Your first paragraph proved my point exactly. Any alternative ruleset servers other than FFA PvP with full loot would prove their model a failure. That is why they won't allow for any different rulesets. Thank you for admitting it. It is more than 99% of the current Darkfall Online fanbois would do. There is one thing I don't understand. The FFA PvP fan bois have tried to get their paws into every PvE game that has ever come along. So why when a PvP game comes a long and some PvE fanbois just want ONE server to play on do so many people cry foul. That just doesn't make much sense and seems a bit hypocritical to me.
Shannie, it's not a PvP game, it's a freedom game. It is a difference. Take away PvP, you take away the freedom to fight. Just look at the real world. You have the choice to loot your neighbour, but you don't. Why ? Because the consequenses of doing it is too harmful. So you go to work to earn your living.
In DF that will be harvesting resourses or mobs and crafing. That is what you can do relatvely safe. You have the freedom of turning to crime but that is more risky because you alienate yourself from your race' community. You can also go raiding other races but then the risk is even greater (longer distances, hostile npc's and pc's). So everyone of us will have to evaluate risk vs profit profile while gaming because higher risk = higher profit. My point is that it you that decide that profile, not some fake server ruleset.
--- And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there. John Smedley, SOE
Shannie, it's not a PvP game, it's a freedom game. It is a difference. Take away PvP, you take away the freedom to fight. Just look at the real world. You have the choice to loot your neighbour, but you don't. Why ? Because the consequenses of doing it is too harmful. So you go to work to earn your living.
UO was supossed to have consequences. You couldn't go into town if u were a pker. So people just shopped with alts
In UO, uou couldn't level for 5 minutes with out 20 man gank squad showing up. This game will be no differnt.
There will be consequences for mass pkers and power abusers, although we don't know what these are, I suggest you keep your comparative speculation to a minimum until you understand more.
"Don't hold breath about another KOTOR game coming from Bioware" - Chris Preistly
"Bioware is more intrested in pursueing development of it's own Intellectual properties"
Your first paragraph proved my point exactly. Any alternative ruleset servers other than FFA PvP with full loot would prove their model a failure. That is why they won't allow for any different rulesets. Thank you for admitting it. It is more than 99% of the current Darkfall Online fanbois would do. There is one thing I don't understand. The FFA PvP fan bois have tried to get their paws into every PvE game that has ever come along. So why when a PvP game comes a long and some PvE fanbois just want ONE server to play on do so many people cry foul. That just doesn't make much sense and seems a bit hypocritical to me.
Shannie, it's not a PvP game, it's a freedom game. It is a difference. Take away PvP, you take away the freedom to fight. Just look at the real world. You have the choice to loot your neighbour, but you don't. Why ? Because the consequenses of doing it is too harmful. So you go to work to earn your living.
In DF that will be harvesting resourses or mobs and crafing. That is what you can do relatvely safe. You have the freedom of turning to crime but that is more risky because you alienate yourself from your race' community. You can also go raiding other races but then the risk is even greater (longer distances, hostile npc's and pc's). So everyone of us will have to evaluate risk vs profit profile while gaming because higher risk = higher profit. My point is that it you that decide that profile, not some fake server ruleset.
Like you said, in the real world there are consequenses for your actions. In Darkfall, there is no real consequense for criminals. You ever hear of http://www.frontier1859.com/ ? That game will be FFA PvP as well. You want to know the big difference between the two? Consequenses. You can and will die in that game if you are a criminal. Want to kill someone? Go ahead. Now the law is after your head. In that game, there will be permadeath for your character. You can play Darkfall Online as some grand FFA PvP game of choices all you want.
I was there with Shadowbane. We all know how huge it was and how it ended up F2P with 5,000 people spread across 6 servers.
Now, if Darkfall Online was like Frontier1859, where if you kill someone the law was after you and everyone even your own faction could hunt you down and kill you permanently without consequence, then I'd be all for it. Unfortunately, the system as currently designed is way to pro griefer. And for the record, I don't see how you are going to be able to gather resources in safety. To me, when you are out harvesting you are going to be the most vulnerable.
Back on topic. If it was a freedom game, then they'd give me a server to play the game in PvE mod if I so chose. They won't, because everyone knows that the non-PvP server would be the most popular server in the game.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Just like tacking PVP on a game designed for PVE is a bad idea doomed to failure..... so is trying to take a game designed for PVP and tacking on a PVE only mode.... (notice, EVE won't do it).....
Eve won't do it because they have 250,000 subscribers all playing on ONE server. Other games have 3,000-15,000 subscribers per server. Two completely different types of game servers.
