Why is it that the two evil companies eat up alll the games with promise.
Next thing, Microsoft will buy NC Soft and Blizzard.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Let's be reasonable now shall we. Not EVERYTHING that comes out of EA is crap. They just have a tendency of abusing Intellectual Property.
Now when I think of it, Warhammer is one of the biggest IP buys you can do... and that scares me. Though Games Workshop WILL not allow EA to ruin the game, you know how their look on the standard of their game is. I think they would rather take the case to court rather than letting EA destroying their name.
It could end up like Valve. EA just produces the retail copies to be sent to stores, and gets payed for that, nothing else. But then again, Mythic may need money from EA, and that could lead to them becoming part of EA and no longer an independent company.
Originally posted by Havoc01 It could end up like Valve. EA just produces the retail copies to be sent to stores, and gets payed for that, nothing else. But then again, Mythic may need money from EA, and that could lead to them becoming part of EA and no longer an independent company.
Mythic is now gone. Bought lock, stock and barrel. The owners of Mythic just got a huge check.
They're now EA. Get used to it.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Originally posted by Shayde Originally posted by Havoc01 It could end up like Valve. EA just produces the retail copies to be sent to stores, and gets payed for that, nothing else. But then again, Mythic may need money from EA, and that could lead to them becoming part of EA and no longer an independent company.
Mythic is now gone. Bought lock, stock and barrel. The owners of Mythic just got a huge check.
They're now EA. Get used to it.
If this is the case, in the word(s?) of Darth Vader,"Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!"
Originally posted by Coldmeat So... whats the over/under on W.A.R. being canceled before Xmas, ala UO2, and UO:O?
No.. it's too far to cancel. I just wouldn't grow TOO attached to it.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Ooooh! I can't wait for Warhammer to be cancelled so EA can 'focus on its existing properties' like the Sims and UO.
What am I talking about, it's not like EA has ever ruined a mmorpg before. They've never taken over a company just as their new mmorpg is released and refuse to advertise or support it. They've never cancelled a developing and extremely popular and revolutionary game to focus their resources on the Sims and the next EA sports title. They've never, EVER, cancelled a sequel to a mmorpg when it was almost finished because said game would compete and depopulate the original game.
Oh excuse me I seem to have a chest cold...cough coughearthandbeyond cough ultimaodysseycough cough cough ultimafraggin2cough.
EA is the devil. My faith in this game just took a dramatic nose dive. If this game gets made successfully it will be through the will of the Mythic employees. The fact that EA has this amount of rancor built up against it is testament to their business practices.
Originally posted by Havoc01 It could end up like Valve. EA just produces the retail copies to be sent to stores, and gets payed for that, nothing else. But then again, Mythic may need money from EA, and that could lead to them becoming part of EA and no longer an independent company.
And that would be why the President of the company became a VP in the move? He will be slipping off the radar in a few months and retired more then likely. EA will apparently has plans for their own replacement for him.
- Scaris
"What happened to you, Star Wars Galaxies? You used to look like Leia. Not quite gold bikini Leia (more like bad-British-accent-and-cinnamon-bun-hair Leia), but still Leia nonetheless. Now you look like Chewbacca." - Computer Gaming World
I see lots of people throwing around facts, truths, half-truths, fabrications and lots of things in between. Let's really look at some incontrovertible facts:
1) There is nobody who is posting here who knows all the facts regarding the closing of EA studios. Unless you are Richard or Robert Garriot, Louis Castle, Brent Sperry or my good friends John Taylor and Kelton Flinn (from Kesmai), you cannot say why those studios were closed. Thus, either defending the studios or attacking them or defending EA or attacking it is pointless.
2) EA has never closed down an online game that was highly profitable at the time it was shutdown. EA has kept UO running for almost 9 years. I think it is safe to say that most of the games that were shut down were not financial successes for the studios/EA.
3) EA is a business, Mythic is a business and GW is a business. Speaking for Mythic and GW, I can say that we are both driven to make great products everytime we create something. I believe that EA feels the same way but since I am new here (I'm writing this from BC), I can't say that they always wanted to make great games simply because I wasn't part of EA until now. Judging by what I saw today, I think they are absolutely driven to make great games. However, we are also all businesses and need to make profits and survive. EA and GW are publicly traded comapnies and thus have a duty to their shareholders to be profitable.
