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i would buy 10 of them if it would get me in beta!
anyway i think its great this letter, no wonder why more games dont reach out like this htouh man you people bitch and moan just to see yourself do it
i would buy 10 of them if it would get me in beta!
anyway i think its great this letter, no wonder why more games dont reach out like this htouh man you people bitch and moan just to see yourself do it
haha i agree people do bitch and moan a little to much here.....and i cant wait to play this game.....and the easy way for any of you ppl to learn the facts about vanguard is to go to www.vanguardsoh.com the FAQ section is great and shoudl answer all ur questions.................
Dear Aradune, worthy MMO follows,
first off, thanks to Aradune (^^) to coming here in person and taking the time to give us some sources to get a more detailled idea about Vanguard. It's no small thing that a COE comes to the forums, especially a place like this, heh. ^^
To all fans, interested or even those who don't like Vanguard I say this: pls try to keep serious and friendly. This is a unique chance to discuss Vanguard and our impressions with the CEO of Sigil himself, so we should take this opportunity like adults.
I have played a lot of MMOs, some short, some a long time. My longest time I spent in SWG, EQ2 and WOW, which I all greatly enjoyed. I know these three are likley the MMOs with which most people compare Vanguard to, and which formed our expectations, wether in good or bad. I have followed Vanguard for about 2 years or so, and I am still putting some hope into it, especially since all of the previous MMO's were mindly said more of less catastrophes. So the list of possible "new MMOs" for me has grown smaller, and practically is now down to Vanguard and LOTR. I guess in this way I represent the point of view of many others.
So I have studied the FAQs, interveiws, articles and movies quite thoroughly. Playing an MMO is a huge investment in money and time, people dedicate in building their character, so it must be a good choice and lasting fun. Vanguard has alwas promised to have many things I enjoyed, but tho I play often, I did not like the hardcore approach at all. I must admit I dont like hard death penalities at all. I dont want to justify myself, this is how I feel. I see MMO playing as spare time hobby and it should not be grief and pain. So I heard of different death ruleset servers, and I think that is a great idea. In that way everyone can decide. Games like DAoC have shown that ruleset servers work quite well without taking players away from "harder" servers.
Vanguard, as I see in the movies, DOES look like I would have imagined Everquest 3, which is only natural. EQ1 was made by many who are now in Sigil, and EQ2 was made to somehow fit into the style of EQ1, so it's no wonder. It is not necessary bad. I loved EQ2, but while Vanguard has some eye catches, it seems now the landscape is a bit barren. The landscape of LOTR does look a bit more lush and detailled and rich. (It may be unfair since Vanguard is closer to release, but that is what I see.) Now I know graphics isnt all. SWG's landscape is most relatively barren, but fun. Usually you can make small zones and then they are rich or huge zones and then they are more sparse, to allow a certain FPS rate. In terms of landscape LOTR is quite like the stunning Oblivion, and as said the videos I have seen dont look SO exciting. Maybe its a matter of choice, I dont know. Just an impression.
Second, I love detailled character generation, and what the videos show is great. I use to spend a lot of time usually working on nose, ears and eyes and I cant have enough of that. Also housing and mounts look great. I loved the open, free housing of SWG a lot and I missed that much in WOW, where I felt like a homeless person. I desire a game to create lasting values. I played SWG for that all 2.5 years through all the crisis and letdowns this game had because of the lasting value. I think those fast food lovers of WOW may not find this important, but surely do.
I could go into many details, but this has been said by others. My very personal wish for Vanguard - or any MMO I pay - is this: How long does it take me to get into the fun? THAT is what WOW did good. I don't want to travel all over the world. I dont want to wait hours and days and months to find a group to finally finish my quest. What I really found annoying in EQ2 was, in the end I found myself logging into the game, I had 60+ quests but could do none of the, because no one was on the same step of those over complicated quests. Or if I had missed the day my guild did that quest, I had little chance to get it done. I know a game needs such complicated quests, but EQ2 is above level 30 or so FULL of those overcomplicated quests a small guild just can not provide. I felt EQ2 had become a job, work more than leisure, with weekly plannings and meeting, instead of just logging in and quickly finding something funny to do. THAT is what I desire of a MMO, that it leads me to the fun, not I have to seek through internet sites to FIND the fun.
sincerly,
Elikal
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Even if it has,
SOE is involved = I wouldnt try it for free.
Enjoy your tiny little niche market.
--------------------
SWG - Killed by $OE
WOW - Retired
Playing WAR
jrgambit is looking for attention.
What confuses me the most is that i've never seen an MMO have such haters. Why are there people so bent on trying to convince other people not to play this game?
Which FF Character Are You?
i would buy 10 of them if it would get me in beta!
anyway i think its great this letter, no wonder why more games dont reach out like this htouh man you people bitch and moan just to see yourself do it
It's good, but not THAT good.... not that I'd know...