Incorrect, because EVE's entire economy and game play is designed around the PVP.... you can't play EVE w/o the PVP which relies on the steady destruction of ships to sustain the crafting economy..... besides, as a PVE game, EVE really tanks..... we all do the PVE just to earn the ISK for our PVP activities... which are expensive to maintain..... (my current fleet of ships consists of 8 Stealth Bombers, 3 Battleships, 4 Haulers, 3 Cruisers worth approximately 1.5 billion ISK). Considering the fact I lose 2-3 ships a month it keeps me busy running PVE, or buying from PVE crafters to replace them.....other folks lose them at a much faster rate.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Like you said, in the real world there are consequenses for your actions. In Darkfall, there is no real consequense for criminals. You ever hear of http://www.frontier1859.com/ ? That game will be FFA PvP as well. You want to know the big difference between the two? Consequenses. You can and will die in that game if you are a criminal. Want to kill someone? Go ahead. Now the law is after your head. In that game, there will be permadeath for your character. You can play Darkfall Online as some grand FFA PvP game of choices all you want. Now, if Darkfall Online was like Frontier1859, where if you kill someone the law was after you and everyone even your own faction could hunt you down and kill you permanently without consequence, then I'd be all for it. Unfortunately, the system as currently designed is way to pro griefer. And for the record, I don't see how you are going to be able to gather resources in safety. To me, when you are out harvesting you are going to be the most vulnerable.
I agree. There would have to be something this extreme to stop the constant random pking
It's an interesting thought. Not a very viable one, and I'll explain why in a moment - but interesting! Of course, it's the flip side of the same argument pvp players have tried for years now: "how will it hurt Vanguard to start one full pvp server? it won't hurt the pve players at all, and just gives the game more subscribers!"
Which is all true. Except that a PvE server on a PvP designed world is going to have very poor gameplay, for the same reason that PvP worlds in PvE games tend to be pointless and silly. The game is built, designed, for a particular type of gameplay. It would require a massive rewrite of the game world and mechanics to make it viable in some other gameplay type.
Here's a good comparison: removing pvp and looting from Darkfall would be like removing levels and items from World of Warcraft. Yes, there are still things to do - but what's the point?
They could create a pve world for Darkfall. It would net them some more money, in the short term, and might even briefly be popular. But the players would leave, and pretty rapidly it would become a ghost server with only a few dedicated folks sticking it out - because none of the content is geared toward pve players. The game is being designed to have content that will have purpose only in a pvp context. Remove it, and what you would likely have left over is a bad pve game.
I used to say the same thing in reverse - used to go into a betatest for a pve game, and suggest a full pvp server. I'm leaning away from that more and more. PvE games that have a pvp server tacked on generally just have bad pvp, pointless fighting with nothing to fight over, no real politics, and a mess. The more I play these games (several dozen, at this point), the more I am seeing that most game designs are pretty specific - and pretty fragile. Messing with core elements can destabilize them very easily, and turn a good Game X into a terrible Game Y.
Short form: games should pick a vision and stick with it. Darkfall is targeting a niche of only a few hundred thousand players, but it's also the ONLY upcoming game really targeting that niche. With no competition except Eve and the mostly defunct Shadowbane, Darkfall should be able to pick up a solid population if it releases well. No, it'll never be a WOW - but it could definitely collect an Eve-level playerbase.
Here's a good comparison: removing pvp and looting from Darkfall would be like removing levels and items from World of Warcraft. Yes, there are still things to do - but what's the point?
WOW has two differnet rule sets. non pvp servers, and open pvp servers. And both are doing well. So you aren't making much sense
Darkfall will have crafting, and quests, and dungeons, and plenty of mobs to kill. So it will have everything othe non pvp games have
Thank you for such a wonderful idea of ruining the economy. Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?
I do not like this idea for this particular game. Developers have a hard enough time getting loot servers and pvp servers right as it is. Let DarkFall focus all their resources on their Open PvP Server like they have been. If it becomes a hit and they do it well, then they can play around with other rule sets.
Like you said, in the real world there are consequenses for your actions. In Darkfall, there is no real consequense for criminals. You ever hear of http://www.frontier1859.com/ ? That game will be FFA PvP as well. You want to know the big difference between the two? Consequenses. You can and will die in that game if you are a criminal. Want to kill someone? Go ahead. Now the law is after your head. In that game, there will be permadeath for your character. You can play Darkfall Online as some grand FFA PvP game of choices all you want. Now, if Darkfall Online was like Frontier1859, where if you kill someone the law was after you and everyone even your own faction could hunt you down and kill you permanently without consequence, then I'd be all for it. Unfortunately, the system as currently designed is way to pro griefer. And for the record, I don't see how you are going to be able to gather resources in safety. To me, when you are out harvesting you are going to be the most vulnerable.