4) The risks to Mythic and WAR are less today because of the EA deal than they were two days ago. If Mythic had screwed up with WAR's development and we were very late in delivering it, there was nobody who could bail us out. Making anything of the scale of WAR is hard and I would be guilty of hubris if I said that there was no chance Mythic would screw up. No company nor any individual gos through life without making mistakes. In the case of WAR, if we made a mistake and we were independent, bad things would happen, that is a simple fact of life.
5) The MMO market is getting more competitive every year and while I thought we would be just fine, if I was wrong, 170+ people would have lost their jobs.
6) EA is more than just interested in WAR, they have become true believers in the game. It took many months, lots of conversations and demos and finally E3 for them to share our faith. It was that faith that led to the deal. If they didn't share that faith we wouldn't have done the deal, period. All the guys who will be involved going forward with Mythic (marketing, etc.) are not only DAoC players but WoW players as well. These guys know and love the genre. Mythic is not dealing with some guys who said "Gee, we know this MMO thing is hot so we want in" (as some companies who talked to Mythic said) but rather, a bunch of hardcore gamers who know and love these types of games.
7) As I've said before, nobody from Mythic is going anywhere from EA's perspective (meaning no layoffs, riffs, etc.) and I'm not going anywhere either. I made a promise to GW that we were going to bust a gut in order to make a great Warhammer MMO. I make very few promises and I do not break my promises, ever. I love the guys at GW (but not in a LoTR hobbits jumping up on the bed way, thank you very much) and I'm not going to let anything bad happen to their beloved IP.
I know that no matter what I say, there will be people saying the exact opposite. I will remind people (especially the new folks here) that many months ago when I first started posting here many people were skeptical and some were downright hostile. I said that I could accept that but I asked for people to judge our results for themselves. Since then Mythic has done what no other maker of a large-scale MMO has ever done before, go to E3 with only 9 months into development and create a kick-Royal Hiny game that won a lot of awards and got lots of people (fans of WH and non-fans) talking about the game and not talking about hype, demos, renders, etc. but talking about the playable game that they saw working. I will say the same thing to you now, watch what we do and decide for yourselves whether I am telling you the truth or not. And if I'm wrong, I'll be the first one here to say so and the blame will fall squarely on my shoulders.
I am truly sorry that the EA deal has caused so much concern and upset in the community. I hope to make it up to you by releasing a game that will stand as the finest game Mythic has ever done and something that EA, Mythic and GW can be proud of now and in the future.
I sincerely doubt EA bought Mythic just to cancel Warhammer. I do think there are new concerns with EA running the show, but I don't think the game being canned is a realistic one.
As a pvper im just looking forward to 1 game, thats "WAR". If EA wont touch game mechanics, contents, etc. and if "WAR" wont become a "CAREBEAR" game like WoW, so no problem for me. So we will check this when BETA starts, now carry on. Btw, tbh that is very disappointing news for me EA bought Mythic, damn...
EA bought Mythic for money. If they really want that money then they should realize that letting Mythic work on WAR and DAoC as they want will bring them that money.
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration - courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and, above all, love of the truth." - Henry Mencken
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg
"And what would you do with a brain if you had one?" - Wizard of Oz
Originally posted by razzielle 2) EA has never closed down an online game that was highly profitable at the time it was shutdown. EA has kept UO running for almost 9 years. I think it is safe to say that most of the games that were shut down were not financial successes for the studios/EA.
Sorry but other companies keep the faith and try and improve the product and get the subs back.AO is a perfect example.
EA is basically you old fashioned 80 yr old vet who thinks is best to shot a dog with a broken leg then try and put the dog leg in order.
Which is something the mmorpg industry does not need at all.
The games that EA 'closed down' were failures people.
Did they close UO? No, because it maintained a solid fanbase and drew in a large number of initial subscribers. Box sales and initial subscription fees were enough to maintain the game and get a return on the investment. Thus... UO stays open. As long as it's keeping afloat and at least breaking even (if not being staying profitable), a MMORPG stays open.
MMORPGs are all about launch success. If they can't get enough interest and community built in the first month of service, a game is more or less doomed. It's all about developement cost vs. returned profits. If the cap is just far too large, and the continued maintenance and developement isn't going to return a profit in any forseeable future... then a game SHOULD be canned. MMORPGs are costly to develope and maintain.
