Reading most of hte posts "blizzard just copying war!!!" well.....their copying DAOC... Thats what its been about this whole time, and since war is coming out they have to step up their game. If you guy shavent noticed its basicaly a reliving of the clone wars. Im not saying people dont enjoy either game...But the quality of MMORPGS as a whole have been struck in the face with an axe.
MMORPGS have been seeing less and less originality and even player involvement in which you use to get into combat. Its all just relying on numbers more than it is player involvement. You HAVE to have all the best weapons and armor or else most likely your not going to be able to achieve much in terms of high end and more respectively PVP.
I look at most of these games and see games that were released 6 months prior and quite frankly as an mmo enthusiast im getting kinda sick of this. Im kinda of sick of paying hard earned money for games that have very few differences than their cloned counterparts. Maybe thats just me!
Of all the mmo companies out there who might be nervous about thier future ect .... Blizzard is not among them, WoW has already paid blizzard back for many years to come, WoW has nicely paid blizzard for thier next gen mmo they have been working on for quite some time, which is one of the mmo project with the biggest budget ever seen, Blizzard's WoW wheel will keep turning well after the release of both WAR and AoC, why? Because blizzard is pretty much the best one at adapting towards new competetion, compared to others.
WAR and AoC are both not yet released.... they are standing on the hype wheel, and i bet the companies in charge of these two mmos are bloody hell nervous till the game ships, why? Because they aren't out yet and everything could change.
Note that even though blizzard said they would try to release an expansion once a year, we really haven't got alot of information about it at all, when you think about it, and they are not going to make a closed beta, however they will make an open one, which is weird when you think about it and then in another way, it makes sense, when you want to keep things secret.
I am willing to believe blizzard still has something rather important to show, because they want to keep it till it's too late for either WAR or AoC to work around that feature...
Or.... That's not the case and blizzard are showing quite alot but just keep it tight for other reasons, i mean if i were blizzard and two very heavily hyped games were to be released in a few months, i would also keep as much secret i could possibly do.
Now back to it all.
In my opinion WAR will do well, it has a solid fangrp behind them, even though i won't be buying nor even interested in WAR, i'm sure it'll do well. AoC will most likely also be doing very well, it is currently the game i am waiting fore.... Now everything can change and should i be honest, WotlK could very well end up being what i buy, because blizzard has a great trademark and they create quality at it's finest, there are many people who buy blizzard games just because they think blizzard must know what they were doing, when they made that game, not really bothering with the genre that much. That is the power of a history of making great games.
I am kinda sick of random idiots saying WAR is the next leet thing and whatever, because i sure as hell know many who don't care jack about WAR but that's not the point, the point is that all these games will prolly do very well, WoW will however still have the massive lead because they have loyal customers, ofcourse you'll see random guys with "i am leaving because blah blah blah look at me i want attention" on the WoW forums...
But you know what they say about the loudest kid, who always complain about dinner, even though the 5 other kids like the food, you'll notice the annoying kid yapping about the food..... And by that, the thing that prolly only a small portion of the players ever visit the homepage or in another case a very small portion ever visit it once a week, with this homepage being visited even by less a number by the WoW fans.
Blizzard didn't get to where they are for nothing boys and girls and they sure as hell don't intend to get old and retire just yet...
Kornfan4evr, you couldnt be more correct, MMO quality over the past 3 years has taken such a nose dive, its hard to understand how the developers could even envisage making a profit out of some of them now this is just my opinion but games such as D&DO (good idea but sorely lacking) LotRO (same as D&D) Vanguard (blergh) Auto Assault (LOL) and many others, while having a massive POTENTIAL to be great games in them selves (yes even auto assault) they were rushed out of the door by companies, who seeing blizzard's sucess wanted a slice of the pie, so they took a lot of idea's from this MMO and that MMO and chucked em together with their prespective lore and rushed it to release (i was in AA, D&DO and vanguard beta, and played the world tour of LotRO too), i personally havnt seen an MMO with the scope of SWG scince and only played WoW to keep with friends ect. why dont developers get off their asses and be creative instead of making hypothetical cash cows which never turn out as such.
Of all the mmo companies out there who might be nervous about thier future ect .... Blizzard is not among them, WoW has already paid blizzard back for many years to come, WoW has nicely paid blizzard for thier next gen mmo they have been working on for quite some time, which is one of the mmo project with the biggest budget ever seen, Blizzard's WoW wheel will keep turning well after the release of both WAR and AoC, why? Because blizzard is pretty much the best one at adapting towards new competetion, compared to others. WAR and AoC are both not yet released.... they are standing on the hype wheel, and i bet the companies in charge of these two mmos are bloody hell nervous till the game ships, why? Because they aren't out yet and everything could change.
Note that even though blizzard said they would try to release an expansion once a year, we really haven't got alot of information about it at all, when you think about it, and they are not going to make a closed beta, however they will make an open one, which is weird when you think about it and then in another way, it makes sense, when you want to keep things secret. I am willing to believe blizzard still has something rather important to show, because they want to keep it till it's too late for either WAR or AoC to work around that feature...
Or.... That's not the case and blizzard are showing quite alot but just keep it tight for other reasons, i mean if i were blizzard and two very heavily hyped games were to be released in a few months, i would also keep as much secret i could possibly do.
Now back to it all.
In my opinion WAR will do well, it has a solid fangrp behind them, even though i won't be buying nor even interested in WAR, i'm sure it'll do well. AoC will most likely also be doing very well, it is currently the game i am waiting fore.... Now everything can change and should i be honest, WotlK could very well end up being what i buy, because blizzard has a great trademark and they create quality at it's finest, there are many people who buy blizzard games just because they think blizzard must know what they were doing, when they made that game, not really bothering with the genre that much. That is the power of a history of making great games. I am kinda sick of random idiots saying WAR is the next leet thing and whatever, because i sure as hell know many who don't care jack about WAR but that's not the point, the point is that all these games will prolly do very well, WoW will however still have the massive lead because they have loyal customers, ofcourse you'll see random guys with "i am leaving because blah blah blah look at me i want attention" on the WoW forums... But you know what they say about the loudest kid, who always complain about dinner, even though the 5 other kids like the food, you'll notice the annoying kid yapping about the food..... And by that, the thing that prolly only a small portion of the players ever visit the homepage or in another case a very small portion ever visit it once a week, with this homepage being visited even by less a number by the WoW fans.
Blizzard didn't get to where they are for nothing boys and girls and they sure as hell don't intend to get old and retire just yet...
Very good post.
You kinda sparked my interest cause after WoW i stopped reading up on blizzard, but am very interested nt his new MMO. If you have any info or websites that may have info ON IT would you mind PMing me?
Huge old school blizzard fan and would love to see if their getting back in touch with their roots, more of twitch combat like play and more player involvement.