I agree. There would have to be something this extreme to stop the constant random pking
Did you both forget that DF DOES have consequences for your actions? Obivously yes because you forget about the guards that will kill you for harming another player that and being flagged and be able to attacked by any other player. So this renders your whole point moot and please read more before making a post like this.
Like you said, in the real world there are consequenses for your actions. In Darkfall, there is no real consequense for criminals. You ever hear of http://www.frontier1859.com/ ? That game will be FFA PvP as well. You want to know the big difference between the two? Consequenses. You can and will die in that game if you are a criminal. Want to kill someone? Go ahead. Now the law is after your head. In that game, there will be permadeath for your character. You can play Darkfall Online as some grand FFA PvP game of choices all you want. Now, if Darkfall Online was like Frontier1859, where if you kill someone the law was after you and everyone even your own faction could hunt you down and kill you permanently without consequence, then I'd be all for it. Unfortunately, the system as currently designed is way to pro griefer. And for the record, I don't see how you are going to be able to gather resources in safety. To me, when you are out harvesting you are going to be the most vulnerable.
I agree. There would have to be something this extreme to stop the constant random pking
Did you both forget that DF DOES have consequences for your actions? Obivously yes because you forget about the guards that will kill you for harming another player that and being flagged and be able to attacked by any other player. So this renders your whole point moot and please read more before making a post like this.
Those "penalties" are not consequences for your actions. Respawn with your skills in tact and going getting more cheap gear to rinse and repeat your griefing on newbies isn't a penalty at all. Plus, it isn't like Shannia the pk griefer is out in the boonies ganking newbies some guard is gonna auto spawn to kill me. As long as I stay away from town and keep on ganking lowbies, I'm pretty penalty free. Eventually someone will catch with me and kill me, but until that happens I've ruined a lot of fun for players for some period of time. You also mentioned, "Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?" No, not at all. All I'm saying is the existing ruleset in Darkfall is too lenient on griefers in this game.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Did you both forget that DF DOES have consequences for your actions? Obivously yes because you forget about the guards that will kill you for harming another player that and being flagged and be able to attacked by any other player. So this renders your whole point moot and please read more before making a post like this.
UO had the exact same rules. Did you play UO at release?? players just stayed away from cities and ran around in 20 man gank groups, slaughtering noobs all day long.
Those "penalties" are not consequences for your actions. Respawn with your skills in tact and going getting more cheap gear to rinse and repeat your griefing on newbies isn't a penalty at all. Plus, it isn't like Shannia the pk griefer is out in the boonies ganking newbies some guard is gonna auto spawn to kill me. As long as I stay away from town and keep on ganking lowbies, I'm pretty penalty free. Eventually someone will catch with me and kill me, but until that happens I've ruined a lot of fun for players for some period of time. You also mentioned, "Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?" No, not at all. All I'm saying is the existing ruleset in Darkfall is too lenient on griefers in this game.
If they are newbies than they most likely arent going to go far from the eye of the guards if their smart and you do kill them once your alignment drops past a point than you'll be relocated to the nearest choasstone as your bind point meaning your not going back to that town anytime soon.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items.
So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed.
For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do?
This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group.
Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
If they are newbies than they most likely arent going to go far from the eye of the guards if their smart and you do kill them once your alignment drops past a point than you'll be relocated to the nearest choasstone as your bind point meaning your not going back to that town anytime soon.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items. So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed. For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do? This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group. Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
You just don't get it. People will use alts to go into towns and buy items. And they run iaround in 20 man groups, so they will slaughter every small group they run across.
If they are newbies than they most likely arent going to go far from the eye of the guards if their smart and you do kill them once your alignment drops past a point than you'll be relocated to the nearest choasstone as your bind point meaning your not going back to that town anytime soon.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items. So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed. For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do? This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group. Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
You just don't get it. People will use alts to go into towns and buy items. And they run iaround in 20 man groups, so they will slaughter every small group they run across.
You still need a huge surplus of gold. You think just because they have 20 people that most of those don't apply? Do they not need weapons? Do they not need repairs? Do they not need to worry about mobs? Do they not need arrows? Do they not need potions? All that goes into weight which makes their whole group slow. Also your post assumes that either 1) its SRS or 2) that everyone in that group has an alt. I'm not trying to say things like that won't happen but its not going to be as common as you two like to make it out to be which would obviously not make this game a pro-greifer game.