If WAR does fail... it will be because it is a bad enough game that noone keeps playing it. If Mythic are the people making the game, then it will be their fault that it's a bad game... not the people giving them the money to increase developement time and effort. MBJ has stated MULTIPLE times on WarhammerAlliance that if the deal didn't ensure that they would get the freedom they need to make a good game, then they wouldn't have even accepted.
But hey... I personally think EA is terrible too... I just have enough faith in Mythic to make a good game. In alot of ways this is more of EA backing up Mythic not the other way around. It's EA who's risking more by acquiring Mythic. Mythic's success or failure is now DIRECTLY their success or failure.
But hey... even my hype dropped from a 10 to 8... I'm still hopeful and looking forward to seeing what the game has to offer when it's released (which is still a long ways off). If it's good... then who bloody cares where their money came from to make the game? If it was going to be good without EA, then it's going to be even better since Mythic has more money to put towards developement. If it was going to suck before EA stepped in... chances are it's still going to suck... since it's Mythic making the game, not EA.
You can scroll up to read the quote. That is all find and dandy, and I hope things work out, but the bottom line is the bottom line, and in 6 months (if I'm not mistaken) Mythic will not own W.A.R., EA will.
Originally posted by dimaryp Originally posted by razzielle ...
You can scroll up to read the quote. That is all find and dandy, and I hope things work out, but the bottom line is the bottom line, and in 6 months (if I'm not mistaken) Mythic will not own W.A.R., EA will.
D
Actually for the record, Games Workshop owns the IP, and nothing EA says or does can change that. GW has always, and will always, have full approval rights on absolutely anything that goes into WAR. Nothing EA can do will change that.
Richard J. Cox "There were much of the beautiful, much of the wanton, much of the bizarre, something of the terrible, and not a little of that which might have excited disgust."
Originally posted by Richard_Mythic Originally posted by dimaryp Originally posted by razzielle ...
You can scroll up to read the quote. That is all find and dandy, and I hope things work out, but the bottom line is the bottom line, and in 6 months (if I'm not mistaken) Mythic will not own W.A.R., EA will.
D
Actually for the record, Games Workshop owns the IP, and nothing EA says or does can change that. GW has always, and will always, have full approval rights on absolutely anything that goes into WAR. Nothing EA can do will change that.
Yes, but I am talking about the game, not the IP. I don't think anyone is under the illusion that EA can change that.
What it boils down to, is we have faith in Mythic, we don't have faith in EA. Mythic=EA in 6 months or so.
What some fear, myself included, is EA purchase of Mythic, is to put W.A.R. up against WoW, to go head to head. We fear that this will dumb down W.A.R.(Not that anything is wrong with WoW mind you). It's just if we wanted WoW, we would be playing it now.
Plus, EA does not have a steller record with MMORPGs.
D
PS I appreciate you posting on this forum to allay our fears.
PPS This is basicly the same thing that happened to Vanguard. People have faith in Sigil, they don't in SOE.
Yes, you're talking about the game, not the IP, but you're ignoring what I said about GW... They have full approval authority over the GAME. Nothing can be added to the game or changed or done to the game that they don't approve...
Richard J. Cox "There were much of the beautiful, much of the wanton, much of the bizarre, something of the terrible, and not a little of that which might have excited disgust."
Originally posted by Richard_Mythic Yes, you're talking about the game, not the IP, but you're ignoring what I said about GW... They have full approval authority over the GAME. Nothing can be added to the game or changed or done to the game that they don't approve...
Comments
Next thing, Microsoft will buy NC Soft and Blizzard.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Now when I think of it, Warhammer is one of the biggest IP buys you can do... and that scares me. Though Games Workshop WILL not allow EA to ruin the game, you know how their look on the standard of their game is. I think they would rather take the case to court rather than letting EA destroying their name.
Formerly known as Royal Arcanist
They're now EA. Get used to it.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
They're now EA. Get used to it.
If this is the case, in the word(s?) of Darth Vader,"Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!"
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
______________________________________________________________________
Lend a hand and break the chains of regularity you lean so closely upon
What am I talking about, it's not like EA has ever ruined a mmorpg before. They've never taken over a company just as their new mmorpg is released and refuse to advertise or support it. They've never cancelled a developing and extremely popular and revolutionary game to focus their resources on the Sims and the next EA sports title. They've never, EVER, cancelled a sequel to a mmorpg when it was almost finished because said game would compete and depopulate the original game.