I find it funny that people claim Blizzard is not worried on the basis of them having 9M subscriptions, so therefore they can "afford to lose some". Nuh uh, people, this is not how business works, and MMORPGs are certainly businesses. You better believe Blizzard is worried, and that is a good and rational thing. Do you think the bosses of Blizzard and Vivendi and all others who have an interest in how much money WoW makes are sitting there going, "Meh, we can lose 3M subscribers to WAR and AoC and still make money, no big deal. Now, let's go jump in the money pile!" That is laughable. No company shrugs off losses like that. Even if they lose only 1M subscribers (that is conservative, in my opinion), that is around $15M less per month that they make in just subscriptions, let alone money they make selling expansions and other game-related items and services. It is a horrendous misconception that when you are making a profit, you will acquiesce and accept making less of a profit so easily. Only a scrub company would do that, and Blizzard is not a bunch of scrubs. They are going to do everything in their power to stop an exodus from their game, no matter how big or small it may be, and they will not be happy about losing anyone. Plus, consider that the bigger you get, the bigger your operating expenses become. Just as a thought exercise, pretend they lost half of their subscribers, which I know is highly improbable. Sure, they still have over 4M, but what about all of the extra overhead they now have? To remain profitable, things will have to go. Servers will be merged, so some of their server farms will now be dormant, earning $0. Some support staff will now be unneeded and must be fired. A lot of other changes to cut costs will probably happen, too. In short, you do not become and stay the industry leader by being smug and overconfident. You need to always have a slight fear of the competition and be willing to adapt to their challenges to stay ahead. You can bet Blizzard has had a lot of internal talks regarding expected losses to future MMORPGs and how they can mitigate them.
QFT sornin, vivandi universal and blizzard will not want to loose any of their player base as WoW is a massive income to the company, and as the company dosen't only encompass blizzard but activision too and that is a MASSIVE gaming development company rivaling EA (source : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vivendi) and many other things so to loose 1M subs at $15 dollars a month is really an unacceptable loss so they would have to lay people off and trim their subsidiaries down which would lead to even more loss, blizzard should be worried over the current state of affairs hence they are planning a new MMO and with the imminant release of WotLK they are trying desperatly to minimise the loss to their playerbase, anyone who says otherwise is a fool, and if blizzard are not getting nervous of the 3rd Gen then they are not the company i thought they were
Desperate is a ridiculous word to use in this situation. Blizzard has gotten a mountain of gold back on their investment already, anything above and beyond is just the cherry on top. Meantime they're adding things to their game to keep their subs happy and creating another game to release in the future to replace WoW.
Desperate is for companies that go under if things start to look bad. Blizzard, they might be disappointed at the worst
Originally posted by Pheace Desperate is a ridiculous word to use in this situation. Blizzard has gotten a mountain of gold back on their investment already, anything above and beyond is just the cherry on top. Meantime they're adding things to their game to keep their subs happy and creating another game to release in the future to replace WoW.
Desperate is for companies that go under if things start to look bad. Blizzard, they might be disappointed at the worst
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
This post is funny. Let's see, WOW which is released has 9 million subscribers. Warhammer Online which is not released has 0. Let's break down the these numbers shall we:
9,000,000 > 0
WOW has nothing to be nervous about. They are operating at a huge profit. WO is operating in the red.
If anyone should be nervous it should be Warhammer Online because expectations at launch will be running high, and if they don't deliver it will be a huge let down.
was this a serious post, or a joke post?
i'm really not sure which it is.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
i would think its accurate to say there must be some concern over any competition by a new mmorpg in the blizzard camp . the warcraft bubble will burst one day and the fact it has 9 million subscribers today does nt mean a signifcant number arnt prepared to try something new .
i ve played warcraft for 2 and a half years and i ve enjoyed it but recently gave it up because i dont like the way the game going with faster leveling and changes to pvp . also i gather it could be another year till the lich kings out and i do want to spend another year going over the same old ground . i m currently playing city of heroes to fill in the time but i do intend to at least try warhammer ( and conan ) and if either is any good i m not sure i ll return to warcraft .i would nt think i m alone , in fact i would say most long term player in know in game are prepared to jump ship .
if blizzard is nt concerned they should be .... of course we said the same thing about lord of the rings , ddo etc . at the end of the day they failed to deliver a product that was as appealing to the public as warcraft . the same maybe true of warhammer . but i hope its not . strong competition from warhammer would mean blizzard would not be able to rest on thier laurels . it ll be good for the mmo gaming industry.
my prediction is warhammer will be a strong second to warcraft and blizzard will be down to about 6 million subscribers by the end of 2008 .
Actually, it's quite obvious WoW is copying Warhammer. The information of how Warhammer was going to operate it's pvp was released well and beyond Lich King expansion. I look at this as just another pathetic attempt at a starter MMO trying to capture more of the glory from a real MMO thats coming out soon.
Btw, to the WoW fanbois. WoW is nothing more than an easy-mode starter MMO, and is considered as such by the serious MMO community. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings but this is how we generally see WoW. Comparing the 9million subscribers to any other MMO is honestly not a very strong point. Considering 87 some odd percent of that subscriber base are children 15 and below. Most of us simply don't care about opinions from individuals that have been alive for roughly 3/5ths the time most of us have. Plus theres the maturity factor which ruins WoW playing for the rest of us due to this community base.
Warhammer and Aoc will be pretty fun. Especially the tighter reigns that will be done on Warhammer guilds. I know a couple guilds personally going to Warhammer whom will have a 18+ only recruiting policy.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity: Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Not sure if he is serious or not, but I'm pretty sure WoW is not currently really worried about Mythic to much right now, even if Warhammer online is insanely successful, it wont really cut into WoW's main customers: The Casual gamers.
Warhammer is more of a niche game, and sure it could possibly become the next 800 pound MMO gorilla, but I really don't think the WoW developers are staying up at night worried about it.
I think this is a fairly frivolous, ill-informed comment. According to you, which game is not a niche game? I would assume almost all except WoW are, which is simply not true. What people call niche games are usually just unsuccessful games that did not attract many players. An empty game != a niche game.
"Niche game" is thrown around by those who think WoW has the exclusive rights to a massive subscriber base, which is a fallacy. The truth is, WAR is not positioning itself as a niche game at all. If you read the features, it has tons that will interest people who do not give a lick about RvR.
Public quests and the Tome of Knowledge are two things I can think of that are a PvE player's wet dream. You basically get massive PvE events that require no planning and massive time investment, and a journal that contains everything about everything you have ever explored and done. Throw in lairs, tons of unique careers, and excellent, established lore and you have a game with a broad appeal. The low computer requirements (not announced, but we know they will be low relative to other games) are also a big help.
In fact, WAR seems to be aiming for the casual market even more than the hardcore one. With highly competitive, risky GvG gameplay, AoC is the one going for the hardcore players, in my opinion. Of course, nothing is black and white, and both games will attract some of each audience, but I think it is inaccurate to state WAR is a niche game with limited appeal.
I'd be happy if WAR just captures all the folks that are 20 years of age and older. It would make for a FAR BETTER community, imho. If that doesn't get them 9 million subscribers, so be it. But there are quite a bit of 20+ gamers out there.
I'd be happy if WAR just captures all the folks that are 20 years of age and older. It would make for a FAR BETTER community, imho. If that doesn't get them 9 million subscribers, so be it. But there are quite a bit of 20+ gamers out there.
Most likely this will happen. Since all the kids in WAR beta are already saying how much it isn't like WoW and that it sucks (lol). Apparently the "MAN THIS IS NOTHING BUT A WOW CLONE!" reached them and failed their hopes once they got in. All i can say is, HAHAHaHAhA /points.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity: Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Originally posted by Pheace Desperate is a ridiculous word to use in this situation. Blizzard has gotten a mountain of gold back on their investment already, anything above and beyond is just the cherry on top. Meantime they're adding things to their game to keep their subs happy and creating another game to release in the future to replace WoW.
Desperate is for companies that go under if things start to look bad. Blizzard, they might be disappointed at the worst
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
so if by 90m / 15 $ you mean 6M subs?