You still need a huge surplus of gold. You think just because they have 20 people that most of those don't apply? Do they not need weapons? Do they not need repairs? Do they not need to worry about mobs? Do they not need arrows? Do they not need potions? All that goes into weight which makes their whole group slow. Also your post assumes that either 1) its SRS or 2) that everyone in that group has an alt. I'm not trying to say things like that won't happen but its not going to be as common as you two like to make it out to be which would obviously not make this game a pro-greifer game.
Look, you obviously didn't play UO at release, since u were 5 years old then. Well I did. And yes, everyone had an alt. And yes it was one big grief fest.
Those "penalties" are not consequences for your actions. Respawn with your skills in tact and going getting more cheap gear to rinse and repeat your griefing on newbies isn't a penalty at all. Plus, it isn't like Shannia the pk griefer is out in the boonies ganking newbies some guard is gonna auto spawn to kill me. As long as I stay away from town and keep on ganking lowbies, I'm pretty penalty free. Eventually someone will catch with me and kill me, but until that happens I've ruined a lot of fun for players for some period of time. You also mentioned, "Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?" No, not at all. All I'm saying is the existing ruleset in Darkfall is too lenient on griefers in this game.
If they are newbies than they most likely arent going to go far from the eye of the guards if their smart and you do kill them once your alignment drops past a point than you'll be relocated to the nearest choasstone as your bind point meaning your not going back to that town anytime soon.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items.
So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed.
For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do?
This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group.
Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
Awwwww, the big bad chaos stone. I think I'm gonna cry now. HELLO!!!!!!! How stupid do you think griefers are. Need supplies or new gear because your's breaks and you can't go to town... who you gonna call, your friends on TS to bring you more of anything else you need! It isn't hard to figure out how to get around that system. The Chaos stone is only a burden to the pure soloist who was stupid enough not to have a list of trusted friends. In a game like this you have friends.
Seriously, are the rules set up that if you trade with a flagged player then you are flagged as well? I seriously doubt it. If so, are you able to drop loot on the ground that others can pick up. If so, now that problem of trading with a flagged player is solved, huh?
This is why I'm saying the rules are too carebear for the griefer. There are way too many ways for the griefer to beat the system. If you become flagged, the game has to be miserable for you, otherwise there is no consequence for one's actions. You mentioned real life earlier, so now it is my turn. Very, very rarely is there a perfect crime where you can keep griefing people over and over where the rules are stacked in your favor. In Darkfall Online, if you go criminal, the odds should be stacked so far against you, it would be like commiting a crime in real life. In real life, if you aid a criminal, knowingly or not, you now have to face the consequences. If someone wants to go criminal, they need to feel the pain for their actions.
And by the way, this is suppose to be a thread about a non-pvp server. LOL, sorry about participating in the derail.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Look what happened to UO when they made trammel....it sucked. Darkfall developers have mentioned before that DF is for a targeted audience. I dont have the link but I swear it said they were planning 2 servers, one for the US and for Europe. That would show me that they arent expecting a big market. When was the last ffa pvp game out anyway? Most gamers don't even know what a ffa pvp game is since they were too young to experience the older game models. You are right it probably would attract more people and make them more money and I am not against it, just as long as they leave the pvp servers alone.
It amazes me how so many anti pvp people come here to say "oh darkfall will obviously fail because ffa pvp is for fantical faggots!" Well I like the challenge of pvp, revenge, domination, and the friendships that occur in brutal games like this. I wont even look at an online game if there is no pvp at all...lets face it, pvm content gets boring unless you have a really good dev team that is always updating. Random pvp is always different. I find that most people that don't liek pvp have been griefed, or are intimidated by the thought of it, I know I was very intimated by it at first. Once you get passed it, it is alot of fun. It is so simple, if you dont like pvp you probably wont like darkfall, but if you have never really tried a game like this with open pvp, then give it a shot because its probably been close to 10 yrs since the market has seen one.
You still need a huge surplus of gold. You think just because they have 20 people that most of those don't apply? Do they not need weapons? Do they not need repairs? Do they not need to worry about mobs? Do they not need arrows? Do they not need potions? All that goes into weight which makes their whole group slow. Also your post assumes that either 1) its SRS or 2) that everyone in that group has an alt. I'm not trying to say things like that won't happen but its not going to be as common as you two like to make it out to be which would obviously not make this game a pro-greifer game.
Look, you obviously didn't play UO at release, since u were 5 years old then. Well I did. And yes, everyone had an alt. And yes it was one big grief fest.
Your right I didn't play UO but you obviously don't realize that UO is not DF. No matter how you slice it logistics will play a large role in this. Also once again your post assumes that DF is SRS which could very well make your point almost entirely moot.