Oh excuse me I seem to have a chest cold...cough coughearthandbeyond cough ultimaodysseycough cough cough ultimafraggin2cough.
EA is the devil. My faith in this game just took a dramatic nose dive. If this game gets made successfully it will be through the will of the Mythic employees. The fact that EA has this amount of rancor built up against it is testament to their business practices.
First vanguard, now warhammer, next is age of conan.
And that would be why the President of the company became a VP in the move? He will be slipping off the radar in a few months and retired more then likely. EA will apparently has plans for their own replacement for him.
- Scaris
"What happened to you, Star Wars Galaxies? You used to look like Leia. Not quite gold bikini Leia (more like bad-British-accent-and-cinnamon-bun-hair Leia), but still Leia nonetheless. Now you look like Chewbacca." - Computer Gaming World
1) There is nobody who is posting here who knows all the facts regarding the closing of EA studios. Unless you are Richard or Robert Garriot, Louis Castle, Brent Sperry or my good friends John Taylor and Kelton Flinn (from Kesmai), you cannot say why those studios were closed. Thus, either defending the studios or attacking them or defending EA or attacking it is pointless.
2) EA has never closed down an online game that was highly profitable at the time it was shutdown. EA has kept UO running for almost 9 years. I think it is safe to say that most of the games that were shut down were not financial successes for the studios/EA.
3) EA is a business, Mythic is a business and GW is a business. Speaking for Mythic and GW, I can say that we are both driven to make great products everytime we create something. I believe that EA feels the same way but since I am new here (I'm writing this from BC), I can't say that they always wanted to make great games simply because I wasn't part of EA until now. Judging by what I saw today, I think they are absolutely driven to make great games. However, we are also all businesses and need to make profits and survive. EA and GW are publicly traded comapnies and thus have a duty to their shareholders to be profitable.
4) The risks to Mythic and WAR are less today because of the EA deal than they were two days ago. If Mythic had screwed up with WAR's development and we were very late in delivering it, there was nobody who could bail us out. Making anything of the scale of WAR is hard and I would be guilty of hubris if I said that there was no chance Mythic would screw up. No company nor any individual gos through life without making mistakes. In the case of WAR, if we made a mistake and we were independent, bad things would happen, that is a simple fact of life.
5) The MMO market is getting more competitive every year and while I thought we would be just fine, if I was wrong, 170+ people would have lost their jobs.
6) EA is more than just interested in WAR, they have become true believers in the game. It took many months, lots of conversations and demos and finally E3 for them to share our faith. It was that faith that led to the deal. If they didn't share that faith we wouldn't have done the deal, period. All the guys who will be involved going forward with Mythic (marketing, etc.) are not only DAoC players but WoW players as well. These guys know and love the genre. Mythic is not dealing with some guys who said "Gee, we know this MMO thing is hot so we want in" (as some companies who talked to Mythic said) but rather, a bunch of hardcore gamers who know and love these types of games.
7) As I've said before, nobody from Mythic is going anywhere from EA's perspective (meaning no layoffs, riffs, etc.) and I'm not going anywhere either. I made a promise to GW that we were going to bust a gut in order to make a great Warhammer MMO. I make very few promises and I do not break my promises, ever. I love the guys at GW (but not in a LoTR hobbits jumping up on the bed way, thank you very much) and I'm not going to let anything bad happen to their beloved IP.
I know that no matter what I say, there will be people saying the exact opposite. I will remind people (especially the new folks here) that many months ago when I first started posting here many people were skeptical and some were downright hostile. I said that I could accept that but I asked for people to judge our results for themselves. Since then Mythic has done what no other maker of a large-scale MMO has ever done before, go to E3 with only 9 months into development and create a kick-Royal Hiny game that won a lot of awards and got lots of people (fans of WH and non-fans) talking about the game and not talking about hype, demos, renders, etc. but talking about the playable game that they saw working. I will say the same thing to you now, watch what we do and decide for yourselves whether I am telling you the truth or not. And if I'm wrong, I'll be the first one here to say so and the blame will fall squarely on my shoulders.