May i ask you a question, are you high on crack? Do you really think out of 9 mill subs, 6 mill are waiting for WAR?
Needless to say it is hardly gonna make blizzard shiver in thier bones, if we knew how much the costs were to keep all thier servers up were and the manpower, it might be interesting but honestly 3mill subs would still make Blizzard walk with alot of cash in thier pockets and with that 6 mill subs lose being a complete fairy tale to say the least.
What mmo will take most of the WoW base will be blizzard's next gen mmo, for some it will sounds as stupid to halve your own playerbase from one game into another but in another way that new game will most likely be different the taste and preference will not be the same and it will just create more new players to that game and allow blizzard making people simply wander between these two games, when they got tired of playing one of them for a long long time, they start on the other one instead, since it's in a different universe whatever that might be.
for those whose wondering about it check this one out, where some of the chaos theory fellahs think what blizzard might be up to:
And at the very last as said many times before, what will cut deep into the wow player subs, would prolly just be another blizzard game, which obviously wouldn't make blizzard sad, since it goes down in thier pockets in the end.
We all know about the icecream flavor theory right?
But in the end please don't come with utterly stupid predictions of how 6mill players will shift over to WAR, believe me, i don't think you would be happy about it, especially not if WAR doesn't have the server power for it, remember WoW when it was booming? Yeah queues, lagg was everyday's bread, now blizzard got hundreds and hundreds(thousands?) of servers with upgraded tech to support heavy drain, they have gone a long way since release and the 9 million subs didn't pop out just in an instant it was a steady increase over the years, when they launched thier game in china and other regions in the world with servers for those areas.
As stated before even 300k would be a success for both AoC and WAR and will keep them alive and giving the creators alot of fonds for upgrades and updates, 1 million could be possible but yet again requires something more, as i'm sure Blizzard got something hiden in thier backhand.
So no need to draw unneeded conclusions and especially not as crazy ones like the 6 mill subs going from WoW, as i said earlier many people in the world who plays WoW don't pay attention to WAR nor AoC, nor do they visit this site or even WoW forums, why? Because they are busy playing the game and having no problems with it.
WoW is not really only about the pve boss killing or pvp hardcore arena or casual BG.... it has to some degree become a rather strange Social hub, where people just stand in the main cities and talk about everydays stuff too. It's as much a chatroom now as it's a pretty decent mmorpg, i guess WoW really did become a true mmorpg, where it make people just socialize in there for whatever reasons.
If you're focused on that WAR will eat up 2+ mill subs from WoW, just through some advanced mass scale pvp, then you're mistaken, they need more than that, they need to make it the new trend, as stupid it sounds. And i also think it's out there where you think: "eh, say what again??" but WoW is increasing in numbers, even today, is because it has so many in it already, many play WoW and keep playing WoW because all thier friends both RL and ingame plays it, in the end it's not about the gear they have worked fore but whom they are playing with and wanna play with.
Another thing to think about ladies and gentlemen.
Originally posted by Pheace Desperate is a ridiculous word to use in this situation. Blizzard has gotten a mountain of gold back on their investment already, anything above and beyond is just the cherry on top. Meantime they're adding things to their game to keep their subs happy and creating another game to release in the future to replace WoW.
Desperate is for companies that go under if things start to look bad. Blizzard, they might be disappointed at the worst
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
so if by 90m / 15 $ you mean 6M subs?
May i ask you a question, are you high on crack? Do you really think out of 9 mill subs, 6 mill are waiting for WAR?
Needless to say it is hardly gonna make blizzard shiver in thier bones, if we knew how much the costs were to keep all thier servers up were and the manpower, it might be interesting but honestly 3mill subs would still make Blizzard walk with alot of cash in thier pockets and with that 6 mill subs lose being a complete fairy tale to say the least.
What mmo will take most of the WoW base will be blizzard's next gen mmo, for some it will sounds as stupid to halve your own playerbase from one game into another but in another way that new game will most likely be different the taste and preference will not be the same and it will just create more new players to that game and allow blizzard making people simply wander between these two games, when they got tired of playing one of them for a long long time, they start on the other one instead, since it's in a different universe whatever that might be.
for those whose wondering about it check this one out, where some of the chaos theory fellahs think what blizzard might be up to:
And at the very last as said many times before, what will cut deep into the wow player subs, would prolly just be another blizzard game, which obviously wouldn't make blizzard sad, since it goes down in thier pockets in the end.
We all know about the icecream flavor theory right?
But in the end please don't come with utterly stupid predictions of how 6mill players will shift over to WAR, believe me, i don't think you would be happy about it, especially not if WAR doesn't have the server power for it, remember WoW when it was booming? Yeah queues, lagg was everyday's bread, now blizzard got hundreds and hundreds(thousands?) of servers with upgraded tech to support heavy drain, they have gone a long way since release and the 9 million subs didn't pop out just in an instant it was a steady increase over the years, when they launched thier game in china and other regions in the world with servers for those areas.
As stated before even 300k would be a success for both AoC and WAR and will keep them alive and giving the creators alot of fonds for upgrades and updates, 1 million could be possible but yet again requires something more, as i'm sure Blizzard got something hiden in thier backhand.
So no need to draw unneeded conclusions and especially not as crazy ones like the 6 mill subs going from WoW, as i said earlier many people in the world who plays WoW don't pay attention to WAR nor AoC, nor do they visit this site or even WoW forums, why? Because they are busy playing the game and having no problems with it.
WoW is not really only about the pve boss killing or pvp hardcore arena or casual BG.... it has to some degree become a rather strange Social hub, where people just stand in the main cities and talk about everydays stuff too. It's as much a chatroom now as it's a pretty decent mmorpg, i guess WoW really did become a true mmorpg, where it make people just socialize in there for whatever reasons.
If you're focused on that WAR will eat up 2+ mill subs from WoW, just through some advanced mass scale pvp, then you're mistaken, they need more than that, they need to make it the new trend, as stupid it sounds. And i also think it's out there where you think: "eh, say what again??" but WoW is increasing in numbers, even today, is because it has so many in it already, many play WoW and keep playing WoW because all thier friends both RL and ingame plays it, in the end it's not about the gear they have worked fore but whom they are playing with and wanna play with.
Another thing to think about ladies and gentlemen.
lol high on crack, may as well say your mum and be done with it, if you can read i suggest you look at the word PROSPECT..... and im not only talking WAR here there are a few other 3rd gen MMO's on the horizon and lets be honest now, people cant grind kara forever, and for the rest of your post, read back a bit, this was a topic that was started about 2 pages back by sorin that i agreed with, the prospect (again please read carefully) of a company of the like of vivandi loosing any amount of money will not be taken lightly, the thread has evolved into new vista's and dont come over all are you stupid with me, cause it wont work. now go find something else to troll and leave the insults at the door
Originally posted by Pheace Desperate is a ridiculous word to use in this situation. Blizzard has gotten a mountain of gold back on their investment already, anything above and beyond is just the cherry on top. Meantime they're adding things to their game to keep their subs happy and creating another game to release in the future to replace WoW.
Desperate is for companies that go under if things start to look bad. Blizzard, they might be disappointed at the worst
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
so if by 90m / 15 $ you mean 6M subs?
May i ask you a question, are you high on crack? Do you really think out of 9 mill subs, 6 mill are waiting for WAR?
Needless to say it is hardly gonna make blizzard shiver in thier bones, if we knew how much the costs were to keep all thier servers up were and the manpower, it might be interesting but honestly 3mill subs would still make Blizzard walk with alot of cash in thier pockets and with that 6 mill subs lose being a complete fairy tale to say the least.