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
Niche? That would mean it is a specialized market...
What is it specialized for? From what I have read, it is going to focus on grouping. Yet, will have areas for solo play, and areas for raiding. The majority of the game will be group oriented though.
That is far from specialized. Take a Druid in most games, they do not specialize in any area, they can heal, buff, and do damage. In this game you can solo, group, or raid.
A druid can atleast in most games I have played, then make choices in equipment, and stat choices to specialize in one of those elements of spell casting. But will never be the best at it.
So if there is any specialization of this game it would be towards the group play.
And I am still not sure where SOE made any great unforgivable mistake in their history. EQ1 is a success, and still is by a lot of people standards. EQ2 is a success. SWG from what I heard everything has been fixed and those that stuck out the waves that were made are still playing.
The only mistake they made was trying to listen to the people on the forums that compalined about aspects of the game. They did what they felt needed to be done. And when it went wrong they tried something else.
Are you telling me you never made a mistake before? Most people make a mistake and don't even try to correct the problem. Maybe Lucas arts made the mistake by giveing control of their game to another company. Does that mean that you will never play a lucas arts game either? Because Lucas arts has made some awesome games!
Anyways get over your SOE ruined my life rampage and go find something to play. I don't agree with what SOE did to SWG but it's done, it's fixed, get over it. I'm going to start watching Doctor Phil just to see how many people come on there to say, "I'm a failure in life, and it's all SOE's fault! they messed up my video game!"
Not so nice guy!
Okay, I gave him some.
Not so nice guy!
I might have undertaken to answer your questions and debate you, but I have a policy that as soon as I see a quote like this, you become fungible Vanguard poster # 1,265 and it really isn't worth the effort. You will note, however, that I have responded to other people who disagree with me (even some who flamed me lol)who could resist the "omgz go back to Wowzorz" mentality.
I'm actually Vanguard poster # 2461 if we're going by the official site forums. :-p
(Got some extra moments so I'll continue.)
I'm picking on you and your method of debate, I apologize.
I want you to know that I'm trying to respond to you because you were the first to question/criticize with substance (even if I think some of it has been answered before in other forms). I respect that.
The first question I asked in the part of my post that you quoted was a serious question, not a rhetorical one. I'm trying to understand where you're coming from. The second question WAS rhetorical and was an example of what I know it obviously is not--you can't do something like that even IN a casual game. Here's probably a better way to phrase it:
What is it, in a game of this genre, that would make it "casual friendly" to you?
Once you answer that for me, I'll tell you (provided I have the info) if Vanguard is or is not in line with that. I could site examples that show how the casual player (in my definition) could still enjoy Vanguard, but I think I would still miss the mark since I don't know what your definition is. As an example, I would think some casual gamers would clap with glee at the mention that crafting is fully one third of the game, but it sounds like that doesn't impress you.
And by the way, you're absolutely right that I didn't directly answer all of your questions in my first post. I'm just not sure I can--some of the questions are rather vague and generalized, and even so, we don't know everything yet. Some of the questions can only truly be answered by someone explaining how they are playing the game, which can't be done with the NDA in place. :-(
You may never get direct answers to those questions to your satisfaction (or anyone's satisfaction) until you (or they) actually play the game and experience it all for yourself. (How's that for dodging the questions?) I agree with you 100% that the ultimate answers will be when people vote with dollars. Until then, we have to make do with what we have.
I guess the only thing I would suggest is just to not assume that, for example, casual gaming is bad in Vanguard until you have all the info to prove that it is. Adopt an innocent until proven guilty approach. I realize that's not easy anymore (I was part of SWG, too...hah).
I can't prove that casual gaming in Vanguard is fun all the way through. I'll give you that. But that doesn't make it bad. It just means that I can't prove that it isn't.
I will tell you some things about Vanguard that excite me, because that's all I can do (the following links are just springboards--more info can be found elsewhere). I could be considered a "casual gamer". I only get a few hours a week to play games, or less than 2hrs per day at the very most. So, I tend to play single-player (the Zelda I mentioned earlier) RTS or other games where I can save and quit at a moment's notice.
Player Housing - http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/faq.php?faqid=518
To be able to fiddle around in a house and create a community that I can be a part of is cool. SWG had it and I had a blast as part of it. VG takes it to a new level, though. No, you can't have urban sprawl as in SWG because the lots are fixed, but the level of control inside the house for customizing is really incredible. One of our videos from E3 shows Jeff Butler demonstrating this. It no longer has to be a completely unbelievable thing to have a completely decked out house, as it was in SWG.
Travel with Meaning - http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/faq.php?faqid=671
An odd one for a casual gamer to be excited about, but hear me out. Even though I'm a casual gamer, I hated what Plane of Knowledge did to EQ1. I want the space in the world to mean something. I don't want catering to casual playstyles to ruin the immersiveness of an expansive world, and to be honest, I don't think PoK was catering to the casual player. I think it was catering to the hardcore raider that had to be in x location every single day. Me, I was satisfied living my career in Qeynos area for half of my levels. I thoroughly enjoyed my first trek from Qeynos to "that other continent".