Your right I didn't play UO but you obviously don't realize that UO is not DF. No matter how you slice it logistics will play a large role in this. Also once again your post assumes that DF is SRS which could very well make your point almost entirely moot.
Those "penalties" are not consequences for your actions. Respawn with your skills in tact and going getting more cheap gear to rinse and repeat your griefing on newbies isn't a penalty at all. Plus, it isn't like Shannia the pk griefer is out in the boonies ganking newbies some guard is gonna auto spawn to kill me. As long as I stay away from town and keep on ganking lowbies, I'm pretty penalty free. Eventually someone will catch with me and kill me, but until that happens I've ruined a lot of fun for players for some period of time. You also mentioned, "Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?" No, not at all. All I'm saying is the existing ruleset in Darkfall is too lenient on griefers in this game.
If they are newbies than they most likely arent going to go far from the eye of the guards if their smart and you do kill them once your alignment drops past a point than you'll be relocated to the nearest choasstone as your bind point meaning your not going back to that town anytime soon.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items.
So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed.
For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do?
This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group.
Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
Awwwww, the big bad chaos stone. I think I'm gonna cry now. HELLO!!!!!!! How stupid do you think griefers are. Need supplies or new gear because your's breaks and you can't go to town... who you gonna call, your friends on TS to bring you more of anything else you need! It isn't hard to figure out how to get around that system. The Chaos stone is only a burden to the pure soloist who was stupid enough not to have a list of trusted friends. In a game like this you have friends.
Did you know that Chaos stones are seculeded spots? So it doesnt even matter if you have friends you'll be so far off it'll probably take you hours to get back to your spot. Even so what stops another person from killing you to get a alignment boost once you get back? Your making yourself a huge target for good-doers, enemy races, and random joe who wants some items and skill xp with no penalty. You don't think that is going to appeal to many people than you got another thing coming.
Seriously, are the rules set up that if you trade with a flagged player then you are flagged as well? I seriously doubt it. If so, are you able to drop loot on the ground that others can pick up. If so, now that problem of trading with a flagged player is solved, huh?
For most they could just kill you and get everything with no penalty so what stops that? So much simpler and more rewarding.
This is why I'm saying the rules are too carebear for the griefer. There are way too many ways for the griefer to beat the system. If you become flagged, the game has to be miserable for you, otherwise there is no consequence for one's actions. You mentioned real life earlier, so now it is my turn. Very, very rarely is there a perfect crime where you can keep griefing people over and over where the rules are stacked in your favor. In Darkfall Online, if you go criminal, the odds should be stacked so far against you, it would be like commiting a crime in real life. In real life, if you aid a criminal, knowingly or not, you now have to face the consequences. If someone wants to go criminal, they need to feel the pain for their actions.
And by the way, this is suppose to be a thread about a non-pvp server. LOL, sorry about participating in the derail.
Your right I didn't play UO but you obviously don't realize that UO is not DF. No matter how you slice it logistics will play a large role in this. Also once again your post assumes that DF is SRS which could very well make your point almost entirely moot.
what is SRS?
Single Race per Server and Single Character per Server. These two are the ones that have been debated on DF forums and one of those is going to be chosen. I would probably guess SCS would be chosen seeing as how majority voted for it.
Your right I didn't play UO but you obviously don't realize that UO is not DF. No matter how you slice it logistics will play a large role in this. Also once again your post assumes that DF is SRS which could very well make your point almost entirely moot.
what is SRS?
Single Race per Server and Single Character per Server. These two are the ones that have been debated on DF forums and one of those is going to be chosen. I would probably guess SCS would be chosen seeing as how majority voted for it.
Not to mention that SCS will generate a lot of additional income for Darkfall Online because of 2 boxing, spying, muling, etc. Nearly every FFA PvP game I've played most people I knew played 2 accounts for a host of different reasons. Saying that, I've never played more than one account where my main was on a PvE server. This goes back to the point of multiple rulesets for the game will drive additional revenue for the company.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Not to mention that SCS will generate a lot of additional income for Darkfall Online because of 2 boxing, spying, muling, etc. Nearly every FFA PvP game I've played most people I knew played 2 accounts for a host of different reasons. Saying that, I've never played more than one account where my main was on a PvE server. This goes back to the point of multiple rulesets for the game will drive additional revenue for the company.
Exactly. Most people will have second accounts. And even if you don't , there will be plenty of people in your guild that do so it isn't a problem.