What mmo will take most of the WoW base will be blizzard's next gen mmo, for some it will sounds as stupid to halve your own playerbase from one game into another but in another way that new game will most likely be different the taste and preference will not be the same and it will just create more new players to that game and allow blizzard making people simply wander between these two games, when they got tired of playing one of them for a long long time, they start on the other one instead, since it's in a different universe whatever that might be.
for those whose wondering about it check this one out, where some of the chaos theory fellahs think what blizzard might be up to:
And at the very last as said many times before, what will cut deep into the wow player subs, would prolly just be another blizzard game, which obviously wouldn't make blizzard sad, since it goes down in thier pockets in the end.
We all know about the icecream flavor theory right?
But in the end please don't come with utterly stupid predictions of how 6mill players will shift over to WAR, believe me, i don't think you would be happy about it, especially not if WAR doesn't have the server power for it, remember WoW when it was booming? Yeah queues, lagg was everyday's bread, now blizzard got hundreds and hundreds(thousands?) of servers with upgraded tech to support heavy drain, they have gone a long way since release and the 9 million subs didn't pop out just in an instant it was a steady increase over the years, when they launched thier game in china and other regions in the world with servers for those areas.
As stated before even 300k would be a success for both AoC and WAR and will keep them alive and giving the creators alot of fonds for upgrades and updates, 1 million could be possible but yet again requires something more, as i'm sure Blizzard got something hiden in thier backhand.
So no need to draw unneeded conclusions and especially not as crazy ones like the 6 mill subs going from WoW, as i said earlier many people in the world who plays WoW don't pay attention to WAR nor AoC, nor do they visit this site or even WoW forums, why? Because they are busy playing the game and having no problems with it.
WoW is not really only about the pve boss killing or pvp hardcore arena or casual BG.... it has to some degree become a rather strange Social hub, where people just stand in the main cities and talk about everydays stuff too. It's as much a chatroom now as it's a pretty decent mmorpg, i guess WoW really did become a true mmorpg, where it make people just socialize in there for whatever reasons.
If you're focused on that WAR will eat up 2+ mill subs from WoW, just through some advanced mass scale pvp, then you're mistaken, they need more than that, they need to make it the new trend, as stupid it sounds. And i also think it's out there where you think: "eh, say what again??" but WoW is increasing in numbers, even today, is because it has so many in it already, many play WoW and keep playing WoW because all thier friends both RL and ingame plays it, in the end it's not about the gear they have worked fore but whom they are playing with and wanna play with.
Another thing to think about ladies and gentlemen.
Groupthink is always hilarious to me. If the media says the only game that will take the throne from Blizzard is itself, then it must be so! The media can have their opinions, but they are flawed human beings just like the rest of us. You've got to take what they say with a grain of salt. WAR's massive numbers will surprise, mark my words, Then the media will be hyping the crap out of it and their numbers will only explode further.
i ve enjoyed warcraft even if it is a starter mmo as some people have said . i would be interested what you consider as more advanced mmo . simply because i would nt mind trying them .
i dont see a problem if warhammer offers us something similar to warcraft .lets face it half life is essentially similar to the original doom . games have always built on other games . now and then something really inovative comes along . but this is once in a blue moon .
the truth is i ve tried a few mmos warcraft is the best thus far . but that does nt mean i did nt enjoy city of heroes ,lord of the rings or eve . i still play them for the odd month now and again they just dont grab me enough to subscribe on a monthly basis ... strangly enough i would play them more often if they had a two week option to subscribe .
the ones i ve not enjoyed are ddo ( repedative and limited) vanguard ( buggy and does nt run well on my system) tabula rasa (just could nt get into it ) star wars galaxys ( just an awful cash in on the name )
i m currently giving guild wars a second try .prefect world because so many have said its the best free mmorpg .
I think this is a fairly frivolous, ill-informed comment. According to you, which game is not a niche game? I would assume almost all except WoW are, which is simply not true. What people call niche games are usually just unsuccessful games that did not attract many players. An empty game != a niche game.
"Niche game" is thrown around by those who think WoW has the exclusive rights to a massive subscriber base, which is a fallacy. The truth is, WAR is not positioning itself as a niche game at all. If you read the features, it has tons that will interest people who do not give a lick about RvR.
Public quests and the Tome of Knowledge are two things I can think of that are a PvE player's wet dream. You basically get massive PvE events that require no planning and massive time investment, and a journal that contains everything about everything you have ever explored and done. Throw in lairs, tons of unique careers, and excellent, established lore and you have a game with a broad appeal. The low computer requirements (not announced, but we know they will be low relative to other games) are also a big help.
In fact, WAR seems to be aiming for the casual market even more than the hardcore one. With highly competitive, risky GvG gameplay, AoC is the one going for the hardcore players, in my opinion. Of course, nothing is black and white, and both games will attract some of each audience, but I think it is inaccurate to state WAR is a niche game with limited appeal.
I agree, WAR will not be a niche game for most. My guess is it will be pretty accessible. That is why I will try AoC first. We'll just have to wait to see how the rating disturbs the subs. Hopefully, the teen will be kept at bay.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Sorry, but OP==Clueless WAR will be successfull. But not so much as to put a dent in WoW numbers. Remember, MMORPGs limp along with 20,000 subscribers (DAoC) for years. Some never even get close to 100,000 (EVE) and are considered 'strong' AAA titles. Old dogs like EQ and AO are still going. WoW has nearly 10 MILLION paying subscribers ! To think that any title is going to take that away (except maybe World of Starcraft) would be just plain silly.
Last time I checked games like DAOC and EVE didn't count every account they had actived and closed they only counted the accounts they got active at that time. Because they didn't care about stuff like that so they could have reached the millions but no one knows . But Blizzard counted every subscriber even if they are not active read between the lines.
IRVINE, Calif. – July 24, 2007 – Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. announced today that World of Warcraft®, its award-winning massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG), has reached a new milestone, with a player base now totaling more than 9 million subscribers worldwide.
9 Million Subscribers not active subscribers.
That makes no sense, blizzard count active accounts (defind by wether they have any play time left) they dont count accounts with no game time (they are not counted as subscribers), accounts that are expired, banned or canceled they also dont count trial accounts.
If an account has no game time they are not defind as a subscriber.
Now sure 1-2% of their numbers could be players who have quit yet have game time left on their subscription.. but unless they cancel their account how does blizzard know that? should blizzard call up every subcriber to ask them?
Hate WoW/Blizzard all you like but do not make a fool of yourself with pointless posts like that. You ask us to read between the lines.. i ask you to read the press release in full.
A Subscriber is an individual or company that is uniquely identified within the system as a user of services.
A Subscriber a person who has paid to receive a periodical
A Subscriber is an individual or company entity that pays for service provided by Ascend on a period basis which varies dependant on the service
Now don't kid yourself unless you work for blizzard A. you don't know their numbers only what they say to you. B. Companies do lie point blank. C. If Blizzard say they seen a pig fly by their office would you believe it. Sure you would because it’s Blizzard they wouldn't lie to you. D. If they don't show the proof why should I believe it. Oh yeah they don't show how many people they have on each server. But DAOC do that’s the only way we know that the game is not doing so hot that’s proof. Also for subscribers even if a person is not active, banned or whatever that person is still counted as a subscriber to that game or company. Because they purchased that company product or services. As I say again read between the lines.