So Vanguard does make travel meaningful, but they also attempt to allow people to stay together. Oh and everyone has the same problem getting from point A to point B, not just me. So it's all part of the fun. But how is VG keeping players together, if that's what they want? Caravans: http://www.silkyvenom.com/?page=articles&articleid=9 I'll have to dig up more info on caravans because there doesn't seem to be much info available. But that link has a paragraph or two on it.
Diplomacy - http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/faq.php?faqid=332 http://www.vgtact.com
An entirely new aspect of gaming that is great for a casual player. Again, this is being touted as fully one third of the game. Some of the cities in Vanguard are HUGE. Phenominally huge. I think each city/town acts as a "dungeon" for diplomacy players complete with quests, phat lootz, epic encounters, and all the other thrills you'd get from crafting or adventuring. This aspect of Vanguard should not be underestimated, IMO, especially for those looking for a less twitchy and more strategic gameplay.
Crafting - http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/faq.php?faqid=146 http://www.vanguardcrafters.com
Again, for the strategically minded player. This is something most are already familiar with, though. But again VG takes the old school and makes it more in depth. There is harvesting of resources involved. There is cost vs. quality vs. quantity and all those counterweights involved. Even your clothes matter. Again, like adventuring, personal item acquisition through crafting/merchantile can enhance your ability to craft even better items and the loop continues until you're the most uber player on the server.
But this is something, like Diplo, you can do on your own time in your own way.
A Focus on Early Mounts - http://www.silkyvenom.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3788
Just so I can contradict myself, I would like to be able to get somewhere relatively quickly, if I need to. That you'll be able to afford a reasonable horse early in the game makes that less of an issue. But later in the game, once you're really an elite player, you can impress the ladies with your unicorn, or demon wolf, or what have you. And once you're an uber elite player, you can impress everyone with your flying mount. The possibilities are amazing.
But then, I can still get a decent horse pretty early on at my slow leveling pace so I'm not left behind.
_________________
So, I'd like to go on, but I've gotta run.
Me, my guild (over 150 peeps) and just about every gamer I know are going to be there for launch. I hope to see a few of you there.
I suggest you get your facts straight. No such statements have been even indirectly made by Sigil. This was found on a computer gaming magazine which is not related to or produced by the company Sigil.
Heard that SOME of the best GROUPING-items are only available via raids however. Which in turn give raiders a strong edge over non-raiders, in ALL gameplays; including the grouping gameplay.
If 20% of the best items are earned through raid only, then raiders are 20% stronger than non-raiders when it come to grouping. (not a raw 20%, since the difference is maybe twice better items, still, this is making the beneficiary of the item WAY more than 20% stronger than a non-raider, as far as grouping is concerned for anyone understand the combat mechanic).
Restricting 1 HP to raiders only when it come to the grouping gameplay is unfair. Now we are talking of 20% of the items at release...and guess what, I am pretty sure it will increase to other items as the game advance and as you "listen" to the communities...the minorities communities that is.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Note that some of the best items in the game can also be obtained by crafting, however to craft raid-level items, a crafter will be expected to put in as much effort as one who obtains raid-level items by raiding. Whether this work itself will involve a lot of raiding, leaves to be answered.
It is a mistake, however it is a mistake I would be ready to cope with, crafting/tradeskilling. Maybe they will make it interesting, if not, I can "bear it", since my love for grouping is just that big.
Unlike raiding, which I rather PvP than raid...however, I rather just be rid of both, definitately. But if it has to come down between a raid or PvP choice, I will PvP, despite the fact I will grief, I will curse, I will bitch, every moment I PvP.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
If crafting in Vanguard stays true to its FAQ, I think it will be quite interesting.
Question 1: Why don't you get into some particulars about the solo/casual gameplay. We've seen the generalities. We're seen the fourth quarter PR and the spin. We're seen the fansite press releases. What else have you got?
There’s quite a bit out there – please read up on it. Not much more I can say at this point unless you want to ask a more specific question.
Question 2: How do you define "content'? Is killing a wandering mob with little to no loot for little to no xp "content"? Is this the solo/casual content to which you refer?
Nope. Check out the posts where I talk about how good items are obtained and how they are available to all playstyles and obtainable through all the spheres. If you want good items, you’ll really need to play in all styles, regions, and spheres of the game. What you describe as casual gameplay is NOT casual gameplay in Vanguard.
Question 3: Tell us more about how a solo and casual player can prosper in what you call an ultra item centric game?
