Also from the stram faq
There are two categories in Steam Greenlight: One for mostly-finished games seeking distribution via Steam and one for early builds and concepts that are simply seeking feedback from the community. You can choose the right category for your title when you post.
Therefore they didn't misuse steam as they used greenlight for publicity and as jeremy said feedback from the steam community as to whether they would be interested
Signed Davan Drakenhoff ruler of Castle Drakenhoff the impenatrable castle made from cardboard
I haven't found Steam users, in general, to be any better or any worse than most other 'communities' that exist on the internet. I suspect it has a younger base of members than most purely because it covers a huge number of games and a lot of them are cheap/free. I'm pretty ambivalent to releasing CoE on Steam, I imagine they probably will eventually so there's no point worrying about it.
Let's be honest though, there is nothing anyone could say that would sate the appetite of the game's detractors. They continue to post in a forum dedicated to a game in which they have no interest and I don't understand why they feel a need to do it. When I come across a game that doesn't interest me, I ignore it. I don't go to their forums and start stirring things up and trying to make trouble.
lunawisp was my peacebringer in City of Heroes. She lives on, in memory, as my gaming id
Comments
The quote you actually refer to even says "PART of the reason". Of course they wanted extra publicity for their kickstarter. Where did they say they didn't? This might blow your mind, but sometimes one action can serve two different purposes at once, like gauging interest while also increasing exposure.
Now if he had said "The ENTIRE reason we put CoE up on steam greenlight..." you might have a point.
But he didn't, so you really have got nothing but hot hair here.
It means they lost in EVE and need a new game to feel powerful again?
Besides, Goons like space. There is Star Citizen for that particular itch.
For all the people saying "good marketing means you should not insult your customer base!" .,.. you clearly have not been paying attention to the Republican Primaries. Getting noticed amongst the thousands of games and millions of entertainment options is what marketing is all about. So by all means keep on flogging the dead horse, indeed make up all kinds of new outrageous accusations if you want to. It worked perfectly for Star Citizen, who had everyone's attention after DS had a meltdown hissyfit.
Marketing is about getting noticed. And for that, anyone who jumps up and down in a thread like this one saying Soulbound Studios is bad at marketing should pause and realize that they already have your undivided attention. They are better than you think, and yes they make some endearing slips so they are definitely computer game makers rather than a slick marketing firm pretending to know how to code, but that just makes me really want to see this game they are making all the more.
I usually tell trolls to go away. But on second thoughts, do your worst. Indeed go all over the internet making shit up if you want. Soulbound will stand in the spotlight and patiently explain their rope design philosophy, everyone will go "hang on, this guy is really intelligent ... and honest ... and the trolls are wrong. Where can I get this game again?".
1) "It's simply a way for us to get more exposure and to hear from the Steam community."
2) "[...] first and foremost to increase awareness of the project, as well as awareness of our Kickstarter."
3) "Does that mean you'll be selling on Steam? No. [...]"
Steam Greenlight FAQ:
1) "[...] enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam.
So, as I mentioned, SS seems to use a system that is meant to let users pick new games being released on Steam, while at the same time telling their fans that the decision to go on Steam isn't made and it's mostly to get Steam users to back CoE.
Also the people backing your game that did not come from steam, how did you determine that they are mature people? They are the same people that we find in every game. Some are mature, some are not.
If people criticize your game, then you need to make a better game, not hide. You pretty much posted here that if Steam users gave you a bad initial response you would say "screw steam, they are too immature for our game made for older, smarter people." Pretty dumb statement. Maturity has nothing to do with a persons opinion of a game.
Eve online is on steam, Sandbox games have been on steam more than anywhere else. Stuff like DayZ, ARK, RUST and about 20+ others. It has also been a place that revived MMORPGs such as D&D Online, LOTRO, and many others after they turned F2P. It also has housed Guild Wars games, The Secret World, Age of Conan, FFXIV, etc.
Not to mention all the realistic combat games like War of the Roses, Chivalry and Life is Feudal among many others.
So Steam houses all the games that your game draws inspiration from pretty much. People play those games and have made indie hits out of many games. How could your company ever think it would be a bad idea to go on there unless you know ahead of time your game is way off target of your projected release or some other problems you have and are scared it would be taken badly on there with poor reviews?
Thanks for the reply, hopefully you guys think better before posting such nonsense that could potentially harm your game by you making generalizations about which group of gamers is mature enough to play your game..
GAME TIL YOU DIE!!!!