PS. You can go to any website any news article and not one of them says active subscribers.
Hi I'm Ravkeen!
Emilia_Emi Lvl 56 Witch Now Playing : Black Desert Online "America is not at war, the US Military is at war, America is at the mall."
The only game that will get me away from WOW is a game with more open ended gameplay. So far i am subscribed to lineage II and vg and wow. All those games in unison offer me everything i need in terms of freedom. If there could be a game that had pvp anywhere, building anywhere, mobility everywhere then I would play that game and switch from the three listed above. Because of htis, and because I represent the casual gamer from wow, I doubt that many people will be playing war since it only offers more of what wow has and nothing new. I get headaches from playing wow too long. Why would i play a game taht is virtualy the same to me, since I know nothing about warhammer lore, for more headaches? I'm already max level in wow. Why not just stick there. The graphics are similar, gameplay similar - but in war it's more limited aka the bottle neck syndrome....
and mythic already screwed us over in daoc with item leveling and what not.
so why would i play a game taht is the exact same but slightly more annoying is the question?
Now aoc, that might be a different story, but based on funcoms previous trackrecord probably not. I think if blizzard releases another mmorpg in the next five years, all these games comming out now will shrivel up and die, because blizzard has done one thing right. That's higher programmers that actually know what kind of mechanics constitute a fun game. In wow when you push forward you move forward. In all these other games it's a finicky pattern at best.
Anyways...this is just my opinion and i'm not flaming anyone or anything so please don't flame me.
Why would Blizzard be worried about anything. They got WOTLK coming plus they are working on a Next-GEN MMO and WOW still is a cash cow so I highly doubt they are worried at all. It is just hype that fans like to conjure up.If you are referring to the BlizzCast they are doing it is 100x better than any WAR podcast. Atleast we get to hear some good tunes in the background and the best one is that we don't have to listen to Paul ramble on
Nobody is copying WAR as its not even out yet and all the footage looks like ass anyway. If anything WAR is attempting to replicate popluar aspects of other favored mmorpgs. Nothing WAR is doing is new in terms of mmorpgs. I dont see what all the hype is about WAR other than the history of the board game etc.
okay Daoc then
Playing: Everthing Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW. I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
Blizzard is not worried about WoW crashing under the pressure of future games. But they are worried about losing out on millions of dollars in subscriptions to WAR and AoC. With 9 millions subscribers, Blizzard is able to work on Starcraft 2, and this mystery MMO without any pinches on budgets and time. Blizzard takes a long time to make games and WoW is their main cash flow while they work.
Over half of WoWs player base are casual gamers and first time MMO players. Many of these people won't hear much or even care much for WAR and AoC. Many of them will be 15 years old and unable to conviince their parents to get them another MMO. Many people will leave WoW then return when the game of their dreams does not live up to expectations, or the WoW expansion gets its own hype. WoW does have the best questing system to date. Many people enjoy WoW for the level grinding more than its PvP and raiding.
Here's another thing, Wow is being advertised on TV now. No other MMO games are. This gives WoW the advantage in snagging more casual gamers and keeping others.
Comments
Reading most of hte posts "blizzard just copying war!!!" well.....their copying DAOC... Thats what its been about this whole time, and since war is coming out they have to step up their game. If you guy shavent noticed its basicaly a reliving of the clone wars. Im not saying people dont enjoy either game...But the quality of MMORPGS as a whole have been struck in the face with an axe.
MMORPGS have been seeing less and less originality and even player involvement in which you use to get into combat. Its all just relying on numbers more than it is player involvement. You HAVE to have all the best weapons and armor or else most likely your not going to be able to achieve much in terms of high end and more respectively PVP.
I look at most of these games and see games that were released 6 months prior and quite frankly as an mmo enthusiast im getting kinda sick of this. Im kinda of sick of paying hard earned money for games that have very few differences than their cloned counterparts. Maybe thats just me!
Of all the mmo companies out there who might be nervous about thier future ect .... Blizzard is not among them, WoW has already paid blizzard back for many years to come, WoW has nicely paid blizzard for thier next gen mmo they have been working on for quite some time, which is one of the mmo project with the biggest budget ever seen, Blizzard's WoW wheel will keep turning well after the release of both WAR and AoC, why? Because blizzard is pretty much the best one at adapting towards new competetion, compared to others.
WAR and AoC are both not yet released.... they are standing on the hype wheel, and i bet the companies in charge of these two mmos are bloody hell nervous till the game ships, why? Because they aren't out yet and everything could change.
Note that even though blizzard said they would try to release an expansion once a year, we really haven't got alot of information about it at all, when you think about it, and they are not going to make a closed beta, however they will make an open one, which is weird when you think about it and then in another way, it makes sense, when you want to keep things secret.
I am willing to believe blizzard still has something rather important to show, because they want to keep it till it's too late for either WAR or AoC to work around that feature...
Or.... That's not the case and blizzard are showing quite alot but just keep it tight for other reasons, i mean if i were blizzard and two very heavily hyped games were to be released in a few months, i would also keep as much secret i could possibly do.
Now back to it all.
In my opinion WAR will do well, it has a solid fangrp behind them, even though i won't be buying nor even interested in WAR, i'm sure it'll do well. AoC will most likely also be doing very well, it is currently the game i am waiting fore.... Now everything can change and should i be honest, WotlK could very well end up being what i buy, because blizzard has a great trademark and they create quality at it's finest, there are many people who buy blizzard games just because they think blizzard must know what they were doing, when they made that game, not really bothering with the genre that much. That is the power of a history of making great games.
I am kinda sick of random idiots saying WAR is the next leet thing and whatever, because i sure as hell know many who don't care jack about WAR but that's not the point, the point is that all these games will prolly do very well, WoW will however still have the massive lead because they have loyal customers, ofcourse you'll see random guys with "i am leaving because blah blah blah look at me i want attention" on the WoW forums...
But you know what they say about the loudest kid, who always complain about dinner, even though the 5 other kids like the food, you'll notice the annoying kid yapping about the food..... And by that, the thing that prolly only a small portion of the players ever visit the homepage or in another case a very small portion ever visit it once a week, with this homepage being visited even by less a number by the WoW fans.
Blizzard didn't get to where they are for nothing boys and girls and they sure as hell don't intend to get old and retire just yet...
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
Kornfan4evr, you couldnt be more correct, MMO quality over the past 3 years has taken such a nose dive, its hard to understand how the developers could even envisage making a profit out of some of them now this is just my opinion but games such as D&DO (good idea but sorely lacking) LotRO (same as D&D) Vanguard (blergh) Auto Assault (LOL) and many others, while having a massive POTENTIAL to be great games in them selves (yes even auto assault) they were rushed out of the door by companies, who seeing blizzard's sucess wanted a slice of the pie, so they took a lot of idea's from this MMO and that MMO and chucked em together with their prespective lore and rushed it to release (i was in AA, D&DO and vanguard beta, and played the world tour of LotRO too), i personally havnt seen an MMO with the scope of SWG scince and only played WoW to keep with friends ect. why dont developers get off their asses and be creative instead of making hypothetical cash cows which never turn out as such.
Very good post.
You kinda sparked my interest cause after WoW i stopped reading up on blizzard, but am very interested nt his new MMO. If you have any info or websites that may have info ON IT would you mind PMing me?
Huge old school blizzard fan and would love to see if their getting back in touch with their roots, more of twitch combat like play and more player involvement.