Comments
In DF that will be harvesting resourses or mobs and crafing. That is what you can do relatvely safe. You have the freedom of turning to crime but that is more risky because you alienate yourself from your race' community. You can also go raiding other races but then the risk is even greater (longer distances, hostile npc's and pc's). So everyone of us will have to evaluate risk vs profit profile while gaming because higher risk = higher profit. My point is that it you that decide that profile, not some fake server ruleset.
---
And when we got more women on the team, it was like No, no, no. We need puppies and horses in there.
John Smedley, SOE
UO was supossed to have consequences. You couldn't go into town if u were a pker. So people just shopped with alts
In UO, uou couldn't level for 5 minutes with out 20 man gank squad showing up. This game will be no differnt.
There will be consequences for mass pkers and power abusers, although we don't know what these are, I suggest you keep your comparative speculation to a minimum until you understand more.
"Don't hold breath about another KOTOR game coming from Bioware" - Chris Preistly
"Bioware is more intrested in pursueing development of it's own Intellectual properties"
- James Henly
In DF that will be harvesting resourses or mobs and crafing. That is what you can do relatvely safe. You have the freedom of turning to crime but that is more risky because you alienate yourself from your race' community. You can also go raiding other races but then the risk is even greater (longer distances, hostile npc's and pc's). So everyone of us will have to evaluate risk vs profit profile while gaming because higher risk = higher profit. My point is that it you that decide that profile, not some fake server ruleset.
Like you said, in the real world there are consequenses for your actions. In Darkfall, there is no real consequense for criminals. You ever hear of http://www.frontier1859.com/ ? That game will be FFA PvP as well. You want to know the big difference between the two? Consequenses. You can and will die in that game if you are a criminal. Want to kill someone? Go ahead. Now the law is after your head. In that game, there will be permadeath for your character. You can play Darkfall Online as some grand FFA PvP game of choices all you want.
I was there with Shadowbane. We all know how huge it was and how it ended up F2P with 5,000 people spread across 6 servers.
Now, if Darkfall Online was like Frontier1859, where if you kill someone the law was after you and everyone even your own faction could hunt you down and kill you permanently without consequence, then I'd be all for it. Unfortunately, the system as currently designed is way to pro griefer. And for the record, I don't see how you are going to be able to gather resources in safety. To me, when you are out harvesting you are going to be the most vulnerable.
Back on topic. If it was a freedom game, then they'd give me a server to play the game in PvE mod if I so chose. They won't, because everyone knows that the non-PvP server would be the most popular server in the game.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Eve won't do it because they have 250,000 subscribers all playing on ONE server. Other games have 3,000-15,000 subscribers per server. Two completely different types of game servers.
Incorrect, because EVE's entire economy and game play is designed around the PVP.... you can't play EVE w/o the PVP which relies on the steady destruction of ships to sustain the crafting economy..... besides, as a PVE game, EVE really tanks..... we all do the PVE just to earn the ISK for our PVP activities... which are expensive to maintain..... (my current fleet of ships consists of 8 Stealth Bombers, 3 Battleships, 4 Haulers, 3 Cruisers worth approximately 1.5 billion ISK). Considering the fact I lose 2-3 ships a month it keeps me busy running PVE, or buying from PVE crafters to replace them.....other folks lose them at a much faster rate."True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
It's an interesting thought. Not a very viable one, and I'll explain why in a moment - but interesting! Of course, it's the flip side of the same argument pvp players have tried for years now: "how will it hurt Vanguard to start one full pvp server? it won't hurt the pve players at all, and just gives the game more subscribers!"
Which is all true. Except that a PvE server on a PvP designed world is going to have very poor gameplay, for the same reason that PvP worlds in PvE games tend to be pointless and silly. The game is built, designed, for a particular type of gameplay. It would require a massive rewrite of the game world and mechanics to make it viable in some other gameplay type.
Here's a good comparison: removing pvp and looting from Darkfall would be like removing levels and items from World of Warcraft. Yes, there are still things to do - but what's the point?
They could create a pve world for Darkfall. It would net them some more money, in the short term, and might even briefly be popular. But the players would leave, and pretty rapidly it would become a ghost server with only a few dedicated folks sticking it out - because none of the content is geared toward pve players. The game is being designed to have content that will have purpose only in a pvp context. Remove it, and what you would likely have left over is a bad pve game.
I used to say the same thing in reverse - used to go into a betatest for a pve game, and suggest a full pvp server. I'm leaning away from that more and more. PvE games that have a pvp server tacked on generally just have bad pvp, pointless fighting with nothing to fight over, no real politics, and a mess. The more I play these games (several dozen, at this point), the more I am seeing that most game designs are pretty specific - and pretty fragile. Messing with core elements can destabilize them very easily, and turn a good Game X into a terrible Game Y.