I am truly sorry that the EA deal has caused so much concern and upset in the community. I hope to make it up to you by releasing a game that will stand as the finest game Mythic has ever done and something that EA, Mythic and GW can be proud of now and in the future.
Mark>>>>
I sincerely doubt EA bought Mythic just to cancel Warhammer. I do think there are new concerns with EA running the show, but I don't think the game being canned is a realistic one.
-----Zero Punctuation Eve Online Review-----
Err.. bye bye WAR. First Vanguard and now WAR. AoC you are my only hope.
Whether this is good or bad for Warhammer simply depends on how much interference EA will have in the production of the game.
What's certain though is that Mythic itself can kiss it's ass goodbye... Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but someday, within the near future...
(*background whispers* Maxis... Westwood... Bullfrog... Origin... ... Mythic?... )
"Religion is fundamentally opposed to everything I hold in veneration - courage, clear thinking, honesty, fairness, and, above all, love of the truth." - Henry Mencken
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg
"And what would you do with a brain if you had one?" - Wizard of Oz
Sorry but other companies keep the faith and try and improve the product and get the subs back.AO is a perfect example.
EA is basically you old fashioned 80 yr old vet who thinks is best to shot a dog with a broken leg then try and put the dog leg in order.
Which is something the mmorpg industry does not need at all.
The games that EA 'closed down' were failures people.
Did they close UO? No, because it maintained a solid fanbase and drew in a large number of initial subscribers. Box sales and initial subscription fees were enough to maintain the game and get a return on the investment. Thus... UO stays open. As long as it's keeping afloat and at least breaking even (if not being staying profitable), a MMORPG stays open.
MMORPGs are all about launch success. If they can't get enough interest and community built in the first month of service, a game is more or less doomed. It's all about developement cost vs. returned profits. If the cap is just far too large, and the continued maintenance and developement isn't going to return a profit in any forseeable future... then a game SHOULD be canned. MMORPGs are costly to develope and maintain.
If WAR does fail... it will be because it is a bad enough game that noone keeps playing it. If Mythic are the people making the game, then it will be their fault that it's a bad game... not the people giving them the money to increase developement time and effort. MBJ has stated MULTIPLE times on WarhammerAlliance that if the deal didn't ensure that they would get the freedom they need to make a good game, then they wouldn't have even accepted.
But hey... I personally think EA is terrible too... I just have enough faith in Mythic to make a good game. In alot of ways this is more of EA backing up Mythic not the other way around. It's EA who's risking more by acquiring Mythic. Mythic's success or failure is now DIRECTLY their success or failure.
But hey... even my hype dropped from a 10 to 8... I'm still hopeful and looking forward to seeing what the game has to offer when it's released (which is still a long ways off). If it's good... then who bloody cares where their money came from to make the game? If it was going to be good without EA, then it's going to be even better since Mythic has more money to put towards developement. If it was going to suck before EA stepped in... chances are it's still going to suck... since it's Mythic making the game, not EA.
Resok
D
D
Actually for the record, Games Workshop owns the IP, and nothing EA says or does can change that. GW has always, and will always, have full approval rights on absolutely anything that goes into WAR. Nothing EA can do will change that.
Richard J. Cox
"There were much of the beautiful, much of the wanton, much of the bizarre, something of the terrible, and not a little of that which might have excited disgust."
D
Actually for the record, Games Workshop owns the IP, and nothing EA says or does can change that. GW has always, and will always, have full approval rights on absolutely anything that goes into WAR. Nothing EA can do will change that.
Yes, but I am talking about the game, not the IP. I don't think anyone is under the illusion that EA can change that.
What it boils down to, is we have faith in Mythic, we don't have faith in EA. Mythic=EA in 6 months or so.
What some fear, myself included, is EA purchase of Mythic, is to put W.A.R. up against WoW, to go head to head. We fear that this will dumb down W.A.R.(Not that anything is wrong with WoW mind you). It's just if we wanted WoW, we would be playing it now.
Plus, EA does not have a steller record with MMORPGs.
D
PS I appreciate you posting on this forum to allay our fears.
PPS This is basicly the same thing that happened to Vanguard. People have faith in Sigil, they don't in SOE.
Richard J. Cox
"There were much of the beautiful, much of the wanton, much of the bizarre, something of the terrible, and not a little of that which might have excited disgust."
D