QFT sornin, vivandi universal and blizzard will not want to loose any of their player base as WoW is a massive income to the company, and as the company dosen't only encompass blizzard but activision too and that is a MASSIVE gaming development company rivaling EA (source : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vivendi) and many other things so to loose 1M subs at $15 dollars a month is really an unacceptable loss so they would have to lay people off and trim their subsidiaries down which would lead to even more loss, blizzard should be worried over the current state of affairs hence they are planning a new MMO and with the imminant release of WotLK they are trying desperatly to minimise the loss to their playerbase, anyone who says otherwise is a fool, and if blizzard are not getting nervous of the 3rd Gen then they are not the company i thought they were
Desperate is a ridiculous word to use in this situation. Blizzard has gotten a mountain of gold back on their investment already, anything above and beyond is just the cherry on top. Meantime they're adding things to their game to keep their subs happy and creating another game to release in the future to replace WoW.
Desperate is for companies that go under if things start to look bad. Blizzard, they might be disappointed at the worst
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
was this a serious post, or a joke post?
i'm really not sure which it is.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
i would think its accurate to say there must be some concern over any competition by a new mmorpg in the blizzard camp . the warcraft bubble will burst one day and the fact it has 9 million subscribers today does nt mean a signifcant number arnt prepared to try something new .
i ve played warcraft for 2 and a half years and i ve enjoyed it but recently gave it up because i dont like the way the game going with faster leveling and changes to pvp . also i gather it could be another year till the lich kings out and i do want to spend another year going over the same old ground . i m currently playing city of heroes to fill in the time but i do intend to at least try warhammer ( and conan ) and if either is any good i m not sure i ll return to warcraft .i would nt think i m alone , in fact i would say most long term player in know in game are prepared to jump ship .
if blizzard is nt concerned they should be .... of course we said the same thing about lord of the rings , ddo etc . at the end of the day they failed to deliver a product that was as appealing to the public as warcraft . the same maybe true of warhammer . but i hope its not . strong competition from warhammer would mean blizzard would not be able to rest on thier laurels . it ll be good for the mmo gaming industry.
my prediction is warhammer will be a strong second to warcraft and blizzard will be down to about 6 million subscribers by the end of 2008 .
Actually, it's quite obvious WoW is copying Warhammer. The information of how Warhammer was going to operate it's pvp was released well and beyond Lich King expansion. I look at this as just another pathetic attempt at a starter MMO trying to capture more of the glory from a real MMO thats coming out soon.
Btw, to the WoW fanbois. WoW is nothing more than an easy-mode starter MMO, and is considered as such by the serious MMO community. I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings but this is how we generally see WoW. Comparing the 9million subscribers to any other MMO is honestly not a very strong point. Considering 87 some odd percent of that subscriber base are children 15 and below. Most of us simply don't care about opinions from individuals that have been alive for roughly 3/5ths the time most of us have. Plus theres the maturity factor which ruins WoW playing for the rest of us due to this community base.
Warhammer and Aoc will be pretty fun. Especially the tighter reigns that will be done on Warhammer guilds. I know a couple guilds personally going to Warhammer whom will have a 18+ only recruiting policy.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Not sure if he is serious or not, but I'm pretty sure WoW is not currently really worried about Mythic to much right now, even if Warhammer online is insanely successful, it wont really cut into WoW's main customers: The Casual gamers.
Warhammer is more of a niche game, and sure it could possibly become the next 800 pound MMO gorilla, but I really don't think the WoW developers are staying up at night worried about it.
I think this is a fairly frivolous, ill-informed comment. According to you, which game is not a niche game? I would assume almost all except WoW are, which is simply not true. What people call niche games are usually just unsuccessful games that did not attract many players. An empty game != a niche game.
"Niche game" is thrown around by those who think WoW has the exclusive rights to a massive subscriber base, which is a fallacy. The truth is, WAR is not positioning itself as a niche game at all. If you read the features, it has tons that will interest people who do not give a lick about RvR.
Public quests and the Tome of Knowledge are two things I can think of that are a PvE player's wet dream. You basically get massive PvE events that require no planning and massive time investment, and a journal that contains everything about everything you have ever explored and done. Throw in lairs, tons of unique careers, and excellent, established lore and you have a game with a broad appeal. The low computer requirements (not announced, but we know they will be low relative to other games) are also a big help.
In fact, WAR seems to be aiming for the casual market even more than the hardcore one. With highly competitive, risky GvG gameplay, AoC is the one going for the hardcore players, in my opinion. Of course, nothing is black and white, and both games will attract some of each audience, but I think it is inaccurate to state WAR is a niche game with limited appeal.
I'd be happy if WAR just captures all the folks that are 20 years of age and older. It would make for a FAR BETTER community, imho. If that doesn't get them 9 million subscribers, so be it. But there are quite a bit of 20+ gamers out there.
Most likely this will happen. Since all the kids in WAR beta are already saying how much it isn't like WoW and that it sucks (lol). Apparently the "MAN THIS IS NOTHING BUT A WOW CLONE!" reached them and failed their hopes once they got in. All i can say is, HAHAHaHAhA /points.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
so if by 90m / 15 $ you mean 6M subs?
May i ask you a question, are you high on crack? Do you really think out of 9 mill subs, 6 mill are waiting for WAR?
Needless to say it is hardly gonna make blizzard shiver in thier bones, if we knew how much the costs were to keep all thier servers up were and the manpower, it might be interesting but honestly 3mill subs would still make Blizzard walk with alot of cash in thier pockets and with that 6 mill subs lose being a complete fairy tale to say the least.
What mmo will take most of the WoW base will be blizzard's next gen mmo, for some it will sounds as stupid to halve your own playerbase from one game into another but in another way that new game will most likely be different the taste and preference will not be the same and it will just create more new players to that game and allow blizzard making people simply wander between these two games, when they got tired of playing one of them for a long long time, they start on the other one instead, since it's in a different universe whatever that might be.
for those whose wondering about it check this one out, where some of the chaos theory fellahs think what blizzard might be up to:
http://www.videogamer.com/features/article/14-12-2007-219.html
And at the very last as said many times before, what will cut deep into the wow player subs, would prolly just be another blizzard game, which obviously wouldn't make blizzard sad, since it goes down in thier pockets in the end.
We all know about the icecream flavor theory right?
But in the end please don't come with utterly stupid predictions of how 6mill players will shift over to WAR, believe me, i don't think you would be happy about it, especially not if WAR doesn't have the server power for it, remember WoW when it was booming? Yeah queues, lagg was everyday's bread, now blizzard got hundreds and hundreds(thousands?) of servers with upgraded tech to support heavy drain, they have gone a long way since release and the 9 million subs didn't pop out just in an instant it was a steady increase over the years, when they launched thier game in china and other regions in the world with servers for those areas.
As stated before even 300k would be a success for both AoC and WAR and will keep them alive and giving the creators alot of fonds for upgrades and updates, 1 million could be possible but yet again requires something more, as i'm sure Blizzard got something hiden in thier backhand.
So no need to draw unneeded conclusions and especially not as crazy ones like the 6 mill subs going from WoW, as i said earlier many people in the world who plays WoW don't pay attention to WAR nor AoC, nor do they visit this site or even WoW forums, why? Because they are busy playing the game and having no problems with it.
WoW is not really only about the pve boss killing or pvp hardcore arena or casual BG.... it has to some degree become a rather strange Social hub, where people just stand in the main cities and talk about everydays stuff too. It's as much a chatroom now as it's a pretty decent mmorpg, i guess WoW really did become a true mmorpg, where it make people just socialize in there for whatever reasons.