Short form: games should pick a vision and stick with it. Darkfall is targeting a niche of only a few hundred thousand players, but it's also the ONLY upcoming game really targeting that niche. With no competition except Eve and the mostly defunct Shadowbane, Darkfall should be able to pick up a solid population if it releases well. No, it'll never be a WOW - but it could definitely collect an Eve-level playerbase.
Owyn
Commander, Defenders of Order
http://www.defendersoforder.com
WOW has two differnet rule sets. non pvp servers, and open pvp servers. And both are doing well. So you aren't making much sense
Darkfall will have crafting, and quests, and dungeons, and plenty of mobs to kill. So it will have everything othe non pvp games have
Thank you for such a wonderful idea of ruining the economy. Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?
I do not like this idea for this particular game. Developers have a hard enough time getting loot servers and pvp servers right as it is. Let DarkFall focus all their resources on their Open PvP Server like they have been. If it becomes a hit and they do it well, then they can play around with other rule sets.
Did you both forget that DF DOES have consequences for your actions? Obivously yes because you forget about the guards that will kill you for harming another player that and being flagged and be able to attacked by any other player. So this renders your whole point moot and please read more before making a post like this.
Did you both forget that DF DOES have consequences for your actions? Obivously yes because you forget about the guards that will kill you for harming another player that and being flagged and be able to attacked by any other player. So this renders your whole point moot and please read more before making a post like this.
Those "penalties" are not consequences for your actions. Respawn with your skills in tact and going getting more cheap gear to rinse and repeat your griefing on newbies isn't a penalty at all. Plus, it isn't like Shannia the pk griefer is out in the boonies ganking newbies some guard is gonna auto spawn to kill me. As long as I stay away from town and keep on ganking lowbies, I'm pretty penalty free. Eventually someone will catch with me and kill me, but until that happens I've ruined a lot of fun for players for some period of time. You also mentioned, "Seriously. Also what I hear about WoW's pvp server is that it usually consists of greifing and is that what you call a good server?" No, not at all. All I'm saying is the existing ruleset in Darkfall is too lenient on griefers in this game.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items.
So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed.
For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do?
This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group.
Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
You just don't get it. People will use alts to go into towns and buy items. And they run iaround in 20 man groups, so they will slaughter every small group they run across.
You just don't get it. People will use alts to go into towns and buy items. And they run iaround in 20 man groups, so they will slaughter every small group they run across.
You still need a huge surplus of gold. You think just because they have 20 people that most of those don't apply? Do they not need weapons? Do they not need repairs? Do they not need to worry about mobs? Do they not need arrows? Do they not need potions? All that goes into weight which makes their whole group slow. Also your post assumes that either 1) its SRS or 2) that everyone in that group has an alt. I'm not trying to say things like that won't happen but its not going to be as common as you two like to make it out to be which would obviously not make this game a pro-greifer game.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items.
So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed.
For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do?
This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group.
Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
Awwwww, the big bad chaos stone. I think I'm gonna cry now. HELLO!!!!!!! How stupid do you think griefers are. Need supplies or new gear because your's breaks and you can't go to town... who you gonna call, your friends on TS to bring you more of anything else you need! It isn't hard to figure out how to get around that system. The Chaos stone is only a burden to the pure soloist who was stupid enough not to have a list of trusted friends. In a game like this you have friends.
Seriously, are the rules set up that if you trade with a flagged player then you are flagged as well? I seriously doubt it. If so, are you able to drop loot on the ground that others can pick up. If so, now that problem of trading with a flagged player is solved, huh?
This is why I'm saying the rules are too carebear for the griefer. There are way too many ways for the griefer to beat the system. If you become flagged, the game has to be miserable for you, otherwise there is no consequence for one's actions. You mentioned real life earlier, so now it is my turn. Very, very rarely is there a perfect crime where you can keep griefing people over and over where the rules are stacked in your favor. In Darkfall Online, if you go criminal, the odds should be stacked so far against you, it would be like commiting a crime in real life. In real life, if you aid a criminal, knowingly or not, you now have to face the consequences. If someone wants to go criminal, they need to feel the pain for their actions.
And by the way, this is suppose to be a thread about a non-pvp server. LOL, sorry about participating in the derail.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Look what happened to UO when they made trammel....it sucked. Darkfall developers have mentioned before that DF is for a targeted audience. I dont have the link but I swear it said they were planning 2 servers, one for the US and for Europe. That would show me that they arent expecting a big market. When was the last ffa pvp game out anyway? Most gamers don't even know what a ffa pvp game is since they were too young to experience the older game models. You are right it probably would attract more people and make them more money and I am not against it, just as long as they leave the pvp servers alone.