Again, it’s all in the links and information I provided. In this case, however, I’ll post here anyway:
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(added to the official FAQ as Entries 11:13, 11:13:1 and 11:13:2)
Thanks for the quotes. I did some searching and have saved this off now so I can answer again as I'm sure this will rightfully continue to pop up as more and more people come to find out more about Vanguard:
Will the best loot come only from raids?
Aradune Mithara: No. Many of them will, but many will also be available to groups. Often the very best items will require a long time commitment, but these commitments shouldn't have to always be contiguous. In other words, say it requires 12 hours of adventuring to obtain a powerful item. In some extreme cases, this could require a raid, or even a group and it could take you all day to complete. In other cases, however, the 12 hours can be broken up into three 4 hour chunks, where the quest or encounter route for the item is broken up into fourths, such that after you achieve 1/4 of the quest or route, you can save, re-group the next day, and then finish up another 3 hour chunk.
I've posted quite a bit on this months ago and encourage your and anyone interested to dig up the posts (some have been re-posted in this thread already -- thanks guys). In a nutshell, we want the best items to be available though a variety of routes: raids, long contiguous adventures, broken up adventures, trade skills, diplomacy, etc. The only potentially controversial aspect of this is that is likely that not ALL of the best items you might want will be available through only one of these methods. If you are a person who wants ALL of the best stuff, you'll have to involve yourself in all of the above, including raiding and long contiguous adventures, even though the majority of content, including that which yields great rewards, will be group oriented.
Essentially, if you want it all (whether items or abilities or spells or whatever), you pretty much have to DO it all as well. I do stress, however, that to be a powerful and effective player, you don't have to do it all. What I'm talking about is the subset of players who, from a personal preference, decide they have to have all of the best gear of every type, for every situation, etc.
So, and hopefully more to your point, if you focus on the casual content in the game, you will find/buy items that make you better, and as you level up, acquire wealth, skills, etc. you will find better equipment, and should feel a sense of accomplishment.
But that equipment most likely wouldn't cut it in a grouping region, and most certainly not in a raid area. Those mobs are harder, more situational, and don't just require more attention when playing (making sure you counter that spell, etc.), but also require that you have items that are at least close to the level range of the group dungeon you are in.
It can't really be any other way. If you want to only be casual, you will progress, but as I've said in the past, you won't have the same stuff as the guy who groups, or who raids. Same with the other spheres and how much time you invest.
All that said, and here's where I risk some wrath, the most powerful items will likely require skill, challenge, risk, and contiguous time commitments involving a lot of people. The reason is that by putting all of those challenges together, you get a bigger challenge. The additional commitment to stay on those extra hours, the organizational skills necessary to lead and organize a large group of people, etc. There's still something to be said about all of that, even though it will be the minority of content, as per what I've commented on in the past.
Could you be more clear? Please elaborate.
Aradune Mithara: What's key here is that the best items should come from experiences where there was the greatest risk vs. reward and time commitment (plus, there's always luck -- being in the right place at the right time, etc.).
Some of the best items will come from conventional raiding (large groups of people participating in long contiguous adventures). Some will come from long adventures consisting of less people and more importantly, while a lot of time will have to be invested, the content will be such that all of that time doesn't have to be contiguous.
Some also will come from the other spheres, but much of the same applies: the best components harvested and then used later to craft the best items will be very rare and in very dangerous locations. Some of it may require long contiguous time commitments, while others will be obtainable by completing several shorter contiguous adventures.
So I guess I'm still not totally sure what exactly you are asking here....
Will you be able to collect ALL of the best gear in the game without going on conventional raids and/or without trading/buying gear obtained from conventional raids? No.
Will you be able to obtain some of the very best gear without participating in conventional raids and/or buying gear obtained via conventional raiding? Absolutely.
If your desire is to be able to obtain any and all gear without ever having to raid or buy equipment obtained via raiding, then Vanguard may not be for you. But if you are content with obtaining some subset of the best gear without raiding or buying raid dropped equipment (or items created via crafting from harvested components obtained via raiding), then I think Vanguard will be fine for you.
Really, if you want the option of obtaining any item in the game period without buying/trading for it, you'll need to involve yourself in all aspects of the game, not just raiding. You'll need to level up in harvesting/crafting, level up in diplomacy, experience the higher end grouping dungeons and such, and also have the tenacity and patience to invest quite a bit of time in the game in general, as going on a high level adventure, whether group or raid oriented, doesn't guarantee that you will obtain that item you seek anyway. Someone else might get the item, or the item might not be available each and every time anyway, as perhaps the rare spawn that drops that item, or rare harvestable, just isn't around that night, or the quest that triggers a sequence of encounter segments that leads to that 'golden' boss mob might already be taken by another group, or even the mob or switch or item or whatever flags you and your group as being able to participate on the encounter segment might not be 'up' either.
Bottom line: if you want it all, you have to be willing to participate in all aspects of the game, especially if you are not willing to buy/trade and participate in the player driven economy, and when I say 'all' of the game, that would include the raids as well.