If you're focused on that WAR will eat up 2+ mill subs from WoW, just through some advanced mass scale pvp, then you're mistaken, they need more than that, they need to make it the new trend, as stupid it sounds. And i also think it's out there where you think: "eh, say what again??" but WoW is increasing in numbers, even today, is because it has so many in it already, many play WoW and keep playing WoW because all thier friends both RL and ingame plays it, in the end it's not about the gear they have worked fore but whom they are playing with and wanna play with.
Another thing to think about ladies and gentlemen.
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
so if by 90m / 15 $ you mean 6M subs?
May i ask you a question, are you high on crack? Do you really think out of 9 mill subs, 6 mill are waiting for WAR?
Needless to say it is hardly gonna make blizzard shiver in thier bones, if we knew how much the costs were to keep all thier servers up were and the manpower, it might be interesting but honestly 3mill subs would still make Blizzard walk with alot of cash in thier pockets and with that 6 mill subs lose being a complete fairy tale to say the least.
What mmo will take most of the WoW base will be blizzard's next gen mmo, for some it will sounds as stupid to halve your own playerbase from one game into another but in another way that new game will most likely be different the taste and preference will not be the same and it will just create more new players to that game and allow blizzard making people simply wander between these two games, when they got tired of playing one of them for a long long time, they start on the other one instead, since it's in a different universe whatever that might be.
for those whose wondering about it check this one out, where some of the chaos theory fellahs think what blizzard might be up to:
http://www.videogamer.com/features/article/14-12-2007-219.html
And at the very last as said many times before, what will cut deep into the wow player subs, would prolly just be another blizzard game, which obviously wouldn't make blizzard sad, since it goes down in thier pockets in the end.
We all know about the icecream flavor theory right?
But in the end please don't come with utterly stupid predictions of how 6mill players will shift over to WAR, believe me, i don't think you would be happy about it, especially not if WAR doesn't have the server power for it, remember WoW when it was booming? Yeah queues, lagg was everyday's bread, now blizzard got hundreds and hundreds(thousands?) of servers with upgraded tech to support heavy drain, they have gone a long way since release and the 9 million subs didn't pop out just in an instant it was a steady increase over the years, when they launched thier game in china and other regions in the world with servers for those areas.
As stated before even 300k would be a success for both AoC and WAR and will keep them alive and giving the creators alot of fonds for upgrades and updates, 1 million could be possible but yet again requires something more, as i'm sure Blizzard got something hiden in thier backhand.
So no need to draw unneeded conclusions and especially not as crazy ones like the 6 mill subs going from WoW, as i said earlier many people in the world who plays WoW don't pay attention to WAR nor AoC, nor do they visit this site or even WoW forums, why? Because they are busy playing the game and having no problems with it.
WoW is not really only about the pve boss killing or pvp hardcore arena or casual BG.... it has to some degree become a rather strange Social hub, where people just stand in the main cities and talk about everydays stuff too. It's as much a chatroom now as it's a pretty decent mmorpg, i guess WoW really did become a true mmorpg, where it make people just socialize in there for whatever reasons.
If you're focused on that WAR will eat up 2+ mill subs from WoW, just through some advanced mass scale pvp, then you're mistaken, they need more than that, they need to make it the new trend, as stupid it sounds. And i also think it's out there where you think: "eh, say what again??" but WoW is increasing in numbers, even today, is because it has so many in it already, many play WoW and keep playing WoW because all thier friends both RL and ingame plays it, in the end it's not about the gear they have worked fore but whom they are playing with and wanna play with.
Another thing to think about ladies and gentlemen.
lol high on crack, may as well say your mum and be done with it, if you can read i suggest you look at the word PROSPECT..... and im not only talking WAR here there are a few other 3rd gen MMO's on the horizon and lets be honest now, people cant grind kara forever, and for the rest of your post, read back a bit, this was a topic that was started about 2 pages back by sorin that i agreed with, the prospect (again please read carefully) of a company of the like of vivandi loosing any amount of money will not be taken lightly, the thread has evolved into new vista's and dont come over all are you stupid with me, cause it wont work. now go find something else to troll and leave the insults at the door
i dunno tbh, at the prospect of loosing $90M+ per month i think any company in the world would be getting quite desperate to stop that happening, ivory backscratchers dont grow on trees you know :P
so if by 90m / 15 $ you mean 6M subs?
May i ask you a question, are you high on crack? Do you really think out of 9 mill subs, 6 mill are waiting for WAR?
Needless to say it is hardly gonna make blizzard shiver in thier bones, if we knew how much the costs were to keep all thier servers up were and the manpower, it might be interesting but honestly 3mill subs would still make Blizzard walk with alot of cash in thier pockets and with that 6 mill subs lose being a complete fairy tale to say the least.
What mmo will take most of the WoW base will be blizzard's next gen mmo, for some it will sounds as stupid to halve your own playerbase from one game into another but in another way that new game will most likely be different the taste and preference will not be the same and it will just create more new players to that game and allow blizzard making people simply wander between these two games, when they got tired of playing one of them for a long long time, they start on the other one instead, since it's in a different universe whatever that might be.
for those whose wondering about it check this one out, where some of the chaos theory fellahs think what blizzard might be up to:
http://www.videogamer.com/features/article/14-12-2007-219.html
And at the very last as said many times before, what will cut deep into the wow player subs, would prolly just be another blizzard game, which obviously wouldn't make blizzard sad, since it goes down in thier pockets in the end.
We all know about the icecream flavor theory right?
But in the end please don't come with utterly stupid predictions of how 6mill players will shift over to WAR, believe me, i don't think you would be happy about it, especially not if WAR doesn't have the server power for it, remember WoW when it was booming? Yeah queues, lagg was everyday's bread, now blizzard got hundreds and hundreds(thousands?) of servers with upgraded tech to support heavy drain, they have gone a long way since release and the 9 million subs didn't pop out just in an instant it was a steady increase over the years, when they launched thier game in china and other regions in the world with servers for those areas.
As stated before even 300k would be a success for both AoC and WAR and will keep them alive and giving the creators alot of fonds for upgrades and updates, 1 million could be possible but yet again requires something more, as i'm sure Blizzard got something hiden in thier backhand.
So no need to draw unneeded conclusions and especially not as crazy ones like the 6 mill subs going from WoW, as i said earlier many people in the world who plays WoW don't pay attention to WAR nor AoC, nor do they visit this site or even WoW forums, why? Because they are busy playing the game and having no problems with it.
WoW is not really only about the pve boss killing or pvp hardcore arena or casual BG.... it has to some degree become a rather strange Social hub, where people just stand in the main cities and talk about everydays stuff too. It's as much a chatroom now as it's a pretty decent mmorpg, i guess WoW really did become a true mmorpg, where it make people just socialize in there for whatever reasons.
If you're focused on that WAR will eat up 2+ mill subs from WoW, just through some advanced mass scale pvp, then you're mistaken, they need more than that, they need to make it the new trend, as stupid it sounds. And i also think it's out there where you think: "eh, say what again??" but WoW is increasing in numbers, even today, is because it has so many in it already, many play WoW and keep playing WoW because all thier friends both RL and ingame plays it, in the end it's not about the gear they have worked fore but whom they are playing with and wanna play with.
Another thing to think about ladies and gentlemen.