It amazes me how so many anti pvp people come here to say "oh darkfall will obviously fail because ffa pvp is for fantical faggots!" Well I like the challenge of pvp, revenge, domination, and the friendships that occur in brutal games like this. I wont even look at an online game if there is no pvp at all...lets face it, pvm content gets boring unless you have a really good dev team that is always updating. Random pvp is always different. I find that most people that don't liek pvp have been griefed, or are intimidated by the thought of it, I know I was very intimated by it at first. Once you get passed it, it is alot of fun. It is so simple, if you dont like pvp you probably wont like darkfall, but if you have never really tried a game like this with open pvp, then give it a shot because its probably been close to 10 yrs since the market has seen one.
Your right I didn't play UO but you obviously don't realize that UO is not DF. No matter how you slice it logistics will play a large role in this. Also once again your post assumes that DF is SRS which could very well make your point almost entirely moot.
Now you also seem to forget that your weapons/armor/reagents needs to repaired/refilled. So unless you can bring all this yourself and by some grace of god it doesnt brake in the process than your cool for now... of course this is IF you can actually carry those and I don't think those are going to be light items.
So with all those items your going to be pretty close to your weight limit. So what that means is your overall slower which means those "newbs" you think you can kill could probably outrun you if you attacked them. Of course if you have some magic/bow than you could use that but what happens when you run out of arrows/reagants? You can't go to town without getting killed.
For some reason you seem to believe that you are the predator and they are the prey but what about the mobs? Unless your in the newbie area(Which is patrolled by guards) than you better expect to be attack by those as well which means to keep health up your going to need food/potions. So this increases your overall weight and since if you do run out you can't go back to town what do you do?
This whole thing is assuming if those newbs are alone. Just being new doesnt make you incompetent so your risking items attacking one so think about your odds when faced against a group.
Of course this assuming that EVERYONE you run into is a newb and since you can't really tell your likely to be beat since you would be in a much worse shape.
Awwwww, the big bad chaos stone. I think I'm gonna cry now. HELLO!!!!!!! How stupid do you think griefers are. Need supplies or new gear because your's breaks and you can't go to town... who you gonna call, your friends on TS to bring you more of anything else you need! It isn't hard to figure out how to get around that system. The Chaos stone is only a burden to the pure soloist who was stupid enough not to have a list of trusted friends. In a game like this you have friends.
Did you know that Chaos stones are seculeded spots? So it doesnt even matter if you have friends you'll be so far off it'll probably take you hours to get back to your spot. Even so what stops another person from killing you to get a alignment boost once you get back? Your making yourself a huge target for good-doers, enemy races, and random joe who wants some items and skill xp with no penalty. You don't think that is going to appeal to many people than you got another thing coming.
Seriously, are the rules set up that if you trade with a flagged player then you are flagged as well? I seriously doubt it. If so, are you able to drop loot on the ground that others can pick up. If so, now that problem of trading with a flagged player is solved, huh?
For most they could just kill you and get everything with no penalty so what stops that? So much simpler and more rewarding.
This is why I'm saying the rules are too carebear for the griefer. There are way too many ways for the griefer to beat the system. If you become flagged, the game has to be miserable for you, otherwise there is no consequence for one's actions. You mentioned real life earlier, so now it is my turn. Very, very rarely is there a perfect crime where you can keep griefing people over and over where the rules are stacked in your favor. In Darkfall Online, if you go criminal, the odds should be stacked so far against you, it would be like commiting a crime in real life. In real life, if you aid a criminal, knowingly or not, you now have to face the consequences. If someone wants to go criminal, they need to feel the pain for their actions.
And by the way, this is suppose to be a thread about a non-pvp server. LOL, sorry about participating in the derail.
Single Race per Server and Single Character per Server. These two are the ones that have been debated on DF forums and one of those is going to be chosen. I would probably guess SCS would be chosen seeing as how majority voted for it.
Single Race per Server and Single Character per Server. These two are the ones that have been debated on DF forums and one of those is going to be chosen. I would probably guess SCS would be chosen seeing as how majority voted for it.
Not to mention that SCS will generate a lot of additional income for Darkfall Online because of 2 boxing, spying, muling, etc. Nearly every FFA PvP game I've played most people I knew played 2 accounts for a host of different reasons. Saying that, I've never played more than one account where my main was on a PvE server. This goes back to the point of multiple rulesets for the game will drive additional revenue for the company.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."