Does this answer your question? If not, I will try to explain further.
Please explain further – that doesn’t necessarily seem consistent:
Aradune Mithara: I think I was consistent, although perhaps not as clear as they could have been. Some of the best items will only be obtainable via raiding, other best items through grouping, and others through special casual areas, and others through the other spheres (harvesting/crafting and diplomacy).
Let me try to come up with a quick hypothetical example -- it's simplistic, but perhaps will make more sense:
1. The best all around helmet (say non-situational -- it has the best AC, or the best +STR attribute) for a warrior may come from a high level group zone
2. The best fire resistant vambraces may come from a raid zone
3. The best light armor boots may come from a challenging encounter that is made for casual/solo size groups (1-3).
4. The best AC armor (call it the Red Dragonscale Breastplate) may come from dragon scales collected in a difficult group dungeon, but then also require a high level harvester to actually collect the scales in the depths of a the dragon's lair, and then a high level crafter to be able to use it and other components to actually create the Red Dragonscale Breastplate
5. The best +Charisma Cloak (call it the Royal Red Sparrow Robe) that enables you access to the throne room in New Targonor may come from a series of challenging diplomatic quests requiring high skills, items, and strategy used by one or more players playing in the Diplomacy sphere.
Were a person to absolutely insist on obtaining all 5 of these hypothetical items above, he would have to either a. engage in all 5 activities to some significant extent, as well as work with others in most of the examples or b. buy/trade for them, assuming they are items that are tradable.
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Continued in next post...
--
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Brad McQuaid
CCO, Visionary Realms, Inc.
www.pantheonmmo.com
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Question 4: Explain how risk should be proportionate to reward. Then define risk. Risk is what? It's time! No matter how you spin it, it's time. So if reward is proportionate to time, this is casual friendly how?
It’s about time, but it’s also about strategy and knowledge of the game, just as it is in most every MMOG. While you can advance by simply devoting time to the game, by employing tactics and learning about your environment, class, how to play in a group (assuming you’re grouping), etc. you decrease risk.
Question 5: Talk about the importance of things besides your gear to an adventurer?
Gear in the other spheres will increase the chances of a favorable outcome, just like in adventuring. Put on the Cloak of Thestran Aristocracy that grants you +5 charisma and +10 influence as a diplomat and that, your skills and abilities, and your choices, are all taken into account when determining the outcome of a diplomatic encounter. Or dress in the garb of New Targonar's underworld if you want to gain access there, where some pretty cool quests may await you. But walk in with your adventuring gear and I don't care how powerful you and your buddies are, you're not taking on the Underworld's Boss and all of his minions. Same with harvesting – use a better harvesting tool and harvest better. Use a better crafting tool, and craft better.
Question 6: Explain why one of your employees did an interview in which they said casual players may want to stick to crafting and diplomacy, and tell me again how this is a casual friendly game?
I’d appreciate a quote, but that was taken out of context if it is indeed accurate. While the other spheres are at times, especially at lower levels, more casual, there will be many instances of difficult and more core gamer and even raid instances where the other spheres will be essential. Likewise, there will be compelling and fun casual content for adventurers from level 1 to 50.
Question 7: Elaborate on how we are all inspired by "the bleeding edge", yet downplay the raid element of the game and its rewards?
We don’t downplay raiding. Raiding will be a blast in Vanguard. We’ll make it less tedious and control things such that zerging and other less creative tactics won’t work (or work nearly as well). We vary raid sizes and have dynamic threat assessment such that if you bring too many people to a raid, the encounter may simply flee. Bottom line: by saying that the game is focused on the middle, the ‘core’ gamer, on grouping, it by no means indicates a desire to downplay or make less fun casual or raiding. The majority of content will be grouping, but there will be plenty of casual and raid content (about 60% group, 20% casual, and 20% raid, although this is a rough estimate and since we’re not done populating the world, being still in beta, that may change, but the general plan won’t, nor will our primary target audience.
Question 8: Tell us how the best part of being partnered with Microsoft was the artistic control you had over the game, and how you parted ways with Microsoft and got SOE as your publisher to gain the artistic freedom you told people you already had?
Things changed at Microsoft. Their gaming studio was reorganized, priorities changed, the Xbox 360 was coming out, etc. So while things went great with Microsoft for some time, as I posted, about a year and a half ago things slowly started to indicated to us that there may be some issues. Phil Spencer, the General Manager in charge of their gaming studios, who also is a big Vanguard fan and plays in beta (and is currently in beta – we remain great friends), and I had a long talk after a while and we both agreed that it made more sense for the success of Vanguard that we find another publisher. So we broke away and went to SOE, who is indeed suited to focusing on just MMOGs, hosting them, marketing them, etc. And now we have even more artistic freedom. So things worked out well, and for all parties. We get a publisher who has more experience with MMOGs and can focus on them and their specific needs, SOE gets a great game during a time period where they need one, and Microsoft still gets a great game that will make their platform (Windows XP, and eventually Windows Vista s well) look great. You have to remember also that Microsoft looks at things differently than many publishers. They have a big picture to look at, in that they make PC games, console games, operating systems, office software, databases, and much more. So for them, a great game that makes their platform and operating system look fantastic, even if its third party, is better than a not-as-great game that is first party. Bottom line: we remain great friends with Microsoft, appreciate all that they have done for us, and look forward to working with them in the future in any number of possible scenarios.