Groupthink is always hilarious to me. If the media says the only game that will take the throne from Blizzard is itself, then it must be so! The media can have their opinions, but they are flawed human beings just like the rest of us. You've got to take what they say with a grain of salt. WAR's massive numbers will surprise, mark my words, Then the media will be hyping the crap out of it and their numbers will only explode further.
i ve enjoyed warcraft even if it is a starter mmo as some people have said . i would be interested what you consider as more advanced mmo . simply because i would nt mind trying them .
i dont see a problem if warhammer offers us something similar to warcraft .lets face it half life is essentially similar to the original doom . games have always built on other games . now and then something really inovative comes along . but this is once in a blue moon .
the truth is i ve tried a few mmos warcraft is the best thus far . but that does nt mean i did nt enjoy city of heroes ,lord of the rings or eve . i still play them for the odd month now and again they just dont grab me enough to subscribe on a monthly basis ... strangly enough i would play them more often if they had a two week option to subscribe .
the ones i ve not enjoyed are ddo ( repedative and limited) vanguard ( buggy and does nt run well on my system) tabula rasa (just could nt get into it ) star wars galaxys ( just an awful cash in on the name )
i m currently giving guild wars a second try .prefect world because so many have said its the best free mmorpg .
perfect world # typo
I think this is a fairly frivolous, ill-informed comment. According to you, which game is not a niche game? I would assume almost all except WoW are, which is simply not true. What people call niche games are usually just unsuccessful games that did not attract many players. An empty game != a niche game.
"Niche game" is thrown around by those who think WoW has the exclusive rights to a massive subscriber base, which is a fallacy. The truth is, WAR is not positioning itself as a niche game at all. If you read the features, it has tons that will interest people who do not give a lick about RvR.
Public quests and the Tome of Knowledge are two things I can think of that are a PvE player's wet dream. You basically get massive PvE events that require no planning and massive time investment, and a journal that contains everything about everything you have ever explored and done. Throw in lairs, tons of unique careers, and excellent, established lore and you have a game with a broad appeal. The low computer requirements (not announced, but we know they will be low relative to other games) are also a big help.
In fact, WAR seems to be aiming for the casual market even more than the hardcore one. With highly competitive, risky GvG gameplay, AoC is the one going for the hardcore players, in my opinion. Of course, nothing is black and white, and both games will attract some of each audience, but I think it is inaccurate to state WAR is a niche game with limited appeal.
I agree, WAR will not be a niche game for most. My guess is it will be pretty accessible. That is why I will try AoC first. We'll just have to wait to see how the rating disturbs the subs. Hopefully, the teen will be kept at bay.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
Last time I checked games like DAOC and EVE didn't count every account they had actived and closed they only counted the accounts they got active at that time. Because they didn't care about stuff like that so they could have reached the millions but no one knows . But Blizzard counted every subscriber even if they are not active read between the lines.IRVINE, Calif. – July 24, 2007 – Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. announced today that World of Warcraft®, its award-winning massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG), has reached a new milestone, with a player base now totaling more than 9 million subscribers worldwide.
9 Million Subscribers not active subscribers.
That makes no sense, blizzard count active accounts (defind by wether they have any play time left) they dont count accounts with no game time (they are not counted as subscribers), accounts that are expired, banned or canceled they also dont count trial accounts.
If an account has no game time they are not defind as a subscriber.
Now sure 1-2% of their numbers could be players who have quit yet have game time left on their subscription.. but unless they cancel their account how does blizzard know that? should blizzard call up every subcriber to ask them?
Hate WoW/Blizzard all you like but do not make a fool of yourself with pointless posts like that. You ask us to read between the lines.. i ask you to read the press release in full.
A Subscriber is an individual or company that is uniquely identified within the system as a user of services.
A Subscriber a person who has paid to receive a periodical
A Subscriber is an individual or company entity that pays for service provided by Ascend on a period basis which varies dependant on the service
Now don't kid yourself unless you work for blizzard A. you don't know their numbers only what they say to you. B. Companies do lie point blank. C. If Blizzard say they seen a pig fly by their office would you believe it. Sure you would because it’s Blizzard they wouldn't lie to you. D. If they don't show the proof why should I believe it. Oh yeah they don't show how many people they have on each server. But DAOC do that’s the only way we know that the game is not doing so hot that’s proof. Also for subscribers even if a person is not active, banned or whatever that person is still counted as a subscriber to that game or company. Because they purchased that company product or services. As I say again read between the lines.
PS. You can go to any website any news article and not one of them says active subscribers.
Hi I'm Ravkeen!
Emilia_Emi Lvl 56 Witch
Now Playing : Black Desert Online
"America is not at war, the US Military is at war, America is at the mall."
I call humbug on this assertion.
Blizzard is as comfortable with WAR as a McDonalds located by a Burger King at a shopping mall foodcourt.
The only game that will get me away from WOW is a game with more open ended gameplay. So far i am subscribed to lineage II and vg and wow. All those games in unison offer me everything i need in terms of freedom. If there could be a game that had pvp anywhere, building anywhere, mobility everywhere then I would play that game and switch from the three listed above. Because of htis, and because I represent the casual gamer from wow, I doubt that many people will be playing war since it only offers more of what wow has and nothing new. I get headaches from playing wow too long. Why would i play a game taht is virtualy the same to me, since I know nothing about warhammer lore, for more headaches? I'm already max level in wow. Why not just stick there. The graphics are similar, gameplay similar - but in war it's more limited aka the bottle neck syndrome....
and mythic already screwed us over in daoc with item leveling and what not.
so why would i play a game taht is the exact same but slightly more annoying is the question?
Now aoc, that might be a different story, but based on funcoms previous trackrecord probably not. I think if blizzard releases another mmorpg in the next five years, all these games comming out now will shrivel up and die, because blizzard has done one thing right. That's higher programmers that actually know what kind of mechanics constitute a fun game. In wow when you push forward you move forward. In all these other games it's a finicky pattern at best.
Anyways...this is just my opinion and i'm not flaming anyone or anything so please don't flame me.
Why would Blizzard be worried about anything. They got WOTLK coming plus they are working on a Next-GEN MMO and WOW still is a cash cow so I highly doubt they are worried at all. It is just hype that fans like to conjure up.If you are referring to the BlizzCast they are doing it is 100x better than any WAR podcast. Atleast we get to hear some good tunes in the background and the best one is that we don't have to listen to Paul ramble on
okay Daoc then
Playing: Everthing
Played: DAoC,AC2,EvE,SWG,WAR,MXO,CoX,EQ2,L2,LOTRO,SB,UO,WoW.
I have played every MMO that has ever come out.
Blizzard is not worried about WoW crashing under the pressure of future games. But they are worried about losing out on millions of dollars in subscriptions to WAR and AoC. With 9 millions subscribers, Blizzard is able to work on Starcraft 2, and this mystery MMO without any pinches on budgets and time. Blizzard takes a long time to make games and WoW is their main cash flow while they work.
Over half of WoWs player base are casual gamers and first time MMO players. Many of these people won't hear much or even care much for WAR and AoC. Many of them will be 15 years old and unable to conviince their parents to get them another MMO. Many people will leave WoW then return when the game of their dreams does not live up to expectations, or the WoW expansion gets its own hype. WoW does have the best questing system to date. Many people enjoy WoW for the level grinding more than its PvP and raiding.
Here's another thing, Wow is being advertised on TV now. No other MMO games are. This gives WoW the advantage in snagging more casual gamers and keeping others.