"Does that mean you're going to do business with companies in Japan"
"No. It means i'm just looking for now to see what is out there"
...
"There are some promising engineers in Japan working on Solar Energy technology I didn't know about. I'm going to do business with them after all"
"But when i asked before, you said 'no!'"
----------------
You see how that logic falls apart?
So their argument is basicly that people over 30 are more inclined to give positive feedback? Is that the bulk of their argument?
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
"The community has shown their interest in this game. Valve has reached out to this developer to start moving things toward release on Steam."
"Steam Greenlight is a system that enlists the community's help in picking some of the new games to be released on Steam."
"Games are submitted to Steam Greenlight in various stages of completion. Once a game has been Greenlit, Valve will reach out to the developer to determine their timeline for finishing their game and launching on Steam."
"Once your game has been Greenlit, you will need a single individual or entity that will be paid for sales of your product."
"Once your game is Greenlit, you will receive an e-mail at the address associated with the account that posted your submission. This e-mail will notify you of your product's Greenlighting and will invite you to begin filling out the digital paperwork."
They could probably halt the process and decline to have CoE released on Steam though.
Someone says the steam community is generally immature, and because you use steam, you take it as a personal attack.
Ridiculous.
Another thing. Lots of gaming studios have no wishes to be on Steam. Hell I can assure you that 90% of the games on steam wished they didn't -have- to be on steam if they were able to keep up with the large consumer base it has due to the hefty cut Steams take on sales and so forth if you publish your game on their platform. The main reason games go on their in the first place is to increase their customer base but in no way should a big game like Elyria feel the need to get on it asap. If anything, it might be a last resort. (Look at Wildstar but I am not saying Steam is bad because it's awesome although it is not something gaming studios want to go to unless they feel it will pay off)
So it is kinda wrong to suggest from the get-go for a game like Elyria to go on Steam unless it needs the extra boost even with the downside of Steam taking a share off your game. Again unnecessary at this point.
(They went on greenlight for the free publicity btw without having to deal with Steam taking a cut. Which is only natural.)
I dont think it will be all that. But thats just cause most people have never heard of or care about CoE. And apparently the devs are intent to keep it that way. Which is a strange position to take when youre standing there with your hand out.
When I judge a company, I typically judge it based on their product. If they fail to produce what they promise. The fact that this infuriated so many people is crazy.
Do you think the few people here saying its not a big deal also speak for anyone? Weve seen the internet tear people apart for less.
John Smedley said something on twitter to the wrong scriptkid and got his company DDoSed and a month later he was sacked.
Yeah game ceo's can say whatever they want lol.
If someone from the steam community attacks COE devs for this, it just proves their point.
I dont think theyre in the business of proving points. Theyre in the business of selling games. And the steam community buys a lot of games. Its like me starting a camo jacket business and saying rednecks are stupid. I dont think the truth of the statement really matters. But at least when I die in a hunting accident my last words can be "see, I told you theyre stupid."
Huh? Steam lets you describe the game on the store page clearly. It also has forums where people go to research within steam too.
Also age does not equal maturity at all. Why do you keep saying age? A 10 year old kid is not going to buy Chronicles of Elyria, nothing in it looks interesting to a kid.
But I mean a 18-21 year old might and might also be much more mature than some of these 30-40yr olds that you say your game caters to the most. Age is only a number. Lots of older gamers are also jaded, grumpy, closed minded etc too. I am 30+ and seen many of them my age and older that are just horrible to play with or against in any game.
GAME TIL YOU DIE!!!!
That is a problem of bold swaying statements and a reason why you avoid them.
His post, and stance on subject, is wrong on many levels but the most staggering about it is that he finds there is enough offended people to warrant public announcement, yet without actual apology. Instead, he "teaches" those about their "errors" - we did not insult anyone, you do not understand what we mean(because the very same people are apparently also stupid, right?).
The most worst thing you can say.
Jason Appleton, Tim Andreson, Jeromy Walsh. Seems cool to be offensive noname developer....
Also from the stram faq
Therefore they didn't misuse steam as they used greenlight for publicity and as jeremy said feedback from the steam community as to whether they would be interested
Signed Davan Drakenhoff ruler of Castle Drakenhoff the impenatrable castle made from cardboard
Let's be honest though, there is nothing anyone could say that would sate the appetite of the game's detractors. They continue to post in a forum dedicated to a game in which they have no interest and I don't understand why they feel a need to do it. When I come across a game that doesn't interest me, I ignore it. I don't go to their forums and start stirring things up and trying to make trouble.