Question 9: Since yours is a "challenging game", talk about how there will be no twinks and PLs ...
This too has been answered many times, but here goes:
There will be twinks. First, there is good twinking (when you twink yourself, which encourages replayability) and then there is bad twinking, when you just hand items to random people that are higher level than they are, giving them an advantage in-game and essentially robbing them of the sense of satisfaction of earning the item themselves. The latter also accelerates MUDflation.
For good twinking, we have the Veteran System, where, say, you have a level 30 character and you make a new second character and equip him with some items from your level 30 character. Because we know you have a level 30 character, we will reward you for creating an ‘alt’ and experiencing other aspects of Vanguard (different areas, different classes, different races, etc.). How will we reward you? In Vanguard, items are scaled such that if a lower level character gets a high level item, while it is slightly better than an item around his level, it’s not as powerful as if it were wielded by a character closer to the level of the item. With the Veteran system, the item scaling isn’t as severe. While your twinked ‘alt’ won’t be godlike, he will be a bit more powerful, noticeably so, and thus you are rewarded and encouraged to play through the game with multiple characters and also play the game longer.
For bad twinking we have several systems that slow down MUDflation, which is arguably the biggest problem with this sort of twinking. First, we have the Altar/Sacrifice system. When you come out of a dungeon with extra loot, instead of just handing it to some random lower level character, or even a lower level friend, you can instead sacrifice it to an altar and receive long lasting buffs that make a significant difference to you and your party when playing the game. Also, with all the different items for the different spheres, plus an emphasis on situational gear, especially at higher levels, you will be encouraged to keep around multiple sets of gear – no longer will you have just one set of gear that is your best because ‘best’ depends on where you are and who you are fighting. You can store your extra gear in the saddle bags of your horse, in your ship, in your home, or in a bank. Horses, for example, are soul bound, so on the occasion that you are fighting high challenge mobs and need to do a CR, you simply reach into your saddle bags, equip yourself with another set of gear, and ride back to the dungeon you died in (which is relatively close by, since you appear at the nearest Outpost to where you died). All of this is very cool and adds a lot of strategy to the game, having decisions to make as to how you configure yourself, but it also helps with twinking by discouraging it and instead encouraging hoarding of gear which thereby decreases the chance of you wanting to hand out items and again makes you think twice about twinking and therefore it slows MUDflation. Another ‘system’ are quests that require you to turn in your current item(s) for better item(s), thus removing the previous item(s) from the economy, again curbing both twinking and MUDflation. And there are others we’ve talked about, which you are welcome to look up, including the ability to lend items as opposed to permanently giving an item to someone (although we’re not sure if that will make it in by release), and more.
Power leveling is discouraged in several ways as well. First, being such an item centric game, you will need to ‘do’ dungeons to get gear. Some gear is only attainable in dungeons, whether by slaying NPCs or finding forges and such where only those special items can be made. Those items will likely be either not tradable or at least attuned. This, therefore, discourages power leveling because it will be that much harder to obtain the items you want – you might figure out a way to power level your way up, but you will have issues obtaining level appropriate gear. There will also be certain spells, skills, and abilities you can only obtain by watching or experiencing the game in certain areas. Thus, if you just power level to hit 50 as fast as you can with as little risk as you can, again you might be level 50, but you won’t be as powerful as the level 50 who played through the game and acquired these various special spells, skills, and abilities, There will also likely be Trivial Loot Code, assuming it works out in beta, to stop bottom feeding, again making it hard on the pure power leveler. And our encounter system will likely also include mechanics that make it such that if you just sit in one area and kill, kill, kill that you will receive diminishing returns. Lastly, buffs and such will scale such that if you have higher level buddies, they won’t be able to cast spells on you such that your noob is overly powerful for his level – just like items are scaled, so is just about everything else. So moving around the world, seeing the sights, experiencing the various overland areas and dungeons, etc. will result in a character that, when you do reach maximum level, is significantly more powerful than the guy who just sat around and killed the most easy mobs over and over again.
And why would we do all of this? Because power leveling generally isn’t fun. Many people do it because they follow the path of least resistance even if that path isn’t the most fun. From the beginning, from the day we put the FAQ up, we put forth the tenet that the path of least resistance shall also be the path to the most fun. So while I’ve focused on that which negatively reinforces you to not just sit there, bored, power leveling, it is also our responsibility to make a game that is fun from levels 1-49 – the game does NOT start at 50. Our goal is to make the game fun regardless of your level or play style, and we mean to reach that goal.
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That's it for now -- let me know if I can help or clarify further.
thanks,
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Brad McQuaid
CCO, Visionary Realms, Inc.
www.pantheonmmo.com
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jrgambit is looking for attention.
What confuses me the most is that i've never seen an MMO have such haters. Why are there people so bent on trying to convince other people not to play this game?
Sorry you feel that way, but I'm confident that most people play great games, regardless of the publisher (and in this case co-publisher). And even if not, I wish you the best. In the meantime, while we may not de-throne the millions of people playing WoW, our niche of 500,000+ will pay extremely well and allow us to continue to develop Vanguard and implement all of the great expansion and other ideas we've got detailed and planned that will last us for years. Vanguard at launch, while IMHO incredible, will be nothing when compared to the Vanguard of 2008 or 2009. Oh, and it will make us enough money to pay rent, buy some toys, and have some fun outside of work too
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Brad McQuaid
CCO, Visionary Realms, Inc.
www.pantheonmmo.com
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Heard that SOME of the best GROUPING-items are only available via raids however. Which in turn give raiders a strong edge over non-raiders, in ALL gameplays; including the grouping gameplay.
If 20% of the best items are earned through raid only, then raiders are 20% stronger than non-raiders when it come to grouping. (not a raw 20%, since the difference is maybe twice better items, still, this is making the beneficiary of the item WAY more than 20% stronger than a non-raider, as far as grouping is concerned for anyone understand the combat mechanic).
Restricting 1 HP to raiders only when it come to the grouping gameplay is unfair. Now we are talking of 20% of the items at release...and guess what, I am pretty sure it will increase to other items as the game advance and as you "listen" to the communities...the minorities communities that is.
I do have to admit I took a scan of the cover and included it in a mini-video we put out just for fun
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Brad McQuaid
CCO, Visionary Realms, Inc.
www.pantheonmmo.com
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sounds hot.
also....why are yall fucking quoting huge paragraphs...
Unfortunately, Jonaku has been around the VSoH boards for a while and he has generally always had negative things to post even before beta was around. I learned long ago that Jonaku's posts are pointless, and just futile attempts to cause disent wherever he can. My questions for Jonaku are:
Why are you still hanging around the VSoH community if you believe it will be such a terrible failure?
Why are we rushing to judgement of a game that is still being made?
Are you a game developer or have some sort of professional experience in the gaming industry?
I believe that the game has a TON of potential, and I could care less what people are saying at this point. The gameplay they are working towards is exactly what I want in a MMO. Because the game has depth and is not geared to get you to max level by soloing in 10 days is a wonderful thing. It has been a terribly long time since I have played a MMO that gave me a sense of accomplishment and offered the depth being discussed here. If Vanguard can pull that off, they will be getting my money for quite some time. Forums always seem plagued by doomsayers wanting to denounce anything they can. I would suggest to everyone that we don't rush to judgement, and let Sigil present the final product. Come release, then we can make VALID criticism and really see if this game delivers.
Hello all im new here. Thought id come and talk about Vanguard cause
ive been reading their forums nearly every day for about 3 years now,
so i know quite alot about the game and ive seen all the movies and
most of the screenies.
First off, someone said, "But he really didn't address the concerns of the players, he just rejected them.
The concerns of the players are X, Y, Z. His answer to each one is
"False" and then he cut and paste marketing material that had
previously been written into this post. My concerns do not feel
addressed, they just feel dismissed."
I
dont think he was rejecting them. I think the purpose of his post was
the say that those things arent an issue, and if you want to see for
yourself, you can visit their forums and read the stuff and watch the
movies etc. I'll try to help link or reply to those questions though.
Heard that the game is only hard core? Its
more hardcore than some games i would imagine. Like WoW for example.
But really its not a seriously hardcore game. Its not EQ all over
again. I think the whole point of this game is to make the good bits of
EQ without the bad bits. And it also uses alot of ideas from games
since EQ and it builds on or changes ideas they used. So the time it
takes to reach level 50 is almost certainly going to be longer than
WoW. But i think it will be quicker than EQ. Besides leveling though,
its not a hard core game, because you dont have to play it all the
time, and you dont have to be hardcore. You can log in for 1 hour a
week and enjoy it just as much as anyone else.
Some players on the official forum are even worried that its becoming
LESS and less hardcore as time goes on. That isn't necessarily true
because it was never really hardcore to begin with. Its not a super
easy game, but it does take a less than hardcore approach to alot of
things. Theres no level loss like EQ. And theres no huge corpse runs
(there are tons of outposts now where people can respawn so you are
never too far from wherever you where hunting). Theres also icons above
some NPC's heads, so in an enormous world like this, it gives you a
break and points out where a merchant is for example. Theres also a map
that anyone can bring up whenever they want. Basically theres lots of
things the game does to make life easier on players, but its still
going to offer a challenge. Its kind of half hardcore half uhhh
none...hardcore...
Heard that you can't solo or play casually? I cant quite remember
the quotes, but they told us what percentage of content they where
making. So like 20% solo, 20% raids, 20% groups etc... I cant remember
exactly what it was. But to me, it sounds a bit like they are making it
similar to the original EQ in terms of content. So if you remember the
original EQ there was 2 dragons, and then they added those 3 plains. So
there was some raid content. And then there was tons of content for
group players. And there was also plenty of places for people solo. One
of the best things about Vanguard (imo) is that the world is HUGE. So
where as 20% solo content in EQ would mean like a couple of medium sized
zones.... in Vanguard its going to be tons. So theres going to be LOTS
of stuff to hunt no matter what you want to do. They also have a swanky
new LFG tool which is better than anything you have ever heard of....
But basically, you are easily going to be able to log in for an hour or
two, get a group and go hunting together and make some progress and
have fun. And then theres crafting like alot of MMORPGs which you can
do for however long you want. But the game also has this Diplomacy
system which is evidently really good... Its also evidently designed
mainly around being solo. So you can likely log on for just 20 minutes (or however long..)
and do some diplomacy if you want.
Heard that SOE has the ability to change the game?
Well basically when he said "False" thats all you need to hear. They
have been totally up front right from the start what the deal was. When
they where with MS it was some kind of 50/50 deal. So MS had a say in
everything they did.... I think they came to some kind of dissagreement
because they decided to part ways, but Sigil borrowed money, and paid
off Microsoft's share. So Sigil ended up owning 100% of everything.....
Then they decided who to go with, and chose SOE because they are the
best at what Sigil need (and they know alot of the people who run SOE and their offices aren't far away etc...). So all SOE are doing is advertising the game,
hosting the servers and billing and technical support (not customer
support like GM's). But rather than SOE being "in charge" of that....
they basically just bought a small share from Sigil's 100%. So they are
kind of in charge of it, but Sigil have the last say in everything they
do. And all they are doing is what i mentioned above..... So not only
do they have a small role in it, they have nothing to do with the
actual game itself - in terms of gameplay, graphics, etc.
Heard that the game only looks like EQ2 +?
Thats upto whoever looks at it i suppose. But theres plenty of
screenshots and movies to look at. Some are better than others..... but
generally i think it looks like a different league to EQ2. But more
importantly, i think its going to be alot less power hungry and more
stable than EQ2. So even EQ2 on maximum settings wont look as good as
Vanguard on medium settings and Vanguard will be way smoother on most
peoples PC's. Best thing to do tho is look at the screenshots. The ones
they released for this years E3 are just amazing..... Theres very few
games that look that good imo. Maybe like... Crysis and UT2k7 and a few
others.
Amathe:Explain how risk should be proportionate to reward. Then define risk.
Risk is what? It's time! No matter how you spin it, it's time. So if
reward is proportionate to time, this is casual friendly how? Didnt read that bit, but when they say risk vs reward, the risk is just the risk to your character. That principle is nothing new, its like most rpgs really. If you kill a level 1 skelly you arent going to get chests full of treasure
From Jonaku, "How bizarre and sadly unprofessional that the CEO of a gaming
company would post in a community forum this long rambling apologia
propaganda piece with everything in it but the kitchen sink. Is this
REALLY the CEO of Vanguard?
Brad: "Hi, you know every criticism of my game
that keeps swirling around the Interwebs from a thousand different
independent sources? They're not true, cause I say so. Here's some
marketing collateral. Q.E.D."
Me: "Okey dokey....."
Its definatly him. He visits the official forum and talks to people
every day. He is always there. And its not sad at all, because its his
job
doing exactly what he wants to do. He could be on a golf course all day
if he wanted to, and just have some marketing department deal with
everything.... But he is doing it himself. He plays the game all the
time, he probably has the final say on everything that happens (him and
his partner anyway), so who better than him to talk about the game? He
is also a big RPG player so he knows whats going on. He is obviously
really interested in this stuff too.
As for the intraweb
It makes sence he visits here doesn't it? He visits the official site,
the site of a major guild, and probably a few other sites. So it makes
sence he would stop by "MMORPG.com" at some point, doesn't it? This is
a major site after all.
p.s. I get the impression he likes a challenge too.... That guild forum i mentioned is full of people quick to flame the game (before they even play it
P.p.s If i can help with this game at all, let me know. I got bookmarks all over the place, so i can link movies and screenshots, and quotes to things about the game. Although, if what you want is solid info, this is probably one of the best places you will find:
http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/faq.php
Takes some getting used to, and theres alot to read.. but everything in that has been confirmed by someone at Sigil.